ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
- Fielder and the Dallas Fuel just won the Overwatch League championship. In my view, Fielder had the most consistent Kiriko play in the tournament and so I wanted to review some of his POV from the Grand Finals to help educate my viewers on how to take their Kiriko play to the next level.
#overwatch2 #kiriko #tips
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Chiyo said on stream the reason why fielder charged ult so much faster than anyone else is because Chiyo would not heal at all on purpose to leave more heals for fielder.
They figured it's better to have a fast Kitsune than a fast beat.
That’s honestly crazy
wasnt this a strat during the moth meta? purposely feeding mercy more ult charge bc valk was busted af
@@pandie_6 mercy was the ONLY healer in the moth meta so…
Which would make sense as to why the casters often brought up how much faster Viol2ts beats were
Oh interesting. And I guess that was also useful to keep the amp for a speed aggression or disengage.
Some key points about Fielder’s play which Jake highlighted:
- Fielder tries to prioritise healing over damage (core of Fielder’s play style, in contrast to aggressive Kiriko’s like Teru)
- He’s always thinking about his positioning and tries to play out of enemy light of sight
- In a losing fight, he plays more aggressively to try and make the miracle play
- When popping the ult, he uses suzu early as the team engages
- He is able to save the suzu for potential enemy ults (specifically reaper in this meta as well as using it on Sparkle whenever he goes for the death blossom)
- If everyone is full health, he’ll pre-heal whoever is the most forward/most likely to take damage
- Ultimately, he’s very teamwork oriented and focuses on what’s best for the team at any given time (whether pre-healing fearless, not going for aggressive angles, not taking any unnecessary 1v1s etc)
Hope this helps, best of luck in your ranked games :)
Good notes.
One thing I do have to say though. This is against pro players and copying this playstyle will only make you dependant on your team. Fielder doesn't play aggressive because he can get easily punished against pro's.
While In ranked games you get punished way less and heal botting does little to benefit your team. Now ofcourse it depends who you are playing with and at what SR. But usually heal botting on ANY character is an L.
Meta in anything below Masters an I'd even say Grandmaster is not going to be the same on like ladder.
Infact meta doesn't even matter on ladder until your super high SR, it's nothing like a scrimming.
So it's wise to not engage with even talking about doing what is in meta, when in metal ranks or even higher sr pools like masters or gm.
There may be a neiche game where your team mates suggest using such a stratagy but it will be half baked but can win games. Flank Kiriko is incredibly strong on ladder, also being an uber as Lucio is also incredibly effective, the unfortunate side note is that dps an tanks do not understand trading resources, map control, natural cover, armor regen or even that distracting half the enemy team enables them to do more damage and to push more aggressively. (you should just heal more -kek)
This is why it's so important to have your thinking cap on, and understand what your team is doing or not doing an make up the differencee on ladder, always be of the mindset to make plays by doing damage an forcing the enemy team into worse positions to create more pressure.
Who's Teru? Where can I watch his gameplay?
Return of the King
The Rat King Returns 🤴
please keep the Coach Jake content going!
it really fills the void left by Jayne
Watching other streamers/youtubers feels a lot less valuable compared to this
this is gold nugget of content
Spilos pretty good too
I would far and away rather listen to Jake anyways.
I remember fielder playing a similar style with moira in the zombie meta last year, he charges ult SO quickly from the amount of healing he does and gets a massive advantage over the opposition fs
What was zombie meta? 6 man?
@@enjoyextreme yeah it was the stupid moira meta in the 2021 June Joust
Looking forward to a possible LIP Sojourn (on Echienwalde against Shock) and a Guxue Winston review (Fearless is better but I prefer different teams for the Coach Series).
Good to have Jake the "Player turned Caster turned Player-Coach turned Coach" back.
Also great job to you and the rest of the Houston boys for the Top 3 Finish!
Hopefully he returns to semi regular content we missed u Jake!
I'm so glad this is back, can't wait to see more POV reviews!
thank you coach jake, i will do my milking smarter not harder
The problem is, in OWL you can just healbot basically for kiriko ult to autowin space/teamfights, but in ranked you will never or almost never have that level of coordination. That's why, in my opinion, Kiriko is just a good flanker/duelist type support, even tho you don't have as many ults per game while doing this. You can get away with flanking in ranked pretty often.
