What we got made sense for how close they were to extinction anyway. However, having it be an option while they were at a stronger point of their existence would've been cool. Maybe be like a spy vs spy scenario.
That questline was so bs, you tell a guard and the oculus guy about killing an assassin, and then they're just like, "oh yeah we found their sanctuary, here random citizen, go take out an entire clan of armed killers BY YOURSELF as a reward for exposing them" like it could of been a whole questline by itself, but it was just so rushed and pointless.
@@jetblackonyx5985 Not saying it was perfect, or even particularly good, just saying it made sense for emphasizing how weak the Brotherhood was at the time.
the victoria vicci quest if you push the statue on it you will get a bonus if you make it look like a accident and also when she has does her speech you got your token to get your reading from oliva the feeble
Well to be fair, the Skyrim branch of the dark brotherhood doesn't die even if you do that quest to destroy them. No mater what you do, Cicero, Babbet, the whiterun fortune teller, and the night mother all survive, and there will still be an assassin on the emperors ship. And don't forget the little boy that you got your first contract from.
In Raven Rock's temple, I wish they scripted dialogue for if you have azura's star, the ebony blade, and the ebony mail in your inventory. The priest guy could be all blown away by seeing someone who is the champion of all three of the "good" daedra... also if you have the ebony blade and encounter the morag tong, they should see the blade and bow before mephala's champion... Lols, that would be fun...
While under Astrid, the Dark Brotherhood stopped following the tenets and became much more independent and about survival and income rather than about serving Sithis. I think the whole point of the Skyrim DB quest line is that Astrid was in the wrong and was punished for it. She breaks most if not all of the tenets, dismisses any authority the Night Mother and by extension the Listener has, and in the end she's punished and most of her beloved family gets killed. To me, this indicates that the Dark Brotherhood will return to the old ways and adhere to them more in the future, leading to prosperity. Babette even says she was around when they abided by the old ways, but she kind of doesn't anymore, mostly because she likes Astrid and is just following her lead though.
you can ask the members of the brotherhood for tips when you have an active main quest. babette will tell you about the statue, gabrielle tells you to shoot victoria from the other alcove, where she left a bow called "finiriel's end". so, yeah, the dialog is there.
The quest "bonuses" in Skyrim are sometimes more than just monetary. The assassin ghost and the Ring of the Nightweaver just to name a few. Edit: The Ancient Shrouded Armor as well!
In Oblivion I killed 1 of the guards sent through the Kvach portal to get his sword and armour so the Dark brotherhoods talent scouts are very good to have found out about a killing that happened in a different plain of existence
I’d like to see a Hashashin inspired assassin group in Hammerfell - I reckon it would suit the overall theme of Hammerfell. I’m excited by the idea of the alikr deserts possibly with some buried cities to explore, and possibly some Caribbean-esque pirating coastal regions. I’m very excited for the middle eastern cities and honestly the whole theme seems to be amazing. Maybe even some inspiration from Petra in Jordan P.s. love what you guys do
This would be the most fitting for an assassin organization in Hammerfell. It also could be an all new group, not ancient like all other groups in Tamriel.
The Desert Vipers (placeholder names) A group of dedicated assassins that have targeted political allies of the Dominion since the Great War, they are dedicated to Hammerfell independence from the shadows. The questline involves a moral dilemma within the faction, which is now (at least 25 years after their founding). Some members want to keep true to their purpose, killing only Dominion allies, while another faction wants to fill in the void left by the Dark Brotherhood (maybe we can have elven veterans of the Brotherhood?). You can resolve this conflict and chose the future of the guild. This is basically a parallel to the group thar fought the invading Templar knights and tried to prevent them from killing. In this case, it’s Redguards fighting the Dominion’s occupation
I like this idea simply because the music would be great. Hearing the ancient, dark intervals of the phrygian dominant scale while wondering the sandy deserts of Hammerfell sounds epic.
It would be awesome to have an established assassins group in ES6, and have the DB be a small, underdog group of relative amateurs with potential, and player choice of who to join. AND make them both good. My hope for ES6 is having exclusive, competing factions for each archetype to give the game more replay value besides trying another build, and making completing ALL the content on one character impossible. Unlikely though
@Sam Guevenne yea but i mainly just wanna see an older cicero still pulling his jester crap even though he's like 90 or something, i think that be cute
I think a good reference to Cicero for Elder Scrolls VI would be to find one of Nazir's descendants, and if you complete a side quest to acquire him as a follower, you'll be gifted a set of jester clothes that look aged, with him explaining he found this buried in the vicinity of his grandfather Nazir's Sanctuary after Nazir finally returned to Sithis' dark embrace. You know something like that, it would give a little bit of lore and explanation for those who didn't play the last game while still being just vague enough that familiar players will grin and go "So he DID end up strangling the Cicero!"
Skyrim's dark brotherhood challenges do also include bonuses, including the gem from Olava the Feeble who gives you your future telling, or an extra ring from the old man, or a unique ring from Muiri. Also, similar to the aftereffects of your murders in Oblivion, there's outcomes resulting from your work. Muiri again - murdering Nilsine as well as the bandit she sent you after first will result in Nilsine's mother committing suicide over the death of another daughter, and her husband sinking even further into despair. So there's those aftereffects. It was also a nice touch to allow you to destroy the dark brotherhood instead. I do wish they'd fleshed out the people a bit more, but I think if you talked to the other Dark Brotherhood members about the different targets you have they give you more of the information and tips/hints about how you might creatively deal with them.
