William Shatner appeared at the Providence Performing Arts Center (PPAC) on May 12, 2018, for a one-night-only event that included a screening of Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan and a live onstage conversation with the actor and I was fortunate enough to get a ticket and I had a great seat. Well, it had been about three years since Leonard Nimoy had passed away, we were all still grieving. It was very cathartic to be among my fellow nerds as we watched Spock’s“death scene“ and mourned for Leonard Nimoy together. The discussion afterwards was amazing. Thank you for putting together this story. And really made my day!
@@AprilPvd I just want to say that I saw this movie in a theater in downtown Chicago in July of 1982 with my first real girlfriend. I had read to her the last chapter of Tale of Two Cities aloud the night before. If you’ll recall, the opening and closing lines of Dickens’ masterpiece bookend the movie. I spent the last 15 minutes of the movie weeping for Spock’s demise and the nobility of his sacrifice and knowing that the “it’s a far far better thing I do than I have ever done. It is a far better rest I go to than I have ever known” line was inevitably coming, and surely from Kirk. It was one of the most emotionally immersive experiences I’ve ever had in the movie theater. Right up there with Star Wars and One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest.
@@tsan3796 Shatner is living proof that if you always express yourself and don't give a damn what people say about you, you will live a long, happy, vigorous life.
I think it's the best ST movie, period. It's the only one I re-watch on a regular basis. My order of best to worst (using only the original cast): 2, 6, 4, 3, 5, 1. The biggest problem I have with 1 is that it's humorless. The biggest problem I have with 4 is that there's too much humor. Even though it's all about whales, the story has no weight.
I remember when i saw the movie in 1982 in theatre. I was very glad that Horner used the Star Trek Fanfare at the beginning of the Main Title. Goldsmith didn't that so i had missed it in the Motion Picture. That Fanfare theme is as iconic as the Fox Fanfare is for Star Wars.
I saw The Wrath of Khan the night it premiered. It was part of the most memorable date I was ever on. I met a beautiful girl in a dorm parking lot three days before I graduated and got her to agree to go on a date with me. Three weeks later, after my college graduation, the undergrad made good on her promise. I still remember everything that happened that night 42 years ago. After dinner we decided to go see the Star Trek movie in downtown Pocatello at the the Chief theater. I remember looking at her when Khan put the "indigenous lifeforms" into Chekhov and Terrell's helmets and thought she was going to loose it. We talked about the movie afterwards while parked on a bridge watching the moon and the clouds play with Bannock peak. We talked about how Star Trek could go on without Spock among other things. She agreed to go on another date with me the following weekend and to my surprise I received a note from her in the mail a few days before our second outing. It was only time I ever got a thank-you note from a girl about a date. In the note she described how she felt during that scene. She wasn't a Star Trek fan growing up but said she loved the movie. We went out a few more times that summer but her education was more important than having a boyfriend and we drifted apart. I still have strong feelings for her to this day and the themes of separation that run through the plot, the line about opening "old wounds" , and all that make it hard for me at times to watch it. A powerful movie for sure.
Ricardo said, "Why would I want to do this I'm hardly in it?" Then he read the script and figured that he was mentioned on almost every page and figured it would be a good career move.
Actually, Westworld (1973) beat Star Trek II by nearly a decade. They used a CG-processed image (very low pixel resolution!) to depict the robot gunfighter's (Yul Brynner's) POV. Actual CGI animation (created by Ed Catmull, the co-founder of Pixar and former President of Disney Animation) was used in Futureworld (1976), the sequel to the original Westworld. They also had experimental CG animated in the late 1950s or early 1960s. The history of this media goes way before 1980s Hollywood.
Nicholas Meyer is that first breath of fresh air a lot of Star Trek has gotten from time to time. Michael Piller for TNG, Ira Stephen Behr for DS9, and Manny Coto for Enterprise.
Wow! You know your Star Trek! I love what Manny Coto did for Enterprise. I'm working on my episode for Voyage Home. I plan to make videos for all thr Star Ttek films.
He and Harve Bennett were truly outsiders looking in. Part of the problem with Roddenberry and (quite accurately) his "cronies" was that they were... too close. Too personal, and too "involved" in the project to step back and be objective about what the franchise needed. That doesn't mean they're bad people or anything, but they were not able to make the cognitive leap into the "strange" to refresh the franchise. And the first two years of TNG reflected a similar problem. The people in Gene's "inner circle" who weren't susceptible to cronyism and wanted to try kooky stuff were washed out by the end of season 1and sent packing. Between that and the writer's strike of '88, we almost lost Star Trek again. thankfully, we had a champion in John Pike at Paramount at the time to keep the wheels on the "Wagon Train to the Stars".
@@Redshirt434 I would include Jeri Taylor for TNG-who wrote Family and brought emotional dimension to the characters, especially Whorf-and Michael Chabon for Picard.
I agree, it was a great movie and wasn’t matched until the much later reboots…. I still enjoy watching Wrath of Khan and the Khan character was a key factor, as well as the stupidity of Kirk getting duped into approaching with his shields down…
The scene with Kirk and Spock dying, and showing the incredible emotion of two life long friends saying goodbye to each other. after Mr Spock's selfless act of heroism. was the greatest scene in all TV and motion pictures. if you went away from that scene with a dry? eye there's definitely something wrong with you that's for sure?
I remember on the NIGHTLY NEWS this show being showlighted! Ricardo was interviewed 1000x because of his physique. This was all over the news in 1982! I was on vacation on Hawaii and even THERE it was all over the news. SO was Star Trek III and Star Trek IV! Amazing times and I miss them. I miss so much of our innocence.
It was such a special time! Such great memories. I was also obsessed with Starlog magazine and getting any info I could find. 😀 Thank you for your comment!
It's crazy to think they made a movie for $13 million. Look at what movies cost now and what actors get paid. It's gone completely nuts. And with all that money, I don't see movies coming out even close to the quality of Star Trek 2. Sure, they have amazing special effects and all that, but the stories and acting are crap. They're also ridiculously long!
@@inhometraineroakville1174 Ha, ha, I remember waaaay back in the day, some magazine article was complaining about the same thing, that things like Star Wars and Jaws had distorted film making by setting such a high cash bar...they also specifically cited Terminator 2 for 80 MILLION dollar price-tag! Ha-ha! I don't mind expensive movies. I just wish Hollywood would go back to making movies I'd like, with less obvious woke/DEI messaging.
Nicholas Meyer was exactly what Star Trek needed at that time. He may not have been happy with the late additions that were made concerning Spock, but fans would have been furious or at least depressed if they had not been added. Glad Nick finally agreed to come back for the final movie in the original cast series, though Leonard Nimoy did a great job with his time at the helm as well. My favorites from best to worst are: 2, 6, 4, 3, 1 and 5. Number 5 took a while to grow on me but it's actually not so terrible. In fact the interaction of Kirk, Spock and Bones in that one is one of the best.
They took what worked best from TOS and used it to make pretty good movie. Shift from the ship to main cast was certainly step in right direction. Just some story parts were not really neccessary and made some passages weak. Like entire Savik plot....why she was even there....
Insaw it at the historic State theatre in Sydney. When Spock “died” in the simulator ppl gasped. They’d heard the rumours. When he actually died there was sobbing. Nervous laughter in the bagpipe scene. Standing ovation at the end. Goosebumps abounded.
Thank you for a great video. I had never realized all the wrangling and changes of course that went into Spock's not quite dying. Amazing how Leonard Nimoy was able to change his own role as Spock from buried to revived.
Meyer was correct: The part where they made it clear that Spock was coming back in Star Trek 3, was the lamest cop out ever. It eliminated all the stakes. It's rare for Hollywood to actually let the viewer know that anything is at risk in a movie.
Interesting. I can respect that and Meyer's a ger towards the decision. Personally, I'm in the camp that they made the right choice. But that's just my opinion.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast It was uplifting with the funeral, already. That tied in the story with our real-life experiences, celebrating people we love who die, because we can't stop death and can't just decide to bring them back. They could have left us with hope...he was shot at the life-building planet...and later brought him back in Star Trek III...without robbing the film of its connection with humanity, by ham-handedly informing us that Spock is DEFINITELY not really dead before the credits were even over. Think of how, in ST:TNG, they kill Yar. That made the series MATTER. It wasn't going to just be another Crewman #6 who died. They do later bring her back in various ways, but first they let the viewer feel her loss for real, without wussing out and fixing it at the end of the episode. Wrath of Khan should've done that.
