So in conclusion, the down fall for the FX4 is the tires, not enough articulation, breakover angles, and LSD overheating. Great video Andre you guys are awesome!
Well land rover adds a lot off money and engineering to is suspension and electronic diff's and technology. So i think a land rover could fair fairly well is this test. However, this test does show or prove that without a good set of tires, depending on the climate or type of ground, could prove whether or not you make it up that trail. And this goes for a certain number of vehicles. And height clearance, or departure/approach angles, LSD, Locking diffs, etc. So many factors contribute. But a good set a tires can get you so far but farther than a road tire that's for sure.
Not mad it didn’t make it up. Clearly not made for that kind of off roading . I’m sure it’s great in the snow grabbing those groceries with all that room. Still a nice vehicle
IJBCI yeah with proper off roading tires im sure it would be a bit happier on gold mine. But with 16 degrees of incline and only two tires grabbing, I’m not disappointed
We rented one during winter vacation in Colorado. The normal 4x4 did great in heavy snow. Not sure why they would give it the FX4 package. Most off roaders would never consider this truck for off road purpose and for dirt road the normal 4x4 would be a fine family hauler.
@Eric Lathouse So we're going to put this on the same level as a crossover? The XC60 actually didn't have to pick any lines, it went straight up with some throttle and did not overheat. The only thing they could have done differently was pick a different line, similar to the one they used to get a Subaru up that obstacle. So sure they could have tried a couple more times with a different line but again, that puts an FX4 pkg on the same level as a crossover. The Infinity QX80 which is in the same class as the Expedition made it up easily. A Honda Ridgeline made it up easily. I would expect a Ford Expedition FX4 to make it up there otherwise get rid of the name.
E P truth. Paid more for smaller and uglier wheels, over paid on the optional locking rear diff, and paid way too much for some thin aluminum skid plates that will be ripped off at the first log or rock they meet. Compared to the Tundra rock warrior’s skid plates these are a joke. And I’m not even a Toyota guy.
E P it’s called an off road package not a hill climb package. The point of having the fx4 package is to have 4wd. Just because you have 4wd doesn’t mean you can climb a mountain
I'm gonna be honest with y'all: this Expedition had to be defective because that rear LSD shouldn't be disabling itself after a little bit of off-roading. We need to see a re-do!!!!
Yeah I agree, that diff lock is bullshit. Or it has a LSD centre diff like a fulltime 4x4 that can't be locked and overheats. No point having a locking centre diff if all the drive just goes to the front when you need it.
jamieh4x4 its a locked in center diff or transfer case as we call it here in the states. Normally a rear wheel drive vehicle, and the troublesome diff is an electronic locking limited slip in the rear axle.
Come on... the FX4 package and like the Z71 package from GM are not off road packages merely stickers and a little different exterior looks. Only thing that is off road oriented in the FX4 package is the locking diff, smaller not so bling wheels, and some paper thin “skid plates” you could rip off with a corn stalk.
It's not even a real locking diff. If this thing had a REAL rear locker, it would have made it up that hill no problem. Unfortunately, it's an e-limited slip, which is basically like any other traction control, using wheel sensors and brakes to control slip. End result is that it doesn't work in hard situations.
Hey hey.... You forgot the gauges say Z71 lol to be fair GM adds hill decent control to their Z71 but that's a stretch. Skid plates are a joke on GMs as i ripped one off a a branch that was just a large twig.... Thankfully BDS has real skid plates for the front when i installed my lift.
The FX4 package includes the following: 2 speed 4x4, 18” wheels, 3.73 eLSD, off road tuned shocks, heavy duty engine radiator, skid plates, chrome plated running boards, front and second row floor liners. FYI, I’ve never had an issue with the skid plates on my F-150s. I’ve bottomed out and scraped but never caused an issue.
The Z71 Colorado made it up that hill without a hiccup. The rear locker o. The Z71 Colorado is an actual locker though. Good enough. Most of the features on the Colorado Z71 are things like lumbar support in the seat, heated seat, hill decent control, heated mirrors, etc etc... not off road oriented. You do get pneumatic shocks... which will be highly resistant to overheating on long high speed washboard roads.
Oh its worse that just the package cost. Ford requires the 202A with the FX4 package. Think $7,000 to get those skid plates and supposed 2 speed transfer case. I'm ignoring the differential lock as seems to be mostly useless in this test.
Helluva locker. Doesn't actually seem to "lock" and disables at the first sign of trouble. "locked" (according to the display) @4:17, tires spinning at different speeds through @4:21 where the display then displays "Electronic Limited Slip Differential Reduced Torque" then "temporarily disabled". So what the "locker" actually is is an electronic limited slip that applies full preload on the clutches but can't actually fully lock and doesn't have enough heat management to function in that capacity anyway. A locker it aint.
Thanks for doing this! Been waiting for it since the first expedition fx4 you guys made on the Ford course. I can see you really tried hard to get up stage 3 and probably more so than a normal person would with their 64K vehicle.
Just traded our 4Runner sr5 4x4 for an ‘18 expedition 4x4 with the rear locker and we love it. Hard to beat the 4Runner though, but with a 4th kid on the way 4Runner had to go
That was pitiful. The FX4 Expedition should have the F150s solid rear axle for sure. Articulation was terrible and the locker didn't even seem to help much. Pretty disappointed in that performance. You can do better than that Ford.
It's a family SUV num nuts! What dumbass wants to ride over a solid rear axle?? Ya u can sit in the 3rd seat. Remember f150 still has ancient leaf springs in the rear! Only ram has solid rear axle with smooth riding coils
@@crazyhass84 idk, our 2015 suburban was pretty comfy with a solid rear, and hey, my 2015 Silverado with a solid rear and leaves just eats up the miles, and you're still good to go after 14 hours on the highway
The old independent suspension on the second gen had much better travel. (If I’m not mistaken it was rated better than the solid rear axle on the Tahoe of its day.) It’s just very tippy. They should’ve figured out how to make the IRS work on and off road.