There's one thing i don't get regarding Bethesda and the Dark Brotherhood. What is the point of coming up with an awesome Assassin Guild and then in the last two Elder Scrolls games come up with a stupid storyline where they nearly wipe out themselves? That is absolutely counter-productive.
I honestly want a podcast around Akatosh and all his different interpretations but also how Akatosh is related to Lorkhan with how some Dragonborn were also Shezzarine
The "You have been misled! - this is the TRUE God of the empire" video they did recently covers a lot of Lorkahn and Akatosh similarities, connections, etc.
I know about that video and I liked it too but I feel like they can cover this in more detail with a podcast and personally I think this one of the best connections in the lore, because with Lorkhan representative of space while Akatosh is time none can exist without the other and that would just be a good podcast to look into
@@denakarganta1502 yeah, true. And maybe also explore the connections between Talos and Lorkahn, which adds another dimension to the Akatosh and Lorkahn one-can't-exist-without-the-other, two-sides-of-the-same-coin idea. Man, the Thalmor have reason to hate Talos.
@@StarlitSeafoam I feel the Thalmor are going about the entire idea about mortality as a prison the wrong way, like the Redguards and Dark Elves have a better way around also they have their own hero gods like Pynaster who also ascended to godhood
You know, I'd read that the lady believed to become the Night Mother had been a Dunmer woman. Maybe they've got different sources. 🤔 Cicero, however, became one of my favorite characters because of his journals. After I spared him and kept him around as a follower, he grew on me.
It would be cool if instead of joining you help establish a new chapter for them in hammerfell with its new base. Having it be detached from the empire would make it a cool place for them to quietly rebuild.
the best dark brotherhood quest was the (party) one where you have to kill all the guest without the others knowing and the fact that your the one with the key everyone is looking for
Like drew was gonna say, in Dragonborn DLC, the Morag Tong are on solstheim, after the tribunal is gone. So SOME family is retaining contact with some faction regardless of size
I really like the Skyrim Dark Brotherhood because of the variety of assassin characters in the sanctuary - they aren't all just people who sneak up and stab people with daggers - they have a mage who likes to blow people apart, a guy who fights his prey in single combat, etc.
The dark brotherhoods ruling body is the black hand, mephala is said to have black hands , eno hlaalu wears black gloves to symbolize mephalas black hands.
If the three criteria of DB returns in ES6, it’s ten-ish years later, and it’s in the Illiac Bay region are met, I would want to be recruited by an aging-but-still-capable Nazir to rebuild the Brotherhood in the area. So instead of destroying the memorable cast of assassins, you build them up this time while taking contracts, with the quest line ending with you being a Speaker (because the Listener is still in Skyrim), and getting to choose between a few unique assassins to be your Silencer (faction follower).
I love the idea that Vivec was the first Night Mother that orchestrated the Morag Tong/DB split, probably as a way to send all these terrible assassins outside of Morrowind to save the Dunmeri people from their unrestrained murderous ways. Mephala is most likely the first Night Mother, but Vivec is Anticipated by them, and he seemed to take credit for the split in his Sermons. Plus that would really rustle the DB’s jimmies. ;)
Maybe a questline based around rebuilding the brotherhood and you can choose to follow a more old school path with the tenets being reinstated or follow a more in it for the money like skyrim. Have it start by sleeping under a moonless sky outdoors and you receive a dream from sithis or the nightmother that leads you to an old abandoned sanctuary in the mountains and gives you the words to open the door finding the nightmothers coffin and the keepers skeleton dressed in the armor of the dark brotherhood and the first few quests can be you going out and finding people who have committed murders and getting them to join the new brotherhood
Michael hits the nail on the head at the beginning of this podcast. It would be better for BGS to be more creative and create or flesh out some other assassin organization for players to interact with. But like with the BoS and SuperMutants in Fallout, the Brotherhood is so established among the fans that they will almost certainly exist as a full faction in TESVI. BGS seems more inclined to include fan-favorite staples and handwave excuses for their inclusion, than to stick to their established continuity and let the DB fade to history.
Around 6:20 Drew calls Michael, Mick, today of fudge muppet we will be looking into the deeper lore reasons as to how these friends developed a mick name
Just saying the specter of Lucien Lachance makes comments about the dread father. If you haven't had the specter summoned when clearing the Dawnstar sanctuary I really recommend it. That or find a youtube video that I'm sure has it lol.
Babette tells you about the statue if you talk to her about the contract and the mage woman tells you about the ledge where you find the unique bow. I can't remember her name though
I have a theory that if the night mother is truly mephala taken a guise to continue her self worshipping assassins cult upon the rise of the tribunal, then perhaps the sudden downfall of the brotherhood is because she has diverted her favor again back to the morang tong since they must be worshipping her again since the fall of the tribunal, that would explain their own comeback
I can see the tong returning and there being an element of them interfering with the Brotherhood's work. But as for a traditionally Dunmer guild taking over the assassin industry of all provinces, I doubt it. If we go back to Morrowind in a game, yes. But the DB transcends borders and race, which is what makes it so versatile. You can't realistically have a bunch of dunmer assassins, sanctioned by the government of morrowimd, running around Hammerfell and/or High Rock and killing their citizens without serious repercussions -- like war. The DB is not tied to any governing body, so they're a much safer choice for all your murderous needs when outside morrowind.
