Dominions 5 Basic Nation Analysis - MA Marignon
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ก.ย. 2024
- MA Marignon is an interestingly complex nation. With inflexible magic supporting a troop lineup of cheap, effective crossbows, bottom-of-the-barrel sacred flagellants and powerful recruit-anywhere sacred knights, Marignon has to rely on their sacreds to carry the early game before transitioning into a late-game leaning heavily on their national summons and whatever magic diversity they can put together from independents. It can make for a difficult transition, but with an efficient bless and strong expansion, Marignon's advantages can certainly be leveraged into a strong midgame.
You can buy this game here; store.steampowe...
Subscribe to the channel! / @generalconfusionplays
If you like my content and want to support me, check out my Patreon: / generalconfusion
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 80 | คู่เอก "รักษ์ vs ยอดนำชัย"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ckLMRorsMeY/mqdefault.jpg)
0:32 HAHAH! Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!
Thank you for the guide. I took a different tact with MA Marignon and was wondering what you thought of it?
Considering the Knights of the Chalice have the highest defense for any sacred that is not "recruit in the capital only" (by 2 points if I am correct) IMHO it is very beneficial to bump them twice with (3C) bless effect of defense +2 to put their defense at 19 and the paladins at 20. Combine that with blood surge and their defense goes up another point. As long as you have enough knights to not get surrounded (easy enough in a wide single lines) they become almost impossible for any unit to hit them. With a very good protection value, good HP, and decent magic resist they hold up pretty well to archer and spell damage which is their only real weakness. They are strong enough to spread into single lines which makes them less vulnerable to area spells.
If you max bless the Knights of the Chalice they are almost thug worthy by themselves with absolutely no gear on them. Later in the game you can spread them out in small groups of 6-20 all over your deployment area so they all can't be hit with the hard hitting area damage spells. Then they charge so quickly across the field of battle it is tough to block them all. They often catch the mages and archers in the rear.
I have played quite a bit with MA Marignon and a max bless imprisoned Baphomet pretender. I get decent scales for keeping the economy up... Dom4, Turm2, Prod2, Heat1, Growth3, Luck1, Mag1. I can get dominion 7 by just taking one more negative scale or one less positive one. I find my scales a nice balance. Higher Dominion seems easy to get anyway since early on expanding is a piece of cake. I go with F4, C6, E5, As4, B4 with the Resulting Bless: (remember you get 2 bonus points in fire and astral) Attack Skill, Major Fire Res, Defense Skill x2, Reinvigoration, Strength of Earth, Minor Magic Res, Magic Weapons, Major Magic Res, and Blood Surge. These knights hit incredibly hard from the very beginning of the game (you start with all blesses), Blood surge procs easily with their first charge at the enemy. Almost nothing can touch the knights with their defense value and better yet they are at str +6 and att +5 with blood surge and are also wielding magic weapons. They are killing machines that rarely die from the second turn of the game. What is great is that you can mass produce these guys from any fortress with a temple. By the time people have late game magic going you will have so many of these sacreds running around it is hard as hell to counter. I have never played with more than 10 players, so I am not sure how this will perform in a truly epic game... but in a short to average game this faction works very well.
I do not use the flagellants to any real extent. My bless recruitment is saved for mages, priests, and the knights/paladins. Excess resources go to crossbows, halberdiers for fort defense, man at arms for guarding the mages, and the occasional architect to speed up sieges. Knights do not break down walls very well. The biggest weakness I have found so far.
