00:00 Download the Conscious Spending Plan so you can use your money GUILT-FREE: iwt.com/csp-youtube Please remember: These are real people who had the courage to come on my podcast and ask for help. Would you be willing to come on this podcast and share every detail of your financial life? Feel free to leave comments based on what you think, but remember that we are here to help in a supportive way, not to demean and criticize.
As a nurse she can work over time and use that money to paydown the debt. No nurse should feel helpless with debt. There are so many work available at the hospitals, clinics home care agencies. If she works at a hospital they are always looking for volunteers to work OT and some hospital makes it mandatory. That pay is time and and a half pay so she can do it. I don't think she is exploring all her options. She' too focus on the numbers.
“There’s no one coming to save you here.” This is why Ramit will always have what Ramsey and Hammer will dream of. The ability to tell the truth with compassion and respect the dignity of the person hearing it. Bravo. You’re a good soul.
I really appreciated the way you called her out on her fake "I wouldn't marry me" BS. It is a manipulative tactic to guilt Matt into alleviating guilt, when its a deflection tactic.
She didn’t borrow $100 and forget to pay it back. She stole $5000 cash from his SAFE. She wasn’t even working at the time so how could she say that she could put it back before he found out. Complete deceit. She said twice that she wanted to pay him back which is only right. But, if she really felt sorry, she wouldn’t be spending almost $1000 out to eat and $700 in clothes PER MONTH. I hope she gets some fire under her but I don’t see it from these follow ups.
@aprilstiek7430 she's not sorry. She just got caught is all. She needs to go return some of the stuff that she bought recently and hand him the money to prove.Now she's not a big, fat liar.😮
And total crocodile tears. He needs to move on from her or his life will end in disaster. If she can steal, lie, and manipulate, she can cheat someday too. I feel bad for this guy.
He's so, SO passive. Almost to the point where I wanted to poke him and shout "wake up, say something!" I don't understand cosigning a loan for someone without having a clear picture about their finances. She even changed the CSP after he looked at it and he just shrugs it off. Wow.
He needs individual therapy, not just couples therapy. I’m so scared for him in this relationship. She needs to do a permanent 180 before they can have a good life together.
@37:30 You stole your boyfriend’s wedding ring money! What do you mean you can’t believe your dad would think you’d have the low moral character to forge his signature to cosign on a loan?!
Yeah that dad story doesn't make sense. Plus why would she move into a house and pay him rent after him mistreating her accusing her. There is definitely more to what she is saying.
Same. I used to watch Caleb but he is a poor communicator and doesn't ever actually ever help anyone. I prefer Ramit's approach of understanding how And why people have financial struggles.
@@Gibblesnyc I'm not a fan of Caleb's style but his follows up's show he does make a difference. Romain Faure is also excellent to watch. He's similar style to ramit but also works with singles
I've been following Caleb since near the beginning and he's now leaned into the type of content that guarantees massive views (negativity, drama, calling people out, clickbait titles, yelling/screaming, etc.) cause it ends up being a win-win since it makes Caleb an insane amount of money while also reaching a huge audience where it'll help others. With all that being said, I stopped watching Caleb for that reason. His older content was actually REALLY helpful cause it was more realistic people whereas today it's all people with so much drama. His channel is now more people laughing at or feeling bad for the guest being audited. A good alternative to Caleb is Romain Faure but his content is honest and helpful so not sure when he'll eventually get a huge following since his videos don't go viral.
This is a wild conversation. There's way too much of a switch between her sounding like shes on the verge of tears when the scrutiny is on her to then sounding very relaxed when moving into solutions. No improvement in the 7 years and still hasnt paid back the 5k she stole.... don't walk, but run.
I feel really bad for Matt but also frustrated that he’s allowed himself to stay in this toxic relationship. Dude she stole from you!!! That is not something to take lightly.
Me too! Not only to give us more context, but also if we’re looking specifically for someone in a similar situation to us - or ready to watch the mega millionaires lol
It seems like her admitting to all her wrong doings and guilt and shame verbally is a defense mechanism so others cannot blame her more. Her attitude did not appear to actually want to solve the problem with her own effort. She’s just worried her bf, her last lifeline, would leave her. The bf also needs to be more assertive and speak up about his expectations and boundaries. Stealing is never acceptable in any kind of relationship.
Shes offended that her dad would think she lacked enough morals to forge his signature on her student loans but yet she stole $5,000 from her boyfriend without issue 🤔
err, Im extremely hesitant to believe her story about not forging her father's signature on those student loans. She has a long history of hiding the truth from those around her out of embarrassment. Ramit, I would be extremely skeptical about her story. She needs lots and lots of mental help about her habits. More than what you can provide in your money session. Only way she can make her relationship work without him just giving up out of frustration and anger.
Thank you for highlighting this as I know sometimes I get accused of seeing the worst in folks. Her whole body language gave it away and Ramit saying more than once that why would her father accuse her of this, felt as he too was having trouble comprehend this circumstances.
I think the signature is largely irrelevant - it’s HER loan. A co-signer is for the bank, to go after if she defaults. Having a co-signer doesn’t mean her dad is morally responsible for the loan. This is just a narrative she’s concocted for herself to blame her lifetime of debt on
Yeah when I was listening something felt off to me about this story. I do think she came from an abusive and neglectful household, but something told me she was lying in my gut. Idk if it was how her voice changed or what and now seeing the comments confirm it. It wasn’t even her stealing the money that made me feel that, it was a very casual and vague story.
@@mrs.quills7061 You have to resign for loans every year. You don't take it all out at once. So the dad doesn't remember signing at least 4 different times for the loans. I call BS. Also, who doesn't quality for ANY government loans. They will give you SOMETHING. Fill out a FASFA.
@@GreengoldAlchemythe ability to get endless overtime makes people overspend knowing that they will pick up shifts and pay for the expense. It doesn’t always turn out well and it is killing yourself for material things. I’m going to be a nurse soon and praying I won’t fall into that trap.
@@GreengoldAlchemy I think they also have a lot of codependency issues and attract users. I know so many nurses paying for family, husbands, boyfriends. I also think they use Shopping as a distraction and stress reliever.
If love alone was enough to create a lifetime of happiness the divorce rates wouldn’t be so high; unfortunately, all these things matter too. I have empathy for her dad, working so hard to take care of a family and bailing mom out of credit card debt for Macy’s which isn’t a store of necessity. It actually doesn’t sound like the dad consented to those loans, and being called spoiled or broke isn’t the worst thing that most of us have heard. Maybe they were spoiled and maybe she actually is broke? But to steal $5000 from your boyfriend is mind blowing, especially when you make more money, but with that he remains quiet because he doesn’t want there to be a fight which means he also can’t have healthy communication and conflict with her. Regardless, I wish them both the best, individually or together.
My guy needs to take the stolen money as a blessing and run for the hills. If he does still tackle this situation he better get a prenup and make sure her debt STAYS her debt
I am a nurse and was like this before. I snapped on my debt when i worked 2 jobs and still had no savings. I finally stopped spending and started working nonstop. She has a huge shovel. She can pay it off in 2 to 3 yrs. Again she has to realize to get mad with her debt and tackle it immediately.
