Hey Josh another great video 👍 I’m wondering something. You seem to buy lots of different cameras and lens and provide us all with great use case reviews but how do you afford to do this ? Does your channel pay for this to happen ? Cheers 👏🏻👏🏻
Thanks! The short is, not yet. If you don't know, my other TH-cam channel is about small scale sustainable agriculture and I have over 200K subscribers. Over the past 3 years or so I have taken money that I have made with that channel and invested in camera gear, computers, lights, etc. I was constantly buying and selling gear before I started this channel, hence one of the motivations to start this channel. I try to buy used gear as much as I can and hunt around for deals. It is tough, but I really enjoy this and think I can provide value to the community from which I have learned so much. The channel is starting to pick up and I hope that it can start paying for some of this stuff soon. I don't mention this in videos, but if you or anyone else would like to support my efforts financially, there is a Paypal donation in every video description. I do really love hearing that these videos are helping people. Thanks for watching!
just waiting it out for the RP2, hopefully with LpE6 battery this time. Canon really is a fascinating company. I've never known a company to hijack their own products.
If you are frustrated imagine those like me that bought a Canon R6... Anyway, the constant overheating problems made me try the Lumix S5 and now it's the one that I use the most. I still keep the R6 but I don't invest in RF lenses anymore. 🤷
Oh I hear you! I definitely wanted to make the point about people’s frustrations with the Canon cameras overheating. I could never get myself to buy a R6 because of that. Even before this update you could run the R5 in line skipped or crop modes to not overheat. Definitely a huge bummer about the R6.
@Ramón Are you primarily a videographer? I have never had the R6 overheat on me, even when shooting outdoors in the summer. But I never shoot video content longer than 10 minutes. Most of the time I shoot stills and bursts for sports.
@@cjm8160 I bought it to record cooking videos. Which now I know it's the worse use case for the R6. Generally I end up recording more than one or two hours of video footage in clips of 15-20 minutes long. All shot in interiors without air-conditioning... The biggest problem is that the camera cannot cool down quickly enough between takes 😕 I never had overheating problems taking photos or with a more casual use like travel
I'm not sure why vloggers care about slight wobble when it comes to their backgrounds. Folks are watching you talk. Infact most folks don't really notice until you point it out. Although the stabe turned on helped.
“Could have done it months ago, years ago.” That is Canon summed up right there. The lack of C1/C2/C3 in video on the R6 is also a huge head scratcher, so congrats on that Canon because you created another new Sony user - me. 😎 Sold my R6 and all my RF glass last week to go into the Sony ecosystem.
Agreed. I moved to the Sony A7S3 several weeks ago. Canon lens don’t work well on Sony cameras but at least you can buy lenses from other manufacturers beside Sony.
@@robs3557 Totally. I’ve bought a few Sigma lenses already, not only are there a ton of options but they are a 1/3 of the cost of GM/RF lenses - and nearly as good. I actually think my Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 is better than the GM 24-70 because I prefer it’s closer minimum focussing distance and colour rendering.
@@mikebanks4796 Hi, Mike, I have been a Canon shooter for almost 8years now and now beginning to consider jumping into the Sony Ecosystem. I am really in love with Canon's colour science and the Canon system is a system I am very used to. Making the decision to switch or not switch has been a very very hard decision for me to make. What has being your experience so far with Sony in relations to colour, codecs, ease of use and other factors in relation to Canon. Should I stay or switch?
@@EasyyokeFilms It is a really big decision and not one that I made quickly myself. Now that I’m switched over, I have zero regrets. Keep in mind though my perspective is coming from my last Canon camera being the R6 and being mostly a video shooter. I really wanted to love that camera but it pushed me over the edge with my annoyance with Canon. Shooting in the Canon ecosystem for over 10+ years had me feeling the same way you’re feeling, so I dipped my toes by renting the a7iv first. It only takes a little bit of playing with the menus/camera to get used to it but yeah, it’s certainly a little different than Canon when you first start using it. I would highly recommend renting a Sony for a weekend and just run it through it’s paces. I had it over the weekend and had the best opportunity to test it by going to a family function and leaving my Canon at home so I was forced to experience the full workflow on the Sony. The a7iv and its menus are actually quite intuitive once you get the hang of it, and with anything, anytime you start/try something new it’s going to be a bit awkward at first. Now that I’m comfortable with it, the customization is amazing. You can truly set it up to be your own personal camera to match your shooting workflow. With the R6, especially with the lack of customization (the no video settings in C1/C2/C3 is super annoying) I was constantly fumbling in the menus, or on the touch screen to change settings and missing shots because of it. The R6 is marketed as a hybrid camera but that’s a lie, it’s a photo first camera that happens to shoot great quality video. The a7iv is truly a hybrid camera and just as easy to shoot/customize for video as it is for photos. That photo/video/S&Q dial is a game changer. As for the colour science, I feel yeah, Canon seems to have that best, but I actually love the colours straight out of my a7iv. In a lot of cases, subjectively, I think it’s better than my R6 was. But if you shoot 10 bit S Log, you can colour grade to pretty much look however you want the footage to. The autofocus on my a7iv is insane, I love how Sony exposes/dynamic range too. Is Sony perfect, no, but I have zero regrets like I mentioned up top. For me, the a7iv is a damn near perfect camera. For me. I bought the Sigma 16-28 f/2.8, Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 and the Sigma 85mm f/1.4 and all 3 lenses were basically the same cost as the RF 15-35 f/2.8 that I had, which is crazy. So just another win for the Sony ecosystem. To be fair, here’s what I miss about my R6: the screen is just better, I do miss how most of the RF lenses are IS, the IBIS + lens IS past 24mm and longer is absolutely insane and almost gimbal like (that wobble wider than 20mm drove me crazy and ruined so many shots) and that’s it. The cropped 4k60 on my a7iv is not a big deal for me personally at all, but for some it is. If I could change one thing about the a7iv, that would be the only thing but I don’t even care so it’s basically a perfect camera for me since I barely use 4k60. Hope this helps!
If the R5 performed this well two years ago, I would definitely choose this over the A7S3. Now I'm heavily invested in Sony and don't bother switching.
I’ve seen a lot of videos saying “the overheating has been eliminated” and I think that’s a dangerous rhetoric. The camera still gets hot, the CFE card still gets hot, this setting simply allows more heat build up and it’s to be seen if this has an impact on the longevity of the camera and the cards. There are several reports who’ve indicated that both the camera and card are noticeably hotter than with the previous firmware, so again I say, Canon didn’t fix or remove the “overheating”, they simply give the user the option to cook their camera longer, lol.
I said in this video that it has basically been eliminated. I also show the R5 overheat in this video. So, it hasn't been eliminated. This firmware does allow videographers to use this camera and record for a lot longer than before without the camera shutting off. Thanks for watching!
@@Josh_Sattin my point was, very few people are indicating that the camera and card are noticeably hotter when using the high setting and I personally think that’s a very important piece that should be mentioned. I’m not speaking to or attacking you directly at all so please don’t take it that way, I’m just saying I wish people would highlight that using this high setting to record longer could have a negative impact on the camera, that’s all.
Well you did comment on my video so I assume you were commenting on what I said. That is a fair assumption. I really doubt that Canon would allow the camera to damage itself. The fact that you can get the camera to overheat indicates to me that there is a limit in the camera where it will shut itself down before damage is done. They also give you the option of running the camera in standard mode if you prefer.
@@Josh_Sattin your video just happened to be the one I commented on, that’s why I clarified to clear that up. 😉 But I disagree about that Canon comment, it’s good business to have a camera die quicker than it otherwise would of based on an action from the user, without that premature death being easily or directly attributable to the company. Look at the Apple lawsuits regarding the batteries and throttled performance, of course they claim they’ve never intentionally manipulated phone performance to push users to upgrade but we’d be naive to believe that to be 100% true. Airlines will and have circumvented doing things that ultimately put planes and lives at risk. Most companies don’t do what’s best for their customers/consumers, they do what’s best for their wallet.
Oh I definitely agree with you that a lot of companies will make decisions mainly on generating maximum profit. Canon is no different with their intentional crippling to force people to buy more expensive cameras. If after this update the camera wouldn't overheat whatsoever then I would have been more suspicious. But, there is a limit in this camera where it does shut itself down.
I’ve been a R5C owner for little bit over a month and one thing for certain about the image quality in video when comparing to the R5 is that there is definitely more quality and range to the R5C. I understand the sensor is the same, but I think the way the software runs the codecs makes the two much different. I have recently also shot with an R5, and the image still seems less “cinematic” and more like a photo camera shooting video. It’s interesting, I think Canon released this R5 firmware update knowing that R5C users are not going to get too upset about it, because there are more things going on behind the scenes to the C version of the R5 in comparison. Love to know anyone else who’s shot on both R5C and R5 recently and still sees a difference.
I agree Jimmy. The R5C definitely has more dynamic range and special sauce in video than the R5. I am hoping to do some testing with the new firmware and see if it's any better. Hopefully someone else has both cameras and can do some comparisons.
I read that a possible reason why the R5C has better dynamic despite being the same sensor as the R5 is because Canon can open up the sensor’s performance more due to the fan dissipating heat much quicker then the passive method of the R5. This makes sense to me if it’s anything like computer Internals. The cooler you can keep your computer, the higher potential to push your CPU/GPU/RAM to its limits. I Believe the R5’s max potential was limited to avoid high temps that could damage the internals.
