Yesss very true!! Happened to me and I knew what kind of person they were while everyone else was falling for the fake persona, and I just sat there thinking "wow these people have no idea"
The worst thing is the lack of self-awareness and inability/unwillingness to have empathy. Narcs can hurt people so badly, but because they never bother to put themselves in your shoes, they act clueless about the harm they're causing. But if anyone ever gave them the same treatment, they would be shattered. I've seen this happen, where if someone reacts to their abuse, they act shocked and hurt, not understanding that the reaction was caused by their original bad action. They view themselves as innocent, and can justify every bad deed they do. And if they're knowledgable about psychology, they'll use psychological theories to excuse their behavior. It's maddening.
I think a narc doesn't care how bad they hurt you because they think you deserve it. This would explain their lack of remorse and empathy later when you tell them to get to steppin'. Since they cannot elevate themselves out of their inferiority mindedness, it may be easier to "bring 'em [the victims they envy] down a notch" by harming them.
What can you do about this? When you are dealing with a daughter who is 40yrs old, who is a convert narcissist and I love her. I don't want to shatter her I want to help her. I don't know how to handle her anymore..except avoid her. But I don't want to hurt her.
This is so true, This video is spot on... I'm married to one, he has me in the silent treatment phase so this will be the time I use to plan my exit strategy, 14 years I've been playing his game and I didn't even realize it until this year. So because he's giving me the silent treatment I'm allowing it to play through I've blocked him on my phone and on Facebook, when he comes home, I'll do the same if he asks me a question I'll give him one word answer and walk away, he's even trying to get me to react by leaving a mess around knowning that I'll say something to him and clean it up...Welp not this time. The mess he left is still in the same spot although it's killing me to leave the mess, I have to show him that he to can be devalued in my eyes as well. I'm working on building back up my self love.
In the beginning - It's like finding the most sincere kindest person in the whole wide world. They are nice and gentle. They are affectionate. They will cuddle you and hold you. A couple months in you will notice that they seem to lack in the intimacy department but you will dismiss that to shyness. They will mimic/mirror your style of communication & you the entire time (which goes unnoticed until they become distant with you & use new words). I learned that If you express intimate emotions they will say “I feel the same way for you too or I would do the same thing for you or I love you just as much or I'm glad to hear that.” Which feels insincere and robotic. However you might dismiss that to shyness or inexperience expressing feelings (even tho they could be gorgeous & clearly experienced with women). They will never voluntarily just express their love for you in their own words and say how much they love or miss you. Very rarely will you get an “I miss you" or ” love you" for no reason at all. You will wonder why? Like do they have any feelings? So, you find yourself working harder to make them feel more safe & more loved in hope's that they provide that love back to you. It's easy to dismiss them withholding as a lack of trust or insecurity because they seem so nice. You will look for logic in behaviors and with Coverts there is never any logic which will lead your further down a rabbit hole creating confusion. In time you will start to doubt your own perception of what you see and lack the clarity to see the abuse. You will have more anxiety, lack inner peace & feel tired. Your physical appearance might change where you either gain or lose weight. You struggle to keep yourself at peace. Its exhausting. By now, you have became an expert at everything they like. You take on all the chores and make their life as easy as possible. You feel isolated too b/c they kept you “away". You feel so confused b/c you worked so hard to break down their walls in hopes of a more consistent close bond with them. One day they seem really into you and the next they withhold affection. It's hard trying to figure out what is wrong. The more you vocalize your feelings the more they encourage you with their words that everything is ok. You certainly don't feel “ok" but you make peace with it the best you can and start “withholding” your feelings too b/c they have made you feel like your “too" sensitive and it's too much! Most of the time it will feel like they are present in the flesh but nothing else is going on inside them. Even after all this time you've been together you still feel like you don't really know them. If you happened to gain the courage at a later time to ask more questions as to why things still feel off they will say your being insecure & that they aren't cheating and make you feel like you have issues. If you cry they will watch tv, stare at their phone or even continue to eat dinner. They won't ever give you all their undivided attention & acknowledge your pain. Which makes you more confused bc their actions doesn't match their words. They won't look at you while you cry, they seem like it causes them shame to see you cry. At times you might feel like your having to teach them about feelings as if they were a child. You will wonder why their emotional intelligence seems very immature/off. Everything they have is something you also don't have access too. Their family, phone, friends, bank accounts, pay stubs, credit card statements, and etc. You will start off feeling like they are very private or insecure & years in it now feels like they are super secretive b/c it makes no sense for them to still be so private. They promise things that they don't see through or conveniently feel bad or forget everything that is important to you. They will isolate you and hide their relationship with you. When you express that something about what they are doing isn't right then they act like they lack understanding and that they do nothing to hurt you. You will always be explaining everything and wondering why they just don't get it! They will even use apologies as a form of manipulation. (lack of empathy and no change to their behavior). You will always feel like you need to phone a friend to ask if your situation is normal because this person will give you $200 to pamper yourself but won't invite you to Christmas dinners or let you have access to their phone. They will leave/abandon/ghost you to say they are sleeping at a relative's house then on their way home they will offer to bring you breakfast or something from the store. Even their giving is a form of manipulation. They want to distract you with gifts to keep you off balanced from the emotional abuse they are putting you through. When you ask them why they didn't come home they will say they felt like you didn't want them around or etc. You will spend the entire relationship wondering how someone who seems like such a nice person can be so emotionally cold. Moreover, People wonder why they end up hurt, seriously hurt, and even killed for their own actions. Cheating is a choice and there’s simply a lot of ignorance in the process.... Thank you so much for helping me out Metaspyclubllc@gmail. com. Your advice and services helped me so much. You are a lifesaver !!! The information you gave me about my cheating partner when you gave me access to his phone was everything I needed to get,.. thank you very much..
I like to describe the conflict as a crazy making merry go round. If you start feeling confused and discussions turn into arguments that just go in circles and you feel you’re not being heard and this becomes the pattern, you are quite possibly dealing with a fragile covert narcissist. If it doesn’t feel normal, then it’s not.
My sister is a covert. If you really listen to a covert while they're telling a story, you'll see that in the story they are the heroes and the victim. Its crazy!
They make up stories, pathological liars...they are delusional & actually believe they are a victim...however, they also consciously know they are manipulative...they see it as justified....they are entitled, yet full of shame...narcissists are the epitome of irony & hypocrisy/double standards because they believe they deserve special treatment & at the same time the covert feels a sense of guilt while their conscience is not enough to stop their sick behavior.
These are the worst, they are more devastating because they seem like a good person and gain your trust then tend to backstab you when you least expect it. Especially in the workplace.
It's really tough because my mother is a covert narcissist and she 100% doesn't believe that she is one, even after bringing it up to her many times. She thinks she can't be a narcissist, in her words, because she has empathy for other people, but when she's confronted or ''challenged'' about a behavior, she acts like a victim, is passive aggressive, makes you feel like you're crazy so basically invalidates everything, completely denies ever being hurtful NO MATTER HOW SMALL THE ISSUE IS, and she has NEVER apologized to me IN MY ENTIRE LIFE even after laying out all the narcissistic and hurtful things she's done. She also has a hard time putting herself in my dad's shoes even though he's suffering from depression, etc etc etc. All other signs point to her being a covert narcissist... thankfully I don't live with my parents anymore so I can be away from it, but it's really tough to _not_ feel crazy, because she hides those behaviors so well until she's ''challenged'' on an issue. Is this a true narcissist or just one with strong traits of it, I wonder...?
In the workplace...in my life I can look back and see a pattern: the FIRST person I’d meet at the the job (who would be very nice, helpful, likable, etc.) would turn out to be the most TOXIC. 🙈
Lizanne Whitlow it’s crazy sometimes. I befriended a guy at my work who’s an expert and valuable on the team, helped onboard him etc... we’d sit next to each other and talk all the time when things were slow. Then it’s like literally (around the holidays) in less than a week he changed. I came in once and was like “hey happy Monday” no response. Figured he was busy but then it became every day and I’d just keep my distance. Then before I knew it he’d be calling me out in meetings without cause, throwing me under the bus, painting me as an idiot in front of management and in front of the client etc, completely out of nowhere. Copying emails to management and putting me down, very condescending and micromanaging....a dictator and a bully sometimes. I wanted to ask him did I do anything or say anything wrong? Nope. I learned a hard lesson, co workers aren’t your friends. Maybe some can be over a long time but don’t trust them right away. The mask falls eventually for the coverts and they stab you in the back, it can cost a job.
For me, the covert narcissist comes across as a people pleaser. They like to be in the spotlight to get the validation that they crave for, as other narcissists but at the same time, they pretend to be humble, simple, generous, over giving. The covert narcissist will take time to build a relationship/friendship with you. During this period, they will show their admiration and their devotion by helping you with everything that is you need. They will try to convince you that you are soulmates and that they understand you deeply. At the same time, you will see them being overly altruistic, maybe helping society by engaging in charities, activism. They feed the poor, take care of the homeless. All this makes you think how lucky you are for having met such a beautiful soul. You want to be by their side for ever. However, soon you notice how much they enjoy being invited in galas to talk about their achievements. But they don’t admit that. They still play the humble guy who doesn’t want all this. Who is beyond money, beyond fame and recognition, who wants to share the floor with other people. But their acts don’t match their words. You come to realise that this selfless soul is actually doing whatever it takes to be in the centre of attention. When you do something together be it at work or at home, they want to control everything about it. They just exerce their control in a more polite and implicit way, making you believe that your voice was heard whereas in reality you did what they wanted you to do. Covert narcissists have a smooth way of leading you on. They don’t shout, they don’t give orders. They are master actors. They convince you that you are together in this. What makes them a narcissist is that when the time comes for them to use you in order to draw certain benefits, they will do it without a second thought and you are not going to believe in your eyes. And when you stand up for yourself and raise your voice against them calling them for their phony identity, then you will see their rage for the first time and the mask will fall. Covert narcissists manipulate less with rage/exhibiting superiority and more with people pleasing behaviour/playing the eternal victim. They are not aggressive as overt narcissists. They are more cunning. What they both have in common is self-centered ness and lack of empathy. In the case of coverts, it will take you longer to find out.They knew what they wanted to get out of you from the beginning. They created a whole theatre play to fool you about who they are and their true motives. You will trust them with all your heart but when the time comes for them to prove their loyalty by choosing your bond over their personal gain, they will choose the latter with no remorse, without even taking any responsibility. Unlike the overt narcissist, they will have an eloquent excuse for doing so, rationalizing why they had to f@ck you over. They will pretend to be sorry about it because this is something that matches the image of modesty that they want to project but in reality they are not sorry at all. You will see them partying with your own money when they said they didn’t have enough to pay you back. You will see them being unfair and untrustworthy to other people as well. When the mask of the victim will fall, you will see the cruel smile of a perpetrator who managed to get what they want without deserving it. If you decide to unmask them run for your life. Moreover, Catching a cheating spouse might be difficult, and knowing what local laws say you can and cannot do might be even more difficult. To simplify the process, consider hiring a private investigator to do the sleuthing for you I genuinely appreciate how incredible you are and your work! Thank you for a job well done Barryinvestigation@gmail. com.
I never realized my mother was a covert narcissist until I went to counseling. She did some terrible, terrible things to us and never took responsibility. Narcissist mother, alcoholic father...how did I make it this far?
I've suspected for a long time my wife was possibly a covert narcissist and your videos have more or less confirmed my belief. There have been a multitude of things done over the years, but just days after my dad passed away and knowing I was deeply hurting, she actually said to me "dwelling on his death isn't going to bring him back, just get over it". Followed closely by "you knew this day was coming so him passing shouldn't have been a surprise". Deeply insensitive and a total lack of caring about my feelings were the beginning of the end. I knew at that moment I was dealing with a whole new level of monster.
Yet if someone THEY know died its the niggest catastrophy in the hisyory of mankind.Also,I tried to explain empathy to my narc saying"you dont go with someone to a funeral to bring him back.You dont do c.p.r on the deceased.You go to show with actions to the person that THEY are not alone suffering suffering. He sat there blinking lije if that was a revelation.SICK stuff.
@@Benlovesscience Have you looked in to see why you hang around them? You have the power to fill your emptiness with soul searching rather than the rollercoaster of other maliciously empty individuals. You need a purpose, a mission, to open up your emotions, and to find who you are through spiritual growth. Otherwise, you can blame them for their behavior, but at the end of the day, you can and will eventually walk away.
@@sabinegroe2006 It may not be what you want to hear, but I am not looking for your approval. My heart has been broken by a covert and an overt narcissist before. I know the feeling. But I also know that I found them, meaning I had codependency to work on. Don't think you're blameless. I know I sure as hell wasn't. Once the victim phase, which btw is what your ex is continuously in, passes, you'll come to realize this. Have a lovely day. It only goes up from here.
Just be calm and keep your eyes open. Most people are not what they pretend to be should be understood. You will draw people similar to yourself. Take care of loving yourself. If you are an Empath personality like myself narcs will spot you easily.
@@mrp8173 but they pretend to be. We have no more time to waist on if they truly are or not. The narrcissist have gift and abilities too. They are decievers.
@@mrp8173 dont you know by now there isnt enough empaths to go around. Empaths a rare . especially when your one yourself, it is really hard to find another one. The percentage in my opinion is 1 out of 10 people are truly a empath in this world.
I would say the first sign will come from your own gut feeling which will send signal to your body telling you that this person doesn't make you feel comfortable being around him/her. The fact that you are already asking this question should alert you to be careful. Something will feel off and you won't know what it is exactly. Covert narcissists can act very charming in the beginning but there will be often also present underlying sense of superiority about them. That sense is actually deriving from them feeling insecure about themselves, so they tend to quietly degrade others in order to feel better about themselves. On the other hand if covert narcissist feels that you are above his league, he will act like your servant, trying to please you - almost annoying in a way. But make no mistake. If you decide to stay in a relationship with him, he will downgrade you and abuse you like all the others. Because in his mind, if you love him, he thinks you are unworthy of him. Covert narcissists hate themselves so if someone loves them, than they think this person is worth less than them and that they can do better. Other sign to look for is any kind of judgment towards others. If he criticises other frequently, he will more likely criticise you as well once he gets more comfortable around you. Pay attention to how he treats people that are dependent on him as well. Narcissists hate those especially if they can't get anything of of that for themselves. Moreover, Cheating in marriages is not restricted to only men. Women cheat as much as men do. If you're suspecting your husband of infidelity, you'll have to keep an eye on him without his knowledge. One of the best ways to know if your spouse cheats on social platforms is by paying close attention to how your spouse behaves while online. The signs are pretty the same. Is your spouse more time on the app without explanation and gets unnecessarily defensive when you ask about it? If your spouse behavior has changed lately, and continues to spend more time on social apps, it's time for you to take action, with the help of a private investigator (suggested; METASPYHUB@GMAIL. COM , you can find out what is taking all their time on social apps, who they are talking to and other things happening,,
Wow! Yes, it was incredibly uncomfortable and bizarre to me that my now ex boyfriend, a covert narcissist acted like my servant for a week then stonewalled for reasons unknown to me. Then left me in a heartbeat for a job 4 hours away. He thought I would just wait on him until he decided to take a different job. He didn’t have to get a job 4 hours away. He wanted that particular job to compete with me.
My ex was a covert and he said everyone in his life needed to be trained, so they would do things properly. He was highly vindictive and said he would wait years to get revenge on someone who hurt him. He was also proud of the fact that he had no empathy. When I first met him, the first few months, I would never have believed he was a narcissist at all, he was so charming and a lot of fun. They are so clever at acting at being nice.
Yes I didn’t know either until recently been Marty to him 21 years never noticed because I was working taking care of the kids taking to sports etc . I have been notice it more and more where it’s weighing me down .
"he said everyone in his life needed to be trained, so they would do things properly. " Beautiful description. When my son-in-law's love-bombing mask came off and his vulnerable narcissism came to the fore, with my daughter becoming both his flying monkey and a vulnerable narcissist in her own right, they set off on a mission to "train" her side of the family, largely on how not to offend him. The whole world pretty much had to revolve around his sensitivities, and to a growing extent feeding her insatiable need for validation. They wanted to do this through family therapy and other means. In the particulars of our case it happened to revolve around race, CRT, and the idea of white privilege to begin with, then as we became completely estranged from him, the core became my daughter's need for validation regarding her own extreme changes in behavior.
When in a relationship with a narcissist; your problems will never be as bad as theirs so they will NEVER be there for you You will NEVER be good enough for them! It doesnt matter what you do? They will make sure to find a reason why you didnt make them happy! If you are sensitive? It will take a VERY long time for you to heal! As soon as you know they are a narcissist? RUN RUN RUN FAST!!
So just because someone is sensitive it takes them longer to heal? Can you explain please. I just think it really depends on the person's strengths and mind.
@@primsandwhims7533 Not. Sure what she meant that if you are sensitive it takes longer to heal from a narcissistic relationship But I am psychologist and can tell you healing does take varying lengths of time. Much depends on the victims personality. Some people are more prone to depression than others, some have a history of another narcissistic relationship eg with a parent so they have two deep wounds to,heal instead of one. The time to heal indeed DOES vary widely. I DONT MEAN TO SPEAK FOR HER and I am not chastising you for your comment either....I just thought I should say something factual to this Sybil Francis PhD
Omg this is so true. Im trying to escape a narc now and the guy always has something chaotic and challenging happening around him. So bad that he NEVER has space for me to feel ANYTHING. And when I am upset, he gets so upset because of the fact that I'm upset that im helping him work through it. There is no room for feelings with narcs!
There are many different signs. These include spending time on phone that was not spent previously, withholding sex from you, withdrawing in communication with you, agitation or anger over Petty stuff or making up situations to get angry or agitated over, lying, being secretive in any way, randomly spending more time caring for and pampering oneself such as putting on makeup or wearing cologne or coloring hair etc. Any type of changed behavior that is not aimed at pleasing or benefiting your relationship. With all of that though, follow your gut. your gut is telling you that something isn't right and it's telling you that this could or is happening, therefore listen to it. Just Free yourself from all of it! Run and don't look back. Go 100% no contact. The mental and emotional abuse is not okay at all! Do not bring anything up to her. Don't try to rationalize or have a conversation about anything. Don't let her know that you know she's in narcissist. All of that can cause a narcissistic rage. If you have not yet witnessed one of those just trust me that you don't want to! A narcissistic rage is beyond any rage I have ever seen or witnessed in my entire life. I am an army combat veteran and served front lines for a year and afghanistan. I have abuse going back from as long as I can remember, the first time in my personal memory is 2 years old. With everything I have been involved in, and my rape, other sexual abuse, their physical abuse, etc in narcissistic rage is by far the worst! If you need to contact your local police department and start a new contact order. No one can protect you like you can! free yourself from it all and move forward in your life. The minute you run and go no contact is the minute your life begins again. If need be seek out professional help. Therapy is the best thing I did for myself. The best gift I gave to me! The abuse is so deep and overwhelming that having a professional guide you through the steps of the healing process is extremely beneficial! Just remember, there is great strength in asking for help. There is great lack and strength or no strength at all in putting on a mask and hiding behind the opinions of society and pretending that you are okay! As human beings we all witness A Time In our lives where we are not okay! Those that heal, move past, and move forward, and have a brighter future are those who ask for help and do the work that is needed through the help! I'm so sorry you are going through this and I wish you the very best! Good luck! Always remember that you are stronger than you believe you are, you are worthy and deserving of better and always, and you are enough just the way you are and who you are today! Take this time for you! Get yourself again. Fix that meal that you're all time favorite, rent that movie you've been wanting to see, have a guys night out with your best friends, remodel a room in your home, go purchase that item you've been wanting to for so long, just do for yourself! Self-acceptance, self-love, and being able to forgive yourself is far more important than what anyone else can give to you! Believe in who you are! You deserve nothing less than that! You're not alone! Feel free to tag me in any other questions that you have! I'll help if I can. Additionally you can hire a cyber expert to help you get remote access to their phone so you can track them and monitor all of their activities without them knowing. You may locate the top cyber specialists locally at Digitalinvestigate@gmail. com, where you can engage a well-trained professional to assist you..........