You said it! Ladder vs league is a completely different animal
If you watch mL7's Kiriko guide he basically advocates for playing for ult farm in ranked too. Definitely need to focus a bit more on creating your own damage pressure in ranked vs high level competitive play, but the end goal is the same. Your ult is what it's all about, you're trying to focus on getting that up as fast as possible.
@@nnn4376does he still she’s been nerfed Since this came out and now her ult isn’t op anymore like here
Hes mostly healing because he trust's his team is going to do well in fights, so its most efficient to just heal them.
exactly, if you are playing with the best players you can just heal them, but any other rank than top 500, you arent getting dps thats hits things
Fielder has the Highest Average healing on Ana, Moira and Kiriko in league and the highest Brigitte win rate, his Playstyle hasn’t changed just adjusted
@@ln2017 Same goes for enemy DPS though, and enemy supports. The gameplay style is still different, but if one team's supports are keeping their other roles supported much better than the other team's, the first team is going to usually win more. Just because the level of play is lower doesn't automatically mean you need to take matters into your own hands. Support is tricky, walking the line between being assertive and proactive while keeping focus on setting up your team since that's what your kit is designed to do best.
IVE BEEN WAITING HES HERE
Thanks Jake, I climbed from silver 5 to plat 5 after focusing on staying alive and trusting my teammates
Finally more OWL reviews!! You provide such great insight into the gameplay and these are by far my favorite content you post. Can’t wait to see a guxue or fearless review! Also-not many people have asked as far as i’ve seen but a lucio or reaper review from playoffs would be interesting
I am so happy this is back
easier to focus on healing when you have edison and sparkie to handle the dmg part if so you dont have to😂
imagine fielder was Moira and Jake repeated «heal first, never go for kills» for 42 minutes. the tiktok moiras would blow up
In ranked though you run into feeders where healbotting them just exposes you because they lack awareness of their bad position. Also, playing into snipers is common in ranked so a good kiriko should always be very good with her kunai. Healbotting the entire game only works if your teammates are noticeably popping off compared to the enemy team
I don’t know, I’ve found that generally speaking you can still prioritise healing so long as you don’t allow it to compromise your position. In other words just don’t heal the feeder if they over extend beyond your LOS. You’re almost guaranteed to have one player between your DPS and tank who can absolutely win fights for you if you pocket them. Of course you can still get a few Kunai in here and there, and you can still punish enemies that expose themselves too much. I have won so many fights not just as kiriko but as support in general by identifying which of my team mates I will let die first, and supporting them with damage instead of heals. Something I’ve found very effective is to use the feeder as bait for a trade. If your DPS insist on over extending to try to secure kills, peek the corner behind them and clean up their kill for them. Worst case scenario you get a trade, best case scenario you secure the kill before they die.
That being said I’ve still had a fair few games where it’s got to the point I’ve thought enough of this, I’m diving the enemy back line myself. Jump over the wall, get a quick double kill on the supports, TP back to the team, Bob’s your uncle.
There are times when focusing on dealing more damage and helping the dps get picks is more valuable, but in most situations you should prioritise healing for the simple fact that you will get Kitsune much faster, and that is a team winning ultimate nine out of ten times. Even with flankers it's often more valuable to heal your teammate that's getting flanked instead of trying to kill the flanker yourself, or if you're the one getting flanked you should just blink/wall climb away and keep healing. That being said I really enjoy dealing damage with Kiriko, especially taking out a Widowmaker at long range or an overconfident Moira.
Really missed this series, I would love to see a deep dive into tankfist, although idk if anyone has played him in owl
There's truly no winning when people wanna give stupid names to stuff, even something as simple as suzu gets changed lol great vid, Jake! hoping for a Guxue vod review too!
What even is a スズ？
鈴 Bell?
涼 Refreshing?
スズ Tin?
If your referring to milk, its because its a reference to minecraft cleansing item. Admittedly an older classic, its not random. Like people from TF2 would call supports medic.
@@blindedbliss it's a bell
Anything that needs to be called out will be given a single-syllable name if it doesn't have one already. Simply a matter of efficiency, if a small one -- but the higher up in skill you get, the more those little things start to matter!
The goat is back
Great vid! I miss your casting because you have great insights
Will we ever get a “ translator Jake “ series
Love when you do these analysis videos, thanks much
Yes it's back! It's great when you do reviews.