@@Josh_Sattin I’ll try to see if I can find the channel that spoke about it, but it was mostly theorizing from cinematographers. I was just giving my opinion that it makes sense if this theory is true because it’s basically how ALL electronic components function. The overheating wasn’t fake, which was proven by DIY PERKS. People were measuring the temps on the surface of the camera but that was an incorrect way of doing so because what mattes is the actual temp of the cpu chip (which ran extremely hot). By way of design, the R5 was never going to put out its max potential because it has no method heat dissipation. Some people increased the passive cooling by replacing the thermal pads with copper heat sinks, but because the R5 is weather sealed, there is very little space for heat dissipation to take place. That’s why I was thinking that the theory about limiting the R5’s sensor potential makes sense. By design it was never meant to output high resolution video for an extended period of time. PS : I’m not an expert in cameras or even pc components, but I learned a few things about thermodynamics and heat dissipation from building desktops from scratch. Heat is always the limiting factor for performance.
I was only listening to you for 5 minutes and when I turn to look at the video, I see you holding a microphone like a news anchor. I kinda chuckled. Interesting how a firmware can help overheating. Seems like they could have waited. I do agree with your thoughts.
I stopped making a videos about camera gear a few months back, partly because I was getting a bit fed up talking about things that turn out not to be true a few months later because of a firmware update. As an R5, R6 and C70 owner, the new firmware seams great...especially for the R5. But the one thing I want to test is the recovery time after recording 4K 120 ... and although I've not tried it yet, apparently it does still overheat after about 20 minutes in 4K 120. I also want to test if using the camera more generally for a while reduces the available time in 4K 120, and by how much. I'd consider making this video myself if no-one else is going to do it, but my channel is moving to a more music and sound design focus.... so I'd love it if you made that video instead :) ??
Thank you for the testing! And, great rundown of scenarios! I had been on the fence about getting an R5 and this update (which alters when/if warnings and shut offs occur due to camera heat, not sure it actually alters how the camera heats up?) was one of the things that pushed me off the fence to go ahead and get one. Expecting it any day now. Thank you again!
I've been getting "Err 70" when I first got my R5. I had to return and exchange it for another one. Then it started having it again. I updated the firmware to 1.6.0 also.
I bought the R5c and even with this fix I still would have purchased the R5c over the R5. The cine options are awesome and give you way more flexibility shooting and the R5c also has better dynamic range. The only thing I hate is the battery life on the R5c but a V-mount fixed that.
I would agree. The R5c is through and through a cinema camera with great stills capability while the R5 is through and through a stills camera with great video capability.
I also picked up an R5c.. a part of me regret it because I could have waited just a few more weeks for this firmware, I would have gone with R5.. but after shooting a few gigs with the R5c. I'm starting to love all the functions it provide 🙌
Yeah I just never used the r5 for video except in crop mode….now…well I’m going to try 4k hq for some interviews. I too was really considering picking up Sony a7s iii, but just don’t want to fork out $5k+ to get true photo hybrid like z9, a1, or r3 and when r1 is announced I’m sure it’ll be $7500 or so….jeesh. I enjoy the Panny gh series just wish they had better af.
Canon is a conservative company when it comes to reliability of their products and I'm guessing they chose to do extensive testing of sustained heat on the R5 components over a long period to make sure the camera was not bricked by doing this. Bricked cameras from overheating would seriously damage Canon's reputation. I don't doubt Canon restricts functionality with some camera models for commercial reasons but I doubt the overheating timer was originally installed for market segmentation reasons.
I think that has been historically true, but the R5 in general has been a buggy mess. I own an R5, and very much like it. I have owned the Canon 20D, 5D II, 5D III, and 5D IV. I have never had as many issues with a camera as I have with this one. They're slowly getting them worked out, but for the first year or so I had regular lock-ups, and just odd behavior. In addition to these problems Canon has also had multiple firmware releases that they've had to essentially recall and re-release. That's surprising, and certainly new for Canon in my experience.
@@Josh_Sattin I understand. Same here for most of what I do but when you need it to match c70 it’s got a tad more detail in shadows (along with a bit of noise to clean up) and slightly more reach in the highlights.
Makes sense. It always depends on what you are shooting too. I'll have to play around with it at some point. I've been pretty happy with XF-AVC Long Gop in the C70.
I bought a R5C after selling my R5 due to heat issues and the inability to use wireless remote for video has killed my workflow on the R5C. Makes me miss my R5 immensely. Now I find out they quietly fixed the overheating issues - really pisses me off. Now I’m going to sell R5C to get R5 back and I bet you theylll fix the damn lack of wireless remote for R5C. I can’t catch a break
Another great video. Thanks Josh! I’ve been in so many discussions about this over the last couple of years (I’m sure we all have). Canon has a really strange business model at this point and it’s hard to believe that it hasn’t effected them more with the competitive market these days. (Maybe it has more than we know.) Hopefully the R7 and the new R5 firmware is a sign of things to come with their lines and business model. It’s almost like they’ve tapped danced around so much trying to protect their own product lines that they can’t even keep track of their own stories anymore. They already charge a premium price for their products, why not just narrow the lines and give people what they want? I remember when I first got into photo, I had to wade through allllll of their bodies (that look the same) but had different prices. That makes it really confusing for people trying to get into the market. Only the deep gear heads understand the differences, and even then, we still sit here confused because we have so many options. The funny thing is, it’s not like we have to choose the better option, we have to choose the option that is least crippled for the $$ amount. I’ve been looking for another companion for my c70 for 3 months (besides the R7, that’s just a no brainer and I’m doing that) but I keep changing my mind based on what sucks about certain models, not what’s great about them. Haha
Thanks for the thoughtful comment. I love this: "It’s almost like they’ve tapped danced around so much trying to protect their own product lines that they can’t even keep track of their own stories anymore." I do think that Canon is headed in the right direction and the R7 is a good example of that. We'll see...
@@Josh_Sattin I’m still dying to see your c70/R7 comparison. I’m still waiting for my R7. If you haven’t started yet, I’d also like to see you throw an R6 in the mix. I have an R6 and it looks great when you shoot alone on it, but it has a noticeably different look when you compare it to the c70 with all of the same log profiles gamma etc. (it has almost a yellowish tint). I’m wondering if the R7 will look that way too or if it will have a closer look. I realize they are different sensors and wont be perfect, But I’d love to see a side by side comparison. Thanks
It's on my list of videos. That list keeps getting longer and I have been making them as fast as I can. I don't have a R6 and have never used one but I have heard from other people that the colors are different than the other cameras. I do think the R7 will be a good B cam for the C70. But yeah, I need to make that video.
As a Canon C70 owner, I must say Sony is killing the game. They got you covered no matter what type of creator you are. I would have switched if it wasnt for the long FX6 backorder.
Basically I picked up a practically new R5 for almost half the price because of the known issues, which they've now fixed. So in a way their miss-handling has been great for me. Feel sorry for the previous owner though.
Hey Josh thanks again for the great video. One suggestion, I think an easy way to test DR is to shoot a full room in an indoor setting with a single window on only one side of the room, ideally testing on sunny days. The relatively dark room and the bright sunlight outside in the same room will guarantee to have a dynamic range larger than any camera. By exposing to the middle, you will be definitely able to compare the shadow performance as well as the highlight. Depending on the weather, the difference between the shadow and the highlight could have more than 20 stops of dynamic range. I shoot real estate primarily, our clients usually like to see the interior of a house and the exterior view in the same shot. For photos, we have HDR but for videos, that's always a problem. I think the outdoor scene used in your video probably has less than 11 stops in total and was not that challenging to either of the cameras.
I think canon needed to release the R5 at the time they did- they had to best Sony to the pinch before the A7S3 and A1. I think that because they rushed the release they hadn’t done endurance tests at high heat etc. and perhaps they crippled it until they had done their internal due diligence. That is my excuse for them, but what’s puzzling is why Canon PR hasn’t made a similar excuse. Their silence allows people to negatively speculate Ps. Been binging your videos - thanks man
You're right. We can only speculate. Transparency and honesty go a long way for customer relationships. Glad you have been enjoying the videos. Thanks for watching!
Guys there is also an issue to have into account, what this firmware really does is to allow the camera to overheat more before give the warning and shutdown, we have to wait and see in service centers if the R5 electronics failure orders increase..... That and maybe when overheating occurs weird thing also occurs like more noise in video... That's a possibility and its not even new to canon many examples in the pass. We will have to wait and see
Nice video, Josh. I don't think the R5C has anything to do with the R5 getting the fix, I think they designed for potential overheating only for 8k recording but release date, getting everything they wanted the R5 to have (high MP, size, EVF resolution, etc etc) made Canon release a flawed camera. Pretty sure they worked day and night to squeeze every ounce of efficiency out of the R5 during video recording, and their engineers finally managed to do something acceptable. IMHO, the fix is a bit too late though and I doubt the overheating is truly fixed, dramatically reduced probably but the real "fix" was the release of the R5C... hehe
Hey Josh, Thanks for the information on the update. I have a question. Are you or anyone else having an issue with video freezing since updating to 1.6.0?
they just needed some time (long term tests) to be able to implement the high temp settings, just like Sony did. I imagine its quiet a decision to set the operating temps just based on numbers to do it at that scale Canon has to do it. I'm just mad they left the record limit in, which has no point. Hope they will get rid of it and bring some more features when they release 2.0, hoefully this winter.
