shouldn't have cancelled it, should have called Nvidia on who they are - a bunch of scammers. Why not base the laptop 4070 chip on the desktop 4070? Ah yes, because money. Because how many people would buy 4080 laptops if Nvidia kept it honest?
Wait... but Matthew Moniz just said "not that much a diference that last year model, and thats a good thing" when he reviewed razer with 4070... So is not good to pay much more $$$ for same???? Damn Dave...
It also also used to be way worse in the gaming laptop bracket, there were many many atrocities that I personally wouldn't of even felt comfortable pulling up with at the local coffee shop. Arguably so the RGB craze is somewhat a good runner up to match those god awful designs
I mean if you want the new 18 inch G18, the 4070 model is "Cheap" for a brand new product with top of the line I9 13980HX and that amazing 18" 1600p 240hz screen
The problem with 4070m is that it's a scam. In 3000 series, 3070m was based on the same chip as desktop 3070. This time around, 4070m is based on desktop 4060 ti, those are 2 different chips with 4060\4060 ti being largely inferior to 4070.
Glad I just got the Legion 5 Pro 3070. Massive clearance sales increase the price gap a ton between the previous and next gen devices. After seeing benchmarks, it would mean I have to pay 35% more money for 5-10% more performance overall
@@Solokid404 The Legion 5 pro 3070 got down to $1100 over Black Friday. 3070 to laptops, which provide the same performance (sometimes better) than the 4070 were down to $1300. Meanwhile 4070 laptops are $2000+. You would genuinely have to be special in the head to buy a 4070 laptop over last gen with that price gap. The only time it's truly better is in DLSS FG but very, very few games support it and even new games coming out aren't certain to. 4070 laptops are over $2,000.
I love the looks of them and can't wait to try them out! But I think the "stealth" moniker really becomes meaningless when they light up the "stealth" letters...
This "4070" should really be a 4060, where it would actually be a noticeable performance bump coming from a 3060. As a 4070, it's a rip-off card for the $ considering you can find 3070ti laptops for $1400 right now easily in the US.
@@7evive 105W 4070 performs the same as a 3070ti at 150W. The only laptops (with 4070) worth it are the thin and light laptops that can handle the 105W and provide the performance of a 3070ti without thermal issues.
@@bl4ckst0ne Honestly I'm not even too sure about these numbers. Jarrod did 25 games with a 150W 3070ti and a 140W 4070. The 3070Ti beat the 4070 in over half the games if there was no DLSS or frame generation. That is a much bigger sample size than any of these numbers.
I found a 3080ti laptop for nearly $1000 off MSRP the day before the 4080 mobile launched. It’s a proper little beast of a gaming laptop and while the new version is a pretty solid improvement, I’m not sure it is worth the nearly $2000 extra dollars it would have cost over the unit I got on sale.
@NovoLuminis Great. It has some of the same downsides as other gaming laptops, runs hot, relatively short battery life, but those are not really fair complaints. It's a solid performer for most titles in 1440P but the graphics card is really starting to show its age.
@@Piketom1 Thanks for answering. My old laptop i7 9750H, GTX 1660ti, also runs quite hot with only 2 hours of battery life. I tilted mine by placing a box at the back, so it's lifted 45 degrees (really does help). I get 140-165 fps on CS2 and 70-150 fps on dayZ, depending on the area im in.
@@secretsanny That's not how it works. People agree that the cost should be less, not that "Not many games support it" Literally, like LITERALLY, all AAA games support and even some INDIE games support it. Literally search.
Yeah, no idea what he is thinking calling it a „budget“ option. MSI has always been absurdly overpriced. The 4080 variant sits at 5k in Europe, so the 4070 will probably be around 4k which is just stupid.
>live on island thousands of miles from anywhere else >every single good on the island has to be sent by boat or airplanes >wonder why everything costs more >blame the companies because you live on an island
@CyberneticArgumentCreator Most things in Australia excepting tech products and cars are made locally. The "island" you're talking about is larger than Western Europe Also, what country makes literally everything except maybe China?
Don't understand why no youtube is acknowledging what's really going on. The 4080 is the 3070 upgrade. And so on. That's why 4090s are in laptops when 3090s weren't. So no they didn't just bump down the 4070 to fit it in smaller computers to sell more...they are lying about which card it's even meant to replace, which is the 3060, not the 3070.
@@AliArghavan mkbhd said specifically he like 30fps more. And I understand why. I don't have a preference, but I can see why 60fps video is weird for some people
It’s not confusing. Nvidia simply shifted the stack downward. The 4070 is 3060 equivalent silicon. The 4090 is 3070ti equivalent silicon. The node performance uplift was so huge this generation that they shrank all the dies and named them the next thing up. 4070 is just the weird one where the performance delta is an overlap with the previous gen. That being said, getting more perf at 100W and below is pretty great, as laptop coolers have gotten obnoxiously loud in the RTX generation laptops. I’m waiting to see if the 7940hs/4070 combo in the Razer Blade 14” sees any significant uplift at 100W. Really tempted to pull the trigger on an open box 6900hx/3070ti model since they got upgraded to USB4 on the type-c ports.
Finally. I was a bit disappointed how you ignored all the BS that Nvidia did with their notebook GPUs. Even the 3090 and 3080 have been badly named and did not relate to their desktop counterparts at all. Nvidia has been behaving scummier with each generation and they need to be punished by reviewers, buyers, regulators and consumer protection agencies for it.
i think by now it is well know that a laptop card is equivalent to its desktop variant of the past generation or the next card in line of the desktop series. eg laptop 4070 is euqal to desktop 4060 or 3070. laptop 3080 is equal to desktop 3070 or 2080. Nothing has changed, i dont c why you say they have been names badly. Nvidia has been a bunch of douches that much is true, but the performance and naming of the laptop cards is the least of it. If u ignore the 128 bit bus thing, the lower cuda cores than past generation, the slower memory bandwidth than the old generation, the 8gb of memory in a supposedly high end card, bad prices etc. just ignore the horror show of the specs and look at the bottom line, the user experience, if u just look at the performance in games, its not awesome, but not bad. it is as expected. with a nice discount come next christmass or black friday etc it may even be called a decent deal. The desktop cards are another sad story though.
