Great video Bud. For those types of deeper cuts in steel, I would recommned using 1/2" diameter end mills vs 3/8". Also for steel, RPMs will need to be lower and also be sure to use lower gear setting on the Tormach for added torque - you are going to need it for steel - even for drilling. Lastly, you may also consider 5 flute end mills or even using 4 flute roughing (corn cob) end mills for roughing the stock on steel. I have cut steel on my Tormach 770 Series 3 from time-to-time and larger diamter (1/2") diamter end mills, approx. 2500-3000 RPM, and stub length (1/2" flute length) is a pretty good recipe for "reasonable" rigidity for heavy cutting in steel. 3/8" stub length isn't bad either but the flute length is shorter. Also, for initial roughing around the outside, I would recommend going with adaptive clearing with multiple step downs (1/4" step down and and on your machine, your can probably get away with as much as 0.075"-0.1" stepover with a 1/2" stub length corn cob end mill in steel). Then for depths longer then 1/2" deep contours on steel use multiple depth step-down contour pass with about 0.005" step over with 4 or 5 flute standard end mill to cleanup the lines left by the corn cob end mill. I got my 5 flute and stub length end mills from Lakeshore Carbide. Stub length (fire plug) and roughing (corn cob) end mills are your friend on these smaller horsepower machines when cutting steel. Keep up the great content.
BendTheIrons - I appreciate the details on how to get through the steel. I was able to get them cut and will get that video out next week. As you outlined, I had to totally change the machining strategy and wend with step downs and .005" side milling cuts for the final clean up. I also ended up using a ½" end mill for some of the pocket clearing instead of the 3/8". To your point I really need to get some roughing end mills, I did not account for those in the budget on this project so great learning for next time. I had a few other challenges, but overall they turned out as good or better than the Aluminum. I will be much more prepared for the next large steel project on my Tormach for sure. Thanks for the comment and for watching.
Michael Koch - Ha, yes I try to keep the story moving to not let the videos get to long. Hopefully it is still clear enough to follow. Glad you liked the parts in this one and I appreciate the comment. Greetings back to you from Texas. I know I have several Australian and Canadian followers and a few from other parts of the world but you are the first shout out from Germany. Welcome!
Look into the 2d adaptive tool path in place of the 2d contour that you used. It won’t cut air and will offer a constant chip load. Use 2d contour for the finish pass.
@duvlss_garage - I could possible make them, however, I have no way to design them. For this project the customer provided the full CAD design for me to work from. He had even 3D printed one in plastic to verify the design. If you have the design complete feel free to reach out via the contact form on my website and I can take a look. Thanks - www.BladesIIB.com
I know someone who manufactures Brembo knockoff brake calipers for scooters... he uses a YCM VMC to do the job... it uses Fanuc OiM2 controllers. But he basically makes a run of about 100 of them. If you got a CNC that is what you should be thinking (making a one off part on a CNC is really a waste of time, it takes a ton of programming and CAD work to make a working part, not to mention you need to make at least 5 sets of test parts to make sure it comes out right). He makes them out of 6160 T6 aluminum, and the Brembo unit he is knocking off is cast.
Tyler Fu - Yes prototype work on the CNC is not efficient. But this was very custom and no market to make more of them. Good learning experience. I did not want to try and machine all those contours by hand. My productions runs are my knife parts maybe I will find a little production part I can make money on. 😁
@@BladesIIB Speaking of production... I thought about using Xometry to do job shops... a CNC is extremely expensive, usually banks are involved if you buy them.. so it's gotta be producing parts in order for it to pay for itself. The problem with Xometry is I looked up how much I'd be paid for the part, and concluded that I have to be Elon Musk to work for them, because you actually have to PAY to work for them. You'd spend far more shipping the part to them than what you'd get from the work. I don't have a CNC because I can't think of anything that I can do that a CNC would help in such a way to justify its cost. I make acoustic guitars by hand, and I don't get enough business to pay for much of anything. Besides wood is easy to shape by hand. The guy I speak of he didn't do any contours at all. He did it all using 2D and had custom cutters made for some profiles. I have no idea the cost to do this in the US. I believe he was making this here: www.scooter-center.com/en/brake-caliper-front-lhs-brembo-4-piston-oe-30/34mm-p4-30/34c-titanium-style-3332085 (it's made from 6160 aluminum by the way, not titanium, but the external shape is the same). Had all sorts of custom cutters made for the production. He had changed enough of the product to avoid any patent lawsuits. He had me draw the product in Master Cam once so he can do contours on it (as he doesn't seem to be very good at drawing 3D objects). But I'll be honest, perhaps in the US it makes sense to make Brembo knockoffs for cars or trucks, but in Taiwan we make motorcycle parts mainly because the market for that is much bigger. Also installation is much easier as you require smaller facilities to install the parts compared to cars or trucks (I presume you're able to install it in your garage). But honestly I'm not sure your Tormarch is up to the task... you really need a bigger VMC (that isn't using an umbrella ATC) for this kind of work. The guy I know has 3 vises set up in the VMC so that he can basically do production runs in it. The coordinate to those vise is dialed into the machine.