The camera does overheat, they simply disabled the monitoring. I suspect within 2 years a lot of cameras are going to need to be repaired because of heat damage. Doubt Canon will will repair cameras at a reasonable cost.
it is also very telling that they did not eliminate the 30 minute record limit. Its frustrating that Canon will now let you cook off the R5 if it gets hot enough but it won't let you record past 30 minutes?
Between those two cameras I would say it's kind of a toss up and more of personal preference. If you need longer than 30 minute run time and/or you are shooting in super low light, then get the A7S3. They are both awesome cameras. I did a A7S3 vs R5C video. That will give you some guidance: th-cam.com/video/pBs9YHf7aQU/w-d-xo.html
Josh thank you so much for these videos they are beyond useful - they help us make informed decisions about gear that we buy with our hard earned! On that note; as you have the FX3 and the R5. Which would you recommend I get? It would be primarily for video but the photo side would be used also. Though I do have a 5D Mark IV. Just keen to know which out of the two cameras creates the better looking video? Thanks!
You are very welcome. I think all of these cameras are great and produce great images. It's kind of just personal preference really. Check out this video that I did comparing the A7S3 and R5C. It'll give you some ideas. th-cam.com/video/pBs9YHf7aQU/w-d-xo.html
Nice video. I can understand the mixed feelings, but call me naive, I'm not as entirely convinced that this was a conspiracy. The 30 minute time limit... well that IS weird at this point. I am REALLY looking forward to your in-depth depth dynamic range test. I bought the R5 back when I knew the R5C was coming within 8 months. I did this because I wanted the smaller form factor and I found a LOT of value in the IBIS. However, the dynamic range is still a really big deal. I'm looking forward to your follow up!
Well this is bs then. If Canon can fix the false overheating via firmware in the R5 why can't they extend the love on the R6? I'm already on the fence between R6 and R7 because I'm looking for a Canon hybrid that is for 70% photo 30% video(4K 24p). I'm more bias on the R6 atm because of better sensor fov and high ISO performance but it's frustrating to see that Canon chose to throw the R6 under the bus with this latest firmware. I'm still on the R6 bus tho 😫
Hey. Not really related to the update, but still an R5 question… With an external monitor (like a Ninja V) connected, will the R5’s back LCD still work? Or does it black out when an HDMI connection is made? I think I’ve changed all of the HDMI settings around and the LCD stays black until I pull the HDMI cable.
DR probably needs a major update. its not the purpose of this update. The R5C has different software and OS for video so it might squeeze more out because of that reason.
I may buy an R5 over an A7SIII because of this. Just like Canon’s colours better. Josh, what are your thoughts on the R5 as a video camera over the A7SIII? A lot of the comparisons are outdated because of the heating issues this camera previously had. I just really don’t like the video coming out of Sony’s… to me, no matter how much colour correction is done, there’s something lifeless about them. I’m just an amateur that’s willing to pay a lot to get something really good. I don’t want to buy crap (ASPC) just to buy something good a 2nd time. Anyways, would appreciate your thoughts!
If I was doing strictly video I would take the A7S3 over the R5, but the R5 is a great camera, just a lot more quirky when it comes to video. The A7S3 also has more dynamic range in Slog3 than the R5 in Clog3. The lens selection in the Sony e mount system is also way better. If you are doing a good amount of photography then get the R5. If you just prefer one camera over the other, then that's totally okay. I find that when I try a new camera system it always takes a little while to get used to the log curves and color science. You can get amazing images out of both cameras. I did a R5C vs A7SIII comparison, which isn't exactly the same as the R5, but close: th-cam.com/video/pBs9YHf7aQU/w-d-xo.html
So Josh, the question is, what do you think ita better to buy? I have the ninja v, so whats the best option r5c or r5 with the ninja v????😱😱😱😱😱 and can u manificate your image wile u are recording video???
I don't think the Ninja V has a much to do with your decision as it did before because the R5 doesn't overheat like it did before. The better question for you to figure out is if the features of the R5 or R5C make more sense for what you need.
Hi there, I have got Canon EOS R5, firmware updated to 1.6. My video system is set to PAL, I come from India. I am planning to record a video with FHD(1920x1080) Unfortunately I do not get option to set my frame rate to 23.98. Also when I try to set to closest available 24, I get a message “these items can not be combined”. Question : How can I set my frame rate to 23.98P in PAL video system? Note : If I change the video system to NTSC, I get an option to set the frame rate to 23.98P. But that will result into light flicker in video.
How can they protect sales of R5c when R5 came before R5c? Basically, they were protecting sales of a camera that was not in existence. That doesn't make sense to me, but I share your frustration. I'm glad I did not upgrade to R5C because I would be pissed.
They waited to release this firmware until the bulk of the R5C sales have happened. If they released this firmware before the R5C release, less people would have bought the R5C.
Great video! Would you recommend having the Digital Movie IS on on my R6 and R7 on top of IBIS to eliminate adding stabilization in post/editing or only IBIS and adding stabilization in post if needed?
Great video, I'm thinking about investing into some Canon gear, I currently run a Sony A7iii & FS100 combo but with canon ef glass. I want to make the move into 10 bit video footage and with the price differences between the R7 and Sony A7iv as well as the lenses it just makes sense for me, the adapated canon ef lenses work like a native lens from what I've seen. Even thinking about picking up an R6 now with this new firmware update.
Gotta say that the camera is now fixed, shot a wedding in 8K raw to test it. Didn't overheat once. 4 hours of shooting. The camera did get warm, but thermals seem to be managed way better in the camera. Software seemed to have been holding the camera back. I also have a theory that they did this to kill the image of buying an Atomos if you want to record 8K RAW on the R5 ( Which is done externally )
The 30min limit was originally set due to import taxes on video cameras in EU. However, that law was repealed in 2019, but Canon may still want to keep it in R5 for a while to protect the R5c as you speculated.
I'm excited that Canon released the firmware update to resolve the overheating issue for the R5, I am SUPER bummed they didn't do the same for the R6. Also... a comment on the 30 min record limit (I hope you're listening Canon) I know the reason was because of taxes and tariffs at the time when the camera release, but that is no longer an issue. If Canon wants they should just release an optional firmware update where you pay $ to bypass the recording limit. Something similar to Atomos or Panasonic to unlock more features.
@@rgco I don’t blame you. Sony is also an obvious choice. A74 is a good choice but afraid of not liking the 1.6 crop along with potential overheating issues. A7siii is overpriced for the 12 mp sensor.
I think the background is still twitching. It's just that the crop is smaller, it doesn't seem to be. In fact, there are convulsions. Does this mean that there is a problem with the body image stabilization of the R5/R6?
First of, welldone for the tests. These videos and tests are really not easy to make and I commend you for that. But one thing I wish all youtubers doing this test know is that "What is worth doing is worth doing well". If you really want to do the overheat test... Do the test with all recording modes. Get a dummy battery and connect to external source of power. And stop making conclusions on half based fact of "I stopped when the battery died". Some people shoot events for long hours and they come with 10, 15batteries... This kind of video will not help them neither does it answer the questions of whether the camera is now reliable to shoot long events. But all the same, welldone
Thanks for doing this video! This firmware update does entice me towards getting the R5 since I’m really a hybrid shooter. Yeah man that battery drain on the R5C goes really really quickly
I rather just use the r5c with a vmount on the back. it lasts longer and is more balanced ergonomically. I just cant stand using mirrorless hybrid for video. I had to rig the hell outta my r5c for me to use it because the c70 is my main choice for video based on handling alone.
This was an emotional update for me. I almost cried!!! It looks like the dynamic range is better. I pray is did becuase thats number 2 on my list of r5 issues.
I hear you! Years of frustration. I am hoping for better dynamic range too. I'll be testing it, but I have a lot of videos to make right now. Thanks for watching!
Hey, Josh! I saw your viral video titled (Canon R7 - Low Light Performance (With R5C Comparison) which has (30K) views. I liked this video a lot, after that I watched a lot of your videos and I think your video is addictive. But today while I was browsing your TH-cam channel a couple of exciting ideas came to mind which can help you to go viral and that I wanna discuss with you:💙
Used a Sony A7SIII yesterday for the first time ever. Shooting inside it overheated 20min in. I was really surprised. Thank God I had my C70:) Great video Josh. Excited for this update, But I was one of the few that never really ran into this issue. I'd be surprised if the dynamic range is better, but it would be sick!
Sony A7sIII overheated in 20minutes?? What codec was that? Phillip Bloom made an heat test last year or thereabout and only the 4K 120p overheated. What frame rate and resolution did you use that overheated in 20minutes please?
Surely the R5 still overheats. It just doesn’t shut down when it overheats. The camera and card are now allowed to get very hot, potentially damaging both. I Wouk’s think the firmware update hasn’t made the camera run cooler. It just permits you to let the camera get really hot!