@@computerscience1101 AMD is still best value for the buck. And AMD CPUs have the advantage of being not as high-powered, hence they are better for portable usage in notebooks. What's cringe about that?
@@kyoko703 Yea, struggled so much to get through the pandemic with a long chain of unfortunate events. It gets better this year and so i hope i can find some good memories.
Crazy that I made the perfect decision buying a Legion 5 Pro 2021. The fully powered 3070 in the Legion is more or less on par with devices released two years later.
MSI laptop hinges are extremely flimsy. My PS42's hinge cracked under very normal, mostly at home use, it's being held together by reinforced aluminum tape... I see that those new devices have a pretty much identical hinge mechanism.
I'm not an expert, but something has always seemed very evident to me in different types of hardware: whenever possible we should avoid buying products that are very close to launches precisely to avoid poor optimization of the technology involved. I've always been a console gamer and never owned a gaming pc or laptop, but now being a Series X owner I'm quite leaning towards buying a laptop with the rtx 4070 because of DLSS3/FG.
Just keep in mind that right now DLSS 3.0 is supported only by a handful of games. Not only that, if you want to play any E-Sports titles, then keep in mind Frame Generatoon causes a quite significant amount of latency, so it's only good for those slower, plot-oriented singleplayer titles. RTX 4070 specifically is good for thin and light gaming/creator notebooks, like new AERO 16 or MSI Stealth lineup, but if you want best bang for a buck, I'd go for a bit chonkier last gen with RTX 3070Ti. Legion lineup was absolutely amazing a year ago!
@@bugbuster8598 oh yeah. I don't play multi-player titles, so latency is not crucial for me. Otherwise, a 60+fps in ultra settings is definitely something priority to my eyes.
@@bugbuster8598 Same thing was said about DLSS when it launched and now it's actually a really useful bit of tech to allow your hardware to be relevant longer. You're spot on about the use case for the laptop 4070, though - it's very obviously designed to have lower heat and power to allow itself to be fit into slim and small laptops while still providing a lot of oomph. The 4070 isn't the card to plug into your 4k monitor at home and use as a mobile desktop, but it body slams any previous midrange card at 100W or below.
I have your oldest, and I'm waiting for your newest to come in the mail to replace it. Apart from the spicy pillows MSI used instead of batteries in the GS63, it has been a great laptop. I'm only just now running into games I can't play, and technically, Starfield does play on it, just at very low settings.
I know 4070 pricing is not great but I just wanted a review of the Stealth 14 and this is unfortunately one of the only reviews out there for it right now. Some people want efficiency and I don't mind the 4070 running a bit slower than some 30 series cards if it's more efficient than the 3070. Wish the review of the laptop got more attention than the GPU. There wasn't much talk about the webcam, speakers or the temperature/noise profiles apart from the mention of the vapor chamber - which is significant. I feel like 4070 is not the same tier as 3070 but it's a good product in its own right. If they can cram 2 RAM slots in a 14" laptop due to the smaller memory bus then so be it, I care more about having more than 24/32GB RAM for work than higher video memory bandwidth. I need a laptop for work and play both, the Stealth 14 seems perfect for that. Not many 14" laptops out there with 400 nits, 240Hz AND 16:10 - that sounds perfect for my use case. The Intel processor/wifi is also what I prefer over ASUS G14's AMD lineup. Waiting for other people to review the Stealth 14 properly.
If any of you guys live near a micro center, there is an msi pulse 15 with 13700h/4070 for 1700 dollars. Its still expensive of course but thats much more reasonable than 2000+ from the other models. The only trade off is the screen is 1080p, but at that size the ppi is decent and you will be able to use 144hz across a wider variety of games.
"Haven't said this phrase in a really long time", I totally cocked my head to the side when you said it, because I hadn't heard it in awhile! Bring it back Dave! Awesome content as always, love your videos. 7 thumbs up!!
Waited for the 4070 vids to start dropping aaaand...last night pulled the trigger on a 3070ti Lenovo Legion with amd 6800h, 16gb, 2tb. Felt good about $1499 price.
@@dilip_1997 no, where can I find info on that? I did find a $50 "first time buyer" coupon (well,, the max is $100 off but only for orders above $2000) that I didn't see until the night after I ordered it, so I'm going to try to call and get that later today.
I have a feeling this is where AMD is going to dominate because they're already more efficient and then you add in the new AMD 7000 CPU/GPU Advantage Laptops that'll get more performance at that same wattage
"thumbs if you liked it, subs if you loved it." Not heard that in a while! Was almost expecting Dave to end it by saying "it's been nice" to go fully old school.
@@homophobesnotwelcomed2308 honestly im mostly looking for something i can do 3D work on, and some light gaming, not sure if that changes anything in this equation
There's also the issue of the huge "3x performance at very low wattage" claims basically using DLSS with frame generation for the FPS numbers, which is a bit misleading as not everyone wants the loss in visual quality that seems to come with FG so far. They're seemingly detuning the raw performance in other applications (decrease in memory bandwidth, CUDA count) while trying to compensate with DLSS for FPS numbers, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are choosing not to enable FG on older RTX models to keep it as the main selling point for Ada. Not to mention that this is all coming with a price hike, and it seems like plenty of previous-gen models with a 3080/3080Ti or RX6800M/6850M XT can be found for a better price than many new models with a 4070 or even a 4060 (looking at you, Razer).
Don't do it!! I got an msi stealth and it was the biggest piece of junk and waste of money in my life. Completely fell apart. I loved msi pc parts, but I will never touch a laptop from them ever again. Save yourself the trouble from my experience!
4:10 Could someone give some examples on what workflows could be dependent on video memory speed and why? I'ma beginning hobby photographer with access to Photoshop and Lightroom so im wondering if this would apply to me. I think I don't this part of the video well enough. Thanks in advance c:
This is coming from a dev, so might not apply much to you especifically: 2 memory problems: -> When you don't have enough to fit everything in the GPU vram (let's say, a really big photo) -> When you're memory is too slow (something that needs to access large amounts of memory fast) AI (machine learning) is a prime example: it needs to fit in the memory to perform well and needs to access a ton of memory (*tons of VRAM and big bus*) Depending on the type of photography that you do, this might affect you, but it is necessay to calculate the exact necessity to be really sure. PS.: What happens when you can't fit the whole thing in the GPU? 1. I might not run or 2. It migh use your RAM (causing degraded performance)
Seems like a naming issue... by that I mean the 4070 should be named the 4060 then there be no issues in fact be a great bargain...... My guess is since now there is xx90 series laptops unlike previous years all the lower chips got their numbers bumped up... It's fine as long the pricing reflects performance but I don't think it will... 4070 will command the xx70 price tag............ It is what it is.............. this also reminded me that the 3070 140w was a fantastic value for laptops last gen... I got x2 both are still beasts for gaming...