8:00 this is so true. I have a friend since childhood that it took me a long time to see their narcissism. I told him one day that my pregnant wife had just been pulled over by our dog, that was chasing a squirrel, and landed on her belly. I was blown away at not only his lack of concern, but his struggle to not smile. He didn't have anything worse to compare that incident to. So he really struggled to find the right fake emotion to respond with. It was that moment that I realized he wasn't who I thought he was. Since that veil was lifted he screams narcissist in everything he does, and I've leaned to avoid him as much as possible. PS my wife and baby are fine thankfully
Im a covert narcissist, it isn't on Purpose i act this way. I am aware but i catch it late. The lies, my life to other people is not what it really is. My whole life is a lie. Boredom is expensive. I buy so many different things and never follow through, today i want to learn ukulele, tomorrow lets buy a drone, ect ect. Nothing is my fault, i know it is, but back to lies we go. For an example, i crashed my truck while intoxicated. I called 911 and blamed it on a hit and run after i moved the vehicle. Emotions are wierd. I rarely cry but am always in thought over spilled milk, i get angry over little things because work is hard today, or things keep falling off the table, anything that is inconvenient to me makes me rage out...customer service don't stand a chance. As far as being nice, I'll do things for anyone, im bored and just do it because you asked. Later down the road I'll be expecting special treatment because i did something for you. If i fix your car, run errands for you ect, and you go and invite someone who did nothing for you to a party or something imma get jealous because it wasn't me. This is just snippets of last month for me. We are wreckless, bored, dishonest, and self centered. Some of us know and try to fix it, some of us know and make no effort. There are people who have no idea and just live this way and wonder why the world is out to get them.
My family is full of ragers.I think it is a learned behavior and you can actually see where it came from, in my family,my mother was a rager, she learned it from her father who was a rager.He learned it from his parents,etc. I hate the way I feel when I go into a rage and hurt the people around me. I can feel the rage boiling up and now I try to ask myself,what is wrong???Sometimes I realize I haven't eaten and probably have low blood sugar, sometimes I realize something happened at work to push me over the edge,sometimes I am tired, the list goes on...I have determined NOT to give in to rage attacks,and that since it is a learned behavior it can be unlearned. It is helping, and now when I feel the rage boiling up, I go into the other room,try not to respond when someone in my family is baiting me, just try to calm down.Several of the people in my family ENJOY the drama of everybody screaming at the top of their lungs.I don't. I have been watching the narcissist videos on TH-cam and it helps alot.I don't want to act the way some in my family do,it's too hurtful,and since they are not willing to discuss the problem and find solutions, I will continue to seek help on my own.The main thing I have learned thou is ANYTHING YOU LEARN, YOU CAN UNLEARN. Normal people DO NOT fly into a rage at the smallest thing, and i do Not want to be like the ragers in my family.
When we met, I thought my husband was the sweetest most gentle person, caring, thoughtful and loving. Now that I’ve realized the kind of person that he is, I know that what he did to me was what they call “love-bombing”. I’m still trying to cope with this realization and it makes me feel as if I’m entering a new world. Learning more about NPD, keeps giving me flashbacks of many different scenes from the past and even the most recent ones: all those times when he was making excuses for his violent behavior, comparing himself to me constantly, putting me down, making me cry on Christmas Day, New Year’s Eve and most recently this month on my birthday, the blaming and shaming, the insincere apologies, public humiliation, abusive behavior, manipulation….I feel dazed and I don’t know what to do.
Listen, falling for a covert narcissist is easy. I'm a mental health therapist and yes I fell for one. The day I realized what he was, was the same day my son was conceived. I broke up with him soon after and then a week after the breakup I missed my period and eventually learned I was pregnant. Covert narcissists are charismatic and gentle at first, but you soon learn they are ill people. They are frustrated with everything, blame you and guilt trip you for everything, try to diagnose you with a mental disorder to make themselves look like victims, lie, demean you, will steal your self esteem if you are weak and unaware of their games, manipulate, lack empathy in the most demonic way, use their own children for their benefit and traumatize them beyond no return, I can go on and on. Moral of the story is get out if you find yourself in that relationship. My son's father is not allowed in his life because I know what he is and the chances of him taking care of his child without a legal obligation is slim to none. I still can't believe I miss the signs in the beginning but I got out rather quickly. Think with your mind and not your sexual organs or you may find yourself with one of these demons.
I’m definitely or was a covert narcissist. It was pure misery for me in my twenties. Thank god I realized how much I lacked self awareness and this helped me a lot and I was able to stop some of the traits. I also notice my closest friends over the years were covert and overt narcissist. This is why when I dated the overt narcissist he couldn’t wreck complete havoc on my life like he did others because I could see thru him and understood it to a degree.
I relate to this.. I've always been told I was very selfish and everything, so I've always been trying to just work on myself and be a better person. But then there's these other people I know that always tell me that I'm the opposite, that I give too much of myself. I have no idea. I am so confused But I wonder if narcissist attract other narcissists because it just seems like I'm surrounded by these people that are so abusive, but at the same time whenever I try to have boundaries I know I'm being selfish... I end up having to apologize and make everything right all over again… I don't know how to explain this without sounding crazy but anyway.. I think i relate
@@revanthkrishna218 Hi!! The best way I can explain it is I shifted my motive in every relationship from my every move/action being to maintain a feeling of superiority and control over the other person to just doing what made me happy even if I’d be rejected or abandoned.
Beware the covert narcissist. If they think you are going to leave them, your life may be on the line. Her subtle questions about insurance and a smirk when I expressed concern for my health later, were actually warning signs. Two days in the hospital saved my life. Never disregard your gut feeling, run.
What a load of bullshit. Sorry that this happens to you but how about we don’t generalise personal anecdotes. I find my self in a lot of the mentioned aspects. And I want to better myself and become a better person for myself and my environment. But instead of tools how to work on my self all I find is hate and stigma. It seems like all videos about narcissism are just a place to unload frustration. You might be hurt by a narcissist but you can not dehumanise them as a consequence. If I take all those comments by heart I see no reason to get help because everything is always gonna be my fault no matter what.
@@chrizzlybearlol just chill and don’t take everything personally. Most of these comments are from tragic experiences. Dealing with Narcs is impossible. It’s good that you are trying to get better, but why should you take any one’s comment to heart. They are only basking on you if you interpret it that way.
My ex wanted me to put my home in his name. I kept telling him no. He then said we should take out life insurance videos on each other; he would be my beneficiary. I asked him why and it just turned into a fight. I was accused of not loving him . . . he became angry when I refused to agree to the life insurance policy. What I never told him, I have a life insurance policy, my children are the beneficiaries. I never figured out why he wanted to be my beneficiary so strongly.
A lot of extremely “narcissistic” individuals are able to maintain jobs. Look at politicians , celebrities, your undeserving manager.... the list goes on and on..........
@J A covert narcissists are extremely good at keeping jobs and friends for a very long time. They put up an altruistic persona while targeting the ones' that are close. True story🙂
Yes it really depends on their level. Overt low iq types can't keep jobs but blame everyone. They usually don't have close friends. Covert narcissists always have a band of friends because of the pity party but never really emotionally close. Higher range narcissists are also Machiavellian so can have high positions. Also they know how to mask
Exactly, idk what he was talking about. That can’t sit still and thrive to be number one, because they are their hardest critics and so they are very goal oriented because they are preoccupied with power, money, and beauty. They are absolute perfectionists.
Two problems with this analysis: I have known two extreme covert narcissists who both held down very good jobs for their careers. One bounced from hobby to hobby though. I also know two people who have suffered abuse at the hands of extreme narcissists who are struggling to find steady work because of all the criticism and stress put upon them by these people. Also, I find it hard to believe that they don’t know they are hurting others when they often take steps to hide it. Sometimes they manipulate, sometimes they character assassinate, sometimes they have selective memories, but I don’t believe they are unaware of the damage they are causing others.
Oh they know but don’t have the right convictions.. only sorry when something happens and they suffer the consequences.. they have a motive for every single thing they do and say . They use people, places and things ,
They're not unaware. But they're shallow and lack empathy when it comes to others. Fundamentally, it's all about them. If they can feel better by hurting others, they will.
@@DANFLIX98 Sexual, emotional, physical, mental.. What hurts the most is the nonchalant reaction of both parents when I was finaly able to tell. My father chose his women over me, my mother chose her friends over me.
No, some think 🤔 they are just like the Best at everything and they're always right, even if you can prove that they are wrong. He calls himself Wisdom and a shaman and healer, and I just want to help you. He told me I was so sick, that he treated my settlement money like it was his.
Yes the zombie apocalypse is happening, Learn thy enemy well and every version of it. This right here is at the root base of this whole pandemic. Malignant Narcissist's don't live or let live. It's extremely sick and twisted. The one good thing this pandemic did bring out was this subject in particular to light. Too much damage all accross the board for years. Glad we can all learn together. 🙏❤️
Just found out I have 56% covert narcissistic traits. I wasn't always this way. That's the reason I even took a test, cause I wasn't always like this. My mom is an overt narcissist and her behaviors used to hurt my feelings as a child. I was a pretty sensitive and stubborn child which made it suitable for my covert narcissism to develop. But I was emotionally intelligent and very empathetic. My mom was never subtle about her criticisms of me and the rest of the fam. Not even a minute would go by where she wouldn't criticize you of this or that. This made me really sensitive to criticism and my life still revolves around making her proud. This led to obsessive compulsive behaviors to deal with all the anxiety. Even sexual ones like masturbation from an early age. It messed me up pretty badly. Like I'd feel dirty all the time and would isolate and cry myself to sleep at nights. Then she started working the night shift and my dad worked the day shift and would come home late after she had left for work. This gave me even more time to self-destruct and damage my psyche. I don't even know how I'm still alive. I've always fantasized about suicide but never really hurt myself physically, Glory be to God! When I noticed I was acting this way because of a string of reasons mainly my mom, I began acting oppositely to how she does. In my own way, I was rebelling against her dictatorial rule and I was showing her I won't be a terrible human like her. She tells EVERYBODY about her problems so I always make sure to refrain from sharing mu problems to anyone She's outgoing so I became extremely introverted( I am a natural introvert but I became more so) She's always sharp about how she looks so I became careless in my style and appearance She likes to control people's every moves so I don't even inquire what people wanna do She invades people's privacies so I am always cautious about not bothering people She is religious so I ran away from religion until I couldn't bear the burden of my life without God( He saved me more than once) There's a lot I could say. My mom hates it when people praise my looks. She views it as a threat. Her beauty is like her super power in her eyes. When she gets compliments she wants to make sure you do so by depriving another person of that compliment so she could be unique. She likes to show off my academic achievements and she made sure to insert some snide to degrade the other person's kid. This made me hate my academic achievements in general. So covert narcissism was my safe haven. It's how I coped. How I survived. I found solace in introspection and self-pity. I hated it when people pity me but I basked in it when I felt it from within. I don't know if there's other psychological disorders that coincide with my behaviors. I just know I'm effed up and I'm gonna spend my life trying to overcome those flaws with God's help and help those around me up and never down. I have hope because even though the years have worn out my optimism and the empathy of the little girl I was, I still love people( I sometimes hate em ngl), I still have deep empathy for those hurting, I still give compliments to people because I genuinely want them to feel good and the biggest light I see in this situation is that I'm mostly VERY happy for people who made it and are physically beautiful. For those who wanna get better from the bottom their hearts, we'll get there! That's the beauty of being humans. We were made in the image and the LIKENESS of God. This messed up world tainted us but if you scrape enough you'll finally reach who you truly are. You're much more than your narcissism.
I am going to be honest with you there is hope for you. Because you acknowledge that you may have the traits. Even after seeing evidence people with NPD will STILL deny it and choose to look down others.
I think you are more traumatised than narcissist. Reading your comment did not make me feel like I needed to get away from you. When someone who has hurt you and abused you countless times says with a straight face they are "the only path to true healing" then you have met a true narcissist. You do get infected from them so maybe if you wait and avoid her you'll find that you score lower?
My mother is covert. I went no contact. It was very stressful living with her for a lot of reasons. One of them was we would move around a lot, no explanation as to why. I barely remember my childhood not from physical abuse or anything but because we moved and i changed schools so much. The boredom thing you talk about strikes me because it makes sense. It was extreme for us. Wed go to a place that she liked, for a long time, like it was traditional to go there often, and then suddenly we didnt have the cabin anymore, or suddenly we weren't going to the pond anymore or suddenly we had a new cool place to go like an expensive campsite or something. Usually there was an explanation but when we stopped going to the pond there wasn't really an explanation. I think she was just bored easily. Im certain she was behind a lot of things that suddenly stopped happening because it happened so often.
Hello Dr fox, I want to thank you for the tremendous amount of help that your videos have given me as I have numerous people in my family with personality disorders including myself. I'm a 60-year-old Caucasian male living in Michigan. On December 16th 2020 I relocated to move in with my 91 year old mother who suffers from end stage CHF. I prepared myself as much as I possibly could with regards to caring for an elderly parent, independence, not letting them feel like they don't have control and quite a lot of information on just what that person may be feeling and going through. The one thing I was not prepared for was my mother being a vulnerable or covert narcissist. She is as smart as a rack. No cognitive issues there. In fact it takes a great deal of calculating on her part to deceive and manipulate and "manage people". Disheartening to say the least as I just recently realized my eldest son was also showing every single trait. I did a lot of soul searching and went way back to my own childhood, environment, primary caregivers AKA parents, my ex-wife's mother being very narcissistic. My oldest daughter dealing with BPD. Some overlap with some manipulation. Just prior to the realization of my son I spent every day for about 8 months with a man whom I thought was my most trusted friend with morals and integrities and the whole nine yards. Only to find out this was all a facade. It was horrible but I need to be thankful because this is how I learned that there was something other than the over to narcissist that most people think of. Still, I didn't see it in my son or I didn't want to. I didn't even realize it was in my or that my ex-wife was dealing with it herself and the kids were just an extension of herself. Right now I'm faced with my own problem which I believe is codependence. Self-worth, etc. They're taking many steps in the last year and a half or two years to eliminate anything that I believed to be toxic from my life. The whole lack of empathy thing really hits hard especially with regards to my son. Also that odd phenomenon where two of my three children seem to well, mostly one of my three favor their mother and have beat the hell out of me for lack of better wording. I did my best to raise the three of them when she left. Now I'm faced with my 91 year old mother and my own self worth. I'm definitely gotten considerably worse. Anyway sir, please accept my heartfelt thanks for doing these videos because they've helped me a great deal and it's my personal opinion that you are one of the best if not the best without you go about explaining these different issues. Thank you again. Joseph Watson
It sounds like you had the same awakening concerning the toxicity in your life that I did Joseph.👍🏻I know how heartbreaking it can be, especially when they are beloved children or family members and I am so so sorry that your heart and spirit has been crushed. Just know that you are so not alone. I was married for 27 yrs to a Covert Narcissist that I thought hung the moon only to find out he was as the Bible describes “A ravenous wolf in sheep’s clothing”. He was in another relationship within minutes like I never existed and I spent the next 10 years trying to figure out what the hell happened. I went back to school and became a Clinical Social Worker and that’s how I figured it out. It was a huge epiphany for me. The only problem was that I too recognized the toxic patterns in several family members as well as friends, coworkers, bosses, and several family members of my ex husband’s family as well. I’ve talked to several friends and we’ve talked about this disorder in some of their family members and friends. It’s amazing that once you see it you can’t unsee it. I don’t know what I would have done without my faith in God and in some ways I felt it was fated so I could bring an end to a generational curse. I now spend a lot of time trying to minimize the damage that’s been done but I have to say that being a truth teller hasn’t won me any favors as the truth hurts. The reality is what it is and I have stopped my codependent and enabling behaviors which I could see was only reinforcing those toxic behaviors. I have been forced to detach to a certain extent to get my point across that I will no longer accept that kind of behavior as painful as that may be. I just want my children and grandchildren to be aware of it so they are able to go on and have healthier relationships than I had and that’s really all anyone can do after it has gone on for so long. I’m praying you find peace in this revelation and I wish you all the very best with your family in the future.🙏🏻☮️😊
I dated a guy that was always suffering with life. Always complaining even if the issue was easily repairable. He would change his mind 100000 times about what he liked or wanted to do and never committed to anything or explores anything and whenever things were challenging he would just put the blame on others and how he was the one suffering. Always bored and suffering with life. Conversations revolved around him, if I was the one going through something he would make it about him. And if he acted wrong it would be my fault because I was the one who did X or Y. And even when he started the conversation with I am sorry, the conversation would shift to but you did this and you are not good enough, you don't give me what I need, you don't let me this or that. And he would shift around people, be more kind and start telling how beautiful and wonderful I was. And embody certain ideas around people that defend those. And he would have crisis every 2 days, either about himself and his whole existence and value, either about the relationship and how it was not good enough or how he was suffering or how it was my fault because I was giving him the necessary. Then he would storm off, be aggressive, and comeback either love bombing me or giving me the silent treatment. Always implying that I had to change things around my aspect or personality in order to be more desirable or beautiful or better. And he would shame contínuosly, be hella jealous, and throw tantrums whenever I wanted to do smtg without them or live my own life. Totally isolated me from my friends and family and the whole year I dated him the relationship was all around him, his needs, his wants, his pain, his crisis. He left me in an hospital, I was sick and in pain, because he had other things to do and he was suffering too. And always tried to manipulate me into being whatever he wanted me to me and make me feel crazy cause he would just deny my reality and I was so confused I didn't even know what was really happening afterall. And I was always sick. Don't do it, you can't change them. Don't ignore the red flags. Don't think they will be better for you. And the small acts off love do not erase the rest. 1 small act of kindness doesn't compensate all the suffering you go through.
I love your videos, they are really really informative and well explained. I do want to say, having dated a Covert Narc (Likely communal), I was blind-sided because he didn’t do any of the suffering / complaints / hurt stuff. He was the quiet helpful uber-liberal hero on the surface. He was a successful Dr of Internal Medicine. But as soon as you saw his friendship, family and romantic relationship patterns...it was very evident. He made up his own rules. He was whomever his audience wanted him to be. He was very egodystonic. He would have the weird slips of the mask, where you’d see the rage under the surface if anyone was more than him in any way.
The damage being involved with a narcissist and loving one does cannot be overestimated. And because it's sly and escalates slowly over time, you put up with it. It wasn't until I finally stopped talking to my ex narcissist that I felt the pain a couple of months later. I was numb to it before that.