I agree Scott, as soon as Microsoft bought Bethesda, I began to recall the best first person sword/spell combat I've ever experienced: Arkane Studio's "Dark Messiah of Might & Magic". I would love nothing more than the people responsible for that and Dishonored to build a smaller, more intimate open world where changes could actually take place based on actions. Your idea rocks, you could easily write the game where you could choose who you'd wish to follow after the schism.
2:20 i find it so cute how Drew says he thinks the Morag Tong will be in ES6 even though its likely gonna be in Hammerfell and then everyone giggles at him
the DB, especially in oblivion, was 100% my favorite. but never because it was edgy or anything or because i particularly liked the idea of being an assassin(Though I never minded that either), but rather because of just how oddly *nice* everyone there is. like, seemingly everyone in oblivion is rude as hell to the pc, but then the dark brotherhood is there and treats you so well and i just fcjhjjhg. it just gives off such paradoxically good vibes
One thing I was wondering, is there a listener in every sanctuary? I was wondering about that, because otherwise it would take a year to get an answer to the black sacrament if you are in another province than the sanctuary with the listener.
The first time I had an experience with the dark brotherhood was in the arena of oblivion. When you get to the end and have to kill the half vampire half orc champion, he is completely passive in the fight. If you complete the arena quest completely before joining the brotherhood, it becomes the next step off of the story of the arena. I loved it at the time as a way to intertie all of the game into itself. Even now I love how it scripted out that way making me feel like I had publicly displayed how unmerciful a killer my character was. I wish in that game there were more questlines that fed into the dark brotherhood like the arena felt like, rather than a generic series of events that happened to occur after killing literally anybody that was a neutrally dispositioned character.
The Mroang Tong and dark brotherhood are enemies if you complete the thieves guild and return it to its former glory you get a dark elf member that use to be a Mroang Tong and he says they rival the dark brotherhood
It would be so awesome for bethesda to make an entire game based fully off of the dark brotherhood and being an assassin!! Like reform the shadowscales or the crimson scars are trying to be reformed!!!
While I don’t share in the worship of Sithis as the Dark Brotherhood does, _I do worship_ his/its soul, the one being who started it all, and the one being who will end it all, and allow for _true transcendence,_ beyond Aedra and Daedra. That being, the only god worthy of worship to me, is, of course, _the Missing God who goes by many names._ Some call him Sheor, and others call him Shezarr. Some know him as Sep, and others know him as Shor. Some understand him as Lorkhaj, The Tricky Cat. And others know him as an evil Trickster God, whose name feels like chewing broken glass when uttered, and thus shall not be named. It matters not how you know him, but it _does matter_ that he exists because of, and thanks to the Dread Father, Sithis, the manifestation of the Void itself. So while I do not _worship_ Sithis, I feel an eternal sense of gratitude to him/it for what he/it sparked in the Aurbis. And that is why, I will leave everyone with a hearty, full-throated, and proud, “HAIL SITHIS!” 💀
Pushing the gargoyle on Vittoria Vici is meant to give you a bonus, but the scripting on the quest is bugged. IIRC the only way to really get it to work is sniping her with an arrow on the balcony during her heartwarming speech.
Oblivion Thieves guild was the best. Great moral side , and detailed main plot line. . Second DB Skyrim for the detailed plot line. The Companions were a good story line But it was a poor replacement for the fighter's guild that did exist in Skyrim in Daggerfall , & Oblivion .
Morag Tong: A mastery of murder and betrayal will help you get ahead in this cruel and indifferent world. Mephala has taught us that, while sometimes distasteful, deception and violence are a reality of the world and it is better to be the deceiver than the decieved. Dark Brotherhood: mURdeR iS CoOl! HaIL sITHis!!!
I really love the rivalry between the dark brotherhood and the morag tong as it helps the emersion in the dragonborn dlc because if you are a brotherhood assassin when you're hired by the second of Raven Rock you have kinda a twisted glee about being an assassin hire too clear out a den of assassin's and if you're not well it as good of a reason as any other to join
Is there any way you can make a video/talk about the size of Tamriel as a continent, its geography, real world size, travel times via walking, horse, ship etc,, distance + real world comparisons and real world cultures?
you should try to do a podcast on the top best fiction from the books of the different games like "a dance of fire", "the real Barenziah", "the mirror" etc...
This isnt my idea but It would be cool if you could side with the penitus oculatus and join the dark brotherhood as a spy it would make the speech skill line so much better. Now heres me adding to that idea, The story would include stuff like the DB becoming suspicious of you, having to frame one of the members, and even having to kill an innocent person to prove your loyalty to the DB (obviously there would be an option to fake the kill).
Could you do a video about what will happen when the dragonborn dies because with the amount of deadra who have the right to your soal when you die there would be a war of the gods over your soal
I love this channel and ES is by far my favorite video game series, but I recently discovered the lore behind Cyberpunk 2077 and it's incredibly dense, I think many of us that are overhyped for Cyberpunk would love to see some analysis of the lore behind the upcoming game
in skyrim even if you kill the dark brotherhood (astrid/nazir/arbijorn etc) you never truly will cuz cicero is still with the nightmother, as long as the nightmother lives the brotherhood lives.
