Honestly it would’ve made more sense to have Sugar Mama be homophobic since she’s old school, but of course Oscar has to be the bad parent to always learn a lesson. 🙄
This goes into my issue with them just bashing Oscar and finding ways TO JUSTIFY bashing Oscar. I mean why can’t Trudy be the homophobic one? Give her some actual flaws that are her own instead of cause of Oscars shit?@@TonyTurner
I kind of think Maya was trying to be the silent strong type that wasn't going to acknowledge people's foolishness. Shes a girl that would take pride in that despite her usually being more vocal. She was probably telling herself that she's got other things to fight people on then people just being ignorant about her dads.
I interpreted Maya's reaction in a similar way. Additionally, I think this may be too close to home for her in order for her to approach it with the more outspoken attitude she uses in most other situations.
Right ✅️ I think it also hits home because it's so personal to maya. Sometimes it can be more comfortable to advocate for something outside of yourself.
The fact that dijoney basically spread online that maya and her brother had 2 gay dads which led to them being bullied and didn’t get any sort of consequences for her gross behavior is so trashy.
Like, why didn't Dijonay get in trouble with the school? I thought, especially in California where this show takes place, that stuff gets SERIOUS fast now?
As much as I dislike Maya, I get why she was quiet. Atleast in my experience, it's easier to fight for and defend others than it is to fight for yourself.
I think Maya is more sensitive when it comes to her family especially talking about her adoption because she doesn't have the "typical" family. Everyone has weaknesses I think her family is one.
You brought up a good point about Barry & Randall being too much for people to handle, but Michael was okay for people. But I don't believe it's inconsistency with the writing. I believe it's hypocrisy! People are fine with someone being gay as long as they're single, but the moment they find out that same gay person have a boyfriend or husband then all hell breaks loose! It's the jealousy and hypocrisy for me that I can't stand. They're not hurting anyone for being gay. Let them be themselves please. How would people like it if they got made fun of for something beyond their control? Y'all need to think about that. Thank you for the video Tony Turner
In my opinion, Michael didn't have to be as feminine as the girls. Case in point, going to the hair salon with girls in preparation for prom night and wearing sparkling pink like the rest of the girls.
This!! 💯 When my family knew I was gay an immediate thing was for example my sister was determining along with her toxic husband if I should be around their kids or not basing me on some random damn videos probably from Facebook. I won't even tell them about any relationships cause at this point it's trifling. Just wanted to give a personal perspective
Michael was okay to people because they never really acknowledged it outside of one episode that I did not even know existed until a few years ago, "Who You Calling a Sissy". For the most part, everyone just saw him as a joke character, which happens a lot with queer characters in general especially in shows from the early 2000s.
The main thing that frustrated me with the episode was the fact that they kind of ignore Micheal. I know he got an episode in the old series but he would’ve been better looked into in this episode. In one of the parts it’s Penny that has to stand up for the kids and Micheal kind of hides behind his friends. I understand (as a pansexual gender queer person) that it is difficult to stand up for yourself against Homophobia and bigotry but I feel it wasn’t ulized enough in why Micheal could possibly relate to the two or want to hide behind his friends
I agree. Michael would have been the perfect character to help defend Maya and KG but they made him a shallow follower. Penny once again has to take on her role of being the mature protagonist
I feel like in general the argument of "well i dont want kids seeing two men or two women in love" is hypocritical. Look at a good chunk of disney movies and most animated movies and shows where the main characters are older teens/adults. Why when the princess and prince kiss or the resolution of the plot is a romantic kiss, that's ok for kids to watch. But if it was the exact same situation but with 2 women or 2 men, it would be considered inappropriate or sexual? Its a double standard. If anything, growing up I felt like heterosexual behavior was more reinforced than anything. If i took an interest in any tv character or had a friend that wasnt female, parents/other adults automatically assumed it was romantic when it wasnt and it was really uncomfortable. Bc that just sends the message that any interactions with the opposite gender is/has to be romantic. I'd also like to point out that "hiding" lgbt people from kids doesn't mean they will end up straight, bc i didn't know being gay was even a thing until half way through high school yet from childhood to now, i had little to no interest in guys but did have crushes on other girls. Everyone in the world isnt gonna be exactly alike and i dont understand why that concept is so hard for other people to grasp. As far as the media goes, i do feel that part of the problem is that lgbt relationships are overly sexualized, which is why people assume its something inappropriate as opposed to two people who love one another wanting to be together. It does bother me when black folks like Oscar are homophobic bc we know what it's like to be discriminated against and judged. So why would we turn around and do it to someone else?
EXACTLY. Why do so many people view two men or two women even holding hands as sexual and "forcing an agenda". Kids movies can literally imply a man and a woman even doing it and we just laugh it off as an adult joke. So, what is this hypocrisy here?
Exactly! The genders of the people kissing aren't what makes it sexual. Twilight was available in middle and high school libraries...it had sex and toxic relationships but because they were heterosexual couples, its a non-issue. It's like you said, insisting on only heterosexual representation reinforces that men and women can't be friends, that there has to be an attraction. And in doing so only reinforces for kids, and even adults, to harass and tease people for not dating or having crushes
If you look closely, most of the tweets ARE positive. It’s just the few negative ones are LOUD. People were saying “yeah who cares” and sending positive messages. But the few that were negative were just louder.
The problem is that the "who cares?" or "I don't care" comments can be taken as negative seeing as it could be interpreted as them choosing not to care about the issues that homosexual people face.
@@therealopaartist Exactly what I'm saying. If someone does not see any problem with homosexual people, then that person must show their support for them instead of mere indifference.
The one thing that made me upset with this episode was that Penny was seen as a bad guy by Maya/KG, and not Dijonay. Penny was the only one who outright stood up for Maya/KG (Michael himself didn't want to stand with both of them). Dijonay was the one who outed them. This is my main problem with the reboot series: the person that needs to be held accountable usually isn't (ex. Trudy locking Penny out and isn't labeled as a bad parent, Zoey briefly dating Noah and is somehow the villain).
Have you thought about why? Considering that Penny knew exactly how Dijonay operated, you think she would have just left Dijonay out. Plus, Michael himself is homosexual, so if he was standing up as well, he would be dismissed as biased just because he's the same sexual orientation as Maya and KG's fathers'.
That was a goof. I think maya and kg were written as if they have known Dijonay and penny long enough to have certain expectations when they shouldn't because they just met these kids. It's like they expected this behavior from dijonay but expected better than a savior-complex from penny. But again, they don't know them well enough to hold that attitude
I’ve always been uncomfortable with kissing scenes as a kid. I was the type of kid who literally ran away from the TV anytime something of the sort happened.😭 But yeah, I totally agree with your point about how weird it is that no one ever had a problem with a man and a woman kissing on screen, but as soon as a same sex couple do LITERALLY THE SAME THING, it’s like “OMG? The heck y’all doing?” I think it’s cause people treat it like it’s unnatural and now they have to explain the entire concept of gayness to their child like it’s foreign. Even though it’s the same reason of “They love eachother.”
Yes but at the same time some families might feel that their kids might get confused and call themselves gay and/or the family belief based on culture/religon. Also, same sex is sometimes considered “abnormal”in some cases. Also, some lgbtq shows try to convince kids that they are gay to get them to be like them So yeah, that’s why ppl view it differently.😊
@@barringtonbaby7952 What shows with queer representation convinces children that they’re queer? Queer representation doesn’t turn people queer. There’s lots of straight characters on TV and some people didn’t turn out to be straight. Besides, queer adults were once queer children who were closeted and they discovered their identity over time.
@@SodaCider641 not any specific show, just in general. Some people (myself not included) feel like their kids might feel like they have to be gay/ be an ally because a character from their show is/because they want to be special in a way/ because they might feel that if a character is gay/other characters support it, they, in their not fully mature minds think they have to do the same
I'm not sure if i'm wrong or not but out of this reboot, when it comes to the parents, it's always Oscar who seems to have the problems with certain situations and is always the one that has to learn a lesson. Never Trudy, nor Sugar Mama, it's always him who seems to start conflicts or be in the wrong.
@@TonyTurner Yeah, and when Trudy made a bad parenting move by locking Penny out, she didn't see any errors in her way or learn the harsh way like Oscar. Heck it seemed like her action was swept under the table.
Well we don’t know that for sure, he could just be flamboyant Or it could be a phase, but when adults come in to the play,and they are married or anything that is seen as “abnormal”, for the kids and other adults, it’s a problem
@@barringtonbaby7952 You need to remember that in this particular reboot, he's seen dating guys over and over. The crew themselves doesn't shy away from it, even during the school dance scene in episode 1, Michael is seen with a boy and when Penny in season 2 of louder and prouder is looking for Bebe, Michael is on a date with Make-Up Boy That boy is Gay AF
Thank you for covering this ... I was so confused with Oscar not wanting to let Penny hang out with maya and kg because they have two dads but he lets penny hang out with micheal and he is gay i don't know if the writers forget that part ...
Right, it's a little inconsistency with the writing because Oscar has never shown a disliking to Michael. He actually feels more comfortable that Penny hangs out with Michael since he doesn't have to worry about them liking each other in a romantic way
I mean, they make Oscar homophobic to have him be unaccepting of two dads, they make him ignorant of autism to have him be “somethings wrong with my son”, they make him weak-willed at Trudy locking Penny out of the house, and that’s in addition to all the usual shit he gets every day. They just bash Oscar for no reason, and then just decide to make him wrong about everything. How is it nobody felt SORRY for the damn guy?
@@TonyTurner that actually does feel consistant lol He was only fine with micheal because he wouldn’t date Penny but (before this episode) if he saw micheal with a boyfriend he probably would have thought it was gross
I think with Michael some adults can view his queerness as "a phase" that he's going through and that "he'll grow out of it". Also, I highly doubt a good chunk of parents know him heck they would have even known about Maya's parents if not for the tweet outing them.
@Attmay well it used to be derogatory but is now just another way to refer to us. We don’t see it as a bad word. I suppose it depends on how you use it but saying Queer isn’t a bad word. Think of it like how Gay used to be used derogatory but now means homosexual.