This episode is scary to watch. Idk if Ramit is just that great of a guy that he can’t tell when these guests are being manipulative, or that he overlooks it because he’s not a licensed therapist, but this girl screams red flags. She made her father a villain because he’s not there to defend himself. But I refuse to believe a parent would make up a lie about co-signing a loan. She stole from her boyfriend. Lied about her debt. And wasn’t forthcoming even while doing the CSP. I wish them the best, but Matt should think long and hard what he’s attaching himself too.
I mean, it may be true about her track record and the signing of the loan...but at the same time, there are parents who actually abuse or kill their children, so forging a document is not out of the realm of possibility.
I think at the end of the day it doesn't matter, she is still responsible for it. Nothing productive is gained from Ramit insisting or doubting her version of events. What's the plan to pay it down?
Uhh Idk…I wouldn’t jump that far, financial abuse is more common than most think. I’m first gen and have seen the same dynamic with a providing father amongst many friends. If anything, it explains the patterns she’s recreating. But it definitely doesn’t excuse her behavior.
Also the boyfriend also co-signed a loan for her for $15,000... In addition to the $5,000. This patience and calm he has managed to be. I do hope that they get counseling before moving forward because these two incidents are indicative of deep problems.
She puts her supposedly abusive family over him? She stole money from him? He signed a personal loan for her, and she did nothing to change her behavior? Dude, run.
Tbf with the father if the mother is constantly over spending and putting them in debts and also hiding debts then it would be a good idea to put the brakes on her somehow. If not, you'd lose everything. Also if daughter is following her path then yes I'd try there too.
I don’t think she’s a good match for him. She stole money that says a lot about someone’s character she has a lot of internal conflicts she needs to work out. Time to move on Matt, she’s not the one.
Ramit big cuzzo, you killed this one. You say things that are on the audience mind, tough questions. I think the guests and the audience got a lot out of this.
This episode was so difficult. There’s so much going on and I hope they find a way to move forward. I kept getting distracted though by how nice this set is!! I want to live there, unironically.
How is this a healthy relationship?! He lent her money for debt consolidation and has no idea where the money went. She stole from him, and herself because he wanted to use money for a ring. He needs therapy as to why this is acceptable behavior to him. The student loan is her debt. I don’t trust the narrative she is spinning about her Dad. Her first goal is to tackle her own debt and pay off debt. His goal should be therapy to understand why he is accepting this behavior from her.
I haven't been this upset by a show in a long time. What the hell is wrong with Matt?!? I was hoping Ramit would shake him. Her little sad girl act is played out! She is holding back a pride smile (not an embarrassment smile). There's something concerning about her demeanor, she's a master manipulator and the boyfriend is a doormat. He wants to motivate her by going to a jewelry store after she stole the engagement ring savings, he doesn't stand a chance. * Also, nurses have access to patient's personal belongings. Her employer should review this video.
He’s got a good heart but I fear he’s not going to have much success in relationships with that passiveness. Being a good husband is about more than just smiling and saying yes. Sometimes you need to take control, put your foot down, and say no for the good of the family. Not sure I can see him doing that.
I do not understand how shopping and spending money helps someone escape the fact that they do not have money. It would give me anxiety to unnecessarily buy things when I am already stressed about bills and money.
I don’t understand how someone can shop so much they spend “x” number a month as a set budget. Seems so odd to me. Are people getting new clothes every month?
note: i haven’t finished the video. “she says no to me all the time.” with her family she doesn’t set boundaries and gets used for money and domestic labor. her fiancé makes her feel safe and comfortable. but what they’ve done is reverse the dynamic where she uses him and he struggles to set boundaries (why she stole from him). even when you love people you should be able to say no. i bet that when she first moved out from her family she felt free. free time, energy, and money. she didn’t have to say no over and over in daily interactions bc saying no to living with them is one decision. i think her fiancé (maybe subconsciously) wanted them to live with their families again bc she was stressing him out the same way. he doesn’t have to learn how to set real boundaries regularly with her if she doesn’t live with him. i think the $1200 they save making six figures is just the excuse.
That’s what I don’t understand either! I know going to be a doctor can be expensive, but a nurse? I wonder what school she went to or if she signed up for predatory loans.
Private nursing degrees are about 120k right now in California. My stepdaughter is going to such a school but paying more like 80k because she did prerequisites at community college.
There are a lot of predatory private nursing colleges out there and if you don't hit certain metrics they fail you and make you start from scratch and pay all over again rather than letting you claim part credit for what you have completed already. It sounds like this was the case for her. Probably paid 120k for the original program she did and then 120k again after they failed out and she had to start over. I've also seen people get crazy assignments during school requiring short term rentals, super long commutes and other things that add to cost.
Yeah no she definitely forged his signature If hes as smart as she says he is,then he most definitely wouldn’t have co-signed a terrible loan And for her to steal 5k from her boyfriend under the guise of ill put it back without him knowing without her having a job is crazy She starts to cry when she has to admit what shes done Dont cry,you weren’t crying when you took the money.Your crying cause you got caught
Exactly this. I parent my parents and sister YET I also need parenting from my husband (something I am improving). It’s a very typical dynamic to see tbh
I doubt very much that her description of her doing everything in the house is accurate. I mean, her Dad has to drive her everywhere. I think she is effective at telling herself stories.
I do not trust the young lady. The Dad tried to advise both the mother and her to manager their finances but they disregarded him. I believe the father wanted both parties to work for financial future but the mother decided to stay at home. Mostly people who migrated from different countries have different backgrounds and perspective about money because they have other responsibilities back home. If they have no support from the spouse and they are overworked, they become overwhelmed and feel used as a source of supply and that builds total resentment towards the partner. If Michelle was able to take take Mark’s money without asking, I am very sure she did forged her dad’s signature, because from the description of the father character, he appears to be a straightforward person. Trust me she is a liability. I am in similar situation and it’s not fun.
My wife (both of us are RN's) and we had similar issues when we were younger. My wife is very frugal and can find a good deal on anything we are needing however. She just never knew how to follow a budget. I took over the budget and we began investing and saving. We talked about finances for both of us, and paid off any outstanding debt which ended up being $35k paid off. Thirty years later we are on track to retire, house paid off, and are debt free other than a car loan about every 10 years. We definitely know how to work together now that we have systems in place.
Regarding the “forged” signature…the signature is irrelevant. It’s HER loan. A co-signer is for the bank to go after if she defaults. But having your dad co-sign doesn’t mean he’s morally responsible to pay for you. She’s confusing a co-signer with a parent plus loan.
Yes! Co-signer is a back-up for the lender. Doesn’t mean THEY owe it, the main borrower owes it. Not the co-signer. But lenders will go after him because she isn’t paying it
The father is legally responsible and the company will go after him if she does not pay. Also, until it is paid it can impact his financial status such as going for another loan.
She’s an addict who is self-soothing from trauma by having others care for her - delivery food - and shopping makes her feel delusionally powerful - can swipe in the moment. It’s a common combination (eating and shopping) maybe not as devastating as drinking alcohol or gambling but slowly destroying her life. She needs therapy to deal with her childhood trauma or she’ll keep self-soothing at the detriment of her life and this relationship.
The $750 a month for clothes….as a nurse? How many sets of scrubs does she need…some hospitals provide your scrubs, you just turn the soiled ones in, get clean ones, all on the honor system.
This episode is FANTASTIC! Everything about it, production quality, the guests, the issues, and the insights. Well done. I feel for Matt, but I have high hopes for them both.