Wrath of Khan, and Nick Meyers other contribution The Undiscovered Country are by far my faves, with the Shatner directed Final Frontier not even in my collection. I’d rather forget about it!
I agree! I love Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country, and Voyage Home. I also love Search for Spock. Final Frontier is such a train wreck but there is something very watchable about it. I'll post a video on Final Frontier soon. Thay production was an epic train wreck!
Thank you so much for the compliment. I hope you keep watching my videos. Star Trek 4 The Voyage Home was released on Monday and I plan to release Star Trek 5 The Final Frontier tomorrow morning. I have so many future videos planned.
The music and orchestration in Star Trek 2 and 3 were incredible. If you pay close attention to all the nuances, and how the music adds to the dynamics, you will gain a true appreciation of how the musical score is a key ingredient to the movie experience overall.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I started paying attention to this after noticing how detailed the music was in the scenes in Star Trek III when Kirk was "stealing" the Enterprise and the Excelsior was readying for a chase. That whole sequence was brilliant by Horner! th-cam.com/video/mkJ3--2K7yo/w-d-xo.html
You’ve done a great job on this… Lots of stuff I didn’t know. Montalban was outstanding and Shatner never better. The movie looks great and moves along wonderfully. It’s amazing how the stars were in alignment to make this a solid, classy production.
So Harve Bennett did more research than the entirety of anyone who’s directed a modern Disney Star Wars show (Tony Gilroy excepted) or anyone directing a marvel show.
You are so right. Can you imagine how good Dosney Star Wars could be if they put in the same effort and research as Harve Bennett? And you're ight, Tony Gilroy is awesome!
That is an amazing story. The precedent-setting CGI and direct video marketing surprised me, not to mention the true believers who charged low wages to no wages. I was a kid in high school who had grown up on the TOS. The movie was so, so awesome, and it still is.
As a 13 year old Trekkie at the time, I remember the announcement that a Star Trek movie was in the works and would be released in 1979. It seemed like forever into the future to my impatient self. For anyone who didn't grow up with TOS in the 60's and 70's, it's hard to convey the level of excitement when the Enterprise finally appeared on the big screen. Today we live in a world of endless reboots and reimaginations of old shows, but back then Star Trek was just a cancelled TV show from the 60's, and once cancelled they don't come back.
Thank you for the comment. It brings back memories. I was 10 yo when this movie came out I remember begging my father to take us to see it and he did. I loved the movie at time, but it was Star Trek 2 that took it to the next level.
Uh , it's HIS creation . He wanted to make a better show and it would have been BUT STAR WARS came along and Paramount saw 💵💵💵💵💵💵 . You can't blame Rodenberry for the first movie .
@@patrickpirzer4080 He still wanted enough control so nobody would turn the Federation into a military organization . And Jar Jar Abrams really screwed up the franchise . I know for sure it wasn't cool with graphic violence that was in it . Seeing someone being flown out of the spaceship from an explosion wasn't needed .
Thank you for the memories! It was such a great film. I couldn't wait for ST3, and I remember reading Starlog and trying to find any information on it. I saw ST3 on opening night.
Saw it for the first time as a kid in the mid 1980s on HBO and loved everything about it. The uniforms, the storyline, and how edgy it was. Already knew Spock would die in the movie, but it was still a gripping adventure. Not even Gene Roddenberry's meddling could ruin it---and he tried.
Me too. I remember when this was on all the time on HBO. I totally fell in love with this movie and with Star Trek. Yeah, and boy... Gene Roddenberry. 🤣Thank you for your comment, and I look forward to more of your comments!
Gold standard for trek ! It’s a great flick because story multi layered of age and prowess experience and it is really a sub movie in space outwitting captain vs captain
There were actual movie posters with "Revenge of the Jedi" on them, from early promotion. I think it worked out better for both as Wrath feels more epic.
Lucas decided that Jedi wouldn't be into "revenge", and so changed it to "return". "Starkiller" was also changed to "Skywalker" years earlier for similar reasons.
When I was a student, I went to a Star Trek movie night - all the movies for hardcore fans. Sitting next to me was a young couple who had won their tickets and had never heard of Star Trek. They left after the first movie, which didn't surprise me. Nowadays, I would advise people like that to go out for a nice meal and come back for the second movie.
I saw it in the theater and immediately afterwards, I wanted to watch it again. The greatest Star Trek film. What an incredible storyline and performances by the actors.
The script had to be written quickly because otherwise ILM would not have time to create the visual effects. There was a scheduled release date but Paramount had not sold tickets in theaters (which isn’t how these things work).
Basically Paramount created the same trap they put themselves into on the first film, by pre-selling the movie. Yes it was a common practice for a blockbuster like Star Trek, but once the film was pre-sold, everyone was locked in and no delays for changes to the film could be made. Star Trek IIs production learned from the mistakes that Roddenberry made on Star Trek I. The first film was never completed. What you see is a rough cut. Robert Wise tried to get Eisner to give him more time to tweak the cut and put in effects that were not completed before the rough cut. Nope! The film was shipped wet from the lab as is. The recent 4K Directors cut of the first film incorporates all of Wise's ideas and adjustments. Plus, they added some shots. It makes a HUGE difference. The Director's edition paced well and it is actually what should have been in the theatres.
Great editing and your use of memes is admirable. Not sure of the audio, though. This movie is undoubtedly one of my all-time favorites and I appreciate your research. Cheers!
Wow! Thank you so much for the kind words. It is truly appreciated. 😊 Yeah, the recording, my voice and pronunciation, and sound sucks! I am still working on it. Actually, the Star Trek audio tracks are the first ones I recorded so they are awkward, and I am editing the videos now weeks after I recorded them.😄 I've made a lot of improvements in my speech, and the Star Wars video is more recent. It's the most recent recording. Check it out and tell me if the Audio and my voice sounds better and more natural. It still has an echo and stuff, but I've bought some equipment to reduce that. Again, thank you so much for your kind and encouraging words!
Great job on this; I didnt think there was anything I didnt already know about this movie, but you proved me wrong! The only thing I would have included here was the name of the WWII Sub movie that they borrowed so much from; The Enemy Below....
Roddenberry There First! Apologies if my comment is redundant. I'll admit that I didn't have the time to look through all (at the moment) 437 comments! All in all, very well done -- I enjoyed watching! But two corrections(?): The new team weren't the first to bring Navy Tradition and Hornblower to the Star Trek Universe. That was actually done by Roddenberry himself back in the 1960's TOS. (See "The Making of Star Trek" 1968, which I believe is no longer in print. If you can find it, go for it! So enjoyable & informative!). Back then, Roddenberry referred to Star Trek as "...Hornblower in space..." And TOS is filled with behavior that comes right out of his own experience in the Navy. (Prime example: TOS: "Balance of Terror".") The irony of all that, and the problematic "Star Trek: The Motion Picture", is that Roddenberry broke rules for ST:TMP that he himself created! He relates in both the book and interviews about how the first (and rejected) TOS Pilot, "The Cage" was good science fiction, but bad television. "Too cerebral". And that he needed to provide more drama and action. Hence the second pilot "Where no man has gone before" provided a fast moving story with plenty of action (and, I believe, Shatner's first torn shirt!). Bennett & Meyer succeeded by directly or indirectly going back to what Roddenberry went with back in the '60s -- and improved on it! Many thanks again!!
Roddenberry leaked an important plotline from script, out of pure peckishness? I thought he was better than that. And Star Trek fans making death threats against the producers, because of Spock's rumored demise? WTF?
Oh, Gene Roddenberry was definitely NOT better than that. 😆 He was a very complex and complicated man. He was a brilliant visionary and helped shape the future, but he also did a lot of shady things. His stories, both noble and crooked are the stuff of Hollywood legend!
The Wrath of Khan did for Star Trek what The Empire Strikes Back did for Star Wars. I'll even bet fans didn't mind at all that the scenes of the Enterprise leaving the drydock were lifted whole from TMP. 🖖😎👍
IMO, Star Trek the Motion Picture was a great movie. The only problem was that it was too long, especially during the sequences when the Enterprise was in Veger's "space ship". I thought the storyline was genius, and seeing the old crew in action again was magical.
Star Trek 1 was/is a horrible movie. It was a TOS episode stretched out to 2 hours. Gene Roddenberry was shown the door after this and not allowed to have anything to do with Star Trek 2. William Shatner hated it, he called it “a bore”.
