Yeah, Arctic had a similar issue with their AIO coolers getting prematurely gunked up and clogged. But they handled it in the best possible way they could. They alerted their customers, offered everybody free advanced RMAs, and even went so far as to give people the option to fix the issue themselves if they wanted. And in Steve's case of Gamers' Nexus, they reached out to him to let him know, and asked him to alert his viewers about the issue.
Not only is this what all companies should do when they find out a critical issue with their product, but it's also a very good "PR move" for the public's eye. So if you were to ask every person that heard of MSI & Arctic AiO issue "If MSI and Arctic were your only choice possible, which one would you buy from?" i can bet the majority would choose to buy Arctic over MSI.
I've been running Arctic fans for years (a couple of them are over 10 years old) and wouldn't hesitate to buy one of their AIOs for the very reason that they gave people the head's up that they messed up. I'd be running one right now, but the Corsair I picked up a couple years ago is still good... I think.
I was one of the people that had a liquid freezer impacted by that issue and Arctic sent me the service kit as requested, so would say excelent job by them. Is it me by the way or are European companies generally handling such issues better than companies based in Taiwan?
@@Angealll I don't think you're wrong. My dad spent some time working in Asia and he said the culture there around engineering, manufacturing and QC are completely messed up by Western standards.
I seen that as well, I have an MSi PC that I built myself. My first PC had an MSi B450 TOMAHAWK, and never had problems. So my new build expanded on MSi components! Still no issues yet...
Yeah, I have seen companies switching off all sorts of brands due to poor quality. Just an idea of all the bard hardware I have seen the last few years: Samsung had a pile of corrupted NVMEs Asus has several motherboards that exploded. Gigbyte power supplies. MSI AIOs Seems like hardware companies have become complacent.
@@deadbatt9321 Nothing beats gigabyte PSU problems , that shit was real FIRE HAZARD , i even bought one whit out knowing , after having some problems with it . I google/youtube it and i realized i was right .The one i had ,had fan failure .I did a power test and it got so hot nearly caught on fire . i was lucky enough that i bought it from big online store and was able to return it easy , went for swap and got corsair PSU . How gigabyte handle it for so many other people and how they got such a massive failure of product that can actually be deadly is the reason im never buying gigabyte again . O yeh they also had the highest failure in the 30xx cards .
I'm from the UK and I've just salvaged the 3 fans from my clogged AIO and wont buy from MSI again. At least Arctic sent out a kit for you, to repair the dodgy pump! Great video👍🏼
Lol same here. I've watched a video on how to self repair the AIO but I can't be bothered. I bought a used Noctua NH D15 for £75 and it does a great job.
AIOs are overkill in many cases. I went with a Coolermaster AIO for my last build. Didn't need it for my 5600x, but just wanted it for something different lol. Still working great over a 1 1/2 years later though. Go with a company that is known for cooling products primarily like Coolermaster.🎉
Same, I purchased the CORELIQUID 360R because it was the "cheap" option from a "reputable" brand like Greg eluded to. annnd it kicked the bucket within 3-4 months. Purchased Noctua NH-D15 right after and haven't looked back. Still have the V2 MSI sent me sitting in my closet; I cant sell it to someone else knowing its most likely going todo the same thing as the V1.
@@HardPumpers The same when I bought my first AIO, for my 3800X it was overkill but I liked it to try something different. My nowadays 7800X3D has a bit more need for cooling (but still believe it could be done by a good air cooler) so I bought a new AIO with the CPU. My previous AIO was a NZXT, my new one is NZXT again. As you say, buy equipment of a manufacturer which is known for quality.
I had the msi 240 in my wife’s pc. I noticed it definitely had some issues keeping it cool under very little to no load. Idle load was like 45c which is super high for our climate in my area. I went through the rma process and got a new one. Idles at around 28-30c now. The point I’m making is even if it hasn’t completely failed, just go ahead and redeem it for a new one
That's why I ALWAYS watch content from you, Jay, & Gamers Nexus. You all actually care about the consumers & are willing to call out the bad behavior by companies that are using bad business practices & treating people poorly.
I agree. I use two fans on my tower cooler and some months ago a fan died without me noticing. I noticed it while looking inside my computer because it was less noisy under load 😅
@@keonxd8918 Nah, Asus is fine. But he should definitely deny AMDip for making such awful hardware. It isn't Asus' fault AMD cpu's don't JUST work. When you have to lasso an entire O.S. just to get a system to run smoothly, and your chip blows up if you make a slight tweak to the voltage, that's just bad hardware. And not for enthusiasts. AMD is for people who can't manually tune a voltage curve or tweak a bios. They release cards like the "7900xtx" when it only has the hardware of an 80 class and highly inefficient. It's quite pathetic. Both of my 4090's are Asus Tuf and MSI Suprim X. Some of the nicest pieces of hardware and PCB's i've ever seen and tested. Quality. Yeah MSI's pump design is bad. It's also patented by the OEM they are in contract with so they couldn't change the design even if they wanted to. Even after the tech world is aware of this issue, people still buy them. I wouldn't. But their other products - chef's kiss. Now Gigabyte, whoever buys that trash is on them.
Well that's certainly a take. There's just one slight hitch: no motherboards other than Asus's are killing Ryzen chips-- and the way Asus handled it was straight garbage. AMD's chips DO "just work" on other motherboards. This ain't it, chief.
I have a msi 360 aio and had these issues as well. I was able to correct them, though, by rinsing out the unit with deionized water and refilling with a better quality coolant. Over a year later, there are no issues as of yet.this fix cost me a total of $40 and no rma wait time.
I had a Silverstone PF240 which failed in the exact same way (clogging) and used the exact same type of screws at the middle just like you showed here. I am fairly certain these manufacturers are using OEMs to make their AIOs precisely MSI, LianLi, Silverstone and maybe a few others and that's why they are having the common failure.
@@Stratos1988 Unfortunately, not yet. Have not been getting the time to go and submit the unit to the RMA center. It is still with me. But yeah, it performed great when it was functional. Had no issues cooling an i7 9700K at 5.1 GHz that consumes 220W on stress tests.
I live in Chile, bought the AIO in Amazon, MSI simply wash their hands with my problem, never wanted to really give me a solution. They wanted to send the product to the USA, with my own money, obviously i have no backup cpu cooler, so wasn't a real option. the shipping cost were high as the product itself, have no sense for me to take that option at that time. Finally i sell the pieces cheap to someone who knew the product was bad and wanted to open the radiator and pump, and play with it.
You’re now my favorite TH-camr. So much respect for you standing against a major company that refuses to treat everyone fairly and equally. At least someone is willing to stand up to them
The solution is quite simple. At the cooling system's assembly site, the cooling liquid should be filtered through a membrane or heat treated like milk and a replaceable inline filter of some sort (think automotive inline gas filter) should be installed between the radiator and the CPU pump. Correct me if I'm wrong but, I think to put it on the CPU pump inlet side would be better to avoid clogging of the pump. Also a better quality liquid with proper PH and antibacterial, anti-molding agent should be used. For those buying a kit, a seringe filter (installation) should be provided with an inline filter (daily operation) and a quality cooling liquid previously proper treated provided. Care to avoid contamination upon filling with proper instructions provided i.e. tube cleaning and other step involving the liquid manipulation.
I had previously had an MSI 240R and observed the high temps, ended up getting a Galahad 360 and a Lian-Li case and have been good ever since, I did attempt to get an RMA on the 240R and was told that my serial number was not in their allotment and was basically SOL. This was about a year ago, I still have my MSI Motherboard, but will probably never to back to that brand for the foreseeable future. Appreciate you keeping awareness of this issue.
I had a couple of MSI motherboards in a row fail catastrophically back in 2013/2014 and one of them took the CPU with it (VRM/caps/power delivery problem) so I just steer clear of most MSI stuff. Some of my ASUS and Gigabyte builds are reaching past 7 years without a problem now.