@@taiwanluthiers I have heard Xometry prices are hard to deal with. Yea am still just a hobby guy so not looking to run my machine day and night yet. Don’t want to take the fun out of it. Having a larger machine would mean keeping it running more often for sure.
@@BladesIIB I really like to have a CNC though, but I just don't have the money to buy it... especially that bank loans in Taiwan is extremely hard to get. Plus I wouldn't want a bank loan as that would mean pressure to make enough to make the payment. The only CNC I have is a CO2 laser cutter...
@@taiwanluthiers Unless it is how you make your living, I agree don’t take a loan for one. The laser sounds pretty cool. I could use something like that for engraving and I know some even cut. I am not to familiar with lasers, maybe one day.
Erik Slagter - Fair question. I am still learning how to make my tool paths more efficient. I thought this side milling would be good since it was full depth. Always a trade off somewhere. If you watch the video cutting the steel one it was a different step down approach. Less air cutting but longer time in the end with all the step downs. Thanks for the question, I am hoping to continue to improve.
I see this is a prototype, but aluminum threads are inherently very weak, especially at that bolt size and torque. This part should be made in stainless steel, or just use helicoils if making out of aluminum.
Zoran M - Appreciate the comment, this part is truly a prototype for test fit only, maybe proof of concept would have been better. It will not be used at all. The actual parts are made from heat treated 4140, check out the video next week to see those.
Your machine is so clean inside the workplace
CarGuy - Thanks! The wash down hose I added makes it pretty easy to keep it clean.
Great video Bud. For those types of deeper cuts in steel, I would recommned using 1/2" diameter end mills vs 3/8". Also for steel, RPMs will need to be lower and also be sure to use lower gear setting on the Tormach for added torque - you are going to need it for steel - even for drilling. Lastly, you may also consider 5 flute end mills or even using 4 flute roughing (corn cob) end mills for roughing the stock on steel. I have cut steel on my Tormach 770 Series 3 from time-to-time and larger diamter (1/2") diamter end mills, approx. 2500-3000 RPM, and stub length (1/2" flute length) is a pretty good recipe for "reasonable" rigidity for heavy cutting in steel. 3/8" stub length isn't bad either but the flute length is shorter. Also, for initial roughing around the outside, I would recommend going with adaptive clearing with multiple step downs (1/4" step down and and on your machine, your can probably get away with as much as 0.075"-0.1" stepover with a 1/2" stub length corn cob end mill in steel). Then for depths longer then 1/2" deep contours on steel use multiple depth step-down contour pass with about 0.005" step over with 4 or 5 flute standard end mill to cleanup the lines left by the corn cob end mill. I got my 5 flute and stub length end mills from Lakeshore Carbide. Stub length (fire plug) and roughing (corn cob) end mills are your friend on these smaller horsepower machines when cutting steel. Keep up the great content.
BendTheIrons - I appreciate the details on how to get through the steel. I was able to get them cut and will get that video out next week. As you outlined, I had to totally change the machining strategy and wend with step downs and .005" side milling cuts for the final clean up. I also ended up using a ½" end mill for some of the pocket clearing instead of the 3/8". To your point I really need to get some roughing end mills, I did not account for those in the budget on this project so great learning for next time. I had a few other challenges, but overall they turned out as good or better than the Aluminum. I will be much more prepared for the next large steel project on my Tormach for sure. Thanks for the comment and for watching.
You talk as fast as a machine gun! 😁 - Good job! 👍👍👍
Greetings from Dresden! 😎
Michael Koch - Ha, yes I try to keep the story moving to not let the videos get to long. Hopefully it is still clear enough to follow. Glad you liked the parts in this one and I appreciate the comment. Greetings back to you from Texas. I know I have several Australian and Canadian followers and a few from other parts of the world but you are the first shout out from Germany. Welcome!
Look into the 2d adaptive tool path in place of the 2d contour that you used. It won’t cut air and will offer a constant chip load. Use 2d contour for the finish pass.
David Scheiding - Thanks for the comment. I need to remember the adaptive clearing tool paths for sure.
awesome work!!! One day I'll need to swap to the 1100mx or Hass if it makes sense
CarGuy - Thanks! Only CNC machine I have had so I can’t give a comparison, but I have been very happy with this Tormach so far. Almost 2 years now.