True! You know your Star Trek. Thanks for the comment. 🙂 My humble opinion from listening to his interviews and reading his book "I am Spock" (fantastic read, by the way) that he was still in the same mind frame as of 1981. It was finishing up Star Trek 2 where he began to change his mind about Star Trek and Spock. I would love to hear your thoughts. And thank you for your thoughtful comment.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast Your very welcome im a huge movie geek not just movies but the making of audio commentaries books. btw greetings from Scotland my friend
Excellent analysis! Hate to shatter the illusions of some die-hard ST true believers, but even as a long time Trekker---from watching the show on original broadcast TV---I felt the first movie was sort of a dud. A little too cerebral, even for a geek like me. I think whatever "success" the first film had, was largely provided by Star Trek fans, eager to see the show on the Big Screen. And I remember at the time, reading reviews from full-fledged Trekkers, expressing their disappointment with it. So when Wrath of Khan came along, I was desperately hoping for something far better. Because I knew if the second Star Trek film failed, that would be the end of Star Trek. And I wasn't to be discouraged. Wrath of Khan absolutely blew me away!
You are so right. I still remember that moment when Wrath of Kahn came out. I was 13 yo and it absolutely blew me a way and turned me into a die-hard Star Trek fan.
The Motion Picture might have been boring but it made a lot of money, which is the studio's idea of success. It also was nominated for three times for Oscar for the effects, art, and music.
You are so right! On paper, it was a huge money maker (although Paramount was hoping for Star Wars money), and I've really come to appreciate The Motion Picture, the older I get. Thank you for all your comments. You know your Star Trek! Keep commenting! I am learning form you as well!
I always thought their new uniforms were inspired by the Canadian Mounties? However, Starfleet was more militarized, and it felt more authentic. Good info!
Thank you for the kind words. I thought the new uniforms were a nice shot in the arm. But now that you mention it, they do look like Canadian Mountie uniforms.
@SBatts-vn1bd I guess in the first film they were trying to look somewhat similar to the uniforms on the TV show. But the end result was that they looked like pajamas. The new uniforms introduced in Star Trek 2 looked really good. I know Meyer was heavily influenced by Captain Horatio Hornblower particularly for the ship to ship battle scene. I think the uniforms while they look similar to Mounties, might have been his futuristic take on the old British naval uniforms.
@@inhometraineroakville1174 Gotcha your point and it's a good one. The rank braiding on their wrists especially was being faithful to the show. IMO, the uniforms for the first picture felt more like the Navy. The color palette doesn't bother me, however I'm glad they upgraded to what we saw in films 2-6.
I remember watching this movie as a kid at maybe 9 or 10 year olds on vhs a few years after it came out and finding it a great film. Hard to imagine it was made on only $14 million bucks.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I still remember the ear bugs terrifying me and the great sadness I felt watching Spock dead on screen, and the final triumphant doom of Khan. true movie magic.
Wow! That's incredible! You own a little piece of history. I would cherish that tape! I threw away all of my VHS tapes (hundreds of them) back in 2013, and I regret it to this day!
One thing that I've not read when speaking of the original film, is that they had a very interesting premise! That storyline, the Voyager satellite has something happen to it, gaining enormous power and becoming an accidental threat to Earth. There is a lot of potential there and I do believe that same premise could have been made into a compelling story, minus the love story between Decker and whatshername.
That's a great list. I love Galaxy Quest. You know, I still haven't seen Master and Commander. I need to check it out. That was Russell Crowe in his prime!
If you watch Space Raiders från 1984 (produced by Roger Corman), you can hear many of James Horner's offcut pieces from his composing work for Wrath of Khan.
Aliens too. Of course on Aliens, Horner was pressed for time. Krull you can also hear bits and pieces. You hear bits and pieces of Cocoon in Die Hard, especially the ending.
The deleted scenes are great! I wish I could see them added back into the moviem I love the scene where Spock mentions that Saavik is half Romulan. And I love the flirting when Davis and Saavik first meet.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast The Director’s cut also shortened the extended special effects scenes . Probably closer to 40 added minutes. I only saw it a few months ago. Really wish it had been the theatrical release. *sigh*
This series and this channel are fantastic...Wrath of Khan is in my tope 5 all time favorite films, yet I had no idea that RODDENBERRY leaked Spock's death and the role this film played in home media...
Thank you so much for the kind words. I hope you keep watching! I just uploaded my video on Voyage Home and I am working on making the video on Final Frontier. So much interesting back story there!
Harlan Ellison would have 'loved' GR's Star Trek 'city' sequel. I think a show needs it's creator but if GR believed that he would have stuck it out through season 3. He didn't care about Star Trek fans and took off when he knew the show wasn't gonna get a 4th season no matter what. If old Gene could jump into a time machine and warn younger Gene about his future he would have stayed put as Producer in season 3.
"You are in a position to demand nothing, sir... I, on the other hand, am in the position to grant, nothing..." - best line in the movie. LOL! I love the refit Enterprise. It's sleek and screams SEX!
Sheeeyit will they ever give up blaming Roddenberry for being human? The real problem with TMP is it needed editing. Cut some scenes, rearrange a few others, get rid of some of the long exposition and make it excited conversation like they did in TWOK with garbled transmissions and bits of dialogue flying about the bridge. Much more exciting. It was all done in post production. A side comment: Marcia Lucas really saved the original Star Wars in post production editing by cutting whole scenes and rearranging sequences. It could still be done for TMP.
Thanks for the comment. Check out my video in Star Trek: The Motion Picture. My opinion is that the two factors were: Paramount pre-selling the theater tickets and 2) Able and Associates not delivering any usable special effects. Gene Roddenberry was not really responsible for the problems. However, he didn't help himself by not helping out the post-production. They needed a scapegoat and he was it.
Yah, Spock died 2 times here.....in a way of saying, lol...but the real sad Trek was Star Trek Beyound, because not only we lost Spock in REAL life, but also Anton Yelchin 😢... Star Trek Wrath of Khan was dark, sad, and yet incredibly well made ( eventhough very transparent mistake happened when Khan said that he knew THAT Chekov there, from the Enterprise, when Space Seed was aired Chekov never was on the ship ). But, who cares about the little mistakes, what got me was that the Star Trek creator himself was basically fired from being the producer of the Wrath of Khan! That must of felt extremely outrages, specially when the show was basically his own creation, with his own ideas, cast, and the ship Enterprise herself.
He was so amazing! It was so good that the world completely forgot about his other character, Mr Roarke, plus the hundreds of other brilliant characters he played. Ricardo Montalban was THE MAN!
Almost everyone in the theater WEPT when Spock died saving the ship... Almost everyone in the theater WEPT when SPOCK'S "KOTRAH" was returned to his regenerated body....! James Horner met a tragic end piloting his own aircraft. A terrible loss....
Its true about the price of movies on VHS. I worked in a video store for many years, 98% of the movies that came had the retail price around $100, video stores paid around $65. Occasionally there would be a title that would be released at a 'sell through' price, usually around $20 on movies studious thought would sell better
Thank you for your comment. I envy you. Back in college, my dream was to work in a video store. Now, I miss them so much. I'd do anything to be able to go inside a Blockbuster.
@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I had a lot of good times working there, it helped cement me as a local legion in the small town I lived in, I still have people referring to me as legend... haha
It is kind of funny... maybe many people didn't think Ricardo's chest was real because it looked like it belonged to a 30 year old Schwarzenegger, but Ricardo's face looked too old at 62. He probably thought he may as well been wearing a fake chest if nobody believes it was really his. 😁
I’ve heard 2 different ideas on ST II moving forward..I’ve heard people on the film say that the movie was in doubt due to the poor reception from the Motion Picture.Thats why the budget for Wraith was slashed almost in half..I’ve also heard that the sequel was all but guaranteed due to the financial success of the 1st movie..It’s probably the latter.If a studio could make $$,I would imagine they would be all in
I've heard some crazy stuff about how Paramount was hedging their bets, hoping to make STII a TV movie, until they saw how great it was. Then they decided to give it a theateical release. Idk if thats true
@@casinoroyalewcheese The first movie was supposed to be a TV show reboot. In fact, they were developing it when Star Wars became a success. Paramount decided to go with Roddenberry's idea of an epic motion picture with the original cast. In fact some of the sets, costumes and actors, like David Gautreaux, that were used in the Motion Picture, were supposed to be for the new show. Gautreaux was supposed to be the new Vulcan replacing Nimoy on the new show. Instead, he dies on the Epsilon space station when it runs into Vger.