I had a friend for years whose odd behavior everyone explains away as "that's just Tom!" He did something recently though that was so messed up that when he turned around and acted like he was the victim, i was so sickened by how callous it was I couldn't look at him. I just wanted him out of my life. TH-cam started serving me these videos about narcissism & when I heard the ones about coverts suddenly years of this guys' behavior started to come into focus. Ah Ha! These people are so predictable, these videos describe them oh so well--just look at the comments. My point is, we're nice people. We think others are too, at least they have good intentions... And that's how they hook us. We aren't evil bastards who go throwing words like "narcissist" or "psychopath" around at people when they're difficult or don't behave as we'd like. We give people the benefit of the doubt and give them lots of chances to work on their problems and try to help them because that's what sane people do. It'd be nuts to just go around dismissing everyone as a narcissist & they get you very confused so it can be hard to sort. It's when you start to prioritize your own needs they show themselves. All I can say is we're all adults so if you feel like this isn't a person good in your life for whatever reason, it's okay to say, "Thanks for all the good times we had, but it's time we go our separate ways." If you weren't sure about it then, you will be when you see how that person takes it.
You underestimate them a great deal. There are higher functioning covert's and overt's, they hold down jobs, and in fact can obtain high positions, many seek positions of power and control, such as in politics, law enforcement, and medical. They can also maintain semi long term relationships. But if one aspect of their life is stably, such as work, the other, such as home, will be complete ciaos. The family is conditioned to keep the family secrets.....at least for awhile.
@@tdeniseechols7434 Yes, this is true mostly the overt, but there are some covert, cerebral type narc's too. There very quiet and unassuming, introverts. But just as evil and can rock you to sleep with there personas.
I don’t agree with some points in this video. I’ve met narcs who never complain, on the contrary they try to keep this facade that shows that they are perfect in every way. Some of them even see complaining as weakness and they make it clear that they disrespect people who are weaker than (what they look) they are.
@@DrDanielFox I'm a bit confused now because I thought the overt is the obvious type who's easier to recognize/spot. While the covert uses other tactics that are harder to recognize? Is acting like a victim is a more of a trait for the over or the covert type?
@@taylorbarnett1199 sometimes even taking on the characteristics of their "actual victims. They put on a "skin suit" of you like Edgar in that men in Black movie. They meticulously watch your reactions to their torture and play the victim role to all your friends n family way before you even know they play victim. So say you know your neighbors have something abusive going on. ...you'll hear the real victim talk crazy and think they are the perp. (Because a narcissist and word salad and gaslighting games makes the victim over react), then the narc will come out smelling like a rose and secretly go to your mom and neighbors putting you as the perp and playing innocent victim. And they win the Golden globe for acting skills. The craziest in the fight is usually the victim (forgive the term crazy, it's how PTSD feels)
You make the best videos about the subject on internet. I’ve lived it, that’s exactly how it is and it’s very difficult to explain to others, but you nailed it. Very impressive.
It's interesting to explore the line between being "normal" and narcissist though. Some identifiers in the video could be true to almost anyone, at least on a thought level
We all exhibit narcissistic traits some of the time, and various mental health issues have overlapping symptoms. The line is if somebody strongly expresses narcissistic traits all the time consistently troughout their life (often from craddle to grave)
I think a lot of this is caused by the "me me me" generation. I am a "boomer" and let me tell you a lot of the parents from my generation are directly responsible for many of the narcs now parenting currently.
Let me say this to you Daniel, yes we live in an intitled generation, but please believe me I was married to a narc for 30+yrs and within the last 2mo I identified what I was dealing with and know when you encounter a narc without any doubts you will know there are no lines to explore its black and white. You never ever want to experience that personality NPDiscorder. Its a evil entity that you better get away from if you can!
@@tracyecutts2080 I had a narc gf when I was younger. I never seen her as evil tho, it's more like pitiful that they experience life on a different way in my opinion. Of course I agree with you, that I don't want that in my life for sure
Well...I have been living with a Covert Narcissist for 32 years; must include the following: 1. Profound fear of abandonment 2. Astute in the art of “word salad” style of commniction 3. Experts in the art of the smear campaign 4. Abusive user of the “silent treatment 5. Ultimate “master” gas lighter 6. Lack any ability of true empathy 7. No true ability to “self reflect” on his or her behavior; especially when wrong/bad. 8. Ultimate opportunist 9. Great at triangulation 10. Extremely Deceptive Manipulators (I have seen over 30 counselors, psychiatrist and psychologist; 95% are not skilled or experienced to recognize a “Covert Narcissist” in any way. I ended up being traumatized by each, because none could recognize this type of person with this disorder. Book knowledge and the DSM does not vet out this disorder properly at all. Also, there is no true means to treat such a person from what I can tell. Narcissist do not practice the art of self-reflection at all to where they recognize their mental illness. The medical practitioners need to take this disorder more seriously and start listening the victims who have to deal with this kind of emotional vampire. They are very dangerous. (Consider these truisms about narcissist: psychcentral.com/blog/7-things-youll-never-see-a-narcissist-do/)
Everything you said applies to my 34 year plus marriage. I worked unsocial hours and put it down to that. She did part time unsocial hours I put it down to that. I worked away from home ditto. When I tried to retire which I felt after 40 years of unsocial shifts was my reward she left and demanded a divorce. During the last 2 years she started to provoke arguments and I spotted her lying. Even now as we divorce her version of events is not one I recognise. I feel the complete fool of course it’s all my fault (sic). The bitch of it is I am trauma bounded it’s impossible to let go. So I have become the victim she loves to play.
Free Bird hi - love ur comments and agree completely - im sorry u have had to go thru so much. i too have been hurt greatly by narcs in my life and i agree completely that not enough is being done to help true victims of this maddening and wildly rampant social emotional disorder. please send me an email maybe we can write a book or create a powerful support group👍🙏
I don't think everyone who makes it all about them is a narcissist. Your bully-boy jock type makes it all about themselves, but isn't necessarily a narcissist. The defining quality of a narcissist is their need to redefine your reality and make it a lie. It's not enough for them to get their way. They need to make sure you never get yours.
Wow. The "I suffer more" thing. Yes. A couple of months ago I had a cycling accident. My jaw was quite swollen and I was bleeding all over. Fortunately x rays were negative and all I needed was a couple of stitches. Within 2 minutes of discussing with my narcissist partner, she started to talk of an accident she had several years before, how hers was worse, she bled more, "why did they not give her x rays?", she's lucky she didn't end up with a concussion, and within 10 minutes I was being accused of calling an ambulance and going to emerg as an attention-seeking device. She ended up angry at me because I "dared" to have an accident and it triggered a rather long fit of narcissistic rage that lasted several days.
Just like the marriage I am gettin ready to get out of its always been one sided, they don't know teamwork, don't show love,they feel sorry for themselves ,and they take advantage of people. They drain you financialy,mentally, and physically. I learned all this thru life coaching that I have been doing for myself the last 4 months .All's I can say is people like you in medical field need to keep teaching people about this because it also teaches us why we are with people like this and than we are able to start loving ourselves, set boundaries for ourselves and forgive ourselves for being and staying in it too long, i will be working on gettin myself healthy for a long time...but I will have my life back..ALOT to be said for peace & happiness!!
It’s been three months since leaving my covert ex, he had a new girlfriend immediately after and we dated for 4 years. It was a devil like no other. I still have panic attacks when I wake up but I learn to just breath and remember he can’t sabotage or hurt me anymore.
Skelellele good for you! Stay away and remember his new girlfriend will go through the same crap..they don't change..one day at a time...it will get easier..they should all be tattooed on their foreheads...dangerous!
My mom took control of situations by creating some long, odd leap into suffering victimhood. My grandfather was a psychiatrist and he couldn't stop the disorder, but I learned he and my father shielded me from her issues. After they died I became aware of what I called her "constant created crisis maintenance." Then I saw your video. Bombshell, but a lifesaver. I approached the subject her in a non-judgemental way, and she acted senile... I gave her a non-judgmental out, and she put on her act to avoid it. Then came my punishment: Every time I left her alone she broke something, hurt herself... Fifty years old and I learned my mom had maintained a lie to her son, who had never questioned her. Now I need therapy. Any slight control mechanism play someone tries on me sends me into a rage.
Best explanation ive heard in years. They cannot put themselves in your shoes due to less great matter in the left anterior insula. A physiologic deficit in the brain and modeling from caretakers who ridiculed them for having needs. ( Sometimes only food shelter and clothing were provided and these people think I wasn't neglected). Repression of the real childhood and idealization of the parents.
Dr. Fox, 15 + years of treatment. This video was both an affirmation and confirmation. The shame has become manageable so I am able to think critically about how I used/use these coping mechanisms to get my needs met. Shutting my mouth and drawing a red circle around me, so to speak, has helped me to stop hurting others and myself. In my red circle, I am safe. Outside my red circle, I am stepping on toes and harming others through threatening their prosperity, their right to be free of my controlling behavior etc. My former husband was very bright and talented. He had discriminating taste, he had a lot of what I wanted to be but was not. I was so jealous and controlling and treated him so poorly in a variety of ways that now, upon reflection after viewing your video, I can see. In fact he loved art and I loved flowers so the backdrop of your set triggered this memory today while watching. Thank you for teaching us and offering greater insight into our behavior. Truly a game changer for me. Happy May Day! 🍃🌱🌿🌷🌿🌱🍃 I am so grateful for you and your work. 🙏🏻. Ordering your work book on Friday! I am so very excited.
Gael Westphal-Clifton I just find it awesome that you can hear this and understand this might be how you feel. Among all the narc bashing, I always hope people that have these traits in a deeper way (cause i know we all have them) discover these videos and really ‘feel them’ ... I just think it’s awesome. We all get a chance to self improve if we go seeking and searching. I hope life’s good!
T Bo: Thank you so very much for your encouraging words. They are very helpful to motivate me to keep going, growing and changing. So much so that it brought me to tears to know I’m not alone in this process and there are those who are able to, as bad as we are as people, recognize that I do want to change and I do want to be a part of things. I began to understand many years ago in my thirties that my treatment professional was shunning me and lavishing attention and caring towards other patients but not me. She invited a group of patients to a party but not me. I’ve felt this same shame of being left out and rejection for years to one degree or another by other professionals. I just did not have the insight or know exactly how to change. So, I guess you could say I’ve been aware of my problem, or at least some of them for a very long time. Thanks again for your kindness.😓
Gael Westphal-Clifton maybe this shame you feel has been there long before your therapists too? How you feel about yourself or what others think about you has been guiding your relationships and co-relating in general and when things get more intimate or personal... bam... some of these traits raise there head? The hate/shame you have for yourself spills out & over and does damage to those around you? First off. Relax. We ALL project our inner fears and so called failings on to those we often love the most and are closest too. It happens. And regularly. You might just need to look at it more and fine tune it. Sounds like the red circle idea REALLY works. I’ll def need to try that for a few things in my life. But I’d say keep going. You’ve been doing the introspection. You know you wanna change. So just work on it everyday and do it. Don’t ruminate too much in hating yourself. That shame based cycle will keep you 10 steps behind. Make peace with yourself. You’re human. Like us all. But you are also worthy like us all! You’ve possibly complicated your feelings and emotions towards yourself to levels that really .... are so out there and over the top you might feel like you’re TOTALLY unworthy... THIS^ is not the case. Tomorrow you wake up like the rest of us. Why don’t you embrace that day with a new mindset? Not one of indifference and shame ... but one of similarity? Be part of the 7 billion that just want to be better and do better? Because that’s all any of us can do, right? Be better than we where the day before?
T Bo: Naturally, the shame is my core content. The feeling of being ashamed of myself has lessened over the years. I’m grateful for that. I do believe that my struggles, strengths, weaknesses are simply a part of the human condition we all face. The BPD likes to tell me from time to time the suffering is somehow worse for me than for others. That’s just self-pity at play and I can’t allow myself to fall into that pit of despair so I try not to feed my disorder with that because it’s a self fulfilling prophecy. Adopting a more balanced view of myself has allowed me longer periods of knowing and feeling I’m certainly not unique and that I am just one of the 7B getting up each day and trying to create a better life for myself and do better and be better. Acceptance and gratitude for where I am and where I’m not anymore unlocks the door to possibilities. Again, I’m grateful for your words of encouragement. It means so very much to me to connect in an authentic way. 🙂
You are describing my sister 1,000%. I'm serious; you touched on EVERYTHING she says and does and your examples are things that she has actually done to me. I really, really, REALLY wish I lived in Texas so I could get help from you.
This was awesome as it showed how all narcissist including covert act in certain situations. I really don’t want my baby momma to be an evil covert narcissist and so I’ve made 100000 excuses for her behavior over the years. She is so well liked and loved by everyone on the periphery and so I sometimes think I may be wrong. Then I hear her autobiography in this post . It’s sucks
Thank you for all you do! Please consider a video on BPD in and exacerbated by chronic illness, invisible illness and the effects on BPD of being dismissed and judged. Thank you!
Hard to identify is an understatement. I went to over 3 dozen or more therapist and counselors, not one identified my ex-wife’s Covert Narcissism at all. I found myself thrown under the freight train every time I went into therapy and counseling after I got frustrated with her behavior. Amazing the kind of front they can put up to ensure people like me appear like the abuser.
@@DrekJS27 Majority of psychologist, psychiatrist, counselors, therapist and people in general are not trained or skilled to recognize Narcissist, especially the covert Vulnerable Narcissist. At the end of my marriage of 32 years I had to go to TH-cam to figure out who I had married.
I was in counseling with same counselor for 11 years and not once was I told anything about this in my husband. We even went to couples counseling for a brief moment and nothing there as well. TH-cam has brought much light to my husband’s abuse to me and our children.
Hi Dr Fox. I have BPD. I am very puzzled about why Narcissists are given such a bad rap. Surely narcissism is a personality disorder & therefore these people for the most part have no clue why they act as they do & why their lives are always a mess? I have struggled so much having BPD for almost 50 years & not knowing it thereby causing damage & hurt to others unwittingly. Surely the narcissist should receive some kind of compassion.? Its hard for me to understand why people with other types of personality disorders are pitied but narcissists are just totally despised. I am sure they dont choose to be the way they are.
I don't disagree with your statements. Folks I have worked with have experienced immense personal damage from those with NPD, but I've also worked with those lower on the NPD spectrum who are contrite and try very hard to control their symptoms and do things differently.
Because they've done us wrong. Horribly wrong. Soul crushingly, financial depletingly, wrong. And they get sheer pleasure out of your misery. They make you trust them, open up to them about your utmost fears and vulnerabilities, so they can use it against you in such a vile way so they can get a high out of your pain. Other personality disorders don't.
Have pity for the narcissist! You are so wrong. The narcissist is fully aware of what they're doing to others. Ask yourself why are they nice to strangers, but yet mean to people close to them? They know when to put on the mask and show to people a good side of them. They are therefore cognizant of their behavior. They do harm to others is because they choose to. No pity for the narcissist.
I live with one of these. It took me a while to figure it out and now I feel more in power. She'd ask how am I just to "beat me" with how much worse she is, we can never have a healthy discussion unless you agree with her point of you, if you don't, she'll cry untill you do. You CAN'T ever point out her mistakes. She never takes responsibility for her decisions. If something goes bad she'll blame anything and everybody. You cannot decide for yourself, she's older and she knows everything better. She's never down to the point. She always beat around the bushes. There's just so much to it but I don't have time to write it all down.
4 years in therapy-no personality disorder. Just seasonal depression and Complex PTSD- married (17 years) to someone with narcissistic traits (per therapist) and yet here I am again-wondering is it me? I’d love a series on how to work on self loathing. I have it. I see it. I can’t really fight it. The core really is I’m less than, I’ll never be enough. I do all this calmly and quietly. I live life outside my home -literally, trying to blend in and be invisible. In relationships...I have no needs and make no waves. I’m tired.
Me too! This is the comment I needed to see, among others. I am still wondering if I’m the monster... so much shame and inability to connect with people genuinely. I suspect I have become a bit of a covert narcissist when I had was once a very compassionate and empathic human. My heart has been closed and untrusting for years because of the abuse from certain relationships and the world in general. I need some tools to get out of this trap.
You said it quite well...we feel burned out (empaths) trying to always figure out how to please others....Jeez I could just spend a few years doing all the stuff I really want to do....come and join in with me J EV!
Me too I suffer from low self esteem and I have co-dependency and sensitive I don’t know if I suffer from covert narcissist. I have empathy for others and would never go out of my way to blame my life choice on anyone but myself. I do feel sorry for myself at times but I know it’s my fault if anything good or bad happens. I do also fear rejection and abandonment but I’m working on my issues. I don’t know if I am one but people have told me I’m too nice and a bit of a people pleaser and have a hard time saying no to others. So I’m working on learning to set healthy boundaries with others. And overcoming my fears of rejection and a abandonment and my co-dependency issues.
I have only learnt about covert in the last year and oh my god you try your best and its never good enough. I have been there when no one else was. He took control of when we meet.the last conversation was so bloody annoying he will never ever be grateful for what u have done for them.so i decided to take my power my time my love and attention to those who need it and appreciate it.its as simple as that .thankyou x
:) i love how compassionate this explanations feel. I wanted to say thank you to dr. Fox, I'm trying to graduate in Psychology, my last exam is something that in English may sound like "Neuro-Psychopathology" and I was having a hard time understanding the DSM V and my textbook is very "basic", especially in the area of Personality Disorders it is highly vague, and I couldn't tell from one another. Your videos are helping me a lot in my personal life as well, you are a great inspiration! Have a nice day, greetings from Italy :)
Great information! All info helps since I was in the dark so long! Thought I could learn to stand up for myself ( no such thing as boundaries), but all the while he was plotting my demise! So hard to consider that someone would pretend to love you while they are plotting to use and disguard you!
This is definitely my dad...He've "suffered" so much in his life, not to minimize that in any way, but he tells those stories over and over again. He came out with "inventions", but people stole ideas from him, he would "build a house" but mom gets in the way, he was always smarter beyond his years... Also when he calls I learned not to talk but only listen, because it might take hours for him to tell his story. Definitely a lot of this information hits home. He was never physically abusive at least to my mom. We did get beating with the belt when we were kids but other than that it's emotional abuse mostly. Fear and guilt based. Is it typical for these people to spy on others?
You literally described my father to a tee. He constantly rants and raves about the past and old stories. I thought it was just a father being overly concerned but as I got older, I realized he’s a complete narc including my mother.
You know he’s a narc when after you break up him no contact, he goes stir crazy, acts so regretful. Goes from saying “I’m sorry for hurting you and for everything I’ve done” to saying “please talk to me. Why aren’t you talking to me to fix this. I don’t understand why you don’t wanna talk to me”. That is alone is sadly terrifying to me. He wonders why I can never trust him again. He did so many shady hurtful things behind my back and in my face, basically lived a double life and he wonders why I’m not talking to him and why I’m scared of him.