Agreed. Besides, just because someone tolerates you doesn’t mean they accept or like you. The way they treat you because you’re different in a certain way (race, religion, gender identity, disability, orientation, etc) is a sign of that.
So it kinda does make sense that they are ok with the kids having a gay friend because then it's "oh well he's going through a phase and will grow out of it" but being friends with two kids that have two dads it's "I don't want them to corrupt my child into thinking this is normal". I'm not homophobic but I assume that's how their mind works.
As someone who has been consistently “othered” saying I’m not black or weird or sensitive I don’t discriminate against anyone of any race or sexual orientation. I judge people by what they bring to the table. If they r mean & rude I don’t mess with them but if they r cool & nice & get along with others I’m down to be their friend.
I don't have so much of a problem with Maya being quiet as soon as she was a part of the targeted harassment. I, personally, am a queer person. I have absolutely zero issue becoming some one else's defense. I can identify a problem and take action against it. I hate it when something goes sideways based on things NOBODY CAN CHANGE. That makes me so mad. That shouldn't be the case. I'll be openly against that kind of thing. But when it comes to my variety of queerness? My quirks? I have self-doubt. I don't know if I know me as well as I think I do. I am an evolving and changing person. Should I speak up? The hate gets to me in ways, too. I depend on other queer people to have my back, I can't advocate for me if I think I'm the problem. Maya is depending on someone to not be a bigot and make things worse before she can find her voice, that's natural. She wants to solve problems, not be one.
Great video bro! This is eye opening in many ways. Homophobia exists and people find positive ways to challenge it. It's cool and important to be an ally. This episode teaches the reality of bullying and awareness. Keep up the amazing work!!! 💯
I don't know what was worse during the kiss scene, the fact that the kiss was animated to be hideous, or that they kept switching back and forth between the kiss and Oscar's shocked reaction, most likely causing seizures if not just miniscule disgust. I can't even tell if the latter was making the former appear gross, or if the former was so grossly done that the latter had to deflect the viewers' perspective.
I definitely think a part of the reason people are against the sex scenes in general is because of the oversaturation. I don't care if someone is gay or straight, but I cringe when romantical displays of affection as are shown. I can't even watch super hero shows without a sex scene or people making out show up for uncomfortable lengths of time. Stuff you'd think would be okay for teenagers to watch is filled with mature content of all kinds. I think it's because of the fact it's a combination of poor writing and acting to make the moment feel awkward. I shouldn't feel uncomfortable seeing people kiss, and I definitely shouldn't be subjected to watching 2 people wrestle in bed in the movie theater. Call me a sensitive snowflake but I am more than proud to admit it on this front. People can make stories where those things can be not only wholesome, but tasteful. It's been done before. The power to imply is a powerful tool in cinema. I and many others shouldn't have to feel like I'm in the room watching people doing the horizonal tango.
Being gay is fine as long it's not overly done like some really think they women or men never liked no form of pda straight gay bi whatever keep that shid at home
True ‼ Like I was saying, I feel they emphasize sex scenes so much in TV shows and movies nowadays. It basically goes on the borderline of being softcore p*rn
You know an annoying concept is that people say if a gay couple raises a kid the kid will "turn gay" which is obviously not true. At this point human social intelligence should've never existed. It always seems like if youre different people feel to have an immediate opinion on you. And to the point where the government has the audacity to determine whether a human can have rights or not. Thats insane to me.
@@yanrokbowl28 I'm not sure if people who believe in that concept extend it to kids. That's what I've heard. I guess it's person who's different will pass it on to others-im assuming that's how they see it. I personally don't believe that.
Actually everyone being fine with Micheal but not the two dads feels accurate to me. So many people are fine with gay people until they start BEING gay (aka being in a relationship) So it feels kinda true to life that the parents would be fine with micheal (who they might think is “in a phase” or something) but not with to grown men who are gay and with eachother It’s all the concept of “I’m okay with gay people just don’t shove it down our throats” (aka don’t be flamboyant and don’t have a gay relationship. It sounds so stupid but homophobia is inherently stupid lol)
Yayyy...reminder that people hate me for who I like. Honestly, this one hit really close to home. I hate in when people get all defensive or god forbid 'they're faking it' or 'are you really into guys/girls'. Yes, I am. Please stop being dicks about it, yes, I like both. I really do enjoy that they showed adults being homosexual. But being a queer kid in school is a really rough experience, I kinda wish they would have gone into that more. As a bisexual person who, by law, is technically still a child. I am very sensitive and get very pissed whenever people, especially kids, act homophobic, it reminds me that it really is just their parents, which is just sad.
Fr I'm still figuring out my sexuality and such and am legally a child so it really hurts me and makes me feel unsafe when I hear such jokes at my school
tbh im glad i reazlixed i was bi at 17-18, instead of earlier even tho some signs were there, bc meant i went clueless until almost finishing hs so i didnt have to eat all the bs other teens did ._. ig sth good came out of realizing later
Surprisingly, as someone who grew up with his dad dating another man, this is pretty accurate. I was reluctant to tell people as a kid that my dad was bisexual and into men, as most of the time I'd either get teased or people would make it weird and treating it different from other straight couples. Even my mom usually didn't wanna talk about it even though they were divorced, cause it was awkward and something that people always commented on. Proud family actually made an accurate episode for once.
As someone who is very queer; I honestly understood pretty much Maya's attitude. I had a friend outing me when I was in high school, and while not outright bullying like this, there were issues, people being assholes, etc; and you just...get tired of it, on a sense. At some point you learn when is worth to fight something, and when is like 'aaaand there it is,' and just move on with your life because you don't have the energy or the time for this. I am normally not passive when is about my queer friends and love ones, but I can see why at some point you just try to ignore it.
11:07 that’s actually a mindset some people have, my friends dad hated the fact that another one of our friends had 2 moms but he was fine when our gay guy friend joined the group, I think it’s like a whole “well the guy isn’t tryna get with my daughter” but also the whole “2 dads is unnatural” thing idk for sure tho
About the interracial gay couple thing, I've noticed that the black dad is always heavier?? (not to bring race into it, it's just something I noticed.) It's in the Loud House and The Hollow.)
I haven’t watched The Hollow but I used to watch the Loud House and have watched some clips of Louder and Prouder, so I do get what you’re saying. I don’t know why the character designers go with that particular design for an interracial gay couple. One solution to this is to have broad mlm (man loving man) representation. There can be couples who have different body types that aren’t just tall and skinny/fat and short or tall and muscular/short and stout, interracial couples that aren’t just black man in a relationship with a white man, polyamorous fathers, disabled queer men, etc. I wish the individual creators of the shows took more risks with character design. I’ve seen creators of queer OCs get praised for their wonderfully beautiful, distinct, diverse designs.
Here's the biggest problem with this episode, didn't they already tackled this issue in the original series called "who you calling a sizzy?", where it focus on Michael? Did the creators seriously forget about that episode, let alone the original series of the Proud Family?
To be fair “didn’t they already tackle this issue” is a common thing with reboots. I mean look at all the 2016 powerpuff girl episodes that are inferior to stories already done in the original.
7:42 I think it definitely could be better and I also think it matters how you do it for example gravity falls has a very suggested gay couple with one being a tall white man the other being a shorter more round man of colour but there written in a way that’s endearing
So I just want to make something clear you may not have understood and a lot of people have misunderstood this in the past. Gender identity and sexuality are 2 different things. You can be a gay man and be very masculine or be very feminine or somewhere in between the same goes for lesbians being what I believe you call Tom boys. I really appreciate you trying to spread awareness and acceptance I just thought I’d clear up a misunderstanding. I also understand where maya is coming from sometimes it’s easier to be an activist and speak up for others and it’s harder to speak up when you are closer to the subject.
Because it challenges stereotypes, and it makes gay people harder to single out from everybody else. That's why boomers fall back on the same tired stereotype of the prancing nelly ka-WEEN and think it's okay for heterosexuals to play us but not for whites to play nonwhites.
The following points are what made this episode so aggravating. Dijonnay running her mouth to everyone about Maya and KG's dad just for the sake of having something to talk about cemented for me that she's incapable of fully respecting others. Her character was the one that should've been removed from the show instead of Sticky. Two, why does Oscar have to be the designated villain of this episode. It's bad enough he's the punching bag of the series, but they can let someone else be the jerk. Got too many to pick from to just keep using Oscar. And heck, even from the perspective of a Black gay man, I'd be uncomfortable seeing another couple being all love dovy in front me regardless of genders. Third, Felix should have stopped acting like a baby and told Sunset he wasn't comfortable with her working with Barry cause he was jealous. She could have ended that foolishness by pointing out Barry was married to a man in two sentences. Dude was a bigger hypocrite and jerk than Oscar was being.
Well, Oscar is redeemed, so technically there is no villain. Of course you could argue why not test another character's good/bad meter, it's consistent
I think the reaction everyone had to them being a couple was more of a 2000's reaction than a current reaction. The current reaction I think from Oscar is that he married a white dude and not that he's gay. He would even tell jokes why gay brothers have to choose white dudes and not fellow brothers like him. Also again the backlash at school against Maya having two dads feels again more 2000's, especially in California which already was very LGBT open. So, I imagine the actual reaction would her getting a lot of positive questions from students until someone secretly starts spouting homophobia at her and she doesn't know who it is. Maybe that guy also starts targeting Michael and other students. Maybe to show that hate can still manifest in tolerant times. And again these days Zoe wouldn't be divided she would be making sure by the student body to find out who is behind this and try to denounce hard.
Yeah it seems like it followed the guidelines of the old episode where Michael was being teased. Nowadays, more kids and teens have a "so what" approach about these kind of things. They did include that but the teasing and "double daddy" comment did seem outdated.
@@TonyTurner It kind of shows the writers are behind the times which is pretty weird considering the younger writers on this show. Seriously, it should have been the gang getting down to the mystery of someone sending nasty stuff to Maya and other students who are LGBT or have LGBT parents. The mystery person could someone you would expect or not expect. Or maybe end on a note they don't find the person just like that episode of Sesame Street we don't know who the racist person is but we end on a note that despite there being racist people you can defy their bigotry by living life to your fullest and proving them wrong.
