Recovered Gamer that's cool you studied international conflicts. Most of human history is rife with repeated mistakes but with the advent of satellite technology and advanced weapons I wonder if looking back in the past is as effective as it once was previously. It's still important of course but the way war and politics has changed so much over the last two decades it's very ominous what the future holds for us. Do you ever think about this?
Aiko Natsumi I dont think there will ever be another conventional war between two "first world countries" because every country is so powerful and most have nuclear weapons. I just can't see a big country going to war, look like they are gonna lose, and not let out nukes. That's why most big countries have fought nothing but proxy wars since the 50's so they can pull away if they need without taking a loss. IF it happens it will be utterly devastating.
You can’t compare reality to fiction like that though… fiction is just fiction. Of course no horror movies will ever compare to real life atrocities like Unit 731 and the Holocaust!
The fact that winners write the history is exemplified by how British how they whitewashed everything they did in India and other colonies. British did mow down unarmed people with machine guns and used indian soldiers like throwaway fodder.
My Great Uncle was captured by the Japanese, was on a hell ship, in the Bataan death march and was in prison camp in Mukden and liberated by the Russians. His account of what happened exactly mirrors what is explained in this podcast (told at 48:00 minutes in this podcast ) We have lots of his artifacts, his journal he kept during the prison camp, his mess kit.
My great uncle was on the forced Bataan death march , interred in a Japanese concentration camp as well. He came back a changed man, he never talked about what he went through . This makes me very sad that he he went through such horrors . The Filipino sneaked food to the prison camp he was at . The Filipino people were very brave.
So my best friend as a child was half filipino. His mom called me "kuya"(?) She told us about her father who fought and uncle who died fighting the Japanese. Said her dad became very upset when he talked about that situation and lived the rest of his life violent. She was a pretty strict woman but very funny. Always she wished her family would get the credit for fighting the Japanese.
Incredible. And there is so little information out there about this. I grew up with whispers about Japanese torture, but the Nazi's were always the boogeymen in history. Excellent podcast. Thank you.
Zondares they become the new emperor is all. that’s honestly pretty offensive as a Korean my self. they did unspeakable things to our people and china.
As a Japanese person, I’ve never been taught this horrifying stuff in schools. These atrocities must be remembered. Jocko and Echo, thank you both of you.
@@jonathanhunt9979I was "fortunate" enough to have a history teacher in high school who was passionate enough about history and the importance of learning from it to take the time to make sure to teach us about attrocities like this that more "mainstream" history sources don't tell us about.
It makes an American wonder what other countries learn about that we don't know about. It's just as horrific to know our officials pardoned them just for data. We still could've prosecuted. Definitely could've lied for the data but our government let that man and others involved live healthy lives after.
I wonder how you Japanese going to face Chinese or Korean after you learnt all these. These two nations seem to be growing much more powerful in mordern days.
I believe I first learned about Nanjing and 731 when I was in high school, bored and surfing the web. I don't think I've ever found anything worse or more chilling in the decade or more since, and I am still continuously fascinated, intrigued, and horrified by the sheer evil and malevolence. Like Jocko said, imagine that the woman and her baby are someone you know. But worse is, imagine that being your mom. Imagine yourself being put on the table, held down and cut open. I am the squeamish type, so getting a paper cut is already unpleasant. Going to the dentist is unpleasant, you are totally at their mercy for not hitting your gums too much with their scary looking tools... but at least the dentist is trying to help you. But now imagine that they're basically tearing you inside out, perhaps (more like most likely) with the intention of causing pain. And no one undergoing this stuff ever had experience. I'd like to think that the victims of this horror show lived a long time ago, and felt less pain than I did, or that since they grew up rough, that this experimentation stuff hut them less... but I'm totally in denial if I continued to believe that. This is the unsettling truth about humans - we are all extremely fragile bodies that don't self heal. Once you are frozen, stabbed, cut open, whatever it is - you aren't going to get any better. Now all you must face is death, and hope that it comes swiftly. After listening to this podcast, I am truly grateful that I was not born in a time and situation where I would have ended up being experimented on. To be conscious ever so briefly in the universe just to have so much pain brought upon you. Truly horrific.
@@adamlew6145 Is it true that VX causes your nervous system to go haywire and you basically suffer muscle spasms so intense you basically end up like a rag doll.
RecovERed GamER ya dude. I read Machete Season not long after that podcast. Reading that book on top of listening to Jordan Peterson will make you take a long look at yourself and realize what atrocities you're capable of.
Forrest Cravens I found the Rwandan genocide actually tougher to come to terms with. Just mind boggling that neighbors started hacking at each other with machetes or teachers dismembering someone that was their student the week before. I've listened to EVERY Jocko podcast and I had the hardest time with that one. There's just something extra terrifying about civil wars where people kill their own fellow citizens.
@@menwithven8114 I read about Rwanda in Amy Chua's excellent "World on Fire", and my first thought was "this is actually WORSE than Nazi Germany" in the sense that the citizens did it. There was no distant government with death camps to give the population plausible deniability; they did it themselves. 800,000 dead in 100 days. The mind boggles.
Not many people know this but after WW2 ended many of the members of Unit 731 ended up being recruited by the US to create biological weapons for the US & according to Peter Williams (who wrote a famous book on the topic) some of those individuals played a role in helping the US use biological weapons during the Korean war.
AmNotHere911 Sounds simular to operation Paperclip. American took the Nazi scientists, only to establish NASA. The CIA and Nazis elite are cut from the same cloth, in my opinion.
I just learned you covered Unit 731. More people need to hear this story because it is unpleasant to hear. I know smart strong people avoid this topic because it stains the social soul. Thank you
I worked for an American colonel who survived the Bataan death March. He was way up in his 90s when the tsunami hit Japan. He cackled every time footage of that came on the news.
Henry Monroe They should touch base on this again, to think all of those war criminals were protected and let go, and the philosophy they had about their work really makes me wonder about the origin of current state.
This needs to be common knowledge all over the world, there's no light/good without dark/evil and people need to know about the evil there is in the world past, present and future. Keep spreading these stories Jocko, the atrocities of the world need to be known and taught in more schools.