Not really seeing the 30 series price drops quite yet as 40 series is only now just trickling out. I imagine the price drops will begin in earnest in mid-March through Spring. Once a 3080 Ti lappy is $500-$1000 cheaper than 4070...that'd be the time to snag.
Anybody else wish they would only make grey or white laptops? Or am I the only one. I wonder if black would be popular if it wasn't the economical choice. Seems like a poll is in order...
People have to remember that the 4070 is actually a "4060". They've just changed the name so they can sell it for more money. The reason why it only has 8GB of VRAM is because it's using their low end silicon. You should compare the performance to the 3060, not the 3070.
I believe, or want to believe, that the RTX 4050 is the second best card in the whole lineup, if not the best, next to the 4090. Seems to have enough performance to blast any game at ultra settings 1080p and hold consistent 60fps without using DLSS. Why is that amazing? Well, think of the past xx50 cards. They where the medium settngs cards in cheap entry level laptops. Now those laptops, for hopefully the same price, enter "the PC experience" realm, where you can enjoy the graphics we PC gamers have a boner for, on an entrie level machine. I'd love to see some 4050 machines paired with intels new 1360U cpu, or any other low wattage cpu. Fat batteries, slim chassies, good cooling, affordable. That's what i hope for 4050 laptops.
What I noticed with 4070 mobile lineup is that there is much starker difference in number of cores compared to 4080, then it was between 3070 and 3080. While between 3070 and 3080, core count difference is 20% (5120 vs 7424), between 4070 and 4080 it is around 60% (4608 vs 7424). 4070 feels more like 3060 replacement then 3070 replacement. In fact, 3080 mobile has 60% more cores than 3060 mobile (3840 vs 7424).
In short, what was originally 3050, 3050Ti, 3060, 3070 and 3080 product categories in mobile GPUs, seems to have been shifted to 4050, 4060, 4070, 4080, 4090. New 4070 is now mid-range, not high end GPU, like old 3070.
On the other hand, there is no anymore real replacement for lower TDP 3070 with 4000 series. Seems like only 4070 fills that gap, since there are no low TDP 4080 models at all.
Personally I feel anything more then a 60 series GPU is overkill for a laptop, with a 50 being my choice. I mean you can pretty much play 1080p max settings on any game these days with one. Better battery, less heat, and lower price too. I understand that there are some workloads that would benefit more from higher end GPUs but most people buying these don't really deal with them.
Then good luck finding a single laptop with a bright 1080p screen with good response times and colors. Most of the time you get the old garbage screens with less than 300nits and the proper screens are all 1440p or above.
@@Lukashoffmann94 True. The only laptops with a 50/60 series card and high end screens tend to be things like the Dell XPS. Not really any good high refresh screen options there.
@2:48 white interior can be a challenge to keep it clean! Even for the "white collars" type of corporatists (the death skin of the fingers, fingerprints, etc, etc)!
im actually happy that u get a gpu with less power and more performance. im very nitpicky in termy of noise so when they restrict power consumptíon by default, their silent modes will actually be silent this time
After knowing your channel for over 6-8 years now. I am completely skipping the RTX 4000s gaming laptop all together and wait for the RTX 5000 in 3 more years. My RTX 3070 msi gp76, with 240hz monitor, 64 GB Ram and 4 tb. It's plenty enough for me. Plus got a benq 27 inch 240hz external monitor for fps eSports (razer huntsman keyboard, 3x razer Viper wireless ultimate v1, Sennheiser drop headset.. etc) . Yah, all that research worth it. Originally the whole budget was for a build of 3090 GPU tower. Sense it was all out stock. Might as well get a balance between portability and home power. Did got a 1 GB download and upload speed wifi. All and all. Thank you Dave 2 D videos for all these years... I respect this man so much!
Holy shi- ! The Studio 16 looks hella sexy, luv the white and gold colour scheme! I currently have the ASUS Zephyrus M16 with i7-12700h and RTX 3060, it's quite loud though (I love silent mode when playing old games). If MSI releases a similar/better looking 16inch studio/thin gaming laptop next GPU gen, I might switch to Team MSI next time I upgrade!
Keeping the keyboard area dark keeps you from needing to have the screen brightness up. White is bright and would need a brighter screen to compensate for that.
My question is if the 'detuning' has helped the battery life for intel/nvidia laptops because it has been quiet convincingly beat by the all-AMD offerings. I will wait and see what AMD have coming and then decide because battery life is important to me for which I wouldn't mind sacrificing 5-10% performance, if I get 30-40+% better battery (from AMD, plus a cheaper laptop too if possible).
Just paid 999€ for a 4060 140w - i5 13500h Victus 16. In the end I think the 4060 is the best deal all around right now. It has the good of 4000 series while performing around old 3070ti, the ram configuration of the 4070 and being priced in the bracket of 4050 laptops (at least here in france). The 4070 cost 50% more (1500€ laptop minimum) while getting between 10 to 15% better framerate...
Eagerly waiting for the 4050 & 4060. These are the more budget friendly, made for the masses products... & NVIDIA refuses to drop them & ensures their delay as much a as they possibly can... It's sad...
Interesting that i found this vid from Dave 1 year later. The interesting thing that's making alot of people lean intho the more recent 40RTX cards is for frame generation and more dedicated graphics.
Here's the take - They all have similar performance, but the 40 Series has better energy efficiency and better dlss. It's not the base performance increase everyone was expecting. But it's still the better card for most uses. The only time the 30 series may win is in older games (with an emphasis on MAY), but this becomes irrelevant to a debate because the 40 series is still smashing older games at 400+ fps anyway. All in all, if you have a 30 series, probably best to wait until the next batch before you upgrade. But if you have something older or nothing at all, the 40 series is a great place to start.