Both are correct. Just because a movie has an unfavorable viewing doesn't mean you can't presell the sequels. Back then, diehard fans of a franchise were a guarantee. They will go see the movie anyway. Tickets were cheap back then too. Most producers are not artists and have little idea what makes a good story that will draw audiences. They look at everything from a numbers and marketing position. Despite the 1st films poor over-all reception with audience, it did score highly well and many Trekkies who liked the look of the New Enterprise and were willing to sit through the boring parts and unfinished effects. So it still made a lot of money which is good for the studio! Which means the next film was guaranteed to sell out, at least in the first two weeks! After that, if the film was bad, the box office numbers will decline sharply. So slashing the budget to 13 million guarantees that if the film tanks with the audience after two weeks, the film is still likely to break even within the first two week. Of course, Star Trek II made bank. Lots of bank! So you get even more profit. It made so much bank, it instantly green lit a #3 movie for $17 million.
After ST VI, I roughed up a screenplay for a final ST with the original crew. Goes like this. Kirk is killed at the beginning of the film in a decidely mundane accident. The Enterprise is on a mission and cannot return to base. Kirk's coffin is sent out to space (like Spocks in ST II). The crew of the ST start making jokes about Kirk's demeanor as a way to relieve the tension. The film turns into a comedy. Spock starts doing Kirk impressions. Anyway, the crew figures out they could go back in time and eliminate the issue that caused the accident and Kirk's death. The crew and Enterprise deal with the regular litany of space issues, Romulans, Klingons. The head of the Klingons would be an Andy Kaufman type of Klingon. Completely miscasted but effective. As the Enterprise speeds up to go through the worm hole and go back in time, the Klingon vessel tags along and goes with them. The Klingon captain ends up helping the Enterprise and saving Kirk's life. Kirk has a very minor role in the film, the crew is the "star". Anyway, it is too late and no one from Hollywood would answer my letters.
I recall the motion picture Academy wouldn't consider this film for an Academy Award for special effects because they cheated and used computer graphics. And then gave it to ET. You also missed that quite a number of the Starfield shots and the computer displays on board the bridge were done by the computer firm of Evans and Sutherland.
Amazing in the modern context that Kirk and Khan never actually meet in person through the whole movie. They talk through the viewscreen, but are never actually in place together. Also a difference from today is Khan dies just BEFORE the Enterprise escapes. He dies thinking he won. That wouldn't happen in a modern movie, we would have to see him react to Kirk beating him.
Yes! They sure knew how to make movies back then. I feel most modern movies just don't have that spark and flair. That's just my opinion. Thank you for your comment.
Yeah, it's 2024 now, so if you're going to do videos about cinema, a graphic medium, please consider posting in 720. Also, Harve was a military policeman, not Navy. Also, I hate to disrupt/utterly dismantle the vibe of the narrative, but "I Am Not Spock" was written and published several years before the first feature film was made.
This was such a serious and depressing movie. That is why Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home is my favorite Start Trek theatrical Film release. It is a light hearted comedy caper.
![30 ชั่วโมงคนเดียว บนรถไฟชั้น 3 โซเวียต [Around The World Ep. 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/MlE9boAVqDA/mqdefault.jpg)
William Shatner appeared at the Providence Performing Arts Center (PPAC) on May 12, 2018, for a one-night-only event that included a screening of Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan and a live onstage conversation with the actor and I was fortunate enough to get a ticket and I had a great seat. Well, it had been about three years since Leonard Nimoy had passed away, we were all still grieving. It was very cathartic to be among my fellow nerds as we watched Spock’s“death scene“ and mourned for Leonard Nimoy together. The discussion afterwards was amazing. Thank you for putting together this story. And really made my day!
Oh wow! That must have been such an amazing and treasured experience. Thank you for sharing.
@@AprilPvd I just want to say that I saw this movie in a theater in downtown Chicago in July of 1982 with my first real girlfriend. I had read to her the last chapter of Tale of Two Cities aloud the night before. If you’ll recall, the opening and closing lines of Dickens’ masterpiece bookend the movie. I spent the last 15 minutes of the movie weeping for Spock’s demise and the nobility of his sacrifice and knowing that the “it’s a far far better thing I do than I have ever done. It is a far better rest I go to than I have ever known” line was inevitably coming, and surely from Kirk. It was one of the most emotionally immersive experiences I’ve ever had in the movie theater. Right up there with Star Wars and One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest.
He’s still doing it at 93 was in ohio last month doing same screening of wrath then Q&A
@@tsan3796 Shatner is living proof that if you always express yourself and don't give a damn what people say about you, you will live a long, happy, vigorous life.
One of the best Star Trek Movies of all time.
Absolutely!
Best science fiction movies ever
I think it's the best ST movie, period. It's the only one I re-watch on a regular basis. My order of best to worst (using only the original cast): 2, 6, 4, 3, 5, 1. The biggest problem I have with 1 is that it's humorless. The biggest problem I have with 4 is that there's too much humor. Even though it's all about whales, the story has no weight.
Horners music in this film was amazing. Added to the spectacle
He was an amazing composer.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast his score for Aliens is one of my all time faves
NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH... NAH!
I remember when i saw the movie in 1982 in theatre. I was very glad that Horner used the Star Trek Fanfare at the beginning of the Main Title. Goldsmith didn't that so i had missed it in the Motion Picture. That Fanfare theme is as iconic as the Fox Fanfare is for Star Wars.
@@chadtopia That's a great score. He was so talented!
I saw The Wrath of Khan the night it premiered. It was part of the most memorable date I was ever on. I met a beautiful girl in a dorm parking lot three days before I graduated and got her to agree to go on a date with me. Three weeks later, after my college graduation, the undergrad made good on her promise. I still remember everything that happened that night 42 years ago. After dinner we decided to go see the Star Trek movie in downtown Pocatello at the the Chief theater. I remember looking at her when Khan put the "indigenous lifeforms" into Chekhov and Terrell's helmets and thought she was going to loose it. We talked about the movie afterwards while parked on a bridge watching the moon and the clouds play with Bannock peak. We talked about how Star Trek could go on without Spock among other things. She agreed to go on another date with me the following weekend and to my surprise I received a note from her in the mail a few days before our second outing. It was only time I ever got a thank-you note from a girl about a date. In the note she described how she felt during that scene. She wasn't a Star Trek fan growing up but said she loved the movie. We went out a few more times that summer but her education was more important than having a boyfriend and we drifted apart. I still have strong feelings for her to this day and the themes of separation that run through the plot, the line about opening "old wounds" , and all that make it hard for me at times to watch it. A powerful movie for sure.
Wow! What a powerful and fascinating story. Thank you for sharing! 🙂
Montalbon gives one of the best performances ever on film. And he seems to delight during every moment. Gracias, Ricardo.
You are so right! He was absolutely fantastic!
Ricardo said, "Why would I want to do this I'm hardly in it?"
Then he read the script and figured that he was mentioned on almost every page and figured it would be a good career move.
He nailed it as Khan. It's interesting that we all remember him more as Khan rather than Mr Roarke.
@@Ron-d2s I love Ricardo Montalban. He had that perfect combination of vanity and humility one finds in the best actors.
So Montalban was worried that this was a big....CON!
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcastI also recall his work in automobile commercial spots (Lincoln?). 120% suave and debonair.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast Mr Roarke, stuffed shirt; Sunyan Khan, no shirt. Pecs win!!
star trek 2 and 3 are incredible. i cry every time. wont forget seeing the enterprise burn up in the night sky. that music, man.
They are such great films. I think 2, 3, and 4 make up a perfect trilogy. Thank you for your comment.
For me Star Trek 2 was pretty much perfect. But Star Trek 3 never worked for me. It lacked all the things that made Start Trek 2 so great.
The CGI Genesis sequence was the first time CGI was used in a motion picture, it beat Tron to the theaters by weeks.
Thanks for the comment. I remember seeing that sequence back then. It was mind-blowing at the time.
Actually, Westworld (1973) beat Star Trek II by nearly a decade. They used a CG-processed image (very low pixel resolution!) to depict the robot gunfighter's (Yul Brynner's) POV. Actual CGI animation (created by Ed Catmull, the co-founder of Pixar and former President of Disney Animation) was used in Futureworld (1976), the sequel to the original Westworld.
They also had experimental CG animated in the late 1950s or early 1960s.
The history of this media goes way before 1980s Hollywood.
@@AvengerII *The First FULLY rendered CGI, not overlays, not elements, but a fully rendered sequence.
better?
@@Ron-d2s Wow.
Thin-skinned.
Keep up that reputation Techies have for being "service-oriented" and humane.
JERK.
When I think of major use by CGI in a film I always think of the Last Starfighter that came out a couple years later.