Gonna give props to my man Andre - it takes guts (& someone else’s ride) to take a full size SUV up Gold Mine hill !! Impressed with how you’ve improved with off roaring. Giving Nathan a run for his money! Roman should be worried. Think you could take him in a side-by-side battle. 😎👍🏻
Locker in the rear... 4lo... wtf limited slip was over heating? Sounds like they didnt put a true transfer case in it! 4hi auto has limited slip but 4lo should a locked transfer case like the last 60 years. Guess not
4Lo might lock the transfer case which is not necessarily a locked axle (diff lock). This shows how an LSD is inferior to a fully-locking differential -- wheel speed difference is reduced across the rear axle... maybe or maybe not at a 1:1 ratio depending on the application, but either way, with no guarantee of reliability in function.
@@DeltaSierra426 Highly misleading to show an actual lock icon if it's just a limit slip, or EDL. All the camera angles were too tight to see what was going on between front and rear, but it's possible that it's an open or limited slip center diff, so even if the rear is locked, when the front loses traction, it just doesn't put any power to the rear once the EDLs overheat, which is pretty worthless. My Gen4 4runner with AWD, has *only* center lock (true lock) and EDL at all four corners and it makes quick work of Goldmine "Stage 3", and a Cliffhangar 2.0. I'm really surprised at how pitifully the Expedition performed.
Right. This truck doesn't have a locker. Andre keeps calling it a locker but it's an electronic LSD. media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2017/06/16/all-new-2018-expedition-fx4-most-off-road-capable-expedition-ever.html
Oh yeah, I forgot about part two of their review. So, this means that the subaru AWD system is better than the Low range and rear locker combo in this Expedition, right? (taking in consideration both are using stock tires)
If the locking rear axle is like the F150 it is only meant to go in a straight line until you get unstuck. It also times itself out thinking that you forgot to shut it off. I got that from reading the book that came with my F150.
My 2003 expedition with FX4 probably could have done this only because it didn't have all the tech to keep it safe, so it always went all out and got up whatever it needed most of the time.
Your 03 wouldnt make it because you'd be spinning one front tire and one back tire on the off camber parts because they have open diffs on the front and rear, no locker or lsd.
yes true, but my expedition was heavily modified and had suspension upgrades with tires and it weighed like 3.5 tones so the wheels generally touch when in flex, but if not the 4Lo or 4A generally figures itself out.
rochab77 I love TFL I love expeditions I love Ford. However I believe the expedition COULD have cleared stage 3 and I’m gonna tell you why in a second but because We drive expeditions everyday we know this wouldn’t be a problem for any expedition new or old. I believe a older expedition would be better because of the high ground clearance. A car is only as good as the driver 🤷🏽♂️ but in this case the driver wasn’t comfortable and it showed... ALOT. Also A vehicle that size requires more momentum than what you would give a RAV4 🤷🏽♂️
I completely agree young sentrell, it was a test car so they are not going to push it because they don't want to pay for it. And yes momentum is key in these situations, your not going to damage anything if you have some inertia going into it. And ground clearance is a big one, my 03' had 11" of ground clearance which made a big difference.
The thing about this SUVs nowadays their meant to take your family to a long trip, tow a trailer, and do some off-roading but not to much. They've changed over the years, some of them had kept the ability of doing a proper off-roading stuff but others just a little bit. Excellent video guys, you always do great review of those cars, showing if they're capable or not. Thumbs up!!
FYI on the 4wd system for anyone that cares. The "4A" puts it in an all wheel drive drive mode that can be driven on all surfaces. In order to get traditional "4WD" (front and rear axles locked together... like a center locker) you need to put the terrain selector to "mud and ruts" or "sand". I think one of the issues Andre had was he prob didn't have the center diff locked... but I could be wrong. Source: I own one and the info is buried pretty deep in the manual.
Right! He had the center locked because it was in Lo however the slick highway tires plus all that torque in low equals a lot of spinning tires. I think changing modes and leaving it in 4A would have been sufficient...
No, there's some BS going on here. If it has a locker, why are you getting these "limited slip" messages all the time? Those are two very different systems. A locker (e-locker, arb, ox locker, etc) just plain works, no buts about it. I'm not seeing both rear wheels spinning on stage 3.
I took my 2015 Ford Expedition EL on Switzerland trail from SR 122 to SR 118 last year with the exception of Gold Mine Hill during January with 3-6 inches of snow and some Artic Claw studded tires. We did some snowshoeing in the backcountry. Overall very pleased. It gets a little narrow sometimes and a few rubs underneath but nothing scary or catastrophic. The dummies who doubt the Gold Mine Hill and hating on the Ford have probably never seen it first hand. The videos do NOT do these obstacles any justice. That 2019 Expedition did very well given the tires and its overall size. Keep up the good work!
The one thing I do not like about the Ford Expedition. That it's only offered with a 3 l Ecoboost V6 just like the Lincoln Navigator. But with General Motors what day did but with general motors what they did with the Chevrolet Suburban and the GMC Yukon and the Cadillac Escalade is to offer a 6.2 liter V8 engine in their full size SUVs. Which I prefer that over the Ford Expedition and the Lincoln Navigator. And to me General Motors has a better setup for their SUVs than Ford does.
So how do turbo charged v-6 engines do compared to a N/A V-8 when it comes to delicate throttle applications in sticky off road situations. Not so well, me thinks.
Tbh I honestly think it would have gotten as far as this FX4. They have similar technology and similar ground clearance. So unless you got momentum from the start (which tfl doesn’t do to challenge the vehicles more) then maybe they would have a chance. But they’re just made for family cruisers and light off-roading. Nothing like this
I've read in the comments that this has an electronic limited slip...new one on me. I guess that works with the ABS? Why doesn't Ford just install the same E-Locker they use in the Raptors instead?
Derrick Moyer I love my explorer. Body on frame, rear wheel drive. They don’t make them like this anymore. I dislike newer suvs and trucks. Show me (any) “cuv” they can tow more than 5,000 pounds!
