The ULTIMATE American V6 Engine Tier List
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 มิ.ย. 2024
- The V6 tier list has been highly requested, and it's here! Starting out the V6 tier lists is American V6 engines. There are plenty of great engines from the big three manufacturers over the years, but as always, one has to be the best. Follow along with the American V6 engine tier list to find out which one comes out on top!
Please be sure to subscribe to the channel to stay tuned for the next one, thanks for watching and have a great day!
Check out our other engine tier lists:
German I6 Tier List:
• The ULTIMATE German I6...
Modern American V8 Tier List:
• The ULTIMATE American ...
V10 Tier List:
• The ULTIMATE V10 Engin...
V12 Tier List:
• The ULTIMATE V12 Engin...
00:00 Introduction
00:29 General Motors
06:19 Ford
13:39 Chrysler
17:20 Final Thoughts - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
Praise the Buick 3800.
Also known as the Ecotec in Australia. Unbelievably strong and can put up with any abuse you throw at it.
@willlong4258 Struth mate the old man is snoring the ecotec is roaring
@@Quxzy "If it's raining and pouring, the Ecotecs are roaring"
@willlong4258 mb that's right I'm a falcon man so ofc I screwed it up haha
@@Quxzy and spac's go mang mang mang
the Buick 3800 is easily one of the most reliable North American engines ever produced. It's such a shame that GM mated it to a glass tansmission and extremely rust prone frames.
Unless you got the t5. One of the best transmissions they made too imo
I like 4.3L vortec to
Not really bad thing, like a 12v Cummins plenty of rotted out dodges for the pickings
@@knownbarkert6153 Only downside to the T5 was that they really didn't like having more than 350ftlbs of torque, but aside from that one limitation it really was the best, especially for Ford flathead retro mods
Truth, my wife had a GTP when I met her, that engine ran like a top while the rest of the car was falling apart around it.
The Buick 3800 may be the best engine GM has ever built. It was to GM what the slant-6 was to Chrysler, only more compact and more powerful. Its practically bulletproof, and can take tremendous power mods, including forced induction, yet remain reliable enough for use as a daily driver. One of the worst things GM ever did was killing it off.
The internet is filled with stories of people getting 300k or more out of them with only normal service. It's one of those rare engines that can outlast the vehicles they were installed into. It breaks my hear to think about how many of them met their premature demise when they got traded-in and crushed in the 2009 "cash for clunkers" program.
Only because people seems to forget the GM 250 i6 which is even more reliable and mods can take up to 2500hp.
@@AMV12SActually m the 3800 was better. The 250 was tough. But it wasn’t known to last for 300,000 miles in stock form.
There wasn't a single 3800 powered vehicle destroyed in cash for clunkers because they weren't inefficient enough
@@keegenm.6154 Are you sure? My Uncle got rid of his Jeep Cherokee with a fuel injected 4.0 for a Honda CRV, under the "cash for clunkers" program, which he almost immediately regretted. I don't think those fuel injected RWD Jeeps were that much less efficient than a carbureted 3800.
Example, my old '84 Buick Regal was lucky to get 20 MPG on the highway and only got 16 MPG max in town. Now those were good numbers compared to its sibling stablemates, the Olds Cutlass or Chevy Monte Carlo with their standard V8's. I think a lot would have to do with the shape and weight of the vehicle as well as what transmission the 3800 was mated to.
I have a lasabre I drive from Little Rock Arkansas to Chicago 2 round trips a month love the 3800 and the 28 mpg. 160k on her.
The Buick 3800 is a legend. Good call on S tier.
The 4.3L is such an underrated engine. Super super awesome engines.
Kinda. Outside the sy/ty. Sad it has practically zero aftermarket.
@@ItsDaJax yea thats the unfortunate part 😕
I love the 4.3l in my astro almost 300k miles with only basic services needed exept the spider injector and fuel pump needing repaced since it sat for years with bad gas. Im positve itll out live the original 4l60e thats showing issues
@@ItsDaJax What? Zero aftermarket? There are lots and lots of performance parts available for a 4.3l v6 if that's what you mean by aftermarket.
@@TDub_ADV I've only seen one intake, sets of headers, and I think maybe a cam or two.
I gotta say the Ford 3.7 Cyclone V6 that came out in 2011 is one of the best V6 engines made.
The rear wheels drive versions are much better than the front wheel drive since the water pump is external on the rear wheel drive models, while front wheel drive models have an internal water pump
It sounds really good
The best base model engine ever in an American Muscle car. They'll beat the 5.7 dodges with just a tune
@@VermillionRacing yeah they dont get anywhere near the praise they deserve. The jump from the 4.0 to the 3.7 is wild. Probably honestly better then 4.6 3v even though that ruffles A LOT of feathers lol. I had a buddy with basic bolt ons on his 3.7 and he hung on my back bumper when my gen 1 5.0 was stock. Super impressive.
They don’t get as much praise because they’re not nearly as reliable as say, the coyote.
I owned a grand caravan gt with the 3.6 pentastar and wow those things could haul some ass
The Chrysler 3.3/3.8 engines are helluva bulletproof engines. My mom's '03 Caravan SE has been using the same 3.3 it had at the factory and has been running beautifully for over 800K km. The only thing to fail was stuff around the engine like the radiator or coolant pipe, or a clogged air filter after a bad day of wildfire smoke, but never the engine itself. The chassis is probably gonna rust through *long* before the engine shuts off for the last time.