There's a shit ton of documentaries and movies about this, many you would commonly find on the History Channel before it became All Aliens All the Time
All these years, I've been familiar like everyone else with the unspeakable horrors that took place in the death camps in Europe under Nazi power. I'm almost 30 years old and first started learning about unit 731 yesterday. Just when we thought that nothing could be any worse than the Nazis, this is the worst thing I have ever heard of. This is not to minimize what the Nazis did at all; The victims of the holocaust in Europe suffered extremely brutal deaths that included being burned alive in some instances. Overall, the Nazis would still be just as bad. Although not as many people died at Unit 731, the Japanese researchers conducted various extreme, gruesome, and agonizing experiments on victims. It reminded me of those Final Destination movies if not even worse. Doing these things to animals is extremely evil. Non-humans don't ever deserve to suffer like that either.
@@BettyWhite2171 I took a peak at it and could not sit through it. It may have looked old for a movie from 1988, yet was ahead of its time when it came to depicting the most gruesome acts of violence in history.
I'm a victim of unit 731 my grandfather was geneticly experimented on, and me and my father have a genetic condition which drs think is directly related and caused from my grandfather's experimentation
@@CRSaltVeins their was a lot of survivors from 731, but only a very very small amount percentage based when compared to the total amount of overall victims. My grandfather was tortured and was apart of many many diff experiments but the one that caused me and my father to be born with a major genetic disorder is from when they forced groups of people to endure increasing amounts of radiation to the point of making some of them die from accute radiation sickness! very quickly after the experiment, the decreased the intensity but increased the durations of exposure so instead of short rlly intense doses they went to lower doses that they received all throughout the day which lasted the majority of the rest of his imprisonment at 731 he endured insane cumulative amounts of non lethal levels of radiation, He just like almost every else who was apart of that "experiment" got cancer! I think it was only 4? Or 6months? Or so.. after the war ended when the first cancer came, but between the wars end and his death a few yrs later from cancer he ended up having like 3-4 completely diff types of cancer over the course of those yrs! I dont mean like one spread to somewhere else I mean like he had whole diff types of cancer happen to him, which is crazy! But during the few yrs he was alone and fighting cancer he remarried and he had 5 kids and every single one had some major genetic condition or deformities, each person being born with a diff condition never the same disease showing in diff kids or twice, and all of the genetic conditions had never ran in our family history before that, and his other 6 children who were all born before the war with his first wife. Whom was also was in 731 and she actually died in 731. But before he was tortured for almost 2yrs straight while living in Hell on Earth, him, his wife and kids were all perfectly healthy, after 731 his wife, 2 of his kids with her died, 1 other kid was permanently mentally disabled from some type of lobotomy type torture they performed on her. And his other kid luckily didnt get tortured too bad my grandpa always said he thinks its because he was so young and they think he was used as some type of control group in diff "experiments" so he got rlly lucky. My grandfather entered with his wife and 4 of his kids into 731, afterwards he left 731 with only 2 kids alive with one being permanently mentally handicapped, the other being the young son that got lucky as survivors or 731. I mentioned previously he had 6 kids but luckily his oldest kid, his first born son who was a late teenager during the outbreak of ww2 when everything kicked off and rlly started getting serious he was in china and my grandfather made him stay in China with relatives and wouldnt let him return home. So he escaped the brutality of the Japanese government, but did end up needing to join the Chinese army. My grandfather is white and was living in korea with my Korean grandmother. She was raped and shit by the Japanese army and then they forced her, her kids and my grandfather into 731 after the captured her small village. But theirs so much more to it, this is just the basics off the top of my head but yea.. if u have any more questions or would like to talk over the phone some about it I'd be happy to talk with you or answer any questions you have. But short answer is, radiation exposer fucked and mutated my grandpa's dna and genetic shit in his seamen up, so when he had kids afterwards his dna was all fucked up in his seamen so when he had kids they all had defects, my dad having one which he then pasted onto me genetically. So I have a condition and I view myself as a victim of them even being alive 80yrs later. Edit: I forgot to mention their is some good that came from all the bad tho, all the data collected by exposing my grandfather and other people to radiation, the knowledge was extremely valuable and important after the Nagasaki and Hiroshima happened, all the "medical" notes they took on the prisoners was read and used to help treat survivors of the nuclear Bombs, and the relatively small group of people who were apart of that "experiment" contributed knowledge that potentially saved 1ks of lives possibly even more so.
i just listened the podcast for the second time and no other episode has angered me so much , i can't believe that American government let all of this savages go free , nut only that but they allowed them high positions in various disciplines , disgusting.
Thank you for taking the time to share the story and to be informative as always and honestly to be humanizing about it, not just pushing a single point of view.
Those civilians would have become hostiles as soon as conventional forces landed on their shores, and they would all be killed anyways. Atomic bombs saved more lives than sending Marines and soldiers would have. Imperial Japan was a borderline religion which all of its inhabitants were willing to die for. Use of the atomic bomb was an act of mercy. Oh, and we helped them rebuild their country after the war. Not the case with Germany, who rebuilt themselves. I don't here any apologies heading Germany's way for leveling Dresden and Hannover along with several other major cities where several civilians were also killed. Do they deserve an apology?
shugo104 I won't speak for Jocko, but I think he does express his opinions on it at 1:03:25. Regardless of what his opinions are on this matter, I don't believe it would really change mine on the matter. I understand your reasoning as far as not becoming blind with hatred for your enemy. I still don't see where the apology part comes in though. They needed to be stopped, they were stopped, end of story. I don't feel sorry for that, nor do I feel that America needs to apologize for that, especially after helping them rebuild. I do respect your consistency in your reasoning though, although I don't entirely agree with it. And your civility.
Forrest Cravens Aha I can see sides flipping in a different world and the Japanese use the excuse that we are too patriotic and would fight to the last civilian so they had to nuke places like New York & San Diego. Quit bullshitting. After we nuked the civilians, we did a thousand bomb grand finale that the generals planned to celebrate their surrender. While peace pamphlets fell on Tokyo. So did fucking bombs. Quit bullshitting dude I see through you
Forrest Cravens Oh yes “helping them rebuild” like establishing military bases on their island and guaranteeing they never have another standing army to defend themselves ever again. Oh yeah big fucking help dude
ROKMC Rec. And even more Japanese. Both by our weapons and their own due to suicide as a result of their failures to defend their homeland. It was the samurai way.
I've always been fascinated by 731. It's concerning how many people still have no idea about it, and I try to learn all that I can on the subject so that I may try to understand it on some level. But the more that I learn, the more that I see, it doesn't make it make any more sense. It's intense psychopathy and sociopathy all the way down, under the flimsiest of reasoning. And to think of how many other events of similar brutality that have happened, still happen, will happen... it's beyond horrifying.
