Whatever Happened To The Ethnic Hero in WWE?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 เม.ย. 2021
- bit.ly/3lw1IIJ Check out XeniaDidThat
DAVE KNOWS that WWE was built off of the Ethnic Hero as their main wrestling champion. However, it's not used all that often in modern times. Which is a shame because wrestling is at it's best when it has variety and diversity. So here's a look at WWE's original formula for success and what makes it work so well.
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A lot of why I feel so strongly about Kofi as champion is that he didn't forget about his friends who helped him along the way, and that means a lot to me. And it was so heart warming when he visited his native Ghana while champion.
I did love Kofi's win myself
Kofi's win is my personal favorite Wrestlemania moment. It also added to Daniel Bryan's story too.
Kofis win is the last storyline i cared about and legitimately marked out for. Him and DB also gave a decent story along with it (who knew good storytelling goes a long way).
Bruno sammartino was a hero to all. Without Bruno, the WWE World Heavyweight Championship wouldn't be as prestigious as it used to be
Bruno an absolute legend
"Used to be" It's sad that we have to put the qualifier now when talking about WWE's World Title.
The title only had legitimacy with Rogers held it as he was the NWA champion who relinquished that title. Bruno boosted its image, but Rogers made it legit.
Bruno was the man who sold more times the MSG in NYC than anyone else
And I am quite found of the Garden myself
Don't forget Shea Stadium. He and Zbysko were awesome! And all the younger folks today need to get some respect for it! Hell, I'm 38, been a wrestler since I was 18 and STILL always gave those two my utter respect!
I grew up near Pittsburgh, and even after his retirement, it was amazing on how over Bruno still was with older fans and non wrestling fans.
Very popular and deservingly so
Great video. Adding one layer there saying that this also applies out of ethnicity or races, but for example CM Punk resoneated with people because he had so much to overcome and was so overlooked like everyone of us in our daily lives. The voice of the voiceless :)
Oh yes, being able to resonate with the fans is key no matter who you are
My favorite ethnic hero, I'll have to go with Bruno Sammartino, Eddie Gurerreo is a close second
Can't go wrong either way
Eventhough it wasn't in the WWF, Ron Simmons win over Vader in Baltimore was my favorite. Although it was a surprise to many, and a spur of the moment decision, it was still a great and historic wrestling event.
Ron Simmons winning was a great moment for sure
That match took in my hometown. I wanted to go to the event but was not able too. I did watch it on TV and was jumping up for join when Ron Simmons beat Vader.
Interesting topic Dave, its always interesting to look back in time and to see just how Bruno impacted the world of wrestling especially prior to the Rock and Roll era of the mid 80s
Yeah he was the very foundation of the entire company without a doubt
I actually liked the Ethnic Hero gimmicks like Wahoo McDaniel and Tatanka. Or on the opposite end of the spectrum Colonel DeBeers and And any one who was more proud of where they came from and not where they currently are like the forgein heels that would proudly fly their own flag and even sign their own National Anthem.
I couldn't get behind Tatanka, despite being part Native. He wasn't a wrestler to just happened to be Native and embraced his culture, his entire gimmick was boiled down to being a Cigar Store Indian stereotype.
Very well made video. Made me think of Rikidozan, who was a national hero for Japanese people, but also an ethnic hero for Korean-Japanese people.
Although he did hide that for a while
Very well put together. This might be your best produced video yet.
Thank you I appreciate that
Great video Dave!
Bruno Sammartino is one of the goats of wrestling, if he never held the WWWF world title for nearly a decade, wrestling probably wouldnt be as known as much as it is nowadays
Def a legend
Not saying Bruno isn't a big name of his era, he did very well for himself, but there is a misconception that he was the absolute face of wrestling at the time. He "only" was in his territory, the champion of the New York territory.
People in Florida, St Louis, the Carolinas, Georgia, Houston, Dallas, the AWA, ect ... weren't going to wrestling to see Bruno. They didn't care much about him because they also had their own local stars. Some of them would be well known in more than one territory, like a current or former NWA champion, guys like Andre the Giant, Terry Funk and others.
Without Bruno, the WWWF probably wouldn't have been a successuful territory in the 60's and 70's but wrestling elsewhere would have been just the same.
What was with the Xenia did that clip before the video started?
And this was strangely uplifting and beautiful video! Kudos to you for tackling such a prickly subject and handling it so well.
It was a shoutout, I got one on her channel too. It was nice collaborating with Xenia. Also, thank you for appreciating the video and how it was handled. And yes this was very difficult, I wanted it out last week, but it was so hard to write. I kept feeling like there was a better way to word things
Great video Dave, you really do make some of the most interesting wrestling related video.
Thank you Lenny, just trying to make wrestling content from a different point of view
One my favorite DKW shows yet. Thanks much for covering this topic.