This was a hard listen. I hope Matt sees the red flags. Even on the podcast, she was not honest. (Ramit asked if she said something when Matt discovered money was missing. She said yes. Ramit asked her what she said, and she said there was just silence.) The theft, the hiding of debt and spending, being accused of forgery (which I'm inclined to believe after the other deceitfulness she admits to), the shifting of blame to others, and acting super apologetic while not actually changing her bad behavior. It would be too much for me. If i were him, I would freeze my credit, pay off the $15k cosigned loan, and move on.
Hearing her shows me how I am not as compassionate with myself. Like others I find myself judging her very harshly to what seems like a totally preventable situation. And as hard as I am on her, and though my situation is better, I also judge myself for not being where I’d like to be. Thank you for helping me notice and try to be better for my own peace.
Oh believe me a lot of really crappy people go into nursing for the money and schedule. My wife has had many down right evil coworkers. Sure made me a lot less trusting without asking questions.
I hate to be so forward, but anyone who tells you they are “always taking care of everyone else” within minutes of beginning a conversation are typically the most self centered people. I have learned this is a manipulation tactic (or a severe lack of self awareness). I am not half way through the episode and I can see multiple inconsistencies in her narrative. I wish this couple well, but this gentleman may want to exercise a lot of caution as he continues this relationship.
I felt manipulation as well. Which explains why her boyfriend is so passive, he has literally no spine. She just kept calling herself worthless and disgusting but despite those intense feelings she had absolutely no plan.
Are we sure she didn't forge her dad's signature? I mean she STOLE from her boyfriend... Her dad said "do what you need to do" ... I don't know, I'm HIGHLY suspicious. Boyfriend needs to stop ignoring all these red flags.
i struggled with talking finances w my partner early in our relationship, i was going into debt bc i didn’t want him to know (shame) or feel like he had to help me (pride/shame). i made those decisions internally but the whole time he was willing to do anything for me if i’d just TALKED TO HIM HONESTLY. it’s been years since and we’re completely open communication wise, and wouldn’t have made it through better people otherwise. i definitely understand why money is one of the biggest relationship killers 😅
She plays the poor hopeless victim role to Ramit but really she is the VILLAIN in this whole story!!! People who feel desperate will ALWAYS do desperate things! (Stealing $5k, forging signatures, etc)
They both have debt to clear. Live together in a tiny studio.. spend the weekend to cook and meal plan. Pack all your lunches and eat dinners at home. Date night is frozen pizza and pasta. Huddle inwards into your relationship and snowball your debts. No new clothes, shopping, no uber eats for until your debt is 30% left. It would probably take 5-8 years to get it done. Light a fire under your butt. No kids before debt is cleared. No dogs too. Tell your parents you have 200+k in debt and you are in a fire mode to get it done. Set boundaries. Frozen pancakes are 3.99 for 24 pieces. Pot roast is less than $10. Pop it in a slow cooker overnight. Voila! Meals for days
She stole from him. How does it work that he's still in this relationship? If or when she becomes his wife she has even more access to his resources. She needs deep therapy and a fiduciary.
I think he enables her bad behavior. I think he needs to leave her and let her hit rock bottom so she is motivated to rebuild her life. She needs a stronger more supportive partner that holds her accountable.
Wow, all the blame on the girl's father. She lived with her boyfriend, and he cosigned for a loan for her, yet he didn't know how much debt she was in? she filled up the CSP and didn't openly discuss it with him and he now finds out on the show how much in debt "they" are in! Do you really think she didn't do something similar to her father and he was the way he was because her mother treated money the same way she does. She admits her mother was secretly racking up hidden charges and i wonder who would have to ultimately take care of it. Let give a little respect to hard working unappreciated men who have put their family first but gets nothing but disrespect. Remember 20 yrs ago, we didn't have all the tools or the lack of social stigma that is accepted today for coming out and admitting you're in debt or not good with money.
I had to turn it off after she started trying to accuse her father of being controlling. He seemed justified in his actions imo. And it's a pretty big red flag how she speaks about all her family including her mom and sister.
I just listened to this. I’m more of a Dave Ramsey listener but will turn on this podcast. This whole episode pissed me off! Who pays $200k for nursing school!!! Who’s the doctor?? Her boyfriend has no boundaries and has no backbone. Collectively they owe an entire house value in debt. 260k is a house in my area. She wants to play victim on the entire call. He needs to put his foot down. Either she gets on a budget and increase the money that she pays on her debts monthly or he’s out. For a finance guy you’d think he’d want to be involved to help her analyze and come up with a strategy. You moved out of a $650 apartment because it cost too much? Doesn’t pass the sniff test. Her plan is to get married and pregnant so this debt is now his problem. Sorry, but they shouldn’t get married. If she was gung-ho and ready to attack the debt this entire conversation would have been different.
but why do you think they moved out? i think they are not being honest. I think he gave her the ultimatum and she doing this dog and pony show singing up for Ramit's show to show the BF that she wants to clean up her act. the moment they are married, she will be back to spend spend.
@@TheSharmam they move back to each parents house in order to avoid $300 dollars of rent. I don’t buy it. If they had their own place they would be living together doing chores, hanging out. I didn’t mention it earlier but she 100% forged the paperwork. This is the same woman that stole $5k out of her boyfriend’s safe (that he was saving to buy her a wedding ring!!). He should leave her now. They also don’t think they mentioned car debt. My hunch is she’s driving around in a new/newish car with a large monthly payment.
He didn’t react angrily enough for me after she stole from him and kept her finances from him. It’s also terrible dynamics for him to keep enabling her without any consequences. He deserves better, someone who wouldn’t steal and lie to him but for that he would need a back bone.
This just tugged at my heart. I hope they can work through this and find their way to a life they can both be happy with. Plus, there's a furry friend that's just waiting for them to arrive. Great show.
My dude, the red flags are flying. These two need loads of counseling before they even think about getting married (mostly her, but some together as well). …and if he decides to go through with it, a prenup.
I relate a lot to Michelle's family situation. People think because I live at home, I'm being taken care of, or saving money, but they just take advantage of me.
Matt actually concerns me more than her. What is his upbringing that makes him stay with a woman that steals a substantial amount of money from him? At his income level, $5,000 probably took him a while to save, so him to just be “disappointed” is unsettling. Not to mention it doesn’t sound like there’s any interest/ intention of paying him back. She actually doubles down and asks him about a ring! I get that he loves her, but he is too calm about the extra $100k debt he didn’t know about. Also for him to just automatically assume responsibility for $230k debt… Ramit had to point out to him that the debt wasn’t his to pay off!! I’m so glad he moved back home.
I was so freaked out when he talked about going to a jewelry store for motivation for her. If her motivation is only so that she can marry him, then what motivates her after that? And after children are in the mix? I'm sorry, Ramit, you were way to soft on her. She's a manipulator and you didn't call it out.
I judged her initially but hearing her story of a controlling (verbally abusive) parent with money, I can somewhat relate. Also having experienced a parent with selective memory after the fact - I get it. People are saying she forged his signature, it's definitely possible but so is her story about her dad too.
I don't believe her on how she painted her father's character. I wish her father was here to clarify things. Somehow, I feel she's lying or at least hiding some important details.
i find this conversation so boring, to mean that even her tone of voice is so lethargic and resigned, jesus, it's like snap out of it! you're in the mess you're in, now what are you going to do about it?? that's mean i know but ugh, i'd rather someone worked up than be this passive, including her partner, absolutely, nobody would take $5 THOUSAND of my dollars and i'd just be like whatever about it. But, i wish them all the best. it ain't easy, that's for sure.