All brands kinda screw up in all ways just take a little bit from all and you'll be fine. in my case I went w a msi branded GPU but I still trust asus mobo see :)
I got a good deal on an MSI case with MSI motherboard and some memory, so i move components to build an "MSI build." I did buy the MAG CORELIQUID 240R because it was at a really good price when I purchased it. About the time of Greg's first video, my son and I started wondering about the AIO because we kept hearing "gurgling" sounds coming from the radiator/pump when we powered on the PC. It would last for a few seconds. We were monitoring temps and didn't notice any major temp differences. Then about 3 months ago, I started noticing that the temps were about 10-15 degrees hotter on low power use and my son stated that it rebooted on him a few times. I attempted the advance RMA process and was told that my S/N was not within the ones that qualified. I was able to RMA it but it took about 3 weeks to get a replacement. By then, I was rebuilding my PC as I was building a separate PC for my son, so I went with different parts and instead got an air cooler because of aesthetics in the new case. But I would have been upset if had to wait 3 weeks for a part that I needed.
3:15 I've been having that problem with about a year. I could go days or even weeks with my computer running perfectly but sometimes out of nowhere my computer will just hard reboot. It's not my motherboard or CPU cooler. Was using an MSI X470 gaming plus , AAMD R5 2600 and a 240mm AIO . The computer was randomly shutting down with this hardware. I upgraded my motherboard and CPU. First in November I upgraded my CPU to an R5 5600 X. There was work being done to my house so my computer was only used for a few minutes about four or five times after upgrading my CPU. But then when I did start gaming two days later the computer suddenly shut down and booted back into windows. That's happened a few times since February. So then three weeks ago I changed to a be quiet pure loop 120 with push pull fan configuration. And it was fine. Last week I upgraded my motherboard and everything was going beautifully smooth. I stress tested my CPU to make sure it wasn't overheating and it never went above 55c at 100% load noatter what test I threw at it using pbo voltage curve optimiser negative 24 it goes up to 4.85GHz. so I thought it was good. Then yesterday I loaded Warhammer dawn of war III andbless than five minutes in the computer suddenly shut down and booted back into windows. What's weird us it didn't show the P.O.S.T. screen. It just went directly to the windows loaf screen. I have theotherboard full screen logo upon boot disabled. So it's either my power supply which is a Corsair HX 760 80+ platinum or I'm getting power surges. So I'm going to ongey a surge protector and if that doesn't help I'll change my power supply.
I broke a motherboard and when I told MSI that it was my fault and not theirs they sent me a new one free of charge no hassle. I literally told them my board isn’t covered by your warranty and they didnt care, just fixed the problem.
Love you kid, I have an MSI 240. I check the temps every day, but don't have the cash for a new one. Thanks for letting us all know about this and I'm planning to change mine out as soon as I can.
Had the same issue with Seagate HDD. Those in USA - upon RMA start, Seagate would send replacements immediately - and once received by customer they could switch with broken model and return that. Don't know about other countries - but New Zealand... we had to send the models - using specific type of packaging - to Singapore, and then 4 - 6 weeks later - if lucky - they would return a refurbished item. This was for an issue they acknowledged... and item still easily within warranty period. Thus because I was not in USA - it was going to cost me nearly 50% of HDDs cost and a couple of months without my machine instead of being a couple of minute switch job at no monetary cost.
I crack-open all AIOs and replace "coolant" with good ole' fashioned distilled water, I flush them yearly and have not had an issue in years of doing this.
I have used MSI motherboards in my last 2 builds and can honestly say they have worked flawlessly so far but yeah I won't be touching an AIO from them. Every company has faulty products but it's how you treat the customer that matters and luckily I have not had the need for support from them so far, I actually moved to using them because I had so many isuses with ASUS motherboards. Honestly though I am an probably always going to stick to air cooling anyway, I prefer the more industrial look of a good air cooler and I always keep good temps.
My MSI AIO was not working correctly but wasn't in the "recall" but I did a RMA and they replaced it. There were some major issues with Enermax AIO that GamersNexus did a big expose on them a couple of years ago. If I have an issue with this AID, then, I'm going back to air cooling.
hey from morroco I wanted to express my sincerest gratitude for the amazing content you consistently share on your TH-cam channel. Your videos have been a constant source of inspiration and entertainment for me, and I truly appreciate the effort and passion you put into each one. Thank you for creating such valuable and enjoyable content
Had a 240R fail on me and your pressure got mine RMA'd as I wasn't covered under the first recall batch. I got a brand new in-box 240R now that I've never installed cus the Thermalright PA120 I replaced the failed AIO with is just so much more peace of mind.
Greg! Never feel bad for dumping on a company for their issues. That's the only real reason we see good change. That's how they get fixed. If ALL the feedback isn't negative when it needs to be. A Corp. will just poo poo an issue away mostly to save money. And every company has tried to do this in the past few years. MSI coolers, Asus motherboards, Gigabyte PSUs. Hell even Nvidia is gonna be hurting after this horribly planned and specced graphics card generation. Screw corporations.
November 2022 I ordered a MSI Katana 15.6” gaming notebook (144Hz 1920x1080 i9-12900H RTX 3070 Ti 16GB RAM 1TB SSD) from Walmart and when it arrived, it wouldn’t accept the barrel plug from the power supply so I could charge it to use, and of course it was completely DOA, which I’ve never seen before since usually there’s enough juice to boot. Upon a close inspection, I saw the port was badly misaligned and there wasn’t anything I could do to correct the issue so I decided returning it was my only option. The lack of quality control convinced me to avoid MSI altogether, although I still have their Godlike MB but any OC whatsoever crashes the rig, even XMP. Even when following the clear instructions from buildzoid over at Actually Hardcore Overclocking. My son has a MSI Tomahawk WiFi without any issues but when it’s time for the next upgrade, I hope we can find better options than ASUS and MSI.
Interesting video Greg. I am a die-hard air cooler fan. So I have had no issues with AIOs, but I do have an MSI motherboard. Works fine, but I had issues with their RGB software causing issues with other software. When I contacted MSI, their helpdesk was not the greatest. I often felt that I was talking to a different person each time. They seemed to want to blame the user, and insisted that the issue required a complete re-installation of the PC. I did eventually solve my issue, which was a software conflict between their RGB software and other software. I resolved it when I switched to Lian Li fans, and the Lian Li connect software. There can always be problems, but how companies deal with customers is crucial. I will avoid MSI in the future if I can, simply because of this lack of good customer service.
I have a MSI gpu and had the same issue with MSI RGB software conflicting with other software. I switched to Open rgb for the gpu and solved it. It's possible that new versions of MSI RGB software have solved the problem, but I don't know and I'm fine in this way.
Air cooling is the way to go for 90% of CPU’s on the market and typically air cooled systems have an easy fix if it does fail-just a fan replacement or re-pasting. LTT had a good video of what CPU’s really need water cooling.
Unfortunately, the 13700k and 13900k DO really need the total throughput of large-radiator AIO solutions in extended all-core workloads. And for people who own those, they shouldn't have to worry about the AIO market being some minefield of sub-1-year lifetimes of parts. I have a 13700k, and it's just fine while gaming with discord and a video running in a browser on separate monitors. Only pulls 90-105W. But if I'm working with media software and rendering huge projects, I need to be able to deal with 200W and at that point most air coolers are reaching the upper part of their thermal limits while a good 360mm+ AIO isn't breaking a sweat.
literally a couple days ago my friend was building an AIO build and I was like dont buy the MSI ones they were known to have some, I guess, mid term? issues, then low-and-behold this video releases and I find that it's still going on
From the uk, I have a Msi build, I’m on my 3rd cooler with in 14 months, the 2nd one I bought from Amazon uk, thankfully they are fine with warranty and sent it back and got a replacement no questions asked.
