wait, so, push-pull is a legit double stroke technique? is it okay to play like paraddidles and 6-stroke rolls with it? cause it kinda seems like cheating tbh since its just sooo much easier than regular double strokes
Been struggling with drop catch or push pull - whatever you want to call it - for a bit now. Went back to standard finger movement practice as a result. Your explanation is much better than any prior one I've seen and I think I might jump back to working on it.
A lot of drummers swear by the Moeller for fast one-handed playing. What I don't like about it is the unevenness of the notes. There's also a technique discussed by Todd Sucherman with more horizontal movement, he describes it like fencing. It's a bit of strange motion but may be good for loud situations, I struggled to get it happening. All in all I think the drop catch is the most logical and efficient of the approaches.
@@8020drummerfor me it‘s more comfortable to play in Moeller but thats probably bc I trained it much more. I get the differently sounding strokes of course. Still think it has valid usage, maybe not in funk but other genres
So guys my feeling about this is this is just refined Moeller. Moeller was about the whip stroke and getting a bounce, but didn’t really specify the hinge mechanism, which is what’s necessary for greater control of the bounce. So it’s a little like asking “nice car. Have you tried the car without the steering wheel?” Btw I’m not demeaning Moeller or claiming credit for the technique in this video. I think Gordy Knudsen deserves most of the credit for codifying the evolution of Moeller.
Are 7A sticks the best sticks for music/songs tnat requires one-handed sixteenth notes. Since theyre the lightest sticks, theyre the easiest to manipulate and wont tire me out easily
@@handler803 I’m not sure light weight is the most important thing. You also have balance, and heavier sticks do some work for you in terms of producing volume. Personally I use 5As for jazz and 5Bs for pocket stuff.
I learned how to do this by first practicing it as a shuffle. Since the limiting factor to how fast you can play this evenly is how quickly you can recover from a catch to do another drop, this allowed me to get used to the feeling of a single "drop/catch" combination at a time. (This part actually developed unintentionally on its own - when I was a young drummer and not able to play the Rosanna shuffle using upstrokes and downstrokes, this technique just sort of happened out of necessity.) From there, I worked on straightening it out, mostly just playing it slowly on a practice pad while watching TV. I can't play it nearly as fast as Jojo Mayer, but it's significantly faster than I can play repeated wrist strokes. I think it's better to have the catch be on the beat, because if you start to become a little uneven, it moves toward a swung/shuffled feel, as opposed to an "inverted shuffle" feel (sort of like playing the first two notes of a triplet, rather than the first and third). However, when playing straight, I find it easier to start with a drop than with a wrist stoke, then drop, so I always end up putting the drop on the beat, which is completely the opposite of what one would do when playing a shuffle. Either way, one thing that has been very helpful for me is to practice using it in a fast bossa kind of thing, with the left hand cross-stick doing: x . x . . x . x . x . . x . x . It forces you to practice aligning the left hand with both repeated drops and repeated catches, all while playing against the foot ostinato. Now I'm struggling with whether or not to develop it in my left hand. I've only ever seen one situation where I'd like to be able to do it (LH on the snare playing a soft "roll" with the RH free to do other things), so it seems like a lot of work for minimal gain.
When I started learning this technique, I was taught to lift and drop my forearm from the elbow joint with the stick instead of from the wrist. I got a bit of pain trying it from the wrist
Been working on this over the past week or so, in order to conquer the “funky drummer” break holding 16ths on the hats the whole time. What I’ve found is I am having a bit of trouble flamming the ghost strokes, not quite aligning with the hats 16ths. Any suggestions on cleaning that up, Nate? For other people, I started with getting a Rosanna shuffle hi hat pattern pretty solid before getting to straight 16ths. I’ve found it easier to swing with drop catch. I made a lot of progress by lightly, *slowly* on a practice pad, for a long long time straight, like watching TV (I know Nate doesn’t like pads, but my wife doesn’t like snare drums in the living room while we’re watching TV-she wins). Building up the muscle memory this way has really helped me advance.
If I have a good loose pivot and dexterous fingers is there anything wrong with just hammering out straight sixteenths really fast? I've done this for ever now and can play fast and smooth. Is it just because it's usually hard to do without a push-pull?
