Is Lionel Messi the GOAT? Shaka Hislop vigorously defends his position | Champions League
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- Alejandro Moreno, Adrian Healey, Paul Mariner, Shaka Hislop, Raphael Honigstein and Bradley Wright-Phillips have another iteration of the Lionel Messi/GOAT debate in the wake of his two goals for Barcelona vs. Liverpool in the UEFA Champions League semifinal first leg. Hislop reiterates his argument: that Messi is not the greatest, because he has never won the World Cup (although he is on the shortlist with Pele, Diego Maradona, and Brazilian Ronaldo). The rest of the panel disagrees.
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Welcome to the club Shaka,
Messi now has a world cup. and scored 3 goals in the finals.
Give respect to the G.O.A.T
He hasn't give his answer yet 🤣😅
@@wanfeel144 he has given an answer, he dodged the question and said he didn’t want to answer that question.
Shaka, solute the GOAT please. On top of the World Cup, HE has scored at every stage of the world cups and has contributed 20 goals during World Cup, the highest of all time.
@@GurinderJohal he's a dishonest liar. The worst kind of blabbering fool.
WE ARE HERE!!!!!!!!
We jokingly say that ligue 1 is farmers league but Pele actually played against farmers
Lmaooo for real
well said
Literally. He scored half his "1000+" goals vs. amateurs. Farmers, cooks, toilet cleaners, ..... literally. AND he was never top scorer in any World Cup he won. He had ALWAYS been outscored by a shit load too. Like Gerd Müller's 10 goals vs. Pele's 4. Or like Pele's 1 goal in 2 of the World Cups he won. Literally 1 goal each World Cup. LMAO
It’s an unpopular opinion but I completely agree
His 1000 goals are not even documented.. Probably scored 400-500
In that case Giroud is better than Lewandowski and Suarez
Flawed reasoning right there. Shaka stated that messi has consistently under-performed against tougher opposition in the world cup. Hence the reason why he wouldn't put Messi in the 🐐 conversation.
thats NOT what shaka said. he isn't comparing the passengers to the drivers. messi pele maradona r9 cruyff zidane et al were all drivers; giroud kleberson et al are passengers. shaka is comparing drivers who have lead their teams to win it vs those who haven't. its really not rocket science. you guys are just picking out the most ridiculous and convenient rebuttal. shaka even mentioned the names he was comparing. his point is, if you have that ability lead your team, even when you are not favorites. cos at club level, more often than not barcelona are always favorites, but when the games are even like with argentina.......alas. shaka never compared the likes of giroud or just any jabroni who was fortunate to win thanks to being on a team with goat type players, to messi. he NEVER made such comparison. think think
Did Giroud let France win?
@@mainakiungua h
messi got his onw chancesin that final and missed too. People like to give excuses for him. Hes a beast ad best in the world yes but dont give excuse when he flops. Like the last word cup the stupid argentine coach was saying the entire team were making messi look bad. and the funniest thing is that messi himself was not spectacular and even missed penalty in the group stages.
Who's watching this after Argentina won the Copa America 😂
He said WC tho?
@@HAL--gb6uf pendu fan alert!
He was just saying who are watching after copa.
@@HAL--gb6uf Pele or Maradona did not win the copa America
@@godwinbernard9568 you gotta be kidding me. I saw the copa finals and Brazil's team had maybe 2 or 3 players. If arg were in euros , I don't think they would have any chance. 😏
@@HAL--gb6uf lol Remember all this copa teams who qualify for wc almost everone goes to quarters and semi s
Mustafi is better then VVD cuz he has a WC. Try changing my mind.
😱😱😭😭
He stepped up his game on the biggest stage. No goals given in the WC Final! Obviously one of the best defenders to ever play the game.
MMA Sports Master The final he didn’t play in!
No reason to try changing your mind cause Mustafi is better then any player you can name.
Mustafi is the goat not Messi or Ronaldo or anyone from the older generation 😂
It’s done and dusted. Messi has ended the goat debate
What has happened in the last month
@@brusselseastside3546 idk he just happened to have won the copa america.
And now World Cup!!😍
Mr. Shaka Hislop is in a conversation about individuality, but all he talks about is squad accomplishments! Why?
Who tf has accomplished something individualy w/o the Support of a great squard
Do you Really believe Messi would have been that succesful if he was playing for fc cologne etc.
ATM TM yes you idiot. He is god
Neymar, until last season, Suarez are in the same team but they can't perform as Messi did. Team is important but individual skill is the foundation of one's success.
Well if he is the GOAT then surely he should be winning games single handedly like maradona did. And dont say that argentina are a shitty team coz theyre not. He should be capable of winning a world cup with that team if he was truly the GOAT. In 2014 they had the most solid defence in the comp, it was actually their attack that was struggling. All it would have taken was a moment of brilliance from messi and they woulda won it. But it just never happened. Sigh...
@@Huss_3 wait what first if Maradona carried argentina like people say then it would have been a case that those other players didn't do their jobs and 8f they won a game it was a case of Maradona being the player to defend and pass to himself and score all the goal if they won it and got to the final don't you think that everyone on the pitch was doing their job and Maradona was doing a little more to get them goals and assists. The world cup is not a competition for one mean teams pof everybody isn't working you will win nothing. Simple and that Argentina team isn't as good as people say having all the attackers has done nothing for them and the defence in the last world cup was actually really bad and you can't deny that. If they wanted to win it they should have brought in a good manager who can get the most out of the players but sadly the last two just couldn't. And in 2014 messi actually played really good but in the final that is the hardest game so you really expect him not to play a team game when he has also relied on his team mates to get that far you don't win the golden ball and not be a good player at least and if higuain the striker had scored the conversation may have been so different
If Messi was born in France or Germnay he would be the goat?? Strange way of thinking
If he wouldve played with Spain instead of Germany
Maradona waz born in argentina n he still won. No one gave Argentina a chance untill they played uruguay in 1986 yet maradona won it unlike messi who despite having better squad didnt manage.
Omar Riyami if Messi played with a better Argentina squad he obviously would’ve won so Maradona’s squad was obviously better than Messi’s can we not think about that?
@@niccofn8895 Argentina's 1986 squad was worse than messi's squad. Problem is that Argentina's squad of 1986 had an exceptional leader n the GOAT, unlike the present squad.
@@omarriyami2923 hahahahahahahahahshahshahshshshshshshhahahahahahahahahah🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Lmao mario gotze is so much better than messi because he scored in the wc final...
🤣🤣🤣
Mario Gotze isn’t in anyone’s GOAT shortlist tho
@@YoogiNation it is in Shaka by his arguments tho hahaha
adriana g Strawmans argument you know that’s not what he’s saying
@Pappy Tron this kid was 2 years good not great thats all stop it hes not even in the top 500 in the world 🤣
Shaka argument is defination of donkey. Its a argument so there will always be for & against and fellow like shagga need something to munch in tv
he was GL
Regardless of Shaka's opinion, it will always have people saying otherwise.
And they should but when all said and done nobody in the history of this sports has a person influence the team like messi has. For a decade.
If Messi is not better than Pele as he has not won a WC, then Giroud or Griezmann is better than Eusebio or Platini.
Neither did Cryuff win it. Individual skill varies a lot than 'Team game'.