@@angelgjr1999 Even the gen 1 and 2 explorers were only rated to 5000 pounds. I saw a ridgeline the other day towing a 15,000 pound boat and probably a 5,000 trailer out of a marina the other day. Rated vs capable is a different story. Over the weekend I took my '95 explorer to do some land clearing and had to cross a slope of 20 degrees on wet grass with a 2 foot ditch going diagonal on it. Even with using 2 wheel drive I was able to get where I had to. 4low is misbehaving and I didn't want it to get stuck "on" when I got onto the pavement. And it is a stick with open diffs. Articulation makes up for traction control in many situations but traction control is nice when you don't have enough articulation.
acephantom903 When will I ever tow 15,000 pounds? Probably never. But yeah old explorers a beast off-road. I’ve never been stuck. Even with rwd and all season tires.
GMC, Chevorolet (Think I misspelled that), have been making these vehicles and it has been very successful in the market gaining them a lot of profit. No surprise Ford or any other car company is beginning to design these.
The expedition has been around since 1997 tbf. It was made as the replacement for the full sized bronco just as the taho replaced the full size blazer. Both have coexisted since the beginning
Standard expeditions do not get a low range transfer case, you have to option it with either a heavy tow package or the fx4, and you can get an fx4 in the max version also, (I've got one). Great video!
@The Fast Lane Truck how does this compare to the Tahoe Z71? I feel like it's mostly cosmetic, and those puny little tires have 0 to do with anything off-road.
Yeah those tires caused the LSD to overheat because of all that spinning.😂🤣🤪. What happens when your stuck with offroad tires and your spinning any longer then 25 seconds? Will you still blame the tires when the LSD is overheating again?
@@siedlaczek7118 I have a great set of 33 inch MT Baja claw on my Ford, I've been stuck plenty. What I'm saying is that scenario you're right it may not have got stuck going up a completely dry hill. But when you do get stuck you're still going to have an overheating LSD, regardless of when you do it is an inevitably.
I had a 2014 fx4 f150 and I feel like the T case in the expedition has to be different. With my truck in 4 high or low all 4 wheels turned at the same speed. I don't understand how your wheels off the ground were going nuts while others were not even turning. AWD T case? I also never had any issue with the E locker disengaging either.
Since we hit a deer and our dodge durango is in the shop we rented a 2018 ford expedition limited but its not the fx4 one it just has 2H and 4auto on the button selector
No you should just not use a Ford product and use a GM product to get somewhere because they actually made it up no problem the Tahoe wasn't tested but the GMC Yukon was and it made it up like it wasn't even there with crappier tires than the Ford
Mike Cav oh my gosh can you quit hating on Ford products just because you’re a Chevy fanboy doesn’t mean you have to go pick something else to do with your time
Don't blame the vehicle for an incompetant driver !! You must maintain power when the truck is hooked up and moving....you NEVER stop and start like he did ...and he is a test driver ??? The vehicle was capable. ..the DRIVER NOT !!!
That truck literally almost made it until you head back down on the gas. It was literally about to go up the third stage. I would love to see you guys try again with a different driver. Good job dude Keep it up
@@philtripe so Yukon had way worse tires than this truck has and it made it up no problem it is the same as a Tahoe and it would make it up no problem probably with slicks
Main issues... Tires and suspension travel. The qx80/armada made that look easy. I wonder how the Toyota Sequoia would have faired (with atrac etc) - I think not as good as the nissan products, but I think better than this Ford did. What do you think?
It's literally a Chevy Tahoe rip off with Ford engine and badges. Compare their shapes and exterior body styles and its obvious the Expedition is a clone of the new Tahoe.
Definitely similar shape as the suburban but hell when you can't beat the longest lasting suv model on the road you might as well make it look similar.
had a '98 Eddie Bauer while living in the mountains of Colorado. Put over 100k on it doing off road here. Was a GREAT vehicle. Think I might by a new one again.
CornRow Kenny Yeah, but in stock form this engine has more torque available, especially at lower RPM's, than pretty much any V8 you want to compare it to. Heck, up in the mountains you'll loose 15 to 20% of your rated power on a non turbo V8. Then the difference will be even more as this "V6" kicks your ass.
@@SaxonTerror Ford did even worse than GM AND Chrysler with taking loans from the Government in 2006 and not even paying them back. They swept it under the rug and sat there acting like they where the good company when the economy crashed back in 2008 when really they are the bad one's. Ford owes people an apology for that but their greedy asses never will. Screw Ford.
On the overheating rear differential, have you reached out to Ford as this looks to be an issue with the SUV? Maybe Ford needs to flash a new program to the computer to get the truck to perform better in these conditions because performance like this is really bad considering the truck has an "off-road" package.
I am so confused Andre, you said you were very impressed with the way the 4wd system and the rear locker worked off road? It did not work, at no point did I see both rear tires spin. Plain and simple if the rear locker was working you would not have had any issue with traction.
That's because they're in the tank for Ford they have always been in the tank for Ford and I can't understand it because Fords are junk! You have to remember they had a Ford Raptor whoopty doo dee
Mike Cav I really think it has more to do with the fact that they do not understand how a vehicle functions and or how to drive correctly, just look at any other of there off road videos, hell they are still using a key to drop air pressure in the tires.
I'm a new Expedition owner and Ford needs to respond why the locker kept disconnecting. Its an FX4 it suppose to be tested and engineered for off road use. I understand its a loaner and you don't want to damage it. However I'm thinking the Infiniti QX 80 made it. Come on Ford customers are demanding an answer!
Everyone already covered the "what heck kind of locked 4-low has a ltd slip to overheat?", so I'm just going to say I really have "M+S" tires. That rating really means they're good in neither mud nor snow. M+S should just stand for "Multi-Season", or something like that.
Thanks for the video. This is clearly a "city SUV", not meant for any serious offroading - not because of tires (you can always change tires) but because the "electronic LSD" is so weak and overheats just as easily as on crossovers from Mazda and Kia. Good enough for winter time in city, not good for anything else ;-) Also, this is another reason why you should use "roller tests" more often - you can test the AWD system just as thoroughly as on this hill (including causing the eLSD to overheat, if you put rollers on very steep incline) without potentially scratching or damaging the car (by hitting some obstacle).
Depends on which model/generation. The current RAV 4 model might or might not but the 2019 RAV4 should since it's built for more moderate off-road ability. On the other hand the 2004/second generation RAV4 could do that trail easily if it's equipped with a 5 speed manual! We have an 2004 RAV4 with a 5 speed manual(driven daily M-F) with an after market rear locker with generic brand all-terrain tires (and yes it does have skid plates) and we take it off-road a lot here in the mountains of the San Bernardino national forest (Big Bear lake CA) where we live.