I learn a lot from watching you talk about other player's gameplay
love this type of video, I'd be very happy to see reviews or coaching like this from you in the future, The theory is clear and fun thanks a lot for this
Let’s gooooo!!!!! Jake is back
Love seeing Jake VOD reviews back
This is dope, ty Jake! I was wishing the replay viewer was available to the public for the grand finals but this will do 👍
Oh my God. Jake coaching the world again. Nature is healing
YES love this series
Thank you Coach Jake. Really appreciate the video!
LETS GOOOO COACH JAKKKEEEE
Yeeeess I love this series. Let's go coach Jake!
I’d like to see you review how viol2t charges ult so fast everytime
Think how fast he would charge if he didn't get picked so much
He was talking about it on stream a few days ago (among other things like his opinion on Kilo and Proper, and talking about Moth)
Basically he used most of his Amps on Healing so he consistently built Beat like 20% faster than most other Lucios (even in this match, he consistently got Beat before Chiyo), and Shock used that fast Beat to go super aggro and give Proper enough space to get the 1st kill of the fight.
However, it doesn't always work out, because he heals so much, he isn't always moving with Speed Boost, so he does get caught out a lot (he dies 1st in tons of fights), and it also means there's less healing for FiNN to do, so they don't charge Kitsune as fast as Fuel, for example.
@@adamrooney5873 what did he have to say about Moth? if you remember
@@adamrooney5873 There’s also the fact that Chiyo doesn’t heal so that Fielder will get his ult before Finn. It’s a battle of strategies. Would you rather have a faster beat or a faster kitsune rush?
That was a dope breakdown. Thank you 🤙
Thanks for the vid. Zen and Kiriko's projectiles fire at the same speed (90 meters a second). I'm on console so projectiles are inherently harder to hit with aim assist making it inconsistent to lead shots. After listening to youtubers say to not be a healbot on Kiriko, I tried going on more flanks to do damage in quickplay and lost several games 😅. I wasnt doing it a ton but still...I'll go back to being mostly a healbot on Kiriko. I liked the comparison of Fielder's positioning to typical Ana or Zen positioning.
It’s realy weird how everything ml7 told me about Kiriko I would do then lose he said not to be a healbot bla bla bla anyway when I started playing like this play style I started WINNING I went on a 10 game winstreak from gold2 to plat3 in a matter of hours this is the first video that actually helped me ever I swear ty jake❤
more of this type of thing would be great
Calling Suzu milk is the funniest thing I’ve heard in a while Jake. Ig Minecraft terminology never leaves ya 😁
The kite at 28:55 on the winston dive was actually so smart. He had an opportunity to tp away, but the targets he would tp to are where the shock would be re-engaging after returning from spawn. So instead of tping into a dangerous sightline he plays the corner knowing that suzu can buy enough time for his team to force mikey out. That and Fearless was able to peel effectively using the last moments of Primal to knock back Mikey to put him in a position that he is either forced to use primal in the middle of the entire enemy team or disengage to his team that are returning to the point. Overall it was one of those sections of the game so full of perfect microplays that I just had to talk about it.
I finally got around to watching the grand final and Fielder got so many key picks that changed engagements. Jake's over-emphasizing that Fielder focused on "healing" because that's what supports "are supposed to do" is hilarious. I wonder what Dallas's coaching staff would say to this review.
Keep up jakerat
Great video :)
Although, I would like to take some lessons with a pinch of salt. Mainly, I feel healbotting on this hero is losing a lot in non organized games and kills or even off angle pressure matter a lot more in solo queue games. We are not playing against shock and we do not have good dps as teammates, so being proactive is more important imho.
Also, I winced in pain whenever you said 'milk' - it is 'suzu', please don't make it sound weird lol :)
Looking forward to more videos
It really depends on both your team comps. If you’re running an OWL meta mirror then playing aggressive is very risky because of the mobility of every hero in this comp but if you’re playing vs a poke comp you need to get in and deal some damage
Finally I don't have to feel bad now when I play Kiriko and prioritise healing over damage
The thing is, OWL is waaay too different to ladder, they're professionals and they always play cohesive, no one goes alone and they move as a unit. They have the necessary skills and game knowledge to perform at that level and "only heal".