@Pedro Guedes do you want to put it in double quotes?
@Pedro Guedes I get it. Are you an octogenarian?
Giroud & Griezman are not 1 of the great players of all time....
@brasileiros Silva are you good. R9 played with Ronaldinho, rivaldo, kaka, and Roberto Carlos. That is too good
Champions league is higher standard because teams can build super squads instead of getting lucky with players
Exact, You are Smart.
Haha .amazing but true.
Champions League is way better. WC has more kudos, which makes it bigger than the CL. Quality wise: no comparison.
yeah, lucky, brasil has been lucky pretty throughout the years
If its higher then messi should have no problem then
Even 11 year old Ronaldo fan boys has a better argument than this 🤦🏼♂️
Wasp this guy is a fool
Most prestigious tournament: World Cup
Highest level of football: Champions League
By your own logic Ronaldo is better because he has more goals in UCL and won more UCL's than Messi lol.
Advenco He has more goals but you aren’t evaluating their ability solely on champions league goals
Leirs Deirs so what are you evaluating their ability on? You mentioned UCL, so elaborate on that.
@@advenco344 I wouldn't mind that arguement at all considering messi has 2 years on him, and waaaay more assists aswell, atleast that arguement gives credit to ronnie too
@@advenco344 ronaldo has more goals because he played more games. Messi has a better goal scoring ratio. Who's better now ?
so if Higuain or Aguero had scored their chances against Germany in the final then suddenly Messi is the GOAT, but because his teammates did not then he isn't. Great argument...
Aahh pls u guys. U blame Argentina's flaws on everybody else but Messi?
If he was the greatest of all time, he would have single-handedly made a difference - like Maradona did, like Pele, Ronaldo.
No way Messi was better than those
Not aguero, more like higuain.
Messi also missed 2 chances
Messi missed a ton of chances too
@Alan James, I have liked your comment, but the point is we simply cannot endorse this mentality whereby Messi gets lauded when he plays well but never criticised when he plays badly.
Just take the last world cup. He did not play well. When that is mentioned, everybody coils into "if it weren't for Messi, Argentina would not have been at the world cup."
While that may be true, the point is he didn't have the best tournament - period.
Let's say it like it is.
Highest level every single year > 1 month competition every 4 years
*1 month
@@adicrossover7744 3 months because 3 world cups. Simple Math.
@@ElPadrino71 but its not 3 world cups every 4 years. And messi has played 4 and not 3
@@adicrossover7744 he's referring to Pele
@@ElPadrino71 By your logic the comment doesnt make sense its not 3 months every 4 years. Its 1 month every 4 years.
Why do they forget that Argentina made it to the final in 2014 and messi singe handedly brought them to the world cup last year.
Because selective memory is sensational medias best weapon.
Well said bro
Yeah singlehandedly with 0 goals in the knockout rounds and completely disappearing in the final lol
@@ElAzul57 Read it again, carefully this time.
He can get a participation trophy but he ain’t getting any World Cup trophy for that.
Shaka is just jealous of Messi. Best team wins the WC not the best player.Argentina is not anywhere near being the 'best team'
They treat football as if it was Tennis. It is a team sport and no matter how good an individual is, all will be for nothing if the collective was not up to par. Lots of big personalities in the game have echoed this same point including Ronaldo and Lionel, but some people never use their brains...Pele had a golden team around him and in fact a lot of old people claim that Garrincha was a better player than Pele. The point is, Pele was surrounded by Champions just like Ronaldo was with the likes of Rivaldo, Ronaldinho..just like Zidane...etc.
U do realise tht maradona won the World Cup with the most average Argentina team ever.Yet messi plays with class players like agureo,dybala,mascherano
It's a mystery.
Barca without Messi is Zero.
But Argentina with Messi is zero
Alain Fegone idiot they all don’t play as a team. It’s all drama
@@alainfegone639 sadly masche is old now and all the rest players are attacking ones-dybala,agureo,icardi,higuain(somewhat). Without any solid midfield and defense
Nothing Messi has done for Argentina- Shaka
2021- Messi has done it for Argentina 28 years later for them
Copa is not proper international football anymore
@@wbcs785 LMFAO OMG BRO STOP
@@wbcs785 but nations league is right?😭just face the fact messi is far gone clear as the goat ain't even a debate no more
Not just Messi he can't do it alone, that victory belongs to single one of the argentinians who played in that tournament. And the coach ofcourse, but Messi was a big part of it indeed...
@@wbcs785 Ahem ahem
So according to Shaka's philosophy , Giroud is better than Messi because he won a world cup ? Really bro ?
Hahaha
Lol🤣🤣🤣
Shaka is a set up to hate on Messi
He made a shortlist of the best players and the diffrence was winning the world cup
@@MarioGarcia-px8xi yes but his logic is flawed, no other player in history did the things Messi does as an individual player for so long in professional competition. This is why to me Messi is the greatest footballer in history so far.
Take away everyones trophies and accolades and just watch them play and tell me who is the greatest, thats the question at the end of the day, just who plays the game better? and the answer is Messi.
Totally agree with you mate. In the sense, I would put Ronaldinho as the best player.
BucketsBasketball winning is what makes it a game.. if there’s no trophies and accolades then it’s just an activity, no one plays football just to play, we want to win while playing.. Messi might be the greatest at what he does on the ball, but the greatest to ever play the GAME, where winning is involved can come down to a lot of players.. For me personally i think it’s Cr7 because of his champions league records which i think is the highest quality in football
@@alidemiri5208 While I agree with you, Messi has won four champions league titles and could tie Ronaldo for 5 this season. So saying Cr7 is the best to play the game has little substance when Messi has almost matched in terms of goals scored and assists and titles won.
Jafrul Islam Messi didn’t even feature in the match day squad when they won in 2006.. he was a young bull and barely played, you had Ronaldinho and eto’o win that champions league.. also Ronaldo has the most goals in ucl finals, semi finals, quarter finals, knockout rounds in general.. the list goes on.. he’s the king of Europe, Messi’s the goat too don’t get me wrong but Ronaldo’s more clutch when it comes to champions league
@@alidemiri5208 Well since we've agreed that Messi is the goat, there is no reason to argue. I'm no Messi fanboy either but seeing the way he plays with the ball is just freakish to say the least. But i do I agree with you in recent times, Ronaldo has been clutch in the CL. Especially since 2014. Take his goals out of Real Madrid's run to the title each year, they would be no where near to it at all. Even Messi in 2015 when Barca won it, it was the contribution of MSN that got them the trophy.
2002 Brazil was the Golden State Warriors with Ronaldo,Ronaldinho and Rivaldo
Dont forget Cafu,Carlos,Lucio the list going on
And kaka
Exactly
Brazil have had the best international teams
i think Kaka was only on the bench but whatever 4 Ballon Dor Winners thats sick
Kaka played for a few minutes against Costa Rica but other then that, yes he was on the bench throughout that tournament...
Here after Messi wins the World Cup ❤
U put messi on those brazil team he would win it too
Absolutely
@TheRealist 811 Name me one player from that team without googling it. It's so funny to read comments from people who want to play experts but have actually no idea what they're talking about...