Good, honest video review. Understanding that tires are a necessary component for off roading as well as sufficient ground clearance to complete the task. Most of us wouldn’t have taken our 50k+ vehicle any farther in OEM shoes. That said, the undercarriage protection as part of the package is great. I’d buy this Expedition for my hunting needs and be happy to put it up against a Tahoe or Similar Dodge configured SUV.
That's an awesome looking Ford Expedition. I have a 2015 Ford Expedition EL with all terrain tires and I would love to go up gold mine hill with it someday😊.
Wonder if the locker worked several times I saw one rear tire not spinning. I know he said he forgot at some point so not sure what points in the footage were or weren’t pretty surprised even though I never expected this vehicle to be exceptional at this.
Try with platinum max tow that has better 22" tires, max suspension, and enhanced engine cooling. The fx4 stx is bad ford marketing for the expy. Then turn on the rock/gravel terrain mode and keep locker engaged. Have not tried anything as difficult as gold mine hill, but on the few trails Ive been on... no problems. Surprisingly good performance.
So in conclusion, the down fall for the FX4 is the tires, not enough articulation, breakover angles, and LSD overheating. Great video Andre you guys are awesome!
The downfall is basic off roading 101. Strong work Ford.
Big down fall is that it’s a Ford
@@irishuwould5185 😐
It's shown that it is poor off roader, I wonder how range rover perform
Well land rover adds a lot off money and engineering to is suspension and electronic diff's and technology. So i think a land rover could fair fairly well is this test. However, this test does show or prove that without a good set of tires, depending on the climate or type of ground, could prove whether or not you make it up that trail. And this goes for a certain number of vehicles. And height clearance, or departure/approach angles, LSD, Locking diffs, etc. So many factors contribute. But a good set a tires can get you so far but farther than a road tire that's for sure.
Put an aggressive tire on it. Spinning street tires on off camber obstacles will overheat any modern limited slip.
Ford you guys have to do better with this package...Especially for a brand new 55-65k platform.
Not mad it didn’t make it up. Clearly not made for that kind of off roading . I’m sure it’s great in the snow grabbing those groceries with all that room. Still a nice vehicle
👍🏻
IJBCI yeah with proper off roading tires im sure it would be a bit happier on gold mine. But with 16 degrees of incline and only two tires grabbing, I’m not disappointed
Stop making excuses. They tested a Volvo XC60 and made it up. Not like the Volvo was "made" for that kind of off-roading either.
We rented one during winter vacation in Colorado. The normal 4x4 did great in heavy snow. Not sure why they would give it the FX4 package. Most off roaders would never consider this truck for off road purpose and for dirt road the normal 4x4 would be a fine family hauler.
@Eric Lathouse So we're going to put this on the same level as a crossover? The XC60 actually didn't have to pick any lines, it went straight up with some throttle and did not overheat. The only thing they could have done differently was pick a different line, similar to the one they used to get a Subaru up that obstacle. So sure they could have tried a couple more times with a different line but again, that puts an FX4 pkg on the same level as a crossover. The Infinity QX80 which is in the same class as the Expedition made it up easily. A Honda Ridgeline made it up easily. I would expect a Ford Expedition FX4 to make it up there otherwise get rid of the name.
The Toyota Land Cruiser and Nissan Armada made it up no problem....The Land Cruiser even did it the snow!
You can’t beat a LC the legend for decades
Hell my 4Runner would do better!
4 runner is offroad beast like LC
Trevor Odom or GX or LX. Toyota/Lexus needs to keep 4Runner/LC/GX/LX around for ever. I never want to see the 4Runner go bye bye.
I dont think you will ever see the LC or 4 runner go
FX4 badges.. to let everyone know you got duped by overpriced packages with little functional value.
E P truth. Paid more for smaller and uglier wheels, over paid on the optional locking rear diff, and paid way too much for some thin aluminum skid plates that will be ripped off at the first log or rock they meet. Compared to the Tundra rock warrior’s skid plates these are a joke. And I’m not even a Toyota guy.
in my 2017 F150 they are nice thick steel plates. There is one thin plate under the engine, but that is aerodynamic
E P it’s called an off road package not a hill climb package. The point of having the fx4 package is to have 4wd. Just because you have 4wd doesn’t mean you can climb a mountain
@@yesimbigwes 👍🏻
Great job, I bet some tires would really help out.
I'm gonna be honest with y'all: this Expedition had to be defective because that rear LSD shouldn't be disabling itself after a little bit of off-roading. We need to see a re-do!!!!
Sadly it looked like every time you had some trouble and started spinning and need it most the locking diff would disable itself....
he says in the vid he forgot to re-enable the locker
He re-enabled the locker and it and it still failed.
Yeah I agree, that diff lock is bullshit. Or it has a LSD centre diff like a fulltime 4x4 that can't be locked and overheats. No point having a locking centre diff if all the drive just goes to the front when you need it.
jamieh4x4 its a locked in center diff or transfer case as we call it here in the states. Normally a rear wheel drive vehicle, and the troublesome diff is an electronic locking limited slip in the rear axle.
That thing is crap
An Expedition that cant go on Expeditions 😂😂
bogart hunter lol nice one
its a grocery getter for women 2006 was the last good year for the expedition
@@LaserStorm1000 thats the year i got😂
@@keenanhatley7184 that’s the year I was born😂
I take my 06 over road in Colorado alot and she never struggles
Come on... the FX4 package and like the Z71 package from GM are not off road packages merely stickers and a little different exterior looks. Only thing that is off road oriented in the FX4 package is the locking diff, smaller not so bling wheels, and some paper thin “skid plates” you could rip off with a corn stalk.
Yes. FX4 shocks tires and skid plates is all you get. Those tires suck!!!
It's not even a real locking diff. If this thing had a REAL rear locker, it would have made it up that hill no problem. Unfortunately, it's an e-limited slip, which is basically like any other traction control, using wheel sensors and brakes to control slip. End result is that it doesn't work in hard situations.