It''s Apaltek Manufactured and every single AIO ever recalled has been an apaltek model with the pump inside the rad just like this one. The fractal Lumen, the Enermax LiqMax, The NZXT M22, the list goes on and on. I agree it should not be the pump in the radiator causing the issue, but those are always the models that are affected. It really sucks since those are one of the very few AIOs sold where you can mount the radiator on the bottom of the case. Deepcool or Thermalright are the way to go for value/budget AIOs that offer superior performance at a cheaper price than pretty much anything else out there. I have been using Deepcool in my personal rigs forever now and their customer service is top notch. The LT720 360mm AIO that can cool 315w CPUs is only $140 and has a beautiful block or the 240mm LT520 can cool 280w for $110 here in the USA. I just ordered a bunch of Thermalright Frozen Notte 240s and 360s for customer builds (these also use a pump on the tubing close to the rad so the rad can be mounted at the bottom of the case) for $50 and $70 respectively. The 360 model has been shown in the very, very few reviews I can find to cool a 13700k up to 310w. Very anxious to check out the 240 myself to see what it can do, which I'm about to install one on a 7600x (not the most demanding CPU, I know) this week and specifically to mount the rad on the bottom of a case. The Frozen Magic is a very nice looking AIO, especially in white. As such, it usually sells more around the $100 range and is hard to find in stock, especially in black.
Thanks Greg, that's why i don't buy MSI products anymore, since they don't want to replace my MSI AIO that making a funny noise, i replaced it with CORSAIR AIO, and now there's no more funny noise. they don't want to replace my MSI AIO. it's their lost... thank you so much Greg, i am learning a lot from you every day. this is tolitzbernal watching from Northern California. GOD BLESS YOU MORE...
Romania here, had a client with a 360 MSI AIO about 2 months ago (the same model as the original Fix Or Flop video) he bought the V2 version to replace his defective unit and he didn't leave his bad unit with us, I think he hoped to RMA it - so I could not get inside to check if it was clogged
I built a mostly MSI PC last July and that includes a 360R V2. It's worked fine so far, and I really like the look of it with all the other MSI parts, but I've seen a number of reviews say that they started having issues around the 1-year mark so I'm keeping an eye on my CPU temps. If I could go back, I definitely would have gone with a different AIO and case.
I was considering going from air cooling my cpu to water cooling it, But after this news i am reconsidering and will just leave the stock cooler on it.
A video series on construction would've been cool to watch. I've always enjoyed Paul from Paul's Hardware's building series and it would've been cool to see the difference between where he lives and Florida.
yep here in Philippines people sell this msi used but not indicate it that it has issues from the factory hopefully people will be aware and til to this date some people still buying this msi aio :(
Mine’s been sent back to MSI since May 10th. CPU was reaching 90 celsius whilst IDLE. Still no news from MSI to this day. The AIO (Iirc Magsafe coreliquid 240r) was about 2.5yrs old (under 3y warranty period)
You've probably seen those screws before, they are used on basically all bathroom partitions. Also this is a coolant issue. If you ever drain a real old water heater you'll see it. As the fluid is heated up the minerals in the coolant gather and solidify.
The computer I'm writing this on I built about 11 years ago specifically to watch TV with (cut the cable). It's used a LOT, runs great, and all I've had to do with the cooler is clean the dust out a few times. Liquid cooling is a neat idea, and some of the setups are amazing (not AIOs), but if you want the computer to just work with minimal maintenance air cooling can't be beat.
By adding a replaceable filter in a loop it will likely eliminate issues and liability. If you don't check and or replace your filter in your loop that's on 'you' not on the manufacturer.
i want to thank you after watching your videos i worked out that it was my AIO that as the issue (idle at 100) and i was made aware of the recall..... as of right now im getting a replacement sent to me and im not 100 GBP out of pocket for a replacement... .THANK YOU! was so disheartened when my first replacement PC in over a decade was suffering from such an issue.
I can almost guarantee that it's a MAG 240R or 360R version 1. MSI solved the issue with the Version 2. The biggest problem now is that retailers are still selling the V1. If your looking to buy one, Make sure it has V2 at the end of the name. As for the V1, Its a fairly simple fix. Remove the hoses from the rad (cut the rubber band at the end and with a little work they will pull off). Remove the distro plate and rubber diverter, and clean the fins. Remove the pump from the rad and flush the rad both forward and backward. reassemble everything. Remove the rubber plug from the fill hole and the screw in plug. Refill with a quality water cooling fluid making sure you get all the air out. Mine clogged after 8 months. After I cleaned it, It has been running perfect for well over 1 1/2 yrs.
Those screws are the same type you find in public bathroom stalls, only much smaller. I think they used them as a planned obsolescence attempt to prevent the "average" user from digging into the guts of the pump. A typical user would normally address it in two ways. Either to see the screws, realize there's no readily available tool to remove them, and leave it alone, or they'd try to remove them anyway, damage the plate, and have to buy a new AIO. The word proprietary is a curse word to me. The only reason for this behavior is them keeping customers from performing routine maintenance on the parts. They're taking a gamble because they want their product to last long enough so the customer doesn't feel ripped off, but not long enough so people don't have to buy them often. They're trading making good, quality products that should sell themselves through tech advancements, and longevity for "good enough" products so they can keep selling without being overly concerned with quality. The argument of "all companies do this" is a non-argument. Just because they do it doesn't make it right. Things need to seriously change because at this point I feel like I can't trust any of them, and will just stop buying things like this. This is also the reason I refuse to buy anything liquid cool. I know everybody's situations are different, and there's definitely a purpose for liquid cooled, but air cooled just works, and is much easier to not only assess, but repair. If a fan breaks you can visibly see, or hear it, and replace it without buying an entirely new cooling system.
Many things could be the culprit but the most common is mixed medals that could come from the block or the pump or the rad. Next thing could be the liquid degradation.
I had an ek aio that had failed. Due to them no longer selling the aio I had they offered to upgrade or refund me with no request to return the aio. We need more companies like EK!
I really appreciate you standing up for the people that don’t have a voice. Even if it’s for something as small as a pc part. If this is not corrected I will not be purchasing MSI products from this point on.
I live in Canada. For the longest time my serial number wasn't accepted. Then when it was finally accepted on the recall page. I tried to do an RMA 4-6 months ago. But they wouldn't do an Advanced RMA. I didn't want to be without my computer. So I cancelled my RMA. I'm just going to use until it finally dies and then purchase something better and never buy an MSI Product again. I've been using my MSI MAG Core Liquid 360R since January 2022.
I yeeted my AOI after having such a headache with the RMA process here in Netherlands. Our retailer was having so much RMAs, that they demanded you to send it directly to MSI, and it took MSI so long to respond to my RMA request, that I already had thrown it out, and just bought a Tower Cooler from Noctua...
Had a friends Lian li Cooler break recently Throttleing his 5950x to 110°C Went to buy a replacement cooler not thinking he could RMA it and then A article pops up 2 days later with hundreds of people complaining about there AIO not working anymore He bought a Noctua Air cooler D15 and he said Might as well do the RMA still since his cooler was bought in that time frame Lian li stated but they asked him for pictures to prove it was over heating He would only be able to have his PC on for 20 secs before it Turned off due to heat How the he'll is he gonna record Temps during Idle and Useage.... he tossed it in the trash and won't buy from lian li no more He hated buying Premo shit but noctua is the way
Just because something is "nothing new", does not make it ok. If something wrong is the "norm", speaking up, regardless of what it is, should be the go-to answer! Go you Mr. Salazar for speaking up.
Arctic also had this issue around the same time, they addressed it VERY quickly. Think I only had a stock cooler in my system for 5 days before getting a replacement. They also asked me to just recycle the old defective AIO
NEVER toss your old air-cooler, I've water-cooled for many years now and personally have never needed my backup air cooler...but I feel great just knowing it's there.