This is so, so true. I have an overt mother and covert younger sister and flying monkey father, so being an empath, I have to keep things at arms length to keep sane. This is hard as an empath, as you can feel their internal pain however i learned in my early 30's i can't always be a rescuer for other peoples internal struggles. There is no helping them to heal if the self-awareness and emotional intelligence is lacking. There is no benefit to try and point out these behaviours as they don't care or listen and usually silent treatment or retaliation (in the form of emotional neglect or dismissing) will follow, so I've been on my own to discover how to cope. It's good that these videos now exist, however I wish they existed when I was a teen as I would've saved myself a load of heart ache trying desperately to make a heart connection, when it was only attention/supply they in fact were seeking. If I'd known this, it would've made so much more sense and I wouldn't have sacrificed so much of myself and my life to pleasing people who are never happy. Glad to know about it all now. Many of the features/ behaviours do cross over between the two types though, maybe more than what is illustrated here. They can be both full of arrogance and then when proven wrong, they turn to poor victim, sometimes it can happen so fast you'll be suddenly talking empathetically about something that happened to them, when you had started with a story about something hard you were going through. So many times when I have made contact when I was going through a difficult time and then to have the whole conversation flipped about how bad they have had something, it totally throws me off my train of thought and I am left completely confused, still struggling with my difficult problem and feeling I am alone in dealing with something I really need help with. You end up taking more on, instead of offloading tensions. I learned who is safe to vent to in my life and bounce ideas off of, and none are my family members. I wish it was though.
Hmmm, not sure I agree with this. But thank God we can agree to disagree. To me, covert seem to be more of the type that are very charismatic, and everybody loves them, and they don't like to draw much attention to them unless of course it is the kind of attention that gets them praise. They only like to be noticed for what they do for others, and generally they don't want other's to do for them because they like to be seen as The Giver, I believe that's how they set us up to draw us in. That's just my $0.10 worth.
Your 10 cents describes my husband to a tee. Everyone loves him. Can you imagine how I felt when he fooled the psychologist we were seeing for marital therapy?!? 🤦♀️
This is my sister... to be considered a good person is simply not enough for her, she has to be seen as an extraordinary person, a saint and martyr. People think she is so empathic, warm, kind and full of values. She knows how to advertise for herself without looking like she does. She never misses an anniversary, she does amazing gifts, she loves to be there for others, but as you say, all for the show. And it works.
@Tony Macaroni I hear you on the loneliness! It's very damaging, because you can end up thinking that anyone could believe the liar at some point, and that theater drama will always win. The narc isolates you in the first place, and then you can end up isolating yourself to avoid suffering. It's like a perfect social murder. It is important to have an activity where the narc has no contact, and never to mix that circle with your narc's circle...
I know nothing but learning about these people, it was an unknown description to my ignorant self till around 3 years ago. When a good friends daughter passed out from Uni with her degree in Psychology, and told me and described my daughter to a T although they had never met, but you would of thought she had known her all her life. I have not spoken with my daughter for 11 years that was the last time she used and abused me, before that short intermission, she could not of been more evil than she was and never spoke to me for 4 or 5 years. Contacted me when she needed advice from me. She is the exact description you posted up above, but never has a friend for very long all her life, as soon as they see her for what she is they go as quickly as a bolting horse. Until then though everyone loves her the best person you could ever meet. She is so evil it breaks my heart that I gave birth to such a person as this. She has even destroyed our marriage, but I hold my husband just as responsible for that anyway. She has nothing to do with myself or her brother, as he has the same opinion as myself what she is, but of course we are the ones that are most evil and wicked and her Father agrees with her. I could write a book about her, from her early childhood as young as 3 years old but as the years passed and she never had friends or for only a few weeks, I always made excuses for her, even Grandparents found her hard going but still I was there for her, couldn't see the pattern was blinded by her excuses and over inflated opinions. How stupid was I took me so many years to see what she was that others saw very quickly.
Yes. My mother is like this. She was diagnosed with something recently. She told me quite some time ago the doctor told her to be cautious. So that this situation don't get worse. Well, she didn't listen to him and the situation did get worse. She ran around telling others that her doctor didn't tell her what he needed to tell her and it is his fault that she is going through what she is going through. She ended up asking someone to do something for her that I was going to do. And EVERY chance she gets she talks about her and her situation. She try to act like a know it all and is selfish, rude, obnoxious, and ALWAYS condemning others. She wear a mask in public and act like she is sweet as pie.
One year with my Covert Narcissist/Dismissive Avoidant: MONTH one : Great MONTH two : Greater MONTH three : Fabulous (heavy love bombing starts/mirroring...) MONTH four : Heaven (I love you...) MONTH five : Seventh heaven... MONTH six : Mask starts to come off (devaluing starts...) MONTH seven : full devalue/dismissive behavior, refusal to talk about issues by ignoring, silent treatment and an aloofness as if I did not even exist, very strange behavior if you've never dealt with this before... MONTH eight : distancing/lying begins (gaslighting also)... MONTH nine : lying clearly shows... MONTH ten : Frustration for me begins to set in... MONTH eleven : Everything is my fault... MONTH twelve : I left her for good, NO contact at all, PERIOD MONTH thirteen : Rebuilding myself. MONTH fourteen : Her; closure letter mailed to me. (attempt to Hoover me.) Me; Still NO contact, too late for her, I DID NOT RESPOND. I learned a lot of new phrases I never heard before regarding Covert Narcissism. Without a doubt, a one-sided relationship and it was horrible. I wish it upon nobody.
Describes a former friend of mine to a T!! Total victim, all about him, passive aggressive, wanted to see others fail, and had a MAJOR facade when it came to business...acted like a big business man but was barely making ends meet, only cared about how he appeared. Was also a loner, and had falling outs with so many he did business with. I came to the conclusion he was a CN when he stopped talking to me after he held up a project for 3 months and wouldn’t respond to my emails. Soooo passive aggressive.
Because of my recent experiences with psychologists I have lost trust in psychotherapy and counseling. However, I keep watching your videos not only because I find them very informative but mostly because the way you talk is really relaxing and soothing to ears. If you were just telling bedtime stories I'd still be watching your videos lol
Good video. I wonder if a lot of this goes under the radar because, "Why would I seek out help when I know better than everybody else?" Even if someone with these traits realises they have a problem, they might think that only they are smart enough to understand and fix their problems.
Coverts are great at flying under the radar. I had two covert narcissist friends I got to know much better during covid lockdowns. So much of their behavior I used to just write off. One of them is in a relationship with an overt narcissist homeless guy she let move in with her so she has someone to victimize her to the point she's suicidal but rather than end the relationship and throw out this mooch who isn't on her lease, she has her own personal suicide hotline... So "depression is kicking my ass, just please always answer the phone when I call" and she'd call at 2 am or she'd call when I was at work in the middle of a big, stressful project, just at the worst times... The last time she called me she wanted $20, the price of a rock (meth) because she was hungry, although she makes more money than i do pays lower rent and bills and supports this loser. I finally told her, "Look, bitch, call suicide hotline, I'm not equipped to deal with all this." I was practically suicidal myself. And I won't even get into the other covert I cut out of my life. Known each of them for years, but coverts know how to string you along. I didn't even know covert narcissism was a thing until I decided to cut these crazy-making people off and ask myself, "WITAF was *that* all about? Who does this?" And then youtube, creepy as it is, started serving me videos about narcissists. I bet they love all this attention; there are a ton of channels & videos about this! I suspect every sane person has a covert narcissist in their lives somewhere just waiting to be found out...
I think that it's important to be objective when trying to determine whether someone is a narcissist (has npd). Because, it's one thing, for example, to be bad about not being punctual, or being kind of flaky (lack of regard for time trait), and a narcissist's reasons and ways of doing this. And people often confuse their dislike for another person for narcissism. But I do know that objectively, if a person truly does lack sufficient and genuine sympathy for the needs or basic welfare of others, demonstrates consistently and persistently an unusually malicious sense of self entitlement, low conscience, a pattern of violating a boundary that is not accidental, and possibly other traits as outlined in the DSM, then there is a possibility of narcissism. I say this because I am worried that this disorder is being misrepresented. For example, domestic violence. A man is not an abuser because he and his wife argue. Or even because he is angry with her. However, if he goes out of his way to start arguments when there was no basis for one at all, puts the other partner down directly or indirectly, has a pattern of gaslighting that results in the partner questioning herself, has a negative impact on her self esteem, and, OR physically assaults his partner in a way that is for that purpose, to assault her, (not self defense), then that is domestic violence. Just an example. I think that people need to know that there are differences between dysfunction and a person who actually may have a personality disorder.
They are not all monsters, and they are human beings suffering a disorder! Would you call an autistic child a monster? Because of their condition? Keep hating hey?
This is such a great video! I finally realize what this is. I have been friends with a lot of covert narcs. I just hope they get help honestly. It must be awful to be in that state of mind.
Thank you for watching and finding the video helpful! It's definitely important to recognize the signs and understand the impact of being friends with covert narcs. I hope this video can bring awareness and encourage those affected to seek help.
I would love to see a video on normal responses to some of the situations mentioned in this video bc most of the people I know respond to life as described, to some degree. Sometimes i wonder what picture of health we’re comparing ourselves to as human beings. Just a thought.
The thing with personality disorders is that they are basically "quirks" that every human can have, only they've become so extreme that it becomes a real problem in their lives. I see the covert narcissist as the ultimate victimist. It just gets out of hand with them.
oh. my. god. thank you for making this video. i didnt know that narcissists had different 'types' until recently when i was thinking about why my current bf's ex left him. she said he was a covert narcissist, and because i only knew the ... 'in your face' version i was confused because i now can see what he was hiding when he told me about that... you said things that he says to me, you described what is going on in my life and how he is responding, ....... i have severe bpd/ self destructive, im on disability for that and other trauma related illnesses... your video has given me hope that i can make the right choice and run... before it is too late. may i ask, are they also very controlling? like i cannot go into another room, i have to stay with him, in the same room, or things get... bad. is that something typical for them as well? THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU DO!!!!
My ex-husband was diagnosed with narcissistic personality disorder. In couples therapy, after he told the psychologist he needed to fix me, the psychologist asked him if there was anything he liked about his wife,. My ex’s response was, “I like that she absorbs my anger.”
Yes, absolutely... everything you said... and lack of respect for authority... or it’s selective according to what they want. I was married to a covert narc for 49 yrs, 9 mos. I’m a 75 yr old Christian widow... Hubby died 2.5 yrs ago. I tried to reach out for help over the years but no one understood. I searched for info... but only began finding info on the internet about 1-2 yrs prior to his death.
Thank you for posting. This helps me explain to family and friends. The covert narcissist is hard to identify and therefore as a survivor it’s equally hard to explain to others.
Sometimes explaining to family and friends backfires. It has for me. People just don't get it. Alot of times the narc will flip around on you saying you're crazy or out to get to get them These family members do the narcissist bidding.
I subscribed after seeing a fantastic video and haven’t seen you since (I forgot your name despite sub, and yt didn’t promote you) Your videos are great in and of themselves, but your ability to provide concrete examples is unique, they’re very broken down and easy to see and can be extrapolated by anyone. Thank you!
I am 16 years old and I've been abused by a narcissist since I was in 5th grade. Since I was 10 years old she obsessed over having me be her backbone. I was forced to go through extreme levels of stress during several staged suicide attempts that I would dedicate so much emotional support for, just to be blamed for the reason their life was so terrible. Since she was a new student she couldn't understand why my friends, whom she just met, failed to give her as much attention as they gave me. She claimed to have a history of bullying so she felt entitled to be treated a certain way. Her family even hated me although I was the best friend she could ever have, probably because she never told anyone a single good thing about me. Some days I would decide to stand my ground and not invite her somewhere (she was obnoxious and outwardly rude to people) I would get harassed for hours on end and contacted off different numbers, she was obsessive. Nothing about her got better as she got older, she just become more intimidated by not controlling me. When we wouldn't be friends, I'd always apologize due to severe OCD I suffer from. I couldn't stand the intrusive thoughts that there is a possibility I could be better to her because I couldn't be the reason she died. But sure enough my anxiety was wrong. She used her life as a threat and 6 years later I still suffer from her abuse socially. I am graduating high school a year early to escape and finally live a life that isn't hers. Thank you for an amazing video!
Marwa Daoud Your ocd can be cured.You're basically trying to control things because you're not able to control other aspects of your life.Face your fears and do what needs to be done.
I feel as if he is describing me a lot I’m not gonna lie but it’s not on purpose. I get jealous because I feel as if I will never be good enough to even be on the same level as someone else. I am a angry person and I know this about myself but I try to hide it from friends. I’ve already quit with family but I still have to stay with them for awhile, I can’t even talk or look at them without wanting to run away or have a mental break down. Honestly I have no idea what’s wrong with me but I really do feel as if I’m the victim in a lot of cases. But when I do something and feel it has no effect on them, they will do the same to me and I want to hurt them but I don’t. It also makes it difficult to know what’s wrong because I am asocial and little antisocial. I have low self esteem and social anxiety. I feel that people are always talking behind my back and sometimes they do it to my face but I have a hard time understanding standing body language and emotions of others. My emotions one day may be angry and another may be sad. I never have had a full day of happiness it feels. And with the way others are talking in the comments about narcissistic people are making me even more insecure about myself.
I have been doing a lot of hard, Focused personal work for about a year now and I'm experiencing difficulty in changing my core concept. My tendency is toward irritation and pessimism. I have been meditating and as a former fitness instructor my exercise level is fine. I'm positive I would be dead without strenuous exercise and I'm grateful for that. But this tendency toward the negative is Rather difficult.
I met a suspected covert narcissist in a church bible study. At one point, she made a point of telling me that she needed me to be more of a facilitator than the style of leadership that I was able to provide. My experience of covert narc is one of expectancy of others - they are intolerant of people's vulnerability and they are hypocritical; they expect others to provide for them but they do not provide for others.
They're very good at making themselves look good in front of other people while treating you badly.
Yes
Very true
Yesss very true!! Happened to me and I knew what kind of person they were while everyone else was falling for the fake persona, and I just sat there thinking "wow these people have no idea"
Indeed, charming to others...
YES!!! omg how!?! I recently split from one and it was hard trying to get my parents to understand that he was hurting me
The worst thing is the lack of self-awareness and inability/unwillingness to have empathy. Narcs can hurt people so badly, but because they never bother to put themselves in your shoes, they act clueless about the harm they're causing. But if anyone ever gave them the same treatment, they would be shattered. I've seen this happen, where if someone reacts to their abuse, they act shocked and hurt, not understanding that the reaction was caused by their original bad action. They view themselves as innocent, and can justify every bad deed they do. And if they're knowledgable about psychology, they'll use psychological theories to excuse their behavior. It's maddening.
You just described my boyfriend :(
I think a narc doesn't care how bad they hurt you because they think you deserve it. This would explain their lack of remorse and empathy later when you tell them to get to steppin'. Since they cannot elevate themselves out of their inferiority mindedness, it may be easier to "bring 'em [the victims they envy] down a notch" by harming them.
What can you do about this? When you are dealing with a daughter who is 40yrs old, who is a convert narcissist and I love her. I don't want to shatter her I want to help her. I don't know how to handle her anymore..except avoid her. But I don't want to hurt her.
I had to explain to a man in his 60's the word 'empathy' sad
This is so true, This video is spot on... I'm married to one, he has me in the silent treatment phase so this will be the time I use to plan my exit strategy, 14 years I've been playing his game and I didn't even realize it until this year. So because he's giving me the silent treatment I'm allowing it to play through I've blocked him on my phone and on Facebook, when he comes home, I'll do the same if he asks me a question I'll give him one word answer and walk away, he's even trying to get me to react by leaving a mess around knowning that I'll say something to him and clean it up...Welp not this time. The mess he left is still in the same spot although it's killing me to leave the mess, I have to show him that he to can be devalued in my eyes as well. I'm working on building back up my self love.
In the beginning - It's like finding the most sincere kindest person in the whole wide world. They are nice and gentle. They are affectionate. They will cuddle you and hold you. A couple months in you will notice that they seem to lack in the intimacy department but you will dismiss that to shyness. They will mimic/mirror your style of communication & you the entire time (which goes unnoticed until they become distant with you & use new words). I learned that If you express intimate emotions they will say “I feel the same way for you too or I would do the same thing for you or I love you just as much or I'm glad to hear that.” Which feels insincere and robotic. However you might dismiss that to shyness or inexperience expressing feelings (even tho they could be gorgeous & clearly experienced with women). They will never voluntarily just express their love for you in their own words and say how much they love or miss you. Very rarely will you get an “I miss you" or ” love you" for no reason at all. You will wonder why? Like do they have any feelings? So, you find yourself working harder to make them feel more safe & more loved in hope's that they provide that love back to you. It's easy to dismiss them withholding as a lack of trust or insecurity because they seem so nice. You will look for logic in behaviors and with Coverts there is never any logic which will lead your further down a rabbit hole creating confusion. In time you will start to doubt your own perception of what you see and lack the clarity to see the abuse. You will have more anxiety, lack inner peace & feel tired. Your physical appearance might change where you either gain or lose weight. You struggle to keep yourself at peace. Its exhausting. By now, you have became an expert at everything they like. You take on all the chores and make their life as easy as possible. You feel isolated too b/c they kept you “away". You feel so confused b/c you worked so hard to break down their walls in hopes of a more consistent close bond with them. One day they seem really into you and the next they withhold affection. It's hard trying to figure out what is wrong. The more you vocalize your feelings the more they encourage you with their words that everything is ok. You certainly don't feel “ok" but you make peace with it the best you can and start “withholding” your feelings too b/c they have made you feel like your “too" sensitive and it's too much! Most of the time it will feel like they are present in the flesh but nothing else is going on inside them. Even after all this time you've been together you still feel like you don't really know them. If you happened to gain the courage at a later time to ask more questions as to why things still feel off they will say your being insecure & that they aren't cheating and make you feel like you have issues. If you cry they will watch tv, stare at their phone or even continue to eat dinner. They won't ever give you all their undivided attention & acknowledge your pain. Which makes you more confused bc their actions doesn't match their words. They won't look at you while you cry, they seem like it causes them shame to see you cry. At times you might feel like your having to teach them about feelings as if they were a child. You will wonder why their emotional intelligence seems very immature/off. Everything they have is something you also don't have access too. Their family, phone, friends, bank accounts, pay stubs, credit card statements, and etc. You will start off feeling like they are very private or insecure & years in it now feels like they are super secretive b/c it makes no sense for them to still be so private. They promise things that they don't see through or conveniently feel bad or forget everything that is important to you. They will isolate you and hide their relationship with you. When you express that something about what they are doing isn't right then they act like they lack understanding and that they do nothing to hurt you. You will always be explaining everything and wondering why they just don't get it! They will even use apologies as a form of manipulation. (lack of empathy and no change to their behavior). You will always feel like you need to phone a friend to ask if your situation is normal because this person will give you $200 to pamper yourself but won't invite you to Christmas dinners or let you have access to their phone. They will leave/abandon/ghost you to say they are sleeping at a relative's house then on their way home they will offer to bring you breakfast or something from the store. Even their giving is a form of manipulation. They want to distract you with gifts to keep you off balanced from the emotional abuse they are putting you through. When you ask them why they didn't come home they will say they felt like you didn't want them around or etc. You will spend the entire relationship wondering how someone who seems like such a nice person can be so emotionally cold. Moreover, People wonder why they end up hurt, seriously hurt, and even killed for their own actions. Cheating is a choice and there’s simply a lot of ignorance in the process.... Thank you so much for helping me out Metaspyclubllc@gmail. com. Your advice and services helped me so much. You are a lifesaver !!! The information you gave me about my cheating partner when you gave me access to his phone was everything I needed to get,.. thank you very much..