I think Cicero either hears Sithis or Mephala, or even The Night Mother but not as good as The Listener would hear her Because in The Dark Brotherhood Questline in Skyrim, when Astrid asks us to kill Cícero, with we Summon The Dark Brotherhood Spirit that we gain, he talks that killing Cícero is not What The Dread Father want
I know many don't consider ESO canon (even though it is) there's so much lore on the brotherhood that you need to check out - the main enemy in the dark brotherhood dlc who is called the black dragon is an ex brotherhood member who was a member of one of these squads that were like a death squad that was used to eliminate brotherhood cells that weren't performing to the correct standards - the fact you are followed on the run up to kill the black dragon by a shadowy figure (Sithis) and when you finally kill the black dragon that skeletal figures come out of the ground to pull her soul into the void proving that Sithis is an actual being and not just someone mentioned in a book
Great episode! Also the dark brotherhood in skyrim does have bonuses; for example kill vici while shes addressing the crowd. I believe that's how u get the Lucian Lachance spell. also i think the morag tong will return in es6 because the thief in riften who was a former morag tong says the members are waiting to return.
My first time playing the dark brotherhood was after I killed the grey prince in the arena it was odd to me because up until that point I had not killed anyone innocent and the grey prince had asked me to kill him because he was so ashamed of his vampire ancestry even tho my red guard characters as a good guy he found that he actually grew to enjoy killing the various targets the dark brotherhood set for him up until the dreaded dead drop quests that have you savagely kill all the high ranking dark brother hood members it was at this point that my character had enough of murder for hire and went back to killing those who deserved it only like bandits rouge wizards necromancers or anyone really unlucky enough to cross his path in the wild
I just wish destroying the brotherhood had more to it. Tracking down members, discovering plots of assassination...etc.
What we got made sense for how close they were to extinction anyway.
However, having it be an option while they were at a stronger point of their existence would've been cool. Maybe be like a spy vs spy scenario.
That questline was so bs, you tell a guard and the oculus guy about killing an assassin, and then they're just like, "oh yeah we found their sanctuary, here random citizen, go take out an entire clan of armed killers BY YOURSELF as a reward for exposing them" like it could of been a whole questline by itself, but it was just so rushed and pointless.
@@jetblackonyx5985 Not saying it was perfect, or even particularly good, just saying it made sense for emphasizing how weak the Brotherhood was at the time.
@@James11111 don't get me wrong, I'm not contesting your point, just emphasizing my contempt for the way that plot point was handled.
@@James11111 Its called the first few quests in Morrowind Tribunal
Drew is a fountain of knowledge... He's quiet most of the time, but... Uncertain about lore? Drew to the rescue!
Drew is best boy.
He has vast daedric knowledge, he is big brain
Thanks, y'all are so sweet.
the victoria vicci quest if you push the statue on it you will get a bonus if you make it look like a accident and also when she has does her speech you got your token to get your reading from oliva the feeble
Well to be fair, the Skyrim branch of the dark brotherhood doesn't die even if you do that quest to destroy them. No mater what you do, Cicero, Babbet, the whiterun fortune teller, and the night mother all survive, and there will still be an assassin on the emperors ship. And don't forget the little boy that you got your first contract from.
In Raven Rock's temple, I wish they scripted dialogue for if you have azura's star, the ebony blade, and the ebony mail in your inventory. The priest guy could be all blown away by seeing someone who is the champion of all three of the "good" daedra... also if you have the ebony blade and encounter the morag tong, they should see the blade and bow before mephala's champion... Lols, that would be fun...
I was mad that they didn't come out to kill me despite my dark brotherhood armor
That's a pretty great idea for a mod!
While under Astrid, the Dark Brotherhood stopped following the tenets and became much more independent and about survival and income rather than about serving Sithis. I think the whole point of the Skyrim DB quest line is that Astrid was in the wrong and was punished for it. She breaks most if not all of the tenets, dismisses any authority the Night Mother and by extension the Listener has, and in the end she's punished and most of her beloved family gets killed.
To me, this indicates that the Dark Brotherhood will return to the old ways and adhere to them more in the future, leading to prosperity. Babette even says she was around when they abided by the old ways, but she kind of doesn't anymore, mostly because she likes Astrid and is just following her lead though.
Became more like the thieves guild in a sense
you can ask the members of the brotherhood for tips when you have an active main quest. babette will tell you about the statue, gabrielle tells you to shoot victoria from the other alcove, where she left a bow called "finiriel's end". so, yeah, the dialog is there.
Nah the best advice is from festus crex "walk up, shake their hand, look them in the eye and then bam! Fireball to the face, works every time"
@@ralcogaming7674 spoken like any good wizard
You should do a podcast on vampires and there history.
7 months later lol
th-cam.com/video/aF1Kiv46ldM/w-d-xo.html
The quest "bonuses" in Skyrim are sometimes more than just monetary. The assassin ghost and the Ring of the Nightweaver just to name a few.
Edit: The Ancient Shrouded Armor as well!
The assassin ghost was the payment not the bonus. The bonus for that quest was gold. Pure simple gold, for you to spend however you wish.