Your average ladder player won't have either the mindset, skills, experience or knowledge to perform in a good way by "only healing". Don't neglect your job as a support by turning into a "healer".
this isn’t ranked bruh
@@KuroiHoshiV I never said I wasn’t gonna do damage 😭 I’m trying
@@zyonthelickman I know
@@zyonthelickman who said anything about ranked 😌 /s
THE GREATEST HAS COME BACK
We need more coach jake please even if you redo hero’s you’ve done I love this kinda content
YOOO HE'S BACK
Jake. Thanks for this video.
we need one of these on shy w hangzhou
i took one look at the team comp and went "this is a passive primary healer kiriko comp, they are gonna focus more on healing to avoid being in the middle of the enemy dives with zero dps support." basically, if your comp as kiriko as the main healer, you need to play more passive because your team cannot survive without you tping around to heal them whenever possible, in a non-kiriko primary comp, you can afford to play more agro towards the enemy supports to force them to not heal their team more. the toughest thing is recognizing when you get more value as a healer focused kiriko, or when using their kit as a flanking dps / buffing type play style. it's why every kiriko main in top 500 or above uses kirko in so many ways, because she gets the most value depending on what her kit needs to be played as during the match.
Hey thx man you seem very knowledgeable. Do you know why awkward (top 1 support) says to dps on ana but when I watch owl the anas are in the back healing and not playing like awkward?
Viol2Ts speed boost to get the entire team away safely from beat blossom kitsune was a sick play. So simple but a huge gamechanger to just give them the space and regroup
I don't think it's Finn's fault that he's behind, it's Viol2t's. Viol2t had the highest HPS by far of any Lucio player in this meta, because I'm guessing Shock weighed Beat more than other teams. If you look at the gap, usually Shock supports are even, or Viol2t is even slightly ahead, but Chiyo is usually lagging like 30-40% behind Fielder. He mentioned in his own VOD that Fuel didn't rate Beat very much, so his goal was to let Fielder heal as much as possible.
The King has returned 🎉
this way to play kiriko is the best for team play where you KNOW you can trust your teammates, in ow ranked you cant trust anyone but yourself to make the right play, so yes you could play like this in ranked but you are at the risk of your teammates so it comes down to decision making at that point and whether to make the call that you can trust your teammates or if you have to make the plays yourself and from experience its the latter most of the time.
love this series, glad its back
Always learn the best from my man Jake "he has crazy aim but decides to only heal" Lyon
But with kiriko you can do two kunia between heals for basically the exact down time as shooting one. For me it depends what's going on. If it's an extended battle in a long straight hallways or open area than I stand behind our tank and heal and double kunia between papers. The efficiency is very close and being able to two tap kill between healing is a huge
When this match was played (1st week of November, 2022) , the cooldown between her healing was lower, so it was actually better to only heal.
The devs nerfed it a bit so now you can squeeze in 1 Kunai in-between
I NEVER comment on OW videos especially with requests like this, but please do more breakdowns.
favorite call for suzu that i've heard was from Punk. When I played in a match with him he called it bell, because of the sound made when it lands. definitely prefer that over saying milk lmao.
One good tip for lower elo kiriko play is if your dps is struggling to confirm a kill you can suzu to stave off the dmg and then look for the headshot to help turn the duel
NEW COACH JAKE LETS FUCKING GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
At this point I have ~100 hrs on Kiriko and in your typical ladder game most of the time you have to heal, heal, heal heal and you auto win (if you dont die and your suzus are good).
But in some games you HAVE TO flank (with your dps) (terru style) at the same or a different angle to win games.
Sometimes it is *impossible* to win if you play "only heal" support (if you basically play fielder style).
I lost a game on Kiriko, where I had more healing alone than both enemy healers combined.
Kinda frustrating that the hero marketed as "support hero for DPS players to enjoy" is optimized by just healing.
I really enjoyed this series. Glad to see it back. =) Sojourn, winston, or lucio next? =D
OMG he's back
I’ve never heard someone call it milk till now
Was so confused for a bit
6:32 "you don't need to do damage with this agent" is just a false statement. Of course in the owl supports basically just heals because the pushes are so coordinated that if they don't heal their teammates they're just gonna die, but in a normal comp (even in top 500) you have to also do damage with Kiriko. Sure you must prioritize healing but if you don't even try to get some kills or stuffs like flanking ecc you're wasting half of the kiriko's kit. Owl is different from usual games and should not be taken as an example of how you should play in the game (of course you can take a few tips on some positioning or decision making ecc, but you can't copy the overall gameplay)
Thank you for this review and explaining very important and useful things! Can you please make same video with some of the pro reaper players? Sparkle or striker mb 🙏
Ultimately this game (and a lot of other ones) boils down to one thing that may seem obvious, but I like to illustrate it with an example. Would you rather be in a team that did one million times the damage, or in a team that won't die? Well there you go.