That's the way the mind works. Anything you can imagine, the worst possible things, have already been done. There's no rational thought behind it, it's pure selfishness and disconnection from reality. The ultimate display of us vs. them. We are special beings living under the emperor, they are just sacks of meat. No different from the Nazis or religious extremists. Separation between you and me, not being able to recognize others as equals. Selfishness or self-centered activity is the most common mental illness of humanity.
ShowMeState 38 the Japanese Shinto Buddhist system has a meditation practice to "annihilate the soul" and disassociate a person from their feelings of remorse, regret, guilt, sympathy, etc.
saving this podcast for later, so forgive me if it's mentioned already. the atrocities continued on past Unit 731 after one of the lieutenant generals in the unit went on after the war to create Japan's first commercial blood bank which grew to be a very large pharmaceutical company called Green Cross (basically was Japan's equivalent of Johnson & Johnson). the company knowingly, and with disregard to the known dangers, imported HIV infected blood for use in hospitals to treat hemophiliacs which caused the AIDS crisis in Japan in the late 1980's/early 90's and killed around 3,000 people. Masao Miyamoto wrote a great article about it called, "Mental Castration, the HIV Scandal, and the Japanese Bureaucracy".
IT astounds me the evil Man is capable of doing when desperate and following orders , this podcast really taught me a lot, and it shows that history is the greatest teacher of all and if we need it's warnings we can avoid the path of darkness and atrocity. Thank you again Jocko , the podcasts just keep getting better
First video from Jocko and oh boy what a doozy. I think you got a subscriber for life. This lab is what I imagined hell to be like with all the inventive tourtures, what could be a worse experience? I can't imagine....
I can’t stop listening to this. I’m always curious about this sort of stuff. It’s haunting to hear about what humans are capable of but I can’t stop being intrigued and wanna hear about it
It was always bother me and anger me that the world has no idea how bad the Japanese were in the war. It’s always Nazi Nazi Nazi but nobody wants to read history to see they shouldn’t keep holding up Russia and Japan to such a high level
And Russia has its share of unimaginable atrocities too. Stalin's Gulags were literal hell on earth, people literally eating each other alive because killing was too much effort.. just take what you want and eat it while the person being consumed screams.. The atrocities that unfolded under Stalin's regime, not just the gulags but everything - it's almost beyond comprehension (as is Nanking and other Japanese atrocities) but many people insist nazis and white slave owners in early America were the worst of the worst in all of history. Heck yes they were bad, not denying that... but my gosh, there is just so much more to even our very recent history. Heck Nanking was so bad that nazis were risking their lives to try to save civilians from the brutalities being inflicted upon them. It has to be really, really bad when nazis come out as the good guys in a sitiation. And after having heard Yeonmi Park speaking out about what's happening in NK.. these things things are still happening in this world right now :c Yet it's always nazis and white slave owners with most folks - that's the limit of their understanding of the evils humans can inflict on other humans. But heck.. maybe it's better to be that way? Sometimes maybe it would be better to just not know. :/
Theres a lot of blurred lines when it comes to evil in our everyday society. But this kind of stuff is just evil no matter what side you're on. If youre ever in a position to make these mistakes, this is the kind of stuff that haunts you til the end.
I read a lot about the Unit and dealt with the subject. It saddens me to see how easily you get over the US crime of protecting these monsters. Protecting a war criminal is also a crime. And a big one at that. I won't even start the whole moral point of view. That's on a whole new level.
Probably because it's something that has been known for a long time now. We were taught some of the atrocities, can't get too detailed with children, of this Unit along with our recruitment of some of the scientists/use of their work along with recruitment of certain nazi rocket scientists starting in 6th grade in my personal experience. Furthermore before the History Channel turned into All Aliens All the Time, it was full of war documentaries that did not skimp on terrible things the US did. Tuskegee experiments, Internment of Japanese Americans, Bioterrorism research, Agent Orange, Inciting Revolutions and etc in countries in the course of the Cold War with the USSR, etc, etc. We are taught our dirty history through not only schools but the media. There are countless documentaries, shows, podcasts, yt videos, movies, and the like out there detailing the ugly parts of our history. Even just a cursory Google search pulls up a lot of the shady shit the government has pulled.
That's pretty legit of that Russian officer. Here are your captors and tormenters , do whatever the hell you want with them. I'm amazed more didn't take Revenge.
I saw a video of the japanese experiments as a kid when i visited korea in '91. My relatives there absolutely hated the Japanese and they showed me this video to show me why. There were a few experiments in them. I remember the frost bite experiments clearly and its worse than the explanation. There were two. 1) he tied a couple people outside in the snow with their hands out in front of them. The japamese would come out and pour water on their bare arms. Not sure how long but they would bring them in and dunk their arms in warm water and pull them out. Then theyd get get a stick and slide their skin right off the arms like socks with loose bands. 2) they would stick both arms in something that froze their arms solid in seconds, pull them out and crack them off with hammers like an ice sculpture. There were a few more but those have stuck with me since ive seem them.
Only half of my family survived the Japanese Occupation of the Philippines. I forgive, but what was done to the Filipinos and other civilizations under Japanese occupations won’t forget anytime soon. My father was born in 1941. His first memories were of the occupation. He didn’t have feelings, not the way most people do. He couldn’t love me or anyone else. It wasn’t his fault.
To say that some of those involved involved in those atrocities my reconcile their actions is in a way to justify evil. When a gross maltreatment of a humans is left unpunished does that give some acceptance of these atrocities as a necessary evil? Where do we draw the line? Can other societies justify wrong doing by sighting the the inhuman treatment performed at Unit 731 and it's sub-units? How, as civilisation are we going to advance if these atrocities are not known so we can learn to recognize the signs so we don't decline and justify such evil?
You know, I used to listen to Joe Rogan, and then I came to Jocko after the Rogan interviews and I have to say Jocko's stuff is pretty fucking powerful.
derek myers goggins has been on JRE only once. where did you hear jocko say this? Listened to all the episodes, not sure were you are getting this from.