19:38 so many story inconsistencies, she feeds and is responsible for her mom and sister, but shes ordering in food ...... maybe Ramit has a kink where he likes to be lied to his face......
Wow, she straight up stole from him. I was devastated when my high school friend stole money from me; I can't imagine the pain, violation, and breach of trust from a lover. I hope Matt gets individual therapy and recognizes his worth.
I tried to feel sorry for Michelle, but I just feel she is living in the victim mentality. If you can take money from your partner and not tell them. Then when it gets down to her choices, she says she doesn't know why she does it. She acts like she has no control over it. I feel like here emotions were more about having herself exposed and not actually her situation. I hope Matt can create boundaries and give Michelle time to prove that she can take control of and get out of the victim mind set. If not, this relationship will forever struggle.
I see a lot of people so focused on saving the relationship, they don't stop to ask if the relationship is actually healthy and if they're their most healthiest version in it. I say this for Michelle as much as Matt. If she could let go of the idea of staying together at all costs, she could be honest with him and let the chips fall where they may. This would enable her to be a more complete and happy individual and own her problems instead of avoiding them. The relationship would also have a better chance at survival. But even if it failed, she'd still be better off than she is now as she would be living her honest self. Matt is also so desperate to hold on that he's willing to bury his head in the sand. He's neither willing to let the relationship go nor commit to it fully (don't blame him). I'm not saying they need to break up, but they need to realize breaking up isn't the worst outcome. Them living this halfway life with all these secrets is a far worse outcome than being single. I'm really worried about Matt. He's very vulnerable to being taken advantage of. I'm glad he's at least not taken on her debt (yet).
So much to this ep- I think he needs to do some deep diving into his own mindset on decision making and standards for what he's willing to put up with. What he sees as a rich life with a partner, what healthy communication looks like, etc and really evaluate if the current situation is meeting that or not. If its not - what milestones can be established if he doesn't want to give up on it. His avoidance of conflict with her needs to be addressed. I hope they end up happy in whatever shape that takes for them. There's definitely some serious stuff to tackle before marriage if that's in the cards. Definitely don't understand the decision to move in together with that joint monthly income. I understand she may be a spending addict but you would think with her trauma of living at home that would motivate her minimally to at least make rent and keep her independence. Also curious why she didn't ask him for the money for her car registration so she could at least retain her ability to drive. (If youre going to steal money, at least use it for your critical bills lol)
She wants us to think that she didn’t have bad enough morals to forge her dad’s signature on her student loans as a co-signer but she did have bad enough morals to steal $5,000 from her boyfriend.
I love to see the motivation and clarity on next steps. Each of them starting therapy sounds like a great move to help them grow individually and as a team. ❤
Yeahhh..no. i get that she is sorry but there is no behavior change and she stole from him. She has no action and intention or resolve to fix it. This guy needs to step away...there is no positive way out.
Why kids keep opting to go to college out of state or private school when you can not afford to just pay for it kills me. Also why no one thinks they can work while they go to college is insane. Everyone I knew worked while in college as engineering and CS majors. I worked full time taking over a full load of engineering classes. It is hard but easier than paying back a huge loan, plus you are young and have more energy.
This was a tough episode. Big problems and no easy solutions. I do wish Ramit had encouraged them to make at least one numbers-based decision on camera. It was weird to see the episode end with no changes to the CSP. Ramit told her to make a plan but why not start now? We see retirement calculations on here all the time; would a debt payoff calculation be too depressing to show?
I would not stay with man, who would steal from me…why he stays? Where are self respect and boundaries? And if she would take his retirement money when he is 70 ? How would he react? Financial infidelity is the same as physical infidelity…. Not acceptable
Thank GOD my nurse wife went down a different road. Now 18 years into her career she has a very healthy 401k and makes 6 figures. Our mortgage is our only debt. But I get it. You take a young person and wear them out with a hard schedule and give them enough money to live it up if they want. It is a hard lesson to learn.
00:00 Download the Conscious Spending Plan so you can use your money GUILT-FREE: iwt.com/csp-youtube
Please remember: These are real people who had the courage to come on my podcast and ask for help. Would you be willing to come on this podcast and share every detail of your financial life? Feel free to leave comments based on what you think, but remember that we are here to help in a supportive way, not to demean and criticize.
As a nurse she can work over time and use that money to paydown the debt. No nurse should feel helpless with debt. There are so many work available at the hospitals, clinics home care agencies. If she works at a hospital they are always looking for volunteers to work OT and some hospital makes it mandatory. That pay is time and and a half pay so she can do it. I don't think she is exploring all her options. She' too focus on the numbers.
Yes but you let her off way too easy. She was clearly lying to you Smh
“There’s no one coming to save you here.” This is why Ramit will always have what Ramsey and Hammer will dream of. The ability to tell the truth with compassion and respect the dignity of the person hearing it.
Bravo. You’re a good soul.
That comment was spot on by Ramit. Nothing changes until people take control of and responsibility for their own money habits.
I really appreciated the way you called her out on her fake "I wouldn't marry me" BS. It is a manipulative tactic to guilt Matt into alleviating guilt, when its a deflection tactic.
And her crocodile tears... I hope he wakes up. She stole from him!
My favourite in person studio set up so far Ramit, might have nailed it this time!
I agree, but the lampshade on the left side needs to be fixed to please my inner monk 😂
YES!!!!
She didn’t borrow $100 and forget to pay it back. She stole $5000 cash from his SAFE. She wasn’t even working at the time so how could she say that she could put it back before he found out. Complete deceit. She said twice that she wanted to pay him back which is only right. But, if she really felt sorry, she wouldn’t be spending almost $1000 out to eat and $700 in clothes PER MONTH. I hope she gets some fire under her but I don’t see it from these follow ups.
Why wouldn't her first priority be to pay back the 5k?
@@dkayok Exactly. Her actions speak volumes. If she was really sorry, paying it back would have been her top priority.
@aprilstiek7430 she's not sorry. She just got caught is all. She needs to go return some of the stuff that she bought recently and hand him the money to prove.Now she's not a big, fat liar.😮
She'd make them go bankrupt and lose the house if they bought one. So much financial infidelity
And total crocodile tears. He needs to move on from her or his life will end in disaster. If she can steal, lie, and manipulate, she can cheat someday too. I feel bad for this guy.
Idk, if she stole from her bf $5000......dad may not be lying about her forging his signature. Seems par for her course, unfortunately
yes, it seems a very extreme accusation to lob at her father who is letting her stay with them after she fully decimated her life. she is a liar!
He's so, SO passive. Almost to the point where I wanted to poke him and shout "wake up, say something!" I don't understand cosigning a loan for someone without having a clear picture about their finances.
She even changed the CSP after he looked at it and he just shrugs it off. Wow.
you dont understand it because you may not know anything about cptsd. these people are damaged mentally
hes a simp :p
what do you mean "I thought it was $100", did you NOT read the title of the video???
@@evan7476😂
@@evan7476that’s so dramatic and nonsensical. The point still stands: the woman stole money from her partner
He needs individual therapy, not just couples therapy. I’m so scared for him in this relationship. She needs to do a permanent 180 before they can have a good life together.
Me too. I wonder if he was or is in an abusive relationship. His absolute fear or reluctance to upset her is concerning.