The Chrysler 3.3/3.8 was an attempt to duplicate the popular v6 the major difference being it uses 60-degree
I agree. I had multiple Caravans as work vehicles with the 3.3L, and while it's underpowered in such a big vehicle, no one buys a minivan to go fast.
V6s CAN be pretty powerful, but their main use case is "I need more torque than a NA four-cylinder with better fuel economy than a V8".
The 3.5/3.7 duratec and cycline engines are A tier. Insanely reliable, especially later versions of tbe motor with weep holes for the water pumps. Not only are they very reliable, they're reliable fast, and sound pretty good.
The cyclone also doesn't suffer the water pump issues in RWD applications. The Water pump on those engines (Mustang/F150) is outside the front cover.
As he was talking about the cyclone, I knew he wasn't going to give it the tier it deserves. Not quite s-tier in my opinion (although I wouldn't argue with someone that think it is), but definitely at least a-tier. My parents owned a 2011 f150 with the 3.7, and it had over 250k miles before they sold it. The 6r80 transmission was starting to get noisy during down shifts, but the buyer said they would deal with it as-is, and paid 5k for it in like 2017.
I think the Ford Cyclone should at least be a B tier. Its a strong engine that makes excellent power and is pretty beastly in ford police interceptors, easily withstanding daily abuse and being able to almost hit 150 mph in some applications! Its served our police force well and became pretty reliable. The 3.7 Variant goes into the A tier in my heart at least because of all the work its put in across america haha
I agree, C tier was definitely too low
I owned a 6 speed 2014 Mustang 3.7 for 5 years. Yes, the water pump failed... dramatically, but luckily it didn't kill the motor. That was the only issue I ever had with it. Apart from that, it sounded great, and with a couple of bolt ons and a tune it was pretty quick and competitive on the streets. It's a perfect first car for anyone shopping right now, as it can take some serious abuse (change that water pump at about every 80k miles though, it's a pretty easy job too).
Thanks for the insight, sounds like you had an overall positive experience
If I didn't have kids I would be looking for one.
The water pump weep hole has a path to drip externally and dual gaskets. The water pump issue killing the whole engine is way overblown. It's only if you don't repair a leaking water pump that eventually kills the engine. As in, people that don't care for their vehicles. Cyclone is an A tier engine if not an S tier.
@@rmkilcWhen did they add the weep holes? I believe later versions of the 3.5, like our 2017 explorer, have those added. But I don't believe it was added until later in the engines design.
@@themidnighttavern6784 No idea. My 2015 Explorer Sport with the 3.5 Ecoboost has it.
3.0 ford and 3.8 buick are my absolute favorite owned a 03 mazda 6s 5speed absolutely amazing for what it was
The 3.0 Ford, whether the Vulcan or the Duratec, is not even in the same ballpark as the Buick 3800. The 3800 is damn near in a league of its own when it comes to reliable V6 engines, no matter the manufacturer or country of origin.
Both good choices, glad you enjoyed owning one
Between my parents and myself, we've owned two Ford 3.0 Vulcan V6's and two 3.0 DOHC Duratec V6's. Each vehicle made it over 250k miles before trading up to a newer vehicle (one Vulcan V6 made it to 376k miles).
I'm in no way saying that the Buick 3800 is bad, especially the supercharged versions, but to say the Ford 3.0's aren't in the same ballpark, that's a little harsh.
@@timothyforce1949They're definitely in the same ballpark in terms of reliability, but the 3.0 doesn't even sniff the 3800 in performance
no disagreements here. ive had Duratec 3.0's live beyond 200k miles with even poor maintenance. absolutely superb engine, i love working on them and theyve never let me down.
Holden Lumina 3.8L never let me down 1998-2004.
The Cyclone was also in the 15 to 17 mustangs as well and water pump on the rear wheel drive vehicles are external and is easy to replace. I think the Cyclone should of have at least been B tier considering that they're reliable and other than water pump they don't have major issues
My top 3:
-GM 3800 turbocharged V6 used in the Buick Regal GNX
-Ford 3.5 Twin Turbo EcoBoost V6 used in the Ford GT
-Chrysler 3.6 Pentastar V6 used in a shitton of cars
GM 3800 Is a great engine, but it had intake gasket issues, oil leak issues and other coolant issues. Saw them a lot in the shop needed repairs. Smooth engine with great power potential.
Yep I always hear the hype, but don’t remember everyone trading in there Toyota and Hondas for the 3800 that’s for sure.
@@Kenzo-bp1zs the transmission we awful in the cars with GM 3.8L. The engine is about as reliable as 90s V6 toyota. Being a pushrod engine it was simplistic in its design, over the Japanese OHC Design.
Gm had to recall them and replace the valve cover gaskets and remove the engine cover because they were catching fire for while
@@alexgrindnshine2522 intake gasket issues, cheap plastic intake elbows, constant ABS/TC problems and to top it off they were attached to the glass Methuselah of transmissions. leaps and bounds better cars than anything from ford or Chrysler at the time tho
yeah, they had issues, but they will run like hot shit longer than most engines will run in general.
There was a Ford Europe 24v dohc v6 used in the Ford Scorpio, The cylinder heads where by Cosworth, It was based on the Cologne V6.