It's been too long 🙌
3:02 I thought two shots and one heal was less healing than one shot one heal on bap but less overall output in terms of APM
Hi jake can u sometimes do an analyse of a certain owl comp?(strenghts and weaknesses, goals etc.) thx
Welcome home :)
That play style works at owl where everybody is cracked not on plat where I play, if I don’t do damager we loose
this passiev playstyle looks like a symptom of proper existing
Healing is not slower if you shoot at the same time. You can hold M1 + M2, to get a full animation cancel.
I wonder how relevant this advice on almost only healing is now that Kiriko's recovery time for healing increased
Tru
I feel like healing 24/7 is only viable in a team environment right? Because ult/suzu are way more important
Come back i wanna see junkrat gameplay
POGGGGG
You don't look at owl gameplay if you wanna climb the ladder in solo q
Ana also used to be able to pre heal people before they were damaged
For anyone wondering what Jake is referring to when he says something like "good Milk from Fielder" or "Fielder should've used Milk there"
The direct translation of what Chinese players call Protection Suzu is basically "Milk" (because language), so a large amount of the pro-scene now say Milk instead of Suzu, because it's easier to say and hear in a crowded voice chat
Well, Kiriko is Japanese, so, while China may have come up with kanji, they are not the authority here. Her "suzu" has 浄気 (jou・ki) written on it, which has nothing to do with milk. The first kanji means cleansing and the second kanji means spirit. 鈴の御加護 is the the move that we are referring to as suzu. The full Japanese name is "suzu no okago". This means bell of divine protection. A suzu is a small bell that is normally used to alert the gods in some form. I am a linguist who also majors in East Asian Culture and knows Japanese. The milk thing is a bit weird to me.
@@randerhaywood1163 I think naming it milk is more justified by visuals/practicality than actual linguistics
Finally
please upload more
Proper is just going to carry. Not saying Shock played bad, it's more the Fuel gamed them. They conceded Proper was going to go ham so they counted on the teamwork and Fearless. It wasn't individual outplay just Fuel just out teamed and schemed the Shock.
People blaming Mikeyy are kinda right. He was the weaker tank, but not awful. The counter dive, kiting and positioning of Fuel was soooo good.
Like the bike setup, what's your FTP?
HE'S BACK? NO WAYY
@jake_ow how did you watch OWL pov's? i cant figure this out.
More vids like this!
We NEED a mer1t soujorn review, he's literally the best in the league
Do you feel this play style would need to change in ranked to be more dps-focused if your other support is not a Lucio?
Yes u can play more assassin kiriko but in the lower ranks u can’t trust ur second support
Barely uses gun because dps are dpsing, sometimes dps don’t dps in solo queue. 😢
I love the dudes who complain that says kiriko should take flanks and should be focusing on dps more I honestly just heal and only dps when I see no one is low or no incoming damage. Of course I try doing a kill if the target is low or out of position
I feel like I can't hit higher total healing with kiriko. Usually with mercy I can regulary hit 17k, I've always felt kirikos healing was slow. Idk
This TH-camr seems to know his shit! He would probably be pretty successful as a pro player/coach/caster.
Missed you babe
Should've won finals mvp. Watch the Seoul dallas game its the largest support diff I've ever seen
Curious to know everyone's thoughts on this but; is Kiriko's animation cancel worth learning for the faster healing? It seems rather negligible to me for the amount of inputs I have to do on top of everything else during a team fight. Some context if someone is unaware of the animation cancel - basically when you use your heal and throw a kunai and melee immediately then reload + use heal, the animation of the healing is reduced (I think either at the end or the beginning of the animation, unsure).
People have already done tests on this, the "animation cancel" doesn't actually decrease the down-time for her Healing Ofuda.
It isn't faster, it's just your brain tricking you because it looks faster.
"shooting my gun" = throwing knives LUL