@37:30 You stole your boyfriend’s wedding ring money! What do you mean you can’t believe your dad would think you’d have the low moral character to forge his signature to cosign on a loan?!
100%!
When she said that my first thought was … didn’t she just say she stole 5K from her partner. Moral ground seems shakey.
Yeah that dad story doesn't make sense. Plus why would she move into a house and pay him rent after him mistreating her accusing her. There is definitely more to what she is saying.
Same exact thought.
This is so much different than Caleb Hammer. Glad I found this
Same. I used to watch Caleb but he is a poor communicator and doesn't ever actually ever help anyone. I prefer Ramit's approach of understanding how And why people have financial struggles.
@@Gibblesnyc I'm not a fan of Caleb's style but his follows up's show he does make a difference. Romain Faure is also excellent to watch. He's similar style to ramit but also works with singles
I've been following Caleb since near the beginning and he's now leaned into the type of content that guarantees massive views (negativity, drama, calling people out, clickbait titles, yelling/screaming, etc.) cause it ends up being a win-win since it makes Caleb an insane amount of money while also reaching a huge audience where it'll help others. With all that being said, I stopped watching Caleb for that reason. His older content was actually REALLY helpful cause it was more realistic people whereas today it's all people with so much drama. His channel is now more people laughing at or feeling bad for the guest being audited. A good alternative to Caleb is Romain Faure but his content is honest and helpful so not sure when he'll eventually get a huge following since his videos don't go viral.
Caleb treats his guests so disrespectfully I had to unsubscribe a while back. Ramit is truly a breath of fresh air from the finance TH-camrs.
@@EmmereRamit been around way longer thoooo.
Love the new setting and increased production value!
A bit hectic 😅
This is a wild conversation. There's way too much of a switch between her sounding like shes on the verge of tears when the scrutiny is on her to then sounding very relaxed when moving into solutions. No improvement in the 7 years and still hasnt paid back the 5k she stole.... don't walk, but run.
Yeah, those were some fake "tears".
I feel really bad for Matt but also frustrated that he’s allowed himself to stay in this toxic relationship. Dude she stole from you!!! That is not something to take lightly.
I like how you show the csp figures at the outset. Thank you.
Me too! Not only to give us more context, but also if we’re looking specifically for someone in a similar situation to us - or ready to watch the mega millionaires lol
It seems like her admitting to all her wrong doings and guilt and shame verbally is a defense mechanism so others cannot blame her more. Her attitude did not appear to actually want to solve the problem with her own effort. She’s just worried her bf, her last lifeline, would leave her. The bf also needs to be more assertive and speak up about his expectations and boundaries. Stealing is never acceptable in any kind of relationship.
Shes offended that her dad would think she lacked enough morals to forge his signature on her student loans but yet she stole $5,000 from her boyfriend without issue 🤔
Someone set this guy up with a woman that won’t steal $5K from him SMH
err, Im extremely hesitant to believe her story about not forging her father's signature on those student loans. She has a long history of hiding the truth from those around her out of embarrassment. Ramit, I would be extremely skeptical about her story. She needs lots and lots of mental help about her habits. More than what you can provide in your money session. Only way she can make her relationship work without him just giving up out of frustration and anger.
Thank you for highlighting this as I know sometimes I get accused of seeing the worst in folks. Her whole body language gave it away and Ramit saying more than once that why would her father accuse her of this, felt as he too was having trouble comprehend this circumstances.
I think the signature is largely irrelevant - it’s HER loan. A co-signer is for the bank, to go after if she defaults. Having a co-signer doesn’t mean her dad is morally responsible for the loan. This is just a narrative she’s concocted for herself to blame her lifetime of debt on
there are people who lie, and then there are liars, and she is a straight up liar.
Yeah when I was listening something felt off to me about this story. I do think she came from an abusive and neglectful household, but something told me she was lying in my gut. Idk if it was how her voice changed or what and now seeing the comments confirm it. It wasn’t even her stealing the money that made me feel that, it was a very casual and vague story.
@@mrs.quills7061 You have to resign for loans every year. You don't take it all out at once. So the dad doesn't remember signing at least 4 different times for the loans. I call BS. Also, who doesn't quality for ANY government loans. They will give you SOMETHING. Fill out a FASFA.
So many nurses struggle with finances, despite being able to make really good money. I used to be one of them. I’m finally getting my $hit together.
Why do you think they struggle with money?
I have noticed that about nurses, yes.
@@GreengoldAlchemythe ability to get endless overtime makes people overspend knowing that they will pick up shifts and pay for the expense. It doesn’t always turn out well and it is killing yourself for material things. I’m going to be a nurse soon and praying I won’t fall into that trap.
@@GreengoldAlchemy I think they also have a lot of codependency issues and attract users. I know so many nurses paying for family, husbands, boyfriends. I also think they use Shopping as a distraction and stress reliever.
Mo money. Mo problems
I sure hope these two don’t have a wedding for 75k next year.
If love alone was enough to create a lifetime of happiness the divorce rates wouldn’t be so high; unfortunately, all these things matter too. I have empathy for her dad, working so hard to take care of a family and bailing mom out of credit card debt for Macy’s which isn’t a store of necessity. It actually doesn’t sound like the dad consented to those loans, and being called spoiled or broke isn’t the worst thing that most of us have heard. Maybe they were spoiled and maybe she actually is broke? But to steal $5000 from your boyfriend is mind blowing, especially when you make more money, but with that he remains quiet because he doesn’t want there to be a fight which means he also can’t have healthy communication and conflict with her. Regardless, I wish them both the best, individually or together.
My guy needs to take the stolen money as a blessing and run for the hills. If he does still tackle this situation he better get a prenup and make sure her debt STAYS her debt
What a depressing episode and sorry but I don’t see her changing, if he was my son I would advise/beg him to end this relationship.
I am a nurse and was like this before. I snapped on my debt when i worked 2 jobs and still had no savings. I finally stopped spending and started working nonstop. She has a huge shovel. She can pay it off in 2 to 3 yrs. Again she has to realize to get mad with her debt and tackle it immediately.
Why do nurses spend big time?
@@davidbernalpianistastress. Few jobs are as physically, emotionally, and mentally taxing all at once. Spending is a cheap dopamine fix, I suppose
@@davidbernalpianistanot all nurses spend big time. I think money philosophy plays a role. I’m a nurse and don’t struggle financially.
This episode is scary to watch. Idk if Ramit is just that great of a guy that he can’t tell when these guests are being manipulative, or that he overlooks it because he’s not a licensed therapist, but this girl screams red flags.
She made her father a villain because he’s not there to defend himself. But I refuse to believe a parent would make up a lie about co-signing a loan. She stole from her boyfriend. Lied about her debt. And wasn’t forthcoming even while doing the CSP. I wish them the best, but Matt should think long and hard what he’s attaching himself too.
I mean, it may be true about her track record and the signing of the loan...but at the same time, there are parents who actually abuse or kill their children, so forging a document is not out of the realm of possibility.
I think at the end of the day it doesn't matter, she is still responsible for it. Nothing productive is gained from Ramit insisting or doubting her version of events. What's the plan to pay it down?
Uhh Idk…I wouldn’t jump that far, financial abuse is more common than most think. I’m first gen and have seen the same dynamic with a providing father amongst many friends. If anything, it explains the patterns she’s recreating. But it definitely doesn’t excuse her behavior.
Also the boyfriend also co-signed a loan for her for $15,000...