You have described them so perfectly ,it's so incredibly correct.
So true. They don't put any effort, all passive aggressive, never say love u or miss you. They just reply me too baby and mimic ur communication style
This is a super accurate description of my ex narc 😬
Soo accurate - thank you
You almost described my marriage.
A narcissist uses your empathy
as a weapon against you
and to control you.
Oooh, so wise and deep, damn.
True
Yup. Because they lack empathy themselves, and introspectively, the world is just an instrument to accomplish their goals.
WTF. I can see the light finally!
Exactly.
I like to describe the conflict as a crazy making merry go round. If you start feeling confused and discussions turn into arguments that just go in circles and you feel you’re not being heard and this becomes the pattern, you are quite possibly dealing with a fragile covert narcissist. If it doesn’t feel normal, then it’s not.
Good job developing and ear for your inner compass. Be well.
Well said
Omg so true….
A CRAZY MAKING MERRY- GO - ROUND OF DENIAL...
PATHOLOGICAL LIARS,COMPULSIVE LIARS AND CON-ARTISTS, PREDATORS, CRIMINALS
@@DrDanielFox APPRECIATED ALL YOUR VIDEOS XOXO THANKS DR.FOX
I'M TRULY GRATEFUL
My sister is a covert. If you really listen to a covert while they're telling a story, you'll see that in the story they are the heroes and the victim. Its crazy!
Right on!
Omg... So true
True! I have a parent that is one, the other parent is beaten (metaphorically) into submission, Every day all the time.
They make up stories, pathological liars...they are delusional & actually believe they are a victim...however, they also consciously know they are manipulative...they see it as justified....they are entitled, yet full of shame...narcissists are the epitome of irony & hypocrisy/double standards because they believe they deserve special treatment & at the same time the covert feels a sense of guilt while their conscience is not enough to stop their sick behavior.
You are attractive.are free as in single?
These are the worst, they are more devastating because they seem like a good person and gain your trust then tend to backstab you when you least expect it. Especially in the workplace.
Charlie Dallachie 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
It's really tough because my mother is a covert narcissist and she 100% doesn't believe that she is one, even after bringing it up to her many times. She thinks she can't be a narcissist, in her words, because she has empathy for other people, but when she's confronted or ''challenged'' about a behavior, she acts like a victim, is passive aggressive, makes you feel like you're crazy so basically invalidates everything, completely denies ever being hurtful NO MATTER HOW SMALL THE ISSUE IS, and she has NEVER apologized to me IN MY ENTIRE LIFE even after laying out all the narcissistic and hurtful things she's done. She also has a hard time putting herself in my dad's shoes even though he's suffering from depression, etc etc etc. All other signs point to her being a covert narcissist... thankfully I don't live with my parents anymore so I can be away from it, but it's really tough to _not_ feel crazy, because she hides those behaviors so well until she's ''challenged'' on an issue. Is this a true narcissist or just one with strong traits of it, I wonder...?
In the workplace...in my life I can look back and see a pattern: the FIRST person I’d meet at the the job (who would be very nice, helpful, likable, etc.) would turn out to be the most TOXIC. 🙈
Lizanne Whitlow it’s crazy sometimes. I befriended a guy at my work who’s an expert and valuable on the team, helped onboard him etc... we’d sit next to each other and talk all the time when things were slow. Then it’s like literally (around the holidays) in less than a week he changed. I came in once and was like “hey happy Monday” no response. Figured he was busy but then it became every day and I’d just keep my distance. Then before I knew it he’d be calling me out in meetings without cause, throwing me under the bus, painting me as an idiot in front of management and in front of the client etc, completely out of nowhere. Copying emails to management and putting me down, very condescending and micromanaging....a dictator and a bully sometimes.
I wanted to ask him did I do anything or say anything wrong? Nope. I learned a hard lesson, co workers aren’t your friends. Maybe some can be over a long time but don’t trust them right away. The mask falls eventually for the coverts and they stab you in the back, it can cost a job.
Charlie Dallachie Did he have a history of doing that to others? Did you stay in that job?
For me, the covert narcissist comes across as a people pleaser. They like to be in the spotlight to get the validation that they crave for, as other narcissists but at the same time, they pretend to be humble, simple, generous, over giving. The covert narcissist will take time to build a relationship/friendship with you. During this period, they will show their admiration and their devotion by helping you with everything that is you need. They will try to convince you that you are soulmates and that they understand you deeply. At the same time, you will see them being overly altruistic, maybe helping society by engaging in charities, activism. They feed the poor, take care of the homeless. All this makes you think how lucky you are for having met such a beautiful soul. You want to be by their side for ever.
However, soon you notice how much they enjoy being invited in galas to talk about their achievements. But they don’t admit that. They still play the humble guy who doesn’t want all this. Who is beyond money, beyond fame and recognition, who wants to share the floor with other people. But their acts don’t match their words. You come to realise that this selfless soul is actually doing whatever it takes to be in the centre of attention. When you do something together be it at work or at home, they want to control everything about it. They just exerce their control in a more polite and implicit way, making you believe that your voice was heard whereas in reality you did what they wanted you to do. Covert narcissists have a smooth way of leading you on. They don’t shout, they don’t give orders. They are master actors. They convince you that you are together in this. What makes them a narcissist is that when the time comes for them to use you in order to draw certain benefits, they will do it without a second thought and you are not going to believe in your eyes.
And when you stand up for yourself and raise your voice against them calling them for their phony identity, then you will see their rage for the first time and the mask will fall. Covert narcissists manipulate less with rage/exhibiting superiority and more with people pleasing behaviour/playing the eternal victim. They are not aggressive as overt narcissists. They are more cunning. What they both have in common is self-centered ness and lack of empathy. In the case of coverts, it will take you longer to find out.They knew what they wanted to get out of you from the beginning. They created a whole theatre play to fool you about who they are and their true motives. You will trust them with all your heart but when the time comes for them to prove their loyalty by choosing your bond over their personal gain, they will choose the latter with no remorse, without even taking any responsibility. Unlike the overt narcissist, they will have an eloquent excuse for doing so, rationalizing why they had to f@ck you over. They will pretend to be sorry about it because this is something that matches the image of modesty that they want to project but in reality they are not sorry at all. You will see them partying with your own money when they said they didn’t have enough to pay you back. You will see them being unfair and untrustworthy to other people as well. When the mask of the victim will fall, you will see the cruel smile of a perpetrator who managed to get what they want without deserving it. If you decide to unmask them run for your life.
Moreover, Catching a cheating spouse might be difficult, and knowing what local laws say you can and cannot do might be even more difficult. To simplify the process, consider hiring a private investigator to do the sleuthing for you I genuinely appreciate how incredible you are and your work! Thank you for a job well done Barryinvestigation@gmail. com.
An EXCELLENT explanation!!!!!! I've seen this with 3 people and your description is SO accurate. Thank u
My husband of 15 years you've just described 😮 I've just exposed him. But he can't do too much because we are in Germany. The law is very strong
I never realized my mother was a covert narcissist until I went to counseling. She did some terrible, terrible things to us and never took responsibility. Narcissist mother, alcoholic father...how did I make it this far?
Uranium Rabbit Jesus ❤️
Uranium Rabbit yet you still here! That makes "you" remarkable!
i would appreciate if you share your birth details.
I wanna hug You! I've got a covert narc mom and absent father. It's tough
"No one suffers like me" is a pretty good description of this comment lol.
I've suspected for a long time my wife was possibly a covert narcissist and your videos have more or less confirmed my belief. There have been a multitude of things done over the years, but just days after my dad passed away and knowing I was deeply hurting, she actually said to me "dwelling on his death isn't going to bring him back, just get over it". Followed closely by "you knew this day was coming so him passing shouldn't have been a surprise". Deeply insensitive and a total lack of caring about my feelings were the beginning of the end. I knew at that moment I was dealing with a whole new level of monster.
😢 I hope you're okay now 🙏
For me it was not visiting when I had cancer. Also accusing me of faking it. Also cheating. Complete hypocrisy and projection.
Yet if someone THEY know died its the niggest catastrophy in the hisyory of mankind.Also,I tried to explain empathy to my narc saying"you dont go with someone to a funeral to bring him back.You dont do c.p.r on the deceased.You go to show with actions to the person that THEY are not alone suffering suffering.
He sat there blinking lije if that was a revelation.SICK stuff.
In my experience. They know what they're doing I can see it in them, they know exactly what they're doing, it's their entitlement.
damn that spot on in my experience too makes me sad that i let it happen
@@Benlovesscience Have you looked in to see why you hang around them? You have the power to fill your emptiness with soul searching rather than the rollercoaster of other maliciously empty individuals. You need a purpose, a mission, to open up your emotions, and to find who you are through spiritual growth. Otherwise, you can blame them for their behavior, but at the end of the day, you can and will eventually walk away.
@@Sarahizahhsum a covert narcissistic individual is not easy to discover and she broke literally my heart
@@sabinegroe2006 It may not be what you want to hear, but I am not looking for your approval. My heart has been broken by a covert and an overt narcissist before. I know the feeling. But I also know that I found them, meaning I had codependency to work on. Don't think you're blameless. I know I sure as hell wasn't. Once the victim phase, which btw is what your ex is continuously in, passes, you'll come to realize this.
Have a lovely day. It only goes up from here.
@@Sarahizahhsum she is calling my anonymous! I won’t return and stay by myself
All of this overwhelming!! I really just wanna be single forever!!!!
Be single cuz these evil demons are all over the damn place these days
Just be calm and keep your eyes open.
Most people are not what they pretend to be should be understood. You will draw people similar to yourself. Take care of loving yourself. If you are an Empath personality like myself narcs will spot you easily.
@@e.turn.ot.e9850 My thought is that Empaths should be with Empaths
@@mrp8173 but they pretend to be. We have no more time to waist on if they truly are or not. The narrcissist have gift and abilities too. They are decievers.
@@mrp8173 dont you know by now there isnt enough empaths to go around. Empaths a rare . especially when your one yourself, it is really hard to find another one. The percentage in my opinion is 1 out of 10 people are truly a empath in this world.
Hypocrisy is what defines them!
Absolutely!
Correct.do as I say not as I do!!!
Rules dont apply to them only you that shit drove me crazy the shit she thought she can pull on me
Not sure how this is a good point when hypocrisy is a trait all of us have...
Add to that legalistic!
I would say the first sign will come from your own gut feeling which will send signal to your body telling you that this person doesn't make you feel comfortable being around him/her. The fact that you are already asking this question should alert you to be careful. Something will feel off and you won't know what it is exactly. Covert narcissists can act very charming in the beginning but there will be often also present underlying sense of superiority about them. That sense is actually deriving from them feeling insecure about themselves, so they tend to quietly degrade others in order to feel better about themselves. On the other hand if covert narcissist feels that you are above his league, he will act like your servant, trying to please you - almost annoying in a way. But make no mistake. If you decide to stay in a relationship with him, he will downgrade you and abuse you like all the others. Because in his mind, if you love him, he thinks you are unworthy of him. Covert narcissists hate themselves so if someone loves them, than they think this person is worth less than them and that they can do better. Other sign to look for is any kind of judgment towards others. If he criticises other frequently, he will more likely criticise you as well once he gets more comfortable around you. Pay attention to how he treats people that are dependent on him as well. Narcissists hate those especially if they can't get anything of of that for themselves. Moreover, Cheating in marriages is not restricted to only men. Women cheat as much as men do. If you're suspecting your husband of infidelity, you'll have to keep an eye on him without his knowledge. One of the best ways to know if your spouse cheats on social platforms is by paying close attention to how your spouse behaves while online. The signs are pretty the same. Is your spouse more time on the app without explanation and gets unnecessarily defensive when you ask about it? If your spouse behavior has changed lately, and continues to spend more time on social apps, it's time for you to take action, with the help of a private investigator (suggested; METASPYHUB@GMAIL. COM , you can find out what is taking all their time on social apps, who they are talking to and other things happening,,
Wow! Yes, it was incredibly uncomfortable and bizarre to me that my now ex boyfriend, a covert narcissist acted like my servant for a week then stonewalled for reasons unknown to me. Then left me in a heartbeat for a job 4 hours away. He thought I would just wait on him until he decided to take a different job. He didn’t have to get a job 4 hours away. He wanted that particular job to compete with me.
My ex was a covert and he said everyone in his life needed to be trained, so they would do things properly. He was highly vindictive and said he would wait years to get revenge on someone who hurt him. He was also proud of the fact that he had no empathy. When I first met him, the first few months, I would never have believed he was a narcissist at all, he was so charming and a lot of fun. They are so clever at acting at being nice.
That's crazy mine holds insane grudges and prides himself on it
Yes I didn’t know either until recently been Marty to him 21 years never noticed because I was working taking care of the kids taking to sports etc . I have been notice it more and more where it’s weighing me down .
"he said everyone in his life needed to be trained, so they would do things properly. " Beautiful description. When my son-in-law's love-bombing mask came off and his vulnerable narcissism came to the fore, with my daughter becoming both his flying monkey and a vulnerable narcissist in her own right, they set off on a mission to "train" her side of the family, largely on how not to offend him. The whole world pretty much had to revolve around his sensitivities, and to a growing extent feeding her insatiable need for validation. They wanted to do this through family therapy and other means.
In the particulars of our case it happened to revolve around race, CRT, and the idea of white privilege to begin with, then as we became completely estranged from him, the core became my daughter's need for validation regarding her own extreme changes in behavior.
Revenge ~? That's so funny covert narcissist are just Homelander~
Unfortunately charming and fun is red flag for pointing out to narcissists usually
My mouth dropped to the floor hearing you describe this form or narcissism... perhaps it’s really time for me to reconsider my current relationship.
i wonder how you are doing today. I was with a CN for 30 years
I hope you’ve escaped , they don’t change and when they destroy your confidence they discard you.
When in a relationship with a narcissist; your problems will never be as bad as theirs so they will NEVER be there for you
You will NEVER be good enough for them! It doesnt matter what you do? They will make sure to find a reason why you didnt make them happy!
If you are sensitive? It will take a VERY long time for you to heal!
As soon as you know they are a narcissist? RUN RUN RUN FAST!!
So just because someone is sensitive it takes them longer to heal? Can you explain please. I just think it really depends on the person's strengths and mind.
@@primsandwhims7533 Not. Sure what she meant that if you are sensitive it takes longer to heal from a narcissistic relationship But I am psychologist and can tell you healing does take varying lengths of time. Much depends on the victims personality. Some people are more prone to depression than others, some have a history of another narcissistic relationship eg with a parent so they have two deep wounds to,heal instead of one. The time to heal indeed DOES vary widely. I DONT MEAN TO SPEAK FOR HER and I am not chastising you for your comment either....I just thought I should say something factual to this Sybil Francis PhD
T Kemp, you are so beautiful 🌹 🌹🌷 🌷🌺🌹 🌹🥀🥀 🥀 and too intelligent
Omg this is so true. Im trying to escape a narc now and the guy always has something chaotic and challenging happening around him. So bad that he NEVER has space for me to feel ANYTHING. And when I am upset, he gets so upset because of the fact that I'm upset that im helping him work through it. There is no room for feelings with narcs!
@Joseph Gross I don't believe you a single word.
There are many different signs. These include spending time on phone that was not spent previously, withholding sex from you, withdrawing in communication with you, agitation or anger over Petty stuff or making up situations to get angry or agitated over, lying, being secretive in any way, randomly spending more time caring for and pampering oneself such as putting on makeup or wearing cologne or coloring hair etc. Any type of changed behavior that is not aimed at pleasing or benefiting your relationship. With all of that though, follow your gut. your gut is telling you that something isn't right and it's telling you that this could or is happening, therefore listen to it. Just Free yourself from all of it! Run and don't look back. Go 100% no contact. The mental and emotional abuse is not okay at all! Do not bring anything up to her. Don't try to rationalize or have a conversation about anything. Don't let her know that you know she's in narcissist. All of that can cause a narcissistic rage. If you have not yet witnessed one of those just trust me that you don't want to! A narcissistic rage is beyond any rage I have ever seen or witnessed in my entire life. I am an army combat veteran and served front lines for a year and afghanistan. I have abuse going back from as long as I can remember, the first time in my personal memory is 2 years old. With everything I have been involved in, and my rape, other sexual abuse, their physical abuse, etc in narcissistic rage is by far the worst! If you need to contact your local police department and start a new contact order. No one can protect you like you can! free yourself from it all and move forward in your life. The minute you run and go no contact is the minute your life begins again. If need be seek out professional help. Therapy is the best thing I did for myself. The best gift I gave to me! The abuse is so deep and overwhelming that having a professional guide you through the steps of the healing process is extremely beneficial! Just remember, there is great strength in asking for help. There is great lack and strength or no strength at all in putting on a mask and hiding behind the opinions of society and pretending that you are okay! As human beings we all witness A Time In our lives where we are not okay! Those that heal, move past, and move forward, and have a brighter future are those who ask for help and do the work that is needed through the help! I'm so sorry you are going through this and I wish you the very best! Good luck! Always remember that you are stronger than you believe you are, you are worthy and deserving of better and always, and you are enough just the way you are and who you are today! Take this time for you! Get yourself again. Fix that meal that you're all time favorite, rent that movie you've been wanting to see, have a guys night out with your best friends, remodel a room in your home, go purchase that item you've been wanting to for so long, just do for yourself! Self-acceptance, self-love, and being able to forgive yourself is far more important than what anyone else can give to you! Believe in who you are! You deserve nothing less than that! You're not alone! Feel free to tag me in any other questions that you have! I'll help if I can. Additionally you can hire a cyber expert to help you get remote access to their phone so you can track them and monitor all of their activities without them knowing. You may locate the top cyber specialists locally at Digitalinvestigate@gmail. com, where you can engage a well-trained professional to assist you..........
8:00 this is so true. I have a friend since childhood that it took me a long time to see their narcissism. I told him one day that my pregnant wife had just been pulled over by our dog, that was chasing a squirrel, and landed on her belly. I was blown away at not only his lack of concern, but his struggle to not smile. He didn't have anything worse to compare that incident to. So he really struggled to find the right fake emotion to respond with.
It was that moment that I realized he wasn't who I thought he was. Since that veil was lifted he screams narcissist in everything he does, and I've leaned to avoid him as much as possible.
PS my wife and baby are fine thankfully
Bless you both, 'flee from the face of a serpent'. Be safe
Im a covert narcissist, it isn't on Purpose i act this way. I am aware but i catch it late. The lies, my life to other people is not what it really is. My whole life is a lie. Boredom is expensive. I buy so many different things and never follow through, today i want to learn ukulele, tomorrow lets buy a drone, ect ect. Nothing is my fault, i know it is, but back to lies we go. For an example, i crashed my truck while intoxicated. I called 911 and blamed it on a hit and run after i moved the vehicle.
