Is VulkanMod really better than Sodium?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ต.ค. 2024
- In this short video, i compared two optimization mods between each other (Sodium and VulkanMod) to see, which one is better in terms of performance.
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Keeping in mind that vulkanmod is still in alpha, and if it's developed enough, we could even see real ray traced shaders, that uses RT cores of the gpus
already been done by cortex, in Vulkanite
Vulkanite:
It's already being done, you don't need to have the full game be on Vulkan to do it iirc.
@@Treetrain1 Ah yes, indeed, altho I tested it, and it looks total black for me
@@Kimizuky then your device most likely doesn't support vulkan
"Is VulkanMod really better than Sodium?"
"Na"
my nerdy brain choke laughed at this
No pun intended sodium: Na
thats a giggler right there
I get it
😅
to be honest, microsoft should make the next big update performance based. Imagine: "Minecraft: The Performance Update" that would be music to my ears
No way. We need more useless mobs and random features that have nothing to do with each other. That's what everyone really wants these days.
@@BarretTheImmaculatetotally
Version 1.12 is one of those. It would be nice to have update dedicated for that.
Yes but money
New mobs generates money
Performance doesn't
@@TheCatboyInQuestion9056 number 1 Microsoft meat rider 💯
Idk anything about this vulcan mod. I do know that sodium is essentially as optimized as opengl minecraft can get. If this alpha-stage mod with first-attempt optimization is matching sodium, this is something we need to pay attention to.
Yeah. Also it's weird to compare generation speed because vulkan is only improving render speed, as i know
Sodium is not really as optimized as it could be, as right now it uses a old version of OpenGL to stay compatible with mac and legacy hardware
@@safixo thats what I mean. its about as good as it gets as the current engine allows
Vulkan works better on AMD GPUs. Note that there is a BIG difference between Sodium and VulkanMod. Sodium is a new rendering code with geometry batching and draw pass consolidation, and it makes many optimizations for vertices, etc.
While, if I understand correctly, as the name suggests, VulkanMod only converts the Render API from OpenGL to Vulkan? I'm not sure about that, but if I'm right, that means that Vulkan can, in fact, be WAY faster than Sodium in the near future if it tries to do more than converting the Render API. It could maybe even do something like what NVidium does with that Render API and have GIGANTIC chunks with low performance cost.
Thanks for this discovery, NickNameHidden!
Will work better on AMD GPUs because AMD originally written it. And makes their cards for that API. It's really clear in f.e. Doom 2016. If we have GPU from NVidia it will work better on DirectX then on Vulkan, but AMD on the other hand will work better on Vulkan. But, that's just digression.
they do make optimizations than just converting it to vulkan, the changelogs say so atleast
you have nvidium on nvidia so that's something i guess
Vulkan is optimized because it uses the graphics card api to draw things as of my understanding, but its goddamn hard to code in it
@@JsjdjJhdjd Only in Turing, Pascal and older cant use nvidium mod
before watching the video, i can tell you that vulkan is i think on par with sodium, gets wrecked by nvidium, and has an arterial blockage outside of windows.
Vulkan mod on Linux is an absolute beast.
@@starleighpersonalmhm I'm getting 200 fps 16 chunks rendering in 2k
Nvidium is exclusive to Nvidia hardware, which not all of us have, as an AMD user Nvidium is irrelevant to me, same goes for any iGPU user
And what do you mean blockage outside of windows? Vulkan isn't windows exclusive, actually it was originally desgined for Linux and Android before being ported to windows shortly after
It means vulcan and nvidium dies of a heart atacks on non-windows because fuck nvidia
IT is not on par. All that Vulkan does is replace the renderer, while sodium actually optimizes the game. The test should have been done with OpenGL+Sodium and Vulkan side by side
I can see the biggest benefit for Vulkan mod with shaders. With Vulkan ray tracing shaders could actually utilize the RT hardware inside them and vastly speed up the rendering speed and even enhance the visuals while having better performance. Of course this is limited to AMD RDNA2, RTX, and Intel Arc GPUs
It's already being done without VulkanMod, Vulkanite by Cortex.