Push pull, just playing relaxed 16ths at various tempos for The Eagle these shoes, shuffle with ghost notes and Rosanna have become a daily part of my practice routine. Along with a bunch of other things including rudiments and just making up patterns and being fluid around the kit...I. Different time signatures. A drummer can knockout 90 minutes and still have a lot left to do.Our alone time can last hours.😂🤣✌️🥁
I do the same thing with my left hand for ghost notes so this is a weird situation where my non-dominant hand was actually better at this than my dominant one lol
Since I had the ability to play fast comfortably I would naturally default to playing 16th note sub divisions. It took me some self awareness to realize that makes me a worse player than being deliberate and choosing to play the subdivision that serves the music, not just the fastest one I can play comfortably.
As a Berklee scholarship recipient (not that that means much lol) possibly a small piece of advice? You may want to look at your body movement and body engagement. Some “feel” the music and express themselves through movement. Just a thought. Love all the vids❤
Ive been trying to improve my single hand 16ths for a month with push pull. From what I understand it's a more fulcrum/moeller based movement with german grip whereas this can be done with all 3 grips. Trouble is I gas out at around 98 bpm which means something with my mechanics is off. Imma back track real far and try this in addition to push pull.
Seeing Jeff Porcaro play live with Toto in 1988, and realizing how many of those uptempo 16th note grooves he played single handed... Life changing. ❤
I’ve watched many of your videos, and I like the simplicity of how you break everything down. This one was especially good!
Now that is definitely something I need to master. Thank you Nate for showing us how to work on that very useful technique!
Such a great channel!! Thanks mate!
Push pull technique. Good for blasts too 🤘
wait, so, push-pull is a legit double stroke technique? is it okay to play like paraddidles and 6-stroke rolls with it? cause it kinda seems like cheating tbh since its just sooo much easier than regular double strokes
Been struggling with drop catch or push pull - whatever you want to call it - for a bit now. Went back to standard finger movement practice as a result.
Your explanation is much better than any prior one I've seen and I think I might jump back to working on it.
Isn‘t there to mention Moeller Technique when playing fast one-handed 16th?
why
A lot of drummers swear by the Moeller for fast one-handed playing. What I don't like about it is the unevenness of the notes. There's also a technique discussed by Todd Sucherman with more horizontal movement, he describes it like fencing. It's a bit of strange motion but may be good for loud situations, I struggled to get it happening. All in all I think the drop catch is the most logical and efficient of the approaches.
Speaking as someone who had to completely relearn to use my left hand. Yes i think its crucial actually. But thats just how i play 🤷
@@8020drummerfor me it‘s more comfortable to play in Moeller but thats probably bc I trained it much more. I get the differently sounding strokes of course. Still think it has valid usage, maybe not in funk but other genres
So guys my feeling about this is this is just refined Moeller. Moeller was about the whip stroke and getting a bounce, but didn’t really specify the hinge mechanism, which is what’s necessary for greater control of the bounce. So it’s a little like asking “nice car. Have you tried the car without the steering wheel?” Btw I’m not demeaning Moeller or claiming credit for the technique in this video. I think Gordy Knudsen deserves most of the credit for codifying the evolution of Moeller.
Are 7A sticks the best sticks for music/songs tnat requires one-handed sixteenth notes. Since theyre the lightest sticks, theyre the easiest to manipulate and wont tire me out easily
@@handler803 I’m not sure light weight is the most important thing. You also have balance, and heavier sticks do some work for you in terms of producing volume. Personally I use 5As for jazz and 5Bs for pocket stuff.
❤Push Pull=Catch Drop?
Yes
I learned how to do this by first practicing it as a shuffle. Since the limiting factor to how fast you can play this evenly is how quickly you can recover from a catch to do another drop, this allowed me to get used to the feeling of a single "drop/catch" combination at a time. (This part actually developed unintentionally on its own - when I was a young drummer and not able to play the Rosanna shuffle using upstrokes and downstrokes, this technique just sort of happened out of necessity.) From there, I worked on straightening it out, mostly just playing it slowly on a practice pad while watching TV. I can't play it nearly as fast as Jojo Mayer, but it's significantly faster than I can play repeated wrist strokes.