Are these the only stealth MSI's now? I thought there would be a non studio gaming focused stealth 16? Like the new gs66 stealh? Man thats dissappointing.No way these can compete with asus m16 and razer blade 16
just don't buy a stealth, buy a razer or a zephyrus if you want a thin and light gaming laptop no vapour chamber and no liquid metal just means terrible thermal management the temps shown in the video are tipical of a new laptop, it'll be thermal throttling in 2 months this comment was written from a gs66 stealth with a 11th gen i7 and a rtx3070
That MSI dragon logo is so cringe, it's like a mix between an awful tattoo on a cougar's bottom and an off-brand Ferrari logo. Not even mentioning the fact they call it "STEALTH" (in caps) and illuminate the damn thing.
I bought a legion laptop with a 4070 with the 13th gen i9. It comes with a 300watt power adaptor brick, and when hardcore gaming on it drains the battery slowly while plugged in. Didn't notice this until one day I was stuck in a hotel waiting on a flight, and got the low battery alert after like 7 hours of Helldivers 2. Had to turn down my settings to keep playing.
inflation times guys, it just done on purpose, the 4000 series has to fit into their old lineup of the 3000RTX mobile cards, there is a lot of last RTX gen card into the wild they have to sell them, since now, the laptop sales are low compared to the years of economical growth, the margin are not driven by sales numbers but by price, and in inflation times the weird thing is the most expensive stuff has the best value, which an inverse pyramid compared to the old days, what happening in the laptop landscape is the same as the Desktop Nvidia cards, the best value Nvidia 4000 Series card was the 4090, in the laptops the best deals are the 4080 and the 4090 laptops, the 4070/4060/4050 will have worst value than the equivalent sibling from last gen, and the performance on average is in the same ballpark
Different name, not very different performance. Hardware unboxed was so unimpressed they cancelled their review
ouch!
Even Jarrod review say the same
How about the price? I would assume it's different.
shouldn't have cancelled it, should have called Nvidia on who they are - a bunch of scammers. Why not base the laptop 4070 chip on the desktop 4070? Ah yes, because money. Because how many people would buy 4080 laptops if Nvidia kept it honest?
Wait... but Matthew Moniz just said "not that much a diference that last year model, and thats a good thing" when he reviewed razer with 4070... So is not good to pay much more $$$ for same???? Damn Dave...
MSI: "we call this the "STEALTH".
Also MSI: slaps a knockoff Lamborghini logo and RGB LEDs on it
See also: Linus's definition of a "sleeper PC".
Well considering how their non-stealth gaming laptops look this IS stealth 😅
It also also used to be way worse in the gaming laptop bracket, there were many many atrocities that I personally wouldn't of even felt comfortable pulling up with at the local coffee shop. Arguably so the RGB craze is somewhat a good runner up to match those god awful designs
Ferrari crest*
You misused a quotation mark.
The problem with the 4070 at this price its just too expensive for what it is
Correct, it is more like 3060, than 3070 replacement, generation wise.
Bro that’s the case with every 4000 series graphics card
I mean if you want the new 18 inch G18, the 4070 model is "Cheap" for a brand new product with top of the line I9 13980HX and that amazing 18" 1600p 240hz screen
The problem with 4070m is that it's a scam. In 3000 series, 3070m was based on the same chip as desktop 3070.
This time around, 4070m is based on desktop 4060 ti, those are 2 different chips with 4060\4060 ti being largely inferior to 4070.
Thats a feature, not a bug mate. It helps justify the cost of the 4080 when the 4080 is overpriced as well
Glad I just got the Legion 5 Pro 3070. Massive clearance sales increase the price gap a ton between the previous and next gen devices. After seeing benchmarks, it would mean I have to pay 35% more money for 5-10% more performance overall
Can you help me get out of plat? I'm lvl 300 soon I should be at least Ascendant at this point lol
How much did you get it for?
@@Solokid404
The Legion 5 pro 3070 got down to $1100 over Black Friday. 3070 to laptops, which provide the same performance (sometimes better) than the 4070 were down to $1300. Meanwhile 4070 laptops are $2000+. You would genuinely have to be special in the head to buy a 4070 laptop over last gen with that price gap. The only time it's truly better is in DLSS FG but very, very few games support it and even new games coming out aren't certain to.
4070 laptops are over $2,000.
@@KaoruSugimura $1100?! I would have snagged that in a heartbeat 😭
As per Jarrod's tech analysis, Mobile 4070 performs worse than mobile 3070ti.
I love the looks of them and can't wait to try them out! But I think the "stealth" moniker really becomes meaningless when they light up the "stealth" letters...
Should be invisible dark force. Now, we white edition.
This "4070" should really be a 4060, where it would actually be a noticeable performance bump coming from a 3060.
As a 4070, it's a rip-off card for the $ considering you can find 3070ti laptops for $1400 right now easily in the US.
Exactly I got my max wattage 3070ti for 1359$ (MSI ge66). Performance is on par with max wattage 4070..
@@7evive 105W 4070 performs the same as a 3070ti at 150W. The only laptops (with 4070) worth it are the thin and light laptops that can handle the 105W and provide the performance of a 3070ti without thermal issues.
@@bl4ckst0ne Honestly I'm not even too sure about these numbers. Jarrod did 25 games with a 150W 3070ti and a 140W 4070.
The 3070Ti beat the 4070 in over half the games if there was no DLSS or frame generation. That is a much bigger sample size than any of these numbers.
@@bl4ckst0ne It doesn't. Watch Jarod's video for a deeper analysis.
@@fidelisitor8953 oh i forgot...jarod's words are gospel
I found a 3080ti laptop for nearly $1000 off MSRP the day before the 4080 mobile launched. It’s a proper little beast of a gaming laptop and while the new version is a pretty solid improvement, I’m not sure it is worth the nearly $2000 extra dollars it would have cost over the unit I got on sale.
Which laptop 💻?
@@Parichaychatterjee1 razor blade 15.
@@Piketom1 heard razor laptops were bad, how's it holding up 1 year later?
@NovoLuminis Great. It has some of the same downsides as other gaming laptops, runs hot, relatively short battery life, but those are not really fair complaints. It's a solid performer for most titles in 1440P but the graphics card is really starting to show its age.