Thank you for appreciating the video
When I started following wrestling in the 60s, there were people like Antonio Pugliese (Italian), Spyros Arion (Greek), and Victor Rivera (Puerto Rican), who may have held titles but were defintely "ethnic heroes" and were solid wrestlers who won most of their matches. "Ethnic hero" shouldn't be thought of as limited to champions, at least in the "old school." In those days, at the end of interviews (they weren't called "promos" yet), they asked Bruno and others to say something to "your fans in your native language," whereupon Bruno will speak in Italian.
This is some next-level wrestling history.
Thank you very much for taking the time to say so and showing such strong support. This video was a major topic, obviously, but one I really hoped to cover the right way
@@DaveKnowsWrestling
Thank you for supporting your fans, we really appreciate you.
Nice video Dave, it's very obvious you really put alot of thought in a controversial topic(for today). One thing you said about the writing of how the ethnic hero overcomes all odds and succeeds reminded me of why the movie Rocky was a success. In that movie you had a boxer(who happened to be Italian,but that's not part of the plot) who should not even be in the same ring as the Champion. Yet through his hard work and determination he triumphs and wins the championship. It is the story of the American Dream, and I think that still resonates. While we may no longer have the "ethnic champion" of yore, hopefully we'll still get to see the underdog Challenger face and overcome everything in his or her path to become the Champ.
That is def why Rocky is one of my favorite movies of all time
Under Vince McMahon, ethic hero is a no, but foreign villain is a constant.
Yeah I almost mentioned that myself
@@DaveKnowsWrestling Really surprised you didn't.
This was a harder episode to write as I ended up rewriting over and over again. There is loads to say but hard to find nature stopping points before veering too far off. So I made strict choices on when to move on and figured there can always be a follow up video
Interesting topic Dave, nice one. Most of great champions are ethnic heroes. Imagine what WWE would have been like without guys like Bruno Sammartino
Exactly, same could be said about America itself
Great video Dave! Do I detect a hint of a mustache? How many Patrons to get you to grow one?
Ha it was my 'lazy filming in the middle of the night' look. And I don't know how many but let's just say a lot
Drew McIntyre. Seamus. Them being Celtic is a huge part of their character identities.
As specified that is only part of the equation
It’s so weird that this is something that is forgotten with Vince McMahon and yet they pull it off effortlessly with someone like Ilja Dragunov in NXT UK.
It is weird isn't it
Asuka qualifies right?
DAVE has great 👍content ( also my Father and Son are named David, so I am biased)
It's good name for sure. Thank you
I think one more thing that drives home your point that Vince has not gravitated to ethnic heroes would be his aversion to having Southern wrestlers as well.
I do think that counts as well
I know it’s not the topic of the video but I would like to know your thoughts on if there will ever be a superstar that can have a Bruno sammartino title reign? If so then who?
No
I personally don't believe in the "American Dream" but I do enjoying seeing people like Kofi getting to win the WWE Championship.
Good video, but I think the main reason that Vince didn't do the ethnic hero was that his operations had expanded nationwide. Having an Italian-American and a Puerto Rican champion is a great way to get over with the American Northeast, but doesn't have the same effect on the rest of the nation.
I think that is a very good point you raise about the product expanding nationally
So would the Foreigner Heel be the flip side of the Ethnic Hero?
Yes it would
Great video! Can't but feel The Rock may have been oversighted here. Or am I mistaken this as he would have been a heel for his first title reign? Did he really play to his black or Samoan heritage? (When NOT in the Nation of Domation)
As I stated in the video, Ethnic is merely one part of the equation. Focusing on race alone is not all there is
@@DaveKnowsWrestling Of course, I'll admit I got confused myself and didn't mean to come across as ignorant or arrogant. It's an important conversation to have and it was an appreciated video.
So let me get this straight. By your definition an ethnic hero is someone who:
1) is a babyface 2) has an underdog story 3) has a gimmick tied to his ethnicity?
How many wrestlers that actually got over in the modern PPV/television-era fit those categories? Tatanka? Sure, back when promotions were highly regional tapping into an italian, mexican or whatever segment could work. Not so much anymore when the audience is global. That's why ethnic gimmicks work so much better on heels because it's much easier to write them as divisive.
I guess you could work an angle where the "ethnic hero" is working against a discriminatory company but why would anyone do that in this day and age?
I do agree that it is a rare case. But that's what makes it special. And personally I do not think the gimmick works better on heels, as it always tends to backfire sooner or later
Good video. Since it’s on the topic of ethnicity I would have loved to see Booker T or another Descendant of American Slaves having a great run as champion. Kofi was a feel good moment but should not be confused with guys like a Booker T, Mark Henry ect because he is a different ethnicity being Ghanaian American even though he’s black. I believe Bobby Lashley fits into a the DOAS type but if he’s just gonna have a transitional title reign just so that McIntyre can have the belt again then that brings fans like me back to square one.
Bobby is Panamanian.
And Booker should've been booked to the fucking stars! Same with Ron Simmons and Truth! Ron was older and didnt want the champion grind, so I get him refusing that spot. But Booker and Truth? WWE should be ashamed for never giving them a WWE Championship run. Side note... I HATE the brand split, 2 main titles thing. There needs to be 1 unified, undisputed WWE World Heavyweight Champion! 1! And 5 to 6 guys per show, gunning for that top spot.