Are you talking about the Duratec 3.0 that went on the Mondeo ST220? Those are also cool
@@isaac4273 nope, Ford did contract cosworth to put 24 valve heads on the Cologne v6
@@cirian75 oh Cosworth worked on the Cologne v6 too? Huh, I didn't know that
@@isaac4273 Only on the very short lived Ford Scorpio
Thank you for taking the time to do this list. I respectfully disagree with listing the Chrysler SOHC V6 at the same ranking as the 2.7l. The claims of the oil sludge in the SOHC engine is a misunderstanding where people think because there are similarities between the LH and SOHC engines that they must share this problem. I have even gone 4700 miles on an oil change on conventional and opened the filter afterwards and had a used oil analysis. No signs of vanish or sludge. Many people would swap their blown 2.7 for 3.2 and 3.5 because of the superior reliability. The SOHC also for its time was one of if not the most powerful naturally aspirated engines of its displacement and prowler owners have boosted them. At minimum the A tier. The Pentastar should be bumped down one due to the head issues, lifters, and copious use of plastic.
I think that the GM 60 degree engine should be lowered at least one ranking given the intake gasket, head gasket, electrical issues. I think there should be distinction between the 3800 versus the Buick V6 as the earlier versions were not nearly as reliable. It's also worth noting that although the engine itself is very stout, many of the parts connected to the engine are not as The coils, various sensors, intake gaskets (series 2), alternators are not very durable. I speak from experience.
The Ford Cyclone engine depends on the application. If it's front-wheel drive yes the timing chain driven water pump is a problem. You can get past 200,000 miles on the original pump or it can blow at 60,000 mi or less. It's a roll of the dice.
I think the high feature V6 should be lowered much further in your list considering the PCV system problems, timing chain problems, oil consumption problems, GDI carbon buildup problems, etc. I've known more people that have had engine failures with these than any other engine on this list.
These are some very valid points, and in the case of the SOHC V6 if you’ve owned one then you’ll know better than I do just having looked at forums. I could see how it would be assumed off the LH similarity’s and find that to be an interesting point. I appreciate the extra info on the other engines as well, getting a different perspective clarifies where there we gaps in information. Thanks for watching!
You're welcome And thank you for being open to my corrections. I actually have had 3. 1 first generation and 2 second generation (I should have said that the second generation version was the one that was a benchmarker in the market, the first generation was an effort to catch up on the SHO engine with a larger displacement). The reason why the 2.7 is problematic is that it has the timing chain driven water pump which permits internal coolant leaking. In addition when they created the 2.7, they lowered the engine deck and did so in a flawed manner which hampered ventilation. This was done to enable it to fit in shorter engine bays with the cloud cars in mind. This is why you can replace a blown 2.7 in a LH or LX car and still use the standard hood but you cannot in a cloud car. The one example that we have of someone who did swap a 3.5 in a cloud car head to make a custom hood. It's an important lesson to remember that while there are some relation between the two engines they are very different considering that the 3.5 is timing belt driven and timing belt driven water pumps don't have the same problem. The main thing you have to remember is to change the water pump and timing belt on time on the second generation version otherwise it will fail (The first generation version had a non-interference engine design which will not result in self-destruction in the event of the timing belt snapping). But that was common during that time and is true of many will respected Japanese engines.
Some engine problems can be very specific to an application. A prime example is the cyclone V6 where if it's a front wheel drive version Ford for whatever reason put in the timing chain driven water pump. On the rear wheel drive version they keep it on the outside where it belongs. Whether you have a good one or bad one depends on your luck. My father had a fifth generation Taurus that he gave to a relative and it has 250,000 miles on it, another relative had a sixth generation Taurus we're the water pump failed at 172,000 mi. I know of examples of higher miles and I know examples of lower miles. It's the luck of the draw. You can have a good example of a very flawed engine or you can have a lemon of a nearly bulletproof engine. We've had bad luck with our 3800s even though everybody else that I know has had great luck with them and our Ford cyclones have been pretty good overall.
@@running2redline you just forgot one car has the V6
I was going to say, the GM high feature V6 is known to be quite the dud. I was surprised to see it rank so well.
Agreed the 3.2 & 3.5 Chrysler were very reliable motors. But due to some the same platforms using the 2.7 & 4.0, they often get rolled into the bad category. The 3.5 is very well known to exceed the 200,000 mi mark. This is why you see 300M's Interpeds & 1st new gen Chargers driving around today
But. There were 2 variants of the 3.9l v6. The LA 3.9l is the one that came exclusively in the Dakota, while the 3.9L Magnum V6 came in the 2nd gen Ram, and Dakota. The magnum variant saw a power increase from 125hp in the LA, to 175hp. The magnum featured fuel injection, and improved heads from the LA. I know all of this cause I have a 3.9L V6 Magnum in my Ram.
I completely missed that my bad, looking into it it seems some solid improvements were surely made. Thanks for putting this up
Yes this engine deserves to be in the top end of your list, extremely reliable and simple to maintain.
@@alexgrindnshine2522 that's what I'm saying
@@running2redline it's like the mopar 3800
@@bigbuffalophill yeah both the 3.9L magnum and the 3.3 3.8L Chrysler are more reliable then the GM 3.8L from working in shops we did a lot more repair work on the GM 3.8L lot of coolant issue that could lead to expensive engine failures. The 3.9L like the 4.3 vortec where just 2 cylinders short of being V8. Share the same design as the 5.2magnum and the 350 vortec. 4.3L had lot more issues with fuel injection and oil leaks when compared to the 3.9L magnum.