I had an issue with MSI as well, in regards with a monitor that started to have severe light bleeding after only few months of purchase. After sending it to a repair shop, they sent it back as an acceptable issue if its not fully visible in a well lit environment. Upon reaching MSI, they confirmed that MSI consider the fault as acceptable and refused the repair or replacement. The monitor itself is the model Optix MAG322CQR and it was not cheap. Not buying any MSI products in the future
I have an MSI Graphics Card, an MSI GTX 1650 4GT LP, which I ordered in 2020. The fans on this 1650 died within warranty and I went to RMA it late 2020 and was strung along by their support staff UNTIL the warranty period expired, at which point I was completely ghosted by them. I've tried contacting them 3 times over the couple years since, where they take my problem seriously until the communication ends, and I promptly never hear anything back again, ever. I will never buy an MSI anything ever again. I've had to keep this 1650 working by buying third-party fans on eBay, which also die fairly often sadly, but at the moment I can't afford a rig upgrade, so I'll just keep dealing with it.
I always feel good about companies that address an issue with their product proactively. I will never begrudge a company for a failure if they own it and take steps to rectify said issue. If they deny responsibility or actively deny legitimate warranty claims, I will NEVER buy anything from them again and will actively recommend against buying their products. Just do right by your customers.
I have always used air. Liquid cooling certainly has its visual allure...but I'd rather not deal with the hassle. Been using a PCCooler "GameIce" GI-D66A with 240W TDP capacity. A 6 pipe x 6mm Shrouded air cooler with push-pull dual fans and RGB (~$70). Has done the job, from E5-1680V2 (8C/16T; OC'd to 4.5Ghz) on X79 to E5-2696V3 (18C/36T; all core turbo-unlocked) on X99. This cooler has been in operation for over 5 years, without issue. Leaks, clogs, and pump failures are things that I'd rather not factor into the risk of ownership.
"A lot of companies do that this is nothing new." Uhm no, we really must not give companies even a single ounce of leeway with things like this. And like Steve from GN said, people/companies make mistakes, however the important part is how you deal with them. If they handle them this badly like ASUS and MSI are doing they really must not be given leeway.
I have only had air cooled computers and haven't had any cooling issues. I don't think I will ever consider liquid cooling. I agree with your stand on MSI!
Enermax, Arctic, and MSi's failures in this area have sworn me off of anything but a custom loop if I'm water cooling. I don't run my PCs hard anymore, other than the occasional game or code compile at this point, and even that's not really running it hard to be honest. I'm back to air cooling and undervolting both CPU and GPU, and I have empathy for anyone who might need to watercool at this point but don't have the skills or patience to build and maintain a loop.
In Australia, under Consumer Protection Law, we're entitled to claim a refund or replacement for defective products above and beyond any warranty offered by the manufacturer. So "RMA'ing" the AIO here should be pretty painless.
Over here in Europe we have those screws on a more regular base (only at a bigger size); they are so called "anti-theft-screws". Normally they are used for items which shouldn't be unscrewed by anyone. Like security cameras, wall mounted clamps for locking a bike, some kind of hinges etc.. But I believe they were more common like 25 years ago than nowadays.
I live an Bangladesh and i had an msi 360mm aio. After 7 month it broke down and i wanted to enter advanced rma process but to my disappointment it didn't apply for my country. So i had to go through the shop to rma the process and even after 2 months no answer from them the shop owner said. Normally the shop takes 20 days at best rma but msi didn't have any aio do they told them to wait until they can send one. After that i bought a corsair aio after adjusting my money with what i had bought the msi one for.
Had the mag 240 with this issue in South Korea . No advanced rma. Had to phone the distributor of MSI here. Thankfully service is quite speedy here. Sent it and the next day they contacted me to say they'll overnight a replacement
I got a couple of those for cheap since people didn't know how to fix them and the AIOs were out of warranty, deep cleaned them with different chemicals and hot water and fused them together (one of the pumps was opened by the guy who sold it to me and ripped the cables from it rip.) and it works pretty fine, semi-custom water cooling for 65 euros. Still what pissed me off was that the serial number didn't even qualify and I took some photos of the block when I opened it, it doesn't qualify MSI huh? Too bad, too bad indeed
I upgraded from a Corsair 240mm AIO to an MSI 360mm AIO when I swapped over to a Z490 10700k based system, and it is the reason why I used a custom loop now. I liked MSI's products but with the way they conduct themselves, I might be swapping to Sapphire or Powercolor for my graphics cards and EVGA for my motherboards. That sucks because I have had no issues with other MSI products.
The funny thing is fractal used the same OEM for there aio that MSI did and when Fractal found this issue there awnser was apply for the RMA and they shipped the replacement out without u even having to send the old one in no questions asked all u had to do was provide the S/N and invoice. Fractal did this for all countries not just Canada and the US.
Im from the Phils, before i encountered defective MSI motherboard. I forgot the model code. I like it because it is color white. After 2 months used, my PC is not turning on. Luckily, I still have my old motherboard that was replaced. I swap it in with same other components. And it boot fine. So it is confirmed the motherboard the issue. I returned it to the seller and they said they dont have replacement for same board so they ask mo to choose other board from their product list then i choose Asus instead. It means the seller (3rd party) can easily replace or swap if confirmed defective within warranty period. So i dont know why they will reject that RMA. Above warranty period is different discussion of course
Hell of a coincidence. I have a CoreLiquid 240R and it died about 2 weeks ago. I bought it a couple of years ago but had about 10 months of consistant use before it shat itself.
My career is not based in the tech space, but I've had to deal with corporate ownership a lot in my 20 years in my field. This is the corporate mindset at work and it's always pure cancer. They only care about reputation as something they can leverage for profit until they burn all the goodwill associated with a brand then they move on to the next one, or "re-brand". It's always a race to the bottom to see how many corners they can cut to maximize profit until it blows up in their face.
I gave up and bought new ones from a different brand. I live in the US and I had 2 builds with those 360Rs in them that failed within a few days of each other. MSI refused to RMA them because its serial was not listed as one of those affected.
They hosed me on a $20 rebate for a graphics card recently. They have an entire online rebate fill-in website for ease and then they snail-mailed me it was rejected. I could not bother to hassle myself further just decided to never purchase MSI again that day.
this is why I'm giving real thought to swapping from the msi board I'm putting in my new rig. I'd rather be forced into buying usb port cards than support a company that..isn't even TRYING to fix the problem.
Yeah, Arctic had a similar issue with their AIO coolers getting prematurely gunked up and clogged. But they handled it in the best possible way they could. They alerted their customers, offered everybody free advanced RMAs, and even went so far as to give people the option to fix the issue themselves if they wanted. And in Steve's case of Gamers' Nexus, they reached out to him to let him know, and asked him to alert his viewers about the issue.
Not only is this what all companies should do when they find out a critical issue with their product, but it's also a very good "PR move" for the public's eye.
So if you were to ask every person that heard of MSI & Arctic AiO issue "If MSI and Arctic were your only choice possible, which one would you buy from?" i can bet the majority would choose to buy Arctic over MSI.
I watched that gamer’s nexus video which led to me deciding to buy one of their aio to cool my 5800x3d
I've been running Arctic fans for years (a couple of them are over 10 years old) and wouldn't hesitate to buy one of their AIOs for the very reason that they gave people the head's up that they messed up. I'd be running one right now, but the Corsair I picked up a couple years ago is still good... I think.
I was one of the people that had a liquid freezer impacted by that issue and Arctic sent me the service kit as requested, so would say excelent job by them. Is it me by the way or are European companies generally handling such issues better than companies based in Taiwan?
@@Angealll I don't think you're wrong. My dad spent some time working in Asia and he said the culture there around engineering, manufacturing and QC are completely messed up by Western standards.
GamerTechToronto was using these in every build they did for awhile. They said the RMA rate was so high they swapped to other brands.
I seen that as well, I have an MSi PC that I built myself. My first PC had an MSi B450 TOMAHAWK, and never had problems. So my new build expanded on MSi components!
Still no issues yet...
GamerTechToronto 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Ow shoot I just bought an MSI 7900 xt from Ontario. Pray for me. 🙏
Yeah, I have seen companies switching off all sorts of brands due to poor quality.
Just an idea of all the bard hardware I have seen the last few years:
Samsung had a pile of corrupted NVMEs
Asus has several motherboards that exploded.
Gigbyte power supplies.
MSI AIOs
Seems like hardware companies have become complacent.