In addition to the $5,000. This patience and calm he has managed to be.
I do hope that they get counseling before moving forward because these two incidents are indicative of deep problems.
She puts her supposedly abusive family over him? She stole money from him? He signed a personal loan for her, and she did nothing to change her behavior? Dude, run.
Tbf with the father if the mother is constantly over spending and putting them in debts and also hiding debts then it would be a good idea to put the brakes on her somehow. If not, you'd lose everything. Also if daughter is following her path then yes I'd try there too.
I don’t think she’s a good match for him. She stole money that says a lot about someone’s character she has a lot of internal conflicts she needs to work out. Time to move on Matt, she’s not the one.
She was brought up by her mother to have to be sneaky
Ramit big cuzzo, you killed this one. You say things that are on the audience mind, tough questions. I think the guests and the audience got a lot out of this.
Ramit, these people need a couples counselor not a financial guru to help them.
This episode was so difficult. There’s so much going on and I hope they find a way to move forward. I kept getting distracted though by how nice this set is!! I want to live there, unironically.
I know! I love the swivel chairs they’re sitting on.
How is this a healthy relationship?! He lent her money for debt consolidation and has no idea where the money went. She stole from him, and herself because he wanted to use money for a ring. He needs therapy as to why this is acceptable behavior to him. The student loan is her debt. I don’t trust the narrative she is spinning about her Dad.
Her first goal is to tackle her own debt and pay off debt. His goal should be therapy to understand why he is accepting this behavior from her.
I haven't been this upset by a show in a long time. What the hell is wrong with Matt?!? I was hoping Ramit would shake him. Her little sad girl act is played out! She is holding back a pride smile (not an embarrassment smile). There's something concerning about her demeanor, she's a master manipulator and the boyfriend is a doormat. He wants to motivate her by going to a jewelry store after she stole the engagement ring savings, he doesn't stand a chance.
* Also, nurses have access to patient's personal belongings. Her employer should review this video.
🐈
That man seems like husband and dad material.
If you mean for a woman looking to take advantage of a man in divorce and family court.
He’s got a good heart but I fear he’s not going to have much success in relationships with that passiveness. Being a good husband is about more than just smiling and saying yes. Sometimes you need to take control, put your foot down, and say no for the good of the family. Not sure I can see him doing that.
I do not understand how shopping and spending money helps someone escape the fact that they do not have money. It would give me anxiety to unnecessarily buy things when I am already stressed about bills and money.
I don’t understand how someone can shop so much they spend “x” number a month as a set budget. Seems so odd to me. Are people getting new clothes every month?
Quick dopamine hit, problem is they're always chasing it and can never finish
Credit cards let you disconnect the things you buy from how much money you actually have at the time. Makes it easier to spend more.
It’s a momentary dopamine hit. It’s a vicious circle.
Yes like omg how can you ignore.
note: i haven’t finished the video.
“she says no to me all the time.” with her family she doesn’t set boundaries and gets used for money and domestic labor. her fiancé makes her feel safe and comfortable. but what they’ve done is reverse the dynamic where she uses him and he struggles to set boundaries (why she stole from him). even when you love people you should be able to say no.
i bet that when she first moved out from her family she felt free. free time, energy, and money. she didn’t have to say no over and over in daily interactions bc saying no to living with them is one decision.
i think her fiancé (maybe subconsciously) wanted them to live with their families again bc she was stressing him out the same way. he doesn’t have to learn how to set real boundaries regularly with her if she doesn’t live with him. i think the $1200 they save making six figures is just the excuse.
As a nurse myself I cannot imagine spending 250k on loans. That like med school debt! CRAZY!!
Ramit mentioned she failed out the first time so she went back...
That’s what I don’t understand either! I know going to be a doctor can be expensive, but a nurse? I wonder what school she went to or if she signed up for predatory loans.
Private nursing degrees are about 120k right now in California. My stepdaughter is going to such a school but paying more like 80k because she did prerequisites at community college.
There are a lot of predatory private nursing colleges out there and if you don't hit certain metrics they fail you and make you start from scratch and pay all over again rather than letting you claim part credit for what you have completed already. It sounds like this was the case for her. Probably paid 120k for the original program she did and then 120k again after they failed out and she had to start over. I've also seen people get crazy assignments during school requiring short term rentals, super long commutes and other things that add to cost.
Yeah no she definitely forged his signature
If hes as smart as she says he is,then he most definitely wouldn’t have co-signed a terrible loan
And for her to steal 5k from her boyfriend under the guise of ill put it back without him knowing without her having a job is crazy
She starts to cry when she has to admit what shes done
Dont cry,you weren’t crying when you took the money.Your crying cause you got caught
I think it's ironic that she feels like a parent to her mom and sister when it seems like he's a parent to her.
I think that is exactly why she is seeking the parent dynamic from him, because her own parents neglected her in those aspects.
Exactly this. I parent my parents and sister YET I also need parenting from my husband (something I am improving). It’s a very typical dynamic to see tbh
Yeah that’s usually the exact dynamic that creates this kind of situation. Unfortunately.
He’s a grandparent
I doubt very much that her description of her doing everything in the house is accurate. I mean, her Dad has to drive her everywhere. I think she is effective at telling herself stories.
I do not trust the young lady. The Dad tried to advise both the mother and her to manager their finances but they disregarded him.
I believe the father wanted both parties to work for financial future but the mother decided to stay at home. Mostly people who migrated from different countries have different backgrounds and perspective about money because they have other responsibilities back home. If they have no support from the spouse and they are overworked, they become overwhelmed and feel used as a source of supply and that builds total resentment towards the partner.
If Michelle was able to take take Mark’s money without asking, I am very sure she did forged her dad’s signature, because from the description of the father character, he appears to be a straightforward person.
Trust me she is a liability. I am in similar situation and it’s not fun.
If this were my son. I would definitely encourage him to leave. She is showing him who she is :( - she needs a lot of work on herself.
I'd be encouraging him to contact the police as it's theft
Hold on. You’re telling me she purposefully omitted her debt in the CSP, only added it after the man was done reviewing it? Ma’am 😭
😂
My wife (both of us are RN's) and we had similar issues when we were younger. My wife is very frugal and can find a good deal on anything we are needing however. She just never knew how to follow a budget. I took over the budget and we began investing and saving. We talked about finances for both of us, and paid off any outstanding debt which ended up being $35k paid off. Thirty years later we are on track to retire, house paid off, and are debt free other than a car loan about every 10 years. We definitely know how to work together now that we have systems in place.
Regarding the “forged” signature…the signature is irrelevant. It’s HER loan. A co-signer is for the bank to go after if she defaults. But having your dad co-sign doesn’t mean he’s morally responsible to pay for you. She’s confusing a co-signer with a parent plus loan.
Yes! Co-signer is a back-up for the lender. Doesn’t mean THEY owe it, the main borrower owes it. Not the co-signer. But lenders will go after him because she isn’t paying it
The father is legally responsible and the company will go after him if she does not pay. Also, until it is paid it can impact his financial status such as going for another loan.
Exactly! Seems like she is thinking that he should help her repay?
She’s an addict who is self-soothing from trauma by having others care for her - delivery food - and shopping makes her feel delusionally powerful - can swipe in the moment. It’s a common combination (eating and shopping) maybe not as devastating as drinking alcohol or gambling but slowly destroying her life. She needs therapy to deal with her childhood trauma or she’ll keep self-soothing at the detriment of her life and this relationship.