@@insylem Riiight sorry bout that
@Dababy Jesus Well I wouldnt say you get NOTHING from the Companions. I got a colossal sense of disappointment!
Blade of woe? Maybes
@Giovanni Messe you get the racism axe
In Oblivion I killed 1 of the guards sent through the Kvach portal to get his sword and armour so the Dark brotherhoods talent scouts are very good to have found out about a killing that happened in a different plain of existence
I’d like to see a Hashashin inspired assassin group in Hammerfell - I reckon it would suit the overall theme of Hammerfell.
I’m excited by the idea of the alikr deserts possibly with some buried cities to explore, and possibly some Caribbean-esque pirating coastal regions. I’m very excited for the middle eastern cities and honestly the whole theme seems to be amazing.
Maybe even some inspiration from Petra in Jordan
P.s. love what you guys do
This would be the most fitting for an assassin organization in Hammerfell. It also could be an all new group, not ancient like all other groups in Tamriel.
The Desert Vipers (placeholder names)
A group of dedicated assassins that have targeted political allies of the Dominion since the Great War, they are dedicated to Hammerfell independence from the shadows.
The questline involves a moral dilemma within the faction, which is now (at least 25 years after their founding). Some members want to keep true to their purpose, killing only Dominion allies, while another faction wants to fill in the void left by the Dark Brotherhood (maybe we can have elven veterans of the Brotherhood?). You can resolve this conflict and chose the future of the guild.
This is basically a parallel to the group thar fought the invading Templar knights and tried to prevent them from killing. In this case, it’s Redguards fighting the Dominion’s occupation
This can be done on Morrowind as there is a skooma pipe in game. Just get a mod to add hammerfell.
I like this idea simply because the music would be great. Hearing the ancient, dark intervals of the phrygian dominant scale while wondering the sandy deserts of Hammerfell sounds epic.
It would be awesome to have an established assassins group in ES6, and have the DB be a small, underdog group of relative amateurs with potential, and player choice of who to join. AND make them both good.
My hope for ES6 is having exclusive, competing factions for each archetype to give the game more replay value besides trying another build, and making completing ALL the content on one character impossible.
Unlikely though
i wann see atlest a refernce to cicero cuz he's got like his own fandom within the dark brotherhood fandom
@Sam Guevenne yea but i mainly just wanna see an older cicero still pulling his jester crap even though he's like 90 or something, i think that be cute
its like they did this on purpose, just like so many other chars in beth games
@@3xm-draconic676 a 90 year old Cicero who finally becomes Listener now that would be MAD!!!
@@jorgesaenz8986 cicero: well...beter late than never also picture this: old cicero with grand kids
I think a good reference to Cicero for Elder Scrolls VI would be to find one of Nazir's descendants, and if you complete a side quest to acquire him as a follower, you'll be gifted a set of jester clothes that look aged, with him explaining he found this buried in the vicinity of his grandfather Nazir's Sanctuary after Nazir finally returned to Sithis' dark embrace. You know something like that, it would give a little bit of lore and explanation for those who didn't play the last game while still being just vague enough that familiar players will grin and go "So he DID end up strangling the Cicero!"
I love these deep dives guys, nice to get you All sitting around talking about something we all love!
Hot chocolate, rainy weather, FudgeMuppet TES podcast. Ah yes, it's all coming together.
A rainy day in parts of the US as well.
Drew the Daedrologist steering it back on track 👍
Skyrim's dark brotherhood challenges do also include bonuses, including the gem from Olava the Feeble who gives you your future telling, or an extra ring from the old man, or a unique ring from Muiri. Also, similar to the aftereffects of your murders in Oblivion, there's outcomes resulting from your work. Muiri again - murdering Nilsine as well as the bandit she sent you after first will result in Nilsine's mother committing suicide over the death of another daughter, and her husband sinking even further into despair. So there's those aftereffects. It was also a nice touch to allow you to destroy the dark brotherhood instead. I do wish they'd fleshed out the people a bit more, but I think if you talked to the other Dark Brotherhood members about the different targets you have they give you more of the information and tips/hints about how you might creatively deal with them.
The Dark Brotherhood sounds like a hard-rock band
There's one thing i don't get regarding Bethesda and the Dark Brotherhood. What is the point of coming up with an awesome Assassin Guild and then in the last two Elder Scrolls games come up with a stupid storyline where they nearly wipe out
themselves? That is absolutely counter-productive.
5:23 Weatherman: “Yeah we’ve got a 60% chance of f o u l m u r d e r over in Morrowind, better bring your poisoned candles and umbrella”
I honestly want a podcast around Akatosh and all his different interpretations but also how Akatosh is related to Lorkhan with how some Dragonborn were also Shezzarine
The "You have been misled! - this is the TRUE God of the empire" video they did recently covers a lot of Lorkahn and Akatosh similarities, connections, etc.
I know about that video and I liked it too but I feel like they can cover this in more detail with a podcast and personally I think this one of the best connections in the lore, because with Lorkhan representative of space while Akatosh is time none can exist without the other and that would just be a good podcast to look into
@@denakarganta1502 yeah, true. And maybe also explore the connections between Talos and Lorkahn, which adds another dimension to the Akatosh and Lorkahn one-can't-exist-without-the-other, two-sides-of-the-same-coin idea. Man, the Thalmor have reason to hate Talos.