@@Piketom1 Thanks for answering. My old laptop i7 9750H, GTX 1660ti, also runs quite hot with only 2 hours of battery life. I tilted mine by placing a box at the back, so it's lifted 45 degrees (really does help). I get 140-165 fps on CS2 and 70-150 fps on dayZ, depending on the area im in.
The 4070 laptops should take a big cut in pricing to be worth buying else it's not. There are not many games that support DLSS3 and Frame Generation
literally all the new AAA game supported it what do you mean? Even some old games are starting to update to DLSS3 too.
@@phongphamthanh5911 at least he got more likes so he must be right *irony off*
@@secretsanny That's not how it works. People agree that the cost should be less, not that "Not many games support it" Literally, like LITERALLY, all AAA games support and even some INDIE games support it. Literally search.
1 year later... developers abuse DLSS 3 and frame generation to avoid optimizing their games and call it a day.
How the tables have turned
MSI: The Stealth lineup will be more of a budget option.
MSI in Australia: The 14 inch model with the 4060 will start at $3700.
Yeah, no idea what he is thinking calling it a „budget“ option. MSI has always been absurdly overpriced.
The 4080 variant sits at 5k in Europe, so the 4070 will probably be around 4k which is just stupid.
>live on island thousands of miles from anywhere else
>every single good on the island has to be sent by boat or airplanes
>wonder why everything costs more
>blame the companies because you live on an island
@@CyberneticArgumentCreator you do know all these laptops are manufactured in either Taiwan or China right?
@@CyberneticArgumentCreator That's the same for nearly every country because everything is shipped from China.
@CyberneticArgumentCreator Most things in Australia excepting tech products and cars are made locally. The "island" you're talking about is larger than Western Europe
Also, what country makes literally everything except maybe China?
Always appreciate the concise objectivity and the clean, pleasing colors Dave. Two thumbs up!
Dave spitting facts. No nonsense videos. Love it.
Don't understand why no youtube is acknowledging what's really going on. The 4080 is the 3070 upgrade. And so on. That's why 4090s are in laptops when 3090s weren't. So no they didn't just bump down the 4070 to fit it in smaller computers to sell more...they are lying about which card it's even meant to replace, which is the 3060, not the 3070.
As somebody who has no interest in 4K, I'm kinda interested in the 4070 if I were to ever upgrade my laptop
Man I really appreciate the 60fps. Looks so smoother and crisper than all the 30fps productions here on youtube.
Most TH-camrs use 24 fps because cInEmAtIc
MKBHD is very wrong sticking to 30fps choppy videos, he needs to step up his game too.
@@AliArghavan calm down Steven Spielberg
@@AliArghavanwhy is more frames stepping up? What does that have to do with production value?
@@AliArghavan mkbhd said specifically he like 30fps more. And I understand why. I don't have a preference, but I can see why 60fps video is weird for some people
It’s not confusing. Nvidia simply shifted the stack downward. The 4070 is 3060 equivalent silicon. The 4090 is 3070ti equivalent silicon. The node performance uplift was so huge this generation that they shrank all the dies and named them the next thing up. 4070 is just the weird one where the performance delta is an overlap with the previous gen. That being said, getting more perf at 100W and below is pretty great, as laptop coolers have gotten obnoxiously loud in the RTX generation laptops. I’m waiting to see if the 7940hs/4070 combo in the Razer Blade 14” sees any significant uplift at 100W. Really tempted to pull the trigger on an open box 6900hx/3070ti model since they got upgraded to USB4 on the type-c ports.
I'd wait. 16 GB of RAM is now going to be a limit in modern games, so I'd wait for a 2023 upgrade or just go with another laptop.
@@cameronbosch1213 what games do you play that use more than 10GB RAM, I'm interested to know as I've never seen anything go upwards of that
Ide get the 3070t,i the 4070 will be twice the price and not much better on the gpu
4090 is not 3070ti equivalent
@@4-0-K Some are starting to recommend 32 GB as a minimum (not vRAM).
Loving the longer hair bro 😁
Gotta go full super Saiyan soon
agreed 💯
I looks like the winds blowing behind him
Thought you were kandyrew for a moment
Gay
Finally. I was a bit disappointed how you ignored all the BS that Nvidia did with their notebook GPUs. Even the 3090 and 3080 have been badly named and did not relate to their desktop counterparts at all. Nvidia has been behaving scummier with each generation and they need to be punished by reviewers, buyers, regulators and consumer protection agencies for it.
AMD all the way
i think by now it is well know that a laptop card is equivalent to its desktop variant of the past generation or the next card in line of the desktop series.
eg laptop 4070 is euqal to desktop 4060 or 3070.
laptop 3080 is equal to desktop 3070 or 2080.
Nothing has changed, i dont c why you say they have been names badly. Nvidia has been a bunch of douches that much is true, but the performance and naming of the laptop cards is the least of it. If u ignore the 128 bit bus thing, the lower cuda cores than past generation, the slower memory bandwidth than the old generation, the 8gb of memory in a supposedly high end card, bad prices etc. just ignore the horror show of the specs and look at the bottom line, the user experience, if u just look at the performance in games, its not awesome, but not bad. it is as expected. with a nice discount come next christmass or black friday etc it may even be called a decent deal. The desktop cards are another sad story though.
@@WaaDokuCringe
@@computerscience1101 AMD is still best value for the buck. And AMD CPUs have the advantage of being not as high-powered, hence they are better for portable usage in notebooks. What's cringe about that?
Dave2D always comes in fresh even when the outro is an oldie. ;-)
How is it oldie? More like it's his signature.
@@rollingthunder9769 it's an oldie because like he said, he hasn't said it in a long time. ;-)
@@kyoko703 I see, didn't even realize he rarely do that now. Time sure flies.
@@rollingthunder9769 fo sho!!! 2020 to now has all seem like a gigantic blur.....
@@kyoko703 Yea, struggled so much to get through the pandemic with a long chain of unfortunate events. It gets better this year and so i hope i can find some good memories.
Very curious to see how well the zephyrus g14 will fare this year with NVIDIA gpus
hopefully it's in my budget too 😿
Crazy that I made the perfect decision buying a Legion 5 Pro 2021. The fully powered 3070 in the Legion is more or less on par with devices released two years later.
What a loss, same performance + new technology
White backlit keyboards suck to type on. I support the decision to use a black interior.