Emotions are wierd. I rarely cry but am always in thought over spilled milk, i get angry over little things because work is hard today, or things keep falling off the table, anything that is inconvenient to me makes me rage out...customer service don't stand a chance. As far as being nice, I'll do things for anyone, im bored and just do it because you asked. Later down the road I'll be expecting special treatment because i did something for you. If i fix your car, run errands for you ect, and you go and invite someone who did nothing for you to a party or something imma get jealous because it wasn't me. This is just snippets of last month for me. We are wreckless, bored, dishonest, and self centered. Some of us know and try to fix it, some of us know and make no effort. There are people who have no idea and just live this way and wonder why the world is out to get them.
Doopa how can you know, I thought narcissistic can’t do self reflection. I hope to pray and get help 🙏
interesting. do you also have adhd?
Me too...almost as if it’s all we know
@@johnsmith23ist Typically, but some wake up. I had BPD and started to self reflect.
My family is full of ragers.I think it is a learned behavior and you can actually see where it came from, in my family,my mother was a rager, she learned it from her father who was a rager.He learned it from his parents,etc.
I hate the way I feel when I go into a rage and hurt the people around me. I can feel the rage boiling up and now I try to ask myself,what is wrong???Sometimes I realize I haven't eaten and probably have low blood sugar, sometimes I realize something happened at work to push me over the edge,sometimes I am tired, the list goes on...I have determined NOT to give in to rage attacks,and that since it is a learned behavior it can be unlearned.
It is helping, and now when I feel the rage boiling up, I go into the other room,try not to respond when someone in my family is baiting me, just try to calm down.Several of the people in my family ENJOY the drama of everybody screaming at the top of their lungs.I don't. I have been watching the narcissist videos on TH-cam and it helps alot.I don't want to act the way some in my family do,it's too hurtful,and since they are not willing to discuss the problem and find solutions, I will continue to seek help on my own.The main thing I have learned thou is ANYTHING YOU LEARN, YOU CAN UNLEARN.
Normal people DO NOT fly into a rage at the smallest thing, and i do
Not want to be like the ragers in my family.
When we met, I thought my husband was the sweetest most gentle person, caring, thoughtful and loving. Now that I’ve realized the kind of person that he is, I know that what he did to me was what they call “love-bombing”. I’m still trying to cope with this realization and it makes me feel as if I’m entering a new world. Learning more about NPD, keeps giving me flashbacks of many different scenes from the past and even the most recent ones: all those times when he was making excuses for his violent behavior, comparing himself to me constantly, putting me down, making me cry on Christmas Day, New Year’s Eve and most recently this month on my birthday, the blaming and shaming, the insincere apologies, public humiliation, abusive behavior, manipulation….I feel dazed and I don’t know what to do.
Listen, falling for a covert narcissist is easy. I'm a mental health therapist and yes I fell for one. The day I realized what he was, was the same day my son was conceived. I broke up with him soon after and then a week after the breakup I missed my period and eventually learned I was pregnant. Covert narcissists are charismatic and gentle at first, but you soon learn they are ill people. They are frustrated with everything, blame you and guilt trip you for everything, try to diagnose you with a mental disorder to make themselves look like victims, lie, demean you, will steal your self esteem if you are weak and unaware of their games, manipulate, lack empathy in the most demonic way, use their own children for their benefit and traumatize them beyond no return, I can go on and on. Moral of the story is get out if you find yourself in that relationship. My son's father is not allowed in his life because I know what he is and the chances of him taking care of his child without a legal obligation is slim to none. I still can't believe I miss the signs in the beginning but I got out rather quickly. Think with your mind and not your sexual organs or you may find yourself with one of these demons.
I’m definitely or was a covert narcissist. It was pure misery for me in my twenties. Thank god I realized how much I lacked self awareness and this helped me a lot and I was able to stop some of the traits. I also notice my closest friends over the years were covert and overt narcissist. This is why when I dated the overt narcissist he couldn’t wreck complete havoc on my life like he did others because I could see thru him and understood it to a degree.
how did you get over it? therapy?
Make sure You dont label yourself as a covert narc if You have been abused and might just be an empath and victim of abuse.
I relate to this.. I've always been told I was very selfish and everything, so I've always been trying to just work on myself and be a better person. But then there's these other people I know that always tell me that I'm the opposite, that I give too much of myself. I have no idea. I am so confused
But I wonder if narcissist attract other narcissists because it just seems like I'm surrounded by these people that are so abusive, but at the same time whenever I try to have boundaries I know I'm being selfish... I end up having to apologize and make everything right all over again… I don't know how to explain this without sounding crazy but anyway.. I think i relate
Hi! I just realised I’m covert so I’m trying to suppress some of its trait so can you tell me how you made it through? It would be really helpful!!
@@revanthkrishna218 Hi!! The best way I can explain it is I shifted my motive in every relationship from my every move/action being to maintain a feeling of superiority and control over the other person to just doing what made me happy even if I’d be rejected or abandoned.
Beware the covert narcissist. If they think you are going to leave them, your life may be on the line.
Her subtle questions about insurance and a smirk when I expressed concern for my health later, were actually warning signs. Two days in the hospital saved my life. Never disregard your gut feeling, run.
What a load of bullshit. Sorry that this happens to you but how about we don’t generalise personal anecdotes. I find my self in a lot of the mentioned aspects. And I want to better myself and become a better person for myself and my environment. But instead of tools how to work on my self all I find is hate and stigma. It seems like all videos about narcissism are just a place to unload frustration. You might be hurt by a narcissist but you can not dehumanise them as a consequence. If I take all those comments by heart I see no reason to get help because everything is always gonna be my fault no matter what.
@@chrizzlybearlol just chill and don’t take everything personally. Most of these comments are from tragic experiences. Dealing with Narcs is impossible. It’s good that you are trying to get better, but why should you take any one’s comment to heart. They are only basking on you if you interpret it that way.
@@chrizzlybearlol please continue to heal and get better I’m sorry you found the comment hurtful, I hope your doing better. Best of luck to you.
My ex wanted me to put my home in his name. I kept telling him no. He then said we should take out life insurance videos on each other; he would be my beneficiary. I asked him why and it just turned into a fight. I was accused of not loving him . . . he became angry when I refused to agree to the life insurance policy. What I never told him, I have a life insurance policy, my children are the beneficiaries. I never figured out why he wanted to be my beneficiary so strongly.
Get away as far away as you can and don’t let them know where you moved to as they will keep hounding in most cases!🤫
A lot of extremely “narcissistic” individuals are able to maintain jobs. Look at politicians , celebrities, your undeserving manager.... the list goes on and on..........
@J A covert narcissists are extremely good at keeping jobs and friends for a very long time. They put up an altruistic persona while targeting the ones' that are close. True story🙂
Infact they seem to climb the ladder higher than any normal person.
Yes it really depends on their level. Overt low iq types can't keep jobs but blame everyone. They usually don't have close friends. Covert narcissists always have a band of friends because of the pity party but never really emotionally close.
Higher range narcissists are also Machiavellian so can have high positions. Also they know how to mask
Exactly, idk what he was talking about. That can’t sit still and thrive to be number one, because they are their hardest critics and so they are very goal oriented because they are preoccupied with power, money, and beauty. They are absolute perfectionists.
@@Lafilledlapluie narcissist period don’t have close friends. It has nothing to do with iq
Two problems with this analysis: I have known two extreme covert narcissists who both held down very good jobs for their careers. One bounced from hobby to hobby though. I also know two people who have suffered abuse at the hands of extreme narcissists who are struggling to find steady work because of all the criticism and stress put upon them by these people.
Also, I find it hard to believe that they don’t know they are hurting others when they often take steps to hide it. Sometimes they manipulate, sometimes they character assassinate, sometimes they have selective memories, but I don’t believe they are unaware of the damage they are causing others.
I’m married to one and I’m pretty sure he knows exactly what he’s doing as he does the same nasty things every time he wants to show his hate for me
Oh they know but don’t have the right convictions.. only sorry when something happens and they suffer the consequences.. they have a motive for every single thing they do and say . They use people, places and things ,
I've known some Narcs who had talent and were fairly productive. More overt types I suppose. But the core self loathing was still there.
They're not unaware. But they're shallow and lack empathy when it comes to others. Fundamentally, it's all about them. If they can feel better by hurting others, they will.
The very sick vindictive covert I was was with for years has has a reliable full time job all her life. It’s part of her mask.
I have many of these traits🤦🏾♀️, but I see it and realized its based on childhood trauma. I'm here because I want to change.
Jess what was your childhood trauma can I ask?
@@DANFLIX98 Sexual, emotional, physical, mental.. What hurts the most is the nonchalant reaction of both parents when I was finaly able to tell. My father chose his women over me, my mother chose her friends over me.
Jess ohhhh gosh, I’m sorry to hear that. Stay strong 💪🏼
Jess you’re a good person Jess, you recognized.
@استغفر الله اللهم صلي وسلم على محمد I'm ok, under quarantine like everyone else
2:21 "Poor Me" attitude.
Narcissists are one of 3 things. 1. The victim 2. The martyr 3. The hero. Or a combination of them. They pull out whatever gets them the most supply.
Are covert narcissists always frustrated with themselves, unhappy, isolated/distant and very critical of themselves/others?
Yes you got it!
No, some think 🤔 they are just like the Best at everything and they're always right, even if you can prove that they are wrong. He calls himself Wisdom and a shaman and healer, and I just want to help you. He told me I was so sick, that he treated my settlement money like it was his.
Yes the zombie apocalypse is happening, Learn thy enemy well and every version of it. This right here is at the root base of this whole pandemic. Malignant Narcissist's don't live or let live. It's extremely sick and twisted. The one good thing this pandemic did bring out was this subject in particular to light. Too much damage all accross the board for years. Glad we can all learn together. 🙏❤️
@@samia6888😂😂
Just found out I have 56% covert narcissistic traits. I wasn't always this way. That's the reason I even took a test, cause I wasn't always like this. My mom is an overt narcissist and her behaviors used to hurt my feelings as a child. I was a pretty sensitive and stubborn child which made it suitable for my covert narcissism to develop. But I was emotionally intelligent and very empathetic. My mom was never subtle about her criticisms of me and the rest of the fam. Not even a minute would go by where she wouldn't criticize you of this or that. This made me really sensitive to criticism and my life still revolves around making her proud. This led to obsessive compulsive behaviors to deal with all the anxiety. Even sexual ones like masturbation from an early age. It messed me up pretty badly. Like I'd feel dirty all the time and would isolate and cry myself to sleep at nights. Then she started working the night shift and my dad worked the day shift and would come home late after she had left for work. This gave me even more time to self-destruct and damage my psyche. I don't even know how I'm still alive. I've always fantasized about suicide but never really hurt myself physically, Glory be to God! When I noticed I was acting this way because of a string of reasons mainly my mom, I began acting oppositely to how she does. In my own way, I was rebelling against her dictatorial rule and I was showing her I won't be a terrible human like her.
She tells EVERYBODY about her problems so I always make sure to refrain from sharing mu problems to anyone
She's outgoing so I became extremely introverted( I am a natural introvert but I became more so)
She's always sharp about how she looks so I became careless in my style and appearance
She likes to control people's every moves so I don't even inquire what people wanna do
She invades people's privacies so I am always cautious about not bothering people
She is religious so I ran away from religion until I couldn't bear the burden of my life without God( He saved me more than once)
There's a lot I could say. My mom hates it when people praise my looks. She views it as a threat. Her beauty is like her super power in her eyes. When she gets compliments she wants to make sure you do so by depriving another person of that compliment so she could be unique. She likes to show off my academic achievements and she made sure to insert some snide to degrade the other person's kid. This made me hate my academic achievements in general.
So covert narcissism was my safe haven. It's how I coped. How I survived. I found solace in introspection and self-pity. I hated it when people pity me but I basked in it when I felt it from within.
I don't know if there's other psychological disorders that coincide with my behaviors. I just know I'm effed up and I'm gonna spend my life trying to overcome those flaws with God's help and help those around me up and never down.
I have hope because even though the years have worn out my optimism and the empathy of the little girl I was, I still love people( I sometimes hate em ngl), I still have deep empathy for those hurting, I still give compliments to people because I genuinely want them to feel good and the biggest light I see in this situation is that I'm mostly VERY happy for people who made it and are physically beautiful.
For those who wanna get better from the bottom their hearts, we'll get there! That's the beauty of being humans. We were made in the image and the LIKENESS of God. This messed up world tainted us but if you scrape enough you'll finally reach who you truly are. You're much more than your narcissism.
I am going to be honest with you there is hope for you. Because you acknowledge that you may have the traits. Even after seeing evidence people with NPD will STILL deny it and choose to look down others.
You might also struggle with BPD, as do I you literally explained my life!
I think you are more traumatised than narcissist. Reading your comment did not make me feel like I needed to get away from you. When someone who has hurt you and abused you countless times says with a straight face they are "the only path to true healing" then you have met a true narcissist. You do get infected from them so maybe if you wait and avoid her you'll find that you score lower?
Spot on! My sister is the victim in every story. Zero self responsibility.
Yeah I got two ugly sisters
My mother is covert. I went no contact. It was very stressful living with her for a lot of reasons. One of them was we would move around a lot, no explanation as to why. I barely remember my childhood not from physical abuse or anything but because we moved and i changed schools so much. The boredom thing you talk about strikes me because it makes sense. It was extreme for us. Wed go to a place that she liked, for a long time, like it was traditional to go there often, and then suddenly we didnt have the cabin anymore, or suddenly we weren't going to the pond anymore or suddenly we had a new cool place to go like an expensive campsite or something. Usually there was an explanation but when we stopped going to the pond there wasn't really an explanation. I think she was just bored easily. Im certain she was behind a lot of things that suddenly stopped happening because it happened so often.
Best video on covert narcissism so far. Short and sweet. I got all the answers I was looking for. Thank you a lot, Dr. 🙏🏼
Hello Dr fox,
I want to thank you for the tremendous amount of help that your videos have given me as I have numerous people in my family with personality disorders including myself.
I'm a 60-year-old Caucasian male living in Michigan. On December 16th 2020 I relocated to move in with my 91 year old mother who suffers from end stage CHF.
I prepared myself as much as I possibly could with regards to caring for an elderly parent, independence, not letting them feel like they don't have control and quite a lot of information on just what that person may be feeling and going through.
The one thing I was not prepared for was my mother being a vulnerable or covert narcissist.
She is as smart as a rack. No cognitive issues there. In fact it takes a great deal of calculating on her part to deceive and manipulate and "manage people".
Disheartening to say the least as I just recently realized my eldest son was also showing every single trait. I did a lot of soul searching and went way back to my own childhood, environment, primary caregivers AKA parents, my ex-wife's mother being very narcissistic.
My oldest daughter dealing with BPD.
Some overlap with some manipulation.
Just prior to the realization of my son I spent every day for about 8 months with a man whom I thought was my most trusted friend with morals and integrities and the whole nine yards. Only to find out this was all a facade. It was horrible but I need to be thankful because this is how I learned that there was something other than the over to narcissist that most people think of. Still, I didn't see it in my son or I didn't want to.
I didn't even realize it was in my or that my ex-wife was dealing with it herself and the kids were just an extension of herself.
Right now I'm faced with my own problem which I believe is codependence. Self-worth, etc.
They're taking many steps in the last year and a half or two years to eliminate anything that I believed to be toxic from my life.
The whole lack of empathy thing really hits hard especially with regards to my son.
Also that odd phenomenon where two of my three children seem to well, mostly one of my three favor their mother and have beat the hell out of me for lack of better wording. I did my best to raise the three of them when she left.
Now I'm faced with my 91 year old mother and my own self worth. I'm definitely gotten considerably worse.
Anyway sir, please accept my heartfelt thanks for doing these videos because they've helped me a great deal and it's my personal opinion that you are one of the best if not the best without you go about explaining these different issues. Thank you again. Joseph Watson
It sounds like you had the same awakening concerning the toxicity in your life that I did Joseph.👍🏻I know how heartbreaking it can be, especially when they are beloved children or family members and I am so so sorry that your heart and spirit has been crushed. Just know that you are so not alone. I was married for 27 yrs to a Covert Narcissist that I thought hung the moon only to find out he was as the Bible describes “A ravenous wolf in sheep’s clothing”.
He was in another relationship within minutes like I never existed and I spent the next 10 years trying to figure out what the hell happened. I went back to school and became a Clinical Social Worker and that’s how I figured it out. It was a huge epiphany for me. The only problem was that I too recognized the toxic patterns in several family members as well as friends, coworkers, bosses, and several family members of my ex husband’s family as well. I’ve talked to several friends and we’ve talked about this disorder in some of their family members and friends. It’s amazing that once you see it you can’t unsee it. I don’t know what I would have done without my faith in God and in some ways I felt it was fated so I could bring an end to a generational curse. I now spend a lot of time trying to minimize the damage that’s been done but I have to say that being a truth teller hasn’t won me any favors as the truth hurts. The reality is what it is and I have stopped my codependent and enabling behaviors which I could see was only reinforcing those toxic behaviors. I have been forced to detach to a certain extent to get my point across that I will no longer accept that kind of behavior as painful as that may be. I just want my children and grandchildren to be aware of it so they are able to go on and have healthier relationships than I had and that’s really all anyone can do after it has gone on for so long. I’m praying you find peace in this revelation and I wish you all the very best with your family in the future.🙏🏻☮️😊
I dated a guy that was always suffering with life. Always complaining even if the issue was easily repairable. He would change his mind 100000 times about what he liked or wanted to do and never committed to anything or explores anything and whenever things were challenging he would just put the blame on others and how he was the one suffering. Always bored and suffering with life. Conversations revolved around him, if I was the one going through something he would make it about him. And if he acted wrong it would be my fault because I was the one who did X or Y. And even when he started the conversation with I am sorry, the conversation would shift to but you did this and you are not good enough, you don't give me what I need, you don't let me this or that. And he would shift around people, be more kind and start telling how beautiful and wonderful I was. And embody certain ideas around people that defend those. And he would have crisis every 2 days, either about himself and his whole existence and value, either about the relationship and how it was not good enough or how he was suffering or how it was my fault because I was giving him the necessary. Then he would storm off, be aggressive, and comeback either love bombing me or giving me the silent treatment. Always implying that I had to change things around my aspect or personality in order to be more desirable or beautiful or better. And he would shame contínuosly, be hella jealous, and throw tantrums whenever I wanted to do smtg without them or live my own life. Totally isolated me from my friends and family and the whole year I dated him the relationship was all around him, his needs, his wants, his pain, his crisis. He left me in an hospital, I was sick and in pain, because he had other things to do and he was suffering too. And always tried to manipulate me into being whatever he wanted me to me and make me feel crazy cause he would just deny my reality and I was so confused I didn't even know what was really happening afterall. And I was always sick.
Don't do it, you can't change them. Don't ignore the red flags. Don't think they will be better for you. And the small acts off love do not erase the rest. 1 small act of kindness doesn't compensate all the suffering you go through.
Wow...EVERYTHING YOU SAID..I EXPERIENCED EXACTLY THE SAME with my narcissistic ex
@@selenajet6525 hope you are doing better and healing ❤️
Actually sounds like you dated a Vulnerable Narcissist.
Still sucks, tho.