I showed the camera actually overheating in this video in an extreme heat situation. So, there is a limit to this camera where it knows to shut itself down. Canon just changed the limit with this firmware update. I am not an engineer and I do not work for Canon, but I highly doubt that Canon would let their camera damage itself.
@@Josh_Sattin This is something I'm a bit worried about myself, but can also see as the reasons for the delay on the firmware update. Perhaps some large scale testing was done for any damage (immediate and long term) on cameras that were overheating and once Canon realized there wouldn't be any class action lawsuits from cameras melting down, they released the update?
Nah. Wouldn't a camera company want to give their customers the best possible product so they like it and recommend it to others? They have known the heat limitations of this camera a long time ago. These cameras take a long time to research and develop and that would have been taken care of before the initial release 2 years ago. Also, why would they still have a 30 minute time limit if this wasn't a false restriction?
@@Josh_Sattin Admittedly I don't know much about these types of things. I remember hearing that the 30 minute time limit determines whether or not it's considered a photo camera or a video camera in Europe, which results in a different tax percentage being applied to it based on the MSRP.
@@waynedennyphoto This was based on a tax law that any camera that recorded over 30 minutes was considered a video camera and taxed higher. This tax law was removed in 2018 or 2019. No reason for this limit in the R5.
A new dynamic range test is needed between the updated R5 and the R5c. Hopefully canon secretly improved it in the 1.6 update. Or does the xf-avc codec the R5c has the extra 1.5 stops.
No, the dynamic range on the R5C is just as good in H.265 (according to Gerald Undone even -slightly- better). I'm also curious about a new dynamic range test between the R5 and R5C
@@filmkitnet my neighbor has an R5. All we have to do is test the 2 R5s with his old firmware against my new firmware and see if the DR has improved or if it’s still the same. 🤔
@@filmkitnet I was out there today for 3 hours in 92 degrees with my R5. Screen open , screen close, and left the camera on as much as possible on purpose. Use a gimbal and hand held. 4k60 clog3 with the 24 1.4 and 50 1.2. Ran it until the battery died. Recorded 27 minutes of actual footage of womens kickball. I almost passed out but but but…. NO OVERHEATING AT ALL. Not even a warning. I even started shooting photos at 20 fps just because I was tired of shooting video. In photo mode it did have the RED warning 0:00 for time remaining. But when I switch back to video it said 29:59. THANK YOU JESUS!! It’s a miracle. The R5 is officially the best hybrid camera ever made. Side note: the tracking in photo mode at 20fps was insane.
A Canon rep told me that the Canon "cripple hammer" is a "stupid" thing that is just not real. He said that Canon does not believe in limiting camera features to protect higher models and they always put as much as they can into every camera they make. He says that the "cripple hammer" is just a conspiracy therory from customers that want more from a camera then it can actually do. If the R5 has a 30min video limit, it must be caused by a hardware limitation that only Canon engineers understand and something customers cant see. Canon doesnt belive in crippling their cameras.
The 30 min limit is to pay lower tax as the camera is not called a video camera in the EU without the ability to record more than 29.59 minutes. The heat limit timers are software only and it was proven with removal/reset of the internal battery about a year ago - check out Tony Northrup video on it about a year ago. What they saw is the camera overheats in a certain amount of time, you pop the internal battery and the camera will be able to record for that period of time again without increasing in heat substantially internally or externally and then it stops again at the pre defined time limit and shows you the overheat warning. It’s fake overheating and now that’s finally been removed in firmware 1.6. But I still believe there is a thermal limit to what the camera can do, but it’s nowhere close to the limitations we’ve faced for the last 2 years.
@@MichaelDrowley - Yes, the dreaded Euro tax. That evil tax that blocked Canon from giving us unlimited recording times. I know Canon was dying to give us un-crippled recording times...they really, REALLY wanted to but sadly, their hands were completely tied. Meanwhile, Panasonic EASILY got around that law and sold us GH series cameras with zero trouble in Europe. Also,..it would have been completely unfair to sell cameras in the US and other places that were NOT time crippled...even though the rest of the world had no tax to blame. Again, there was just nothing Canon could really do,....no matter how badly they wanted us to have it. Today?...well the Euro law is gone but who knows?... that pesky law could return someday. Canon just want's to be on the safe side in case that nasty law returns someday. The Canon R5 will be pre-compliant and pre-crippled for Europe. Very prudent and forward-thinking on Canon's part. This is why I love Canon.
In regards to the 30min time limit, has there been any instance of a camera that launched with a 30min time limit and then subsequently removed that restriction? I wonder if it has to deal with certifications and essentially re-certifying this camera on the legal end. Yes, the tariff for cameras that record above 30min has been long abolished and it's the reason why we see new Canon cameras (R3, R7, etc) shipping without the 30min record limit but I think the R5 is a special case because it's already been certified as a photo camera and Canon doesn't want to spend the legal money/time or if it's even allowed by regulating bodies to re-certify a camera.
@@Josh_Sattin oh that's right. There's surprisingly little information on the web but it looks like ~ July 2019 that tariff was removed. Do we know when manufacturers submit their products for certification? A year prior to launch? Maybe 6 months? I don't know. Otherwise, I agree, there's no reason why Canon can't remove the recording limit then.
Appreciate the work you did with this, but WISH you did ALL-I instead of IPB… I get IPB is just as good with a subject that isn’t moving etc, but ALL-I is what I would think is most important here. Was hoping to eliminate testing it myself, but looks like I will still have to in ALL-I modes. Thanks again truly and also, might want to try out either Sony Tough or Angelbird CF Express cards. I’ve noticed quite the difference with times compared to other cards. I get more out of those two.
@@Josh_Sattin just lacking 4K60. Just thinking that 4K60 is probably one of the most used frame rates outside of 4K24 HQ. Not trying to annoy you because your channel is one that I resort to, but a lot of people are probably interested in the 4K60 ALL-I. Again, thanks a lot for the work involved in these tests. Takes a lot of time to do.
You're welcome. I am pretty confident with my tests that basically the overheating on this camera is really not going to be an issue anymore. Also, I did mention that I don't currently have a CFExpress card so I cant even test 4K60 ALL-I.
Hey Josh another great video 👍 I’m wondering something. You seem to buy lots of different cameras and lens and provide us all with great use case reviews but how do you afford to do this ? Does your channel pay for this to happen ? Cheers 👏🏻👏🏻
Thanks! The short is, not yet. If you don't know, my other TH-cam channel is about small scale sustainable agriculture and I have over 200K subscribers. Over the past 3 years or so I have taken money that I have made with that channel and invested in camera gear, computers, lights, etc. I was constantly buying and selling gear before I started this channel, hence one of the motivations to start this channel. I try to buy used gear as much as I can and hunt around for deals. It is tough, but I really enjoy this and think I can provide value to the community from which I have learned so much. The channel is starting to pick up and I hope that it can start paying for some of this stuff soon. I don't mention this in videos, but if you or anyone else would like to support my efforts financially, there is a Paypal donation in every video description. I do really love hearing that these videos are helping people. Thanks for watching!
just waiting it out for the RP2, hopefully with LpE6 battery this time. Canon really is a fascinating company. I've never known a company to hijack their own products.
I'm r6 user really frustrated for overheating , unrealiable camara and not true value of money .
Sold my Canon stuff after 15 years of using them for the FX3/A7IV
I don’t blame you man! I did that before too and now I have both.
If you are frustrated imagine those like me that bought a Canon R6... Anyway, the constant overheating problems made me try the Lumix S5 and now it's the one that I use the most. I still keep the R6 but I don't invest in RF lenses anymore. 🤷
Oh I hear you! I definitely wanted to make the point about people’s frustrations with the Canon cameras overheating. I could never get myself to buy a R6 because of that. Even before this update you could run the R5 in line skipped or crop modes to not overheat. Definitely a huge bummer about the R6.
I hear you man, it really sucks. The update for the r6 is coming.
@Ramón Are you primarily a videographer? I have never had the R6 overheat on me, even when shooting outdoors in the summer. But I never shoot video content longer than 10 minutes. Most of the time I shoot stills and bursts for sports.
@@cjm8160 I bought it to record cooking videos. Which now I know it's the worse use case for the R6. Generally I end up recording more than one or two hours of video footage in clips of 15-20 minutes long. All shot in interiors without air-conditioning... The biggest problem is that the camera cannot cool down quickly enough between takes 😕
I never had overheating problems taking photos or with a more casual use like travel
Heard worst stories and frustration with Panasonic from other TH-camrs. Sony also overheats. So not ever camera is perfect.
I'm not sure why vloggers care about slight wobble when it comes to their backgrounds. Folks are watching you talk. Infact most folks don't really notice until you point it out. Although the stabe turned on helped.
“Could have done it months ago, years ago.” That is Canon summed up right there.
The lack of C1/C2/C3 in video on the R6 is also a huge head scratcher, so congrats on that Canon because you created another new Sony user - me. 😎 Sold my R6 and all my RF glass last week to go into the Sony ecosystem.
Agreed. I moved to the Sony A7S3 several weeks ago. Canon lens don’t work well on Sony cameras but at least you can buy lenses from other manufacturers beside Sony.
@@robs3557 Totally. I’ve bought a few Sigma lenses already, not only are there a ton of options but they are a 1/3 of the cost of GM/RF lenses - and nearly as good. I actually think my Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 is better than the GM 24-70 because I prefer it’s closer minimum focussing distance and colour rendering.