I recently started using this faction with some drain scales and added N5 with the incarnate bless of Recuperation for healing afflictions on the knights and those damned old mages. Strangely, the knights almost never die but still get injured sometimes. As they gain experience they just get even better. The old Marignon mages are constantly getting injured and are a real pain. Not sure yet if the recuperation is worth it. (doubt it actually, but still experimenting) The drain scales have both positive and negative effects... The drain scales slow early research, but if you concentrate on construction, one in four of your grand masters will have air magic and you can make feathers. Once you get to construction 6 you should have saved so many fire gems that every one of your cheap initiates can forge a pair of lanterns and your research will skyrocket! The heat and drain scales cancel each other out for mages casting fire spells so it is not too fatiguing for your fire mages in your own dominion. All other types of magic casting in my dominion is very fatiguing (heat/drain) and that is not so bad for this faction since spell casting (especially other magic types) is not Marignon's strong point anyway. Last but not least the reinvigoration from the earth magic and blood surge helps the sacred mages and troops to hold up in the heat/drain. Having the knights mounted helps in this regard as well. I think other factions troops and mages seem to whither towards the end of any longer battles.
Hope to get some feedback on using drain scales like this to help defense against heavy magic users? Thanks in advance for any discussion.
Best Marri bless ever; Death explosion, Fateweaving and Blood Vengeance. Onward my flagellants of doom. Muwahahahahahahahahahahahaha
If you're doing death explosion flagellants, you really, REALLY need a big fire resistance bless too. Otherwise they'll chain reaction the instant one of them gets grazed by an arrow, and you lose your entire stack.
That's the point. It's so stupidly bad your opponents die laughing and leave you alone.
But if you wanted something viable then yes you're correct.
MA Marignon, Death Explosion + Luck + Major Fire Resistance is the most success I've had with the Death Explosion bless... for whatever that's worth (and I don't play multiplayer).
10 fire resistance is enough to prevent most friendly fire, and luck is a general huge benefit for such squishy critters as flagellants - they won't melt to missile fire. Nice for your mages too (the explosions, not so much. Don't guard your mages with flagblasts).
Would be very nice to see you continuing these for a nation through the ages as you've done before. I would like to see LA Marignon and how it became from a zealous theocracy to demon summoners - speaking of which could you dedicate one or two minutes to the "lore" of the nations? I know there isn't much but I like that part a lot
Margion was losing to ermor because they used humans to fight the necromancers. They would win battles but the undead and their fallen would rise back up. So they made a pact with demons since demons could fight the undead and not die and be resurrected.
First time i heard the words "pig wang" in a dominions 5 context. I am amused.
Marignon is a nation that likes the unaging bless, since your most powerful mages and priests are all really goddamn old and sacred.
Holy pyre (a national evocation spell) is surprisingly useful against low protection troops, since your knights (or fire resistant flaggelants) can just shrug it off, and it absolutely annihilates skelespam. If you really need to, you can give your initiates a fire gem (or a fire in a jar if you can get them at a discount) to phoenix power up at the start of the battle and then just keep spamming holy pyre. It can make storming Marignon's research forts a real pain in the ass.
I'll never play a nation with old mages again without the unaging bless. It really makes a big difference if you want to use High Inquisitors in combat, as opposed to just using them for a bit of site searching, rituals, and whatnot.
Also taking darkvision (whatever the N one is called) is great for this nation. When you get Evocaton 5, you can drop Solar Eclipse in ever fight.
Never take barkskin with this nation. Too much fire magic to have to work around using sacreds with mages that might nuke.
Also the heat aura is problematic to use with this nation. You wind up fatiguing out your crossbowmen and any other non-sacreds behind the lines.
Could I please kindly request one of the following nations as your insights are invaluable;
MA Uruk
LA Pythium
Any Arco.
Great to see those flags and knights in action. :-)
Actually against shields like the Knights have the flagellants have an additional 2 attack, so they are smacking knights for 21 damage twice with 15 attack. Pretty solid little chaff units. Oh, and don't forget that despite being chaff they have 14 morale, which is pretty insane.
WOAH don't underestimate the Angels of the Host- the ones that come with the Arch Angel (F4H3, so flying throne claimer if you don't have time to move your slow as old men around) are the good ones that come with a flambeau. They are your suicide hit squad, target largest or rear and watch them slaughter enemy thugs/SC's before their buff cycles. They make great bodyguards too.
It's the other Angels of the Heavenly Choir that suck since they only have a fist.