The 90° Essex V6 ran until 2004.
Supercharged versions were found in the 89 to 97 Ford Thunderbird (iirc), as well as the 89 to 91 Mercury Cougar XR7, which were both on the MN12 platform.
While in production, several things changed, including moving from single port to split port intake and heads, as well as adding in a balance shaft, at least in the mustang to better compete with the Camaro, which helped with the vibration issues and allowed it to rev higher. The head gasket issue was caused both by bad head gasket material from the factory, and the head bolt threads starting flush with the deck surface. This caused the deck surface to raise slightly, lessening the pressure on the gasket, causing them to fail prematurely. This was changed in later years by cutting the threads for the head bolts to start engaging slightly below the deck surface.
While not able to handle insane amounts of power, there are companies that provide aftermarket support for these engines that can push power output to around 500hp.
Overall, I wouldn't put it in the same tier as the Buick 3800, but it definitely deserves to be above its 60° counterpart.
I’d research the skystang turbo, and watch the long explanation of what’s done to that car, I think they can handle a lot more boost than people think it’s just hard to get enough fuel and air into them, and some modifications to the block is needed
Personally though I think that 500ish horsepower mark with boost and handling and being choiceful in where you keep and remove weight from the cars they were in is where they really shine though, it gets a lot more costly to go up from there but they can handle more power if for some reason you’d want to
Awesome vid as always, highly anticipating a Japanese v6 tier list too
Much appreciated, glad you enjoyed it. Japanese V6 is likely next
My GM 3800 is the supercharged L67 variant and is currently vacationing in it's 3rd chassis and now powers a 99 Monte Carlo in place of the lame 3.1 it came with... Hell of an engine... I've spent 10+ years and over 100k miles trying to hurt it... Hell of an engine!
Love your videos man. I always love hearing the classic joke that the Aston Martin V12 is just two Duratec V6s fused together. It's mostly true though, despite making Aston owners and purists mad. Ford really was responsible for Aston's success in the 2000s. Both the V6 and V12 are legends
Thank you, means a lot to hear that. That is pretty funny, no reason to be mad with such a good engine. Interesting how many different companies have used Ford’s engines over the years, I’m super happy with the Ford MZR in my NC
Thank you for being the first youtuber I've seen to not lump all of the High Feature engines together. The issues with the pre-LFX engines tainted the 3.6 name, but the LFX and LGX are phenomenal engines. The LF3/LF4 could've been broken out into their own rankings and belong in the S-tier though.
I came here looking for the LF4 because i got an ATS-V and its a total hauss
Nice list, One thing ill mention though is that the chrysler 3.9 jumped to around 180hp after getting EFI
The 3.8 liter by ford. My brother’s daily mustang (2002) has 430k miles on it. Only ever replaced a water pump and a rear main seal in its life, also a power steering pump, but that’s expected by ford. and still looks and runs like an 80000 mile car. Well done, ford.
The GMC V6 should be up there in the A or S Tier. While not a performer, that thing is indestructible, and couldn’t be easier work on. Basically a gas powered diesel engine.
The pentastar should get S because they are great my grandmas van with the pentastar has 240000 miles and doesn’t burn any oil and has never had a major or minor engine repair
I drove one for work that had 450,000 miles on it and something else broke
They're interference engines unlike the slightly more powerful GM high feature
American Inline 4s or 6s would also be a cool list to see in the future 👀
American inline 6 is definitely due, I’ve already done German and Japanese for those
@@running2redline Can't wait for the video 👍
@@running2redlineWell if you do american 4 cylinders; ya can't leave out the Lima 140cu 2.3 liter. Based off the european 1.8 and 2.0. Carbed made 88hp, but the early draw through carb turboed version made 139hp to the 302s 140 with the 79-81 Cobra. It has decent enough aftermarket to the point that it's the choice to use along with the 22R and 22RE for midget, ministock, and mini stadium trucks. The efi turbo 2.3 made about 175-180hp depending on the car it was in, and the most n/a power it made was about 110 in the twin spark DIS version. It's not the same as the Duratec 2.3.
The 3800 engine truly is insanely reliable and durable. To bad they mated them to one of the weakest most unreliable transmissions ever.
The transmission weren't the best but they weren't that bad, no one maintains the damn things. My 03 impala had 250,000 miles no tranny problems. And my 08 buick I have now has 200,000 miles and the trans shifts perfectly
Thats nice. I had six 4T65Es that didn't even last long enough to reach a service interval.
After I finally gave that car away with another brand new transmission, I switched to RWD V8 vehicles exclusively and haven't had a single drivetrain issue in years since.
So your experience won't change my opinion at all. Besides that, all FWD platforms are bottom of the barrel scrap.
@RobFRC Jesus christ what are you doing to these things lol. I used to neutral drop and reverse to drive burnouts in mine and still couldn't kill it.
All I was doing was driving to work. Its FWD with like 200hp, not like you can abuse that if you wanted to. I definitely didn't do neutral drops or reverse donuts ever because doing one blown transmission a year was enough already.
I stopped doing any tire squealing period after the 3rd transmission and even then they still only lasted 15-20k miles each.
It ran and drove great til one day i'll get a gear change that takes a little longer than usual, finally hits the shift harder than normal. Within a few days of that I start losing gears or having the torque converter lock up at idle and stall the engine.