@@mikebanks4796 Hi, Mike, I have been a Canon shooter for almost 8years now and now beginning to consider jumping into the Sony Ecosystem. I am really in love with Canon's colour science and the Canon system is a system I am very used to. Making the decision to switch or not switch has been a very very hard decision for me to make. What has being your experience so far with Sony in relations to colour, codecs, ease of use and other factors in relation to Canon. Should I stay or switch?
@@robs3557 How has your transition to sony being? Being contemplating on switching too
@@EasyyokeFilms It is a really big decision and not one that I made quickly myself. Now that I’m switched over, I have zero regrets. Keep in mind though my perspective is coming from my last Canon camera being the R6 and being mostly a video shooter. I really wanted to love that camera but it pushed me over the edge with my annoyance with Canon.
Shooting in the Canon ecosystem for over 10+ years had me feeling the same way you’re feeling, so I dipped my toes by renting the a7iv first. It only takes a little bit of playing with the menus/camera to get used to it but yeah, it’s certainly a little different than Canon when you first start using it. I would highly recommend renting a Sony for a weekend and just run it through it’s paces. I had it over the weekend and had the best opportunity to test it by going to a family function and leaving my Canon at home so I was forced to experience the full workflow on the Sony.
The a7iv and its menus are actually quite intuitive once you get the hang of it, and with anything, anytime you start/try something new it’s going to be a bit awkward at first. Now that I’m comfortable with it, the customization is amazing. You can truly set it up to be your own personal camera to match your shooting workflow.
With the R6, especially with the lack of customization (the no video settings in C1/C2/C3 is super annoying) I was constantly fumbling in the menus, or on the touch screen to change settings and missing shots because of it. The R6 is marketed as a hybrid camera but that’s a lie, it’s a photo first camera that happens to shoot great quality video.
The a7iv is truly a hybrid camera and just as easy to shoot/customize for video as it is for photos. That photo/video/S&Q dial is a game changer. As for the colour science, I feel yeah, Canon seems to have that best, but I actually love the colours straight out of my a7iv. In a lot of cases, subjectively, I think it’s better than my R6 was. But if you shoot 10 bit S Log, you can colour grade to pretty much look however you want the footage to. The autofocus on my a7iv is insane, I love how Sony exposes/dynamic range too.
Is Sony perfect, no, but I have zero regrets like I mentioned up top. For me, the a7iv is a damn near perfect camera. For me. I bought the Sigma 16-28 f/2.8, Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 and the Sigma 85mm f/1.4 and all 3 lenses were basically the same cost as the RF 15-35 f/2.8 that I had, which is crazy. So just another win for the Sony ecosystem.
To be fair, here’s what I miss about my R6: the screen is just better, I do miss how most of the RF lenses are IS, the IBIS + lens IS past 24mm and longer is absolutely insane and almost gimbal like (that wobble wider than 20mm drove me crazy and ruined so many shots) and that’s it.
The cropped 4k60 on my a7iv is not a big deal for me personally at all, but for some it is. If I could change one thing about the a7iv, that would be the only thing but I don’t even care so it’s basically a perfect camera for me since I barely use 4k60.
Hope this helps!
If the R5 performed this well two years ago, I would definitely choose this over the A7S3. Now I'm heavily invested in Sony and don't bother switching.
Totally understandable. The A7S3 is also an amazing camera. Thanks for watching!
Very impressive that they fixed this
Great video! Let me add one more to the frustration list...One Button White Balance in Video
100% ! Yes, that is needed too.
I’ve seen a lot of videos saying “the overheating has been eliminated” and I think that’s a dangerous rhetoric. The camera still gets hot, the CFE card still gets hot, this setting simply allows more heat build up and it’s to be seen if this has an impact on the longevity of the camera and the cards. There are several reports who’ve indicated that both the camera and card are noticeably hotter than with the previous firmware, so again I say, Canon didn’t fix or remove the “overheating”, they simply give the user the option to cook their camera longer, lol.
I said in this video that it has basically been eliminated. I also show the R5 overheat in this video. So, it hasn't been eliminated. This firmware does allow videographers to use this camera and record for a lot longer than before without the camera shutting off. Thanks for watching!
@@Josh_Sattin my point was, very few people are indicating that the camera and card are noticeably hotter when using the high setting and I personally think that’s a very important piece that should be mentioned. I’m not speaking to or attacking you directly at all so please don’t take it that way, I’m just saying I wish people would highlight that using this high setting to record longer could have a negative impact on the camera, that’s all.
Well you did comment on my video so I assume you were commenting on what I said. That is a fair assumption. I really doubt that Canon would allow the camera to damage itself. The fact that you can get the camera to overheat indicates to me that there is a limit in the camera where it will shut itself down before damage is done. They also give you the option of running the camera in standard mode if you prefer.
@@Josh_Sattin your video just happened to be the one I commented on, that’s why I clarified to clear that up. 😉 But I disagree about that Canon comment, it’s good business to have a camera die quicker than it otherwise would of based on an action from the user, without that premature death being easily or directly attributable to the company. Look at the Apple lawsuits regarding the batteries and throttled performance, of course they claim they’ve never intentionally manipulated phone performance to push users to upgrade but we’d be naive to believe that to be 100% true. Airlines will and have circumvented doing things that ultimately put planes and lives at risk. Most companies don’t do what’s best for their customers/consumers, they do what’s best for their wallet.
Oh I definitely agree with you that a lot of companies will make decisions mainly on generating maximum profit. Canon is no different with their intentional crippling to force people to buy more expensive cameras. If after this update the camera wouldn't overheat whatsoever then I would have been more suspicious. But, there is a limit in this camera where it does shut itself down.
Considering its a stills camera its still pretty impressive
I’ve been a R5C owner for little bit over a month and one thing for certain about the image quality in video when comparing to the R5 is that there is definitely more quality and range to the R5C. I understand the sensor is the same, but I think the way the software runs the codecs makes the two much different. I have recently also shot with an R5, and the image still seems less “cinematic” and more like a photo camera shooting video. It’s interesting, I think Canon released this R5 firmware update knowing that R5C users are not going to get too upset about it, because there are more things going on behind the scenes to the C version of the R5 in comparison. Love to know anyone else who’s shot on both R5C and R5 recently and still sees a difference.
I agree Jimmy. The R5C definitely has more dynamic range and special sauce in video than the R5. I am hoping to do some testing with the new firmware and see if it's any better. Hopefully someone else has both cameras and can do some comparisons.
Just like how the 1DC looked way more filmic than the 1DX II etc.
@@TJ-po9ol but was it merely a feeling or it was actually more filmic? That I’m interested to know 😄
I read that a possible reason why the R5C has better dynamic despite being the same sensor as the R5 is because Canon can open up the sensor’s performance more due to the fan dissipating heat much quicker then the passive method of the R5. This makes sense to me if it’s anything like computer Internals. The cooler you can keep your computer, the higher potential to push your CPU/GPU/RAM to its limits. I Believe the R5’s max potential was limited to avoid high temps that could damage the internals.
Could you please provide a link to this? Was there any testing done or just theorizing?
@@Josh_Sattin I’ll try to see if I can find the channel that spoke about it, but it was mostly theorizing from cinematographers. I was just giving my opinion that it makes sense if this theory is true because it’s basically how ALL electronic components function. The overheating wasn’t fake, which was proven by DIY PERKS. People were measuring the temps on the surface of the camera but that was an incorrect way of doing so because what mattes is the actual temp of the cpu chip (which ran extremely hot). By way of design, the R5 was never going to put out its max potential because it has no method heat dissipation. Some people increased the passive cooling by replacing the thermal pads with copper heat sinks, but because the R5 is weather sealed, there is very little space for heat dissipation to take place. That’s why I was thinking that the theory about limiting the R5’s sensor potential makes sense. By design it was never meant to output high resolution video for an extended period of time.
PS : I’m not an expert in cameras or even pc components, but I learned a few things about thermodynamics and heat dissipation from building desktops from scratch. Heat is always the limiting factor for performance.
I was only listening to you for 5 minutes and when I turn to look at the video, I see you holding a microphone like a news anchor. I kinda chuckled. Interesting how a firmware can help overheating. Seems like they could have waited. I do agree with your thoughts.
Yeah, it's fun to change things up for different videos. I haven't used that in a while. Thanks for watching!
Totally empathise with you as a long term canon user. It’s enough to make me leave canon because they don’t respect their customers.
Thanks Josh, always appreciate your analysis!
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
I’ve never had an issue overheating from the get go on my r5 or r6. So this just makes the r5 even better
I stopped making a videos about camera gear a few months back, partly because I was getting a bit fed up talking about things that turn out not to be true a few months later because of a firmware update.
As an R5, R6 and C70 owner, the new firmware seams great...especially for the R5. But the one thing I want to test is the recovery time after recording 4K 120 ... and although I've not tried it yet, apparently it does still overheat after about 20 minutes in 4K 120.
I also want to test if using the camera more generally for a while reduces the available time in 4K 120, and by how much.
I'd consider making this video myself if no-one else is going to do it, but my channel is moving to a more music and sound design focus.... so I'd love it if you made that video instead :) ??
Incredibly insightful video, thank you for making this!