Can your brain really not discern the disconnect between 2 innocent, civilian-populated cities and a corrupt government-funded facility, just because they exist within the same country? What kind of fucked up worldview do you have? If those bombings were "necessary" in your head, you're no better than the vile "researchers" of Unit 731.
ben cunningham yes there is a huge disconnect between innocent cities and the government military itself. Do you think japan regularly put the entirety of their assets on the coast so we can bomb them only? Civilians will always be killed where wars are fought future and present its inevitable although limitable. Tell me how the US can end the war with a casualty total on both sides of less than the around 200,000 killed in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. You can’t though. Although targeting Hiroshima and Nagasaki was an act of cruelty and something we shouldn’t celebrate dropping those bombs saved more lives on both sides.
@@URBANLEGENDKB By your logic, given the atrocities carried out by the US government i.e. Agent Orange, MK Ultra to name a few - would nuking America be considered an act of justice ? To prevent future wars and terrorism of course.
Ya know ... people say the Abombs were excessive ... idk I'd have to disagree I'm sorry but if these individuals werent allowed to quit when they asked and did this to their own people I believe we got lucky as horrible of a method it was I dont think it was excessive it ended the war and it got the potential disaster of a man made intentional plague to be stopped ... if they had utilized this knowledge I dont know if our society would have survived
My father was in Okinawa and Iwo Jima and recolected with deserved emotion how 16 inch shells from a battleship could crush Japanese military occupants heads like smashed eggs protected by 20 foot 👣 thick concrete walls in beach fortifications.
Help chat, I'm looking for a Jocko soundbite. Its to the tune of "3 missions in life, A passion, yadda yadda, and a woman to save". Was it from the the mook episode or the Perterson one?
As a physician scientist, I have trouble understanding how most of this data would have been useful. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. Was this guy really a scientist? While they were wasting resources on this ridiculousness, we had the Manhattan Project.
Any one know of some really great ones about ww2, the Pacific Islands and of course Iraq or Afghanistan. Like first person talking about fire fights. I've heard some of the main one's, but if anyone has some plz let me know. Thanks
All of this is under the umbrella of war, so the quote "Nothing more stupid and fearful than war" stands.. with the exception being that the tolerant cannot be tolerant of the intolerant.
Thank you sirs for sharing this info and it makes me wonder if there are any connections to Lymes and ticks, which could be compared to fleas and rats, and what went on from 2020-present with the vaccine mandate, and those are just two examples did ishi have that figured out as well or was it a springboard to what we experienced lately. Also I was thinking about what makes groups from different areas do the same kinds of things, was ishi exposed and influenced by eugenics like hitler was? We as a people I think need to discuss more these unpleasant and terrible events, if nothing else but to show some kind of rememberence and to try to honor their lives in some way so their deaths and suffering were not in vain. If we look at all the events and exposures that have happened in our lives that made us who we are and shaped us down one path or another, if it works on a small scale it will also work on a larger scale…….
The world is ignorant to Japanese war crimes during the world wars. We south koreans will never forget.
ROKMC Rec. As an American I always wondered why North Koreans hate the U.S. so much. We helped get those crazy ass Japanese out of there.
Yes but the North Koreans also hate the japanese. Its just that their threats against japan dont get broadcasted.
ROKMC Rec. The world really is, unfortunately :(
Recovered Gamer that's cool you studied international conflicts. Most of human history is rife with repeated mistakes but with the advent of satellite technology and advanced weapons I wonder if looking back in the past is as effective as it once was previously. It's still important of course but the way war and politics has changed so much over the last two decades it's very ominous what the future holds for us. Do you ever think about this?
Aiko Natsumi I dont think there will ever be another conventional war between two "first world countries" because every country is so powerful and most have nuclear weapons. I just can't see a big country going to war, look like they are gonna lose, and not let out nukes. That's why most big countries have fought nothing but proxy wars since the 50's so they can pull away if they need without taking a loss. IF it happens it will be utterly devastating.
I'm Chinese, this is the scar that is burned into every one of us, my blood boils, there are no words.
Horror movies do not compare to the kinds of experiments done by Imperial Japan.
don't forget the rape of naking...
You can’t compare reality to fiction like that though… fiction is just fiction. Of course no horror movies will ever compare to real life atrocities like Unit 731 and the Holocaust!
This podcast has no fear to talk about the harsh topics and the history nobody wants to talk about. #standbytogetsome
ARIES nice. Thanks, I couldn't come up with the words.
We were taught this in history class several years in a row and then again when you have to get the obligatory US history class in highschool
The fact that winners write the history is exemplified by how British how they whitewashed everything they did in India and other colonies. British did mow down unarmed people with machine guns and used indian soldiers like throwaway fodder.
EXCEPT American war crimes ofc xD
@@st1llfr338 they cover some of that as well.
My Great Uncle was captured by the Japanese, was on a hell ship, in the Bataan death march and was in prison camp in Mukden and liberated by the Russians. His account of what happened exactly mirrors what is explained in this podcast (told at 48:00 minutes in this podcast ) We have lots of his artifacts, his journal he kept during the prison camp, his mess kit.
My great uncle was on the forced Bataan death march , interred in a Japanese concentration camp as well.
He came back a changed man, he never talked about what he went through .
This makes me very sad that he he went through such horrors . The Filipino sneaked food to the prison camp he was at . The Filipino people were very brave.
So my best friend as a child was half filipino. His mom called me "kuya"(?) She told us about her father who fought and uncle who died fighting the Japanese. Said her dad became very upset when he talked about that situation and lived the rest of his life violent. She was a pretty strict woman but very funny. Always she wished her family would get the credit for fighting the Japanese.
Incredible. And there is so little information out there about this. I grew up with whispers about Japanese torture, but the Nazi's were always the boogeymen in history. Excellent podcast. Thank you.
only cause the nazis had more men power and invaded more...japan did more damage invading less than any other country...
Nathanial The Japanese liberated South East Asia from its colonial overlords of the West.
Because it's only politically correct to hate whites and talk about their faults.
@@razkable What Japan did to Asia was more terrible than the Nazis.
Zondares they become the new emperor is all. that’s honestly pretty offensive as a Korean my self. they did unspeakable things to our people and china.
As a Japanese person, I’ve never been taught this horrifying stuff in schools. These atrocities must be remembered. Jocko and Echo, thank you both of you.
As an American, I was never taught this either.
@@jonathanhunt9979I was "fortunate" enough to have a history teacher in high school who was passionate enough about history and the importance of learning from it to take the time to make sure to teach us about attrocities like this that more "mainstream" history sources don't tell us about.