Maybe it’s cause I live in the south but teens definitely still care and make fun of people. They just don’t make fun of them directly to their faces because half the gay kids (at my school atleast) would beat their ass lmaoo
@@strange0130 I gotta see some of these Southern Gay kids. Their parents must have taught them some skills.The South ain't the same as California. South are more upfront and as you said in the Southern states they also can kick your butt if you dare mock them.
More on it being “inconsistent” with them not allowing their kids around their dads and not Micheal is due to a lot of lgbtq prejudice that does happen against adults being how gay adults are called “predators” and unsafe around children (tho that is wrong, for many reasons) and seeing a kid being lgbtq is easier to slide under the rug being “oh he’s confused” or “it’s a phase”
What frustrating about the episode is Dijonay never got punished for what she did only Penny called her out on it. When the episode ended typical Dijonay what the fuck man. I hate her character so much. Not a fan of reboot itself should have been left alone. I don't like how Maya hangs with gang after she bad mouth each one of them first episode.
Then we really haven't progressed from the first episode of *the Facts of Life* 45 years ago where one of the girls thought that showing affection to another girl and being a tomboy automatically made her a lesbian without actually saying the L word.
The interesting thing I’ve noticed about interracial couples gay or straight is that 99% of the time they have a white person. Sometimes you’ll see a black and East Asian couple but rarely is it two dark skinned or brown people together. Maybe I’m just out of the loop though.
The solution to this would be to have broad interracial relationship representation, which means more than just black person in a relationship with a white person. I would also love to see interracial couples celebrating their cultures.
I have a children's book I wrote that has two same-sex parents where one of the parents was shamed by her own family for wanting to marry a girl fairy over a boy fairy. Now you are wondering fairies??? It is a fairy book called I want to be whatever fairy I want to be. It's about teaching kids to be more open with telling your parents what you want to be and not what they you to be and it tackles issues regarding this and it has different types of fairies like, fairy godmothers, tooth fairies, forest fairies, season fairies and sweet dream fairies that are based off careers in the modern world. It also teaches parents to be more understanding of their children's wants and needs in their future careers.
Well I’m not surprised proud family would tackle this, considering it’s always been a woke show. And is another example why Dijonay is such crap friend. What is so great about her? Just like the last proud family, and is incredibly two-faced. And yes I know all the other friends are bad too, except Zoey, but she’s the worst one. Still, a nice episode.
I'm glad where geting more shows with gay characters shows like steven universe owl house she ra harley quin helluva boss and hazbin hotel show that these type of relationships aren't stopping anytime soon
16:44 *OMG* This reminds me of one time I was still living w my mom. I was watching a movie w her and my siblings and these two guys (which they’re relationship had me screaming w joy) but they were getting it on and my mom was just like “ew no, im sorry (My nickname), I can’t do this- I don’t know how you watch this stuff” It was a bit sad she didn’t really get into the story and got put off the show because of one scene. And she always accused me of being bi for the way i dress
Say what you will having two dads would be awesome. Thats two fathers. As a male a boy needs a father in his life for guidance but twice that many would be soo much I terms of what they can teach.
Maya might not have played the activist role here because there are more stakes. Sometimes it’s harder to fight for yourself than it is to fight for something you have no personal stakes in. It might have also been her attempting to say she was too strong to react to such childish behaviour.
I like that you brought up the discourse over Barry and Randall's physical designs because it's something that kinda annoyed me a bit. I'm not a poc, but I am queer and fat. I actually really like when queer couples are portrayed with different body types. There's an entire community of men who find fat, hairy men or "bears" sexy and attractive. I know Proud Family doesn’t have a great record of portraying fat people, so it's a breath of fresh air to see them have a couple with a thin man and a fat man and have them be mutually attracted to one another and not have it be made into a joke or a lesson to learn. Again, I'm white, so I don't want to speak too much on the racial implications of the character design, but I think it's unfair to automatically deem a black man being short and fat as automatically problematic when his appearance is not commented on by the narrative. There are short, fat black gay men in real life and there's is nothing wrong with any of those traits, especially not to the men that, again in real life, are in relationships with them.
Great comment. It irks me when there is talk about representation, but cherry-picking and hypocrisy behind it. It sends a message that a group is only acceptable if they look a cerain way.
I didn't like the reboot because its just bad. But i always loves Randall's design. I found him as the Father who could Most likely Emotionally connect with his kids. And Barry could But, Probably has Generation problems due to being in the military. having Randel Being on the chubbier side could be very telling of how much he loves his husband. I don't think he's ugly. Though I know how little interracial couples same sex or not is portrayed. Especially Same sex, Everyone always makes the POC look.....Off, next to their lover. But i think Barry and Randall Fit Because their designs bounce off each other with Shape Language. But we all know how much of a riot would be out there if the Black Character was fit, and the white one Was on the chunkier side...Or maybe not? Since people have been really into Dad bods lately. Its just.....Weird. in all hindsight.
Do people often kiss each other on the lips at the workplace, in front of customers? I thought it was a cheek kiss or something till you showed the screenshot. Idk why they had to go that hard on it. I feel like that in itself might be bad rep. I'm not saying anything is wrong with it, but I could see it being weaponized as "look at these gay people being inappropriate." Maybe a "love you honey" or something would've been enough.
I’m aroace and I find it uncomfortable to see people kiss each other on the lips regardless of orientation. Not to mention it’s very unprofessional to make out with your romantic partner at work. Considering the show’s rating is PG, I do agree that a “love you, honey” or something small would’ve have been enough.
Honestly, I never really cared about Randall, I find him to be the most boring character in the show. Barry is a tall, strong undercover cop who's a great cook...Barry works at a bank and is bad at cooking. That's all we know about him. When it comes to relationships, personality, or something relatable, Randall definitely got the short end of the stick. I find his personality to be flat, and him as a character not at all interesting or engaging.
I noticed with most male same sex couples on TV, it goes into the cliche of someone, no matter what they look like always falling for the talk, muscular, has abs, supermodel dude and I am always like why? Girls on tv go for this. Guys on tv go for this. I also notice this happens with someone who, like Randall, no matter what race they are falling for what seems like the superficial version of a guy. To me it feels weird especially if some scenes slip into fetish kind of territory. Just to add some clarity, I am not against many of these couples. These are my observations on how media portrays them.
As an artist I have also noticed a bit of a thing that happens which is honestly low key homophobia. It happens when ever well known characters are shipped and drawn together usually gay or lesbian ships. People responding to the artwork then to bark front to back about how they see the two as good friends or reasons as to why they shouldn't be together....but you never see this argument whenever they are shipped with another opposite gendered character. Just thought I'd bring this up...cause it's interesting how it is...just, let people ship in peace and be respectful, LORD.
I thought Randal is a cute soft character. You can tell he was cute when he was younger and got the family man bod. Barry probably doesn't have it because he needed to be active for his job. On a surface level they are a cute couple. But the show wrote them so badly. They are used as a plot device. Instead of them just being two people who love each other. Each of their appearance is a lesson. The gay relation in adventure time was treated alot better. Because it showed that gay characters can be affectionate even doing mundane things.
And I'm not sure why , but . I feel like this would of been more the reaction in the 2000's , and vice versa. This episode feels more dated . I feel like the kids would pick on someone like Micheal now like they did then and this episode in particular felt even earlier then that. It felt weird Oscar being so disturbed by it. Maybe I'm bias but the characters seemed not only inconsistent but maybe even regressed.
(Not talking about Tony Obviously) Yeah,I'm sorry But I Think it makes sense for Suga Moma NOT to be Homophobic...Alot of Elders are Surprisingly Accepting,Also I think when you're in Suga Momma's Place and Have Lived her Life,2 men kissing and being in a Relationship is Probably the least of your Worries,
Honestly they could have a problem with Maya's dads and not have a problem with Michael because they see what he's going through as just a phase. The whole just a phase mindset does tend to happen to a lot of gays kids when they finally come out. No one will acknowledge that they are gay and treat it as just a phase but Maya's dads are full grown adults and can't just be going through a phase
I think the reason why the girl with two dads isn't reacting to the bullying is because if she did react all the people against them will point and say 'Look they're the negative stereotype! See! They got angry!'
I feel like there are many different ways to represent the gay community in media. There's some really not great ones, but I also don't think there's one "right" way to do it either. I like stories lie this where they tackle these kind if issues, expecially when it's done as respecfully as it is here, but I also like stories like The Owl House where it's just there. The struggles need to be talked about, but it's also important to show it as just no big deal, and perfectly normal. Cause it IS normal.
This episode came off a bit forced bc earlier in the reboot oscar jokes that penny can dance w/ Micheal bc he ''wasnt worried about Michael.'' bc...obvious reasons. Made it seem like oscar would be the main adult ok w/ gay. The fact disney chose oscar was way out of character.
3:03 that is so valid i remember that i used t be like that but i feel like that was worse for me i was made fun of and bullied for until i was 14 all the way to 5 about the gay thing when i said i "like guys" i mean friends but my family took that the other way i was bullied for 9 damn years for that and that made me homophobic and racist was a given for my dad was a hardcore racist when my sister went gay i made fun of her said she wasn't really gay and all that wich was true because she went full on straight a year ago now but that's not my point through self penace i realized that i was a asshole for no good reason and a bad person so i forced myself to be educated on that i forced myself to fully understand it all as punishment for my actions as a child all the way to a teen i got rid of all that bad shit and became supporting and encouraged even helped a lesbian couple to get together stood up for those people that where getting bullied even got into fights defending them in my remaining years in highschool became "WOKE" according to my ex friends but if getting mature and educated makes me Woke? Then i will gladly wear that shit all day.
So you asked what people think about the interracial gay couple pairings between black and white men. My short answer is: People will have an issue either way. Longer answer: Black people already have a stereotype out there that we are all athletic, muscular, masculine, and strong. This when applied to men is always met with favor. The upsetting side of that coin is that that same stereotype is thrown on black women to whom none of that is flattering (typically). In the black community, white men are often made fun of for being weak, scrawny, and maybe feminine. Adding on top of that the fact that they are gay would automatically lose "man points" for them in the black community. So the decision to make the white man attractive and classically masculine seems to be a way of balancing out that issue. If things were reversed, people would give less thought to the parts of the conversation that need to be had here. No issues with it -- although I have to admit that I haven't seen any of the PF reboot yet.