Hey hey.... You forgot the gauges say Z71 lol to be fair GM adds hill decent control to their Z71 but that's a stretch. Skid plates are a joke on GMs as i ripped one off a a branch that was just a large twig.... Thankfully BDS has real skid plates for the front when i installed my lift.
The FX4 package includes the following: 2 speed 4x4, 18” wheels, 3.73 eLSD, off road tuned shocks, heavy duty engine radiator, skid plates, chrome plated running boards, front and second row floor liners. FYI, I’ve never had an issue with the skid plates on my F-150s. I’ve bottomed out and scraped but never caused an issue.
The Z71 Colorado made it up that hill without a hiccup. The rear locker o. The Z71 Colorado is an actual locker though. Good enough. Most of the features on the Colorado Z71 are things like lumbar support in the seat, heated seat, hill decent control, heated mirrors, etc etc... not off road oriented. You do get pneumatic shocks... which will be highly resistant to overheating on long high speed washboard roads.
the FX4 Package is $1600.00 so you get skid plates and step rail, which cost Ford $200.00,... nice
You also get stickers
RIGHT, that should cover the other $1400
Oh its worse that just the package cost. Ford requires the 202A with the FX4 package. Think $7,000 to get those skid plates and supposed 2 speed transfer case. I'm ignoring the differential lock as seems to be mostly useless in this test.
Helluva locker. Doesn't actually seem to "lock" and disables at the first sign of trouble. "locked" (according to the display) @4:17, tires spinning at different speeds through @4:21 where the display then displays "Electronic Limited Slip Differential Reduced Torque" then "temporarily disabled". So what the "locker" actually is is an electronic limited slip that applies full preload on the clutches but can't actually fully lock and doesn't have enough heat management to function in that capacity anyway. A locker it aint.
For an actual test of how much difference a solid axle and real diff lock make, try it again with an FX4 F-150.
Thanks for doing this! Been waiting for it since the first expedition fx4 you guys made on the Ford course. I can see you really tried hard to get up stage 3 and probably more so than a normal person would with their 64K vehicle.
At 4:41, what is rattling in the car on that hill? You can clearly hear something rattling.
It's a Ford what do you expect?!?!
Just traded our 4Runner sr5 4x4 for an ‘18 expedition 4x4 with the rear locker and we love it. Hard to beat the 4Runner though, but with a 4th kid on the way 4Runner had to go
But will the Sequoia, Tahoe , Armada go up? I think so
A Tahoe Z71 with a G80 locker would easily tackle this course.
And suburban
The new z71 tahoe does not have lockers so no it wouldn't make it.
8:50 he says he forgot to re-enable the locker? so we don't really know whether it could pass stage 3 with the locker enabled?
That was pitiful. The FX4 Expedition should have the F150s solid rear axle for sure. Articulation was terrible and the locker didn't even seem to help much. Pretty disappointed in that performance. You can do better than that Ford.
It's a family SUV num nuts! What dumbass wants to ride over a solid rear axle?? Ya u can sit in the 3rd seat. Remember f150 still has ancient leaf springs in the rear! Only ram has solid rear axle with smooth riding coils
@@crazyhass84 idk, our 2015 suburban was pretty comfy with a solid rear, and hey, my 2015 Silverado with a solid rear and leaves just eats up the miles, and you're still good to go after 14 hours on the highway
Ford junda cheap yuck
The old independent suspension on the second gen had much better travel. (If I’m not mistaken it was rated better than the solid rear axle on the Tahoe of its day.) It’s just very tippy. They should’ve figured out how to make the IRS work on and off road.
Tires can make or break any vehicle
How does limited slip overheat??
The limited slip overheats by creating too much heat.
Really expensive shopping cart.....”honey we need groceries!!!!”
Gonna give props to my man Andre - it takes guts (& someone else’s ride) to take a full size SUV up Gold Mine hill !!
Impressed with how you’ve improved with off roaring. Giving Nathan a run for his money! Roman should be worried. Think you could take him in a side-by-side battle. 😎👍🏻
Locker in the rear... 4lo... wtf limited slip was over heating? Sounds like they didnt put a true transfer case in it! 4hi auto has limited slip but 4lo should a locked transfer case like the last 60 years. Guess not
4Lo might lock the transfer case which is not necessarily a locked axle (diff lock). This shows how an LSD is inferior to a fully-locking differential -- wheel speed difference is reduced across the rear axle... maybe or maybe not at a 1:1 ratio depending on the application, but either way, with no guarantee of reliability in function.
@@DeltaSierra426 Highly misleading to show an actual lock icon if it's just a limit slip, or EDL. All the camera angles were too tight to see what was going on between front and rear, but it's possible that it's an open or limited slip center diff, so even if the rear is locked, when the front loses traction, it just doesn't put any power to the rear once the EDLs overheat, which is pretty worthless. My Gen4 4runner with AWD, has *only* center lock (true lock) and EDL at all four corners and it makes quick work of Goldmine "Stage 3", and a Cliffhangar 2.0. I'm really surprised at how pitifully the Expedition performed.
Right. This truck doesn't have a locker. Andre keeps calling it a locker but it's an electronic LSD.
media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2017/06/16/all-new-2018-expedition-fx4-most-off-road-capable-expedition-ever.html
@Andy HAss, If it doesn't have a real transfer case then it makes you wonder what 2HI mode really is. Surely it can't be FWD in 2HI.
@@daemn42 It has a true transfer case system that locks when engaged. It just doesn't have a locking rear differential.
Did you notice it never went into 1st gear?
Either 2nd or 3rd gear while trying stage 3.
So what? It's in 4lo with a 10 speed trans!!! I am surprised it didnt pull it in 4th. 1st and 2nd r granny gears. Rarely used
Would make a world of difference to have better tires, I'd take this over a Minivan any day of the week
'first stage is a rocky incline going up'. Like an up escalator. Love you brother
I think the subaru outback did the same as this one, right?
jimbo386 the outback made it all the way.
Oh yeah, I forgot about part two of their review.
So, this means that the subaru AWD system is better than the Low range and rear locker combo in this Expedition, right? (taking in consideration both are using stock tires)
@@jimbo386 no..... but you can think that if you want.