I love your videos, they are really really informative and well explained. I do want to say, having dated a Covert Narc (Likely communal), I was blind-sided because he didn’t do any of the suffering / complaints / hurt stuff. He was the quiet helpful uber-liberal hero on the surface. He was a successful Dr of Internal Medicine. But as soon as you saw his friendship, family and romantic relationship patterns...it was very evident. He made up his own rules. He was whomever his audience wanted him to be. He was very egodystonic. He would have the weird slips of the mask, where you’d see the rage under the surface if anyone was more than him in any way.
th-cam.com/video/nGTZWME2WZc/w-d-xo.html
You really talk about everything I’m experiencing.. and you put it out there in a way which was easy to understand. Thank you
The damage being involved with a narcissist and loving one does cannot be overestimated. And because it's sly and escalates slowly over time, you put up with it. It wasn't until I finally stopped talking to my ex narcissist that I felt the pain a couple of months later. I was numb to it before that.
I had a friend for years whose odd behavior everyone explains away as "that's just Tom!" He did something recently though that was so messed up that when he turned around and acted like he was the victim, i was so sickened by how callous it was I couldn't look at him. I just wanted him out of my life. TH-cam started serving me these videos about narcissism & when I heard the ones about coverts suddenly years of this guys' behavior started to come into focus. Ah Ha! These people are so predictable, these videos describe them oh so well--just look at the comments. My point is, we're nice people. We think others are too, at least they have good intentions... And that's how they hook us. We aren't evil bastards who go throwing words like "narcissist" or "psychopath" around at people when they're difficult or don't behave as we'd like. We give people the benefit of the doubt and give them lots of chances to work on their problems and try to help them because that's what sane people do. It'd be nuts to just go around dismissing everyone as a narcissist & they get you very confused so it can be hard to sort. It's when you start to prioritize your own needs they show themselves. All I can say is we're all adults so if you feel like this isn't a person good in your life for whatever reason, it's okay to say, "Thanks for all the good times we had, but it's time we go our separate ways." If you weren't sure about it then, you will be when you see how that person takes it.
You underestimate them a great deal. There are higher functioning covert's and overt's, they hold down jobs, and in fact can obtain high positions, many seek positions of power and control, such as in politics, law enforcement, and medical. They can also maintain semi long term relationships. But if one aspect of their life is stably, such as work, the other, such as home, will be complete ciaos. The family is conditioned to keep the family secrets.....at least for awhile.
A truly scary illness.
Interesting that you mention that, because 'The State' is malignant narcissism as an organization.
What you’re describing sounds more aligned with overt narcissists but again everything is a spectrum and it varies from mild to severe.
@@GrandmaBones666 Yes it is!!!
@@tdeniseechols7434 Yes, this is true mostly the overt, but there are some covert, cerebral type narc's too. There very quiet and unassuming, introverts. But just as evil and can rock you to sleep with there personas.
I don’t agree with some points in this video. I’ve met narcs who never complain, on the contrary they try to keep this facade that shows that they are perfect in every way. Some of them even see complaining as weakness and they make it clear that they disrespect people who are weaker than (what they look) they are.
+Sämir. E. Tarcheh you are describing a an Overt or Grandiose narcissist. This video is about another subtype Covert.
@@DrDanielFox I'm a bit confused now because I thought the overt is the obvious type who's easier to recognize/spot. While the covert uses other tactics that are harder to recognize? Is acting like a victim is a more of a trait for the over or the covert type?
You just described my adoptive mom and adoptive dad.
Sämir. E. Tarcheh that’s a trait of the covert. Acting like a victim.
@@taylorbarnett1199 sometimes even taking on the characteristics of their "actual victims. They put on a "skin suit" of you like Edgar in that men in Black movie. They meticulously watch your reactions to their torture and play the victim role to all your friends n family way before you even know they play victim. So say you know your neighbors have something abusive going on. ...you'll hear the real victim talk crazy and think they are the perp. (Because a narcissist and word salad and gaslighting games makes the victim over react), then the narc will come out smelling like a rose and secretly go to your mom and neighbors putting you as the perp and playing innocent victim. And they win the Golden globe for acting skills. The craziest in the fight is usually the victim (forgive the term crazy, it's how PTSD feels)
I like you - and the flowers
You make the best videos about the subject on internet. I’ve lived it, that’s exactly how it is and it’s very difficult to explain to others, but you nailed it. Very impressive.
It's interesting to explore the line between being "normal" and narcissist though. Some identifiers in the video could be true to almost anyone, at least on a thought level
We all exhibit narcissistic traits some of the time, and various mental health issues have overlapping symptoms. The line is if somebody strongly expresses narcissistic traits all the time consistently troughout their life (often from craddle to grave)
Daniel There is a huge gap between both of them.They are opposite to each other.
I think a lot of this is caused by the "me me me" generation. I am a "boomer" and let me tell you a lot of the parents from my generation are directly responsible for many of the narcs now parenting currently.
Let me say this to you Daniel, yes we live in an intitled generation, but please believe me I was married to a narc for 30+yrs and within the last 2mo I identified what I was dealing with and know when you encounter a narc without any doubts you will know there are no lines to explore its black and white. You never ever want to experience that personality NPDiscorder. Its a evil entity that you better get away from if you can!
@@tracyecutts2080 I had a narc gf when I was younger. I never seen her as evil tho, it's more like pitiful that they experience life on a different way in my opinion. Of course I agree with you, that I don't want that in my life for sure
Well...I have been living with a Covert Narcissist for 32 years; must include the following:
1. Profound fear of abandonment
2. Astute in the art of “word salad” style of commniction
3. Experts in the art of the smear campaign
4. Abusive user of the “silent treatment
5. Ultimate “master” gas lighter
6. Lack any ability of true empathy
7. No true ability to “self reflect” on his or her behavior; especially when wrong/bad.
8. Ultimate opportunist
9. Great at triangulation
10. Extremely Deceptive Manipulators
(I have seen over 30 counselors, psychiatrist and psychologist; 95% are not skilled or experienced to recognize a “Covert Narcissist” in any way. I ended up being traumatized by each, because none could recognize this type of person with this disorder.
Book knowledge and the DSM does not vet out this disorder properly at all. Also, there is no true means to treat such a person from what I can tell.
Narcissist do not practice the art of self-reflection at all to where they recognize their mental illness.
The medical practitioners need to take this disorder more seriously and start listening the victims who have to deal with this kind of emotional vampire. They are very dangerous.
(Consider these truisms about narcissist: psychcentral.com/blog/7-things-youll-never-see-a-narcissist-do/)
Everything you said applies to my 34 year plus marriage. I worked unsocial hours and put it down to that. She did part time unsocial hours I put it down to that. I worked away from home ditto. When I tried to retire which I felt after 40 years of unsocial shifts was my reward she left and demanded a divorce. During the last 2 years she started to provoke arguments and I spotted her lying. Even now as we divorce her version of events is not one I recognise. I feel the complete fool of course it’s all my fault (sic).
The bitch of it is I am trauma bounded it’s impossible to let go. So I have become the victim she loves to play.
Yellow Bird see a320 comments thank you for you insight.
Yellow Bird What if they have some of these characteristics but could self-reflect?
Yellow Bird thanks for that info!!!
Free Bird hi - love ur comments and agree completely - im sorry u have had to go thru so much. i too have been hurt greatly by narcs in my life and i agree completely that not enough is being done to help true victims of this maddening and wildly rampant social emotional disorder. please send me an email maybe we can write a book or create a powerful support group👍🙏
Anti social, lack of self awareness, lack of taking responsibility for anything, lack boundaries, liars and hypocrites.
So basically: how do you spot a narcissist of either type?
When everything ends up being about them, one way or another.
They can lace it with abusive language or sweeten it up with false concern about your health. Either case it’s all about them and we are the problem
Overt is just a little more obvious but after time the covert becomes clear as day too! It just takes longer to unravel
I don't think everyone who makes it all about them is a narcissist. Your bully-boy jock type makes it all about themselves, but isn't necessarily a narcissist. The defining quality of a narcissist is their need to redefine your reality and make it a lie. It's not enough for them to get their way. They need to make sure you never get yours.
@@RealityCheck6T9
A very telling comment. I really like the last line.
@@jwrobin21 I don't remember most of the comments I post to TH-cam, but yeah that one hit hard didn't it
Wow. The "I suffer more" thing. Yes.
A couple of months ago I had a cycling accident. My jaw was quite swollen and I was bleeding all over. Fortunately x rays were negative and all I needed was a couple of stitches.
Within 2 minutes of discussing with my narcissist partner, she started to talk of an accident she had several years before, how hers was worse, she bled more, "why did they not give her x rays?", she's lucky she didn't end up with a concussion, and within 10 minutes I was being accused of calling an ambulance and going to emerg as an attention-seeking device.
She ended up angry at me because I "dared" to have an accident and it triggered a rather long fit of narcissistic rage that lasted several days.
Wow me and a sibling
Damn my sister is like that
A sick or injured person is NO good to a Narc. Why? Bc they are needy and THUS, not able to give good Supply. :(
Critical Path Its because you're trying to take her limelight by being a victim.
@@rohithreddy75 yes very correct.
Just like the marriage I am gettin ready to get out of its always been one sided, they don't know teamwork, don't show love,they feel sorry for themselves ,and they take advantage of people. They drain you financialy,mentally, and physically. I learned all this thru life coaching that I have been doing for myself the last 4 months .All's I can say is people like you in medical field need to keep teaching people about this because it also teaches us why we are with people like this and than we are able to start loving ourselves, set boundaries for ourselves and forgive ourselves for being and staying in it too long, i will be working on gettin myself healthy for a long time...but I will have my life back..ALOT to be said for peace & happiness!!
It’s been three months since leaving my covert ex, he had a new girlfriend immediately after and we dated for 4 years. It was a devil like no other. I still have panic attacks when I wake up but I learn to just breath and remember he can’t sabotage or hurt me anymore.
Skelellele good for you! Stay away and remember his new girlfriend will go through the same crap..they don't change..one day at a time...it will get easier..they should all be tattooed on their foreheads...dangerous!
Coach Lee on you tube is great for anxiety attacks. Good luck to you
My mom took control of situations by creating some long, odd leap into suffering victimhood. My grandfather was a psychiatrist and he couldn't stop the disorder, but I learned he and my father shielded me from her issues.
After they died I became aware of what I called her "constant created crisis maintenance."
Then I saw your video. Bombshell, but a lifesaver. I approached the subject her in a non-judgemental way, and she acted senile... I gave her a non-judgmental out, and she put on her act to avoid it. Then came my punishment: Every time I left her alone she broke something, hurt herself... Fifty years old and I learned my mom had maintained a lie to her son, who had never questioned her.
Now I need therapy. Any slight control mechanism play someone tries on me sends me into a rage.
Best explanation ive heard in years. They cannot put themselves in your shoes due to less great matter in the left anterior insula. A physiologic deficit in the brain and modeling from caretakers who ridiculed them for having needs. ( Sometimes only food shelter and clothing were provided and these people think I wasn't neglected). Repression of the real childhood and idealization of the parents.
Talk about covert? I just had no idea what was happening inside. To get my needs met, this is what was happening? Wow. What an eye opener. 😔
Dr. Fox,
15 + years of treatment. This video was both an affirmation and confirmation. The shame has become manageable so I am able to think critically about how I used/use these coping mechanisms to get my needs met. Shutting my mouth and drawing a red circle around me, so to speak, has helped me to stop hurting others and myself. In my red circle, I am safe. Outside my red circle, I am stepping on toes and harming others through threatening their prosperity, their right to be free of my controlling behavior etc.
My former husband was very bright and talented. He had discriminating taste, he had a lot of what I wanted to be but was not. I was so jealous and controlling and treated him so poorly in a variety of ways that now, upon reflection after viewing your video, I can see. In fact he loved art and I loved flowers so the backdrop of your set triggered this memory today while watching. Thank you for teaching us and offering greater insight into our behavior. Truly a game changer for me. Happy May Day! 🍃🌱🌿🌷🌿🌱🍃 I am so grateful for you and your work. 🙏🏻. Ordering your work book on Friday! I am so very excited.
Gael Westphal-Clifton I just find it awesome that you can hear this and understand this might be how you feel. Among all the narc bashing, I always hope people that have these traits in a deeper way (cause i know we all have them) discover these videos and really ‘feel them’ ... I just think it’s awesome. We all get a chance to self improve if we go seeking and searching. I hope life’s good!
T Bo:
Thank you so very much for your encouraging words. They are very helpful to motivate me to keep going, growing and changing. So much so that it brought me to tears to know I’m not alone in this process and there are those who are able to, as bad as we are as people, recognize that I do want to change and I do want to be a part of things. I began to understand many years ago in my thirties that my treatment professional was shunning me and lavishing attention and caring towards other patients but not me. She invited a group of patients to a party but not me. I’ve felt this same shame of being left out and rejection for years to one degree or another by other professionals. I just did not have the insight or know exactly how to change. So, I guess you could say I’ve been aware of my problem, or at least some of them for a very long time. Thanks again for your kindness.😓
Gael Westphal-Clifton maybe this shame you feel has been there long before your therapists too? How you feel about yourself or what others think about you has been guiding your relationships and co-relating in general and when things get more intimate or personal... bam... some of these traits raise there head? The hate/shame you have for yourself spills out & over and does damage to those around you?
First off. Relax. We ALL project our inner fears and so called failings on to those we often love the most and are closest too. It happens. And regularly. You might just need to look at it more and fine tune it. Sounds like the red circle idea REALLY works. I’ll def need to try that for a few things in my life.
But I’d say keep going. You’ve been doing the introspection. You know you wanna change. So just work on it everyday and do it. Don’t ruminate too much in hating yourself. That shame based cycle will keep you 10 steps behind. Make peace with yourself. You’re human. Like us all. But you are also worthy like us all! You’ve possibly complicated your feelings and emotions towards yourself to levels that really .... are so out there and over the top you might feel like you’re TOTALLY unworthy...
THIS^ is not the case. Tomorrow you wake up like the rest of us. Why don’t you embrace that day with a new mindset? Not one of indifference and shame ... but one of similarity? Be part of the 7 billion that just want to be better and do better? Because that’s all any of us can do, right? Be better than we where the day before?
T Bo:
Naturally, the shame is my core content. The feeling of being ashamed of myself has lessened over the years. I’m grateful for that. I do believe that my struggles, strengths, weaknesses are simply a part of the human condition we all face. The BPD likes to tell me from time to time the suffering is somehow worse for me than for others. That’s just self-pity at play and I can’t allow myself to fall into that pit of despair so I try not to feed my disorder with that because it’s a self fulfilling prophecy.
Adopting a more balanced view of myself has allowed me longer periods of knowing and feeling I’m certainly not unique and that I am just one of the 7B getting up each day and trying to create a better life for myself and do better and be better. Acceptance and gratitude for where I am and where I’m not anymore unlocks the door to possibilities.
Again, I’m grateful for your words of encouragement. It means so very much to me to connect in an authentic way. 🙂
You are describing my sister 1,000%. I'm serious; you touched on EVERYTHING she says and does and your examples are things that she has actually done to me. I really, really, REALLY wish I lived in Texas so I could get help from you.
TheNikki284 , contact him !
I think I will, thank you💛
You explain covert narcissism better than anyone I have found and in 1/2 the time. So thank you.
As a covert narcisist, i wanna say thank you for the content on this issue!
You’re welcome
This was awesome as it showed how all narcissist including covert act in certain situations. I really don’t want my baby momma to be an evil covert narcissist and so I’ve made 100000 excuses for her behavior over the years. She is so well liked and loved by everyone on the periphery and so I sometimes think I may be wrong. Then I hear her autobiography in this post . It’s sucks
😢
😭😭😭🥀🙏
Thank you for all you do! Please consider a video on BPD in and exacerbated by chronic illness, invisible illness and the effects on BPD of being dismissed and judged. Thank you!
Hard to identify is an understatement. I went to over 3 dozen or more therapist and counselors, not one identified my ex-wife’s Covert Narcissism at all.
I found myself thrown under the freight train every time I went into therapy and counseling after I got frustrated with her behavior. Amazing the kind of front they can put up to ensure people like me appear like the abuser.
Might be worth considering why they cannot seem to see it.
@@DrekJS27
Majority of psychologist, psychiatrist, counselors, therapist and people in general are not trained or skilled to recognize Narcissist, especially the covert Vulnerable Narcissist.
At the end of my marriage of 32 years I had to go to TH-cam to figure out who I had married.
I was in counseling with same counselor for 11 years and not once was I told anything about this in my husband. We even went to couples counseling for a brief moment and nothing there as well. TH-cam has brought much light to my husband’s abuse to me and our children.
Hi Dr Fox. I have BPD. I am very puzzled about why Narcissists are given such a bad rap. Surely narcissism is a personality disorder & therefore these people for the most part have no clue why they act as they do & why their lives are always a mess? I have struggled so much having BPD for almost 50 years & not knowing it thereby causing damage & hurt to others unwittingly. Surely the narcissist should receive some kind of compassion.? Its hard for me to understand why people with other types of personality disorders are pitied but narcissists are just totally despised. I am sure they dont choose to be the way they are.
I don't disagree with your statements. Folks I have worked with have experienced immense personal damage from those with NPD, but I've also worked with those lower on the NPD spectrum who are contrite and try very hard to control their symptoms and do things differently.
It's because of the cold hearted, soulless things they do to people that live them.
Because they've done us wrong. Horribly wrong. Soul crushingly, financial depletingly, wrong. And they get sheer pleasure out of your misery. They make you trust them, open up to them about your utmost fears and vulnerabilities, so they can use it against you in such a vile way so they can get a high out of your pain. Other personality disorders don't.
Have pity for the narcissist! You are so wrong. The narcissist is fully aware of what they're doing to others. Ask yourself why are they nice to strangers, but yet mean to people close to them? They know when to put on the mask and show to people a good side of them. They are therefore cognizant of their behavior. They do harm to others is because they choose to. No pity for the narcissist.
After I confronted mine with the truth, she exploded and said I don't do what I do to please anybody but myself.
I live with one of these.
It took me a while to figure it out and now I feel more in power.
She'd ask how am I just to "beat me" with how much worse she is, we can never have a healthy discussion unless you agree with her point of you, if you don't, she'll cry untill you do. You CAN'T ever point out her mistakes. She never takes responsibility for her decisions. If something goes bad she'll blame anything and everybody. You cannot decide for yourself, she's older and she knows everything better. She's never down to the point. She always beat around the bushes. There's just so much to it but I don't have time to write it all down.
4 years in therapy-no personality disorder. Just seasonal depression and Complex PTSD- married (17 years) to someone with narcissistic traits (per therapist) and yet here I am again-wondering is it me? I’d love a series on how to work on self loathing. I have it. I see it. I can’t really fight it. The core really is I’m less than, I’ll never be enough. I do all this calmly and quietly. I live life outside my home -literally, trying to blend in and be invisible. In relationships...I have no needs and make no waves. I’m tired.
Me too! This is the comment I needed to see, among others. I am still wondering if I’m the monster... so much shame and inability to connect with people genuinely. I suspect I have become a bit of a covert narcissist when I had was once a very compassionate and empathic human. My heart has been closed and untrusting for years because of the abuse from certain relationships and the world in general. I need some tools to get out of this trap.
Don't loathe yourself they are monsters we are fine people so calm down.
You said it quite well...we feel burned out (empaths) trying to always figure out how to please others....Jeez I could just spend a few years doing all the stuff I really want to do....come and join in with me J EV!