@@TheMasterOfSafariNice if both team up like iris and DH that would be amazing
Also upscaling and frame generation algorithms only support DX12 and Vulkan. This is the only way currently to get this in MC without using the Render Dragon engine, especially now that FSR3 is open source and getting a quality update soon
Keep in mind that Vulkan mod only changes the rendered, which means that if the devs of Sodium release a version for Vulkan it could have both the performance of vulkan and sodium combined.
this is not possible, as sodium is a 'rendering engine' by itself, you can't combine two rendering engines.
Please prove me wrong. @@xd4sty VulkanMod supported mods list on GitHub specifically states that Sodium will never be supported.
WE BEATING WALL OF FLESH WITH THIS ONE🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥🔥
WERE MAKING IT INTO HARDMODE WITH THIS ONE 🔥🔥🗣️
@@timeblade WE ARE GOING TO SMASH SUPREME CALAMITAS WITH THIS ONE 🔥🔥
WE ARE GONNA TAKE XEROC WITH THIS ONE!
WE'RE CRUSHING YHARIM WITH THIS ONE!!!💪💪💪💥🔥🔥
WERE MAKING IT INTO POSTMOONLORD CALAMITY CONTENT WITH THIS ONE🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥‼‼‼‼‼‼‼‼
in order to properly test these performarnce mods you had to make sure you are completely GPU bound, because these mods mostly affect graphics, not the structure of the minecraft itself
You should use rivatuner instead of a mod. (It's apart of MSI Afterburner) It shows frame times, min and max fps, 1% lows and 0.1% lows. Sometimes you can't tell the difference from just fps.
how do you use msi afterburner on an nvidia gpu??
I think there's also MangoHud that shows that as well.
I think there's also MangoHud that shows that as well.
capframex better
@@Anonymous-Not-FoundWhat? It’s made for nvidia gpus…
I remember in some GitHub thread on Nvidium’s repo that the optimizations that Nvidium does, *is* supported for AMD gpus, with the caveat that the driver only supports Vulkan calls not OpenGL calls.
Edit: Grammar, and spelling.
Nvidium uses mesh shaders, which are only supported by Nvidia GPUs in OpenGL. This is due to OpenGL being developed by different companies, and many of them can't agree on what functionality to implement, so they create OpenGL extensions, which are only supported by their own platform. Other platforms support mesh shaders, just not in OpenGL. Switching to Vulkan should allow the use of mesh shaders on any platform that supports them. Actually, mesh shading has been around for a while, and it is heavily used in latest-gen console graphics
you are extremely underrated bro
With vulkan, I am now able to use vkBasalt shaders (ReShade). I was able to experiment with some test shaders, but they all were just some proofs of concepts.
On another note, from the testing that I did (without shaders), I found out that loading chunks is slower with vulkanmod. My GPU would peak its usage for just a small moment whenever I load new chunks with sodium, and the fps would stay relatively stable. With vulkanmod, my gpu did not seem to peak at all, but my fps do drop a lot when loading chunks. This feels like it can be improved, usually I have a higher gpu utilisation when using vulkan vs OpenGL. I believe these results are due to sodium batching the rendering operations and applying some other optimisations. I don't think vulkanmod is really doing any optimisations yet.
Speaking of bedrock edition,
I played on a java edition launcher for android called pojavlauncher.
And it runs smoother then bedrock edition when using optifine (no joke)
cap if you were playing in newer versions however in olders versions then yes but its an unfair comparsion still
I was actually watching this video to see if Volkan was good for Android Java Edition
@@NotTuredit’s unfair bc BE ain’t got no performance mods which do anything
@@Fryingpan-s8jbut the performance mods for java edition only exist to fix the horrible optimization it has
@@Fryingpan-s8j not really i have more fps in bedrock than java even with peformance mods but thats only for newer versions
question: how were the % lows in the fps of the first tests? that's usually an alright measure of stability to sample the lowest performance peaks to know how much the game stutters when certain things starts being calculated.
what impresses me, is how they did it, because vulkan is significantly more low level than opengl (low level means closer to bare metal), but the performance is worth it, vulkan also has built-in raytracing support
It's worth noting that what vulkanmod and sodium does, are not mutually exclusive. So with the render backend swapped with vulkan, sodium could still be implemented with the new renderer. This is something that in reality mojang should do themselves, but they only care about bedrock, which is where they made use of DX12 for the new render engine.