If the locking rear axle is like the F150 it is only meant to go in a straight line until you get unstuck. It also times itself out thinking that you forgot to shut it off. I got that from reading the book that came with my F150.
My 2003 expedition with FX4 probably could have done this only because it didn't have all the tech to keep it safe, so it always went all out and got up whatever it needed most of the time.
Your 03 wouldnt make it because you'd be spinning one front tire and one back tire on the off camber parts because they have open diffs on the front and rear, no locker or lsd.
rochab77 my 95 f150 4x4 can make it up there with its open diffs
yes true, but my expedition was heavily modified and had suspension upgrades with tires and it weighed like 3.5 tones so the wheels generally touch when in flex, but if not the 4Lo or 4A generally figures itself out.
rochab77 I love TFL I love expeditions I love Ford. However I believe the expedition COULD have cleared stage 3 and I’m gonna tell you why in a second but because We drive expeditions everyday we know this wouldn’t be a problem for any expedition new or old. I believe a older expedition would be better because of the high ground clearance. A car is only as good as the driver 🤷🏽♂️ but in this case the driver wasn’t comfortable and it showed... ALOT. Also A vehicle that size requires more momentum than what you would give a RAV4 🤷🏽♂️
I completely agree young sentrell, it was a test car so they are not going to push it because they don't want to pay for it. And yes momentum is key in these situations, your not going to damage anything if you have some inertia going into it. And ground clearance is a big one, my 03' had 11" of ground clearance which made a big difference.
The thing about this SUVs nowadays their meant to take your family to a long trip, tow a trailer, and do some off-roading but not to much. They've changed over the years, some of them had kept the ability of doing a proper off-roading stuff but others just a little bit. Excellent video guys, you always do great review of those cars, showing if they're capable or not. Thumbs up!!
FX4 is a joke with that locker. Over heating , Geez !
FYI on the 4wd system for anyone that cares. The "4A" puts it in an all wheel drive drive mode that can be driven on all surfaces. In order to get traditional "4WD" (front and rear axles locked together... like a center locker) you need to put the terrain selector to "mud and ruts" or "sand". I think one of the issues Andre had was he prob didn't have the center diff locked... but I could be wrong.
Source: I own one and the info is buried pretty deep in the manual.
Right! He had the center locked because it was in Lo however the slick highway tires plus all that torque in low equals a lot of spinning tires. I think changing modes and leaving it in 4A would have been sufficient...
No, there's some BS going on here. If it has a locker, why are you getting these "limited slip" messages all the time? Those are two very different systems. A locker (e-locker, arb, ox locker, etc) just plain works, no buts about it. I'm not seeing both rear wheels spinning on stage 3.
I took my 2015 Ford Expedition EL on Switzerland trail from SR 122 to SR 118 last year with the exception of Gold Mine Hill during January with 3-6 inches of snow and some Artic Claw studded tires. We did some snowshoeing in the backcountry.
Overall very pleased.
It gets a little narrow sometimes and a few rubs underneath but nothing scary or catastrophic.
The dummies who doubt the Gold Mine Hill and hating on the Ford have probably never seen it first hand.
The videos do NOT do these obstacles any justice.
That 2019 Expedition did very well given the tires and its overall size.
Keep up the good work!
We completely agree!
So this is Switzerland trail?
The expedition is a nice SUV. It's huge tho, I wouldn't pick it as my off-roader.
That’s probably why gm is still using the clutch Style g80.
Is that why they don't warn you when they're about to fail and catastrophically explode? Because that's not a selling point or perk.
@@kingdaniel3519 grenaded G80s are grossly over exaggerated.
I've seen enough of them personally to know otherwise.
@9:07 Turbo spooling hard😍😍😍 thanks for the video guys really awesome!
Yeah, the sound was awesome. Too bad the car sucked at the test.
The major problem with the FX4 Expedition is that it's too light. You need more weight, bigger better tires, more lift and that should do the trick.
The one thing I do not like about the Ford Expedition. That it's only offered with a 3 l Ecoboost V6 just like the Lincoln Navigator. But with General Motors what day did but with general motors what they did with the Chevrolet Suburban and the GMC Yukon and the Cadillac Escalade is to offer a 6.2 liter V8 engine in their full size SUVs. Which I prefer that over the Ford Expedition and the Lincoln Navigator. And to me General Motors has a better setup for their SUVs than Ford does.
Why don’t “off road” packages include off road tires? Proves they’re just stickers and stiffer suspension.
You need to try real off-road worthy tires on that Expedition and redo the test
Doubt it would do much better. It barely limped through the first two stages
Can you get a different one to test here?
Yet these guys keep dissing the Subaru Outback....
..at least IT made it up😂...
If it has a rear locker, why were you getting limited slip errors when it should have been locked?
$70,000 Turd!
Campus Automotive Inc A 2,000$ old Cherokee can do better...
Andre, at 9:34 it is in 2nd gear! Did you put it in Low range 1st gear?
Why would you even take one of those off road in the first place
So how do turbo charged v-6 engines do compared to a N/A V-8 when it comes to delicate throttle applications in sticky off road situations. Not so well, me thinks.
The Tahoe would've made it up no problem.
Tommy Hammond youre right
Too early for jokes, son
Tommy Hammond lol good one
I highly doubt it . Better tires and the expedition probably would have gone further
Tbh I honestly think it would have gotten as far as this FX4. They have similar technology and similar ground clearance. So unless you got momentum from the start (which tfl doesn’t do to challenge the vehicles more) then maybe they would have a chance. But they’re just made for family cruisers and light off-roading. Nothing like this
I've read in the comments that this has an electronic limited slip...new one on me. I guess that works with the ABS? Why doesn't Ford just install the same E-Locker they use in the Raptors instead?
pos ford... diff overheated with that lame climb? lol get a real truck
Derrick Moyer 1999 Ford Explorer
@@angelgjr1999 i run a 99 k2500 454 powered pickup but not oppossed to older fords
Derrick Moyer I love my explorer. Body on frame, rear wheel drive. They don’t make them like this anymore. I dislike newer suvs and trucks. Show me (any) “cuv” they can tow more than 5,000 pounds!