It's from episode 1. Maya is pretty judgemental and did not want to associate with Penny cause she don't share the same beliefs as her assuming her to be phony. Penny on the other hand just wanted to be her friend being that she is the new kid on the block. Long story short Maya insists that she proves her worth by breaking out a talking panda at the Zoo. Penny eventually saw the writing on the wall (figuratively) realizes how wrong this is but Maya refused to listen. Penny flat out calls Maya out for bad attitude and leaves. Back to present Maya seems to respect Penny after she defends her from the Gross sisters. Seeing as all their other interactions have remained friendly/civil though they are not close. Penny's friend group is still pretty flakey. Unfortunately😒
@@alize0623 absolutely, it was hard to enjoy the development of the characters, it’s like right after a funny joke or a cool snippet of dialogue it would show someone having sex
One of the biggest issues I have with Barry and Randall’s relationship doesn’t come up in this episode but comes up in a later episode. Of the two Randall seems more morally bankrupt than Barry and while this episode clearly demonstrates his questionable morals better than later episodes, it was the episode where he tells Barry “do something with your white privilege” when the police were arresting the kids during an illegal protest. Barry isn’t just an attractive, muscular white guy who married a less attractive, less fit black guy. Barry was also a rich guy who likely married the wrong person without realizing it and it gave me the impression that Randall didn’t marry Barry because he loved him but that it was because of what Randall thought he could get by marrying Barry. I don’t know maybe I’m reading too much into it but Randall guilt tripping his partner into getting what he wants just felt all sorts of wrong to me, especially when Barry hadn’t actually done anything wrong.
3:02 - I was actually that “Tom boy” and had never understood other girls. I always played sports with the boys in elementary school. Tom Higgins would call me a lesbian and then I’d kick his ass, even though I didn’t know what a lesbian was. Hahahaha. Fast forward to adulthood and… turns out he was right. HAHAHAHAHA.
I've seen this argument somewhere. Probably by idiots online or in the media, but I've seen people say that being gay is fine, but raising a kid is a no no because now you're "poisoning their minds into thinking being gay is okay". Like "we tolerate you for being different, but you don't get the same rights as us straight people".
I think the reason why maya was so tired of this because it happened at her old shcool and the reason(probably)why they let them hang out with Michael because he's still young and can"grow"out of it but barry and randell are two grown men and probably affected the children they adopted
Yes. It’s annoying cause a lot of people even consider two boys holding hands as sexual. (Strange world) Even though if one was a girl, then it’s natural and cute. I notice that a lot of homosexuality is being turned synonymous to sexual stuff and kinky taboo lust. That gay people can’t be genuine and in love. It’s all just lust. I think it’s multiple factors, homophobia, but also the recent depictions of homosexual kids being extremely sexual in teen series. I see a lot and I don’t think it’s bad. But is it just me but there is a habit of having to have a sex scene after wards the reveal or have the gay guy be extremely sexual in his jokes. I don’t think the solution is to erase this kind of representation but introduce different kinds of situations to show gay relationships in a more wholistic manner. I think I see in most recent anime where homosexuality is more normalized. It’s treated “Like yeah that’s a thing” and the relationships are treated like any other straight couple. Another problem I noticed too that west media has to announce they are gay because straight is the default factory setting. But well this view is challenged if you look at how anime handles it or even k dramas. We don’t know the sexuality. Just cause they like girls doesn’t mean they aren’t bi. Or just cause they don’t announce their sexuality , doesn’t mean they are automatically straight.
A month late to this party, just found you last week and found this channel to be really insightful. Honestly, my opinions about the "typical" same sex couple setup is mostly for the, forgive me if i come off as rude, "typical ideal white man" so that they, specifically, can see that ANYONE, even a perceived blue collar white man, can still be happy with another man. As an olive toned female i cant say if thats true or not, but those men are they types ive seen personally who have this issue most and need to see it with their own eyes to realize its okay. (Bad example, but American Dad had something like this once where there was a lesbian couple raising kids and the "true american" dad had kidnapped the kids to take them to an anti-gay states to be "raised properly," only to realize that the kids werent any different from his own, even with two moms and returned them, realizing that gays and lesbians could still raise good "normal" families.) For appearances though, i don't hold a strong opinion, i find the black father more attractive myself, but attractiveness is subjective and should not be perceived as objectively "right" or "wrong" in any light. Even if you remove color and job from this it would still be "the tall, muscular, "conventionally attractive", man likes the short, chubby, nerdier man" and thats fine, no matter what race you tack onto it.
I think this episode was one of the worst of the reboot. The character inconsistencies alone were enough to ruin this for me. Homophobia is already a highly contentious topic in the states, but to give the character who learns the lesson be Oscar is….not the best. It’d make sense if Laceinga and Dijonay to act that way, but Zoe and Michael, it’s not working. It would’ve actually been a good way to get a character relationship with Mya and Michael going. Oscar is obsessed with money, I doubt he actually cares who’s giving it to him. But also, if Oscar’s this way, it’d naturally make sense Sugar Mama is that way as well. But, to have the character that not even the show takes seriously learn this lesson….it’s just not working.
Honestly I'm learning that some of the tomboy girls you go to school with ended up being nonbinary lesbian/queer identified. The funny thing about tomboy-ism in my region of the US. I live in the middle Appalachians and very rural and local non-binary AFAB explained this to me, is that our region has a lot of "country girls" and we are actually encouraged to take on more masculine roles and mannerism where I come from. The area is very anti-gay and anti-femme (historically) but "country girls" are the norm. I'm a cis woman and bi but I do remember getting picked on some for being "girly". I'm a very femme person.
8:00 if you fight against it then you get targetted harder. sounds like you're being shown both sides of it. one who defends himself and the other person waiting for it to blow over. activism won't make the homophobes like her and all. atleast that's how this video sounds to me for that part.
7:41 honestly as a gay black guy with a white boyfriend all i want is for there to be a mixed race couple where they BOTH equal, Either both of them are ugly, attractive,femmije masc etc it gets
I like to describe “phobia” by explaining that “hydrophobic” materials aren’t afraid of water, they reject water.
Good analogy ‼
Yes
Yeah a lot of ppl seem to drop the “aversion to” from the definition.
Wouldn't that be "hydroproof"
@@yanrokbowl28 no i think you mean water proof
Honestly it would’ve made more sense to have Sugar Mama be homophobic since she’s old school, but of course Oscar has to be the bad parent to always learn a lesson. 🙄
Yep
So cliche for them to make Oscar the ignorant one
See, I think this is just forcing to making Oscar worse… I mean, they just flat out ignore that Michael is infinitely more flamboyant.
This goes into my issue with them just bashing Oscar and finding ways TO JUSTIFY bashing Oscar.
I mean why can’t Trudy be the homophobic one? Give her some actual flaws that are her own instead of cause of Oscars shit?@@TonyTurner
Yup.
Dijonay being that one backstabbing two faced friend once again
She will never learn.
Surprised? She’s always been like that.
@@kaykay8855I’m not surprised. I would be surprised if she didn’t act like that.
Why won't they rewrite her so she's not like that? This character trait has stayed the same for 20 years
You can always count on Dijonay to be the messy one ‼
Dijonay is literally just an antagonist that just happens to be in the "friend" group.
That’s like, most of the friend group ☠️
Never watched the show but the first impression I would get from her was that she was the antagonist
She's the woke version of Cartman 😂
I kind of think Maya was trying to be the silent strong type that wasn't going to acknowledge people's foolishness. Shes a girl that would take pride in that despite her usually being more vocal. She was probably telling herself that she's got other things to fight people on then people just being ignorant about her dads.
I can see that looking back. She was trying to take the high road but I wanted her to at least defend herself
I interpreted Maya's reaction in a similar way. Additionally, I think this may be too close to home for her in order for her to approach it with the more outspoken attitude she uses in most other situations.
Right ✅️ I think it also hits home because it's so personal to maya. Sometimes it can be more comfortable to advocate for something outside of yourself.
@@TownieSimBuildsi agree
The fact that dijoney basically spread online that maya and her brother had 2 gay dads which led to them being bullied and didn’t get any sort of consequences for her gross behavior is so trashy.
for real where's the teaching moment on outing people like that, at least as a side lesson? even just penny calling her out afterward? =[
Like, why didn't Dijonay get in trouble with the school? I thought, especially in California where this show takes place, that stuff gets SERIOUS fast now?
As much as I dislike Maya, I get why she was quiet.
Atleast in my experience, it's easier to fight for and defend others than it is to fight for yourself.
That's a fair point ‼
There's also the higher chances of Black students getting suspended/expelled, which is why Maya had played it smart.
I think Maya is more sensitive when it comes to her family especially talking about her adoption because she doesn't have the "typical" family. Everyone has weaknesses I think her family is one.
You brought up a good point about Barry & Randall being too much for people to handle, but Michael was okay for people. But I don't believe it's inconsistency with the writing. I believe it's hypocrisy! People are fine with someone being gay as long as they're single, but the moment they find out that same gay person have a boyfriend or husband then all hell breaks loose! It's the jealousy and hypocrisy for me that I can't stand. They're not hurting anyone for being gay. Let them be themselves please. How would people like it if they got made fun of for something beyond their control? Y'all need to think about that. Thank you for the video Tony Turner
In my opinion, Michael didn't have to be as feminine as the girls. Case in point, going to the hair salon with girls in preparation for prom night and wearing sparkling pink like the rest of the girls.
@@abrahamisaacmuciusiii9192 yeah, but you know- gotta go as stereotypical as they come.
This!! 💯 When my family knew I was gay an immediate thing was for example my sister was determining along with her toxic husband if I should be around their kids or not basing me on some random damn videos probably from Facebook. I won't even tell them about any relationships cause at this point it's trifling. Just wanted to give a personal perspective
Michael was okay to people because they never really acknowledged it outside of one episode that I did not even know existed until a few years ago, "Who You Calling a Sissy". For the most part, everyone just saw him as a joke character, which happens a lot with queer characters in general especially in shows from the early 2000s.