You are very welcome. Thanks for watching!
Thank you for the testing! And, great rundown of scenarios! I had been on the fence about getting an R5 and this update (which alters when/if warnings and shut offs occur due to camera heat, not sure it actually alters how the camera heats up?) was one of the things that pushed me off the fence to go ahead and get one. Expecting it any day now. Thank you again!
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
I've been getting "Err 70" when I first got my R5. I had to return and exchange it for another one. Then it started having it again. I updated the firmware to 1.6.0 also.
I bought the R5c and even with this fix I still would have purchased the R5c over the R5. The cine options are awesome and give you way more flexibility shooting and the R5c also has better dynamic range. The only thing I hate is the battery life on the R5c but a V-mount fixed that.
I would agree. The R5c is through and through a cinema camera with great stills capability while the R5 is through and through a stills camera with great video capability.
I also picked up an R5c.. a part of me regret it because I could have waited just a few more weeks for this firmware, I would have gone with R5.. but after shooting a few gigs with the R5c. I'm starting to love all the functions it provide 🙌
Yeah I just never used the r5 for video except in crop mode….now…well I’m going to try 4k hq for some interviews. I too was really considering picking up Sony a7s iii, but just don’t want to fork out $5k+ to get true photo hybrid like z9, a1, or r3 and when r1 is announced I’m sure it’ll be $7500 or so….jeesh. I enjoy the Panny gh series just wish they had better af.
Canon is a conservative company when it comes to reliability of their products and I'm guessing they chose to do extensive testing of sustained heat on the R5 components over a long period to make sure the camera was not bricked by doing this. Bricked cameras from overheating would seriously damage Canon's reputation. I don't doubt Canon restricts functionality with some camera models for commercial reasons but I doubt the overheating timer was originally installed for market segmentation reasons.
I think that has been historically true, but the R5 in general has been a buggy mess. I own an R5, and very much like it. I have owned the Canon 20D, 5D II, 5D III, and 5D IV. I have never had as many issues with a camera as I have with this one. They're slowly getting them worked out, but for the first year or so I had regular lock-ups, and just odd behavior. In addition to these problems Canon has also had multiple firmware releases that they've had to essentially recall and re-release. That's surprising, and certainly new for Canon in my experience.
Great video Josh. Agree with you 100%! Just shoot 8K RAW light and render in Log2 in resolve.
Thanks Michael! I can’t get myself to shoot in 8K raw for the stuff that I do. The files are so big!
@@Josh_Sattin I understand. Same here for most of what I do but when you need it to match c70 it’s got a tad more detail in shadows (along with a bit of noise to clean up) and slightly more reach in the highlights.
Makes sense. It always depends on what you are shooting too. I'll have to play around with it at some point. I've been pretty happy with XF-AVC Long Gop in the C70.
The R6 did not get the fixes about overheating. 😩 To say the Canon is a frustrating company would be an understatement.
I hear you!
I bought a R5C after selling my R5 due to heat issues and the inability to use wireless remote for video has killed my workflow on the R5C. Makes me miss my R5 immensely. Now I find out they quietly fixed the overheating issues - really pisses me off. Now I’m going to sell R5C to get R5 back and I bet you theylll fix the damn lack of wireless remote for R5C. I can’t catch a break
Another great video. Thanks Josh! I’ve been in so many discussions about this over the last couple of years (I’m sure we all have). Canon has a really strange business model at this point and it’s hard to believe that it hasn’t effected them more with the competitive market these days. (Maybe it has more than we know.) Hopefully the R7 and the new R5 firmware is a sign of things to come with their lines and business model. It’s almost like they’ve tapped danced around so much trying to protect their own product lines that they can’t even keep track of their own stories anymore. They already charge a premium price for their products, why not just narrow the lines and give people what they want? I remember when I first got into photo, I had to wade through allllll of their bodies (that look the same) but had different prices. That makes it really confusing for people trying to get into the market. Only the deep gear heads understand the differences, and even then, we still sit here confused because we have so many options. The funny thing is, it’s not like we have to choose the better option, we have to choose the option that is least crippled for the $$ amount. I’ve been looking for another companion for my c70 for 3 months (besides the R7, that’s just a no brainer and I’m doing that) but I keep changing my mind based on what sucks about certain models, not what’s great about them. Haha
Thanks for the thoughtful comment. I love this: "It’s almost like they’ve tapped danced around so much trying to protect their own product lines that they can’t even keep track of their own stories anymore." I do think that Canon is headed in the right direction and the R7 is a good example of that. We'll see...
@@Josh_Sattin I’m still dying to see your c70/R7 comparison. I’m still waiting for my R7. If you haven’t started yet, I’d also like to see you throw an R6 in the mix. I have an R6 and it looks great when you shoot alone on it, but it has a noticeably different look when you compare it to the c70 with all of the same log profiles gamma etc. (it has almost a yellowish tint). I’m wondering if the R7 will look that way too or if it will have a closer look. I realize they are different sensors and wont be perfect, But I’d love to see a side by side comparison. Thanks
It's on my list of videos. That list keeps getting longer and I have been making them as fast as I can. I don't have a R6 and have never used one but I have heard from other people that the colors are different than the other cameras. I do think the R7 will be a good B cam for the C70. But yeah, I need to make that video.
As a Canon C70 owner, I must say Sony is killing the game. They got you covered no matter what type of creator you are. I would have switched if it wasnt for the long FX6 backorder.
Basically I picked up a practically new R5 for almost half the price because of the known issues, which they've now fixed. So in a way their miss-handling has been great for me. Feel sorry for the previous owner though.
Nice! Yeah I think it's a good time to pick up a used R5.
Hey Josh thanks again for the great video. One suggestion, I think an easy way to test DR is to shoot a full room in an indoor setting with a single window on only one side of the room, ideally testing on sunny days. The relatively dark room and the bright sunlight outside in the same room will guarantee to have a dynamic range larger than any camera. By exposing to the middle, you will be definitely able to compare the shadow performance as well as the highlight. Depending on the weather, the difference between the shadow and the highlight could have more than 20 stops of dynamic range. I shoot real estate primarily, our clients usually like to see the interior of a house and the exterior view in the same shot. For photos, we have HDR but for videos, that's always a problem. I think the outdoor scene used in your video probably has less than 11 stops in total and was not that challenging to either of the cameras.
I think canon needed to release the R5 at the time they did- they had to best Sony to the pinch before the A7S3 and A1. I think that because they rushed the release they hadn’t done endurance tests at high heat etc. and perhaps they crippled it until they had done their internal due diligence.
That is my excuse for them, but what’s puzzling is why Canon PR hasn’t made a similar excuse. Their silence allows people to negatively speculate
Ps. Been binging your videos - thanks man
You're right. We can only speculate. Transparency and honesty go a long way for customer relationships. Glad you have been enjoying the videos. Thanks for watching!
Guys there is also an issue to have into account, what this firmware really does is to allow the camera to overheat more before give the warning and shutdown, we have to wait and see in service centers if the R5 electronics failure orders increase..... That and maybe when overheating occurs weird thing also occurs like more noise in video...
That's a possibility and its not even new to canon many examples in the pass. We will have to wait and see
Nice video, Josh. I don't think the R5C has anything to do with the R5 getting the fix, I think they designed for potential overheating only for 8k recording but release date, getting everything they wanted the R5 to have (high MP, size, EVF resolution, etc etc) made Canon release a flawed camera. Pretty sure they worked day and night to squeeze every ounce of efficiency out of the R5 during video recording, and their engineers finally managed to do something acceptable. IMHO, the fix is a bit too late though and I doubt the overheating is truly fixed, dramatically reduced probably but the real "fix" was the release of the R5C... hehe
Hey Josh, Thanks for the information on the update. I have a question. Are you or anyone else having an issue with video freezing since updating to 1.6.0?
they just needed some time (long term tests) to be able to implement the high temp settings, just like Sony did. I imagine its quiet a decision to set the operating temps just based on numbers to do it at that scale Canon has to do it. I'm just mad they left the record limit in, which has no point. Hope they will get rid of it and bring some more features when they release 2.0, hoefully this winter.
I like Canon's Ibis and colors better but their cheap 1.8 primes have the slowest autofocus ever. I chose to go with the A7iv instead.
Maybe Nikon will release something like Z8 soon, so Canon took preventive step.
I was thinking the same yesterday 😂
The camera does overheat, they simply disabled the monitoring. I suspect within 2 years a lot of cameras are going to need to be repaired because of heat damage. Doubt Canon will will repair cameras at a reasonable cost.
In this video I show the camera shutting down from overheating. The monitoring has not been disabled.
it is also very telling that they did not eliminate the 30 minute record limit. Its frustrating that Canon will now let you cook off the R5 if it gets hot enough but it won't let you record past 30 minutes?
Agreed. Protecting other cameras is the only logical explanation to me.
Would you recommend the sony a7s3 over the canon r5 I shoot vlog/documentary
Between those two cameras I would say it's kind of a toss up and more of personal preference. If you need longer than 30 minute run time and/or you are shooting in super low light, then get the A7S3. They are both awesome cameras. I did a A7S3 vs R5C video. That will give you some guidance: th-cam.com/video/pBs9YHf7aQU/w-d-xo.html
Josh thank you so much for these videos they are beyond useful - they help us make informed decisions about gear that we buy with our hard earned! On that note; as you have the FX3 and the R5. Which would you recommend I get? It would be primarily for video but the photo side would be used also. Though I do have a 5D Mark IV. Just keen to know which out of the two cameras creates the better looking video? Thanks!