@@angelgjr1999 Even the gen 1 and 2 explorers were only rated to 5000 pounds. I saw a ridgeline the other day towing a 15,000 pound boat and probably a 5,000 trailer out of a marina the other day. Rated vs capable is a different story.
Over the weekend I took my '95 explorer to do some land clearing and had to cross a slope of 20 degrees on wet grass with a 2 foot ditch going diagonal on it. Even with using 2 wheel drive I was able to get where I had to. 4low is misbehaving and I didn't want it to get stuck "on" when I got onto the pavement. And it is a stick with open diffs. Articulation makes up for traction control in many situations but traction control is nice when you don't have enough articulation.
acephantom903 When will I ever tow 15,000 pounds? Probably never. But yeah old explorers a beast off-road. I’ve never been stuck. Even with rwd and all season tires.
The GoPro getting knocked off the bottom has become a staple of the videos. Love it ! Haha
Ford backwards: Driver Returns On Foot 😁
Losky79 no. Stop with the stupid joke
Why does it still look like a refrigerator with chrome and wheels?
Ford copying the Tahoe lol
GMC, Chevorolet (Think I misspelled that), have been making these vehicles and it has been very successful in the market gaining them a lot of profit. No surprise Ford or any other car company is beginning to design these.
The expedition has been around since 1997 tbf. It was made as the replacement for the full sized bronco just as the taho replaced the full size blazer. Both have coexisted since the beginning
@@thetetons744 he means they tried to copy the Z71 package on the tahoe
@@diegogallegos1610 ah makes sense
Standard expeditions do not get a low range transfer case, you have to option it with either a heavy tow package or the fx4, and you can get an fx4 in the max version also, (I've got one). Great video!
Subaru Outback needed as a tow vehicle.
Why? It took multiple tries for it to get up the hill, hardly any better.
@The Fast Lane Truck how does this compare to the Tahoe Z71? I feel like it's mostly cosmetic, and those puny little tires have 0 to do with anything off-road.
2:36 wtf is that hole in the backseat
WTF trippy
I was going to say, what are you talking about... and then boom, it looks like theres a hole right through the car into the ground.
Trippy, but this is just shadows running on the trunk floor
Where is this trail?
Tires are garbage, thats the bigest problem in this situation
That’s the biggest problem? I think it’s the not enough wheel travel and weak locker.
Yeah those tires caused the LSD to overheat because of all that spinning.😂🤣🤪. What happens when your stuck with offroad tires and your spinning any longer then 25 seconds? Will you still blame the tires when the LSD is overheating again?
@@robmd3851 you wouldn't get stuck like that with off road tires
@@siedlaczek7118 I have a great set of 33 inch MT Baja claw on my Ford, I've been stuck plenty. What I'm saying is that scenario you're right it may not have got stuck going up a completely dry hill. But when you do get stuck you're still going to have an overheating LSD, regardless of when you do it is an inevitably.
@bartosz Siedlecki How are Better tires going to help when the tires spinning are in the air? 0 grip x better tires still equals 0 grip.
I had a 2014 fx4 f150 and I feel like the T case in the expedition has to be different. With my truck in 4 high or low all 4 wheels turned at the same speed. I don't understand how your wheels off the ground were going nuts while others were not even turning. AWD T case? I also never had any issue with the E locker disengaging either.
Locking diff? You mean electronic LSD. Not locking. The first try up and it didn't even spin both rear wheels before the message. G80 FTW.
Damn right G80 ftw!!!
EGGINFOOLS I wish my Silverado had a g80
G80 is garbage
@@MrManic52001 Found the guy who bought the fx4 expedition thinking it had a locker.
@@EGGINFOOLS nah.... i know better, i know the G80 is garbage compared to the e locker on the f150 or jeep or 4 runner.
Since we hit a deer and our dodge durango is in the shop we rented a 2018 ford expedition limited but its not the fx4 one it just has 2H and 4auto on the button selector
You should retry when it isn't so dry and rotted
King Steven It should just stay on the pavement.
Yah like pick a muddy and wet day? Come on that was perfect offroad conditions for the mall crawler if it was to make it at all.
No you should just not use a Ford product and use a GM product to get somewhere because they actually made it up no problem the Tahoe wasn't tested but the GMC Yukon was and it made it up like it wasn't even there with crappier tires than the Ford
Mike Cav oh my gosh can you quit hating on Ford products just because you’re a Chevy fanboy doesn’t mean you have to go pick something else to do with your time
Lsd, what lsd? Seemed like it is locked center diff and locked rear diff. So what lsd?
Don't blame the vehicle for an incompetant driver !! You must maintain power when the truck is hooked up and moving....you NEVER stop and start like he did ...and he is a test driver ???
The vehicle was capable. ..the DRIVER NOT !!!
That truck literally almost made it until you head back down on the gas. It was literally about to go up the third stage. I would love to see you guys try again with a different driver. Good job dude Keep it up
Chevy Tahoe would have made it.
with those tires? not likely
@@philtripe so Yukon had way worse tires than this truck has and it made it up no problem it is the same as a Tahoe and it would make it up no problem probably with slicks
@@douhgremuro150 full of shit
@@MrManic52001 ?
@@douhgremuro150 "any bus size car can do this"
Nah.
Main issues... Tires and suspension travel. The qx80/armada made that look easy. I wonder how the Toyota Sequoia would have faired (with atrac etc) - I think not as good as the nissan products, but I think better than this Ford did. What do you think?
It's literally a Chevy Tahoe rip off with Ford engine and badges. Compare their shapes and exterior body styles and its obvious the Expedition is a clone of the new Tahoe.
Wrong
Lol Chevy ain't worth it even if Ford is failing with customers wants
Travis RC it looks nothing like a Tahoe
How is cocaine?
Definitely similar shape as the suburban but hell when you can't beat the longest lasting suv model on the road you might as well make it look similar.
What kind of rear locker doesn't lock? Should've had no problem
One word...!!!! FORD!
Big question, I am going to buy a Expedition, but I still like 2017 model. Which one is better for offroad? and which body frame is more tough?
Fords a rolling turd box the fancy gmc Yukon pull it off no problem lmao
Wheres the video
On this TFL channel durrrrrr
@@chevydiesel350015 give me the link
Lmao "fancy" trucks courtesy of the American taxpayer. Gmc wouldn't even exist without my money.