@@deadbatt9321 Nothing beats gigabyte PSU problems , that shit was real FIRE HAZARD , i even bought one whit out knowing , after having some problems with it . I google/youtube it and i realized i was right .The one i had ,had fan failure .I did a power test and it got so hot nearly caught on fire . i was lucky enough that i bought it from big online store and was able to return it easy , went for swap and got corsair PSU . How gigabyte handle it for so many other people and how they got such a massive failure of product that can actually be deadly is the reason im never buying gigabyte again . O yeh they also had the highest failure in the 30xx cards .
I'm from the UK and I've just salvaged the 3 fans from my clogged AIO and wont buy from MSI again. At least Arctic sent out a kit for you, to repair the dodgy pump! Great video👍🏼
Lol same here. I've watched a video on how to self repair the AIO but I can't be bothered. I bought a used Noctua NH D15 for £75 and it does a great job.
It just confirmed my long belief that air cooling was a better and safer option. I went back to air and I'm not likely to change that again. lol.
Yep. If your setup or cpu doesn't require the additional cooling of liquid, no need for it.
AIOs are overkill in many cases. I went with a Coolermaster AIO for my last build. Didn't need it for my 5600x, but just wanted it for something different lol. Still working great over a 1 1/2 years later though. Go with a company that is known for cooling products primarily like Coolermaster.🎉
Same, I purchased the CORELIQUID 360R because it was the "cheap" option from a "reputable" brand like Greg eluded to. annnd it kicked the bucket within 3-4 months.
Purchased Noctua NH-D15 right after and haven't looked back.
Still have the V2 MSI sent me sitting in my closet; I cant sell it to someone else knowing its most likely going todo the same thing as the V1.
I have been using air cooling since house pc's where a thing lol some of my older systems don't even need cooling
@@HardPumpers The same when I bought my first AIO, for my 3800X it was overkill but I liked it to try something different. My nowadays 7800X3D has a bit more need for cooling (but still believe it could be done by a good air cooler) so I bought a new AIO with the CPU. My previous AIO was a NZXT, my new one is NZXT again. As you say, buy equipment of a manufacturer which is known for quality.
I had the msi 240 in my wife’s pc. I noticed it definitely had some issues keeping it cool under very little to no load. Idle load was like 45c which is super high for our climate in my area. I went through the rma process and got a new one. Idles at around 28-30c now. The point I’m making is even if it hasn’t completely failed, just go ahead and redeem it for a new one
That's why I ALWAYS watch content from you, Jay, & Gamers Nexus.
You all actually care about the consumers & are willing to call out the bad behavior by companies that are using bad business practices & treating people poorly.
In case anyone is interested, they are called Clutch Head screws.
Can't go wrong with the good old tower cooler, not much to go wrong with a big slab of metal with a fan. Very easy to maintain and fix.
I agree. I use two fans on my tower cooler and some months ago a fan died without me noticing. I noticed it while looking inside my computer because it was less noisy under load 😅
Greg, we appreciate your integrity to deny MSI projects even when it hurts your pocket. Youre an absolute boss. 🤟
Sometimes we gotta do what we gotta do even if it can potentially hurt our pockets
If he's gonna deny using MSI products in the future, he should do the same for Asus and Gigabyte as well.
@@craig9365 "maybe" their PSUs had some issues
@@keonxd8918 Nah, Asus is fine. But he should definitely deny AMDip for making such awful hardware. It isn't Asus' fault AMD cpu's don't JUST work. When you have to lasso an entire O.S. just to get a system to run smoothly, and your chip blows up if you make a slight tweak to the voltage, that's just bad hardware. And not for enthusiasts. AMD is for people who can't manually tune a voltage curve or tweak a bios. They release cards like the "7900xtx" when it only has the hardware of an 80 class and highly inefficient. It's quite pathetic. Both of my 4090's are Asus Tuf and MSI Suprim X. Some of the nicest pieces of hardware and PCB's i've ever seen and tested. Quality. Yeah MSI's pump design is bad. It's also patented by the OEM they are in contract with so they couldn't change the design even if they wanted to. Even after the tech world is aware of this issue, people still buy them. I wouldn't. But their other products - chef's kiss. Now Gigabyte, whoever buys that trash is on them.
Well that's certainly a take. There's just one slight hitch: no motherboards other than Asus's are killing Ryzen chips-- and the way Asus handled it was straight garbage. AMD's chips DO "just work" on other motherboards. This ain't it, chief.
This channel is growing on me, there's a gentleness and honesty about it.
I have a msi 360 aio and had these issues as well. I was able to correct them, though, by rinsing out the unit with deionized water and refilling with a better quality coolant. Over a year later, there are no issues as of yet.this fix cost me a total of $40 and no rma wait time.
Literally just got an RMA on their AIO 🙄🙄😠😠It's my 4th one from them...
I had a Silverstone PF240 which failed in the exact same way (clogging) and used the exact same type of screws at the middle just like you showed here.
I am fairly certain these manufacturers are using OEMs to make their AIOs precisely MSI, LianLi, Silverstone and maybe a few others and that's why they are having the common failure.
You can add Fractal to that list, I had one of their 280 AOIs that suffered the same failure.
Have you RMA'd your unit ? I hold Silverstone in high regard and am curious how did they handle this kind of an issue.
@@Stratos1988 Unfortunately, not yet. Have not been getting the time to go and submit the unit to the RMA center. It is still with me.
But yeah, it performed great when it was functional. Had no issues cooling an i7 9700K at 5.1 GHz that consumes 220W on stress tests.
Local distributor companies should exist supporting the products service/RMA to ease customers rather than going direct to HQ.
I live in Chile, bought the AIO in Amazon, MSI simply wash their hands with my problem, never wanted to really give me a solution.
They wanted to send the product to the USA, with my own money, obviously i have no backup cpu cooler, so wasn't a real option.
the shipping cost were high as the product itself, have no sense for me to take that option at that time.
Finally i sell the pieces cheap to someone who knew the product was bad and wanted to open the radiator and pump, and play with it.
You’re now my favorite TH-camr. So much respect for you standing against a major company that refuses to treat everyone fairly and equally. At least someone is willing to stand up to them
The solution is quite simple.
At the cooling system's assembly site, the cooling liquid should be filtered through a membrane or heat treated like milk and a replaceable inline filter of some sort (think automotive inline gas filter) should be installed between the radiator and the CPU pump. Correct me if I'm wrong but, I think to put it on the CPU pump inlet side would be better to avoid clogging of the pump. Also a better quality liquid with proper PH and antibacterial, anti-molding agent should be used.
For those buying a kit, a seringe filter (installation) should be provided with an inline filter (daily operation) and a quality cooling liquid previously proper treated provided. Care to avoid contamination upon filling with proper instructions provided i.e. tube cleaning and other step involving the liquid manipulation.
Hey man, thank you for keeping track on this issue, this happened to me. Much respect on your stance. Great content as always. Cheers!
I live in Asia, I never had any issue with any of my hardwares and this got me thinking if warranty really means anything from where I live.
I had previously had an MSI 240R and observed the high temps, ended up getting a Galahad 360 and a Lian-Li case and have been good ever since, I did attempt to get an RMA on the 240R and was told that my serial number was not in their allotment and was basically SOL. This was about a year ago, I still have my MSI Motherboard, but will probably never to back to that brand for the foreseeable future. Appreciate you keeping awareness of this issue.
I had a couple of MSI motherboards in a row fail catastrophically back in 2013/2014 and one of them took the CPU with it (VRM/caps/power delivery problem) so I just steer clear of most MSI stuff. Some of my ASUS and Gigabyte builds are reaching past 7 years without a problem now.