MSI laptop hinges are extremely flimsy. My PS42's hinge cracked under very normal, mostly at home use, it's being held together by reinforced aluminum tape... I see that those new devices have a pretty much identical hinge mechanism.
I'm not an expert, but something has always seemed very evident to me in different types of hardware: whenever possible we should avoid buying products that are very close to launches precisely to avoid poor optimization of the technology involved. I've always been a console gamer and never owned a gaming pc or laptop, but now being a Series X owner I'm quite leaning towards buying a laptop with the rtx 4070 because of DLSS3/FG.
Just keep in mind that right now DLSS 3.0 is supported only by a handful of games. Not only that, if you want to play any E-Sports titles, then keep in mind Frame Generatoon causes a quite significant amount of latency, so it's only good for those slower, plot-oriented singleplayer titles. RTX 4070 specifically is good for thin and light gaming/creator notebooks, like new AERO 16 or MSI Stealth lineup, but if you want best bang for a buck, I'd go for a bit chonkier last gen with RTX 3070Ti. Legion lineup was absolutely amazing a year ago!
You bought Xbox ?? 😅😂
@@bugbuster8598 oh yeah. I don't play multi-player titles, so latency is not crucial for me. Otherwise, a 60+fps in ultra settings is definitely something priority to my eyes.
@@boomfestival2023 sim, comprei. Gamepass é incrível.
@@bugbuster8598 Same thing was said about DLSS when it launched and now it's actually a really useful bit of tech to allow your hardware to be relevant longer. You're spot on about the use case for the laptop 4070, though - it's very obviously designed to have lower heat and power to allow itself to be fit into slim and small laptops while still providing a lot of oomph. The 4070 isn't the card to plug into your 4k monitor at home and use as a mobile desktop, but it body slams any previous midrange card at 100W or below.
4070 laptops are a joke. 50% more expensive than a 3070 ti laptop for the same performance.
I have your oldest, and I'm waiting for your newest to come in the mail to replace it. Apart from the spicy pillows MSI used instead of batteries in the GS63, it has been a great laptop. I'm only just now running into games I can't play, and technically, Starfield does play on it, just at very low settings.
Dave - it's been a long time - are you still alive?
I know 4070 pricing is not great but I just wanted a review of the Stealth 14 and this is unfortunately one of the only reviews out there for it right now. Some people want efficiency and I don't mind the 4070 running a bit slower than some 30 series cards if it's more efficient than the 3070. Wish the review of the laptop got more attention than the GPU. There wasn't much talk about the webcam, speakers or the temperature/noise profiles apart from the mention of the vapor chamber - which is significant.
I feel like 4070 is not the same tier as 3070 but it's a good product in its own right. If they can cram 2 RAM slots in a 14" laptop due to the smaller memory bus then so be it, I care more about having more than 24/32GB RAM for work than higher video memory bandwidth.
I need a laptop for work and play both, the Stealth 14 seems perfect for that. Not many 14" laptops out there with 400 nits, 240Hz AND 16:10 - that sounds perfect for my use case. The Intel processor/wifi is also what I prefer over ASUS G14's AMD lineup. Waiting for other people to review the Stealth 14 properly.
I keep thinking there's a grey spec of dust in the middle of my screen whenever I watch a new Dave2D video
If any of you guys live near a micro center, there is an msi pulse 15 with 13700h/4070 for 1700 dollars. Its still expensive of course but thats much more reasonable than 2000+ from the other models. The only trade off is the screen is 1080p, but at that size the ppi is decent and you will be able to use 144hz across a wider variety of games.
3:24 that numpad should be illegal
"Haven't said this phrase in a really long time", I totally cocked my head to the side when you said it, because I hadn't heard it in awhile! Bring it back Dave! Awesome content as always, love your videos. 7 thumbs up!!
Waited for the 4070 vids to start dropping aaaand...last night pulled the trigger on a 3070ti Lenovo Legion with amd 6800h, 16gb, 2tb. Felt good about $1499 price.
Did u use the 30% Cashback?
Hopefully you enjoy it! I have the 2021 17 inch with a 5800h and a 3060, and I am absolutely loving it!
@@dilip_1997 no, where can I find info on that? I did find a $50 "first time buyer" coupon (well,, the max is $100 off but only for orders above $2000) that I didn't see until the night after I ordered it, so I'm going to try to call and get that later today.
@@necrojoe i think it was on the capital one shopping app with lenovo!!!
The music at the end sounded AWESOME. Listening on my iPhone 13 mini in my living room, sounded like surround sound. It made me look behind me.
Name?
Everything okay with you bro?
outwitting customers is the biggest marketing success this time it was a name game
Nice. Got me a 3070 laptop during Christmas sale. So worth
Judging by Dave's hair this video was definitely recorded on a monday... lol 😂
I have a feeling this is where AMD is going to dominate because they're already more efficient and then you add in the new AMD 7000 CPU/GPU Advantage Laptops that'll get more performance at that same wattage
"thumbs if you liked it, subs if you loved it." Not heard that in a while! Was almost expecting Dave to end it by saying "it's been nice" to go fully old school.
Im thinking of replacing my 1080 pc to samsungs 4070 laptop, can you say if it'll be an upgrade in performance and how much?
If you really wanna get a laptop then get a 4080 one, more worth your money
I really hoped to get something in the ekosystem i use, but it might be the wise choice to go 4080
@@homophobesnotwelcomed2308 honestly im mostly looking for something i can do 3D work on, and some light gaming, not sure if that changes anything in this equation
1:35 is best graph I ever seen , awesome content
There's also the issue of the huge "3x performance at very low wattage" claims basically using DLSS with frame generation for the FPS numbers, which is a bit misleading as not everyone wants the loss in visual quality that seems to come with FG so far. They're seemingly detuning the raw performance in other applications (decrease in memory bandwidth, CUDA count) while trying to compensate with DLSS for FPS numbers, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are choosing not to enable FG on older RTX models to keep it as the main selling point for Ada. Not to mention that this is all coming with a price hike, and it seems like plenty of previous-gen models with a 3080/3080Ti or RX6800M/6850M XT can be found for a better price than many new models with a 4070 or even a 4060 (looking at you, Razer).
What?
Thanks!
For the first time, to me, there is more to life than lenovo and Asus. Would love to get that Stealth 16 Studio.