Jealousy?
Confusion. Characters are confused. The plot is confused. The writers are confused. Everyone confused 😂
😅😅😅😅
The AUDIENCE is confused!
The main thing that frustrated me with the episode was the fact that they kind of ignore Micheal. I know he got an episode in the old series but he would’ve been better looked into in this episode.
In one of the parts it’s Penny that has to stand up for the kids and Micheal kind of hides behind his friends. I understand (as a pansexual gender queer person) that it is difficult to stand up for yourself against Homophobia and bigotry but I feel it wasn’t ulized enough in why Micheal could possibly relate to the two or want to hide behind his friends
I agree. Michael would have been the perfect character to help defend Maya and KG but they made him a shallow follower. Penny once again has to take on her role of being the mature protagonist
I feel like in general the argument of "well i dont want kids seeing two men or two women in love" is hypocritical. Look at a good chunk of disney movies and most animated movies and shows where the main characters are older teens/adults. Why when the princess and prince kiss or the resolution of the plot is a romantic kiss, that's ok for kids to watch. But if it was the exact same situation but with 2 women or 2 men, it would be considered inappropriate or sexual? Its a double standard. If anything, growing up I felt like heterosexual behavior was more reinforced than anything. If i took an interest in any tv character or had a friend that wasnt female, parents/other adults automatically assumed it was romantic when it wasnt and it was really uncomfortable. Bc that just sends the message that any interactions with the opposite gender is/has to be romantic. I'd also like to point out that "hiding" lgbt people from kids doesn't mean they will end up straight, bc i didn't know being gay was even a thing until half way through high school yet from childhood to now, i had little to no interest in guys but did have crushes on other girls. Everyone in the world isnt gonna be exactly alike and i dont understand why that concept is so hard for other people to grasp. As far as the media goes, i do feel that part of the problem is that lgbt relationships are overly sexualized, which is why people assume its something inappropriate as opposed to two people who love one another wanting to be together. It does bother me when black folks like Oscar are homophobic bc we know what it's like to be discriminated against and judged. So why would we turn around and do it to someone else?
Great points ‼
EXACTLY. Why do so many people view two men or two women even holding hands as sexual and "forcing an agenda". Kids movies can literally imply a man and a woman even doing it and we just laugh it off as an adult joke. So, what is this hypocrisy here?
Frfr
Exactly! The genders of the people kissing aren't what makes it sexual. Twilight was available in middle and high school libraries...it had sex and toxic relationships but because they were heterosexual couples, its a non-issue. It's like you said, insisting on only heterosexual representation reinforces that men and women can't be friends, that there has to be an attraction. And in doing so only reinforces for kids, and even adults, to harass and tease people for not dating or having crushes
these same parents could watch snow white with their kids and not give a shit about a guy kissing an unconscious woman (who he assumes is dead)
If you look closely, most of the tweets ARE positive.
It’s just the few negative ones are LOUD.
People were saying “yeah who cares” and sending positive messages.
But the few that were negative were just louder.
The problem is that the "who cares?" or "I don't care" comments can be taken as negative seeing as it could be interpreted as them choosing not to care about the issues that homosexual people face.
@@yanrokbowl28 or It’s the fact it’s none of their business.
@@therealopaartist Exactly what I'm saying. If someone does not see any problem with homosexual people, then that person must show their support for them instead of mere indifference.
The one thing that made me upset with this episode was that Penny was seen as a bad guy by Maya/KG, and not Dijonay. Penny was the only one who outright stood up for Maya/KG (Michael himself didn't want to stand with both of them). Dijonay was the one who outed them.
This is my main problem with the reboot series: the person that needs to be held accountable usually isn't (ex. Trudy locking Penny out and isn't labeled as a bad parent, Zoey briefly dating Noah and is somehow the villain).
Dijonay gets away with too much shit, and never has to account for it.
Have you thought about why? Considering that Penny knew exactly how Dijonay operated, you think she would have just left Dijonay out.
Plus, Michael himself is homosexual, so if he was standing up as well, he would be dismissed as biased just because he's the same sexual orientation as Maya and KG's fathers'.
That was a goof. I think maya and kg were written as if they have known Dijonay and penny long enough to have certain expectations when they shouldn't because they just met these kids. It's like they expected this behavior from dijonay but expected better than a savior-complex from penny. But again, they don't know them well enough to hold that attitude
Yeah but Maya wouldn’t fit into Penny’s “friend” group if she wasn’t also toxic
Zoey was innocent it that case, Noah just chose her and she left him (they weren’t really together tho)
I’ve always been uncomfortable with kissing scenes as a kid. I was the type of kid who literally ran away from the TV anytime something of the sort happened.😭
But yeah, I totally agree with your point about how weird it is that no one ever had a problem with a man and a woman kissing on screen, but as soon as a same sex couple do LITERALLY THE SAME THING, it’s like “OMG? The heck y’all doing?”
I think it’s cause people treat it like it’s unnatural and now they have to explain the entire concept of gayness to their child like it’s foreign. Even though it’s the same reason of “They love eachother.”
Ikr
Lust: the other 4 letter word that starts with L.
Yes but at the same time some families might feel that their kids might get confused and call themselves gay and/or the family belief based on culture/religon. Also, same sex is sometimes considered “abnormal”in some cases.
Also, some lgbtq shows try to convince kids that they are gay to get them to be like them
So yeah, that’s why ppl view it differently.😊
@@barringtonbaby7952 What shows with queer representation convinces children that they’re queer? Queer representation doesn’t turn people queer. There’s lots of straight characters on TV and some people didn’t turn out to be straight. Besides, queer adults were once queer children who were closeted and they discovered their identity over time.
@@SodaCider641 not any specific show, just in general. Some people (myself not included) feel like their kids might feel like they have to be gay/ be an ally because a character from their show is/because they want to be special in a way/ because they might feel that if a character is gay/other characters support it, they, in their not fully mature minds think they have to do the same
I'm not sure if i'm wrong or not but out of this reboot, when it comes to the parents, it's always Oscar who seems to have the problems with certain situations and is always the one that has to learn a lesson. Never Trudy, nor Sugar Mama, it's always him who seems to start conflicts or be in the wrong.
That's true. They always make Oscar the ignorant one. Same thing when they learned that Bebe has Autism
@@TonyTurner Yeah, and when Trudy made a bad parenting move by locking Penny out, she didn't see any errors in her way or learn the harsh way like Oscar. Heck it seemed like her action was swept under the table.
@@TonyTurner Oscar’s just shit on by everyone and every thing.
Why is Michael able to slay and being gay in the group but having two fathers with kids in the school is suddenly a crime!?
Right ‼ There goes the inconsistencies in the writing again
@@TonyTurnerDisney can't gay, Disney can't black, Disney can't do much of anything.
@@TonyTurnerI think it’s because Oscar thought that Michael was going through a phase.
Well we don’t know that for sure, he could just be flamboyant
Or it could be a phase, but when adults come in to the play,and they are married or anything that is seen as “abnormal”, for the kids and other adults, it’s a problem
@@barringtonbaby7952 You need to remember that in this particular reboot, he's seen dating guys over and over. The crew themselves doesn't shy away from it, even during the school dance scene in episode 1, Michael is seen with a boy and when Penny in season 2 of louder and prouder is looking for Bebe, Michael is on a date with Make-Up Boy
That boy is Gay AF
Thank you for covering this ... I was so confused with Oscar not wanting to let Penny hang out with maya and kg because they have two dads but he lets penny hang out with micheal and he is gay i don't know if the writers forget that part ...
Right, it's a little inconsistency with the writing because Oscar has never shown a disliking to Michael. He actually feels more comfortable that Penny hangs out with Michael since he doesn't have to worry about them liking each other in a romantic way
@@TonyTurner I’ll be honest, that might be the only disreputable thing about Oscar that I think is kind of clever.
I mean, they make Oscar homophobic to have him be unaccepting of two dads, they make him ignorant of autism to have him be “somethings wrong with my son”, they make him weak-willed at Trudy locking Penny out of the house, and that’s in addition to all the usual shit he gets every day.
They just bash Oscar for no reason, and then just decide to make him wrong about everything. How is it nobody felt SORRY for the damn guy?
@@TonyTurner that actually does feel consistant lol He was only fine with micheal because he wouldn’t date Penny but (before this episode) if he saw micheal with a boyfriend he probably would have thought it was gross
@@strange0130 I don’t think it would make him say she couldn’t hang out with him anymore, though.
I think with Michael some adults can view his queerness as "a phase" that he's going through and that "he'll grow out of it". Also, I highly doubt a good chunk of parents know him heck they would have even known about Maya's parents if not for the tweet outing them.
Q---r is a slur. Flagged.
@Attmay well it used to be derogatory but is now just another way to refer to us. We don’t see it as a bad word. I suppose it depends on how you use it but saying Queer isn’t a bad word.
Think of it like how Gay used to be used derogatory but now means homosexual.
Agreed. Besides, just because someone tolerates you doesn’t mean they accept or like you. The way they treat you because you’re different in a certain way (race, religion, gender identity, disability, orientation, etc) is a sign of that.
So it kinda does make sense that they are ok with the kids having a gay friend because then it's "oh well he's going through a phase and will grow out of it" but being friends with two kids that have two dads it's "I don't want them to corrupt my child into thinking this is normal". I'm not homophobic but I assume that's how their mind works.
As someone who has been consistently “othered” saying I’m not black or weird or sensitive I don’t discriminate against anyone of any race or sexual orientation. I judge people by what they bring to the table. If they r mean & rude I don’t mess with them but if they r cool & nice & get along with others I’m down to be their friend.