Nicholas Meyer is that first breath of fresh air a lot of Star Trek has gotten from time to time. Michael Piller for TNG, Ira Stephen Behr for DS9, and Manny Coto for Enterprise.
Wow! You know your Star Trek! I love what Manny Coto did for Enterprise. I'm working on my episode for Voyage Home. I plan to make videos for all thr Star Ttek films.
He and Harve Bennett were truly outsiders looking in. Part of the problem with Roddenberry and (quite accurately) his "cronies" was that they were... too close. Too personal, and too "involved" in the project to step back and be objective about what the franchise needed. That doesn't mean they're bad people or anything, but they were not able to make the cognitive leap into the "strange" to refresh the franchise. And the first two years of TNG reflected a similar problem. The people in Gene's "inner circle" who weren't susceptible to cronyism and wanted to try kooky stuff were washed out by the end of season 1and sent packing. Between that and the writer's strike of '88, we almost lost Star Trek again. thankfully, we had a champion in John Pike at Paramount at the time to keep the wheels on the "Wagon Train to the Stars".
@@Redshirt434 I would include Jeri Taylor for TNG-who wrote Family and brought emotional dimension to the characters, especially Whorf-and Michael Chabon for Picard.
TWoK was the best Star Trek movie. It saved the franchise and it's still fun to watch, unlike the first Trek movie.
You are so right! It's the movie that turned me into a die-hard Star Trek fan!
In my opinion, Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan was THE best Star Trek movie, PERIOD!!
I agree, it was a great movie and wasn’t matched until the much later reboots…. I still enjoy watching Wrath of Khan and the Khan character was a key factor, as well as the stupidity of Kirk getting duped into approaching with his shields down…
There was some over-acting on Shatner’s part I felt but yeah, I remember my eyes tearing up when Spock was dying.
I think STTMP could be saved with editing and scoring changes. Voyage home is better than khan in some ways.
The scene with Kirk and Spock dying, and showing the incredible emotion of two life long friends saying goodbye to each other. after Mr Spock's selfless act of heroism. was the greatest scene in all TV and motion pictures. if you went away from that scene with a dry? eye there's definitely something wrong with you that's for sure?
I remember on the NIGHTLY NEWS this show being showlighted! Ricardo was interviewed 1000x because of his physique. This was all over the news in 1982! I was on vacation on Hawaii and even THERE it was all over the news. SO was Star Trek III and Star Trek IV! Amazing times and I miss them. I miss so much of our innocence.
It was such a special time! Such great memories. I was also obsessed with Starlog magazine and getting any info I could find. 😀 Thank you for your comment!
Entire cast and crew, and audience, began to cry...
Yup! I can see why. 😮💨
It's crazy to think they made a movie for $13 million. Look at what movies cost now and what actors get paid. It's gone completely nuts. And with all that money, I don't see movies coming out even close to the quality of Star Trek 2. Sure, they have amazing special effects and all that, but the stories and acting are crap. They're also ridiculously long!
I agree! Star Trek II was so amazing and made on a very small budget. It is still so impressive.
you dont feel any connection to the characters.. ..this is why STD is so bad. its just leaves you cold
12 million in 1982, about 40 million today...STILL pretty low for a scifi blockbuster.
@@MM22966 I don't think they're making any major movies now for less than $200 million. It's just stupid!
@@inhometraineroakville1174 Ha, ha, I remember waaaay back in the day, some magazine article was complaining about the same thing, that things like Star Wars and Jaws had distorted film making by setting such a high cash bar...they also specifically cited Terminator 2 for 80 MILLION dollar price-tag! Ha-ha!
I don't mind expensive movies. I just wish Hollywood would go back to making movies I'd like, with less obvious woke/DEI messaging.
Nicholas Meyer was exactly what Star Trek needed at that time. He may not have been happy with the late additions that were made concerning Spock, but fans would have been furious or at least depressed if they had not been added. Glad Nick finally agreed to come back for the final movie in the original cast series, though Leonard Nimoy did a great job with his time at the helm as well. My favorites from best to worst are: 2, 6, 4, 3, 1 and 5. Number 5 took a while to grow on me but it's actually not so terrible. In fact the interaction of Kirk, Spock and Bones in that one is one of the best.
I always hated when TBS would play 2 4 5.... so they were skipping the return of Spock, and putting in the weakest with 5.
I love your rankings! I agree that Nicholas Meyer did an awesome job with Star Trek II and Star Trek VI. Thanks for comment!
His daughter, Dylan, is engaged to actress Kristen Stewart.
They took what worked best from TOS and used it to make pretty good movie. Shift from the ship to main cast was certainly step in right direction. Just some story parts were not really neccessary and made some passages weak. Like entire Savik plot....why she was even there....
no, he wasn't
The REAL reason Nimoy came back for Trek III is that he was made director of the movie.
Please check out my video on Star Trek III: The Search for Spock. 😀
AI narration sucks worse than "Spock's Brain"....
Insaw it at the historic State theatre in Sydney. When Spock “died” in the simulator ppl gasped. They’d heard the rumours. When he actually died there was sobbing. Nervous laughter in the bagpipe scene. Standing ovation at the end. Goosebumps abounded.
Wow! That's incredible. Thank you for your comment.
Thank you for a great video. I had never realized all the wrangling and changes of course that went into Spock's not quite dying. Amazing how Leonard Nimoy was able to change his own role as Spock from buried to revived.
Thank you for the kind words. It is appreciated. 😀Let me know what you think of the other videos.
Meyer was correct:
The part where they made it clear that Spock was coming back in Star Trek 3, was the lamest cop out ever. It eliminated all the stakes.
It's rare for Hollywood to actually let the viewer know that anything is at risk in a movie.
Interesting. I can respect that and Meyer's a ger towards the decision. Personally, I'm in the camp that they made the right choice. But that's just my opinion.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast It was uplifting with the funeral, already. That tied in the story with our real-life experiences, celebrating people we love who die, because we can't stop death and can't just decide to bring them back.
They could have left us with hope...he was shot at the life-building planet...and later brought him back in Star Trek III...without robbing the film of its connection with humanity, by ham-handedly informing us that Spock is DEFINITELY not really dead before the credits were even over.
Think of how, in ST:TNG, they kill Yar.
That made the series MATTER.
It wasn't going to just be another Crewman #6 who died.
They do later bring her back in various ways, but first they let the viewer feel her loss for real, without wussing out and fixing it at the end of the episode.
Wrath of Khan should've done that.
Wrath of Khan, and Nick Meyers other contribution The Undiscovered Country are by far my faves, with the Shatner directed Final Frontier not even in my collection. I’d rather forget about it!
I agree! I love Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country, and Voyage Home. I also love Search for Spock. Final Frontier is such a train wreck but there is something very watchable about it. I'll post a video on Final Frontier soon. Thay production was an epic train wreck!
Then you're missing out on three-boobed cat-lady.
Ok, that was an incredibly informative, “fascinating” look at the making of TWOK. Nice job!!!!
Thank you so much for the compliment. I hope you keep watching my videos. Star Trek 4 The Voyage Home was released on Monday and I plan to release Star Trek 5 The Final Frontier tomorrow morning. I have so many future videos planned.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I’ve subscribed!
The music and orchestration in Star Trek 2 and 3 were incredible. If you pay close attention to all the nuances, and how the music adds to the dynamics, you will gain a true appreciation of how the musical score is a key ingredient to the movie experience overall.
The music is so incredible. James Horner was a genius! 👍 Thank you for your comment.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I started paying attention to this after noticing how detailed the music was in the scenes in Star Trek III when Kirk was "stealing" the Enterprise and the Excelsior was readying for a chase. That whole sequence was brilliant by Horner!
th-cam.com/video/mkJ3--2K7yo/w-d-xo.html
The Wrath of KHAN Is An Awesome Movie!
👊😎✊
One of my favorite 👌😆👍🍁
RIP To All that Have passed away since then in Time 😔🍁
Thank you! Wrath of Khan is one of my favorites as well. 👊🖖
It is, hands down, my favorite Star Trek movie despite the tragic ending.
You’ve done a great job on this… Lots of stuff I didn’t know. Montalban was outstanding and Shatner never better. The movie looks great and moves along wonderfully. It’s amazing how the stars were in alignment to make this a solid, classy production.
Thank you so much for thr kind words. I agree. Wrath of Khan was so good. I hope you keep watching all the videos I release. 🙂
Fantastic! What a nice retrospective! Tons of information I'd not heard before. Thank-you!