It makes an American wonder what other countries learn about that we don't know about. It's just as horrific to know our officials pardoned them just for data. We still could've prosecuted. Definitely could've lied for the data but our government let that man and others involved live healthy lives after.
你才是真正为日本着想的人，和那些极右分子不一样
I wonder how you Japanese going to face Chinese or Korean after you learnt all these. These two nations seem to be growing much more powerful in mordern days.
I believe I first learned about Nanjing and 731 when I was in high school, bored and surfing the web. I don't think I've ever found anything worse or more chilling in the decade or more since, and I am still continuously fascinated, intrigued, and horrified by the sheer evil and malevolence.
Like Jocko said, imagine that the woman and her baby are someone you know. But worse is, imagine that being your mom. Imagine yourself being put on the table, held down and cut open. I am the squeamish type, so getting a paper cut is already unpleasant. Going to the dentist is unpleasant, you are totally at their mercy for not hitting your gums too much with their scary looking tools... but at least the dentist is trying to help you. But now imagine that they're basically tearing you inside out, perhaps (more like most likely) with the intention of causing pain. And no one undergoing this stuff ever had experience. I'd like to think that the victims of this horror show lived a long time ago, and felt less pain than I did, or that since they grew up rough, that this experimentation stuff hut them less... but I'm totally in denial if I continued to believe that.
This is the unsettling truth about humans - we are all extremely fragile bodies that don't self heal. Once you are frozen, stabbed, cut open, whatever it is - you aren't going to get any better. Now all you must face is death, and hope that it comes swiftly. After listening to this podcast, I am truly grateful that I was not born in a time and situation where I would have ended up being experimented on. To be conscious ever so briefly in the universe just to have so much pain brought upon you. Truly horrific.
Maybe it's fucked up but these dark podcasts are always some of the best. We all need to realize how horrifying normal people are capable of becoming.
Check out the book Ordinary Men, about SS officers
As a biochemist biochemical warfare freaks me out more than any other kind of war
I’m terrified of Sarin gas. What a demonic chemical
I was a 74 delta (CBRN Specialist) in the Army. They put us in full MOPP gear in a room with two kinds of nerve agent one of them being VX.
@@adamlew6145 Is it true that VX causes your nervous system to go haywire and you basically suffer muscle spasms so intense you basically end up like a rag doll.
This podcast and #16 about the Rwandan genocide are definitely the two hardest I've heard.
RecovERed GamER ya dude. I read Machete Season not long after that podcast. Reading that book on top of listening to Jordan Peterson will make you take a long look at yourself and realize what atrocities you're capable of.
Forrest Cravens I found the Rwandan genocide actually tougher to come to terms with. Just mind boggling that neighbors started hacking at each other with machetes or teachers dismembering someone that was their student the week before. I've listened to EVERY Jocko podcast and I had the hardest time with that one. There's just something extra terrifying about civil wars where people kill their own fellow citizens.
RecovERed GamER ditto.
@@menwithven8114 I read about Rwanda in Amy Chua's excellent "World on Fire", and my first thought was "this is actually WORSE than Nazi Germany" in the sense that the citizens did it. There was no distant government with death camps to give the population plausible deniability; they did it themselves. 800,000 dead in 100 days. The mind boggles.
I love how he went straight into it right away. Jocko is a real one 💯
Not many people know this but after WW2 ended many of the members of Unit 731 ended up being recruited by the US to create biological weapons for the US & according to Peter Williams (who wrote a famous book on the topic) some of those individuals played a role in helping the US use biological weapons during the Korean war.
AmNotHere911 Sounds simular to operation Paperclip. American took the Nazi scientists, only to establish NASA. The CIA and Nazis elite are cut from the same cloth, in my opinion.
I just learned you covered Unit 731. More people need to hear this story because it is unpleasant to hear. I know smart strong people avoid this topic because it stains the social soul. Thank you
I worked for an American colonel who survived the Bataan death March. He was way up in his 90s when the tsunami hit Japan. He cackled every time footage of that came on the news.
My my how interesting- whose here in April 2020?
Just started listening today. May 4th.
Henry Monroe They should touch base on this again, to think all of those war criminals were protected and let go, and the philosophy they had about their work really makes me wonder about the origin of current state.
@@AKStorm49 right on man!
@@LadyMinju greetings from the past 😂
@@GatorDave I completely agree my friend. I also wonder how much of this is still practiced today
Man Jocko, keep the book reads coming, this is your most immersive yet. I love all your videos but I really keep coming back for the book reads.
Joe Rogan got me here....and am glad🙏
This needs to be common knowledge all over the world, there's no light/good without dark/evil and people need to know about the evil there is in the world past, present and future.
Keep spreading these stories Jocko, the atrocities of the world need to be known and taught in more schools.
There's a shit ton of documentaries and movies about this, many you would commonly find on the History Channel before it became All Aliens All the Time
The blacker the darkness the brighter the light that overcomes that darkness seems.
All these years, I've been familiar like everyone else with the unspeakable horrors that took place in the death camps in Europe under Nazi power. I'm almost 30 years old and first started learning about unit 731 yesterday. Just when we thought that nothing could be any worse than the Nazis, this is the worst thing I have ever heard of. This is not to minimize what the Nazis did at all; The victims of the holocaust in Europe suffered extremely brutal deaths that included being burned alive in some instances. Overall, the Nazis would still be just as bad. Although not as many people died at Unit 731, the Japanese researchers conducted various extreme, gruesome, and agonizing experiments on victims. It reminded me of those Final Destination movies if not even worse. Doing these things to animals is extremely evil. Non-humans don't ever deserve to suffer like that either.
Did you watch the movie about this? It's called Men behind the sun, if you're interested.
@@BettyWhite2171 I took a peak at it and could not sit through it. It may have looked old for a movie from 1988, yet was ahead of its time when it came to depicting the most gruesome acts of violence in history.