Never broke a hard part in the transmission, it was always clutch pack failures. So even a $10,000 fully built TEP transmission wont solve this problem because the upgraded ZPak clutch packs for 4T65Es were discontinued by Raybestos like 20 years ago and nobody else ever came out with another option, besides 4T80 swap.
@RobFRC that's crazy man. I'm a mechanic I see these with high mileage all the time. That being said I know damn well the 4t65e is not a great transmission. But never have I heard of one failing after 20k miles. Let alone six.. not saying i don't believe you, just surprised.
Good video, I was just researching the engine in the ats-v so I enjoyed watching this
I’m glad you liked it, and good luck with the purchase if you’re buying one!
Having owned a few of the engines on this list, I can honestly say that as long as there are no glaring engineering flaws or defects in manufacture, the key is regular maintenance and using the available power properly. The 3.0 Vulcan platform is no powerhouse, but it does everything I reasonably ask of it, and at 160K it's running better than factory spec
Good job on the info sheets for the engine, they look slick while remaining very informative
I appreciate the feedback and will keep them as is!
Appreciate the content! Thanks
I’m so excited for this vid
I appreciate hearing that and hope you enjoy it!
I’m a mopar guy, who drives a 3800 Buick to work daily. Growing up, my folks had a 3.8l Essex Taurus, then a 3500 Intrigue. Both were great cars that gave us 80k and 100k miles respectively. Both were sold locally and were crashed with good engines. Dad was a 3k mile oil change guy, and not a hot rodder. Guessing that’s why they lasted. That 3.5 was actually a quick Erving engine. I’m a little harder on things, hence the 3800. Only V6 I’ve owned. Everything else has has been V8 or 4cyl.
I had a Mazda6 with the 3.0 Duratec. It wasn't the fastest thing in the world but it was tons of fun to rev out and it sounded great. It had a really noticable VVT switchover just like a VTEC. It was really crammed in the engine bay though and hard to work on. I miss it as affordable V6 cars are becoming a thing of the past.
Oh god, Im swapping a D-tier!
I have a '97 Plymouth Grand Voyager, 436k miles on the original 3.3L V6. Im swapping in a 4.0L SOHC V6 with custom camshafts, custom heads, and a whipple supercharger.
Can’t lie that sounds like it’s gonna be sick, good luck and hope it turns out well!
Loved the Duratec in my Escape! That thing could scoot! Still running strong after 200,000 miles when I sold it.
The 4.6 v8 and the 3.7 v6 tornado were both put into the the vpg mv1 a purpose built mobility van it was built on leftover crown vic chassis i belive
The 3.6 Pentastar has been suffering with quite a bit of failures in recent times. Usually stemmed from its design. Porosity in the cylinders has been causing coolant to leak from the water jackets into the combustion chamber. Oil coolers are still known to leak oil into the valley, with the early ones from 2011-2013 having the bypass break when replacing the oil filters. Water pump failures is pretty high, and all the timing covers eventually do leak oil.
My GF has a 14 avenger and I'd say kind of like a Ram. The most redeeming feature of that car is engine. It has potential to be a fantastic sports car, but Chrysler really didn't have very good quality control in the 2010s
Years go by and high mileage,abuse etc cause issues..Toyota's have major issues too..I am a former Toyota Tech.
@@mypronouniswtf5559 Except these problems exist with/without keeping up on them.
I would like to mention just a small tidbit about the cyclone water pump failure issue, if you have a transversely mounted cyclone you get an internal water pump, if it’s longitudinally mounted you get an external water pump. It’s only the transverse mounted cyclones that get coolant flooding into the engine. When my pump failed I didn’t know there was a difference either, scared the shit out of me when my coolant temps went up 1 day. I immediately pulled over to investigate it, next day I topped off the coolant and since it was still under warranty I took it to a dealership and they fixed it. I’ve put about 15-20k miles since then and the motor is still going strong.
I grew up in a family that really liked the S10/Blazer line with the Vortec 4.3 so I learned how to work on them pretty extensively. I really do like that engine.
The only issues I have learned about them are that the OEM alternator will almost always die between 65-75k miles, which is an easy fix by simply not buying an OEM alternator to replace it.
Secondly, intake gaskets every 100k miles. They have a tendency to corrode and leak coolant into the engine at around 100k. Not pretty.
Aside from that, those 4.3's are pretty bulletproof. Super easy to work on, super reliable.
Not 3800-tier, but still solid.
My first engine total loss was on the 3.0 Duratec (Mondeo ST220). Great car
I'll always have a warm place in my heart for the Buick 3800. My family has owned four of them over the years.
The first was a 1965 225 that we got out of a Buick Skylark and swapped into a '72 Vega around 1976.
Then my aunt bought a 1977 Buick Regal with the 3.8 V6. That was not a great engine because it ate timing chains every 50,000 miles.
When I was living in NJ in 1989, I bought a 1978 Buick Skyhawk with the 3.8 V6 and 5-speed manual as a beater car to use in the north Jersey traffic free-for-all. I drove that car for 5 years and never had any problems with the engine.
And last November I noticed a 4th-Gen Camaro for sale on the side of the road during my morning commute in the Detroit area. I stopped to take a look, and it had the 3800 V6 with a 5-speed manual trans. Since I also have a warm spot for 4th-Gen Camaros, I had to have it. It's a Series II 3800 and runs very nicely.