You are very welcome. I think all of these cameras are great and produce great images. It's kind of just personal preference really. Check out this video that I did comparing the A7S3 and R5C. It'll give you some ideas.
th-cam.com/video/pBs9YHf7aQU/w-d-xo.html
@@Josh_Sattin awesome will do thank you!!
Nice video. I can understand the mixed feelings, but call me naive, I'm not as entirely convinced that this was a conspiracy. The 30 minute time limit... well that IS weird at this point. I am REALLY looking forward to your in-depth depth dynamic range test. I bought the R5 back when I knew the R5C was coming within 8 months. I did this because I wanted the smaller form factor and I found a LOT of value in the IBIS. However, the dynamic range is still a really big deal. I'm looking forward to your follow up!
My autofocus got messed up when recording since I got the update. it keeps focusing in and out even though the square is focused on the eye.
Well this is bs then. If Canon can fix the false overheating via firmware in the R5 why can't they extend the love on the R6? I'm already on the fence between R6 and R7 because I'm looking for a Canon hybrid that is for 70% photo 30% video(4K 24p). I'm more bias on the R6 atm because of better sensor fov and high ISO performance but it's frustrating to see that Canon chose to throw the R6 under the bus with this latest firmware. I'm still on the R6 bus tho 😫
Hey. Not really related to the update, but still an R5 question… With an external monitor (like a Ninja V) connected, will the R5’s back LCD still work? Or does it black out when an HDMI connection is made? I think I’ve changed all of the HDMI settings around and the LCD stays black until I pull the HDMI cable.
DR probably needs a major update. its not the purpose of this update. The R5C has different software and OS for video so it might squeeze more out because of that reason.
Great stuff man…. Would really like to see the dynamic range comparison with the R5C
Thanks! Me too. Unfortunately I don't have a R5C anymore. Hopefully someone will do that comparison.
I may buy an R5 over an A7SIII because of this. Just like Canon’s colours better. Josh, what are your thoughts on the R5 as a video camera over the A7SIII? A lot of the comparisons are outdated because of the heating issues this camera previously had.
I just really don’t like the video coming out of Sony’s… to me, no matter how much colour correction is done, there’s something lifeless about them.
I’m just an amateur that’s willing to pay a lot to get something really good. I don’t want to buy crap (ASPC) just to buy something good a 2nd time.
Anyways, would appreciate your thoughts!
If I was doing strictly video I would take the A7S3 over the R5, but the R5 is a great camera, just a lot more quirky when it comes to video. The A7S3 also has more dynamic range in Slog3 than the R5 in Clog3. The lens selection in the Sony e mount system is also way better. If you are doing a good amount of photography then get the R5. If you just prefer one camera over the other, then that's totally okay. I find that when I try a new camera system it always takes a little while to get used to the log curves and color science. You can get amazing images out of both cameras. I did a R5C vs A7SIII comparison, which isn't exactly the same as the R5, but close: th-cam.com/video/pBs9YHf7aQU/w-d-xo.html
Is Fix the Wobble
And the R6 is still overheating 😓😭
Yeah, it's a bummer. I feel you.
So Josh, the question is, what do you think ita better to buy? I have the ninja v, so whats the best option r5c or r5 with the ninja v????😱😱😱😱😱 and can u manificate your image wile u are recording video???
I don't think the Ninja V has a much to do with your decision as it did before because the R5 doesn't overheat like it did before. The better question for you to figure out is if the features of the R5 or R5C make more sense for what you need.
Hi there,
I have got Canon EOS R5, firmware updated to 1.6. My video system is set to PAL, I come from India. I am planning to record a video with FHD(1920x1080)
Unfortunately I do not get option to set my frame rate to 23.98. Also when I try to set to closest available 24, I get a message “these items can not be combined”.
Question : How can I set my frame rate to 23.98P in PAL video system?
Note : If I change the video system to NTSC, I get an option to set the frame rate to 23.98P. But that will result into light flicker in video.
You can only shoot 23.98 in NTSC. You can't shoot 23.98 in PAL.
How can they protect sales of R5c when R5 came before R5c? Basically, they were protecting sales of a camera that was not in existence. That doesn't make sense to me, but I share your frustration. I'm glad I did not upgrade to R5C because I would be pissed.
They waited to release this firmware until the bulk of the R5C sales have happened. If they released this firmware before the R5C release, less people would have bought the R5C.
It looks like the R5 auto focus is faster
Great video! Would you recommend having the Digital Movie IS on on my R6 and R7 on top of IBIS to eliminate adding stabilization in post/editing or only IBIS and adding stabilization in post if needed?
It depends on what you are shooting. The electronic IS also adds a crop. Play with both and see what you like.
Great video! Did you try any 60fps overheating tests or do you plan to?
Thanks. I did not and don’t plan to. I mention that in this video.
@@Josh_Sattin I must have missed that! brushing my teeth while watching lol. Sorry. Nice work though, you always have valuable content!
No worries. Thanks for watching!
Does anyone know where he got the windscreen for his mic?
www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1548069-REG/rode_interviewgo_interview_go_handheld.html/BI/22187/KBID/28723/DFF/d10-v21-t1-x1038191/SID/DFF
@@Josh_Sattin i think his doesnt have the logo on it...
@@rodmanblanchard2511 I colored it in with a sharpie. Haha.
@@Josh_Sattin ha! Genius
@Josh Sattin why you sell your R5c?
I talk about that a bit in this video.
Great video, I'm thinking about investing into some Canon gear, I currently run a Sony A7iii & FS100 combo but with canon ef glass. I want to make the move into 10 bit video footage and with the price differences between the R7 and Sony A7iv as well as the lenses it just makes sense for me, the adapated canon ef lenses work like a native lens from what I've seen. Even thinking about picking up an R6 now with this new firmware update.
Keep in mind that they did not fix the overheating in the R6. Just in the R5.
@@Josh_Sattin Ah okay that changes my decision then haha. Thanks for the info
You bet. Thanks for watching!
Gotta say that the camera is now fixed, shot a wedding in 8K raw to test it. Didn't overheat once. 4 hours of shooting. The camera did get warm, but thermals seem to be managed way better in the camera. Software seemed to have been holding the camera back. I also have a theory that they did this to kill the image of buying an Atomos if you want to record 8K RAW on the R5 ( Which is done externally )
The is no excuse for the 30 minutes record limit.
Agreed.
Sold my r5 and went to Sony a7 IV. Slowly getting out my lenses. Canon has created another Sony user.
Thoughts? Are you happy with the purchase?
I would rather an A1 since all my gear is Sony. but that prices is ridiculous. But with all these updates the R5 has hit my radar again.
Dang, it sucks how they do things to "protect" their higher-end cine cameras. This update seems to really fix the R5... may need to get one honestly.
I know Dave! It is now a different camera since it doesn't overheat.
Let's not buy it all together to keep from supporting this crappy business model 🤷♂
The 30min limit was originally set due to import taxes on video cameras in EU. However, that law was repealed in 2019, but Canon may still want to keep it in R5 for a while to protect the R5c as you speculated.
I'm excited that Canon released the firmware update to resolve the overheating issue for the R5, I am SUPER bummed they didn't do the same for the R6. Also... a comment on the 30 min record limit (I hope you're listening Canon) I know the reason was because of taxes and tariffs at the time when the camera release, but that is no longer an issue. If Canon wants they should just release an optional firmware update where you pay $ to bypass the recording limit. Something similar to Atomos or Panasonic to unlock more features.
I am also super bummed this wasn’t included in the R6 update. Now I have to think about upgrading to the R5 just for the overheating issue
Honestly I ve the r6 and I’m really thinking on a switch to Sony more that upgrade to the r5
@@rgco I don’t blame you. Sony is also an obvious choice. A74 is a good choice but afraid of not liking the 1.6 crop along with potential overheating issues. A7siii is overpriced for the 12 mp sensor.
@@sammyh9542 Yeah, it's true, just waiting to know the next problem with the R5 :D
I think the background is still twitching. It's just that the crop is smaller, it doesn't seem to be. In fact, there are convulsions. Does this mean that there is a problem with the body image stabilization of the R5/R6?
I cancelled my R7 pre-order after the 1.6 firmware, now I can really shoot R5 without worry about the fake overheating timer.
First of, welldone for the tests. These videos and tests are really not easy to make and I commend you for that. But one thing I wish all youtubers doing this test know is that "What is worth doing is worth doing well". If you really want to do the overheat test... Do the test with all recording modes. Get a dummy battery and connect to external source of power. And stop making conclusions on half based fact of "I stopped when the battery died". Some people shoot events for long hours and they come with 10, 15batteries... This kind of video will not help them neither does it answer the questions of whether the camera is now reliable to shoot long events. But all the same, welldone
Thanks for doing this video! This firmware update does entice me towards getting the R5 since I’m really a hybrid shooter. Yeah man that battery drain on the R5C goes really really quickly
You're welcome. Yeah, this update makes the R5 a much better hybrid option than it was before. Thanks for watching!