I don't have so much of a problem with Maya being quiet as soon as she was a part of the targeted harassment. I, personally, am a queer person. I have absolutely zero issue becoming some one else's defense. I can identify a problem and take action against it. I hate it when something goes sideways based on things NOBODY CAN CHANGE. That makes me so mad. That shouldn't be the case. I'll be openly against that kind of thing. But when it comes to my variety of queerness? My quirks? I have self-doubt. I don't know if I know me as well as I think I do. I am an evolving and changing person. Should I speak up? The hate gets to me in ways, too. I depend on other queer people to have my back, I can't advocate for me if I think I'm the problem. Maya is depending on someone to not be a bigot and make things worse before she can find her voice, that's natural. She wants to solve problems, not be one.
Just got a say I like your voice man..I never been this focused on hearing someone talk.
Wow. Thank You ‼
Great video bro!
This is eye opening in many ways. Homophobia exists and people find positive ways to challenge it. It's cool and important to be an ally. This episode teaches the reality of bullying and awareness. Keep up the amazing work!!! 💯
Thank You ‼
@@TonyTurner Your welcome!!
I don't know what was worse during the kiss scene, the fact that the kiss was animated to be hideous, or that they kept switching back and forth between the kiss and Oscar's shocked reaction, most likely causing seizures if not just miniscule disgust.
I can't even tell if the latter was making the former appear gross, or if the former was so grossly done that the latter had to deflect the viewers' perspective.
I definitely think a part of the reason people are against the sex scenes in general is because of the oversaturation. I don't care if someone is gay or straight, but I cringe when romantical displays of affection as are shown. I can't even watch super hero shows without a sex scene or people making out show up for uncomfortable lengths of time. Stuff you'd think would be okay for teenagers to watch is filled with mature content of all kinds.
I think it's because of the fact it's a combination of poor writing and acting to make the moment feel awkward. I shouldn't feel uncomfortable seeing people kiss, and I definitely shouldn't be subjected to watching 2 people wrestle in bed in the movie theater.
Call me a sensitive snowflake but I am more than proud to admit it on this front. People can make stories where those things can be not only wholesome, but tasteful. It's been done before. The power to imply is a powerful tool in cinema. I and many others shouldn't have to feel like I'm in the room watching people doing the horizonal tango.
Being gay is fine as long it's not overly done like some really think they women or men never liked no form of pda straight gay bi whatever keep that shid at home
I don’t like sex scenes or romantic scenes in general because they always felt forced.
True ‼ Like I was saying, I feel they emphasize sex scenes so much in TV shows and movies nowadays. It basically goes on the borderline of being softcore p*rn
As someone who is aro and ace I completely agree
@@kaykay8855100 percent
You know an annoying concept is that people say if a gay couple raises a kid the kid will "turn gay" which is obviously not true. At this point human social intelligence should've never existed. It always seems like if youre different people feel to have an immediate opinion on you. And to the point where the government has the audacity to determine whether a human can have rights or not. Thats insane to me.
So according to the concept, if someone has a bisexual kid, they are to forbid said kid from having _any_ friends?
Blame religion
@@yanrokbowl28 I'm not sure if people who believe in that concept extend it to kids. That's what I've heard. I guess it's person who's different will pass it on to others-im assuming that's how they see it. I personally don't believe that.
@@SugarSista820yeah ik, I do
Fr
They dont make any effort into anymore,Loved ur channel
ps:Hugs from mexico and korea
Thank You ‼
I like how Dijonay get's no punishment for doing what she did...
Actually everyone being fine with Micheal but not the two dads feels accurate to me. So many people are fine with gay people until they start BEING gay (aka being in a relationship)
So it feels kinda true to life that the parents would be fine with micheal (who they might think is “in a phase” or something) but not with to grown men who are gay and with eachother
It’s all the concept of “I’m okay with gay people just don’t shove it down our throats” (aka don’t be flamboyant and don’t have a gay relationship. It sounds so stupid but homophobia is inherently stupid lol)
Yayyy...reminder that people hate me for who I like. Honestly, this one hit really close to home. I hate in when people get all defensive or god forbid 'they're faking it' or 'are you really into guys/girls'. Yes, I am. Please stop being dicks about it, yes, I like both. I really do enjoy that they showed adults being homosexual. But being a queer kid in school is a really rough experience, I kinda wish they would have gone into that more. As a bisexual person who, by law, is technically still a child. I am very sensitive and get very pissed whenever people, especially kids, act homophobic, it reminds me that it really is just their parents, which is just sad.
Fr I'm still figuring out my sexuality and such and am legally a child so it really hurts me and makes me feel unsafe when I hear such jokes at my school
tbh im glad i reazlixed i was bi at 17-18, instead of earlier even tho some signs were there, bc meant i went clueless until almost finishing hs so i didnt have to eat all the bs other teens did ._. ig sth good came out of realizing later
Surprisingly, as someone who grew up with his dad dating another man, this is pretty accurate. I was reluctant to tell people as a kid that my dad was bisexual and into men, as most of the time I'd either get teased or people would make it weird and treating it different from other straight couples. Even my mom usually didn't wanna talk about it even though they were divorced, cause it was awkward and something that people always commented on.
Proud family actually made an accurate episode for once.
As someone who is very queer; I honestly understood pretty much Maya's attitude.
I had a friend outing me when I was in high school, and while not outright bullying like this, there were issues, people being assholes, etc; and you just...get tired of it, on a sense. At some point you learn when is worth to fight something, and when is like 'aaaand there it is,' and just move on with your life because you don't have the energy or the time for this.
I am normally not passive when is about my queer friends and love ones, but I can see why at some point you just try to ignore it.
11:07 that’s actually a mindset some people have, my friends dad hated the fact that another one of our friends had 2 moms but he was fine when our gay guy friend joined the group, I think it’s like a whole “well the guy isn’t tryna get with my daughter” but also the whole “2 dads is unnatural” thing idk for sure tho
About the interracial gay couple thing, I've noticed that the black dad is always heavier?? (not to bring race into it, it's just something I noticed.) It's in the Loud House and The Hollow.)
I haven’t watched The Hollow but I used to watch the Loud House and have watched some clips of Louder and Prouder, so I do get what you’re saying. I don’t know why the character designers go with that particular design for an interracial gay couple. One solution to this is to have broad mlm (man loving man) representation. There can be couples who have different body types that aren’t just tall and skinny/fat and short or tall and muscular/short and stout, interracial couples that aren’t just black man in a relationship with a white man, polyamorous fathers, disabled queer men, etc. I wish the individual creators of the shows took more risks with character design. I’ve seen creators of queer OCs get praised for their wonderfully beautiful, distinct, diverse designs.
Great video,right on point.Can u also do an episode of the proud family black history month episode,keep it up
That one is coming soon. Thank You ‼
Here's the biggest problem with this episode, didn't they already tackled this issue in the original series called "who you calling a sizzy?", where it focus on Michael? Did the creators seriously forget about that episode, let alone the original series of the Proud Family?
To be fair “didn’t they already tackle this issue” is a common thing with reboots. I mean look at all the 2016 powerpuff girl episodes that are inferior to stories already done in the original.
7:42 I think it definitely could be better and I also think it matters how you do it for example gravity falls has a very suggested gay couple with one being a tall white man the other being a shorter more round man of colour but there written in a way that’s endearing
Imagine being so bothered by two men/women living their lives in peace 😂😂 I don’t get it like why?
So I just want to make something clear you may not have understood and a lot of people have misunderstood this in the past. Gender identity and sexuality are 2 different things. You can be a gay man and be very masculine or be very feminine or somewhere in between the same goes for lesbians being what I believe you call Tom boys. I really appreciate you trying to spread awareness and acceptance I just thought I’d clear up a misunderstanding. I also understand where maya is coming from sometimes it’s easier to be an activist and speak up for others and it’s harder to speak up when you are closer to the subject.
11:10 this isnt an inconsistent in the writing people are fine with gay feminine men but have issue with a gay masculine men
Because it challenges stereotypes, and it makes gay people harder to single out from everybody else. That's why boomers fall back on the same tired stereotype of the prancing nelly ka-WEEN and think it's okay for heterosexuals to play us but not for whites to play nonwhites.
The following points are what made this episode so aggravating.
Dijonnay running her mouth to everyone about Maya and KG's dad just for the sake of having something to talk about cemented for me that she's incapable of fully respecting others. Her character was the one that should've been removed from the show instead of Sticky.
Two, why does Oscar have to be the designated villain of this episode. It's bad enough he's the punching bag of the series, but they can let someone else be the jerk. Got too many to pick from to just keep using Oscar. And heck, even from the perspective of a Black gay man, I'd be uncomfortable seeing another couple being all love dovy in front me regardless of genders.
Third, Felix should have stopped acting like a baby and told Sunset he wasn't comfortable with her working with Barry cause he was jealous. She could have ended that foolishness by pointing out Barry was married to a man in two sentences. Dude was a bigger hypocrite and jerk than Oscar was being.
Heck, yours could have segwayed into FELIX being the one with a problem.
And yes, they just always have to hate on Oscar…
Well, Oscar is redeemed, so technically there is no villain. Of course you could argue why not test another character's good/bad meter, it's consistent
I think the reaction everyone had to them being a couple was more of a 2000's reaction than a current reaction. The current reaction I think from Oscar is that he married a white dude and not that he's gay. He would even tell jokes why gay brothers have to choose white dudes and not fellow brothers like him. Also again the backlash at school against Maya having two dads feels again more 2000's, especially in California which already was very LGBT open. So, I imagine the actual reaction would her getting a lot of positive questions from students until someone secretly starts spouting homophobia at her and she doesn't know who it is. Maybe that guy also starts targeting Michael and other students. Maybe to show that hate can still manifest in tolerant times. And again these days Zoe wouldn't be divided she would be making sure by the student body to find out who is behind this and try to denounce hard.
Yeah it seems like it followed the guidelines of the old episode where Michael was being teased. Nowadays, more kids and teens have a "so what" approach about these kind of things. They did include that but the teasing and "double daddy" comment did seem outdated.
@@TonyTurner It kind of shows the writers are behind the times which is pretty weird considering the younger writers on this show. Seriously, it should have been the gang getting down to the mystery of someone sending nasty stuff to Maya and other students who are LGBT or have LGBT parents. The mystery person could someone you would expect or not expect. Or maybe end on a note they don't find the person just like that episode of Sesame Street we don't know who the racist person is but we end on a note that despite there being racist people you can defy their bigotry by living life to your fullest and proving them wrong.