That engine was formed from an all aluminum V8 that was eventually sold to Rover who changed it and then used it in everything for over 30+ years… So that single V8 spawned two different engines that were each produced for 30+ years. If you want to know more check out Jason Cammisa’s video on the Rover SD1 (or his podcast episode on the Rover V8)
@@griffins750 It also spawned an F1 world championship-winning engine called the Repco-Brabham. It was an sohc conversion of the basic 215 Oldsmobile block.
@@andyharman3022 Yep the “Fireball V8” or “Rockett V8”, it was also the basis for the first production turbocharged engine
the 3.9l magnum was one of the best v6 motors chrysler has ever made. they were low on power, but man they were bulletproof and would never die. get the 3.9l in a dakota with a manual, and you have THE BEST midsized pickup truck ever made.
Love the Pentastar, but it has issues with its cams wearing down. I'm also not pleased with the plastic oil filter housing. It's a pain to replace but aftermarket has aluminum housings so that should be on the list of mods
It’s not the housing thats the problem. It’s the seals under the oil cooler itself.
Cam wear is due to the notorious rocker arm failure with them engine's.
I've seen so many 3800 Buick V6's with over 300,000 miles.
The water pump issues with the Ford Cyclone are really only a problem on front wheel drive engines - which is unfortunately most of them. The rear wheel drive versions used in the Mustang, F150, and in some industrial applications has an externally mounted, belt driven water pump. I have one in my F150, And it's my favorite V6 that I've owned. And it answers a question I had when I was younger: What if you put a high-revving smaller engine in a pickup truck, would it work? It does, it even pulls trailers well, it's just really screamy when you need power.
Apparently the water pump thing isn't much of an issue on the duratecs.
@@themidnighttavern6784 its not really a thing on the cyclone either, the waterpump thing is very overblown
The high feature is an absolute dumpster fire of an engine. Astonishing you out that where you did.
That seems to be a common comment so I’ll admit I was likely wrong there. I think I was biased because I owned 2 LFXs for a total 110k miles with zero issue, I must’ve gotten lucky
Yeah you definitely were lucky. That high feature engine is total garbage. Chains were an issue until they replaced it with the newer two chain engine, but it’s completely different. I’ve seen multiple 3.6 Acadia/Traverses throw connecting rods too.
I’ve got a 3.6 LY7 in my Pontiac G8, it’s sitting at 220k miles and hasn’t had any major failures.
had a 4th gen regal with the 3800 for my first car and after my dad passed away I stopped getting oil changes and that engine survived from 82k miles until 113k on the same oil before I sold it to someone in town and I still see him driving it around from time to time! fr tho if u want a starter car to give to someone who might not value stuff too heavily yet u can't go wrong with the 3800 👍
Series III 3800 V6. It had an aluminum intake manifold instead of the plastic manifold. Great engine. I wish we had our 2004 Pontiac Grand Prix back.
For the record I do believe to my knowledge that the Cologne should have been B tier due to the failing time change systems often not causing permanent damage. I have yet to hear of a single case of it causing permanent damage but I’m sure it has happened. As well, I do believe that the 3.0 L Vulcan is a lot less reliable than he let on about as in the newer models they switched from a regular set of points distribution to electronic, and all they did was replace the rotor cap with a sensor (making it the camshaft position sensor) and add a crankshaft sensor. This sensor fails regularly as it has to be replaced every 50-100 thousand miles or so. As well, the Vulcans are prone to leaking coolant, and the poor replacement of the ECT sensor causes the engine to overheat long before the sensor reads that the engine is overheating causing cracked cylinder heads which is/was a popular repair in shops in my hometown.
I've got a '96 B3000 and I thank you for the info. I'm at somewhere above 232k on the engine (odometer was broken when I got it) and it's still running strong!
2012 Mustang 3.7 v6…Had an intake and exhaust on mine and was getting well over 30mpg highway…Great sounding engine too!!
Can’t argue with that, impressive stuff!
if you buy a pentastar, be aware that the oil cooler will eventually leak, not that big of a deal but you need to remove the intake manifold and replace all the gaskets too
Due to earlier mechanical issues and part supply problems, I'd personally place the ecoboost in b tier. They have very common turbocharger failures, even now, I've seen them shear the crankshaft in half, and turbos are on a two year waiting list, last I heard.
I think the SHO should belong in the s column. Just because it was never turbocharged or supercharged shouldn't hold it back. And it made much more than the advertised 220 horsepower. Find lived a hard life, head over 200,000 mi on it and still had no problem revving to 7000 RPM and hitting the rev limiter.
That’s completely fair, really good engine
Also 220+ hp from a na v6 in late 80s was beastly
Don't forget about the "Sleepers" video about that one guy's Buick Regal GS with the supercharged 3800 and built transmission. When he runs it on high boost it goes toe to toe with a Whipple'd "New Edge" Mustang
Not saying he doesn’t have the power but I’m having trouble understanding how he gets the traction to do that.
I had a 84 Jeep Cherokee and its 2.8L GM V6 was a real dog. Leaked oil (poor rocker cover design), stalled in curves due to float bowl fuel starving, blown head gasket. I had a friend with the same motor in a Blazer and he had to replace the engine twice. My Explorer 4L Ford V6 was bullet-proof--what a relief!