The $750 a month for clothes….as a nurse? How many sets of scrubs does she need…some hospitals provide your scrubs, you just turn the soiled ones in, get clean ones, all on the honor system.
She aint buyinh scrubs…
Buying the latest jeans and sweaters not work scrubs
This episode is FANTASTIC! Everything about it, production quality, the guests, the issues, and the insights. Well done. I feel for Matt, but I have high hopes for them both.
This was a hard listen. I hope Matt sees the red flags. Even on the podcast, she was not honest. (Ramit asked if she said something when Matt discovered money was missing. She said yes. Ramit asked her what she said, and she said there was just silence.) The theft, the hiding of debt and spending, being accused of forgery (which I'm inclined to believe after the other deceitfulness she admits to), the shifting of blame to others, and acting super apologetic while not actually changing her bad behavior. It would be too much for me. If i were him, I would freeze my credit, pay off the $15k cosigned loan, and move on.
Hearing her shows me how I am not as compassionate with myself. Like others I find myself judging her very harshly to what seems like a totally preventable situation. And as hard as I am on her, and though my situation is better, I also judge myself for not being where I’d like to be. Thank you for helping me notice and try to be better for my own peace.
What is scary is that SHE is a nurse which requires good judgment and good character but she is neither of those things.
Oh believe me a lot of really crappy people go into nursing for the money and schedule. My wife has had many down right evil coworkers. Sure made me a lot less trusting without asking questions.
well- she did not have money for renewing registration, so.... :|
Take your time to find the right spouse!
I hate to be so forward, but anyone who tells you they are “always taking care of everyone else” within minutes of beginning a conversation are typically the most self centered people. I have learned this is a manipulation tactic (or a severe lack of self awareness). I am not half way through the episode and I can see multiple inconsistencies in her narrative. I wish this couple well, but this gentleman may want to exercise a lot of caution as he continues this relationship.
Fully agree, sadly we only learn this the hard way 😅
yes, it was too quick , and a martyr tactic, like, look at poor me taking care of everyone
She scares me, so much manipulation, self loathing, and self sabotage, I have no idea what to trust she’s saying
I felt manipulation as well. Which explains why her boyfriend is so passive, he has literally no spine. She just kept calling herself worthless and disgusting but despite those intense feelings she had absolutely no plan.
Making two pancakes at home costs about 50 cents 🤦♀️ I'm floored by people draining their finances for Uber Eats.
And they take no time to make, you could even premix the mix and just pour the batter and flip when you get home. Crazy.
Lol they make over $180k and felt like they needed to both move home with parents because the combined rent was $1,200?? 😂😂😂
Maybe if and when they split, it'll make it easier
Makes no sense
Yes because she has a huge spending addiction. That’s what this episode is about.
They said the make $119,000
@@Michelgia523Is $119k a year not livable or something?
Are we sure she didn't forge her dad's signature? I mean she STOLE from her boyfriend... Her dad said "do what you need to do" ... I don't know, I'm HIGHLY suspicious.
Boyfriend needs to stop ignoring all these red flags.
Holy heck, finger snaps for that moment explaining moral judgment. Wow. Everyone needs this in one area or another of their lives.
Ramit doing pre marital counseling. I hope each take the time independently to sort themselves out before moving forward.
"Did you say anything?"
"Yeah"
"What did you say?"
"There was a lot of silence"
Oooookay
i struggled with talking finances w my partner early in our relationship, i was going into debt bc i didn’t want him to know (shame) or feel like he had to help me (pride/shame). i made those decisions internally but the whole time he was willing to do anything for me if i’d just TALKED TO HIM HONESTLY. it’s been years since and we’re completely open communication wise, and wouldn’t have made it through better people otherwise.
i definitely understand why money is one of the biggest relationship killers 😅
She plays the poor hopeless victim role to Ramit but really she is the VILLAIN in this whole story!!! People who feel desperate will ALWAYS do desperate things! (Stealing $5k, forging signatures, etc)
They both have debt to clear. Live together in a tiny studio.. spend the weekend to cook and meal plan. Pack all your lunches and eat dinners at home. Date night is frozen pizza and pasta. Huddle inwards into your relationship and snowball your debts. No new clothes, shopping, no uber eats for until your debt is 30% left. It would probably take 5-8 years to get it done. Light a fire under your butt. No kids before debt is cleared. No dogs too. Tell your parents you have 200+k in debt and you are in a fire mode to get it done. Set boundaries.
Frozen pancakes are 3.99 for 24 pieces. Pot roast is less than $10. Pop it in a slow cooker overnight. Voila! Meals for days
She stole from him. How does it work that he's still in this relationship? If or when she becomes his wife she has even more access to his resources. She needs deep therapy and a fiduciary.
I think he enables her bad behavior. I think he needs to leave her and let her hit rock bottom so she is motivated to rebuild her life. She needs a stronger more supportive partner that holds her accountable.
21:47 thanks for the reminder Ramit, I should go to sleep. Will finish this in the morning
BROTHER YOU GOTTA LEAVE HER
Wow, all the blame on the girl's father. She lived with her boyfriend, and he cosigned for a loan for her, yet he didn't know how much debt she was in? she filled up the CSP and didn't openly discuss it with him and he now finds out on the show how much in debt "they" are in! Do you really think she didn't do something similar to her father and he was the way he was because her mother treated money the same way she does. She admits her mother was secretly racking up hidden charges and i wonder who would have to ultimately take care of it. Let give a little respect to hard working unappreciated men who have put their family first but gets nothing but disrespect. Remember 20 yrs ago, we didn't have all the tools or the lack of social stigma that is accepted today for coming out and admitting you're in debt or not good with money.
I had to turn it off after she started trying to accuse her father of being controlling. He seemed justified in his actions imo.
And it's a pretty big red flag how she speaks about all her family including her mom and sister.
Side note but I really liked the intro and filming style this episode! Love that you try different styles and are receptive to audience input :)
I just listened to this. I’m more of a Dave Ramsey listener but will turn on this podcast. This whole episode pissed me off! Who pays $200k for nursing school!!! Who’s the doctor?? Her boyfriend has no boundaries and has no backbone. Collectively they owe an entire house value in debt. 260k is a house in my area. She wants to play victim on the entire call. He needs to put his foot down. Either she gets on a budget and increase the money that she pays on her debts monthly or he’s out. For a finance guy you’d think he’d want to be involved to help her analyze and come up with a strategy. You moved out of a $650 apartment because it cost too much? Doesn’t pass the sniff test. Her plan is to get married and pregnant so this debt is now his problem. Sorry, but they shouldn’t get married. If she was gung-ho and ready to attack the debt this entire conversation would have been different.
but why do you think they moved out? i think they are not being honest. I think he gave her the ultimatum and she doing this dog and pony show singing up for Ramit's show to show the BF that she wants to clean up her act. the moment they are married, she will be back to spend spend.
@@TheSharmam they move back to each parents house in order to avoid $300 dollars of rent. I don’t buy it. If they had their own place they would be living together doing chores, hanging out. I didn’t mention it earlier but she 100% forged the paperwork. This is the same woman that stole $5k out of her boyfriend’s safe (that he was saving to buy her a wedding ring!!). He should leave her now. They also don’t think they mentioned car debt. My hunch is she’s driving around in a new/newish car with a large monthly payment.
Matt is such a patient person, unrealistically.