Don't do it!! I got an msi stealth and it was the biggest piece of junk and waste of money in my life. Completely fell apart. I loved msi pc parts, but I will never touch a laptop from them ever again. Save yourself the trouble from my experience!
@@dorrito Thanks for the warning!
Isn't acer decent as well?
You should take a look on new AERO 16 from Gigabyte, then.
Love your videos mate. There’s a reason you have 3.6M subs.
Nice watch btw! Is it a new ga2100 model or some custom mod?
Would also like to know that!!!
@6:10 i think the chart is mislabeled, you probably meant Firestrike Graphics...
4:10 Could someone give some examples on what workflows could be dependent on video memory speed and why? I'ma beginning hobby photographer with access to Photoshop and Lightroom so im wondering if this would apply to me. I think I don't this part of the video well enough. Thanks in advance c:
This is coming from a dev, so might not apply much to you especifically:
2 memory problems:
-> When you don't have enough to fit everything in the GPU vram (let's say, a really big photo)
-> When you're memory is too slow (something that needs to access large amounts of memory fast)
AI (machine learning) is a prime example: it needs to fit in the memory to perform well and needs to access a ton of memory (*tons of VRAM and big bus*)
Depending on the type of photography that you do, this might affect you, but it is necessay to calculate the exact necessity to be really sure.
PS.: What happens when you can't fit the whole thing in the GPU? 1. I might not run or 2. It migh use your RAM (causing degraded performance)
@@tablettablete186I'm a bit late, but thank you for your response! TH-cam didn't notify me of any replies :(
Seems like a naming issue... by that I mean the 4070 should be named the 4060 then there be no issues in fact be a great bargain...... My guess is since now there is xx90 series laptops unlike previous years all the lower chips got their numbers bumped up... It's fine as long the pricing reflects performance but I don't think it will... 4070 will command the xx70 price tag............ It is what it is..............
this also reminded me that the 3070 140w was a fantastic value for laptops last gen... I got x2 both are still beasts for gaming...
Not really seeing the 30 series price drops quite yet as 40 series is only now just trickling out. I imagine the price drops will begin in earnest in mid-March through Spring. Once a 3080 Ti lappy is $500-$1000 cheaper than 4070...that'd be the time to snag.
Wdym?
Looking at the graph at 1:32 it makes me wonder if you can get a high wattage 4060 instead of a 4070, or just step all the way up to a 4080.
Where's Dave????????
Anybody else wish they would only make grey or white laptops? Or am I the only one. I wonder if black would be popular if it wasn't the economical choice. Seems like a poll is in order...
People have to remember that the 4070 is actually a "4060". They've just changed the name so they can sell it for more money. The reason why it only has 8GB of VRAM is because it's using their low end silicon. You should compare the performance to the 3060, not the 3070.
Why? Why they don't make 16:9 anymore?
I hate that 16:10 aspect ratio! So pointless.
Please review the samsung book 3 ultra and how it compares to the dell XPS
Your two second intro is so smooth it’s almost therapeutic
I believe, or want to believe, that the RTX 4050 is the second best card in the whole lineup, if not the best, next to the 4090. Seems to have enough performance to blast any game at ultra settings 1080p and hold consistent 60fps without using DLSS. Why is that amazing? Well, think of the past xx50 cards. They where the medium settngs cards in cheap entry level laptops. Now those laptops, for hopefully the same price, enter "the PC experience" realm, where you can enjoy the graphics we PC gamers have a boner for, on an entrie level machine. I'd love to see some 4050 machines paired with intels new 1360U cpu, or any other low wattage cpu.
Fat batteries, slim chassies, good cooling, affordable. That's what i hope for 4050 laptops.
Some TH-camrs have noticed stuttering issues on 4050 laptops though, I'd be more cautious.
Dave's hair is getting wilder and wilder and I'm not complaining
What I noticed with 4070 mobile lineup is that there is much starker difference in number of cores compared to 4080, then it was between 3070 and 3080.
While between 3070 and 3080, core count difference is 20% (5120 vs 7424), between 4070 and 4080 it is around 60% (4608 vs 7424). 4070 feels more like 3060 replacement then 3070 replacement. In fact, 3080 mobile has 60% more cores than 3060 mobile (3840 vs 7424).
Also RTX 4060 mobile has just 20% more core count than 4050. Feels more like 3050Ti replacement.
In short, what was originally 3050, 3050Ti, 3060, 3070 and 3080 product categories in mobile GPUs, seems to have been shifted to 4050, 4060, 4070, 4080, 4090. New 4070 is now mid-range, not high end GPU, like old 3070.
On the other hand, there is no anymore real replacement for lower TDP 3070 with 4000 series. Seems like only 4070 fills that gap, since there are no low TDP 4080 models at all.
But then, peformance difference between 4050 and lower TDP 4070 is a joke. No more then 30%. While between lower TDP 4070 and 4080 is whooping 50%.
It really feels we are missing lower TDP version of 4080 mobile in the market, as real replacement for lower TDP 3070/3080 for low profile laptops.
Nice video, I came for the info and the geek but... I stayed for those beautiful shots and b-roll. Amazing work man.
Miss you Dave 😢
Personally I feel anything more then a 60 series GPU is overkill for a laptop, with a 50 being my choice. I mean you can pretty much play 1080p max settings on any game these days with one. Better battery, less heat, and lower price too. I understand that there are some workloads that would benefit more from higher end GPUs but most people buying these don't really deal with them.
Then good luck finding a single laptop with a bright 1080p screen with good response times and colors.
Most of the time you get the old garbage screens with less than 300nits and the proper screens are all 1440p or above.
@@Lukashoffmann94 True. The only laptops with a 50/60 series card and high end screens tend to be things like the Dell XPS. Not really any good high refresh screen options there.
Glad to see Dave call out the lack of improvement of rtx 4070
@2:48 white interior can be a challenge to keep it clean! Even for the "white collars" type of corporatists (the death skin of the fingers, fingerprints, etc, etc)!
im actually happy that u get a gpu with less power and more performance. im very nitpicky in termy of noise so when they restrict power consumptíon by default, their silent modes will actually be silent this time
With how easy it is to set fps and power limits, I don't get your point
After knowing your channel for over 6-8 years now. I am completely skipping the RTX 4000s gaming laptop all together and wait for the RTX 5000 in 3 more years. My RTX 3070 msi gp76, with 240hz monitor, 64 GB Ram and 4 tb. It's plenty enough for me. Plus got a benq 27 inch 240hz external monitor for fps eSports (razer huntsman keyboard, 3x razer Viper wireless ultimate v1, Sennheiser drop headset.. etc) . Yah, all that research worth it.