TheRealist 811 then messi dragged Argentina to 3 finals in 4 or 3 years so sad that his team contained likes of higuain
Better still, put Pele on those Argentina teams that Messi was in, Argentina would be counting at least 2 more WCup wins
@@ugawinner7731 put pele on argentina team on 2014 and argentina would dreaming to get qualified in wc
Shaka shoud go to psychologist. And check his thinking process
U should go.
Messi is not even top 3.
He's a complete failure with his national team.
the national team who refused to pay for his medical expenses but barca did..lmao
@@michaeltrumph121 without winning worldcup he is considered as goat then how much better is he than the other winners.there are many worldcup winners klose is leading worldcup goalscorer he is not in the picture for goat.
@@saishashank4397
Klose was just a benchwarmer in most matches in 2014, not the reason they won the WC.
ever since xavi left, he's choked. he'd choke at the premier league where every single match has crazy intensity. instead he plays in his safe farmer league
How does Shaka sleep at night? With his delusional argument lmao
I don't understand. I mean he says Messi doesn't do anything for Argentina. He literally single handedly brought them to the WC last year. Argentina are currently the worst team in the world. If he had half decent players he'd have something
@@contact5235 calm the fuck down. argentina are mediocre but to call them the worst is delusional even for messi fanboys. they still have world class strikers which most other teams with bad midfields and defences don't. but yes, it's not good enough to win a world cup
@@contact5235 Argentina are the worst team in the world? What the fuck are you smoking?
@@b3rg059 They are terrible right now. Terrible players (all the good ones are old/retired for Argentina), overall a squad that just isn't worthy. Sure they aren't the worst national team worldwide, but amongst the worst supposed better teams.
@@contact5235 Winning a trophy on club level or international level requires the perfect team. Doing things week in week out, constantly providing mind boggling stats (goals, assists, chances, free kick). You wouldn't find any individual near him as in personal level of performance for last 10-15 years.
This has aged well.. the debate is over. Messi is the greatest to ever live after Copa America.
Well if him lifting a international trophy means he is the GOAT then Pele, Maradona, Ronaldo (Portuguese) and many others are GOATS aswell
@@joshuarackal 6 Ballon D'Or 🤔🤔🤔
@@osastech6956 I have a question is Modric better than Xavi and Iniesta cause of his Ballon Dor?
@@joshuarackal exactly
This shakakakakka's point doesnt even make sense.
@@joshuarackal That is just 1 ballondor right? We are talking about 6 of em. 6 golden boot as well. A worldcup golden ball too. Thats enough to ne named the goat
It's interesting to see how many people think it legitimate to summarize an entire player's career to 21 games over the past 15 years.
This is my flaw with Shaka's theory. In a World Cup you play 3 group games, followed by Second Round, Quarters, Semis then a final. That's 7 games in a whole tournament. A tournament that happens every 4 years.
@@MrGlostuber Shaka is just stupid as hell
@@MrGlostuber But It's the WC. The greatest tournament, the most prestigious. If you are the GOAT, you will play the best football you've ever played at the WC. The same way a Maradona would or a Pele. Quit making excuses .
@@ImGonnaGoHomeNow Teams want to play their best every game whether that's for club or country, in the end they're all human and can't always perform. Football is a team game, Messi can't do it all himself, Argentina are a mess, they don't seem to have chemistry.
@@ImGonnaGoHomeNow this is not magical fairytale land where your best comes out and you become a superhero when needed you spastic. Maradona had a great team that PERFORMED, Pele had a great team that PERFORMED. Stop being a sheep and listening to people saying dona and pele carried their respective teams, that has ALWAYS been utter nonsense. And keep cokehead and the farmer slayer out of the GOAT argument dont disrespect Messi like that
So Shaka is saying if Messi was born in France or Germany he would be the GOAT lmao
Gavin Odem literally. So stupid.
Ik rite such a stupid logic
Argentina has had a better squad line up than Germany and arguably France. Maybe on par with France. The only time Messi(outside of Barcelona) has had to prove his worth and win something, he's flopped. If he carries Barça, he should carry Argentina as well.
Cuthbert Ojong Yep a golden ball in the World Cup on a team that played Macherano as their best cb at 33 was definitely up to par with France and MILES better then a full strength Germany. Smh
@@Cuthbert237 It's a team sport you melt, you try to carry a team and get motivated to play for a country where the entire media shit on you for not carrying a team with the likes of Aguero, Di Maria and Dybala to the World Cup finals every year just because you can do it with a Club that adores you and backs you even on your worst nights. Also the World Cup is a knockout tournament with 1 leg. All it takes is a bad night to derail a career by your logic. Messi's LaLiga success is about being consistently brilliant. Not some luck heavy tournament held once every 4 years. Atleast the Champions League is held once a year so it also is based on consistent brilliance not "one tournament wonder"ing like Gotze did. Pele is great, but I and about more than half of football fans don't agree the World Cup is the most prestigious trophy to be won in football and isn't required to be named the greatest ever.
1) Messi is the GOAT!
2) Shaka is a clown
How can he be the GOAT when Ronaldo has more international trophies and champions league and mor goals in Champions league and world cup. Also proven in 3 different leagues. The most complete player with
Strength
Speed
Headers
Shooting
Skills
Defending
Penalties
Finishing.
Champions legaue history of fc barcelona: 5
Ronaldo alone: 5
@@ahrlj24 Don't argue with messi fans...They are delusional
CR7 is the true GOAT. Dude has won everything for his club and has silverware for his country. Unlike Messi he's a leader and respects his country's jersey. CR7 >>>Messi. Can't change my mind.
Hahaha salty Ronaldo fan boys. Cristiano Ronaldo is not even in the debate 😂😂😂
Please Shaka , just say:" I am stupid, I am going home."
@@ArgentineFootballfan1978 why?because he is under maradona's shadow in Argentina?
sohel bashar no because Barcelona and the Spain national team have similar playing styles and he knows more players in the Spain national team because there are a lot of Barcelona players there therefore better chemistry in the team
He is an idiot
Unfortunately Shaka has made his bed and been silly enough to do it on TV in front of millions watching..he has no choice but to lay in it now, he knows he’s wrong but also knows admitting it in front of millions watching will make him look even more stupid..pride has kicked in and face saving is on auto pilot..smh!
@@ArgentineFootballfan1978 What's wrong with playing for Argentina? And if he played for Spain , what about if he played for Ac Milan ? And not Barcelona?
Cristiano Ronaldo is my favorite player, yet I really like Messi and believe he is the GOAT and I’m always in awe when I watch him
Respect !
Respect..
you have a real football brain there sir and not letting favoritism cloud your judgment..kudos to you sir
I am in awe when both played, like Ronaldo against Atletico, just amazed by ronaldo
RONaldo is better than pessi
Shaka? Mentally not okay!!! Messi has nothing done for Argentina? Well, he has won 2005 youth word-cup, 2008 Olympic gold, 4 times runner-up in Copa America & runner-up in 2014 World-cup, golden boot in world cup.
A B top scorer for Argentina and won player of the tournament in 2014 as well
He has to play WC till his lifetime to reach the number of goals ronaldo or klose scored in WC. According to your arguments, when Argentina reach Final it's messi carried them and when they get knocked out it's Football is a team game. Really a shitty logic just the shitty fans of course shittiest alien.