I think it's better to have the catch be on the beat, because if you start to become a little uneven, it moves toward a swung/shuffled feel, as opposed to an "inverted shuffle" feel (sort of like playing the first two notes of a triplet, rather than the first and third). However, when playing straight, I find it easier to start with a drop than with a wrist stoke, then drop, so I always end up putting the drop on the beat, which is completely the opposite of what one would do when playing a shuffle. Either way, one thing that has been very helpful for me is to practice using it in a fast bossa kind of thing, with the left hand cross-stick doing: x . x . . x . x . x . . x . x . It forces you to practice aligning the left hand with both repeated drops and repeated catches, all while playing against the foot ostinato.
Now I'm struggling with whether or not to develop it in my left hand. I've only ever seen one situation where I'd like to be able to do it (LH on the snare playing a soft "roll" with the RH free to do other things), so it seems like a lot of work for minimal gain.
When I started learning this technique, I was taught to lift and drop my forearm from the elbow joint with the stick instead of from the wrist. I got a bit of pain trying it from the wrist
Been working on this over the past week or so, in order to conquer the “funky drummer” break holding 16ths on the hats the whole time. What I’ve found is I am having a bit of trouble flamming the ghost strokes, not quite aligning with the hats 16ths. Any suggestions on cleaning that up, Nate?
For other people, I started with getting a Rosanna shuffle hi hat pattern pretty solid before getting to straight 16ths. I’ve found it easier to swing with drop catch. I made a lot of progress by lightly, *slowly* on a practice pad, for a long long time straight, like watching TV (I know Nate doesn’t like pads, but my wife doesn’t like snare drums in the living room while we’re watching TV-she wins). Building up the muscle memory this way has really helped me advance.
Get a double kick pedal and play singles (RLRL) with you feet while you do 16ths with one hand at a time
Should a hand movement have unworldly attributes assigned to it? Play all that at p. Respect as always.
If I have a good loose pivot and dexterous fingers is there anything wrong with just hammering out straight sixteenths really fast? I've done this for ever now and can play fast and smooth. Is it just because it's usually hard to do without a push-pull?
Love it. Thank you!
All these years I've been trying to fall out of the building... no wonder.
yes indeed, it should NOT feel like you are falling out of a building.
You are freaking awesome 🎉. Thank you thank you thank you
American grip 😂😂 that’s my left hand
Push pull, just playing relaxed 16ths at various tempos for The Eagle these shoes, shuffle with ghost notes and Rosanna have become a daily part of my practice routine. Along with a bunch of other things including rudiments and just making up patterns and being fluid around the kit...I. Different time signatures. A drummer can knockout 90 minutes and still have a lot left to do.Our alone time can last hours.😂🤣✌️🥁
Le panache et le prestige mon ami ! (Great lesson)
Nate you're incredible dude
Awesome lesson, thx !
Straight sixteenths sound stale. Better to accent the eighths.
“Beef is boring. Only eat pork bro.”
Brilliant Nate!
I do something like that to place ghost notes fast
I do the same thing with my left hand for ghost notes so this is a weird situation where my non-dominant hand was actually better at this than my dominant one lol
🎉🎉🎉🎉
💪💪💪💪
И важно обращать внимание на динамику / акценты. Если все ноты хэта будут звучать одинаково, то это будет не лучший ваш концерт.
Thumbs up for the tips 🤟🤟
Unless ur playing German grip 🤣🤣
Since I had the ability to play fast comfortably I would naturally default to playing 16th note sub divisions. It took me some self awareness to realize that makes me a worse player than being deliberate and choosing to play the subdivision that serves the music, not just the fastest one I can play comfortably.
As a Berklee scholarship recipient (not that that means much lol) possibly a small piece of advice? You may want to look at your body movement and body engagement. Some “feel” the music and express themselves through movement. Just a thought. Love all the vids❤
Ive been trying to improve my single hand 16ths for a month with push pull. From what I understand it's a more fulcrum/moeller based movement with german grip whereas this can be done with all 3 grips. Trouble is I gas out at around 98 bpm which means something with my mechanics is off. Imma back track real far and try this in addition to push pull.