Originally the whole budget was for a build of 3090 GPU tower. Sense it was all out stock. Might as well get a balance between portability and home power. Did got a 1 GB download and upload speed wifi. All and all. Thank you Dave 2 D videos for all these years... I respect this man so much!
Always appreciate how you explain the market position of new products Dave and the relative value compared to previous iterations. Thanks man 👍
Do u know when the stealth 16 studio will be available in stores tho? I really want to purchase this.
Just got a 3080 laptop, kinda think the cost/performance is a tad better. Also boi needs a haircut
Nvidia messed him up so bad that his hair is still recovering.
Holy shi- ! The Studio 16 looks hella sexy, luv the white and gold colour scheme!
I currently have the ASUS Zephyrus M16 with i7-12700h and RTX 3060, it's quite loud though (I love silent mode when playing old games).
If MSI releases a similar/better looking 16inch studio/thin gaming laptop next GPU gen, I might switch to Team MSI next time I upgrade!
Keeping the keyboard area dark keeps you from needing to have the screen brightness up. White is bright and would need a brighter screen to compensate for that.
My question is if the 'detuning' has helped the battery life for intel/nvidia laptops because it has been quiet convincingly beat by the all-AMD offerings. I will wait and see what AMD have coming and then decide because battery life is important to me for which I wouldn't mind sacrificing 5-10% performance, if I get 30-40+% better battery (from AMD, plus a cheaper laptop too if possible).
hey Dave how you doing?
You haven't posted any videos lately so I'm just curious.
MSI proves the importance of logo design.
Just paid 999€ for a 4060 140w - i5 13500h Victus 16. In the end I think the 4060 is the best deal all around right now. It has the good of 4000 series while performing around old 3070ti, the ram configuration of the 4070 and being priced in the bracket of 4050 laptops (at least here in france). The 4070 cost 50% more (1500€ laptop minimum) while getting between 10 to 15% better framerate...
Eagerly waiting for the 4050 & 4060. These are the more budget friendly, made for the masses products... & NVIDIA refuses to drop them & ensures their delay as much a as they possibly can... It's sad...
oh wow, having a big light up rgb "STEALTH" text at the back is very stealthy indeed lol
This is MSI ad!
I'm glad you brought back thumbs if you liked it, subs if you loved it! I think its the coolest and most subtle way to promote your channel. Big fan!
Its a Trap. Its a 4060
your hair is starting to look like the early days of uncle roger
Dave looks like he needs some sleep 😂
Interesting that i found this vid from Dave 1 year later. The interesting thing that's making alot of people lean intho the more recent 40RTX cards is for frame generation and more dedicated graphics.
And yet they aren’t in stock except for razer. Wasn’t the chip shortage over???
Woah woah woah, dave watching you after 6 months, man that hair looks sick on you🤯
Here's the take -
They all have similar performance, but the 40 Series has better energy efficiency and better dlss.
It's not the base performance increase everyone was expecting.
But it's still the better card for most uses.
The only time the 30 series may win is in older games (with an emphasis on MAY), but this becomes irrelevant to a debate because the 40 series is still smashing older games at 400+ fps anyway.
All in all, if you have a 30 series, probably best to wait until the next batch before you upgrade.
But if you have something older or nothing at all, the 40 series is a great place to start.
i have a 1050 ti laptop (lmao) i need an upgrade should i go for 3080ti lap or a 4070 one
@@kurosaki-1GO My opinion go for the 4070. Whilst in select games you might get a few more raw fps with the 3080, you get better dlss with the 4070.
W take
@dave2d, Hope everything is alright? Missing your uploads 🥲
The startding logo for dave 2D is sick. I watched it like 10 times.
Are these the only stealth MSI's now? I thought there would be a non studio gaming focused stealth 16? Like the new gs66 stealh? Man thats dissappointing.No way these can compete with asus m16 and razer blade 16
That saturation change though…i noticed Dave!
No thanks Nvidia. If i wanted 3070 performance i would have bought it last year at a cheaper price
just don't buy a stealth, buy a razer or a zephyrus if you want a thin and light gaming laptop
no vapour chamber and no liquid metal just means terrible thermal management
the temps shown in the video are tipical of a new laptop, it'll be thermal throttling in 2 months
this comment was written from a gs66 stealth with a 11th gen i7 and a rtx3070
Omg I just realized the intro sound effect is amazing I can't stop listening to it
That MSI dragon logo is so cringe, it's like a mix between an awful tattoo on a cougar's bottom and an off-brand Ferrari logo.
Not even mentioning the fact they call it "STEALTH" (in caps) and illuminate the damn thing.
you can turn off the rgb tho
Yeah but the logo is still there and ugly as shit.
Nice. I like the white and black inside. Blue good also.
It's funny that they have the word STEALTH flashing in bright rgb
Uhm…the chart at 6:11 must be wrong? It says Time Spy Graphics 30k points for 4070 but the other two charts state 12k for the 4070? 🤨
I bought a legion laptop with a 4070 with the 13th gen i9. It comes with a 300watt power adaptor brick, and when hardcore gaming on it drains the battery slowly while plugged in. Didn't notice this until one day I was stuck in a hotel waiting on a flight, and got the low battery alert after like 7 hours of Helldivers 2. Had to turn down my settings to keep playing.
inflation times guys, it just done on purpose, the 4000 series has to fit into their old lineup of the 3000RTX mobile cards, there is a lot of last RTX gen card into the wild they have to sell them, since now, the laptop sales are low compared to the years of economical growth, the margin are not driven by sales numbers but by price, and in inflation times the weird thing is the most expensive stuff has the best value, which an inverse pyramid compared to the old days, what happening in the laptop landscape is the same as the Desktop Nvidia cards, the best value Nvidia 4000 Series card was the 4090, in the laptops the best deals are the 4080 and the 4090 laptops, the 4070/4060/4050 will have worst value than the equivalent sibling from last gen, and the performance on average is in the same ballpark