Thank you so much for the kind words. I hope you keep listening to more videos. I'm finishing up my video on Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home.
So Harve Bennett did more research than the entirety of anyone who’s directed a modern Disney Star Wars show (Tony Gilroy excepted) or anyone directing a marvel show.
You are so right. Can you imagine how good Dosney Star Wars could be if they put in the same effort and research as Harve Bennett? And you're ight, Tony Gilroy is awesome!
That is an amazing story. The precedent-setting CGI and direct video marketing surprised me, not to mention the true believers who charged low wages to no wages. I was a kid in high school who had grown up on the TOS. The movie was so, so awesome, and it still is.
It is! I saw this as a teenager when it came out and it turned me into a die-hard Star Trek fan. Thank you for your comment.
As a 13 year old Trekkie at the time, I remember the announcement that a Star Trek movie was in the works and would be released in 1979. It seemed like forever into the future to my impatient self. For anyone who didn't grow up with TOS in the 60's and 70's, it's hard to convey the level of excitement when the Enterprise finally appeared on the big screen. Today we live in a world of endless reboots and reimaginations of old shows, but back then Star Trek was just a cancelled TV show from the 60's, and once cancelled they don't come back.
Thank you for the comment. It brings back memories. I was 10 yo when this movie came out I remember begging my father to take us to see it and he did. I loved the movie at time, but it was Star Trek 2 that took it to the next level.
Thank God they got Gene out of the script team. He has no business writing stories.
Haha! You said it! 🤣
He has no business writing stories? Dude, he created Star Trek! Get some perspective. 🤣
Uh , it's HIS creation . He wanted to make a better show and it would have been BUT STAR WARS came along and Paramount saw 💵💵💵💵💵💵 . You can't blame Rodenberry for the first movie .
Roddenberry was a good and creative writer for TV but not for cinema. That's right.
@@patrickpirzer4080 He still wanted enough control so nobody would turn the Federation into a military organization . And Jar Jar Abrams really screwed up the franchise . I know for sure it wasn't cool with graphic violence that was in it . Seeing someone being flown out of the spaceship from an explosion wasn't needed .
I saw STII opening weekend. Not a dry eye in the house. Loved it, and saw it several times. Then I couldn't wait for STIII. Fantastic stuff!
Thank you for the memories! It was such a great film. I couldn't wait for ST3, and I remember reading Starlog and trying to find any information on it. I saw ST3 on opening night.
Saw it for the first time as a kid in the mid 1980s on HBO and loved everything about it. The uniforms, the storyline, and how edgy it was. Already knew Spock would die in the movie, but it was still a gripping adventure. Not even Gene Roddenberry's meddling could ruin it---and he tried.
Me too. I remember when this was on all the time on HBO. I totally fell in love with this movie and with Star Trek. Yeah, and boy... Gene Roddenberry. 🤣Thank you for your comment, and I look forward to more of your comments!
I cried when Spock died, not afraid to say it either.
Me too!
Excellent! This video is of the 2% on YT that truly give this place value!
Thank you so much for the kind words! I hope you keep watching the videos! Have you checked out the other videos I have made so far?
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast Am doing so gradually. 😁
The film is like fine wine, it just keeps getting better with every passing year.
I agree! This movie holds up so well!
It was and is one of the greats. It’s the rare movie that gets better with age.
It's amazing how well it holds up today!
Enjoyed this thanks for the sharing ❤🎉
Thank you for the kind words! 😀
The first time I saw the Genesis Project graphics blew me away... What a Great Flick!
Yes! Such a great movie! And the Genesis Sequence was so mind blowing at the time.
Gold standard for trek ! It’s a great flick because story multi layered of age and prowess experience and it is really a sub movie in space outwitting captain vs captain
Such an amazing and incredible film. Thank you for your comment!
They decided not to name the movie "Revenge of Khan" because of "Revenge of the Jedi," then George Lucas was like, "Ha just kidding!"
Haha! 🤣 That's hilarious!
There were actual movie posters with "Revenge of the Jedi" on them, from early promotion.
I think it worked out better for both as Wrath feels more epic.
Lucas decided that Jedi wouldn't be into "revenge", and so changed it to "return". "Starkiller" was also changed to "Skywalker" years earlier for similar reasons.
When I was a student, I went to a Star Trek movie night - all the movies for hardcore fans. Sitting next to me was a young couple who had won their tickets and had never heard of Star Trek. They left after the first movie, which didn't surprise me. Nowadays, I would advise people like that to go out for a nice meal and come back for the second movie.
Haha! 🤣 That's great! A Star Trek movie night sounds awesome!
I saw it in the theater and immediately afterwards, I wanted to watch it again. The greatest Star Trek film. What an incredible storyline and performances by the actors.
Yes! Such an amazing film. Thank you for your comment.
The script had to be written quickly because otherwise ILM would not have time to create the visual effects. There was a scheduled release date but Paramount had not sold tickets in theaters (which isn’t how these things work).
Interesting!
Basically Paramount created the same trap they put themselves into on the first film, by pre-selling the movie. Yes it was a common practice for a blockbuster like Star Trek, but once the film was pre-sold, everyone was locked in and no delays for changes to the film could be made. Star Trek IIs production learned from the mistakes that Roddenberry made on Star Trek I. The first film was never completed. What you see is a rough cut. Robert Wise tried to get Eisner to give him more time to tweak the cut and put in effects that were not completed before the rough cut. Nope! The film was shipped wet from the lab as is. The recent 4K Directors cut of the first film incorporates all of Wise's ideas and adjustments. Plus, they added some shots. It makes a HUGE difference. The Director's edition paced well and it is actually what should have been in the theatres.
Great editing and your use of memes is admirable. Not sure of the audio, though. This movie is undoubtedly one of my all-time favorites and I appreciate your research. Cheers!
Wow! Thank you so much for the kind words. It is truly appreciated. 😊 Yeah, the recording, my voice and pronunciation, and sound sucks! I am still working on it. Actually, the Star Trek audio tracks are the first ones I recorded so they are awkward, and I am editing the videos now weeks after I recorded them.😄 I've made a lot of improvements in my speech, and the Star Wars video is more recent. It's the most recent recording. Check it out and tell me if the Audio and my voice sounds better and more natural. It still has an echo and stuff, but I've bought some equipment to reduce that. Again, thank you so much for your kind and encouraging words!
I saw this in the theater when it opened. Funny how many men left with 'something in their eyes', including me! I grew up on TOS. Good video!
Thank you for the kind words! I hope you keep watching my videos. I should be releasing The Voyage Home in the next couple of days.
As Geoge Takei would say "oh my' to ricardo montalbans chest.
Yes! He was buff! Oh my indeed! 😀
Despite efforts with the previous remakes - the death of Spock in the original Star Trek II can and could never be redone. Classic forever. :)
You are so right. It was a historic cultural moment of our generation.
Great job on this; I didnt think there was anything I didnt already know about this movie, but you proved me wrong! The only thing I would have included here was the name of the WWII Sub movie that they borrowed so much from; The Enemy Below....
Thank you so much for the kind words. And you taught me something about the sub movie name. 🙂
Roddenberry There First! Apologies if my comment is redundant. I'll admit that I didn't have the time to look through all (at the moment) 437 comments! All in all, very well done -- I enjoyed watching! But two corrections(?): The new team weren't the first to bring Navy Tradition and Hornblower to the Star Trek Universe. That was actually done by Roddenberry himself back in the 1960's TOS. (See "The Making of Star Trek" 1968, which I believe is no longer in print. If you can find it, go for it! So enjoyable & informative!). Back then, Roddenberry referred to Star Trek as "...Hornblower in space..." And TOS is filled with behavior that comes right out of his own experience in the Navy. (Prime example: TOS: "Balance of Terror".") The irony of all that, and the problematic "Star Trek: The Motion Picture", is that Roddenberry broke rules for ST:TMP that he himself created! He relates in both the book and interviews about how the first (and rejected) TOS Pilot, "The Cage" was good science fiction, but bad television. "Too cerebral". And that he needed to provide more drama and action. Hence the second pilot "Where no man has gone before" provided a fast moving story with plenty of action (and, I believe, Shatner's first torn shirt!). Bennett & Meyer succeeded by directly or indirectly going back to what Roddenberry went with back in the '60s -- and improved on it! Many thanks again!!
Thank you for your comment. You know your Star Trek. Check out my video on Star Trek TOS which should be released Wednesday. 🙂
This is still my favorite Star Trek movie.