Maybe it’s cause I live in the south but teens definitely still care and make fun of people. They just don’t make fun of them directly to their faces because half the gay kids (at my school atleast) would beat their ass lmaoo
@@strange0130 I gotta see some of these Southern Gay kids. Their parents must have taught them some skills.The South ain't the same as California. South are more upfront and as you said in the Southern states they also can kick your butt if you dare mock them.
@@92JazzQueen southern teens have no chill. I swear there’s a fight atleast once a month 😂
More on it being “inconsistent” with them not allowing their kids around their dads and not Micheal is due to a lot of lgbtq prejudice that does happen against adults being how gay adults are called “predators” and unsafe around children (tho that is wrong, for many reasons) and seeing a kid being lgbtq is easier to slide under the rug being “oh he’s confused” or “it’s a phase”
Hey there Tony awesome video pal keep them coming dude
Thank You ‼
@@TonyTurner you’re welcome brother
What frustrating about the episode is Dijonay never got punished for what she did only Penny called her out on it. When the episode ended typical Dijonay what the fuck man. I hate her character so much. Not a fan of reboot itself should have been left alone. I don't like how Maya hangs with gang after she bad mouth each one of them first episode.
I hated Dijonay this episode she deserves some real karma
I hate Dijonay in EVERY episode. XD get on my level!
Seriously, she’s a karma dodger…
Anyone else notice they never used the words Gay or Homosexual in the episode?
Then we really haven't progressed from the first episode of *the Facts of Life* 45 years ago where one of the girls thought that showing affection to another girl and being a tomboy automatically made her a lesbian without actually saying the L word.
The interesting thing I’ve noticed about interracial couples gay or straight is that 99% of the time they have a white person. Sometimes you’ll see a black and East Asian couple but rarely is it two dark skinned or brown people together. Maybe I’m just out of the loop though.
A lot of ppl have said the same thing
The solution to this would be to have broad interracial relationship representation, which means more than just black person in a relationship with a white person. I would also love to see interracial couples celebrating their cultures.
I have a children's book I wrote that has two same-sex parents where one of the parents was shamed by her own family for wanting to marry a girl fairy over a boy fairy. Now you are wondering fairies??? It is a fairy book called I want to be whatever fairy I want to be. It's about teaching kids to be more open with telling your parents what you want to be and not what they you to be and it tackles issues regarding this and it has different types of fairies like, fairy godmothers, tooth fairies, forest fairies, season fairies and sweet dream fairies that are based off careers in the modern world. It also teaches parents to be more understanding of their children's wants and needs in their future careers.
Wow. That sounds really interesting. Is it available anywhere?
@@TonyTurner yes Amazon
@ericastones152 Gonna check it out ‼
What’s the book called?
@@JamboreeBlackberry I Want To Be Whatever Fairy I Want To Be
Good video! Also really love that shirt!
Thank You ‼
Well I’m not surprised proud family would tackle this, considering it’s always been a woke show. And is another example why Dijonay is such crap friend. What is so great about her? Just like the last proud family, and is incredibly two-faced. And yes I know all the other friends are bad too, except Zoey, but she’s the worst one.
Still, a nice episode.
Actually Zoey can just as bad as the rest of Penny’s friends. When the going gets tough, she’ll flake on you. There are multiple instances on the show
@@Karlos1234ify NOBODY is “just as bad” as Dijonay… sorry, that’s just facts.
@@battybuddy True enough. Zoey is weak willed and will cave due to peer pressure or the idea of being famous
@@Karlos1234ify exactly.
My bi peeps, check in 👀✅
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I'm glad where geting more shows with gay characters shows like steven universe owl house she ra harley quin helluva boss and hazbin hotel show that these type of relationships aren't stopping anytime soon
All media needs to be 100% gay 100% of the time, especially Disney movies.
@@Attmay not exactly there should be some representation and that means including everyone
Fr though I agree
TONYYYYYY I WATCH AND LIKE YOUR VIDEOS, BUT I HAVE NOT COMMENTED IN AWHILE!!! Keeep going!!
Thank You ‼
@@TonyTurnerlmaoo tony do you remember me from the beginning of your videos? My name was Devon smith?? Lmaoo
16:44 *OMG*
This reminds me of one time I was still living w my mom. I was watching a movie w her and my siblings and these two guys (which they’re relationship had me screaming w joy) but they were getting it on and my mom was just like “ew no, im sorry (My nickname), I can’t do this- I don’t know how you watch this stuff”
It was a bit sad she didn’t really get into the story and got put off the show because of one scene. And she always accused me of being bi for the way i dress
Say what you will having two dads would be awesome. Thats two fathers. As a male a boy needs a father in his life for guidance but twice that many would be soo much I terms of what they can teach.
Maya might not have played the activist role here because there are more stakes. Sometimes it’s harder to fight for yourself than it is to fight for something you have no personal stakes in. It might have also been her attempting to say she was too strong to react to such childish behaviour.
I like that you brought up the discourse over Barry and Randall's physical designs because it's something that kinda annoyed me a bit. I'm not a poc, but I am queer and fat. I actually really like when queer couples are portrayed with different body types. There's an entire community of men who find fat, hairy men or "bears" sexy and attractive.
I know Proud Family doesn’t have a great record of portraying fat people, so it's a breath of fresh air to see them have a couple with a thin man and a fat man and have them be mutually attracted to one another and not have it be made into a joke or a lesson to learn. Again, I'm white, so I don't want to speak too much on the racial implications of the character design, but I think it's unfair to automatically deem a black man being short and fat as automatically problematic when his appearance is not commented on by the narrative. There are short, fat black gay men in real life and there's is nothing wrong with any of those traits, especially not to the men that, again in real life, are in relationships with them.
Great comment. It irks me when there is talk about representation, but cherry-picking and hypocrisy behind it. It sends a message that a group is only acceptable if they look a cerain way.
I didn't like the reboot because its just bad. But i always loves Randall's design. I found him as the Father who could Most likely Emotionally connect with his kids. And Barry could But, Probably has Generation problems due to being in the military.
having Randel Being on the chubbier side could be very telling of how much he loves his husband. I don't think he's ugly.
Though I know how little interracial couples same sex or not is portrayed. Especially Same sex, Everyone always makes the POC look.....Off, next to their lover. But i think Barry and Randall Fit Because their designs bounce off each other with Shape Language. But we all know how much of a riot would be out there if the Black Character was fit, and the white one Was on the chunkier side...Or maybe not? Since people have been really into Dad bods lately. Its just.....Weird. in all hindsight.
Great discussion Tony!! Where’s the mj biopic at?! 😮
Coming soon as more comes out ‼
Do people often kiss each other on the lips at the workplace, in front of customers? I thought it was a cheek kiss or something till you showed the screenshot. Idk why they had to go that hard on it. I feel like that in itself might be bad rep. I'm not saying anything is wrong with it, but I could see it being weaponized as "look at these gay people being inappropriate." Maybe a "love you honey" or something would've been enough.
Right, they were really going for shock value ‼
I’m aroace and I find it uncomfortable to see people kiss each other on the lips regardless of orientation. Not to mention it’s very unprofessional to make out with your romantic partner at work. Considering the show’s rating is PG, I do agree that a “love you, honey” or something small would’ve have been enough.
Honestly, I never really cared about Randall, I find him to be the most boring character in the show. Barry is a tall, strong undercover cop who's a great cook...Barry works at a bank and is bad at cooking. That's all we know about him. When it comes to relationships, personality, or something relatable, Randall definitely got the short end of the stick.
I find his personality to be flat, and him as a character not at all interesting or engaging.
I noticed with most male same sex couples on TV, it goes into the cliche of someone, no matter what they look like always falling for the talk, muscular, has abs, supermodel dude and I am always like why?
Girls on tv go for this. Guys on tv go for this.
I also notice this happens with someone who, like Randall, no matter what race they are falling for what seems like the superficial version of a guy. To me it feels weird especially if some scenes slip into fetish kind of territory.
Just to add some clarity, I am not against many of these couples. These are my observations on how media portrays them.
And if they are fat, they are never just slightly overweight, but morbidly obese.
As an artist I have also noticed a bit of a thing that happens which is honestly low key homophobia. It happens when ever well known characters are shipped and drawn together usually gay or lesbian ships. People responding to the artwork then to bark front to back about how they see the two as good friends or reasons as to why they shouldn't be together....but you never see this argument whenever they are shipped with another opposite gendered character. Just thought I'd bring this up...cause it's interesting how it is...just, let people ship in peace and be respectful, LORD.
I thought Randal is a cute soft character. You can tell he was cute when he was younger and got the family man bod. Barry probably doesn't have it because he needed to be active for his job. On a surface level they are a cute couple. But the show wrote them so badly. They are used as a plot device. Instead of them just being two people who love each other. Each of their appearance is a lesson. The gay relation in adventure time was treated alot better. Because it showed that gay characters can be affectionate even doing mundane things.
And I'm not sure why , but . I feel like this would of been more the reaction in the 2000's , and vice versa. This episode feels more dated . I feel like the kids would pick on someone like Micheal now like they did then and this episode in particular felt even earlier then that. It felt weird Oscar being so disturbed by it. Maybe I'm bias but the characters seemed not only inconsistent but maybe even regressed.
Not really there are people who still feel this way
@@moonlightprincess449 Not as common as it was in the 2000's.
And not enough to form some kind of mob over it, in most states.@@92JazzQueen
(Not talking about Tony Obviously) Yeah,I'm sorry But I Think it makes sense for Suga Moma NOT to be Homophobic...Alot of Elders are Surprisingly Accepting,Also I think when you're in Suga Momma's Place and Have Lived her Life,2 men kissing and being in a Relationship is Probably the least of your Worries,
I really like your sweater in this video🥰
Thank You ‼
Honestly they could have a problem with Maya's dads and not have a problem with Michael because they see what he's going through as just a phase. The whole just a phase mindset does tend to happen to a lot of gays kids when they finally come out. No one will acknowledge that they are gay and treat it as just a phase but Maya's dads are full grown adults and can't just be going through a phase
I think the reason why the girl with two dads isn't reacting to the bullying is because if she did react all the people against them will point and say 'Look they're the negative stereotype! See! They got angry!'