3.9 V6 Magnum Dodge from 1992 up had 180 hp and 224 torque in it's highest configuration..(175 hp in 1992)..
Everyone likes to dog on the v6 Camaros but the 3800 bolted up to a 5 speed is smooth, reliable and fun to drive. Especially with the y87 package which adds an lsd and shorter gears ratios. Slept on budget beater
That’s a good point, even in the newer ones the LFX mated to the 6L50 is a nice duo
The Chrysler 3.3L 3.8L engines are extremely reliable. Working in shops people that owned vans would have 300k hard miles of neglect and abuse on those engines and they still ran perfect. Also the Chrysler 3.9L magnum V6 is extremely reliable. Out side of those two engines I think you did a good job on your list.
Thanks for the insight, I could’ve been off there. 300k is certainly impressive especially if neglected. Thanks for watching!
@@running2redline heck yeah! I learn something new when I watch your channel. You have alot of knowledge with Ford and Chevy. Ford was putting out some high performance V6 for awhile. Those Dure Tech motors hauled ass.
When I went looking for a second car in October 2022, I decided I would only consider a GM if it had the Buick 3800 V6, and that's exactly what i got (2007 Buick Lucerne CX).
Not putting the 3800 in s tier would be criminal😂
Had an ‘02 le Sabre after my dad owned it and put 220k miles on it. I then drove it to over 270k and we only had to replace the map sensor after all that time lol what a goat engine, frame was getting pretty rusty unfortunately didn’t want to sell it.
I’ve replaced rod bearings on a Buick 3800 with the car on a pair of ramps, so easy to work on.
That’s nuts, one can dream of that on a modern car
I had a 2001 Escape a few years back with the Duratec 30. The entire car around the Duratec completely fell apart over time and the transmission failing for the second time was the last straw for me, but the engine itself was incredibly strong.
I think the 2015-17 mustang also has the cyclone for its v6 variants? Also at a reduced 5 hp down to 300 from the previous 2011-2014 gen
More than that probably. The 3v made 305 and the v6 made about 312 in the 11-14.
No the 3.7 was rated 305 hp 11-14 and 300 15-17 280 tq while the 3v 05-09 was 300/320 and in 2010 it was 315/325.
@@midnight347 Exactly! Good to see accurate, factual numbers. Rare thing on here these days...
The one oversight I noticed was that the "High Feature" GM 3.6L was also offered in the G6 GXP. I own a 2008 GXP and the Cadillac and Chevy parts are interchangeable on the 3.6L that year. Car currently has Cadillac valve covers on it that were a perfect match after one of the originals cracked.
I think I would have drawn a distinction between the Ford Cologne 4.0 pushrod V6 and the 4.0 OHC V6. The pushrod one is reliable, if perhaps underpowered, the OHC one is infamous for having 3 or 4 timing chains, (depending on the application) and the tensioner issues which you did mention.
I have driven both the Buick 3800 and the 3.8l 90’ Essex from a Mercury Cougar and I love both of them they are similar both very different in a lot of ways
My 98 olds intrigue had the 3800, never left me stranded anywhere!
Excellent round-up of 6 cylinder engines and it agrees with my experience.
13:40 solid video but lots of errors with the 3.9. First off, it was carbureted in 1987 when it was used only in the Dakota. From 1988-91, it was used in the Dakota, ram 1500/2500, and the full size vans. From 1987-91 (during the LA-block design era) your power figures are correct.
From 1992-2003 it was replaced with the magnum version and rated at 175-180hp and 225 ft lbs. it was used in the Dakota, 99 model year only durangos, Ram 1500 (until 2001) and full size vans.
I think you may be undervaluing the Ford 3.5 Cyclone in my '14 Edge! It is very good, burns no oil, gets decent mileage, has plenty of power, and has not cost anything in 7 years of ownership. I am aware of the waterpump issue - so far, no problems at 112 k km. Thanks for the video.
It sounds like you are right, you’ve certainly had a great experience and that’s worth more than what I know about it. Glad it’s running smooth and that you enjoyed the video!
Buik 3800 also went into the Holden Commodore and Statesman from 88 to 95 when it was replaced by the High feature V6 (Aloytech)
Honestly I miss small displacement V6 motors I had a Honda Accord 3 l V6 it made 200 horsepower and 195 lb feet of torque I now have a a 2.5 l 4 cylinder naturally aspirated that makes the same power numbers but I still enjoyed the V6 power delivery smoothness and sound
The Buick 3800 V6 is what made the old gen Le Sabre, Century, and Park Avenue sedans the tanks that they are, aside from the fully steel body.
The very first car I drove was my father’s 1996 Mercury Sable with the 3.0 liter Vulcan. As ugly as those cars were, they were very comfortable and ran smooth. Very minimal vibrations.
The 3.9 magnum was found in the 2nd gen rams and the vans of that time and was also used until 2003 when the 3.7 replaced it in 2004. They switched to port injection in 92 and they made around 180 horsepower.
JDM V6 tier list plz? The 2gr FSE is slept on and is a powerhouse
I’ll make it happen!
Yes!
10:16 The Duratec also had a 3.5 L version called the Duratec 35. That used to be in the first gen Fusion Sport
Got an LFX V6 currentl! Love it!
Still have my 06 grand prix gt with the L32 supercharged Series 3 3800, engine has 225000 on it with just normal maintenance, it has outlasted the suspension and other parts but still runs like a top, that and so much power out of it with just some tuning...there is now becoming a huge market for these engines with ZZP performance, Intense Racing, and all them pushing these engines. It is safe to really push the stock blocks to near 600 hp and easy to get 350hp or more with light upper end modifications and tunning.