Now do Sodium, Nvidium and Vulkan Mod, that would be a good comparison! :D
nvidium is different than those two
@@zamgion Nvidium is a performance optimisation mod as well
Yes but nvidium is only compatible with nvidia gpus. Which is kinda unfair to AMD GPU's lol
@@pigpogftw Sometimes..I question my existence with my AMD GPU..
@@pigpogftw keep in mind that Vulkan works best with AMD cpus and gpus
its crazy how I left this on my chrome page to watch it later for over half a year and its only 4 minutes... my attention span is cooked i didnt even check how long it was 😭
Vulkanmod just updated to 0.4.0 and brings a lot of optimizations! Could you make a comparison video with the updated version?
Yo bro how do i download it
@@pikachustorm4831 curseforge
3:00 that's because the only thing vulkanmod does is swapping the renderer
if vulkanmod also had the optimizations that sodium has, it would be 10x faster
And he has nVidia card
@@Niepokonany666 true, i forgot about that
For those saying Mojang should make a performance update, you need to remember they must make money. You can’t really advertise that to the public, they should improve both performance and content. Same with QoL features
It's Minecraft, the bestselling video game of all time, and owned by the giant that is Microsoft. I think they can afford to make a performance update.
@@vibaj16 Microsoft would never allow it, they’d make it a small part of a content update
Because at the end of the day you can’t really make a trailer for performance and put it on the Microsoft yt expecting it to make more sales, it would make people assume it’s got really bad performance
bro is playing Minecraft with Terraria music in the background 😭
you're doing a favor for the minecraft community :)
the thing is that vulkan really shines on lower end computers, so that's why there wasn't much difference on your side since your computer is pretty powerful
In a low-end pc, VulkanMod gives a little bit more fps than sodium in some cases. Personally, I think VulkanMod is better (although it has a lot of mod incompatibilities) in my phone (yes my phone), VulkanMod performed a lot better than Sodium. In a flat world, during chunk loading, my fps in Sodium was bad 1-16 FPS, and it smooths out when all chunks (which takes a while because chunk loading is slow when I have Sodium) have been loaded while in VulkanMod my fps while loading is 5-25 FPS and it smooths out really quickly and reaching 100-260 FPS real quickly and Chunk Loading is slow but not as slow as Sodium and VulkanMod dropped a new update in it's Github Repository which improved Chunk Loading and it's noticeable in my device.
For me it doubled the FPS compared to Sodium but Sodium didn’t really increase my FPS at all. The reason is probably that Sodium uses newer OpenGL versions and MacOS deprecated OpenGL. That bad thing about Vulkan is that it is incompatible with a lot of other mods
That's not how GPU/CPU usage works if the CPU has low usage it's good if GPU has low usage it's horrible
honestly the best optimization mods for nvidia users is soudium with nvidium, i have the same processor as you but i have the gtx 1650 with 16gb ddr4 ram on dual channels and i get around 600-800fps on a normal world with 16 chunk render distance
You forgot to have vanilla as control.
some infos arent fully right, most mods are gonna work perfectly fine on VulkanMod - where it gets problematic is when mods directly mess with the renderer: Iris is the best example for a mod that will never work with VulkanMod
1.15 was a performance update which did absolutely nothing
I hope they release a performance update that actually adds performance
Hello, just here to comment that Vulkan being better than openGL is a myth. The difference between them is that Vulkan exposes a lot more controls over how your gpu renders, this can be used for a better optimization but when you latterly have 10x the code to write you might start just copying standard solutions to the problems that are done for you by openGL. Now that the mod works and is in alpha I assume the developers are going to replace those solutions.
Also when you have like 1k fps the problem becomes not in your gpu or cpu but in the god dam north bridge of your chipset (If my memory serves me correctly.) Which is responsible for transferring data in between cpu and gpu cuz keep in mind it has to transfer data for over 1k images per second.
So for better testing next time make sure to load your world. And ya testing is freaking hard I feel you.
I wonder how optimized we could get if we managed to get vulkan rendering combined with sodium level optimizations
1:42 "not that big of a difference"
that 100 fps is all i need
Vulkan works best with AMD cpus and gpus
Really?
what if i have an nvidia gpu with a ryzen cpu? and also is vulkan compatible with nvidium?