Always listened to jre at work, untill I discovered this gem thanks brother very informative and factual. Good work man
My grandpa and his brothers fought in Burma glad that they were never caught by the Japanese
I'm a victim of unit 731 my grandfather was geneticly experimented on, and me and my father have a genetic condition which drs think is directly related and caused from my grandfather's experimentation
I am so, truly sorry... Heartbreaking x
Would you care to elaborate ? I’m curious because what is told is that nobody survived unit 731
@@CRSaltVeins their was a lot of survivors from 731, but only a very very small amount percentage based when compared to the total amount of overall victims. My grandfather was tortured and was apart of many many diff experiments but the one that caused me and my father to be born with a major genetic disorder is from when they forced groups of people to endure increasing amounts of radiation to the point of making some of them die from accute radiation sickness!
very quickly after the experiment, the decreased the intensity but increased the durations of exposure so instead of short rlly intense doses they went to lower doses that they received all throughout the day which lasted the majority of the rest of his imprisonment at 731 he endured insane cumulative amounts of non lethal levels of radiation, He just like almost every else who was apart of that "experiment" got cancer! I think it was only 4? Or 6months? Or so.. after the war ended when the first cancer came, but between the wars end and his death a few yrs later from cancer he ended up having like 3-4 completely diff types of cancer over the course of those yrs!
I dont mean like one spread to somewhere else I mean like he had whole diff types of cancer happen to him, which is crazy! But during the few yrs he was alone and fighting cancer he remarried and he had 5 kids and every single one had some major genetic condition or deformities, each person being born with a diff condition never the same disease showing in diff kids or twice, and all of the genetic conditions had never ran in our family history before that, and his other 6 children who were all born before the war with his first wife.
Whom was also was in 731 and she actually died in 731. But before he was tortured for almost 2yrs straight while living in Hell on Earth, him, his wife and kids were all perfectly healthy, after 731 his wife, 2 of his kids with her died, 1 other kid was permanently mentally disabled from some type of lobotomy type torture they performed on her. And his other kid luckily didnt get tortured too bad my grandpa always said he thinks its because he was so young and they think he was used as some type of control group in diff "experiments" so he got rlly lucky.
My grandfather entered with his wife and 4 of his kids into 731, afterwards he left 731 with only 2 kids alive with one being permanently mentally handicapped, the other being the young son that got lucky as survivors or 731. I mentioned previously he had 6 kids but luckily his oldest kid, his first born son who was a late teenager during the outbreak of ww2 when everything kicked off and rlly started getting serious he was in china and my grandfather made him stay in China with relatives and wouldnt let him return home. So he escaped the brutality of the Japanese government, but did end up needing to join the Chinese army. My grandfather is white and was living in korea with my Korean grandmother.
She was raped and shit by the Japanese army and then they forced her, her kids and my grandfather into 731 after the captured her small village. But theirs so much more to it, this is just the basics off the top of my head but yea.. if u have any more questions or would like to talk over the phone some about it I'd be happy to talk with you or answer any questions you have.
But short answer is, radiation exposer fucked and mutated my grandpa's dna and genetic shit in his seamen up, so when he had kids afterwards his dna was all fucked up in his seamen so when he had kids they all had defects, my dad having one which he then pasted onto me genetically. So I have a condition and I view myself as a victim of them even being alive 80yrs later.
Edit: I forgot to mention their is some good that came from all the bad tho, all the data collected by exposing my grandfather and other people to radiation, the knowledge was extremely valuable and important after the Nagasaki and Hiroshima happened, all the "medical" notes they took on the prisoners was read and used to help treat survivors of the nuclear Bombs, and the relatively small group of people who were apart of that "experiment" contributed knowledge that potentially saved 1ks of lives possibly even more so.
Damn, thank you for sharing this. I had no idea it even existed. Best podcast ever.
i just listened the podcast for the second time and no other episode has angered me so much , i can't believe that American government let all of this savages go free , nut only that but they allowed them high positions in various disciplines , disgusting.
Thank you for taking the time to share the story and to be informative as always and honestly to be humanizing about it, not just pushing a single point of view.
Those who feel the need to apologize for microwaving the Japanese twice at the end of the war need to listen to this.
Those civilians would have become hostiles as soon as conventional forces landed on their shores, and they would all be killed anyways. Atomic bombs saved more lives than sending Marines and soldiers would have. Imperial Japan was a borderline religion which all of its inhabitants were willing to die for. Use of the atomic bomb was an act of mercy.
Oh, and we helped them rebuild their country after the war. Not the case with Germany, who rebuilt themselves. I don't here any apologies heading Germany's way for leveling Dresden and Hannover along with several other major cities where several civilians were also killed. Do they deserve an apology?
shugo104 I won't speak for Jocko, but I think he does express his opinions on it at 1:03:25. Regardless of what his opinions are on this matter, I don't believe it would really change mine on the matter.
I understand your reasoning as far as not becoming blind with hatred for your enemy. I still don't see where the apology part comes in though. They needed to be stopped, they were stopped, end of story. I don't feel sorry for that, nor do I feel that America needs to apologize for that, especially after helping them rebuild.
I do respect your consistency in your reasoning though, although I don't entirely agree with it. And your civility.
Forrest Cravens
Aha I can see sides flipping in a different world and the Japanese use the excuse that we are too patriotic and would fight to the last civilian so they had to nuke places like New York & San Diego. Quit bullshitting. After we nuked the civilians, we did a thousand bomb grand finale that the generals planned to celebrate their surrender. While peace pamphlets fell on Tokyo. So did fucking bombs. Quit bullshitting dude I see through you
Forrest Cravens
Oh yes “helping them rebuild” like establishing military bases on their island and guaranteeing they never have another standing army to defend themselves ever again. Oh yeah big fucking help dude
ROKMC Rec. And even more Japanese. Both by our weapons and their own due to suicide as a result of their failures to defend their homeland. It was the samurai way.
Wow, this needs more attention than it gets
I've always been fascinated by 731. It's concerning how many people still have no idea about it, and I try to learn all that I can on the subject so that I may try to understand it on some level. But the more that I learn, the more that I see, it doesn't make it make any more sense. It's intense psychopathy and sociopathy all the way down, under the flimsiest of reasoning. And to think of how many other events of similar brutality that have happened, still happen, will happen... it's beyond horrifying.
That's the way the mind works. Anything you can imagine, the worst possible things, have already been done. There's no rational thought behind it, it's pure selfishness and disconnection from reality. The ultimate display of us vs. them. We are special beings living under the emperor, they are just sacks of meat. No different from the Nazis or religious extremists. Separation between you and me, not being able to recognize others as equals. Selfishness or self-centered activity is the most common mental illness of humanity.