@@StarlitSeafoam I feel the Thalmor are going about the entire idea about mortality as a prison the wrong way, like the Redguards and Dark Elves have a better way around also they have their own hero gods
like Pynaster who also ascended to godhood
Also because of Akatosh and Lorkhan basically needing each other they really are just short sighted
Are we gonna have to cause a dragon-break to get an episode about the Numidium? I swear they had plans from ep 1
Earliest I have ever been for these guys.
You know, I'd read that the lady believed to become the Night Mother had been a Dunmer woman. Maybe they've got different sources. 🤔 Cicero, however, became one of my favorite characters because of his journals. After I spared him and kept him around as a follower, he grew on me.
Hes my favorite for one quote
Alone .
"take someone's things before you kill them? And they call me crazy..."
how did i just find out you lads have a podcast hell yes
It would be cool if instead of joining you help establish a new chapter for them in hammerfell with its new base. Having it be detached from the empire would make it a cool place for them to quietly rebuild.
Oh I like that
Scott straight up looks like a character from ES 4 Oblivion.
😂😂😂😂😂
the best dark brotherhood quest was the (party) one where you have to kill all the guest without the others knowing and the fact that your the one with the key everyone is looking for
Like drew was gonna say, in Dragonborn DLC, the Morag Tong are on solstheim, after the tribunal is gone. So SOME family is retaining contact with some faction regardless of size
3:26 oh boy, here I go killing again.
I really like the Skyrim Dark Brotherhood because of the variety of assassin characters in the sanctuary - they aren't all just people who sneak up and stab people with daggers - they have a mage who likes to blow people apart, a guy who fights his prey in single combat, etc.
The Dark Brotherhood is one of my favorite guilds, I loved being an assassin in Oblivion and Skyrim
You guys are great. I listen to the podcast while I play Morrowind a lot recently.
Remember, in the emperor's ship there is another assassin on board, other than the dragonborn.
Babette tells you about the statue option during the Vici wedding ✌️doing that quest again today as I'm listening
I am so early that Jyggalag hasn't turned into Sheogorath yet
😳
Nice.
The dark brotherhoods ruling body is the black hand, mephala is said to have black hands , eno hlaalu wears black gloves to symbolize mephalas black hands.
Thanks!
Just saw this! Thank YOU!
I started playing ESO because I got so tired of waiting for TES6. I will be 40 by the time of release.
Are you enjoying ESO?
@@samurai2k455 pretty much yeah!
Scott -
"ewww , cat furries .."
"ewww , edgy assassins"
"I like Vikings , Katanas & Alien Elves"
To each their own , man ..
I agree with him
If the three criteria of DB returns in ES6, it’s ten-ish years later, and it’s in the Illiac Bay region are met, I would want to be recruited by an aging-but-still-capable Nazir to rebuild the Brotherhood in the area. So instead of destroying the memorable cast of assassins, you build them up this time while taking contracts, with the quest line ending with you being a Speaker (because the Listener is still in Skyrim), and getting to choose between a few unique assassins to be your Silencer (faction follower).
I love the idea that Vivec was the first Night Mother that orchestrated the Morag Tong/DB split, probably as a way to send all these terrible assassins outside of Morrowind to save the Dunmeri people from their unrestrained murderous ways. Mephala is most likely the first Night Mother, but Vivec is Anticipated by them, and he seemed to take credit for the split in his Sermons.
Plus that would really rustle the DB’s jimmies. ;)
HAIL SITHIS!
Flex like Sithis.
I have one, two, three, four, five cold killers in the Brotherhood, aye
You get the ghost of lucien lachance and the extra set of special brotherhood armour as quest rewards
I love these so much, please keep doing them!
Maybe a questline based around rebuilding the brotherhood and you can choose to follow a more old school path with the tenets being reinstated or follow a more in it for the money like skyrim. Have it start by sleeping under a moonless sky outdoors and you receive a dream from sithis or the nightmother that leads you to an old abandoned sanctuary in the mountains and gives you the words to open the door finding the nightmothers coffin and the keepers skeleton dressed in the armor of the dark brotherhood and the first few quests can be you going out and finding people who have committed murders and getting them to join the new brotherhood
Michael hits the nail on the head at the beginning of this podcast. It would be better for BGS to be more creative and create or flesh out some other assassin organization for players to interact with. But like with the BoS and SuperMutants in Fallout, the Brotherhood is so established among the fans that they will almost certainly exist as a full faction in TESVI. BGS seems more inclined to include fan-favorite staples and handwave excuses for their inclusion, than to stick to their established continuity and let the DB fade to history.
Around 6:20 Drew calls Michael, Mick, today of fudge muppet we will be looking into the deeper lore reasons as to how these friends developed a mick name
Love you guys. Keep up the amazing work.
Just saying the specter of Lucien Lachance makes comments about the dread father. If you haven't had the specter summoned when clearing the Dawnstar sanctuary I really recommend it. That or find a youtube video that I'm sure has it lol.
I love the deep diving discussion into the TES lore, guys! Keep it up! :D
yay another podcast i can rewatch 20 times
Pretty sure Babette tells you about the statue you can push over because it's so old. I know they do have dialogue about using it.