@@abdullahalmamun5985 Do you agree that in the world cup, as the team progress, their opponents get better???
2 is not a winner 3 nobody remembers
@@abdullahalmamun5985 Messi was their best player in the 2014 WC, scoring the most goals and being named the player of the tournament and yes that means he carried them because nobody besides him and mascherano had a good tournament, but there's only so much one player can do and that was shown during the final where they failed to win .
If Higuain had scored Messi would have been the greatest of all time.
Yeah stupid higuain. And stupid manager for putting higuain in instead of aguero
Messi missed a 1v1 too.
@@hellowalkman4506 when?
@@hellowalkman4506 do you know what 1 vs 1 is?
@@hellowalkman4506 when was this lmao? must of watched the wrong WC final
Who is here after Messi wins the Qatar World Cup? Congrats Messi. You are the GOAT now.
Wait wait wait if Messi is the best club player wouldn't that mean that Maradona and Pele are just the best National team players. Okay cool. So why is that any different from club play.
MIND BLOWN!!!!!
Good analogy never thought of that👏👏
Zidane won 1998 and put France 2006 into the final .... we all know they lose because of the b*** Materazzi
@@lapulga8555 Lol no doubt Zidane is one of the greatest players but he has only himself to blame for losing his cool as a captain.
An also if u compare pele games played for is career to the world. Its less than 1 %. So how can u judge him off world cup alone
Yeah but did Pele win Trebles or play in the UCL? I wonder if the football back then was of this intensity even? I feel like Messi is producing in a much much difficult era compared to what pele has done in.
Pele era had no offside back then. (Don't know if true)
Football was best in brazil back then
Ahahahhahaha Pele won the World Cup at age 16. How many world cups has he won? And don t you mention the Olympics!
Sacha R world cup or winning any football tournament is a team effort. Its not a bowling tournament. You judge a team on trophies, and a player on his performances, records, stats, skill and ability. Based on your illogical logic Dembele and Umtiti are better players on barcelona much younger and with a world cup. Grab some brains asap. Pls.
@@doomsdayknight2229 Ahahahahhahahahhaa. Ok here is to your "superior logic"
1. He is autistic ( meaning he is smarter than any average person)
2. He has ONLY PLAYED FOR BARCELONA and Argentina. Meaning that if he cannot play anywhere else.
3. He has never won Any serious tittle with Argentina.
4. And these average french footballers that you mentioned ADMIT that Messi is greater than them. THEY ALL KNOW IT.
5. I wasn t comparing Messi to them but to Pele who by the way won 2 World Cups.
6. I get it that you love Messi and so do I but he is not the GOAT. He is the best of our generation period.
Well Mbappe and Griezman are better than Messi then. What a fool.
Paul Mutuku i know Pavard is twice the player messi is
It kills him to see Messi have a average of 43 goals let alone his assists for the past 14 years since he debuted.
Yes they delivered wen it mattered did your shit messi deliver
edwin terence wabushi Hahaha go back to Africa and play in the forrest, this football game is not for your brain to handle
Sorry bro your DNA reflects your stupidity mutuku
Shaka you got your medical dosage wrong again
If Messi scored 2000 goals but was from north macedonia I guess he would just be trash lol
@Aru Sub I know that I am just stating how stupid they are
I think the real debate here is if Shaka is the greatest clown of all time.
Aditya Mankare 😂 yes he is
True that 😂😂
GOAT Comment
World cup trophy, champions league trophy and every trophy there is , they are team achievements. U can't take that as a measure of how great a single player is.
Well then he still falls way behind Pele because he scored 1000+ goals
Jackson james He played in WC final and A Copa America final. With very talented strikers midfielders etc. He is no GOAT
@@colindesal7936 no he dosent bleacherreport.com/articles/1099349-top-5-things-pele-does-not-want-you-to-know#slide1
@@hopegaming867 except they don't perform that well in Argentina shirt. Also messi does not receive that much passes when he plays with Argentina. Still he remains the top scorer of Argentina and Golden ball winner so .........
@@hopegaming867 dude u didn't get what I was trying to say. I was saying that u should not take trophies as a single players measure. When talking about the GOAT of football, we should consider individual achievements. Not team achievements like trophies.
shaka's a flat earther, confirmed.
koko P. Hah cheers. 👏🏻
Who got this after messi won the copa america 😉
"Mario gotze is better than Messi because he scored in the WC final 2014 " ~Shaka logic
Basically!!! THANK YOU!!!!!
Stupid logic. Smh
And you play in the world cup every 4 years. League play and champions league is every year.
If messi is great y he doesnt leave barca and play for other teams to prove his greatness. He is worried that he will be good player and will lose the tag of best player
@@arshadmukadam7852....he love football first not money.... and there is a thing called "LOYALTY" which you know nothing about....... Legends like totti stayed in the same club too.....
Plus he doesn't need to change club to prove he is the GOAT....his consistency and performance week in and week out is enough......
I could go on and on but you already made up your mind ...so what's the point?
Pau Tonsing Messi even won the player of the tournament that WC
@@pautonsing4129 ✌ yeah right
So mbappe is the goat because he won the world cup. Ok.
Most retarded argument of 2019? Yes. The point isn't winning the World Cup makes you the best, it's that you would expect the greatest of all time in any sport to have won and performed in the competition of highest prestige. Messi hasn't scored a knockout stage goal in a World Cup. Di Maria dragged Argentina to the final and Messi missed a one on one.
@@antoniosvasilellisneto379 The biggest competition in football isn't the world cup though. It hasn't been since a a long time now. The Champions League is the pinnacle of football. The most competitive football is not being played at the world cup but at the top 4 leagues in Europe and in the Champions League. The world cup has just become a cash cow for FIFA and the host countries to revitalize tourism in their country. How can you consider the World Cup to be the top competition when the best players come to play at it after playing 60 games a season, playing every 3 days week in week out? That is ridiculous to be honest. Football has become very similar to Basketball in that the top competition is not the FIBA world cup, it is the NBA.
Edit: I also wanted to add that the World Cup is a competition played once every four years. How can such a competition be used to measure the consistency and achievements of one's career?
or maybe Liorise?! XD
Shut up Neymar go dive into that Kid shadow
comparing team achievements in a team sport is just plain stupid.. nobody ever is going to carry a team by himself
Shaka must dread the days he shows up to defend his ridiculous position
He listing facts though, where's your emotional argument
Sean Houlker weirdo
Been waiting for years to revisit this video! Messi never needed a WC to solidify his legacy so his argument never held water. Shaka, eat a humble pie and go sulk in the corner.
😄
Maybe Messi scored against a team he supports. Shaka low key knows Messi is the GOAT he just don't want to admit it on TV.
I honestly think Shaka thinks he is making a legitimate argument.
This moron looks at being the GOAT as some superficial bullshit that revolves around trophies rather than the players skill.
Why is Messi a goat ? Because he scored 2 goals against Liverpool does not make him a goat. Fact!
@@benban8055 look at his career achievements...Not just 2 goals or a single tournament
@@benban8055 clearly it's not the Liverpool goals being discussed. Don't be stupid.
@@curtisprince1980 Who said the Liverpool goals is what is being discussed? Are you confused ? I think you are.