@@BladesIIB Nice, and you're welcome. Awesome work again.
Can you make brackets for brembo calipers for a 90 c1500.
@duvlss_garage - I could possible make them, however, I have no way to design them. For this project the customer provided the full CAD design for me to work from. He had even 3D printed one in plastic to verify the design. If you have the design complete feel free to reach out via the contact form on my website and I can take a look. Thanks - www.BladesIIB.com
I know someone who manufactures Brembo knockoff brake calipers for scooters... he uses a YCM VMC to do the job... it uses Fanuc OiM2 controllers. But he basically makes a run of about 100 of them. If you got a CNC that is what you should be thinking (making a one off part on a CNC is really a waste of time, it takes a ton of programming and CAD work to make a working part, not to mention you need to make at least 5 sets of test parts to make sure it comes out right).
He makes them out of 6160 T6 aluminum, and the Brembo unit he is knocking off is cast.
Tyler Fu - Yes prototype work on the CNC is not efficient. But this was very custom and no market to make more of them. Good learning experience. I did not want to try and machine all those contours by hand. My productions runs are my knife parts maybe I will find a little production part I can make money on. 😁
@@BladesIIB Speaking of production... I thought about using Xometry to do job shops... a CNC is extremely expensive, usually banks are involved if you buy them.. so it's gotta be producing parts in order for it to pay for itself. The problem with Xometry is I looked up how much I'd be paid for the part, and concluded that I have to be Elon Musk to work for them, because you actually have to PAY to work for them. You'd spend far more shipping the part to them than what you'd get from the work. I don't have a CNC because I can't think of anything that I can do that a CNC would help in such a way to justify its cost. I make acoustic guitars by hand, and I don't get enough business to pay for much of anything. Besides wood is easy to shape by hand.
The guy I speak of he didn't do any contours at all. He did it all using 2D and had custom cutters made for some profiles. I have no idea the cost to do this in the US. I believe he was making this here: www.scooter-center.com/en/brake-caliper-front-lhs-brembo-4-piston-oe-30/34mm-p4-30/34c-titanium-style-3332085 (it's made from 6160 aluminum by the way, not titanium, but the external shape is the same). Had all sorts of custom cutters made for the production. He had changed enough of the product to avoid any patent lawsuits. He had me draw the product in Master Cam once so he can do contours on it (as he doesn't seem to be very good at drawing 3D objects).
But I'll be honest, perhaps in the US it makes sense to make Brembo knockoffs for cars or trucks, but in Taiwan we make motorcycle parts mainly because the market for that is much bigger. Also installation is much easier as you require smaller facilities to install the parts compared to cars or trucks (I presume you're able to install it in your garage). But honestly I'm not sure your Tormarch is up to the task... you really need a bigger VMC (that isn't using an umbrella ATC) for this kind of work. The guy I know has 3 vises set up in the VMC so that he can basically do production runs in it. The coordinate to those vise is dialed into the machine.
@@taiwanluthiers I have heard Xometry prices are hard to deal with. Yea am still just a hobby guy so not looking to run my machine day and night yet. Don’t want to take the fun out of it. Having a larger machine would mean keeping it running more often for sure.
@@BladesIIB I really like to have a CNC though, but I just don't have the money to buy it... especially that bank loans in Taiwan is extremely hard to get. Plus I wouldn't want a bank loan as that would mean pressure to make enough to make the payment. The only CNC I have is a CO2 laser cutter...
@@taiwanluthiers Unless it is how you make your living, I agree don’t take a loan for one. The laser sounds pretty cool. I could use something like that for engraving and I know some even cut. I am not to familiar with lasers, maybe one day.
Are you not cutting a lot of air :-) ?
Erik Slagter - Fair question. I am still learning how to make my tool paths more efficient. I thought this side milling would be good since it was full depth. Always a trade off somewhere. If you watch the video cutting the steel one it was a different step down approach. Less air cutting but longer time in the end with all the step downs. Thanks for the question, I am hoping to continue to improve.
@@BladesIIB I guess it's the fusion learning curve. Anyway the part came out great!
@@erikslagter3231 Thanks, yes happy with the part. Always more to learn. Can never find the time to do all I want to.
I see this is a prototype, but aluminum threads are inherently very weak, especially at that bolt size and torque. This part should be made in stainless steel, or just use helicoils if making out of aluminum.
Zoran M - Appreciate the comment, this part is truly a prototype for test fit only, maybe proof of concept would have been better. It will not be used at all. The actual parts are made from heat treated 4140, check out the video next week to see those.