Was hoping we’d get a sithis tangent... Perhaps a discussion about the primordial entities of Elder Scrolls perhaps?
Babette tells you about the statue if you talk to her about the contract and the mage woman tells you about the ledge where you find the unique bow. I can't remember her name though
If the Dark Brotherhood &/or the Morag Tong aren’t in TES6, then maybe we’ll see the return of the Assassin’s League, or maybe even the Crimson Scars
I have a theory that if the night mother is truly mephala taken a guise to continue her self worshipping assassins cult upon the rise of the tribunal, then perhaps the sudden downfall of the brotherhood is because she has diverted her favor again back to the morang tong since they must be worshipping her again since the fall of the tribunal, that would explain their own comeback
I can see the tong returning and there being an element of them interfering with the Brotherhood's work. But as for a traditionally Dunmer guild taking over the assassin industry of all provinces, I doubt it. If we go back to Morrowind in a game, yes. But the DB transcends borders and race, which is what makes it so versatile. You can't realistically have a bunch of dunmer assassins, sanctioned by the government of morrowimd, running around Hammerfell and/or High Rock and killing their citizens without serious repercussions -- like war. The DB is not tied to any governing body, so they're a much safer choice for all your murderous needs when outside morrowind.
I agree Scott, as soon as Microsoft bought Bethesda, I began to recall the best first person sword/spell combat I've ever experienced: Arkane Studio's "Dark Messiah of Might & Magic". I would love nothing more than the people responsible for that and Dishonored to build a smaller, more intimate open world where changes could actually take place based on actions. Your idea rocks, you could easily write the game where you could choose who you'd wish to follow after the schism.
Hardest thing to in Skyrim in Dark Brotherhood questline is choising between sparing or killing Cicero.
Nah I always kill him
Nah I always
Nah I
Greatest psychopath sidekick
If the storyline lines up, I would love to see Nazir in The Elder Scrolls Vl.
For a second I thought you wrote Nazeem 😂🙈
Accept I would never let him in elder scrolls 6, or at least it wouldn’t be long before I hire the brotherhood to kill him
@@EmmaCosgrove123 Nazeem is too busy “visiting” the “Cloud District”.
@@MALWylie nazeem is visiting the dragonborns moms “cloud district”
2:20 i find it so cute how Drew says he thinks the Morag Tong will be in ES6 even though its likely gonna be in Hammerfell and then everyone giggles at him
the DB, especially in oblivion, was 100% my favorite. but never because it was edgy or anything or because i particularly liked the idea of being an assassin(Though I never minded that either), but rather because of just how oddly *nice* everyone there is. like, seemingly everyone in oblivion is rude as hell to the pc, but then the dark brotherhood is there and treats you so well and i just fcjhjjhg. it just gives off such paradoxically good vibes
One thing I was wondering, is there a listener in every sanctuary? I was wondering about that, because otherwise it would take a year to get an answer to the black sacrament if you are in another province than the sanctuary with the listener.
I think there is only one listener and he has the speakers who report to the sanctuaries its really not a good system
There is also that in lore the instant death from mehrunes razor might be intended to be more effective against people who are important
The first time I had an experience with the dark brotherhood was in the arena of oblivion. When you get to the end and have to kill the half vampire half orc champion, he is completely passive in the fight. If you complete the arena quest completely before joining the brotherhood, it becomes the next step off of the story of the arena. I loved it at the time as a way to intertie all of the game into itself. Even now I love how it scripted out that way making me feel like I had publicly displayed how unmerciful a killer my character was. I wish in that game there were more questlines that fed into the dark brotherhood like the arena felt like, rather than a generic series of events that happened to occur after killing literally anybody that was a neutrally dispositioned character.
The Mroang Tong and dark brotherhood are enemies if you complete the thieves guild and return it to its former glory you get a dark elf member that use to be a Mroang Tong and he says they rival the dark brotherhood
I like the edgeyness of the dark brotherhood. Sithis and the night mother are cool and intriguing.
It would be so awesome for bethesda to make an entire game based fully off of the dark brotherhood and being an assassin!! Like reform the shadowscales or the crimson scars are trying to be reformed!!!
While I don’t share in the worship of Sithis as the Dark Brotherhood does, _I do worship_ his/its soul, the one being who started it all, and the one being who will end it all, and allow for _true transcendence,_ beyond Aedra and Daedra. That being, the only god worthy of worship to me, is, of course, _the Missing God who goes by many names._
Some call him Sheor, and others call him Shezarr.
Some know him as Sep, and others know him as Shor.
Some understand him as Lorkhaj, The Tricky Cat. And others know him as an evil Trickster God, whose name feels like chewing broken glass when uttered, and thus shall not be named.
It matters not how you know him, but it _does matter_ that he exists because of, and thanks to the Dread Father, Sithis, the manifestation of the Void itself.
So while I do not _worship_ Sithis, I feel an eternal sense of gratitude to him/it for what he/it sparked in the Aurbis. And that is why, I will leave everyone with a hearty, full-throated, and proud, “HAIL SITHIS!” 💀
Imagine worshipping exclusively "big god corpse" & "literal nothingness" 😁
@@EinFelsbrocken lmao
31:27 Outfall? Lol I believe the word you were looking for was "fallout"
Kinda ironic.