All brands kinda screw up in all ways just take a little bit from all and you'll be fine. in my case I went w a msi branded GPU but I still trust asus mobo see :)
I got a good deal on an MSI case with MSI motherboard and some memory, so i move components to build an "MSI build." I did buy the MAG CORELIQUID 240R because it was at a really good price when I purchased it. About the time of Greg's first video, my son and I started wondering about the AIO because we kept hearing "gurgling" sounds coming from the radiator/pump when we powered on the PC. It would last for a few seconds. We were monitoring temps and didn't notice any major temp differences. Then about 3 months ago, I started noticing that the temps were about 10-15 degrees hotter on low power use and my son stated that it rebooted on him a few times. I attempted the advance RMA process and was told that my S/N was not within the ones that qualified. I was able to RMA it but it took about 3 weeks to get a replacement. By then, I was rebuilding my PC as I was building a separate PC for my son, so I went with different parts and instead got an air cooler because of aesthetics in the new case. But I would have been upset if had to wait 3 weeks for a part that I needed.
3:15 I've been having that problem with about a year. I could go days or even weeks with my computer running perfectly but sometimes out of nowhere my computer will just hard reboot.
It's not my motherboard or CPU cooler. Was using an MSI X470 gaming plus , AAMD R5 2600 and a 240mm AIO . The computer was randomly shutting down with this hardware.
I upgraded my motherboard and CPU. First in November I upgraded my CPU to an R5 5600 X. There was work being done to my house so my computer was only used for a few minutes about four or five times after upgrading my CPU. But then when I did start gaming two days later the computer suddenly shut down and booted back into windows. That's happened a few times since February.
So then three weeks ago I changed to a be quiet pure loop 120 with push pull fan configuration. And it was fine.
Last week I upgraded my motherboard and everything was going beautifully smooth. I stress tested my CPU to make sure it wasn't overheating and it never went above 55c at 100% load noatter what test I threw at it using pbo voltage curve optimiser negative 24 it goes up to 4.85GHz. so I thought it was good.
Then yesterday I loaded Warhammer dawn of war III andbless than five minutes in the computer suddenly shut down and booted back into windows. What's weird us it didn't show the P.O.S.T. screen. It just went directly to the windows loaf screen. I have theotherboard full screen logo upon boot disabled.
So it's either my power supply which is a Corsair HX 760 80+ platinum or I'm getting power surges. So I'm going to ongey a surge protector and if that doesn't help I'll change my power supply.
I broke a motherboard and when I told MSI that it was my fault and not theirs they sent me a new one free of charge no hassle. I literally told them my board isn’t covered by your warranty and they didnt care, just fixed the problem.
Love you kid, I have an MSI 240. I check the temps every day, but don't have the cash for a new one. Thanks for letting us all know about this and I'm planning to change mine out as soon as I can.
Had the same issue with Seagate HDD. Those in USA - upon RMA start, Seagate would send replacements immediately - and once received by customer they could switch with broken model and return that. Don't know about other countries - but New Zealand... we had to send the models - using specific type of packaging - to Singapore, and then 4 - 6 weeks later - if lucky - they would return a refurbished item. This was for an issue they acknowledged... and item still easily within warranty period.
Thus because I was not in USA - it was going to cost me nearly 50% of HDDs cost and a couple of months without my machine instead of being a couple of minute switch job at no monetary cost.
I crack-open all AIOs and replace "coolant" with good ole' fashioned distilled water, I flush them yearly and have not had an issue in years of doing this.
I am with you Greg, MSI and Asus need to do better with customer service and their products!
I have used MSI motherboards in my last 2 builds and can honestly say they have worked flawlessly so far but yeah I won't be touching an AIO from them. Every company has faulty products but it's how you treat the customer that matters and luckily I have not had the need for support from them so far, I actually moved to using them because I had so many isuses with ASUS motherboards. Honestly though I am an probably always going to stick to air cooling anyway, I prefer the more industrial look of a good air cooler and I always keep good temps.
My MSI AIO was not working correctly but wasn't in the "recall" but I did a RMA and they replaced it. There were some major issues with Enermax AIO that GamersNexus did a big expose on them a couple of years ago. If I have an issue with this AID, then, I'm going back to air cooling.
hey from morroco I wanted to express my sincerest gratitude for the amazing content you consistently share on your TH-cam channel. Your videos have been a constant source of inspiration and entertainment for me, and I truly appreciate the effort and passion you put into each one. Thank you for creating such valuable and enjoyable content
Had a 240R fail on me and your pressure got mine RMA'd as I wasn't covered under the first recall batch. I got a brand new in-box 240R now that I've never installed cus the Thermalright PA120 I replaced the failed AIO with is just so much more peace of mind.
Greg! Never feel bad for dumping on a company for their issues. That's the only real reason we see good change. That's how they get fixed. If ALL the feedback isn't negative when it needs to be. A Corp. will just poo poo an issue away mostly to save money. And every company has tried to do this in the past few years. MSI coolers, Asus motherboards, Gigabyte PSUs. Hell even Nvidia is gonna be hurting after this horribly planned and specced graphics card generation. Screw corporations.
November 2022 I ordered a MSI Katana 15.6” gaming notebook (144Hz 1920x1080 i9-12900H RTX 3070 Ti 16GB RAM 1TB SSD) from Walmart and when it arrived, it wouldn’t accept the barrel plug from the power supply so I could charge it to use, and of course it was completely DOA, which I’ve never seen before since usually there’s enough juice to boot. Upon a close inspection, I saw the port was badly misaligned and there wasn’t anything I could do to correct the issue so I decided returning it was my only option.
The lack of quality control convinced me to avoid MSI altogether, although I still have their Godlike MB but any OC whatsoever crashes the rig, even XMP.
Even when following the clear instructions from buildzoid over at Actually Hardcore Overclocking. My son has a MSI Tomahawk WiFi without any issues but when it’s time for the next upgrade, I hope we can find better options than ASUS and MSI.
Interesting video Greg. I am a die-hard air cooler fan. So I have had no issues with AIOs, but I do have an MSI motherboard. Works fine, but I had issues with their RGB software causing issues with other software. When I contacted MSI, their helpdesk was not the greatest. I often felt that I was talking to a different person each time. They seemed to want to blame the user, and insisted that the issue required a complete re-installation of the PC.
I did eventually solve my issue, which was a software conflict between their RGB software and other software. I resolved it when I switched to Lian Li fans, and the Lian Li connect software.
There can always be problems, but how companies deal with customers is crucial. I will avoid MSI in the future if I can, simply because of this lack of good customer service.
I have a MSI gpu and had the same issue with MSI RGB software conflicting with other software. I switched to Open rgb for the gpu and solved it. It's possible that new versions of MSI RGB software have solved the problem, but I don't know and I'm fine in this way.
Air cooling is the way to go for 90% of CPU’s on the market and typically air cooled systems have an easy fix if it does fail-just a fan replacement or re-pasting. LTT had a good video of what CPU’s really need water cooling.
Unfortunately, the 13700k and 13900k DO really need the total throughput of large-radiator AIO solutions in extended all-core workloads. And for people who own those, they shouldn't have to worry about the AIO market being some minefield of sub-1-year lifetimes of parts.
I have a 13700k, and it's just fine while gaming with discord and a video running in a browser on separate monitors. Only pulls 90-105W. But if I'm working with media software and rendering huge projects, I need to be able to deal with 200W and at that point most air coolers are reaching the upper part of their thermal limits while a good 360mm+ AIO isn't breaking a sweat.
literally a couple days ago my friend was building an AIO build and I was like dont buy the MSI ones they were known to have some, I guess, mid term? issues, then low-and-behold this video releases and I find that it's still going on
From the uk, I have a Msi build, I’m on my 3rd cooler with in 14 months, the 2nd one I bought from Amazon uk, thankfully they are fine with warranty and sent it back and got a replacement no questions asked.
It''s Apaltek Manufactured and every single AIO ever recalled has been an apaltek model with the pump inside the rad just like this one. The fractal Lumen, the Enermax LiqMax, The NZXT M22, the list goes on and on. I agree it should not be the pump in the radiator causing the issue, but those are always the models that are affected. It really sucks since those are one of the very few AIOs sold where you can mount the radiator on the bottom of the case.