Now I wouldn't buy an Arch Angel for six suicide squad boyz and I wouldn't get an Arch Angel at all in vanilla since they compete for gems with Harbingers, but don't slander my sweet sweet angelic death squad. Pretty sure you know but for the wider audience in the most common mod Dominions Enhanced (DE) they are actually a sick summon since they cost fire gems and fire magic itself was buffed to the point it has some great thug spells.
All good points, except one; Marignon's old men are not slow, because they can all teleport with one booster at worst. Airdropping A-random Grand Masters into major battles to lead communions cast Fog Warriors and such is a time-honored tradition for Mari.
I'd love to see a video on LA Mari. The blood magic I imagine makes it a much stronger era
Fateweaving… huh. I'd never have thunk.
I like (fire4+2, astral6+2, blood4) +4 attack, luck, blood surge. Luck actually makes Flagellents a lot more survivable. Use temples to mass large numbers of them for early expansion.
Thanks for the video! One fun and cheap bless option I found is going Fire 4 and Astral 4 to get Flaming Weapons and Twist Fate. It's a budget way to help both Flagellants and Knights.
Also, you haven't talked about taking a Virtue with Death 5 as an early expander. Don't you think that the Fear and Awe combo can work? I know it probably doesn't count as a supercombatant, but I feel it's something to use if you want something different than usual. As a side benefit you can get Stygian Flesh for the Flagellants and of course you get access to Death magic overall. Thoughts?
Certainly doable! I generally don't think Stygian Flesh is a super useful bless - it's basically Barkskin that doesn't work against spells - but yes, a Virtue with Death 5 will expand through indies very easily.
Have you considered Luck + Awe? it makes your flagellants into incredibly annoying chaff, and also makes your Knights absurdly hard to kill. Also, I am pretty sure that Angels of Fury are assassins. If you are playing MA Marignon, I would check out the Dominions Enhanced Mod, which gives you some really cool options, including unique Archangel summons (essentially super-seraphs with unique abilities, including one that breaks you into nature and water) and a world enchantment that causes your dominion to spread better, and makes you freespawn angels.
Also, dont forget your assassins and Trabadours
Angel's of Fury are not assassins, they have no magic (including holy magic) and lose awe but come with blood vengeance. You are probably thinking of them as assassins because in DE there is a Mari national spell that summons one of these for an assassination event.
How about luck and (whatever the fire bless is that makes you explode) on the flagellants for full meme?
One fun thing to do with Marri, although not that practical, is spend the points for the death explosion bless. Get a bunch of them, a high level priest to cast divine blessing, put them at the front in a skirmish, and drown the infidels in a wave of suicide bombers.
I did a bless heavy lousy scales awake bahomet pretender, with 10 dominion so I could recruit more sacreds. Attack skill twice from fire, fateweaving from astral, stygian flesh from death, and extra strength from blood. Now my flagellants were high strength high accuracy 2 attack dudes with decent armor and ignoring the first hit on them. They were so cheap you could recruit them in numbers anywhere you had a temple and they were strong enough to trade 1 for 1 with blackplate infantry from Ulm!
As it should be. Zealots of faith against Zealots of Steel.
Great video! Thanks!
I keep hearing "flatulence." (Thanks for a great vid.)
Seems like theyd do alright with blood bond and some reinvig too
Those Seraph path you couldn't remember are 4f, 4a, 4s, and 4h.
Also what are your opinions on LA Marri's Fallen Angles? Blood 7, 88 slaves 4b 1s, for and SC with 3f, 3d, and 3b.
They're extremely solid SCs - D/F gives you the Soul Vortex/Phoenix Pyre combo, and Blood is always useful. Plus they fly and have excellent base stats, of course - and as cheap as they are, LA Mari can absolutely spam them if they want - Any S-random Goetic Master can summon them with a couple of boosters, and LA Marignon has all the paths to forge them the gear they want.