Pushing the gargoyle on Vittoria Vici is meant to give you a bonus, but the scripting on the quest is bugged. IIRC the only way to really get it to work is sniping her with an arrow on the balcony during her heartwarming speech.
Oblivion Thieves guild was the best. Great moral side , and detailed main plot line. . Second DB Skyrim for the detailed plot line. The Companions were a good story line But it was a poor replacement for the fighter's guild that did exist in Skyrim in Daggerfall , & Oblivion .
You don't go to Skyrim in Daggerfall. Only High rock and Hammerfell.
To be fair, iirc, the Fighter's Guild doesn't exist in Skyrim's era. Or is that the Mage's Guild?
My favourite assassin's guild. Thanks guys.
Morag Tong: A mastery of murder and betrayal will help you get ahead in this cruel and indifferent world. Mephala has taught us that, while sometimes distasteful, deception and violence are a reality of the world and it is better to be the deceiver than the decieved.
Dark Brotherhood: mURdeR iS CoOl! HaIL sITHis!!!
I believe Scott was looking for “aftermath”?
Or....Fallout?
yes, a great podcast yet again!
I really love the rivalry between the dark brotherhood and the morag tong as it helps the emersion in the dragonborn dlc because if you are a brotherhood assassin when you're hired by the second of Raven Rock you have kinda a twisted glee about being an assassin hire too clear out a den of assassin's and if you're not well it as good of a reason as any other to join
Is there any way you can make a video/talk about the size of Tamriel as a continent, its geography, real world size, travel times via walking, horse, ship etc,, distance + real world comparisons and real world cultures?
Hey Fudge, are you guys continuing the greatest of all time series?
Still waiting for the the greatest High Elves and Dark Elves of all time video
The dark brotherhood was my fav quest line i did in skyrim
There should be a redguard assassin guild based on the hashashin of the Middle East
Oh yes my favorite in game group 🤗 was waiting for it so muchhh
you should try to do a podcast on the top best fiction from the books of the different games like "a dance of fire", "the real Barenziah", "the mirror" etc...
You should do a video on the orgins of trolls and their subtypes
Oh boy, here I go killing again!
This isnt my idea but It would be cool if you could side with the penitus oculatus and join the dark brotherhood as a spy it would make the speech skill line so much better. Now heres me adding to that idea, The story would include stuff like the DB becoming suspicious of you, having to frame one of the members, and even having to kill an innocent person to prove your loyalty to the DB (obviously there would be an option to fake the kill).
Could you do a video about what will happen when the dragonborn dies because with the amount of deadra who have the right to your soal when you die there would be a war of the gods over your soal
I just want Drew to read to me every night b4 bed
I liked The Dark Brotherhood in Skyrim but I absolutely loved them in Oblivion they were so cool in oblivion
I love this channel and ES is by far my favorite video game series, but I recently discovered the lore behind Cyberpunk 2077 and it's incredibly dense, I think many of us that are overhyped for Cyberpunk would love to see some analysis of the lore behind the upcoming game
in skyrim even if you kill the dark brotherhood (astrid/nazir/arbijorn etc) you never truly will cuz cicero is still with the nightmother, as long as the nightmother lives the brotherhood lives.
True you just kill the fake family along with Astrid
I think Cicero either hears Sithis or Mephala, or even The Night Mother but not as good as The Listener would hear her
Because in The Dark Brotherhood Questline in Skyrim, when Astrid asks us to kill Cícero, with we Summon The Dark Brotherhood Spirit that we gain, he talks that killing Cícero is not What The Dread Father want
Catch me anxiously waiting for Michael’s DB comparison video
I know many don't consider ESO canon (even though it is) there's so much lore on the brotherhood that you need to check out
- the main enemy in the dark brotherhood dlc who is called the black dragon is an ex brotherhood member who was a member of one of these squads that were like a death squad that was used to eliminate brotherhood cells that weren't performing to the correct standards
- the fact you are followed on the run up to kill the black dragon by a shadowy figure (Sithis) and when you finally kill the black dragon that skeletal figures come out of the ground to pull her soul into the void proving that Sithis is an actual being and not just someone mentioned in a book
Great episode! Also the dark brotherhood in skyrim does have bonuses; for example kill vici while shes addressing the crowd. I believe that's how u get the Lucian Lachance spell. also i think the morag tong will return in es6 because the thief in riften who was a former morag tong says the members are waiting to return.
Make the comparison video, Michael. :3 Oblivion will win, but it'll still be fun to take a look at both games' questlines.
My wish has been commanded!!
Still waiting on Fudgemuppet to do a podcast on the Asir. I know they will get tired of covering the same lore over and over eventually.
Fuck yeah!!!! Great way to start my Sunday
My first time playing the dark brotherhood was after I killed the grey prince in the arena it was odd to me because up until that point I had not killed anyone innocent and the grey prince had asked me to kill him because he was so ashamed of his vampire ancestry even tho my red guard characters as a good guy he found that he actually grew to enjoy killing the various targets the dark brotherhood set for him up until the dreaded dead drop quests that have you savagely kill all the high ranking dark brother hood members it was at this point that my character had enough of murder for hire and went back to killing those who deserved it only like bandits rouge wizards necromancers or anyone really unlucky enough to cross his path in the wild
Morag Tong: Kanly
Dark Brotherhood: Murder for hire