Deepcool or Thermalright are the way to go for value/budget AIOs that offer superior performance at a cheaper price than pretty much anything else out there. I have been using Deepcool in my personal rigs forever now and their customer service is top notch. The LT720 360mm AIO that can cool 315w CPUs is only $140 and has a beautiful block or the 240mm LT520 can cool 280w for $110 here in the USA. I just ordered a bunch of Thermalright Frozen Notte 240s and 360s for customer builds (these also use a pump on the tubing close to the rad so the rad can be mounted at the bottom of the case) for $50 and $70 respectively. The 360 model has been shown in the very, very few reviews I can find to cool a 13700k up to 310w. Very anxious to check out the 240 myself to see what it can do, which I'm about to install one on a 7600x (not the most demanding CPU, I know) this week and specifically to mount the rad on the bottom of a case. The Frozen Magic is a very nice looking AIO, especially in white. As such, it usually sells more around the $100 range and is hard to find in stock, especially in black.
Thanks Greg, that's why i don't buy MSI products anymore, since they don't want to replace my MSI AIO that making a funny noise, i replaced it with CORSAIR AIO, and now there's no more funny noise. they don't want to replace my MSI AIO. it's their lost... thank you so much Greg, i am learning a lot from you every day. this is tolitzbernal watching from Northern California. GOD BLESS YOU MORE...
Romania here, had a client with a 360 MSI AIO about 2 months ago (the same model as the original Fix Or Flop video)
he bought the V2 version to replace his defective unit and he didn't leave his bad unit with us, I think he hoped to RMA it - so I could not get inside to check if it was clogged
I built a mostly MSI PC last July and that includes a 360R V2. It's worked fine so far, and I really like the look of it with all the other MSI parts, but I've seen a number of reviews say that they started having issues around the 1-year mark so I'm keeping an eye on my CPU temps. If I could go back, I definitely would have gone with a different AIO and case.
I think the problems only affected the v1.I have the v2 also and no problems at all
I was considering going from air cooling my cpu to water cooling it, But after this news i am reconsidering and will just leave the stock cooler on it.
Air cooling is, no doubt, added peace of mind! There are many great AIOs out there, but I wouldn't blame you for sticking with effective simplicity 👍
There's a third option: a beefier-than-stock air cooler.
A video series on construction would've been cool to watch. I've always enjoyed Paul from Paul's Hardware's building series and it would've been cool to see the difference between where he lives and Florida.
I had an MSI that also clogged, bought a cheap air fan to get by with until the replacement came.
I am scared of any water cooling solution. Leaks are normally catastrophic and this video only reinforces that to me.
yep here in Philippines people sell this msi used but not indicate it that it has issues from the factory hopefully people will be aware and til to this date some people still buying this msi aio :(
Even properly designed liquid coolers are a disposable item, they don't last very long. That's why I only use air coolers, nothing to break
Mine’s been sent back to MSI since May 10th. CPU was reaching 90 celsius whilst IDLE. Still no news from MSI to this day. The AIO (Iirc Magsafe coreliquid 240r) was about 2.5yrs old (under 3y warranty period)
You've probably seen those screws before, they are used on basically all bathroom partitions. Also this is a coolant issue. If you ever drain a real old water heater you'll see it. As the fluid is heated up the minerals in the coolant gather and solidify.
The computer I'm writing this on I built about 11 years ago specifically to watch TV with (cut the cable). It's used a LOT, runs great, and all I've had to do with the cooler is clean the dust out a few times.
Liquid cooling is a neat idea, and some of the setups are amazing (not AIOs), but if you want the computer to just work with minimal maintenance air cooling can't be beat.
I never was into water cooling... I told those that asked for water cooled builds that I'm a computer builder...not a plumber...
Using tamper screws seems like a really bad thing for consumers, right to repair anyone?
it's been like a month where i don't get notified when you upload it just shows up in my home page
By adding a replaceable filter in a loop it will likely eliminate issues and liability. If you don't check and or replace your filter in your loop that's on 'you' not on the manufacturer.
i want to thank you after watching your videos i worked out that it was my AIO that as the issue (idle at 100) and i was made aware of the recall..... as of right now im getting a replacement sent to me and im not 100 GBP out of pocket for a replacement... .THANK YOU! was so disheartened when my first replacement PC in over a decade was suffering from such an issue.
I can almost guarantee that it's a MAG 240R or 360R version 1. MSI solved the issue with the Version 2. The biggest problem now is that retailers are still selling the V1. If your looking to buy one, Make sure it has V2 at the end of the name. As for the V1, Its a fairly simple fix. Remove the hoses from the rad (cut the rubber band at the end and with a little work they will pull off). Remove the distro plate and rubber diverter, and clean the fins. Remove the pump from the rad and flush the rad both forward and backward. reassemble everything. Remove the rubber plug from the fill hole and the screw in plug. Refill with a quality water cooling fluid making sure you get all the air out. Mine clogged after 8 months. After I cleaned it, It has been running perfect for well over 1 1/2 yrs.
This makes me glad I have an air cooler. Worse case scenario I have to replace a couple fans, and even if they die my cpu won't throttle
Thar special screwdriver bit is called a 'spanner head driver'. It works on screw heads that only have 2 holes in it, called 'spanner screws'..
Those screws are the same type you find in public bathroom stalls, only much smaller. I think they used them as a planned obsolescence attempt to prevent the "average" user from digging into the guts of the pump. A typical user would normally address it in two ways. Either to see the screws, realize there's no readily available tool to remove them, and leave it alone, or they'd try to remove them anyway, damage the plate, and have to buy a new AIO.
The word proprietary is a curse word to me. The only reason for this behavior is them keeping customers from performing routine maintenance on the parts. They're taking a gamble because they want their product to last long enough so the customer doesn't feel ripped off, but not long enough so people don't have to buy them often. They're trading making good, quality products that should sell themselves through tech advancements, and longevity for "good enough" products so they can keep selling without being overly concerned with quality.
The argument of "all companies do this" is a non-argument. Just because they do it doesn't make it right. Things need to seriously change because at this point I feel like I can't trust any of them, and will just stop buying things like this.
This is also the reason I refuse to buy anything liquid cool. I know everybody's situations are different, and there's definitely a purpose for liquid cooled, but air cooled just works, and is much easier to not only assess, but repair. If a fan breaks you can visibly see, or hear it, and replace it without buying an entirely new cooling system.
Many things could be the culprit but the most common is mixed medals that could come from the block or the pump or the rad. Next thing could be the liquid degradation.
I had an ek aio that had failed. Due to them no longer selling the aio I had they offered to upgrade or refund me with no request to return the aio. We need more companies like EK!
I really appreciate you standing up for the people that don’t have a voice. Even if it’s for something as small as a pc part. If this is not corrected I will not be purchasing MSI products from this point on.
I live in Canada. For the longest time my serial number wasn't accepted. Then when it was finally accepted on the recall page. I tried to do an RMA 4-6 months ago. But they wouldn't do an Advanced RMA. I didn't want to be without my computer. So I cancelled my RMA. I'm just going to use until it finally dies and then purchase something better and never buy an MSI Product again. I've been using my MSI MAG Core Liquid 360R since January 2022.
I yeeted my AOI after having such a headache with the RMA process here in Netherlands. Our retailer was having so much RMAs, that they demanded you to send it directly to MSI, and it took MSI so long to respond to my RMA request, that I already had thrown it out, and just bought a Tower Cooler from Noctua...
Wow so many companies are having issues right now... My friends have been replacing their Lian Li Galahad AIOs as well.
Had a friends Lian li Cooler break recently Throttleing his 5950x to 110°C Went to buy a replacement cooler not thinking he could RMA it and then A article pops up 2 days later with hundreds of people complaining about there AIO not working anymore He bought a Noctua Air cooler D15 and he said Might as well do the RMA still since his cooler was bought in that time frame Lian li stated but they asked him for pictures to prove it was over heating He would only be able to have his PC on for 20 secs before it Turned off due to heat How the he'll is he gonna record Temps during Idle and Useage.... he tossed it in the trash and won't buy from lian li no more He hated buying Premo shit but noctua is the way
Just because something is "nothing new", does not make it ok. If something wrong is the "norm", speaking up, regardless of what it is, should be the go-to answer! Go you Mr. Salazar for speaking up.