Great choice! For me, it has always been a toss up between this one and Star Trek IV.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast Yes. That is a close 2nd😀
I remember seeing this in the theater in 82', great movie.
That must have been an awesome experience!
The best of the movies, period.
This movie is so good!
This movie also gave us one of the greatest and most enduring memes: “Kahn!”
True! True! And referenced in Seinfeld by George Costanza!
Roddenberry leaked an important plotline from script, out of pure peckishness? I thought he was better than that. And Star Trek fans making death threats against the producers, because of Spock's rumored demise? WTF?
Oh, Gene Roddenberry was definitely NOT better than that. 😆 He was a very complex and complicated man. He was a brilliant visionary and helped shape the future, but he also did a lot of shady things. His stories, both noble and crooked are the stuff of Hollywood legend!
RIP James Horner 😞
So sad. He was taken too early.
The Wrath of Khan did for Star Trek what The Empire Strikes Back did for Star Wars. I'll even bet fans didn't mind at all that the scenes of the Enterprise leaving the drydock were lifted whole from TMP. 🖖😎👍
I agree. This movie saved Star Trek. This is the movie that turned me into a die-hard Star Trek fan.
IMO, Star Trek the Motion Picture was a great movie. The only problem was that it was too long, especially during the sequences when the Enterprise was in Veger's "space ship". I thought the storyline was genius, and seeing the old crew in action again was magical.
I agree. Star Trek The Motion Picture is a very good story.
Star Trek 1 was/is a horrible movie. It was a TOS episode stretched out to 2 hours. Gene Roddenberry was shown the door after this and not allowed to have anything to do with Star Trek 2. William Shatner hated it, he called it “a bore”.
@@TowGunner Do you know the meaning of "IMO"?
Nimoy's book "I AM NOT SPOCK" was released in 1975. Years before Star Trek II was even thought of.
True! You know your Star Trek. Thanks for the comment. 🙂 My humble opinion from listening to his interviews and reading his book "I am Spock" (fantastic read, by the way) that he was still in the same mind frame as of 1981. It was finishing up Star Trek 2 where he began to change his mind about Star Trek and Spock. I would love to hear your thoughts. And thank you for your thoughtful comment.
Thank you for this very interesting and iv subscribed
Thank you so much for the kind words. It's truly appreciated! 😀
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast Your very welcome im a huge movie geek not just movies but the making of audio commentaries books. btw greetings from Scotland my friend
Excellent analysis! Hate to shatter the illusions of some die-hard ST true believers, but even as a long time Trekker---from watching the show on original broadcast TV---I felt the first movie was sort of a dud. A little too cerebral, even for a geek like me. I think whatever "success" the first film had, was largely provided by Star Trek fans, eager to see the show on the Big Screen. And I remember at the time, reading reviews from full-fledged Trekkers, expressing their disappointment with it. So when Wrath of Khan came along, I was desperately hoping for something far better. Because I knew if the second Star Trek film failed, that would be the end of Star Trek. And I wasn't to be discouraged. Wrath of Khan absolutely blew me away!
You are so right. I still remember that moment when Wrath of Kahn came out. I was 13 yo and it absolutely blew me a way and turned me into a die-hard Star Trek fan.
Thank you for the kind words!
The Motion Picture might have been boring but it made a lot of money, which is the studio's idea of success. It also was nominated for three times for Oscar for the effects, art, and music.
You are so right! On paper, it was a huge money maker (although Paramount was hoping for Star Wars money), and I've really come to appreciate The Motion Picture, the older I get. Thank you for all your comments. You know your Star Trek! Keep commenting! I am learning form you as well!
One of the best sci fi movies to date.
I agree!
Robert Fletcher's uniforms for Star Trek II are dynamite, the crew has never looked better, and I think these are the best uniforms in the franchise.
I agree with you 100%. They were a jolt of fresh air to the franchise. Thank you for your comment.
no TOS were. bell bottom trousers & pink shirt ridiculous
I always thought their new uniforms were inspired by the Canadian Mounties? However, Starfleet was more militarized, and it felt more authentic. Good info!
Thank you for the kind words. I thought the new uniforms were a nice shot in the arm. But now that you mention it, they do look like Canadian Mountie uniforms.
@SBatts-vn1bd I guess in the first film they were trying to look somewhat similar to the uniforms on the TV show. But the end result was that they looked like pajamas. The new uniforms introduced in Star Trek 2 looked really good. I know Meyer was heavily influenced by Captain Horatio Hornblower particularly for the ship to ship battle scene. I think the uniforms while they look similar to Mounties, might have been his futuristic take on the old British naval uniforms.
@@inhometraineroakville1174 Gotcha your point and it's a good one. The rank braiding on their wrists especially was being faithful to the show. IMO, the uniforms for the first picture felt more like the Navy. The color palette doesn't bother me, however I'm glad they upgraded to what we saw in films 2-6.
I remember watching this movie as a kid at maybe 9 or 10 year olds on vhs a few years after it came out and finding it a great film. Hard to imagine it was made on only $14 million bucks.
I was 10 years old when this came out as well! 😀 They made a great film with such a small budget.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I still remember the ear bugs terrifying me and the great sadness I felt watching Spock dead on screen, and the final triumphant doom of Khan. true movie magic.
I still have that original $39 VHS tape, was the first movie I ever got that wasn't recorded from the T.V. Watched it over 200 times, at least.
Wow! That's incredible! You own a little piece of history. I would cherish that tape! I threw away all of my VHS tapes (hundreds of them) back in 2013, and I regret it to this day!
One thing that I've not read when speaking of the original film, is that they had a very interesting premise! That storyline, the Voyager satellite has something happen to it, gaining enormous power and becoming an accidental threat to Earth. There is a lot of potential there and I do believe that same premise could have been made into a compelling story, minus the love story between Decker and whatshername.
The story of Star Trek The Motion Picture is interesting indeed.
My favorite ST movies:
The Wrath of Khan
The Undiscovered Country
Galaxy Quest
Master and Commander: Farside of the World
First Contact
That's a great list. I love Galaxy Quest. You know, I still haven't seen Master and Commander. I need to check it out. That was Russell Crowe in his prime!
If you watch Space Raiders från 1984 (produced by Roger Corman), you can hear many of James Horner's offcut pieces from his composing work for Wrath of Khan.
That's amazing! Thanks for comment!
Aliens too. Of course on Aliens, Horner was pressed for time. Krull you can also hear bits and pieces. You hear bits and pieces of Cocoon in Die Hard, especially the ending.
I watched Star Trek I with the additional ~20 minutes added back in and it’s as good as WoK. No kidding.
The deleted scenes are great! I wish I could see them added back into the moviem I love the scene where Spock mentions that Saavik is half Romulan. And I love the flirting when Davis and Saavik first meet.
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast The Director’s cut also shortened the extended special effects scenes . Probably closer to 40 added minutes. I only saw it a few months ago. Really wish it had been the theatrical release. *sigh*
This series and this channel are fantastic...Wrath of Khan is in my tope 5 all time favorite films, yet I had no idea that RODDENBERRY leaked Spock's death and the role this film played in home media...
Thank you so much for the kind words. I hope you keep watching! I just uploaded my video on Voyage Home and I am working on making the video on Final Frontier. So much interesting back story there!
Harlan Ellison would have 'loved' GR's Star Trek 'city' sequel.
I think a show needs it's creator but if GR believed that he would have stuck it out through season 3.
He didn't care about Star Trek fans and took off when he knew the show wasn't gonna get a 4th season no matter what.
If old Gene could jump into a time machine and warn younger Gene about his future he would have stayed put as Producer in season 3.
Interesting speculation. Gene Roddenberry was certainly a complicated man.
THE BEST Star Trek Movie of the entire lot!
Yes. This one and Voyage Home are my two favorites.
Bravo! Very well done!
Thank you so much!
'I Am Not Spock' was published in 1975. Not after the first film (1979).
Thanks for the correction. Have you read his 1995 follow-up "I Am Spock"? It was an amazing read.
"You are in a position to demand nothing, sir... I, on the other hand, am in the position to grant, nothing..." - best line in the movie. LOL!
I love the refit Enterprise. It's sleek and screams SEX!
Such a great line! And that redesigned Enterprise is still my favorite!
Star Trek's 2+4 were the only good ones. But they both were VERY good.
Thanks for your comment! 2 and 4 are my favorites. I'm working on "The Making if Star Trek 4: The Voyage Home" video which will be released soon.
