Hearing Dorn talking about generational hatred and about how it'll keep going until the people are fighting battles they forgot what they were fighting for... And then you look at the Imperium of the late 41st and go "Oh, he was spot on. They both were."
@BridgeTROLL777 yeah but it's the fact that that's what the Imperium turned into: an empire of worlds kept in line by the fear of authority figures, random executions, and entire worlds being erased for reasons that may or may not be true. They keep the boot on the neck of the people just as Curze said they would.
@@Ravil322 not really. while current empire might lobotomize and make servitor out of person suspected of some crime, imperium does not sadistically torture its citizens for example if they steal some food.... Curz is even more extreme than imperium currently.
@@MrTawnyMan I think it was either the book "A thousand sons" or "Prospero burns", probably the former. Over some world, Curze was punishing the world because they defied him and Magnus was begging not to, or at least spare the libraries because of the knowledge they might contain. Curze told him no, and Magnus tried to make his case about the path for mankind, trying to appeal to Curze's sense of curiosity and the value of knowledge and such. Last thing he tries to do is say something akin to "I know what father wants, I talked with him while he was making us, and this is not it". Curze told him to beat it and Magnus went away with his tail between his legs. It showed that Magnus was incapable of convincing anyone else of his cause, it showed his naivety, it showed that he was quick to give up and quick to nurture a grudge, quick to appeal to a higher power for support instead of relying on his own strength, it showed his heightened sense of self importance, etc. Foreshadowing for everything Magnus would end up being. I don't want to read it again and this account was jumbled as a flashback, but I think his sons saw his weakness too at that point. Someone like Dorn would've not acted like that... as shown here.
I always imagined curze with a dracula-ass accent. and dorn with a stern, flat standard american one. if you ever do a lion el johnson voice over you should give him the closest you can do to a norman accent. he always struck me as as a dark ages knight type
Curze has an hoarse, quiet voice, without flirtatious notes. He believes in what he says and there is no doubt or attempt to persuade, he is simply sure as hell and maybe a little bored to condescend with explanation of such obvious things
He is known to be cold and clinical but he does have his emotional moments . He almost killed Garro when he told him horus had turned traitor because he thought he was lying
I always feel like 30k is a huge tonal whiplash. 40k imperium knows it's evil at least from a thematic standpoint. 30k on the other hand is written as if "no, we're actually the good guys until the demon showed up."
@@saltysocks1074 i mean, 30k to 40k is supposed to feel like that because thats the whole point of the modern imperium. 30k feels at least somewhat "we are the good guys" (though it was never fully true) with the imperium because they were a functional empire, with sane leadership and goals. 40ks version is 10k years of cults, degradation, madness, endless horrors, and all sorts of other warping effects. Roboute summed it up well "Look what they've made of our dream. This bloated, rotting carcass of an empire is driven not by reason and hope but by fear, hate and ignorance".
Romanian. Kurze and the night lords have had what is supposed to be transylvanian accents because of Dracula. Why they don’t give the Blood Angels Transylvanian accents instead of the night lords I don’t know, but there it is.
And then you bay for the blood of the Chinese, Russians, Nigerians, Syrians, Vietnamese and whoever else isn't going to meekly bow to the imperium that murdered them by the millions.
The words used by Dorn when he argues for the Great Crusade are the exact same as everyone who's been brainwashed by an authoritarian regime. Morally, Dorn is a better man, but everything the Night Haunter says is exactly what the Imperium did during the Great Crusade. Give every world they encountered a choice, "Either abandon all rights you think you're entitled to and submit to our regime, or see your planet bathed in blood." Every single one. Word Bearers, Iron Hands, Blood Angels, Lunar Wolves, Space Wolves, Ultramarines, Salamanders, some may have enjoyed it more than others and some may have regretted it, but that's what they did. Whether the invaders come as "liberators" or "conquerors" only matters to the invaders.
All human worlds would be swallowed up by xenos, mutants, or other abominations if they weren't brought under compliance by the emperor under one flag and one banner. The Great Crusade was their one and only chance of quick galactic unification before tyranids and chaos overtook them.
Hearing Dorn talking about generational hatred and about how it'll keep going until the people are fighting battles they forgot what they were fighting for... And then you look at the Imperium of the late 41st and go "Oh, he was spot on. They both were."
Curz's view is extremely narrow so I would say he is wrong in terms of vision of Imperium.
@BridgeTROLL777 yeah but it's the fact that that's what the Imperium turned into: an empire of worlds kept in line by the fear of authority figures, random executions, and entire worlds being erased for reasons that may or may not be true. They keep the boot on the neck of the people just as Curze said they would.
@@BridgeTROLL777 I mean, current Empire is even worse in terms of hatred
@@Ravil322 not really. while current empire might lobotomize and make servitor out of person suspected of some crime, imperium does not sadistically torture its citizens for example if they steal some food.... Curz is even more extreme than imperium currently.