That rear locker didn't look like it was doing much at all on Stage 3. Shouldn't the rear axle have been turning at least a little?
What did you make, FORD? A urban Truck?! I don’t really think this is a good choice anymore. Maybe the GM trucks are still better.
It's an SUV.... not a truck.
Ok, what I wanted to say is that it's a truck based, so it should have similar characteristics as trucks.
Yeah Ford dont close 5 shops. How are we trying to copie you?
had a '98 Eddie Bauer while living in the mountains of Colorado. Put over 100k on it doing off road here. Was a GREAT vehicle. Think I might by a new one again.
Hhhhhhh ford 😂
Why is the transmission in 2nd gear the whole time ?
If it aint a v8 it aint a suv.
If it aint a v8 it aint a truck either😂
CornRow Kenny tell that to my 5.9 Inline 6
V6 is pretty good though. Plenty of power but won’t drink as much gas as a v8.
When you have a big vehicle, who cares about gas mileage! Screw v6 Ecoboost in big vehicles!
Sir James1990 V6 isn’t that bad. But I cringe when I see mod size trucks with a 4 cylinder.
CornRow Kenny Yeah, but in stock form this engine has more torque available, especially at lower RPM's, than pretty much any V8 you want to compare it to.
Heck, up in the mountains you'll loose 15 to 20% of your rated power on a non turbo V8. Then the difference will be even more as this "V6" kicks your ass.
Awesome video!!
What upgrades to the Expedition could you have done to help you with that final obstacle?
Ford = Found Off Road Dead. LMAO
shut up dale
GMC = took government money to keep from going bankrupt
On road too
@@SaxonTerror Ford did even worse than GM AND Chrysler with taking loans from the Government in 2006 and not even paying them back. They swept it under the rug and sat there acting like they where the good company when the economy crashed back in 2008 when really they are the bad one's. Ford owes people an apology for that but their greedy asses never will. Screw Ford.
Ford = Fails at Off Road Driving. Lol.
Thanks for a real off road test!
How would the lsd overheat? Would a locker be better for that?
It uses clutch packs just like a tranny does. Friction= heat
King Daniel why is it slipping
Which part of "Limited Slip" is confusing to you?
King Daniel never mind it's way over your head
Apparently it's over yours.
What's all the clicking noises??
On the overheating rear differential, have you reached out to Ford as this looks to be an issue with the SUV? Maybe Ford needs to flash a new program to the computer to get the truck to perform better in these conditions because performance like this is really bad considering the truck has an "off-road" package.
I am so confused Andre, you said you were very impressed with the way the 4wd system and the rear locker worked off road? It did not work, at no point did I see both rear tires spin. Plain and simple if the rear locker was working you would not have had any issue with traction.
That's because they're in the tank for Ford they have always been in the tank for Ford and I can't understand it because Fords are junk! You have to remember they had a Ford Raptor whoopty doo dee
Mike Cav I really think it has more to do with the fact that they do not understand how a vehicle functions and or how to drive correctly, just look at any other of there off road videos, hell they are still using a key to drop air pressure in the tires.
I'm a new Expedition owner and Ford needs to respond why the locker kept disconnecting. Its an FX4 it suppose to be tested and engineered for off road use. I understand its a loaner and you don't want to damage it. However I'm thinking the Infiniti QX 80 made it. Come on Ford customers are demanding an answer!
It can also make it, his driving and vehicle knowledge leaves a lot to be desired.
Have. 4runner pro would lime to do goldmine hill can you send me the coordinates
Everyone already covered the "what heck kind of locked 4-low has a ltd slip to overheat?", so I'm just going to say I really have "M+S" tires. That rating really means they're good in neither mud nor snow. M+S should just stand for "Multi-Season", or something like that.
Thanks for the video. This is clearly a "city SUV", not meant for any serious offroading - not because of tires (you can always change tires) but because the "electronic LSD" is so weak and overheats just as easily as on crossovers from Mazda and Kia. Good enough for winter time in city, not good for anything else ;-)
Also, this is another reason why you should use "roller tests" more often - you can test the AWD system just as thoroughly as on this hill (including causing the eLSD to overheat, if you put rollers on very steep incline) without potentially scratching or damaging the car (by hitting some obstacle).
Will it do a burn out and what's the ET"s
It didn't look like the locker was locking. Thanks for the video guys.
what do you guys think could a rav4 make it up gold mine hill?
Depends on which model/generation. The current RAV 4 model might or might not but the 2019 RAV4 should since it's built for more moderate off-road ability. On the other hand the 2004/second generation RAV4 could do that trail easily if it's equipped with a 5 speed manual! We have an 2004 RAV4 with a 5 speed manual(driven daily M-F) with an after market rear locker with generic brand all-terrain tires (and yes it does have skid plates) and we take it off-road a lot here in the mountains of the San Bernardino national forest (Big Bear lake CA) where we live.
that's great I have a 2003 rav4 with the 5 speed manual but it's completely stock
I have never driven it off-road tho
Good, honest video review. Understanding that tires are a necessary component for off roading as well as sufficient ground clearance to complete the task. Most of us wouldn’t have taken our 50k+ vehicle any farther in OEM shoes. That said, the undercarriage protection as part of the package is great. I’d buy this Expedition for my hunting needs and be happy to put it up against a Tahoe or Similar Dodge configured SUV.
That's an awesome looking Ford Expedition. I have a 2015 Ford Expedition EL with all terrain tires and I would love to go up gold mine hill with it someday😊.
Total nail biter! I was worried that truck was going to get scratched. Thanks for this awesome video, Andre.
Wonder if the locker worked several times I saw one rear tire not spinning. I know he said he forgot at some point so not sure what points in the footage were or weren’t pretty surprised even though I never expected this vehicle to be exceptional at this.
Try with platinum max tow that has better 22" tires, max suspension, and enhanced engine cooling. The fx4 stx is bad ford marketing for the expy. Then turn on the rock/gravel terrain mode and keep locker engaged. Have not tried anything as difficult as gold mine hill, but on the few trails Ive been on... no problems. Surprisingly good performance.