Does it work well with Snapdragon chipsets
@@DoooFuswith Nvidia you won't see much of a difference
And no, nvidium is not nor ever will be compatible with vulkan mod, nvidium uses openGL layers exclusive to Nvidia GPUs
Vulkan is not openGL, it's am entirely separate graphics API
@@flamingscar5263 so what im getting from this is that i should not use vulkan on my nvidia gpu, but i can instead recommend it to my friend who has an all amd system?
It would be interesting to use a realistic benchmark world, like the Hermitcraft world. Additionally a lot of players play on servers, so testing that would be interesting too.
the best mod you can use is sodium with nvidium trust me you may not get that many more frames from nvidium but the chunk rendering is so much smoother that you can render 32 chunks on a pc that can otherewise only handle 10 chunks
you should have done sodium and all the sodium mods that are part of it because it boosts fps even further
I'm not a developer but as a Minecraft player and someone who messed around with things like the nvidia control panel and similar... I think the engine swap would make a difference when both the hardware (in this case GPU) and the software (Minecraft) support and make an active use of the possible feature benefits. Sodium optimizes game functions while vulkanmod only changes the render engine. Minecraft is a CPU intensive game and without shaders, iris iGPUs and AMD equivalents will basically be on pair with dedicated graphics.
You don't need, in fact you don't want 1000 FPS because input latency will hit hard. Don't call cap on this because I did test this on different computers, even on a mac, capping fps to 360 for my personal build is the sweet spot, adding any extra frame for input will give close to no benefit other than making your room warmer in winter.
Nvidia control panel options won't affect performance because everything gets decided by the game rather than the panel, designed for older games. It might work on Minecraft but the default settings are most likely the best, nvidia wouldn't sell as much in the gaming market if they didn't squeeze those 3fps out via drivers
An optimized game does not mean that it will use less resources instead it just means that it runs optimally as it should while it may use or not use more resources is irrelevant
This dudes a real one for putting terraria music in his Minecraft video
Should point out that there shouldn't be a lot of mod incompatibility, unless a mod specifically is designed to bypass the renderer and do its own rendering directly to the GPU API. To my knowledge not many mods do this, as they depend on the renderer classes to do the heavy lifting.
theres also nvidium with bobby for fabric which gives A LOT
Yes by a long shot, i strictly only add vulkan compatible mods on my server, sodium is great on high end pcs but in my case theres sometimes load stutters, while vulkan is buttery smooth all the time
VulkanMod doesn't even implement most of the optimizations that Sodium does. Just imagine if the dev decides to implement these!
there is also Nvidium
True, but it's just for chunks and it also does not support shaders, like vulkan.
It is CRAZY a new alpha mod has this performance. Nvidium+Vulkan are insane. I wonder if we could have a meta-mod over both of them that chooses to swap out the rendere based on the GPU available, or just ship both in modpack and tell ppl to turn one on I guess. It'd be insane if you could ship sodium + vulkan + nvidium and have sodium be the default, and then ppl could swap to whatever renderer they want. In the future these 2 should become viable options.
Much of the ecosystem seems built on top of sodium and tied to it tho 💀(indium / create w/ sodium fix and flywheel... ETF EMF)
Sodium mod is optimising the open gl implementation of the game while vulkan mod swaps opengl with vulkan but i am assuming the underlying game logic code remains the same and its only the rendering api thats swapped, if thats the case then a mod like sodium could be developed for vulkan that will allow the vulkan mod to have an even bigger improvement
No, the vulkan API was not born as a faster API, it was born as a lower level API then open gl that gives you more control over the GPU and allows you to do better optimizations than you ever could with open gl, one single call to opengl can equal tens of calls to vulkan, and it's basically the same level of abstraction of DirectX except it's cross platform which is really cool
These tests don't mean anything because we don't know what your system configuration is. Vulkan theoretically always runs better on AMD GPUs. If you have an Nvidia GPU you likely won't see a performance uplift.
BUT! Sodium has Nvidium
Nvidium is ass
On certain devices (eg. mine,) there can be significant differences in framerate. When I last tried it, I averaged ~300 on sodium and ~1000 on VulkanMod, comparable to your framerates. It's likely on a per-computer basis, test on your devices.
HOWEVER. I still do not recommend switching if you use a significant amount of mods. I had to cut down my mod list from ~200 to 30 to get it to launch.