The way Jacko is holding his knife 🔪 and complaining how echo didn't get him more trucker hats at 2:05:20 😂
These people were ruthless! I don't understand how people can have such disregard towards another human being.
by not considering them human beings
ungface Makes sense. Just don't get why people like Ishi gotta be assholes
lmaooo
He wanted to win AT ALL COST
ShowMeState 38 the Japanese Shinto Buddhist system has a meditation practice to "annihilate the soul" and disassociate a person from their feelings of remorse, regret, guilt, sympathy, etc.
I searched this out. Out of interest. Curiosity. I'm glad to find Jocko had a show on it
By the 47 minute mark, I'm without words. I am just shocked. This has us all reeling and sick to our stomachs.
saving this podcast for later, so forgive me if it's mentioned already. the atrocities continued on past Unit 731 after one of the lieutenant generals in the unit went on after the war to create Japan's first commercial blood bank which grew to be a very large pharmaceutical company called Green Cross (basically was Japan's equivalent of Johnson & Johnson). the company knowingly, and with disregard to the known dangers, imported HIV infected blood for use in hospitals to treat hemophiliacs which caused the AIDS crisis in Japan in the late 1980's/early 90's and killed around 3,000 people. Masao Miyamoto wrote a great article about it called, "Mental Castration, the HIV Scandal, and the Japanese Bureaucracy".
1:40:40 Probably the best speech Ive ever heard jocko say.
We shall never forget.... thank you Jocko Willink for bringing the darkness to light
IT astounds me the evil Man is capable of doing when desperate and following orders , this podcast really taught me a lot, and it shows that history is the greatest teacher of all and if we need it's warnings we can avoid the path of darkness and atrocity. Thank you again Jocko , the podcasts just keep getting better
this video and podcast is criminally underrated
First video from Jocko and oh boy what a doozy. I think you got a subscriber for life. This lab is what I imagined hell to be like with all the inventive tourtures, what could be a worse experience? I can't imagine....
When moral absolutes are rejected, science becomes its own ethic and these things are allowed to happen
I can’t stop listening to this. I’m always curious about this sort of stuff. It’s haunting to hear about what humans are capable of but I can’t stop being intrigued and wanna hear about it
Tough one to listen to, but completely understand why it is important. Thanks Jocko/Echo!!
I’m surprised I didn’t learn about Unit-731 In school 🏫 only online
There are things much worse than war, and it's very necessary for people to realize that kind of evil is still living within people nowadays.
This one was rough. I remember reading the Raping of Nanking, and now listening to this,......this is just horrifying.
Jocko has an episode on Nanking. It's brutal to listen to, but they had to live it :c
It was always bother me and anger me that the world has no idea how bad the Japanese were in the war. It’s always Nazi Nazi Nazi but nobody wants to read history to see they shouldn’t keep holding up Russia and Japan to such a high level
And Russia has its share of unimaginable atrocities too. Stalin's Gulags were literal hell on earth, people literally eating each other alive because killing was too much effort.. just take what you want and eat it while the person being consumed screams.. The atrocities that unfolded under Stalin's regime, not just the gulags but everything - it's almost beyond comprehension (as is Nanking and other Japanese atrocities) but many people insist nazis and white slave owners in early America were the worst of the worst in all of history. Heck yes they were bad, not denying that... but my gosh, there is just so much more to even our very recent history. Heck Nanking was so bad that nazis were risking their lives to try to save civilians from the brutalities being inflicted upon them. It has to be really, really bad when nazis come out as the good guys in a sitiation. And after having heard Yeonmi Park speaking out about what's happening in NK.. these things things are still happening in this world right now :c Yet it's always nazis and white slave owners with most folks - that's the limit of their understanding of the evils humans can inflict on other humans. But heck.. maybe it's better to be that way? Sometimes maybe it would be better to just not know. :/
Theres a lot of blurred lines when it comes to evil in our everyday society. But this kind of stuff is just evil no matter what side you're on. If youre ever in a position to make these mistakes, this is the kind of stuff that haunts you til the end.
Well done. This is appreciated. So hard to hear but it truly is necessary to know what our own are capable of and have done. Thank Jocko and Charles..
Can’t find a new copy of the book. Only used and they are around $50 us
It's one of the oldest tactics glad everyone paying in attention salute
First time listening. Crazy how relevant this is to corona and its origins.
Thank you very much!
I read a lot about the Unit and dealt with the subject. It saddens me to see how easily you get over the US crime of protecting these monsters. Protecting a war criminal is also a crime. And a big one at that. I won't even start the whole moral point of view. That's on a whole new level.
Probably because it's something that has been known for a long time now. We were taught some of the atrocities, can't get too detailed with children, of this Unit along with our recruitment of some of the scientists/use of their work along with recruitment of certain nazi rocket scientists starting in 6th grade in my personal experience.
Furthermore before the History Channel turned into All Aliens All the Time, it was full of war documentaries that did not skimp on terrible things the US did. Tuskegee experiments, Internment of Japanese Americans, Bioterrorism research, Agent Orange, Inciting Revolutions and etc in countries in the course of the Cold War with the USSR, etc, etc.
We are taught our dirty history through not only schools but the media. There are countless documentaries, shows, podcasts, yt videos, movies, and the like out there detailing the ugly parts of our history.
Even just a cursory Google search pulls up a lot of the shady shit the government has pulled.
15 Japanese doing those experiments were convicted.
@@orlock20 Yeah but we did take some of the head guys' intel in exchange for no prosecution
@@Saphire1993 The head guys were prosecuted plus even underlings such as an orderly.
Thank you. May we never forget that Japan did commit these heinous crimes.
Does anyone else wanna hear Jocko talk about Operation Paperclip?
Tough listen. Had to listen 20 minutes at a time. Good job guys.
😂 Words hurt ya that much
@@stevencrow5462 They do if you actually have a working mind and imagination.
@@shroomzed2947 lol na, got those in spades
Halfway through and zero "getting after its"
That's pretty legit of that Russian officer.
Here are your captors and tormenters , do whatever the hell you want with them. I'm amazed more didn't take Revenge.
Real Evil exists.
Societies use psychopaths and sociopaths to do these kind of things ; we are all involved !
13:47 "Back to the bookTOGOVILLAGERS"..
Damn, the popular children’s game Roblox is named after unit 731, dark
Japan: horrific nightmarish torture
Also Japan: anime! sushi! (◕ᴗ◕✿)
I saw a video of the japanese experiments as a kid when i visited korea in '91. My relatives there absolutely hated the Japanese and they showed me this video to show me why. There were a few experiments in them. I remember the frost bite experiments clearly and its worse than the explanation. There were two.