@@MarkSven888 spot on! Tools would be great. Maybe a few genuine friends who can relate also.
Me too I suffer from low self esteem and I have co-dependency and sensitive I don’t know if I suffer from covert narcissist. I have empathy for others and would never go out of my way to blame my life choice on anyone but myself. I do feel sorry for myself at times but I know it’s my fault if anything good or bad happens. I do also fear rejection and abandonment but I’m working on my issues. I don’t know if I am one but people have told me I’m too nice and a bit of a people pleaser and have a hard time saying no to others. So I’m working on learning to set healthy boundaries with others. And overcoming my fears of rejection and a abandonment and my co-dependency issues.
It's virtually impossible to get a narcissist to get treatment for their own problems. Like you said it's everyone else that's the problem not them.
I have only learnt about covert in the last year and oh my god you try your best and its never good enough. I have been there when no one else was. He took control of when we meet.the last conversation was so bloody annoying he will never ever be grateful for what u have done for them.so i decided to take my power my time my love and attention to those who need it and appreciate it.its as simple as that .thankyou x
:) i love how compassionate this explanations feel. I wanted to say thank you to dr. Fox, I'm trying to graduate in Psychology, my last exam is something that in English may sound like "Neuro-Psychopathology" and I was having a hard time understanding the DSM V and my textbook is very "basic", especially in the area of Personality Disorders it is highly vague, and I couldn't tell from one another. Your videos are helping me a lot in my personal life as well, you are a great inspiration! Have a nice day, greetings from Italy :)
thanks and best of luck on your studies.
You've just described the family member I've not long cut contact with. I knew this was the problem but you described it perfectly.
Great information! All info helps since I was in the dark so long! Thought I could learn to stand up for myself ( no such thing as boundaries), but all the while he was plotting my demise! So hard to consider that someone would pretend to love you while they are plotting to use and disguard you!
Best description of covert narc I've heard. Thank you!
This is definitely my dad...He've "suffered" so much in his life, not to minimize that in any way, but he tells those stories over and over again. He came out with "inventions", but people stole ideas from him, he would "build a house" but mom gets in the way, he was always smarter beyond his years... Also when he calls I learned not to talk but only listen, because it might take hours for him to tell his story. Definitely a lot of this information hits home. He was never physically abusive at least to my mom. We did get beating with the belt when we were kids but other than that it's emotional abuse mostly. Fear and guilt based. Is it typical for these people to spy on others?
You literally described my father to a tee. He constantly rants and raves about the past and old stories. I thought it was just a father being overly concerned but as I got older, I realized he’s a complete narc including my mother.
Brilliant video. Explains the covert narcissist exactly true to life, thank you. Info better late than never.
You know he’s a narc when after you break up him no contact, he goes stir crazy, acts so regretful. Goes from saying “I’m sorry for hurting you and for everything I’ve done” to saying “please talk to me. Why aren’t you talking to me to fix this. I don’t understand why you don’t wanna talk to me”. That is alone is sadly terrifying to me. He wonders why I can never trust him again. He did so many shady hurtful things behind my back and in my face, basically lived a double life and he wonders why I’m not talking to him and why I’m scared of him.
This is so, so true. I have an overt mother and covert younger sister and flying monkey father, so being an empath, I have to keep things at arms length to keep sane. This is hard as an empath, as you can feel their internal pain however i learned in my early 30's i can't always be a rescuer for other peoples internal struggles. There is no helping them to heal if the self-awareness and emotional intelligence is lacking. There is no benefit to try and point out these behaviours as they don't care or listen and usually silent treatment or retaliation (in the form of emotional neglect or dismissing) will follow, so I've been on my own to discover how to cope. It's good that these videos now exist, however I wish they existed when I was a teen as I would've saved myself a load of heart ache trying desperately to make a heart connection, when it was only attention/supply they in fact were seeking. If I'd known this, it would've made so much more sense and I wouldn't have sacrificed so much of myself and my life to pleasing people who are never happy. Glad to know about it all now.
Many of the features/ behaviours do cross over between the two types though, maybe more than what is illustrated here. They can be both full of arrogance and then when proven wrong, they turn to poor victim, sometimes it can happen so fast you'll be suddenly talking empathetically about something that happened to them, when you had started with a story about something hard you were going through. So many times when I have made contact when I was going through a difficult time and then to have the whole conversation flipped about how bad they have had something, it totally throws me off my train of thought and I am left completely confused, still struggling with my difficult problem and feeling I am alone in dealing with something I really need help with. You end up taking more on, instead of offloading tensions. I learned who is safe to vent to in my life and bounce ideas off of, and none are my family members. I wish it was though.
Hmmm, not sure I agree with this. But thank God we can agree to disagree. To me, covert seem to be more of the type that are very charismatic, and everybody loves them, and they don't like to draw much attention to them unless of course it is the kind of attention that gets them praise. They only like to be noticed for what they do for others, and generally they don't want other's to do for them because they like to be seen as The Giver, I believe that's how they set us up to draw us in. That's just my $0.10 worth.
Yep!
Your 10 cents describes my husband to a tee. Everyone loves him. Can you imagine how I felt when he fooled the psychologist we were seeing for marital therapy?!? 🤦♀️
This is my sister... to be considered a good person is simply not enough for her, she has to be seen as an extraordinary person, a saint and martyr. People think she is so empathic, warm, kind and full of values. She knows how to advertise for herself without looking like she does. She never misses an anniversary, she does amazing gifts, she loves to be there for others, but as you say, all for the show. And it works.
@Tony Macaroni I hear you on the loneliness! It's very damaging, because you can end up thinking that anyone could believe the liar at some point, and that theater drama will always win. The narc isolates you in the first place, and then you can end up isolating yourself to avoid suffering. It's like a perfect social murder.
It is important to have an activity where the narc has no contact, and never to mix that circle with your narc's circle...
I know nothing but learning about these people, it was an unknown description to my ignorant self till around 3 years ago. When a good friends daughter passed out from Uni with her degree in Psychology, and told me and described my daughter to a T although they had never met, but you would of thought she had known her all her life. I have not spoken with my daughter for 11 years that was the last time she used and abused me, before that short intermission, she could not of been more evil than she was and never spoke to me for 4 or 5 years. Contacted me when she needed advice from me. She is the exact description you posted up above, but never has a friend for very long all her life, as soon as they see her for what she is they go as quickly as a bolting horse. Until then though everyone loves her the best person you could ever meet. She is so evil it breaks my heart that I gave birth to such a person as this. She has even destroyed our marriage, but I hold my husband just as responsible for that anyway. She has nothing to do with myself or her brother, as he has the same opinion as myself what she is, but of course we are the ones that are most evil and wicked and her Father agrees with her. I could write a book about her, from her early childhood as young as 3 years old but as the years passed and she never had friends or for only a few weeks, I always made excuses for her, even Grandparents found her hard going but still I was there for her, couldn't see the pattern was blinded by her excuses and over inflated opinions. How stupid was I took me so many years to see what she was that others saw very quickly.
Yes. My mother is like this. She was diagnosed with something recently. She told me quite some time ago the doctor told her to be cautious. So that this situation don't get worse. Well, she didn't listen to him and the situation did get worse. She ran around telling others that her doctor didn't tell her what he needed to tell her and it is his fault that she is going through what she is going through. She ended up asking someone to do something for her that I was going to do. And EVERY chance she gets she talks about her and her situation. She try to act like a know it all and is selfish, rude, obnoxious, and ALWAYS condemning others. She wear a mask in public and act like she is sweet as pie.
One year with my Covert Narcissist/Dismissive Avoidant:
MONTH one : Great
MONTH two : Greater
MONTH three : Fabulous (heavy love bombing starts/mirroring...)
MONTH four : Heaven (I love you...)
MONTH five : Seventh heaven...
MONTH six : Mask starts to come off (devaluing starts...)
MONTH seven : full devalue/dismissive behavior, refusal to talk about issues by ignoring, silent treatment and an aloofness as if I did not even exist, very strange behavior if you've never dealt with this before...
MONTH eight : distancing/lying begins (gaslighting also)...
MONTH nine : lying clearly shows...
MONTH ten : Frustration for me begins to set in...
MONTH eleven : Everything is my fault...
MONTH twelve : I left her for good, NO contact at all, PERIOD
MONTH thirteen : Rebuilding myself.
MONTH fourteen :
Her; closure letter mailed to me. (attempt to Hoover me.)
Me; Still NO contact, too late for her, I DID NOT RESPOND. I learned a lot of new phrases I never heard before regarding Covert Narcissism. Without a doubt, a one-sided relationship and it was horrible. I wish it upon nobody.
You just exactly described my relationship with the woman I just left. Keep working on yourself man it can and will only get better.
Omg..recognized your timeline as my own...Im withdrawing from my narc right now..going No Contact..
I agree with all of this.. but I came back after 4 months doubting myself and then it began again after 2 weeks broke it off and now in legal matters
Yes this was exactly my case too. I thought he has a dismissive avoidant personality yes is also covert narcissist. It was very painful.
Nailed it! Hi from Australia from a fellow Psychologist.
Describes a former friend of mine to a T!! Total victim, all about him, passive aggressive, wanted to see others fail, and had a MAJOR facade when it came to business...acted like a big business man but was barely making ends meet, only cared about how he appeared. Was also a loner, and had falling outs with so many he did business with. I came to the conclusion he was a CN when he stopped talking to me after he held up a project for 3 months and wouldn’t respond to my emails. Soooo passive aggressive.
Because of my recent experiences with psychologists I have lost trust in psychotherapy and counseling. However, I keep watching your videos not only because I find them very informative but mostly because the way you talk is really relaxing and soothing to ears. If you were just telling bedtime stories I'd still be watching your videos lol
Good video. I wonder if a lot of this goes under the radar because, "Why would I seek out help when I know better than everybody else?" Even if someone with these traits realises they have a problem, they might think that only they are smart enough to understand and fix their problems.
Bingo!
tobuslieven Not really They would reject their diagnosis.
Coverts are great at flying under the radar. I had two covert narcissist friends I got to know much better during covid lockdowns. So much of their behavior I used to just write off. One of them is in a relationship with an overt narcissist homeless guy she let move in with her so she has someone to victimize her to the point she's suicidal but rather than end the relationship and throw out this mooch who isn't on her lease, she has her own personal suicide hotline... So "depression is kicking my ass, just please always answer the phone when I call" and she'd call at 2 am or she'd call when I was at work in the middle of a big, stressful project, just at the worst times... The last time she called me she wanted $20, the price of a rock (meth) because she was hungry, although she makes more money than i do pays lower rent and bills and supports this loser. I finally told her, "Look, bitch, call suicide hotline, I'm not equipped to deal with all this." I was practically suicidal myself. And I won't even get into the other covert I cut out of my life. Known each of them for years, but coverts know how to string you along. I didn't even know covert narcissism was a thing until I decided to cut these crazy-making people off and ask myself, "WITAF was *that* all about? Who does this?" And then youtube, creepy as it is, started serving me videos about narcissists. I bet they love all this attention; there are a ton of channels & videos about this! I suspect every sane person has a covert narcissist in their lives somewhere just waiting to be found out...
Covered a wide scope of very helpful examples. Needing to be constantly entertained for me is inverted into needing to be constantly entertaining.
I think that it's important to be objective when trying to determine whether someone is a narcissist (has npd). Because, it's one thing, for example, to be bad about not being punctual, or being kind of flaky (lack of regard for time trait), and a narcissist's reasons and ways of doing this. And people often confuse their dislike for another person for narcissism. But I do know that objectively, if a person truly does lack sufficient and genuine sympathy for the needs or basic welfare of others, demonstrates consistently and persistently an unusually malicious sense of self entitlement, low conscience, a pattern of violating a boundary that is not accidental, and possibly other traits as outlined in the DSM, then there is a possibility of narcissism. I say this because I am worried that this disorder is being misrepresented. For example, domestic violence. A man is not an abuser because he and his wife argue. Or even because he is angry with her. However, if he goes out of his way to start arguments when there was no basis for one at all, puts the other partner down directly or indirectly, has a pattern of gaslighting that results in the partner questioning herself, has a negative impact on her self esteem, and, OR physically assaults his partner in a way that is for that purpose, to assault her, (not self defense), then that is domestic violence. Just an example. I think that people need to know that there are differences between dysfunction and a person who actually may have a personality disorder.
My world is shattering even more by watching your videos. Would I ever be different?
Wow this video was PERFECTION. An awesome job covering these monsters in just a few minutes. Great job Dr. Fox 👏👏👏
They are not all monsters, and they are human beings suffering a disorder! Would you call an autistic child a monster? Because of their condition? Keep hating hey?
This is such a great video! I finally realize what this is. I have been friends with a lot of covert narcs. I just hope they get help honestly. It must be awful to be in that state of mind.
Thank you for watching and finding the video helpful! It's definitely important to recognize the signs and understand the impact of being friends with covert narcs. I hope this video can bring awareness and encourage those affected to seek help.
I would love to see a video on normal responses to some of the situations mentioned in this video bc most of the people I know respond to life as described, to some degree. Sometimes i wonder what picture of health we’re comparing ourselves to as human beings. Just a thought.
The thing with personality disorders is that they are basically "quirks" that every human can have, only they've become so extreme that it becomes a real problem in their lives. I see the covert narcissist as the ultimate victimist. It just gets out of hand with them.
guess who You completely misunderstood it.Everyone isnt susceptible to this.
Such a well structured and life changing video thanks!
Thank you very much
oh. my. god. thank you for making this video. i didnt know that narcissists had different 'types' until recently when i was thinking about why my current bf's ex left him. she said he was a covert narcissist, and because i only knew the ... 'in your face' version i was confused because i now can see what he was hiding when he told me about that... you said things that he says to me, you described what is going on in my life and how he is responding, ....... i have severe bpd/ self destructive, im on disability for that and other trauma related illnesses... your video has given me hope that i can make the right choice and run... before it is too late. may i ask, are they also very controlling? like i cannot go into another room, i have to stay with him, in the same room, or things get... bad. is that something typical for them as well?
THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU DO!!!!
Wow watching this is like realizing the calls are coming from inside the house. This helped me realize my friend is one of these
My ex-husband was diagnosed with narcissistic personality disorder. In couples therapy, after he told the psychologist he needed to fix me, the psychologist asked him if there was anything he liked about his wife,. My ex’s response was, “I like that she absorbs my anger.”
I'M SO SORRY. WHAT A REPREHENSIBLE INDIVIDUAL. YOU SHOULD HEX HIM.
@@Gina-fr7if
Thank you, but I don’t believe in hexing people.
I’m just glad I got to divorce him. I’m glad I don’t have to to be him 😀
Yes, absolutely... everything you said... and lack of respect for authority... or it’s selective according to what they want. I was married to a covert narc for 49 yrs, 9 mos. I’m a 75 yr old Christian widow... Hubby died 2.5 yrs ago.
I tried to reach out for help over the years but no one understood. I searched for info... but only began finding info on the internet about 1-2 yrs prior to his death.
3 hours of being in the firing line with a Narcissist requires 3 weeks to be far from them. This simple formula has kept me sane.
You literally describe my ex covert narcissist to the Letter…spot on sir!
Thank you for posting. This helps me explain to family and friends. The covert narcissist is hard to identify and therefore as a survivor it’s equally hard to explain to others.
Sometimes explaining to family and friends backfires. It has for me. People just don't get it. Alot of times the narc will flip around on you saying you're crazy or out to get to get them These family members do the narcissist bidding.
Dennise Lavee Without knowledge of the disorder yes.After you understand narcissism its easy to Pick them apart from the crowd.
Explaining who is a narcissist in the family might backfire. Please think it out and tread carefully.
I subscribed after seeing a fantastic video and haven’t seen you since (I forgot your name despite sub, and yt didn’t promote you)
Your videos are great in and of themselves, but your ability to provide concrete examples is unique, they’re very broken down and easy to see and can be extrapolated by anyone. Thank you!
I am 16 years old and I've been abused by a narcissist since I was in 5th grade. Since I was 10 years old she obsessed over having me be her backbone. I was forced to go through extreme levels of stress during several staged suicide attempts that I would dedicate so much emotional support for, just to be blamed for the reason their life was so terrible. Since she was a new student she couldn't understand why my friends, whom she just met, failed to give her as much attention as they gave me. She claimed to have a history of bullying so she felt entitled to be treated a certain way. Her family even hated me although I was the best friend she could ever have, probably because she never told anyone a single good thing about me. Some days I would decide to stand my ground and not invite her somewhere (she was obnoxious and outwardly rude to people) I would get harassed for hours on end and contacted off different numbers, she was obsessive. Nothing about her got better as she got older, she just become more intimidated by not controlling me. When we wouldn't be friends, I'd always apologize due to severe OCD I suffer from. I couldn't stand the intrusive thoughts that there is a possibility I could be better to her because I couldn't be the reason she died. But sure enough my anxiety was wrong. She used her life as a threat and 6 years later I still suffer from her abuse socially. I am graduating high school a year early to escape and finally live a life that isn't hers. Thank you for an amazing video!
Marwa Daoud Your ocd can be cured.You're basically trying to control things because you're not able to control other aspects of your life.Face your fears and do what needs to be done.
Hope the best for you!
Thank you Dr Fox for offering help to the CN and not just their victims. it is a rarity.
I feel as if he is describing me a lot I’m not gonna lie but it’s not on purpose. I get jealous because I feel as if I will never be good enough to even be on the same level as someone else. I am a angry person and I know this about myself but I try to hide it from friends. I’ve already quit with family but I still have to stay with them for awhile, I can’t even talk or look at them without wanting to run away or have a mental break down. Honestly I have no idea what’s wrong with me but I really do feel as if I’m the victim in a lot of cases. But when I do something and feel it has no effect on them, they will do the same to me and I want to hurt them but I don’t. It also makes it difficult to know what’s wrong because I am asocial and little antisocial. I have low self esteem and social anxiety. I feel that people are always talking behind my back and sometimes they do it to my face but I have a hard time understanding standing body language and emotions of others. My emotions one day may be angry and another may be sad. I never have had a full day of happiness it feels. And with the way others are talking in the comments about narcissistic people are making me even more insecure about myself.
Dog Bad Jealousy in adults can be from something called ‘Separation Anxiety’. Try to talk to a counsellor, if you can. 👍
I have been doing a lot of hard, Focused personal work for about a year now and I'm experiencing difficulty in changing my core concept. My tendency is toward irritation and pessimism. I have been meditating and as a former fitness instructor my exercise level is fine. I'm positive I would be dead without strenuous exercise and I'm grateful for that.
But this tendency toward the negative is Rather difficult.
Ellen D Scott,you look stunning 🌹 🌹🌷 🌷🌷🌺🌹 🌹🌷 🌷🌺
Thank you, for this information. I appreciate you speaking from a non-judgmental perspective.
I met a suspected covert narcissist in a church bible study.
At one point, she made a point of telling me that she needed me to be more of a facilitator than the style of leadership that I was able to provide.
My experience of covert narc is one of expectancy of others - they are intolerant of people's vulnerability and they are hypocritical; they expect others to provide for them but they do not provide for others.
Thanks for sharing this video !
Learning with your teachings!!
Glad it was helpful!