Insane how quickly they clogged I have had a corsair AIO running 24/7 for almost 4 years now with 0 issues.
Arctic also had this issue around the same time, they addressed it VERY quickly. Think I only had a stock cooler in my system for 5 days before getting a replacement. They also asked me to just recycle the old defective AIO
NEVER toss your old air-cooler, I've water-cooled for many years now and personally have never needed my backup air cooler...but I feel great just knowing it's there.
I had an issue with MSI as well, in regards with a monitor that started to have severe light bleeding after only few months of purchase. After sending it to a repair shop, they sent it back as an acceptable issue if its not fully visible in a well lit environment. Upon reaching MSI, they confirmed that MSI consider the fault as acceptable and refused the repair or replacement. The monitor itself is the model Optix MAG322CQR and it was not cheap. Not buying any MSI products in the future
I had a 280 go bad. It wasn't even on the recall list when I checked.
I have an MSI Graphics Card, an MSI GTX 1650 4GT LP, which I ordered in 2020. The fans on this 1650 died within warranty and I went to RMA it late 2020 and was strung along by their support staff UNTIL the warranty period expired, at which point I was completely ghosted by them. I've tried contacting them 3 times over the couple years since, where they take my problem seriously until the communication ends, and I promptly never hear anything back again, ever.
I will never buy an MSI anything ever again. I've had to keep this 1650 working by buying third-party fans on eBay, which also die fairly often sadly, but at the moment I can't afford a rig upgrade, so I'll just keep dealing with it.
I would just like to thank you Greg for superior diligence investigating and looking out for the consumer. As a consumer, I appreciate it.
I always feel good about companies that address an issue with their product proactively. I will never begrudge a company for a failure if they own it and take steps to rectify said issue. If they deny responsibility or actively deny legitimate warranty claims, I will NEVER buy anything from them again and will actively recommend against buying their products. Just do right by your customers.
I have always used air. Liquid cooling certainly has its visual allure...but I'd rather not deal with the hassle. Been using a PCCooler "GameIce" GI-D66A with 240W TDP capacity. A 6 pipe x 6mm Shrouded air cooler with push-pull dual fans and RGB (~$70). Has done the job, from E5-1680V2 (8C/16T; OC'd to 4.5Ghz) on X79 to E5-2696V3 (18C/36T; all core turbo-unlocked) on X99. This cooler has been in operation for over 5 years, without issue.
Leaks, clogs, and pump failures are things that I'd rather not factor into the risk of ownership.
"A lot of companies do that this is nothing new." Uhm no, we really must not give companies even a single ounce of leeway with things like this.
And like Steve from GN said, people/companies make mistakes, however the important part is how you deal with them. If they handle them this badly like ASUS and MSI are doing they really must not be given leeway.
I have only had air cooled computers and haven't had any cooling issues. I don't think I will ever consider liquid cooling. I agree with your stand on MSI!
Enermax, Arctic, and MSi's failures in this area have sworn me off of anything but a custom loop if I'm water cooling. I don't run my PCs hard anymore, other than the occasional game or code compile at this point, and even that's not really running it hard to be honest. I'm back to air cooling and undervolting both CPU and GPU, and I have empathy for anyone who might need to watercool at this point but don't have the skills or patience to build and maintain a loop.
In Australia, under Consumer Protection Law, we're entitled to claim a refund or replacement for defective products above and beyond any warranty offered by the manufacturer. So "RMA'ing" the AIO here should be pretty painless.
Have had problems with 3 motherboards and 2 graphic cards, never used an AIO of their brand. I stopped using the companies products around 4 yrs ago.
Over here in Europe we have those screws on a more regular base (only at a bigger size); they are so called "anti-theft-screws". Normally they are used for items which shouldn't be unscrewed by anyone. Like security cameras, wall mounted clamps for locking a bike, some kind of hinges etc.. But I believe they were more common like 25 years ago than nowadays.
Have seen used to secure door-locks and handles as well
I live an Bangladesh and i had an msi 360mm aio. After 7 month it broke down and i wanted to enter advanced rma process but to my disappointment it didn't apply for my country.
So i had to go through the shop to rma the process and even after 2 months no answer from them the shop owner said.
Normally the shop takes 20 days at best rma but msi didn't have any aio do they told them to wait until they can send one.
After that i bought a corsair aio after adjusting my money with what i had bought the msi one for.
Had the mag 240 with this issue in South Korea . No advanced rma. Had to phone the distributor of MSI here. Thankfully service is quite speedy here. Sent it and the next day they contacted me to say they'll overnight a replacement
Honestly, if you're not directly buying from MSI, u shouldn't be contacting them, always contact the authorized distributor
I got a couple of those for cheap since people didn't know how to fix them and the AIOs were out of warranty, deep cleaned them with different chemicals and hot water and fused them together (one of the pumps was opened by the guy who sold it to me and ripped the cables from it rip.) and it works pretty fine, semi-custom water cooling for 65 euros. Still what pissed me off was that the serial number didn't even qualify and I took some photos of the block when I opened it, it doesn't qualify MSI huh? Too bad, too bad indeed
I upgraded from a Corsair 240mm AIO to an MSI 360mm AIO when I swapped over to a Z490 10700k based system, and it is the reason why I used a custom loop now. I liked MSI's products but with the way they conduct themselves, I might be swapping to Sapphire or Powercolor for my graphics cards and EVGA for my motherboards. That sucks because I have had no issues with other MSI products.
13:10 I thought I spotted Yugioh cards in the background. I like Greg even more now
Can we get your story on why you don't like fractal? I love their cases myself. Just curious
The funny thing is fractal used the same OEM for there aio that MSI did and when Fractal found this issue there awnser was apply for the RMA and they shipped the replacement out without u even having to send the old one in no questions asked all u had to do was provide the S/N and invoice. Fractal did this for all countries not just Canada and the US.
Im from the Phils, before i encountered defective MSI motherboard. I forgot the model code. I like it because it is color white. After 2 months used, my PC is not turning on. Luckily, I still have my old motherboard that was replaced. I swap it in with same other components. And it boot fine. So it is confirmed the motherboard the issue. I returned it to the seller and they said they dont have replacement for same board so they ask mo to choose other board from their product list then i choose Asus instead. It means the seller (3rd party) can easily replace or swap if confirmed defective within warranty period. So i dont know why they will reject that RMA. Above warranty period is different discussion of course
cant go wrong with EVGA Aios. never had an easier RMA process.
EVGA RMA process is fantastic, sent back a PSU and GPU no problem at all.
Yeah they actually care about their customers, sad they are no longer selling GPUs.
Sometimes. Using old components is a time saver.
Msi replaced my 360 before I had issues. Thanks to you .
Hell of a coincidence. I have a CoreLiquid 240R and it died about 2 weeks ago. I bought it a couple of years ago but had about 10 months of consistant use before it shat itself.
My career is not based in the tech space, but I've had to deal with corporate ownership a lot in my 20 years in my field. This is the corporate mindset at work and it's always pure cancer. They only care about reputation as something they can leverage for profit until they burn all the goodwill associated with a brand then they move on to the next one, or "re-brand". It's always a race to the bottom to see how many corners they can cut to maximize profit until it blows up in their face.
3:00
lol the color of the pc is really close to the underwater shot in the ad XD
I gave up and bought new ones from a different brand. I live in the US and I had 2 builds with those 360Rs in them that failed within a few days of each other. MSI refused to RMA them because its serial was not listed as one of those affected.
They hosed me on a $20 rebate for a graphics card recently. They have an entire online rebate fill-in website for ease and then they snail-mailed me it was rejected. I could not bother to hassle myself further just decided to never purchase MSI again that day.
*Thank you for being honest and having integrity*
this is why I'm giving real thought to swapping from the msi board I'm putting in my new rig. I'd rather be forced into buying usb port cards than support a company that..isn't even TRYING to fix the problem.