1) he tied a couple people outside in the snow with their hands out in front of them. The japamese would come out and pour water on their bare arms. Not sure how long but they would bring them in and dunk their arms in warm water and pull them out. Then theyd get get a stick and slide their skin right off the arms like socks with loose bands.
2) they would stick both arms in something that froze their arms solid in seconds, pull them out and crack them off with hammers like an ice sculpture.
There were a few more but those have stuck with me since ive seem them.
Great episode.
Only half of my family survived the Japanese Occupation of the Philippines. I forgive, but what was done to the Filipinos and other civilizations under Japanese occupations won’t forget anytime soon. My father was born in 1941. His first memories were of the occupation. He didn’t have feelings, not the way most people do. He couldn’t love me or anyone else. It wasn’t his fault.
The Rape on Nanking and now this?… always wondered how we could have dropped those bombs.. now I know. Ty. Peace to everyone and everything
To say that some of those involved involved in those atrocities my reconcile their actions is in a way to justify evil. When a gross maltreatment of a humans is left unpunished does that give some acceptance of these atrocities as a necessary evil? Where do we draw the line? Can other societies justify wrong doing by sighting the the inhuman treatment performed at Unit 731 and it's sub-units? How, as civilisation are we going to advance if these atrocities are not known so we can learn to recognize the signs so we don't decline and justify such evil?
Damn David Wallace knew a lot more about history than the office portrayed
Explain
Jocko is a harrrrrd man.
hard as metal
US Marine checking in. 2002 - 2010. OIF x 2. Thanks.
I just hope that useful insight was gained from all that suffering.
And 3 years later.......
The First rule about 731 is . " You do NOT talk about 731 " - Jocko Podcast. Good video Bro
Honestly I'm gonna try molk for the first time here soon, because I wanna know how good it actually is
You know, I used to listen to Joe Rogan, and then I came to Jocko after the Rogan interviews and I have to say Jocko's stuff is pretty fucking powerful.
A pretty powerful fucking sadist
well...this is about as dark as it gets
When is David Goggins gonna be on here?
Blue Goat He's probably not. He's been on Rogan so many times that Jocko has stated he doesn't have much to talk with him about.
derek myers goggins has been on JRE only once. where did you hear jocko say this? Listened to all the episodes, not sure were you are getting this from.
It's literally a podcast about military shit u fucking mong
David Goggins does not have a good reputation in the seal community from what I’ve heard.
Now I fully understand, why the atombombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima were necessary. I would have delivered them myself.
Can your brain really not discern the disconnect between 2 innocent, civilian-populated cities and a corrupt government-funded facility, just because they exist within the same country? What kind of fucked up worldview do you have? If those bombings were "necessary" in your head, you're no better than the vile "researchers" of Unit 731.
Yeah man we're all fucked. Best of luck guys
ben cunningham yes there is a huge disconnect between innocent cities and the government military itself. Do you think japan regularly put the entirety of their assets on the coast so we can bomb them only? Civilians will always be killed where wars are fought future and present its inevitable although limitable. Tell me how the US can end the war with a casualty total on both sides of less than the around 200,000 killed in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. You can’t though. Although targeting Hiroshima and Nagasaki was an act of cruelty and something we shouldn’t celebrate dropping those bombs saved more lives on both sides.
@@URBANLEGENDKB By your logic, given the atrocities carried out by the US government i.e. Agent Orange, MK Ultra to name a few - would nuking America be considered an act of justice ? To prevent future wars and terrorism of course.
When the bombs were dropped the japanese closed the facilities.
I will listen to this until all of these acts are no longer existing
Ya know ... people say the Abombs were excessive ... idk I'd have to disagree I'm sorry but if these individuals werent allowed to quit when they asked and did this to their own people I believe we got lucky as horrible of a method it was I dont think it was excessive it ended the war and it got the potential disaster of a man made intentional plague to be stopped ... if they had utilized this knowledge I dont know if our society would have survived
So glad I found you!
My father was in Okinawa and Iwo Jima and recolected with deserved emotion how 16 inch shells from a battleship could crush Japanese military occupants heads like smashed eggs protected by 20 foot 👣 thick concrete walls in beach fortifications.
Help chat, I'm looking for a Jocko soundbite. Its to the tune of "3 missions in life, A passion, yadda yadda, and a woman to save". Was it from the the mook episode or the Perterson one?
As a physician scientist, I have trouble understanding how most of this data would have been useful. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. Was this guy really a scientist? While they were wasting resources on this ridiculousness, we had the Manhattan Project.
Thank you for this podcast
Any one know of some really great ones about ww2, the Pacific Islands and of course Iraq or Afghanistan. Like first person talking about fire fights. I've heard some of the main one's, but if anyone has some plz let me know. Thanks
This ones gnarly. But worth a listen, to put things in perspective.
S 1 was it worse than the nanking episode
sook Mike hawk didn’t listen, what #?
60 it's really fucked up
sook Mike hawk thank I'm gonna have a listen
If one does not learn from history, nothing will save you.
A lot of information about this has been removed from you tube.
Jocko have you thought about pre packaged milk or should we stick with the Ziploc bags
I had to listen to this podcast in three parts...to heavy for just one sitting...
whelp I know what my next book purchase is.
I almost didnt make it through this it was tough... It has to be known.
Me as well. Almost just had to stop listening. But we owe it those who suffered.
Amazing and interesting podcast!!!
All of this is under the umbrella of war, so the quote "Nothing more stupid and fearful than war" stands.. with the exception being that the tolerant cannot be tolerant of the intolerant.
Love the Jocko Podcast. The way he tells stories is awesome!
Thank you sirs for sharing this info and it makes me wonder if there are any connections to Lymes and ticks, which could be compared to fleas and rats, and what went on from 2020-present with the vaccine mandate, and those are just two examples did ishi have that figured out as well or was it a springboard to what we experienced lately. Also I was thinking about what makes groups from different areas do the same kinds of things, was ishi exposed and influenced by eugenics like hitler was? We as a people I think need to discuss more these unpleasant and terrible events, if nothing else but to show some kind of rememberence and to try to honor their lives in some way so their deaths and suffering were not in vain. If we look at all the events and exposures that have happened in our lives that made us who we are and shaped us down one path or another, if it works on a small scale it will also work on a larger scale…….
Lest we forget... "Hell on earth" lacks few hells here.