According to Shaka I guess Mustafi is better than Messi...He has a World Cup 🏟
izzojunior he’s basically saying jf Messi was born in france, germnay, brazil etc he’d be the goat
You have to be a major influence in the win, you can’t just be a part of the team
@@afshara100 still it means griezzmann is better than him then?
Class on Bread I don’t think griezmann had the biggest influence on the team, so no. Mbappe at age 19 however was very impressive, and there’s an argument there in terms of international effectiveness, but not club effectiveness. You have to have both.
Clearly you're too stupid to understand nuance
The word cup is not the highest level. Liverpool and Barca would beat france and croatia everyone knows that
That's why the world cup is harder...you're not allowed to poach players....dumbass.
*face palm*
@@jr3624 the teammates you get are completely by chance, with clubs every player gets an even chance to succeed
Jr Morales tell that to Qatar lol
Lucas what are you smoking??? Varane, Umtiti, pogba, Kante, fekir, dembele, Mbappe, Griezman, are all top 5 in their position in the world, they beat Lpool and Barca
I'm surprised that Zinedine Zidanes name hasn't been mentioned in this list of greats, having won both the Champions League with Real Madrid, and the World Cup with France.
both teams were powerhouses, one team had the galaticos (perhaps one of the most stacked and op team) and the other is France (a nation that is among the best footballing countries).Zidane was a play-maker and dribbler but was a weak goal-scorer, thus making him less of a full-rounded player. but still Zidane is amongst the top 5 greatest footballers of all-time
You idiot we are not counting trophies here !!!
@@johnmateo9951 peles team didn't even needed him
@Niranjan Rajesh zizou is the only one who lead his team to a WC FINAL at 36, ur probably 10
@@johnmateo9951 but Argentina is among one of the best national teams in the Rolf an a giant but he was unlucky to not have the squads that Maradona had
In 1962 Brazil won the World Cup with pele only playing 2 games so they didn’t need him that much
Tom Wellings exactly my thoughts. Those three world cups that Brazil won, they had a stacked team. Amazing players in every position. Pele just happened to be there. Garrincha played in Pele's time for Brazil as well. And many of the players that played there say he was just as good if not better than Pele. Pele is astronomically overrated.
You talk like you have seen pele play, most of his career wasnt even televised. you cant compare watching clips of pele games to watch players like ronaldo or messi week in week out. For over 10+ years.
Maradona is easily the best ever.. Loads of his games are on TH-cam if you've not seen him... He could do everything messi could... And remember football favoured defenders back then..
@@54dbruno
You said:
*"He (Maradona) could do everything Messi could..."*
Maradona: *344 goals* in his entire career.
Messi: *600 goals* for Barcelona (not counting Argentina) and he's yet to retire or even slow down.
TRY AGAIN.
@@solraclegnar4270
You mean Didi, Vava, Gerson, Jairzinho, Clodoaldo etc. These were also some of the best players of that era so it's a no wonder.
Shaka is the skip Bayless of soccer
Young Cabbage couldn’t have said it better
Skip is a billion times smarter than Shaka.
ElGallo skip is only smart to dumb people
*football
Football
I am here today after Messi won the Copa America today. if Shaka Hilop still thinks WC is gonna defined the GOAT. You should stop coming to ESPN.
Shaka talking rubbish. Best player is an individual achievement. The World Cup has nothing to do with it. Messi is by far the best player ever producing the same form for over 10 years still making the best defenders fall on their arse whilst scoring over 40 goals a season.
I agree that Messi's consistency and longevity is to be noted and in a side by side comparison it looks more impressive. But, the reality is that you cannot compare these players with amazing talents and abilities across different eras.
Messi has the greatest highlight reel I've ever seen. But that's because we live in an era where we can see almost everything he does and watch countless hours of his highlights. We have some highlights of Maradonna and Pele but it just doesn't compare.
We also live in an era where health diet and fitness are down to a science. Who knows what Pele would have done now given the science and research that goes into top level athletic performance.
So all Shaka is saying is the only thing we can use to compare them, is what i call mental grit and toughness that comes with the pressure a World Cup. Because that pressure is consistent across the eras.
-- They player doesn't have clubmates that know their play.
---The hopes and dreams of an entire country on your back.
--If you lose a game you go home.
Some players rise to the occasion and take their play to new levels.. some play their normal game and some players dont measure up.
Shaka did not make up those stats.
He has played 756 minutes in World Cup knockout matches since 2006, but has failed to score a single goal.
He has scored 50% of his World Cup goals against Nigeria (three of six) the rest against Iraq and some other low ranked teams.
Remember we are talking about the greatest player to ever play the game.
@@N8N-Soccer seems a little bit over complicated to me in what is after all a simple game. Just looking at what Messi does with a football in all situations for 10 years against the best defenders in the world makes him the best player ever.
Also in todays football most of the top teams in Europe are better than most of the Countries playing in the World Cup which wasn't always the case.
Deo1 The overall quality of play though is better as well. Defenders are better in every way. The tactics are better in every way. If you want to apply better health and diets then you need to acknowledge the fact that Messi is playing against people with the same benefits, just like pele was playing against players with the same disadvantages.
Abderian, great point.. And let me clarify I do think Messi is in the discussion for the greatest. However, consider that the one thing that underscores just how great he is his LONGEVITY and CONSISTENCY. It’s what everyone points to as what separates him from other greats. ie. playing the game at a top leveI for over a decade.
To reiterate my earlier point..that is based almost purely on science and differing approaches to when Pele played to now.
Health and fitness and understanding recovery techniques and rehab; hydration; fatigue - you name it. These players these days are treated like an F1 race car for good reason. They train with electronic monitors for Christ sake.
They train /play on pristine pitches. .
Their gear is custom designed per player.
Everything is set so Messi will never break and yet he still does because he is still part human.
All of this contributes to his amazing talent staying with us for so long.
Having said that, please research Pele and what he had to endure during his time. From the pitches to gear to abuse on and off the pitch..And still he also played for a long time.
splodge 57, I am not anti- Messi in any way, I’m fact my comments aren’t necessarily to say he’s not the greatest.
They were in defense of Shaka’s opinion. You had made some comments that what he said was “rubbish” and that basically Messi was way above the rest.
I was just pointing out that people will have different opinions on who is the Greatest. and Shaka’s arguments were actually valid. If you are the greatest player in the history of the game.. then explain those statistics.
And let’s not use the age old excuse of it’s a team sport and the rest of the teams he has been on sucks. Because :
1- Its not like the other players on the Argentine squads play in Sunday leagues
2- every other team in the World Cup has the same situation to deal with
3- Messi didnt earn his greatness creds from his ability to make and receive great passes to and from his teammates- He is a game changer. The guy can on his own take on any number of defenders at will. That’s why he is the magician. That’s why we are having this discussion.
Shaka is saying when the world is watching and waiting. When his countrymen are hoping and praying that the greatest footballer in the history of the game will take over the game ... he doesn’t.
World Cup argument is so stupid for two reasons.
1. It's not the highest level. In the world cup you only start playing hard games in the knockouts. You may even get lucky and play teams like Panama and Costa Rica all the way to a final. Teams like this and China and South Africa and Honduras etc, with all due respect, they're nothing compared to champions league teams.