His first captain lead a new legion of hate
'all empires are forged in blood, to pretend otherwise is naive'
darn that hits hard
If only Magnus had such balls during his confrontation with Curze.
When did Magnus confront Curze? It's been so long I forgot 😅
@@MrTawnyMan I think it was either the book "A thousand sons" or "Prospero burns", probably the former.
Over some world, Curze was punishing the world because they defied him and Magnus was begging not to, or at least spare the libraries because of the knowledge they might contain.
Curze told him no, and Magnus tried to make his case about the path for mankind, trying to appeal to Curze's sense of curiosity and the value of knowledge and such. Last thing he tries to do is say something akin to "I know what father wants, I talked with him while he was making us, and this is not it".
Curze told him to beat it and Magnus went away with his tail between his legs. It showed that Magnus was incapable of convincing anyone else of his cause, it showed his naivety, it showed that he was quick to give up and quick to nurture a grudge, quick to appeal to a higher power for support instead of relying on his own strength, it showed his heightened sense of self importance, etc.
Foreshadowing for everything Magnus would end up being. I don't want to read it again and this account was jumbled as a flashback, but I think his sons saw his weakness too at that point. Someone like Dorn would've not acted like that... as shown here.
I always imagined curze with a dracula-ass accent. and dorn with a stern, flat standard american one.
if you ever do a lion el johnson voice over you should give him the closest you can do to a norman accent. he always struck me as as a dark ages knight type
Every time I've heard him he's been Welsh. It seems to work.
@@DeusExMachina10001 He sounds like Tywin Lannister/Charles Dance in my head
Given what happened with Nostromo, Dorn was absolutely right.
Curze has an hoarse, quiet voice, without flirtatious notes. He believes in what he says and there is no doubt or attempt to persuade, he is simply sure as hell and maybe a little bored to condescend with explanation of such obvious things
The truth is you need both to a certain degree. Only one never works. Respect and fear of consequence has to exist together.
Hearing strong emotion in Dorn’s voice is strange
He is known to be cold and clinical but he does have his emotional moments . He almost killed Garro when he told him horus had turned traitor because he thought he was lying
I got to agree with manbat oh I mean Kurze with this.
Curze is correct about some of his points about human nature but dorn is correct about not only making them fear you. They need to like you too.
I never thought Dorn would be a naive idealist. I'm not saying I agree with Curze, but from what little I know, that is what the Imperium is built on.
Lol are you serious bro?
I always feel like 30k is a huge tonal whiplash.
40k imperium knows it's evil at least from a thematic standpoint. 30k on the other hand is written as if "no, we're actually the good guys until the demon showed up."
@@saltysocks1074 i mean, 30k to 40k is supposed to feel like that because thats the whole point of the modern imperium.
30k feels at least somewhat "we are the good guys" (though it was never fully true) with the imperium because they were a functional empire, with sane leadership and goals. 40ks version is 10k years of cults, degradation, madness, endless horrors, and all sorts of other warping effects.
Roboute summed it up well "Look what they've made of our dream. This bloated, rotting carcass of an empire is driven not by reason and hope but by fear, hate and ignorance".
Would love to see something from Magnus or Ahriman :)
Dorn is american - Kurze is Russian ..... Hmmmm
Romanian. Kurze and the night lords have had what is supposed to be transylvanian accents because of Dracula. Why they don’t give the Blood Angels Transylvanian accents instead of the night lords I don’t know, but there it is.
Transylvania is more sinister of an accent.
I want to say Kurze is wrong...and then I turn on the news.
Curze is wrong, but he is speaking of compliance, not of war between 2 diametrically opposed people as in the Mid East.
And then you bay for the blood of the Chinese, Russians, Nigerians, Syrians, Vietnamese and whoever else isn't going to meekly bow to the imperium that murdered them by the millions.
I think both have pretty good points, but they fail because Conrad is too extremist and Dorn too stiff and comes out as a bitt of a hypocrite.
The words used by Dorn when he argues for the Great Crusade are the exact same as everyone who's been brainwashed by an authoritarian regime. Morally, Dorn is a better man, but everything the Night Haunter says is exactly what the Imperium did during the Great Crusade. Give every world they encountered a choice, "Either abandon all rights you think you're entitled to and submit to our regime, or see your planet bathed in blood." Every single one. Word Bearers, Iron Hands, Blood Angels, Lunar Wolves, Space Wolves, Ultramarines, Salamanders, some may have enjoyed it more than others and some may have regretted it, but that's what they did. Whether the invaders come as "liberators" or "conquerors" only matters to the invaders.
All human worlds would be swallowed up by xenos, mutants, or other abominations if they weren't brought under compliance by the emperor under one flag and one banner. The Great Crusade was their one and only chance of quick galactic unification before tyranids and chaos overtook them.
Local British man sounds like American and ... Freddy Frazbear goes ur ur ur urur Leon Kennedy
Roose Bolton and Ned Stark.
This couldn't have written more childish