Sheeeyit will they ever give up blaming Roddenberry for being human? The real problem with TMP is it needed editing. Cut some scenes, rearrange a few others, get rid of some of the long exposition and make it excited conversation like they did in TWOK with garbled transmissions and bits of dialogue flying about the bridge. Much more exciting.
It was all done in post production.
A side comment: Marcia Lucas really saved the original Star Wars in post production editing by cutting whole scenes and rearranging sequences. It could still be done for TMP.
Thanks for the comment. Check out my video in Star Trek: The Motion Picture. My opinion is that the two factors were: Paramount pre-selling the theater tickets and 2) Able and Associates not delivering any usable special effects. Gene Roddenberry was not really responsible for the problems. However, he didn't help himself by not helping out the post-production. They needed a scapegoat and he was it.
Yah, Spock died 2 times here.....in a way of saying, lol...but the real sad Trek was Star Trek Beyound, because not only we lost Spock in REAL life, but also Anton Yelchin 😢...
Star Trek Wrath of Khan was dark, sad, and yet incredibly well made ( eventhough very transparent mistake happened when Khan said that he knew THAT Chekov there, from the Enterprise, when Space Seed was aired Chekov never was on the ship ).
But, who cares about the little mistakes, what got me was that the Star Trek creator himself was basically fired from being the producer of the Wrath of Khan! That must of felt extremely outrages, specially when the show was basically his own creation, with his own ideas, cast, and the ship Enterprise herself.
That was so heart-breaking when Anton Yelchin died. It was such a shock. He was great in Star Trek, Terminator Salvation, and Charlie Bartlett.
Montalban was the star of that movie, which is still my favorite of the entire franchise.
He was so amazing! It was so good that the world completely forgot about his other character, Mr Roarke, plus the hundreds of other brilliant characters he played. Ricardo Montalban was THE MAN!
Almost everyone in the theater WEPT when Spock died saving the ship...
Almost everyone in the theater WEPT when SPOCK'S "KOTRAH" was returned to his regenerated body....!
James Horner met a tragic end piloting his own aircraft.
A terrible loss....
I hope you enjoy the Star Trek III: Search for Spock video SO sad about James Horner. So tragically young!
Its true about the price of movies on VHS. I worked in a video store for many years, 98% of the movies that came had the retail price around $100, video stores paid around $65. Occasionally there would be a title that would be released at a 'sell through' price, usually around $20 on movies studious thought would sell better
Thank you for your comment. I envy you. Back in college, my dream was to work in a video store. Now, I miss them so much. I'd do anything to be able to go inside a Blockbuster.
@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcast I had a lot of good times working there, it helped cement me as a local legion in the small town I lived in, I still have people referring to me as legend... haha
That early idea of Rodenberry's had a similar set up to First Contect.
Interesting! How so?
The part about the Klingons traveling back in time to prevent the Federation from forming is basically what the Borg does in First Contact.
Great concise summary!
Thank you for the kind words. I plan to eventually make a video about all thr Star Trek movies. I hope you enjoy them.
Loved every one of them gene Roddenberrys put out the best movies for star trek I don't care what they say
Thank you for your comment. Gene Roddenberry only produced Star Trek The Motion Picture. It was Harve Bennett that deserves most of the credit.
An amazing film. 👌👌
Yes. It certainly is! 🙂🖖
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan was not produced by Paramount Pictures but by Paramount Television.
That is very interesting. Thanks for the comment. 😃
It is kind of funny... maybe many people didn't think Ricardo's chest was real because it looked like it belonged to a 30 year old Schwarzenegger, but Ricardo's face looked too old at 62. He probably thought he may as well been wearing a fake chest if nobody believes it was really his. 😁
That's a good point. 😀
"Ceti Alpha V; Ceti Alpha VI... whatever it takes." - Mr. Mom
Haha. 🤣
Great video! 😊👏👏👏
Thank you so much for the kind words! I hope you enjoy the whole series. I just uploaded Voyage Home and I'm working on Undiscovered Country.
Horatio Hornblower in space! Sailing navy in space, wind in ship's sails.
Yes! You got it! 😀
I’ve heard 2 different ideas on ST II moving forward..I’ve heard people on the film say that the movie was in doubt due to the poor reception from the Motion Picture.Thats why the budget for Wraith was slashed almost in half..I’ve also heard that the sequel was all but guaranteed due to the financial success of the 1st movie..It’s probably the latter.If a studio could make $$,I would imagine they would be all in
Too true! That's how Hollywood thinks!
I've heard some crazy stuff about how Paramount was hedging their bets, hoping to make STII a TV movie, until they saw how great it was. Then they decided to give it a theateical release. Idk if thats true
@@casinoroyalewcheese The first movie was supposed to be a TV show reboot. In fact, they were developing it when Star Wars became a success. Paramount decided to go with Roddenberry's idea of an epic motion picture with the original cast. In fact some of the sets, costumes and actors, like David Gautreaux, that were used in the Motion Picture, were supposed to be for the new show. Gautreaux was supposed to be the new Vulcan replacing Nimoy on the new show. Instead, he dies on the Epsilon space station when it runs into Vger.
Both are correct. Just because a movie has an unfavorable viewing doesn't mean you can't presell the sequels. Back then, diehard fans of a franchise were a guarantee. They will go see the movie anyway. Tickets were cheap back then too. Most producers are not artists and have little idea what makes a good story that will draw audiences. They look at everything from a numbers and marketing position. Despite the 1st films poor over-all reception with audience, it did score highly well and many Trekkies who liked the look of the New Enterprise and were willing to sit through the boring parts and unfinished effects. So it still made a lot of money which is good for the studio! Which means the next film was guaranteed to sell out, at least in the first two weeks! After that, if the film was bad, the box office numbers will decline sharply. So slashing the budget to 13 million guarantees that if the film tanks with the audience after two weeks, the film is still likely to break even within the first two week. Of course, Star Trek II made bank. Lots of bank! So you get even more profit. It made so much bank, it instantly green lit a #3 movie for $17 million.
US navy? That makes so much sense.
It does! Thank you for your comment.
Excellent video!
Thank you very much!
After ST VI, I roughed up a screenplay for a final ST with the original crew. Goes like this. Kirk is killed at the beginning of the film in a decidely mundane accident. The Enterprise is on a mission and cannot return to base. Kirk's coffin is sent out to space (like Spocks in ST II). The crew of the ST start making jokes about Kirk's demeanor as a way to relieve the tension. The film turns into a comedy. Spock starts doing Kirk impressions. Anyway, the crew figures out they could go back in time and eliminate the issue that caused the accident and Kirk's death. The crew and Enterprise deal with the regular litany of space issues, Romulans, Klingons. The head of the Klingons would be an Andy Kaufman type of Klingon. Completely miscasted but effective. As the Enterprise speeds up to go through the worm hole and go back in time, the Klingon vessel tags along and goes with them. The Klingon captain ends up helping the Enterprise and saving Kirk's life. Kirk has a very minor role in the film, the crew is the "star". Anyway, it is too late and no one from Hollywood would answer my letters.
Haha! That made me laugh. 🤣 Thank you.
I recall the motion picture Academy wouldn't consider this film for an Academy Award for special effects because they cheated and used computer graphics. And then gave it to ET.
You also missed that quite a number of the Starfield shots and the computer displays on board the bridge were done by the computer firm of Evans and Sutherland.
Ooh, that's a great point. You know your Star Trek! Thank you.
Amazing in the modern context that Kirk and Khan never actually meet in person through the whole movie. They talk through the viewscreen, but are never actually in place together. Also a difference from today is Khan dies just BEFORE the Enterprise escapes. He dies thinking he won. That wouldn't happen in a modern movie, we would have to see him react to Kirk beating him.
Yes! They sure knew how to make movies back then. I feel most modern movies just don't have that spark and flair. That's just my opinion. Thank you for your comment.
Yeah, it's 2024 now, so if you're going to do videos about cinema, a graphic medium, please consider posting in 720. Also, Harve was a military policeman, not Navy. Also, I hate to disrupt/utterly dismantle the vibe of the narrative, but "I Am Not Spock" was written and published several years before the first feature film was made.
🤣
@@TotallyAwesomeFilmsPodcastI didn't mean to sound so d bag. The video was ok and I will check out your other stuff 👍
Horner also did Krull and Aliens.
Both amazing films!
This was such a serious and depressing movie. That is why Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home is my favorite Start Trek theatrical Film release. It is a light hearted comedy caper.
I love both movies. I cant decide which is my favorite. Check out my video on Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home.
Almost certainly this movie saved Star Trek.
It certainly did! I agree with you 100%.