0:55 If that 512 number is the minimum ram allocation, you should actually make that match the maximum allocation. When Java dynamically changes those values during runtime, it reduces performance.
We need :
Minecraft : Full Power (performance)
and
Minecraft: Keeping Inventory
The entire point of Vulkan is to utilize multiple cores and threads + modern tech like RT/PT. Vulkan rendering also a little bit optimal compared to OpenGL. In this case both Sodium and VulkanMod are even as they use one thread for rendering.
Ultimate Vulkan implementation are actually made my ID Software in ID Tech 7. Their engine don't have main thread and everything done as "jobs" distributing workload to all CPU cores evenly.
That is possible in Minecraft Java, but for this a lot of parts of the game should be rewritten. Sound engine, Entity engine, and then the Rendeder. But that ALOT of work.
Vulkan mod is unstable compared to sodium which is the reason why the fps isnt consistent compared to sodium 1200-1300 fps
vulkan vs sodium? nah do vulkan vs sodium + nvidium + bobby (printing fps atp)
bro bobby doesnt increase ur fps
@@vegito6316 your only half correct, it technically doesn’t increase your fps yes, what it does do is let you run a higher render distance without actually loading in the chunks, it helps keep frame rate up with high render distance settings, for example I’ve before been able to use Bobby to increase my render distance to 96chunks, all settings on high, with no lag
Half the things you measured are not changed by either of these mods, so any results you measured are just the result of normal fluctuation.
i really wouldn't worry about performance if you never dip below your monitors refresh rate
The Nvidium mod is pretty good, especially at high render distances.
I don’t think Minecraft coded with OpenGL has been optimized to render on Vulkan "translator?" this may be why the fps are so weird.
Very high quality video! this vid was like sodium to me, made my day better!
try nvidium. you can more than likely do 32 chunks
Vulkan did actually boost my frames cuz it switches game render from open gl to vulkan but when i logged on to mccisland it crashed and was doing this every time
vulkan is so good just need to add shaders suport and ti whell be perfect
What if we connect this mods?
Use all Sodium optimization and add vullan render to it
Says it's incompatible on the mod page.
imagine:
vulkan rendering engine with sodium's mc rendering engine optimizations
crazy that vulkan actually gives me so much fps than sodium, too bad there are many glitches though
Vulkan is simply the better choice. Next Minecraft update should migrate to Vulkan, so all modders are forced to add support for it. OpenGL has no business in a game in 2024 as it doesn't even allow for real raytracing.
i just want Nvidium to work with shaders..
vulkan is just a renderer, sodium does more than just optimizing rendering such as generating geometry of chunks
I can definitely see this vulkan mod eventually replace sodium, but for now the mod compatibility is just abysmal. If ur fine running 100% vanilla mc with only vulkanmod then sure go for it. But if you have basically any other mod such as iris, distant horizons, even smaller ones like advancement plaques and so on then the game just straight up wont work.
Ill give it like 3 years at least before its usable as a replacement for sodium.
"Even bedrock started lagging", ah yes, because bedrock has a history of running smoothly. Said nobody ever.
let me put it this way:
there are FORGE mods (for 1.19.x)
that fix ALL of the issues with most things that people have
1. theres a mod called ferrite core (or ferritecore) that reduces the RAM usage when its not needed
2. theres performance mods that improve the FPS
3. theres performance mods that "cache" things (like the fast suite, by Shadows_of_Fire) that even further reduce RAM and improve FPS by more of a byproduct of trying to reduce tps lag when fetching things like different crafting recipes, which also ends up making things more stable by accident
4. theres mods that work identically like sodium (like lithium or canary, etc.) but the only thing that sodium has that these others dont is the fact that fabric needs more mods to get the most basic things running and compatible with each other, which only gives performance benefits with fewer mods, and has a much worse impact with larger packs that have the same mods
lithium isnt identical rubidium or embeddium is identical to sodium but rubidum is just an forge port of sodium
More gpu utilization is usually better
As far as I'm aware, the Vulkan api is optimized towards AMD gpus, so your 3060 may not show improvements.