2. Winning as a player is HUGELY dependent on how lucky you were with your nation of birth and timing. If Messi was as good as he is or better, but was born as an Azerbaijani, is he not the best because Azerbaijan will never win the WC??
STUPID argument
That’s not what he’s saying though. He’s saying that at the club level their are 4 legends which include Messi, but in order to distinguish himself amongst the others winning a World Cup is essential. Think about it. Let’s say a player comes along who is around the same level as Messi and matches all of his club records. You would say they were equals right? But let’s say this player also had a far more successful international career and won the World Cup, dominating international football. Well, then you’d have to give the crown of greatness to him over Messi. Eventually someone like this will come along to the point that you could not ever question his resume as the so called GOAT. Oh and btw... virtually every great that has played has been from countries that are quite good at international football. Messi being one of them.
Di Lima was called extra-terrestrial, O Fenômeno because he was truly magical. Messi is in the class of C Ronaldo who has actually won three consecutive UCL titles and an European championship title.
@@therealtigertalk the argument fails on the simple fact that it depends on who you are playing with internationally. R9 played with one of the greatest Brazil teams ever. Same is true of Pele. A squad of greats. Argentina have had weak teams for the past two WCs and only got to a final because of messi's exploits.
Maradona also played in an Argentina team more equal to their peers than the Argentina of the last two WCs.
If George Best had avoided drink and fulfilled his potential, would he not be in the argument because he was from NI and not able to win a WC? That's silly. A player is judged on his ability and what he does week in week out. Messi is unrivalled in this respect.
Wont even go into how EVERY player is a professional athlete now compared to Maradona and Pele's days.
yoogeo1 Argentina has not had “weak” teams. Talent wise they have always been amongst the best in international football. And Messi has been underwhelming in the knockout stages. Either way I don’t subscribe to Shaka’s argument. I think Messi is the best player of all time but not the greatest. By that I mean he is the most skillful player to ever play the game but in 100 years or so someone will come that is even better. But just because that player is better does not mean he is greater. Each generation is different based on the accessibility of training and technological advancements. Not to mention the different tactics, styles of play, and rules. This is why to me you cannot compare one generation to the next in terms of greatness. So Pelé, Messi, Maradona etc. defined their generations and as a result can be labeled as the greatest but only within their respective eras. For example you cannot really compare Napoleon to George Washington. But you can respect the accomplishments of each.
@@therealtigertalk theres a video on TH-cam showing the squad Argentina took to the last two world cups and just how poor they were. People romanticise Argentina because of the Maradona and riquelme eras but the squad has been poor for a very long while and people actually forget that. He was underwhelming in the knockout rounds the last world cup, but brilliant in the one they got to the final. Note the game against Belgium in which he tore them apart single handedly...
I wish Shaka played goalie today. Messi would literally take a dump on his face every time he played him
tbf tho Shaka was a great keeper.
Peter Griffin Messi would still ruin him lol
He was good not great and Messi would nutmeg him
Peter Griffin Let’s be honest - how “good” can a goalkeeper actually be? There are definitely very good goalkeepers but against Messi they may as well not be there most of the time.
Who is here after Messi winning his 6th B'dor ❤️
the World Cup argument is such a delusional argument LMAO
In my opinion, Thomas Muller is the greatest player of all time. I just think that on an individual level, he has long surpassed the likes of Pele, Maradona, Messi, Ronaldo Nazario, Cristiano Ronaldo,Cruyff and Zidane. If you look at the things he’s done, it’s absolutely incredible. Simply no one has the ability to perform as dominantly and successfully in big games as Muller. At every major tournament, he has performed extremely well especially against top clubs in the knockout phase. In the champions league, he has scored massive goals against Real Madrid, FC Barcelona, Manchester United, Manchester City, Chelsea, Arsenal and Juventus to kill them off. He has bagged world class performances at the World Cup by scoring in bunches against England, Argentina, Uruguay, Portugal and Brazil. Footballers should be ranked for how clutch they are and their ability to win matches. How many players have achieved as prestigiously at both club and international level as Muller? There is no one close to his level, therefore he is the undisputed GOAT.
But I bet if Messi ever won a World Cup by some miracle his fans would never ever stop talking about it as the greatest achievement of his career, so it is what it is, however delusional you want to call it the World Cup is the most prestigious trophy in the entire sport and all the players talked about in the GOAT conversation have atleast one of them.
voldmerot to me you compare individual Stats and how they played in games . To me comparing team trophies is different that team success
It's actually not how can a player be considered the GOAT if he has never won the most important title the World Cup. Imagine calling Michael Jordan a GOAT if he never won a championship lol
Vince E that totally different, football there’s other trophies. While NBA only has one. Plus basketball different it’s a game of 5v5 so a single player can really dictate the game more and not rely on teammates as much compare to football where it’s a game of 11 v 11
According to Shaka Giroud is better than Messi because he has a World Cup
@TheRealist 811 Napoli was NOT average in the 80s. Argentina had a powerhouse of a team with Maradona. Get your fucking facts right idio5
Please leave my giroud alone
@@juanmanuelcorrea7673 yet Aguero, Di Maria, Mascherano, Milito, Saviola, Banega, Higuain, Dybala, Tevez, etc... were not powerhouse of a team when Messi was playing with them right?😂😂 if Pessi failed it is because he plays with woods, but if they all win together, then it is him, blame everyone so that Messi would look good😂😂 i thought a great player makes a team look great😂😂
@@daniel_mensa All those players you mentioned are a failure in the national team. NOT POWERHOUSE (Dybala? Higuain? You know shit about football). Powerhouse is Batistuta, Pasarella, Burruchaga, Valdano... ETC. (You 100% do not know any of those players).Di maria... all those are just big name players. Di maria is a failure both in the national team and club. Banega? Serious cringe. Dybala has done nothing for Argentina. Tevez had his time. Higuain is the sole reason you're hating on Messi, because of him Messi doesn't have 2 Copa Americas and a world cup.
@itsmejohny he's very intelligent and has good link up play. Why did France pick him instead of lacazette and others. He's more useful than you think
So if Messi trades allegiances to Spain he wins the world cup....
You need to tell Shaka this
I honestly think that if Messi played for Spain instead of Argentina, he could have possibly won 2WCs and 3Euros. Despite being the exact same player as he is today. Shaka is somehow forgetting that football is a team game.
There are only 8 countries that have ever won the World Cup of football. Sucks for you if you're born in one of the other 187 countries, you're not even qualified to be in the GOAT-discussion. That is the logic of the narrow-minded dogmatic called Mr. Shaka.
I think winning a world Cup won't change any thing about Leo he has done unthinkable . I love him
Anyone who states Messi isn’t the greatest individual player is objectively wrong.
BlackSeedsOfVengeance facts 💯
LoL you're just saying that just to push the Messi is the "GOAT" narrative down our throats. Get lost.
@@runrafarunthebestintheworld triggered Ronalso fan 🙉
@@runrafarunthebestintheworld He is. Nobody needs pushing.
The G.O.A.T wont have trouble winning a international trophy.Yet to this day Messi hasn't won 1. In a club conversation Messi will take the conversation.The world cup converstation is rubish.People should look outside the world cup.