I know it's not generally advised but how do people feel about having an awake Wizard Pretender (Like the great Enchantress). This way you could benefit from the additional Astral Gem per turn and you could have a powerful mage Site Searching from Turn 1. Meaning you will discover sites early and totally beat out your opponents in the magic department. You could use it as a way to overcome your lack of diversity in mages.
I really feel like it is easier to get into air when you can sitesearch with a lvl 3 air mage in the first 10 turns. You could have enough Airgems to empower it to 4 and let you build the Air helmet to raise your random Air Sages to Lvl 2 or 3 so they can cast wind guide for your crossbowmen
My understanding is that dormant wouldn't set you too far back and it's an extra 150 design points. It's 12 astral gems and about 6 site searches at best cost to wait for a dormant. In return you'd have a better bless/rainbow/scales than you'd normally have.
Though against AI it probably wouldn't matter and I don't MP yet so idk there.
@@Kaiser282 Thanks for the answer, but I've given up on this strategy in the last 7 months. Having 3 luck yields more gems than this idea ever could. You can also get free labs and you'll have a higher chance of getting your national heroes. I tend to go full scales now with only 4 or 8 bless points on a dormant wizard pretender chassis.
@@Mizelei2012 I feel that. I've given up on a lot of strats over the last year. Scales, luck especially, is just so nice for so many things.
I wonder if it would be valid to go Imprisoned and go neutral heat instead? As it is, the Heat3 eats most of the income you get from Growth aparts from the well... growth part of it
Taking Heat is kinda good for Marignon. Since fire is the most common path it'll help out the mages by reducing the fatigue they rack up casting fire spells.
I don't know if it's from a patch but someone said barkskin raises the natural protection to 10. If the unit's natural protection is already 10 then there's no benefit. So it doesn't do anything for Marignon's Knights.
No, Marignon's knights have no natural protection at all. All of their protection comes from armor, so putting Barkskin on them does indeed help - natprot and armor prot stack, albeit not with perfect efficiency. Knights with Barkskin cast on them end up with IIRC something like 24 or 25 total protection.
@@GeneralConfusionPlays Thx I didn't know you could view natural protection on dom5inspector. It's written "basic" when you point over it. I thought protection was natural protection so I was confused.
Yikes that sore throat...still great vid as per usual :)
for getting fog warriors from harbingers, it might be worth using two witch hunters and a crystal matrix to skip the storm( a turn AND hurts your precision) + storm power
Only if the harbinger doesn't need to fly around casting it on different armies.
if you have an army, you prob have at least two witch hunters no? in fact, you might be wanting to make a witch hunter communion even without the harbringer, so you could just add it on (maybe gear it out and have it thug a little after the casting so you don't go thunderstriking in your fire communion?)
Oh right communion slave exists as a spell so you don't need to give crystals to witch hunters. I thought you meant slapping on a whole crystal communion of human 10 hit point plebs you cant always rely on in each army. In any case you should have the ability to cast fog warriors with or without communion slaves so I'd give it some extra gems and change the script whenever I need to.
yup, one harbinger can technically go between armies to cast fog warriors as long as you script some witch hunters w/ communion slave, harbingers are only air 3 so they can't cast it without some boost to a4, at wich point you can use gems to cast it as if you were a5 (which is the level of the spell). so it would cost 4 air gems instead of 3; also costing a lot of fatigue.
I know all of that. I was saying sometimes you don't have the mages but fog warriors could win you the battle so you should be prepared to pay the extra air gems and fatigue. Also it costs 6 gems without mages not 4, 2 for storm which you need for storm power, and 4 for fog warriors. An air booster would be good in that very specific situation but it's necessary and chances are the few and expensive air boosters you might have will have better places to be.
Are their evocation spells any good?
6:46 NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!
Silly general. This popped up after the marri campaign announcement.
I think we've fallen into another universe where this video was made first.
abzurd
Next please
ma r'lyeh
ma ulm
ma man
Egor Ivlev ma ulm alrdy done, check playlist
ma r'yleh is also already done