Are you Silent Hill fan? Because I heard OST from SH2 in this video
I have tried it with my laptop
Sodium: 30-120 fps
Vulkan: 160-780 fps
Components: Amd A6, Amd Radeon R4, 8GB Ram
Minecraft version: 1.21
I will make a video about it later
bruh my mac fps makes vulkan better but less support right now. i get 280-490 fps with sodium and 300-500 fps with vulkan
Depends on your hardware, like significantly depends
The more modern the more it will lean towards Vulkan, the older the more it will lean towards sodium
I'm Ignoring nvidium its exclusive to Nvidia and many people play Minecraft with iGPUs, which will never be Nvidia
Older hardware will have been desgined for Minecrafts ancient graphics API known as openGL (seriously the newest openGL version came out in 2017) and no mod other then vulkan mod changes away from openGL
Newer hardware will have been optimized for Vulkan, a significantly more modern and faster API, hell for the small amount of Intel ARC GPU users youll see performance differences in the thousands of %, thats not an exaggeration, those GPUs have such bad openGL support that going from sodium to Vulkan could mean the difference of 60fps and 600fps
For us AMD gpu users the difference isnt that significant, but still significant, AMDs openGL support is pretty bad as well, not nearly non existent like Intel ARC, but pretty bad, Vulkan is much faster for us
The only company that actually has good openGL support is Nvidia, they happen to be the most popular GPU maker, but the nearly 20% of us not using Nvidia will lean towards Vulkan
PC is too good to show the real difference. This is my main issue with videos that show FPS mods. 16 render distance and 800fps is insane in my books
It might be worth it to test on Linux. Games that use the Vulkan renderer tend to perform better on Linux’s Mesa drivers vs Windows’s drivers.
imma test it on my chromebook. I don't have high hopes. Sodium made the game just freeze.
@@vibaj16 A chromebook probably wouldn’t be good to test. ChromeOS is based on Gentoo Linux at its core, but it’s so far removed I don’t see the point.
Guys, subscribe to that channel, i wanna see this guy grow up
it very much depends on your gpu, intel igpus are signafacantly better with vulkanmod for example
Bro you have to allocate CPU cores in Vulcan to have faster losing chunks
Test it with Create mod. Put down 50 train bogeys, but don't turn them into a train. Those are the laggiest blocks I can think of.
I used sodium and stuff but ive gone back to optifine since it does enough and i can't be asked to install all that every update
Someone find a way to combine these 2
You could always use ferrite core for less memory usage but I typically alot 8 gigs of ram so it is good enough and btw now vulkan provides an feature so Minecraft is less intensive on cpu and relies more on gpu so you get more fps my pc got 900 fps cause of using cpu + sodium and when I used vulkan+gpu it boosted upto 5000 fps
You might wanna cap FPS at 60 for utilization test
No mods minimal possible settings: 34-51 fps optifine: 57-71 Fps sodium: 89-128 fps vulkan mod: 216-489🤨🧐
My PC components
Amd Ryzen 5 whit readon Graphics
4GB ram
117GB
Speaks nothing to folks running on older hardware (Java latest version, also latest MC build with AMDGPU + Vulkan + Wayland and no mods, all on GCN2 hardware). I remember the good old days of infdev, QQ…
To be fair. Wouldn't performance be better on amd hardware when using VulkanMod? I'm pretty sure VulkanApi favors amd but Idk how been outta the loop for a minute
"lets compare a fully released mod with a mod that has not even reached beta stages" lol
You're laughing at a mod that has room for potential lol
@@oldbonniegamer938 this comment defends vulkanmod. i was refering to how he compares a released mod to an indev mod and complains that the indev mod sucks a bit
@taureon_ Yeah, but minecraft is a single core performance. Unless peeps have a powerful CPU, then performance uplifts with shaders will still be crappy.
Home on, F3 says FPS
it can lower ur fps when using f3 so its usually better to install a fps mod like he did
The thing i care about for my pc is chunk gen speed, on my weak pc my fps is more than fine even with high render distance but exploring new chunks is often nearly impossible especially when using elytra because new chunks generate way too slow, i wonder if this mod does the job on that better than sodium
Simple answer : No
And it was Ruining my Minecraft rendering
there's a way to run vulkan and opengl but i forgot how it was done but it wasn't done with minecraft yet. something about "gfx portability ashes" to have vulkan over opengl as in vulkan api can run with opengl api for compatibility.
what happens if you combine those 2 mods