Millions of enlighten fans worldwide knows messi is the GOAT including myself, numbers still growing, some start realizing now, while a small nostalgic fraction is deluded
i'M OLD saw them both. Pele was a greater player.
@@forshigity5000 against truck drivers?, No defense strategy?
This like telling swae Lee is better than 2pac .....busted 😂
MMM against potato farmers?
Tupac is forever I’m young and you can’t be the hands down GOAT yet you can’t win the World Cup with Argentina.
Shaka acts like he knows everything about football 😂
everyone in that chair like knows everything
Why do they even need his opinion? That guy is only know for denying Messi as the greatest.
Lol true😂. Didn't he know that messi was the player of the tornument in world Cup 2014. Do he even watch world Cup ?😂
He just said his opinion and you all are triggered
Messi has had a better career than all of them
Consistently at the top for 15 years
And he has been in a world cup final
And has won a Copa as the tournaments best player hehe
True.. messi is the best..it's just pure bad luck that he has not got the support he has at barca to win the world cup..feel sorry for the man..if Higuain had scored that day...only if.. .Greatest ever player its really sad not to see him win a world cup...
Dembele won Worldcup so dembele is greatest of all time 🤣🤣🤣🤣by Shaka logic
hem basnet u Messi fan boys are stupid asf the man is talking about main stand out players dembele is a bench warmer... Messi only performs for Barca don’t tell me about oh he’s the top scorer for Argentina 99% of his goals are against shit teams Ecuador etc
@@04foreverinvincible69 no he did it in the WC made it to the final
38 YOUNGMONEY dumbass who scored hat trick against Brazil who scored against did you u Ronaldo fan boys are stupid asf
38 YOUNGMONEY lol penaldo played for Manchester United Real Madrid and juv which are considered to be one of the biggest clubs and has world class players u call that challenge wtf there is limit of stupidity don’t be so fucking stupid
@@hembasnet8651 i'm a messi fan .. but ur argument is stupid !! If more than one player come in the discussion of GOAT then obviously u can't compare different generations & era ..... the common ground should be competitions & messi hasn't won the world cup .. he could've in 2014 but was unlucky even after having a good game .... So basically u can't disprove his stats & quality and remove him from GOAT discussion bcoz obviously he's there if not he's the one... but to say he's better than all the others who were considered GOAT .. u can't prove that unless messi wins one world cup !!! & Again i'm a messi & consider him GOAT coz i haven't seen pele or maradona play live ! But Shaka argument is valid & u're counter about dembele was stupid AF !
How many champions leagues have Maradona, Brasilian Ronaldo and Pele won?
Zero.
Di Stefano won about 5 or 6 European cups when only the league champions participated. So better than Messi then. Pele won the Copa Libertadores twice destroying European champions, Benfca to win the World Club cup.
Ugochukwu Okafor ooooo destroying a team of Portuguese part time players/part time farmers
@@BetterCallSaul. Benfica were legitimate European champions having beaten Barcelona 3-2 in the final.
Do you know, difference between a stone and a rock. The champions league is like a stone, analogy for you
@@Vince-ud3ek 5 Champions League that Real Madrid & Di Stefano won was hugely arguable in term of its prestige. Completely a different tournament back then. Not to mention the suspected manipulation/involvement of Spanish government at that time. I left that for you to research.
I can understand him saying not being the greatest of all time. But Messi is without question the greatest of our generation. I've never seen pele or maradona play, but from their highlights, they don't make me go WOW as much as Messi does. For me, he's the greatest I've ever watched. Period.
So by your logic, he is the GOAT...as although you haven't seen them "play" you have seen "highlights" and wasn't impressed, but highlights are from actual play footage so you "have seen them".
@@Ratooner basically.
@@Ratooner yeah and that didn't impress him. Simple. Messi will impress you in highlights as well
Algorithm doing his job
How can he say that Messi hasn't done anything for Argentina? Messi single handedly took them to 2014 WC final.
AND single handedly took them to the 2018 WC. Without him, they wouldn't even have qualified. If that doesn't tell you how trash the team around him is/was, then what else would? Like, come on...
He never said that. He only says Messi's resume isn't as impressive as the others in WCs.
Messi has brought argentina to the most finals in their history
@@variegated_stingray but did Jack shit in that tournament and please dont say his teammates lets him down its the same teammates he had since 2010 well some of them
And he's Argentina's all time scorer
The old guy got really defensive out of nowhere. He gets seriously saucy when told Germany only became professional in 1963, which is very important as they did well in every world cup Pele played in.
Also the Champions League is harder to win and is played at a higher standard than the world cup. There are no Panama's in the Champions League.
There are
tribal que I agree.
There's a lot of world class players but only 1 galactic class player. 14 years of being the best. Best stats. That World Cup argument is weak. Shaka is just stubborn.
So delisional
Here we are now, Argentina with 🏆🇦🇷💙
Shaka Hislop sounding like the most deluded fool ever
Paul Mariner: Hold my beer
Pure reaction from Moreno! Shaka is a symbolism of Football Idiocracy
Shaka chats bollocks, just because Messi hasnt won a world cup,
He was a goal keeper anyway lol.
Shakka is right . Messi has played in 4 world cups and in 3 of the world cups messi was a total disgrace and only in 2014 he was half decent
Well he's won an international trophy now.....
What has pele done for club? Win a couple Brazilian league titles for santos 😭😭😭and what maradona the goat Bc he won a Italy championship 😭stop it messi coulda done it in every era
Pele never played in Europe and u compare him with a player that has played in Europe and scored 50 goals a season for the last 10 seasons, common
@@osamuaigbokhae5756 competition was in South America just imagen players like coutinho, neymar, firmino, marcelo, ect... All playing in one league
Pele won the world cup more than once score a total of 12 goal moradona won the world and won the Italian championship with Napoli don't forget that Messi plays with the best players at one of the best club if not the best club in Europe
Messi is the GOAT whoever cant see that is deluded and fhey are missing out bigtime
You're deluded. Messi isn't even top 3.
Essio Fuzulu hey kid we are all big fans of Messi here, we have just lived longer to see other special players in different football eras.
Michael Trumph yep. That’s because fifa is corrupt. And THERES NO WAY GREIZMANN AND MBAPPE ARE BETTER THAN MESSI. No way
@@barritoothy
Who said they are ?!
barritoo thy agreed how he got fifth that year is an utter disgrace
He ain't the goat until he torments farmboys and shepherds week in week out like pele
😂😂😂😂😂😂✅✅✅✅
Go watch highlights of Pele's Copa Libertadores and World cup performances and stop comparing him to this midget.
Who is watching after they got humbled 4-0 at Anfield?
I
That doesn't change the fact that he's GOAT
@@augustinedansoopoku8120 Nah my Goat will never fumble a 3-0 lead in an important semi final after promising your club the trophy and still losing
Agree, does not change the facts, he actually played a good games besides a few mistakes and considering the ball barley went to the attacking side, he cant be the goalkeeper, the defender and a midfielder.