I rather just use the r5c with a vmount on the back. it lasts longer and is more balanced ergonomically. I just cant stand using mirrorless hybrid for video. I had to rig the hell outta my r5c for me to use it because the c70 is my main choice for video based on handling alone.
Wibble wobble wow. Overheating setting is good, nice tests, recording the recording.
I used the FX3 to record the recording. I knew that wouldn’t overheat.
@@Josh_Sattin Solid burn!
Damn, warble still alive and well.
This was an emotional update for me. I almost cried!!! It looks like the dynamic range is better. I pray is did becuase thats number 2 on my list of r5 issues.
I hear you! Years of frustration. I am hoping for better dynamic range too. I'll be testing it, but I have a lot of videos to make right now. Thanks for watching!
Thank you for the info. Always appreciated.
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
Appreciate this!
this story with the dynanic range is interesting. I will try to make a test in raw clog 2 and 4k clog 3. Thanks a lot for this idea!
Hey, Josh! I saw your viral video titled (Canon R7 - Low Light Performance (With R5C Comparison) which has (30K) views. I liked this video a lot, after that I watched a lot of your videos and I think your video is addictive.
But today while I was browsing your TH-cam channel a couple of exciting ideas came to mind which can help you to go viral and that I wanna discuss with you:💙
Used a Sony A7SIII yesterday for the first time ever. Shooting inside it overheated 20min in. I was really surprised. Thank God I had my C70:)
Great video Josh. Excited for this update, But I was one of the few that never really ran into this issue. I'd be surprised if the dynamic range is better, but it would be sick!
Thanks Brandon! Classic issue when using a Sony for the first time. Gotta set the Auto Power Off Temp setting to high. C70 won’t let you down though!
@@Josh_Sattin it wasn’t mine. It was another TH-camrs that’s had it for quite a while. They might have not known though
@@BrandonTalbot Oh I figured that. I assume you would have let me know if you bought a Sony.
@@Josh_Sattin hahahaha definitely
Sony A7sIII overheated in 20minutes?? What codec was that? Phillip Bloom made an heat test last year or thereabout and only the 4K 120p overheated. What frame rate and resolution did you use that overheated in 20minutes please?
Surely the R5 still overheats. It just doesn’t shut down when it overheats. The camera and card are now allowed to get very hot, potentially damaging both. I Wouk’s think the firmware update hasn’t made the camera run cooler. It just permits you to let the camera get really hot!
I showed the camera actually overheating in this video in an extreme heat situation. So, there is a limit to this camera where it knows to shut itself down. Canon just changed the limit with this firmware update. I am not an engineer and I do not work for Canon, but I highly doubt that Canon would let their camera damage itself.
@@Josh_Sattin This is something I'm a bit worried about myself, but can also see as the reasons for the delay on the firmware update. Perhaps some large scale testing was done for any damage (immediate and long term) on cameras that were overheating and once Canon realized there wouldn't be any class action lawsuits from cameras melting down, they released the update?
Nah. Wouldn't a camera company want to give their customers the best possible product so they like it and recommend it to others? They have known the heat limitations of this camera a long time ago. These cameras take a long time to research and develop and that would have been taken care of before the initial release 2 years ago. Also, why would they still have a 30 minute time limit if this wasn't a false restriction?
@@Josh_Sattin Admittedly I don't know much about these types of things. I remember hearing that the 30 minute time limit determines whether or not it's considered a photo camera or a video camera in Europe, which results in a different tax percentage being applied to it based on the MSRP.
@@waynedennyphoto This was based on a tax law that any camera that recorded over 30 minutes was considered a video camera and taxed higher. This tax law was removed in 2018 or 2019. No reason for this limit in the R5.
Josh your killing it!
Thank you for the kind words!
A new dynamic range test is needed between the updated R5 and the R5c. Hopefully canon secretly improved it in the 1.6 update. Or does the xf-avc codec the R5c has the extra 1.5 stops.
I'm curious how they compare as well. Unfortunately I don't have the R5C anymore. I'm hoping someone else does the comparison.
No, the dynamic range on the R5C is just as good in H.265 (according to Gerald Undone even -slightly- better). I'm also curious about a new dynamic range test between the R5 and R5C
@@filmkitnet my neighbor has an R5. All we have to do is test the 2 R5s with his old firmware against my new firmware and see if the DR has improved or if it’s still the same. 🤔
@@presise1620 That would be AWESOME!! Subbed to see the results 🙂
@@filmkitnet I was out there today for 3 hours in 92 degrees with my R5. Screen open , screen close, and left the camera on as much as possible on purpose. Use a gimbal and hand held. 4k60 clog3 with the 24 1.4 and 50 1.2. Ran it until the battery died. Recorded 27 minutes of actual footage of womens kickball. I almost passed out but but but…. NO OVERHEATING AT ALL. Not even a warning. I even started shooting photos at 20 fps just because I was tired of shooting video. In photo mode it did have the RED warning 0:00 for time remaining. But when I switch back to video it said 29:59. THANK YOU JESUS!! It’s a miracle. The R5 is officially the best hybrid camera ever made. Side note: the tracking in photo mode at 20fps was insane.
A Canon rep told me that the Canon "cripple hammer" is a "stupid" thing that is just not real. He said that Canon does not believe in limiting camera features to protect higher models and they always put as much as they can into every camera they make. He says that the "cripple hammer" is just a conspiracy therory from customers that want more from a camera then it can actually do. If the R5 has a 30min video limit, it must be caused by a hardware limitation that only Canon engineers understand and something customers cant see. Canon doesnt belive in crippling their cameras.
Strange, another Canon rep told me that there is "cripple hammer"
If this is the case then why not fix the overheating in the R6 too?
@@blazotatar8611 - Oh no....as a huge Canon fan, I dont know what to do. Which Canon rep do I put my faith in??....uggg.
The 30 min limit is to pay lower tax as the camera is not called a video camera in the EU without the ability to record more than 29.59 minutes. The heat limit timers are software only and it was proven with removal/reset of the internal battery about a year ago - check out Tony Northrup video on it about a year ago. What they saw is the camera overheats in a certain amount of time, you pop the internal battery and the camera will be able to record for that period of time again without increasing in heat substantially internally or externally and then it stops again at the pre defined time limit and shows you the overheat warning. It’s fake overheating and now that’s finally been removed in firmware 1.6. But I still believe there is a thermal limit to what the camera can do, but it’s nowhere close to the limitations we’ve faced for the last 2 years.
@@MichaelDrowley - Yes, the dreaded Euro tax. That evil tax that blocked Canon from giving us unlimited recording times. I know Canon was dying to give us un-crippled recording times...they really, REALLY wanted to but sadly, their hands were completely tied. Meanwhile, Panasonic EASILY got around that law and sold us GH series cameras with zero trouble in Europe. Also,..it would have been completely unfair to sell cameras in the US and other places that were NOT time crippled...even though the rest of the world had no tax to blame. Again, there was just nothing Canon could really do,....no matter how badly they wanted us to have it. Today?...well the Euro law is gone but who knows?... that pesky law could return someday. Canon just want's to be on the safe side in case that nasty law returns someday. The Canon R5 will be pre-compliant and pre-crippled for Europe. Very prudent and forward-thinking on Canon's part. This is why I love Canon.
In regards to the 30min time limit, has there been any instance of a camera that launched with a 30min time limit and then subsequently removed that restriction? I wonder if it has to deal with certifications and essentially re-certifying this camera on the legal end. Yes, the tariff for cameras that record above 30min has been long abolished and it's the reason why we see new Canon cameras (R3, R7, etc) shipping without the 30min record limit but I think the R5 is a special case because it's already been certified as a photo camera and Canon doesn't want to spend the legal money/time or if it's even allowed by regulating bodies to re-certify a camera.
I believe that European tax law ended in 2019. The R5 came out in 2020.
@@Josh_Sattin oh that's right. There's surprisingly little information on the web but it looks like ~ July 2019 that tariff was removed. Do we know when manufacturers submit their products for certification? A year prior to launch? Maybe 6 months? I don't know.
Otherwise, I agree, there's no reason why Canon can't remove the recording limit then.
Appreciate the work you did with this, but WISH you did ALL-I instead of IPB…
I get IPB is just as good with a subject that isn’t moving etc, but ALL-I is what I would think is most important here.
Was hoping to eliminate testing it myself, but looks like I will still have to in ALL-I modes.
Thanks again truly and also, might want to try out either Sony Tough or Angelbird CF Express cards. I’ve noticed quite the difference with times compared to other cards. I get more out of those two.
Thanks. I did test the overheating in 4K24 ALL-I in this video.
@@Josh_Sattin just lacking 4K60. Just thinking that 4K60 is probably one of the most used frame rates outside of 4K24 HQ.
Not trying to annoy you because your channel is one that I resort to, but a lot of people are probably interested in the 4K60 ALL-I.
Again, thanks a lot for the work involved in these tests. Takes a lot of time to do.
You're welcome. I am pretty confident with my tests that basically the overheating on this camera is really not going to be an issue anymore. Also, I did mention that I don't currently have a CFExpress card so I cant even test 4K60 ALL-I.
I don't get the whole battery thing with the R5C, just mount a small 45 w power bank and you're good. You don't even need to rig it up.