My thoughts on Maya’s reaction might’ve been because she and her brother have been there before
Hey tony nice sweater
Thank You ‼🔥
I swear everyone in Penny's freiend group are backstabers
I feel like there are many different ways to represent the gay community in media. There's some really not great ones, but I also don't think there's one "right" way to do it either. I like stories lie this where they tackle these kind if issues, expecially when it's done as respecfully as it is here, but I also like stories like The Owl House where it's just there. The struggles need to be talked about, but it's also important to show it as just no big deal, and perfectly normal. Cause it IS normal.
There is one right way to do it: realistically.
Okay i've offically lost all faith in disney when it comes to media.
Yes, thanks for pointing out about the Michael paradox. It's like, dude, Michael will probably grow up to be a 2nd father of children.
I'm shocked Maya and KG are OK with Dijonay after this....of COURSE they are......
This episode came off a bit forced bc earlier in the reboot oscar jokes that penny can dance w/ Micheal bc he ''wasnt worried about Michael.'' bc...obvious reasons. Made it seem like oscar would be the main adult ok w/ gay. The fact disney chose oscar was way out of character.
6:52 "How did I get on this thread"
3:03 that is so valid i remember that i used t be like that but i feel like that was worse for me i was made fun of and bullied for until i was 14 all the way to 5 about the gay thing when i said i "like guys" i mean friends but my family took that the other way i was bullied for 9 damn years for that and that made me homophobic and racist was a given for my dad was a hardcore racist when my sister went gay i made fun of her said she wasn't really gay and all that wich was true because she went full on straight a year ago now but that's not my point through self penace i realized that i was a asshole for no good reason and a bad person so i forced myself to be educated on that i forced myself to fully understand it all as punishment for my actions as a child all the way to a teen i got rid of all that bad shit and became supporting and encouraged even helped a lesbian couple to get together stood up for those people that where getting bullied even got into fights defending them in my remaining years in highschool became "WOKE" according to my ex friends but if getting mature and educated makes me Woke? Then i will gladly wear that shit all day.
So you asked what people think about the interracial gay couple pairings between black and white men. My short answer is: People will have an issue either way. Longer answer: Black people already have a stereotype out there that we are all athletic, muscular, masculine, and strong. This when applied to men is always met with favor. The upsetting side of that coin is that that same stereotype is thrown on black women to whom none of that is flattering (typically). In the black community, white men are often made fun of for being weak, scrawny, and maybe feminine. Adding on top of that the fact that they are gay would automatically lose "man points" for them in the black community. So the decision to make the white man attractive and classically masculine seems to be a way of balancing out that issue. If things were reversed, people would give less thought to the parts of the conversation that need to be had here. No issues with it -- although I have to admit that I haven't seen any of the PF reboot yet.
Granted I've mostly been watching Tony's videos but did I miss something between Maya and Penny, where's this one-sided beef coming from?
It's from episode 1. Maya is pretty judgemental and did not want to associate with Penny cause she don't share the same beliefs as her assuming her to be phony. Penny on the other hand just wanted to be her friend being that she is the new kid on the block. Long story short Maya insists that she proves her worth by breaking out a talking panda at the Zoo. Penny eventually saw the writing on the wall (figuratively) realizes how wrong this is but Maya refused to listen. Penny flat out calls Maya out for bad attitude and leaves.
Back to present Maya seems to respect Penny after she defends her from the Gross sisters. Seeing as all their other interactions have remained friendly/civil though they are not close. Penny's friend group is still pretty flakey. Unfortunately😒
The sex stuff is bad for aces like me. Its too much
Honestly, I agree. I feel like it's way too overdone in many shows
@@TonyTurnerthis is one of the reasons I struggled watching Shameless. Too much unnecessary sex.
@@alize0623 absolutely, it was hard to enjoy the development of the characters, it’s like right after a funny joke or a cool snippet of dialogue it would show someone having sex
@@LiquidFro sometimes for no reason. Like they’d be fighting and then start fucking
@@alize0623 fr and horror movies like I watch it for horror not watching too people at it 😭
One of the biggest issues I have with Barry and Randall’s relationship doesn’t come up in this episode but comes up in a later episode. Of the two Randall seems more morally bankrupt than Barry and while this episode clearly demonstrates his questionable morals better than later episodes, it was the episode where he tells Barry “do something with your white privilege” when the police were arresting the kids during an illegal protest. Barry isn’t just an attractive, muscular white guy who married a less attractive, less fit black guy. Barry was also a rich guy who likely married the wrong person without realizing it and it gave me the impression that Randall didn’t marry Barry because he loved him but that it was because of what Randall thought he could get by marrying Barry. I don’t know maybe I’m reading too much into it but Randall guilt tripping his partner into getting what he wants just felt all sorts of wrong to me, especially when Barry hadn’t actually done anything wrong.
10:34 Actually this was before they kissed, not after.
3:02 - I was actually that “Tom boy” and had never understood other girls. I always played sports with the boys in elementary school. Tom Higgins would call me a lesbian and then I’d kick his ass, even though I didn’t know what a lesbian was. Hahahaha.
Fast forward to adulthood and… turns out he was right. HAHAHAHAHA.
I've seen this argument somewhere. Probably by idiots online or in the media, but I've seen people say that being gay is fine, but raising a kid is a no no because now you're "poisoning their minds into thinking being gay is okay". Like "we tolerate you for being different, but you don't get the same rights as us straight people".
I think the reason why maya was so tired of this because it happened at her old shcool and the reason(probably)why they let them hang out with Michael because he's still young and can"grow"out of it but barry and randell are two grown men and probably affected the children they adopted
Yes. It’s annoying cause a lot of people even consider two boys holding hands as sexual. (Strange world) Even though if one was a girl, then it’s natural and cute.
I notice that a lot of homosexuality is being turned synonymous to sexual stuff and kinky taboo lust.
That gay people can’t be genuine and in love. It’s all just lust.
I think it’s multiple factors, homophobia, but also the recent depictions of homosexual kids being extremely sexual in teen series. I see a lot and I don’t think it’s bad. But is it just me but there is a habit of having to have a sex scene after wards the reveal or have the gay guy be extremely sexual in his jokes. I don’t think the solution is to erase this kind of representation but introduce different kinds of situations to show gay relationships in a more wholistic manner.
I think I see in most recent anime where homosexuality is more normalized. It’s treated “Like yeah that’s a thing” and the relationships are treated like any other straight couple.
Another problem I noticed too that west media has to announce they are gay because straight is the default factory setting. But well this view is challenged if you look at how anime handles it or even k dramas. We don’t know the sexuality. Just cause they like girls doesn’t mean they aren’t bi. Or just cause they don’t announce their sexuality , doesn’t mean they are automatically straight.
A month late to this party, just found you last week and found this channel to be really insightful.
Honestly, my opinions about the "typical" same sex couple setup is mostly for the, forgive me if i come off as rude, "typical ideal white man" so that they, specifically, can see that ANYONE, even a perceived blue collar white man, can still be happy with another man.
As an olive toned female i cant say if thats true or not, but those men are they types ive seen personally who have this issue most and need to see it with their own eyes to realize its okay. (Bad example, but American Dad had something like this once where there was a lesbian couple raising kids and the "true american" dad had kidnapped the kids to take them to an anti-gay states to be "raised properly," only to realize that the kids werent any different from his own, even with two moms and returned them, realizing that gays and lesbians could still raise good "normal" families.)
For appearances though, i don't hold a strong opinion, i find the black father more attractive myself, but attractiveness is subjective and should not be perceived as objectively "right" or "wrong" in any light.
Even if you remove color and job from this it would still be "the tall, muscular, "conventionally attractive", man likes the short, chubby, nerdier man" and thats fine, no matter what race you tack onto it.
I think this episode was one of the worst of the reboot. The character inconsistencies alone were enough to ruin this for me. Homophobia is already a highly contentious topic in the states, but to give the character who learns the lesson be Oscar is….not the best. It’d make sense if Laceinga and Dijonay to act that way, but Zoe and Michael, it’s not working. It would’ve actually been a good way to get a character relationship with Mya and Michael going.
Oscar is obsessed with money, I doubt he actually cares who’s giving it to him. But also, if Oscar’s this way, it’d naturally make sense Sugar Mama is that way as well. But, to have the character that not even the show takes seriously learn this lesson….it’s just not working.
Oscar sadly has to always be the punching bag, and sugar mama can’t be that way cause she has to be against everything Oscar thinks…
In Maya’s defense, it can be easier to stand up for other people than it is to stand up for yourself.
Well my parents don't like seeing that kind of stuff so they always freak out but when i see it i could care less
naw tf is the "I ship it"💀💀💀 6:51
Writers just took anything they saw from Twitter 😅
I think it ok cuz it canon
@DazeDewDrop who's hunty
Honestly I'm learning that some of the tomboy girls you go to school with ended up being nonbinary lesbian/queer identified. The funny thing about tomboy-ism in my region of the US. I live in the middle Appalachians and very rural and local non-binary AFAB explained this to me, is that our region has a lot of "country girls" and we are actually encouraged to take on more masculine roles and mannerism where I come from. The area is very anti-gay and anti-femme (historically) but "country girls" are the norm. I'm a cis woman and bi but I do remember getting picked on some for being "girly". I'm a very femme person.
8:00 if you fight against it then you get targetted harder. sounds like you're being shown both sides of it. one who defends himself and the other person waiting for it to blow over. activism won't make the homophobes like her and all. atleast that's how this video sounds to me for that part.
Loud house have Clyde dads are interracial couple white father taller but both average looking.
7:41 honestly as a gay black guy with a white boyfriend all i want is for there to be a mixed race couple where they BOTH equal, Either both of them are ugly, attractive,femmije masc etc it gets
1:08 I detest PDA in general. I don’t care if it’s a male and female.
lol jealous? I’m just playing tho, PDA can be pretty awkward.