Aye 😂😂😂😂
It’s really amazing how underachievers try to make an argument against the greatest of all time🤣🤣
If you love football you know messi is the G.O.A.T and with var maradona wouldn't have won a world cup maybe the same with Pele
levy kun with or without VAR
Pelé didn’t do shit in WC.... in 1962 and 1966 WC he scored 1 goal
And in other 2 (1958 and 1970) he scored around 5
He was not even the best Brazilian in those world cups
So wann say..that giroud is GOAT 🤣🤣...THEY criticize messi b'coz he doesn't play for their fav. Team ..🚬🥃..thank me later
I am watching it after Argentina won the World Cup 😂
Shaka Hyslop is a clown, by his logic he prolly thinks Pogba’s a better player than Messi smh
Miles Chan nobody is comparing pogba to any goat. He didn’t say all World Cup winners are the best players ever. U can’t choke on the international level and be the goat.
Albert , you cant convince people that cant understand the basics of the argument. I dont think he even watched the video. Because Shaka said he wasnt even saying he had to win it.. only that you cant claim to be the greatest footballer in the history of the game and fail to score a single goal the the knock out stage. and only score 6 goals in all three WC --3 against Nigeria,
He has no logic
Deo1 the World Cup is different now. The World Cup used to be different. Some teams had non pros.
Alan Garcia u can only beat what’s infront of u. If Messi played back then they’d hack him out of most games. Because the rules are very much in his favor. He literally punched another player and got away with it.
What a ridiculous argument, a player plays 90% of their career at club level. Messi is the greatest of all time and those who deny it are willingly blinding themselves from the truth.
Greatest of all toilet 🚽
@@Gabriel-pr1kz Lol
Yet he’s never tried to play in anything but La Liga so nah as long as Cristiano is breathing, Messi isn’t the greatest
@@calebhogue2619 Yeah I guess you're right playing at Manchester United (When they were actually good), Real Madrid, and Juventus is really hard! Wake up, this season Ronaldo has done nothing, Messi's going to win the treble, Golden Boot, and has a chance for more. All this while Barcelona hasn't been at there best, he's rescued 17 points for Barcelona in LaLiga. Without him they wouldn't have won anything but the Copa. This quote sums it up, "Barcelona used to be a good team and Messi, Now Barcelona are a good team because of Messi."
@@calebhogue2619 i guess ronaldo wo n the Ucl with getafe,newcastle and atalanta...nice try😂😂 it is like messi going to man city,they would win the leugue fir the next 6 years
Messi has 48 goals, 19 assists in 46 games this season.... Holy fuc..
I got this as youtube recommendation after Argentina won Copa America 😂
One question for this guy. How does a TEAM competition define individual greatness?
Denis Omerovic It’s a team sport so how do you label one guy the greatest?
@@xtrey19x And how do you label the guy who makes the greatest impact positively on his team whenever he steps on the field. Just by his presence he changes the flow of the game towards his team. Even carried his team to the WC final just to lose bcoz of mistakes of his teammates. Not to mention his Golden Boot.
@@nirwanraika7865 ??? So messi can play against 11 players and beat them ??
@@nomad4732 When did i say he can alone beat 11 players?? I just said he makes a great impact on his team whenever he plays. Just compare the games with and without he's in and whenever he subs in.
@@nirwanraika7865 did i say you said it? I asked you !
u say wc makes u the goat ? the champions league has way more quality than the world cup in pele's era
That’s not what he’s saying though. He’s saying that at the club level their are 4 legends which include Messi, but in order to distinguish himself amongst the others winning a World Cup is essential. Think about it. Let’s say a player comes along who is around the same level as Messi and matches all of his club records. You would say they were equals right? But let’s say this player also had a far more successful international career and won the World Cup, dominating international football. Well, then you’d have to give the crown of greatness to him over Messi. Eventually someone like this will come along to the point that you could not ever question his resume as the so called GOAT
David Kess shut up
Big stiff Idiot your name made me lol. Thanks have a good weekend bro.
You don’t need the World Cup to be the best ! That’s like saying the same thing about Gianluigi Buffon or ZLATAN Ibrahimovic because they’ve never won a Champions League ! Cmon now ?! Messi can win something with Argentina it’s just that his international teammates especially Higuain always let him down unfortunately !
But as a team accomplishment it is important
alex kanyima yeah but if your a quality player it doesn’t define you you know what I mean .
Thank God higuiaine retired few months back..
Messi TheKing did he didn’t know that . But still Argentina aren’t great right now regardless if Higuain is there or not . I mean the whole side oozes quality but something’s not clicking recently with them . Is it that there not training properly , the coach , attitude issues behind the scenes , who knows !
George Kandylis they meet 4/5 times a year.. Then go away to play with their clubs.. How do you expect chemistry in such cases.. So when such teams meet how is that the most prestigious competition is what gets me..
Where was your Messi last night?
Shaka a whole hater lol he hating on messi
Exactly
Shaka ..u are right..pele is all the way..best ever
Messi is not the greatest of all time! Ronaldinio was better then him
@@nicolettedavis3108 well I respect your opinion but shaka is still a hater lol
@@nicolettedavis3108 if ronaldinho himself says that messi is better than why should we listen to you?answers please
Messi is the GOAT. I don't even need to say more.
Well you're wrong. That title belongs to CR7.
@@jr3624 Is it cuz he raped your beloved Spurs? Your team can't even win trophies ffs. Messi is a better scorer, playmaker, assister, free kick taker, dribbler, passer and so much more it ain't close.
Jr Morales Ronaldo fucking trash stfu
Jr Morales Mate, it’ll annoy I Am Always Happy, but I support Forest, really like Barca, but also like Spurs. Seriously though... Ronaldo could never produce such a complete performance like Messi did against Spurs in October. He’s better in every aspect, bar heading and penalties.
@@iamalwayshappy8485 I find it weird how so many Arsenal fans love Messi seeing as he scored the most against them, but then come to think of it, maybe they're just open-minded and have an eye for good football, it's no coincidence they appreciated Wengerball 🤔
lol Shaka, If Messi is regarded as the greatest club player of all time, then shouldn't Pele be regarded as greatest country player ? How come Pele is the greatest then ?
@LipJobby yeah and Messi scored 400 goals against Spanish peasants.
Prince of Theves ”peasants” Valencia, Sevilla, Betis, Alavés etc. would rip any other leagues mid-table teams apart...
3 World Cups?
@@princeoftheves1549 not fair, but Spanish league is easier it's true. Less competitive.
@@miyahtallulah Thats why I am calling Pele, greatest "country" player. But to be the greatest, shouldn't Pele be the greatest "club" player as well ?
Why did this old video of ESPN pop up now 😂 Right place at the right time 😅
Shaka is deluded, how can he not say Messi is not the greatest with the things the man does 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️
He has not won a World Cup or Copa America. Stop comparing the Back then to now. He and no one can be the best of all time. Pele was the best in his time and Messi is the best this century.
messi had everything for him to be great while cr7 had to start from the bottom with sporting and move himself up . big difference . one likes to challange himself while the other wont move from his comfort zone
Talk when messi can win 3 cl’s in a row like cr7
100% Agree.
Try to Search Pelé best 10 solo goals (dont had), Search pelé best 10 chip goals (dont had), search Pelé 10 best dribbles, search Pelé top 10 free kicks. After that change the name Pelé for Messi. Tell me what you see, eyes dont lie.
@@TPZlt Talk when ronaldo can make 10 real solo goals or best 10 chip goals, show me ronaldo dribling six players. Try to find in youtube.i challenge you.