All of these adults who live with their parents always seem to talk a lot of shit about them...
Run far and fast if someone steals from you.
He didn’t react angrily enough for me after she stole from him and kept her finances from him. It’s also terrible dynamics for him to keep enabling her without any consequences. He deserves better, someone who wouldn’t steal and lie to him but for that he would need a back bone.
This just tugged at my heart. I hope they can work through this and find their way to a life they can both be happy with. Plus, there's a furry friend that's just waiting for them to arrive. Great show.
My dude, the red flags are flying.
These two need loads of counseling before they even think about getting married (mostly her, but some together as well).
…and if he decides to go through with it, a prenup.
I relate a lot to Michelle's family situation. People think because I live at home, I'm being taken care of, or saving money, but they just take advantage of me.
why dont you leave ?
@@denisgsv I'm literally trying bro. It's a fight every day.
@@denisgsvit’s not that easy for a lot of people.
Matt actually concerns me more than her. What is his upbringing that makes him stay with a woman that steals a substantial amount of money from him? At his income level, $5,000 probably took him a while to save, so him to just be “disappointed” is unsettling. Not to mention it doesn’t sound like there’s any interest/ intention of paying him back. She actually doubles down and asks him about a ring! I get that he loves her, but he is too calm about the extra $100k debt he didn’t know about. Also for him to just automatically assume responsibility for $230k debt… Ramit had to point out to him that the debt wasn’t his to pay off!! I’m so glad he moved back home.
I was so freaked out when he talked about going to a jewelry store for motivation for her. If her motivation is only so that she can marry him, then what motivates her after that? And after children are in the mix? I'm sorry, Ramit, you were way to soft on her. She's a manipulator and you didn't call it out.
I judged her initially but hearing her story of a controlling (verbally abusive) parent with money, I can somewhat relate. Also having experienced a parent with selective memory after the fact - I get it. People are saying she forged his signature, it's definitely possible but so is her story about her dad too.
Love listening to these as i do my workout and start my day
I also listen to this during my workouts ^_^
@@snowjae9380 +1
I don't believe her on how she painted her father's character. I wish her father was here to clarify things. Somehow, I feel she's lying or at least hiding some important details.
i find this conversation so boring, to mean that even her tone of voice is so lethargic and resigned, jesus, it's like snap out of it! you're in the mess you're in, now what are you going to do about it??
that's mean i know but ugh, i'd rather someone worked up than be this passive, including her partner, absolutely, nobody would take $5 THOUSAND of my dollars and i'd just be like whatever about it.
But, i wish them all the best. it ain't easy, that's for sure.
19:38 so many story inconsistencies, she feeds and is responsible for her mom and sister, but shes ordering in food ...... maybe Ramit has a kink where he likes to be lied to his face......
27:26 oh the tears, the she's cornered, got caught and out comes the waterworks.
Wow, she straight up stole from him. I was devastated when my high school friend stole money from me; I can't imagine the pain, violation, and breach of trust from a lover. I hope Matt gets individual therapy and recognizes his worth.
I tried to feel sorry for Michelle, but I just feel she is living in the victim mentality. If you can take money from your partner and not tell them. Then when it gets down to her choices, she says she doesn't know why she does it. She acts like she has no control over it. I feel like here emotions were more about having herself exposed and not actually her situation. I hope Matt can create boundaries and give Michelle time to prove that she can take control of and get out of the victim mind set. If not, this relationship will forever struggle.
@@musiclover-71 she's victim presenting, frankly it's a con artists method for garning sympathy and deflecting. Matt is a mark, not a partner.
I see a lot of people so focused on saving the relationship, they don't stop to ask if the relationship is actually healthy and if they're their most healthiest version in it. I say this for Michelle as much as Matt. If she could let go of the idea of staying together at all costs, she could be honest with him and let the chips fall where they may. This would enable her to be a more complete and happy individual and own her problems instead of avoiding them. The relationship would also have a better chance at survival. But even if it failed, she'd still be better off than she is now as she would be living her honest self.
Matt is also so desperate to hold on that he's willing to bury his head in the sand. He's neither willing to let the relationship go nor commit to it fully (don't blame him). I'm not saying they need to break up, but they need to realize breaking up isn't the worst outcome. Them living this halfway life with all these secrets is a far worse outcome than being single. I'm really worried about Matt. He's very vulnerable to being taken advantage of. I'm glad he's at least not taken on her debt (yet).
Wow, communication about finances is so important for married couples 🙏🏽
So much to this ep- I think he needs to do some deep diving into his own mindset on decision making and standards for what he's willing to put up with. What he sees as a rich life with a partner, what healthy communication looks like, etc and really evaluate if the current situation is meeting that or not. If its not - what milestones can be established if he doesn't want to give up on it. His avoidance of conflict with her needs to be addressed. I hope they end up happy in whatever shape that takes for them. There's definitely some serious stuff to tackle before marriage if that's in the cards.
Definitely don't understand the decision to move in together with that joint monthly income. I understand she may be a spending addict but you would think with her trauma of living at home that would motivate her minimally to at least make rent and keep her independence.
Also curious why she didn't ask him for the money for her car registration so she could at least retain her ability to drive. (If youre going to steal money, at least use it for your critical bills lol)
She wants us to think that she didn’t have bad enough morals to forge her dad’s signature on her student loans as a co-signer but she did have bad enough morals to steal $5,000 from her boyfriend.
The new format is awesome. Great job Ramit
Matt... You can talk without being hurtful. Therapy will help but hold her accountable
bro is getting scammed, she's acting like a put upon immaculate victim, not buying it at all.
23:37 he cosigned on her loan consolidation, his trust is very misplaced.
I love to see the motivation and clarity on next steps. Each of them starting therapy sounds like a great move to help them grow individually and as a team. ❤
Yeahhh..no. i get that she is sorry but there is no behavior change and she stole from him. She has no action and intention or resolve to fix it. This guy needs to step away...there is no positive way out.
Gender roles are very real, because we wouldn't give so much mercy to a guy that stole $5k from his gf.
She is so full of crap.. "i dont feel worthy... im a people pleaser.... " if she steals she is self entitled.
Why kids keep opting to go to college out of state or private school when you can not afford to just pay for it kills me. Also why no one thinks they can work while they go to college is insane. Everyone I knew worked while in college as engineering and CS majors. I worked full time taking over a full load of engineering classes. It is hard but easier than paying back a huge loan, plus you are young and have more energy.
Sir, run… don’t think, just RUN!!!
This was a tough episode. Big problems and no easy solutions. I do wish Ramit had encouraged them to make at least one numbers-based decision on camera. It was weird to see the episode end with no changes to the CSP. Ramit told her to make a plan but why not start now? We see retirement calculations on here all the time; would a debt payoff calculation be too depressing to show?
I felt that too. Would have loved to see some solid calculations like normal.
I would not stay with man, who would steal from me…why he stays? Where are self respect and boundaries? And if she would take his retirement money when he is 70 ? How would he react? Financial infidelity is the same as physical infidelity…. Not acceptable
Thank GOD my nurse wife went down a different road. Now 18 years into her career she has a very healthy 401k and makes 6 figures. Our mortgage is our only debt. But I get it. You take a young person and wear them out with a hard schedule and give them enough money to live it up if they want. It is a hard lesson to learn.
I wanted to hear her dad’s version of it all. I don’t know, I have a feeling he may be actually right.
I kept thinking the same thing.