Impressive stuff, I’m sure it’s been fun!
I loved the 3.2l that came in the 1st gen CTS it had a decent sound for a v6… that damn timing belt🥲
The LA/Magnum V6 was used longer than 96. I have a 98 and I believe they continued until 01. When the second generation Dodge Ram 1500 was introduced it received a base model option with MPFI. This was in 94. They were still gutless but incredibly reliable. Mine has 275k miles and makes full compression on all cylinders
It's weird hearing the 3.8 Essex have vibration issues. When I first got my Mustang, it was hard to tell it was running at times.
Some of them had a balance shaft and some didn't. You could have two identical year Mustangs that came off the assembly line one right after the other. One would vibrate and the other would be smooth. That's ford for yah.
@@g3neration216 Apparently the balance shaft was absent from Mustangs from 1989 - 1998, meaning I don't have a balance shaft.
@@joshjlmgproductions3313 that's what the wiki will tell you. Did intake and timing cover on a 94 mustang. I know for a fact it was the original engine because I know the guy who bought it new. It ran hot from a bad water pump, but amazingly didn't pop a head gasket. instead it warped the timing cover... I recommended doing intake as well and having it checked just in case. A bad intake can make a wonderful milkshake. Anyway it had a balance shaft...don't care what people think I saw it myself. Unfortunately this was before everyone had a camera in their back pocket.
@@joshjlmgproductions3313 On another note they had some balancing problems as well.
I have the gm 4.3 vortec in my 99 blazer and the ford 4.2 in my 98 f150.
I agree with your ranking on them
First time listener.
Very cool format you have!!! 👍
The SHO also had five valves per cylinder,
Yamaha's Genesis design.
Love's pressurized fuel mixture.
Just saying...................
Welcome to the channel and I’m glad you enjoyed the video!
The high feature 3.6 in my traverse has been awesome. I’ve put 117,000 miles on it in 5 years and all I’ve done is change the oil and filters. It didn’t even need the spark plugs I put in it 😂 as long as you check and add oil at every 4000-5000 miles it _shouldn’t_ have that timing tensioner problem.
I think it is a landmark that today you can buy a 300-hp Ford Mustang V-6 ...look how far we've come along.
Also, thanks for starting the list with the legendary GMC Truck engine V-6 family.
My first car that I purchased was a 2000 Chevrolet Impala LS with the 3800 Series 2 V6.
JDM V6 Tier list next? Can’t wait to see my beloved J-series
Working on it right now!
The High-feature engine is such a diverse platform. From the 280hp LFX in the Equinox to the extremely tunable LF4 in the ATS/CT4 Vs, mixed with the ease of swapping it into other cars. It’s easily S-tier IMO, but I’ll gladly take an A
My dad had a 91 sable with that 3.8. It was so bad. It blew a head gasket which caused it to over heat, threw a rod through the block and blew up. He had to have the bottom end rebuilt and 40k miles and the top end at 80k. It was slow. Only got about 19 mpg. It sounded horrible and made me miss so many days of school. Plus it went through 3 transmissions in 100k miles. Compare that to his 2007 grand prix with the 3.8 series 3 and its night and day. It was so reliable( even though the transmission could have been better) and had decent power. He could get 28 mpg, and it sounded good.
I have a 4.3 2014 Silverado and it's incredible. Tons of power and easily 25mpg. The 4.3 is S tier. Very reliable motor. Also had a 3.1 V6 94 Cavalier and loved it. Accurate at B tier due to intake gasket issues.
I have a 3,5l version of the 2.7 in a 2006 dodge magnum SXT, before buying it i did my research and those who did not have as much trouble maintained the cars better, the consensus was according to my research was an oil change every 3k Miles, whether in needed it or not, no matter the oil used. Mine has 209K miles and still going strong at 28 years old. Not saying you are wrong, but there is always exceptions
The 2.7l and 3.2/3.5/4.0l are different the 2.7l has four cams as its dohc and the 3.2/3.5/4.0 has 2 its a sohc. The 3.2/3.5/4.0 were good i had one and put over 300k miles on mine. The 2.7 were notorious for oil sludge timing chain and waterpump problems very few of these engines survive over 100k miles unless they are meticulously maintained with frequent oil changes, but sometimes even that was no guarantee of long life
Always willing to admit an oversight, it appears it may be more user error than pure design flaw. Thanks for sharing your experience with it
@@running2redline After a little research you were right, the 2.7 and the 3.5L were not the same class i had always thought the 3.5 was an upgrade in the engine platform
the series 2 was found in a lot of buicks from the 90s and early 2000's and my 2000 pontiac grand prix had the 3800 series 2 as does my buick lesabre
Glad to see the v6 in my '00 S10 got an A tier! I'd personally put it at S tier but that's just my bias.
Gonna put a turbo on it one day after a basic rebuild, then see how much the OEM parts can take before it blows.
That turbo is gonna make it a blast, good luck with it!
I bought a rusted out and written off buick, with one of those beautiful 3800 engines. It still runs perfectly. I plan on taking the engine from the Buick and dropping it into my Pontiac fiero. Make a real solid car with one of the greatest engines of all time.
I love the Fiero styling, that sounds like a sick build right there, good luck!
I have the SOHC V6 3.5 and it quite surprises me the issues that were talked about because on my side it is reaching soon the 500000k kms and had absolutely no issues since I bought it brand new.