@@Lunacyk You nailed it! I didn’t know Lashely’s linage goes back to Panama which is good to know. Even if Ron Simmons said he didn’t want to become WWE champion I don’t believe him. When he first came back in 1996 and shedded that horrible Gladiator gimmick he wasn’t that old at all. He was still in his physical prime and became the leader of The Nation that character was WWF Championship worthy but there’s no way Simmons would have gotten past Bret, HBK and guys like Sid (who Vince had a hard on for). I just don’t buy that a guy that came off of being the first black WCW Champion wouldn’t want to have the prestige of being the WWF Champion...that excuse about the grind doesn’t add up. As much as I love and respect Simmons as a man and more importantly a BLACK MAN he tends to soft shoe around these subjects like Mark Henry does. The way society was set up back then and still with structures of power to even be employed at places like WWE you cannot come off as being too pro black because being considered a black militant will take you out of the run for opportunities and make you persona-non-grata. Simmons,Henry, and Booker T knew know how to walk that fine line. If Simmons was anything like The Farooq character in real life backstage would have been regulated to Tom Brandi status.
No one can compete with Bruno Sammartino’s WWWF Championship record. And Eddie Guerrero’s promos were always awesome (especially in the WWE) but it never overshadowed his in ring capabilities. I’d put Eddie above Bruno but it’s really close
They are both great legends, I understand why it is hard to choose
I'd say some of the change was due to VKM taking it country wide in the 80's. What sold out in NYC probably wasn't going to sell out well across the country. Enter the All American Hulk Hogan.
That is a very good point about the national expansion
I don't think he qualifies as an "Ethnic hero", but I think the modern iteration of it would be the "working class hero" like Stone Cold Steve Austin, Mick Foley or CM Punk. Guys who "aren't supposed to make it" and represent the viewing audience more than the people who are.
I do think that is a category unto itself. There is something to be said for wrestlers that aren't supposed to make it who do
Is Hulk Hogan just an Oompa Loompa with gigantism? He just looks so orange...
I've personally never got why some people get deep orange tans. But there are a lot of trends I will never understand
@@DaveKnowsWrestling Maybe Hogan's not actually a tan? What if that's his original skin color all along?
Along these lines, would you classify Apollo Crews as an ethnic hero/villain in his current gimmick?
Would Ricky Steamboat also count as an Ethnic Hero, being he was one of the few Asian wrestlers to be depicted in a Heroic, Respectful light?
Well his story of being an underdog never really came up too much
Does Bianca BelAir count as an ethnic hero? I know that there was a lot of buzz about her headlining WrestleMania
there's still alot of wrestler's in WWE with different ethnicities & race's
No one here is saying that there isn't
My Ethnic hero is Batista
I think like most things, The "Ethnic Hero" was an idea that died out in time. In the modern day, given how painfully immature WWE can be at times when depicting people who aren't White or American/Canadian (in particular their terrible history w/ the depiction of Japanese talent) I think it should be left in the past. Also, consider the reactive nature of the internet, in particular Cancel Culture.
The last wrestler who I think was an "Ethnic Hero" was probably Eddie Guerrero, considering how he always embraced his Latino/Mexican roots, and his "Lie, Cheat, Steal" gimmick took a humorous jab at the negative stereotypes that were associated w/his people. (Crime Tyme played w/ a similar idea, but would not be so lucky).
I think what makes such a Hero work is that they are embraced not only by their Ethnic group, but by those outside of it that still like/relate to the performer. When Eddie shouted "Viva La Raza!" He wasn't just talking about Latinos, he was speaking to his fans, who come from all over the world.
THAT was La Familia.
I do agree that Eddie was an Ethnic Hero, but I also think Kofi was too
@@DaveKnowsWrestling IMHO, Kofi was an underdog tale. It was him as a person being held back, i don't think race played much of a role, unlike the Booker T/HHH angle (which Book should have won! one of the WORST booking decisions EVER!)
Ah but as I said repeatedly in the video.. this is not about race
I remember Booker T was supposed to be an Etnic Hero, but the writing was so bad that it came off as more unintentionally racist.
"unintentionally"
@@connorkinsman3164 I say Unintentionally because it seemed obvious that Booker was going to win at Mania the way they where originally telling the story, only for Trips to beat him and continue his reign of terror. They set up Booker in the story to be a conquering hero.
Yeah I am pretty sure they did it on purpose
Booker DID Won that title.....as a Joke Heel.
Dave, do u think nowadays WWE stray away from this type of thing because perhaps people are more sensitive with how certain ethnicities are portrayed?
That's an interesting point to raise out!
No, as I said Vince Jr never really did it until Eddie, over 20 years after taking over. And if sensitivity was an issue then WWE wouldn't be doing a lot of stuff that they do, so clearly they don't care about that. But the concept of someone representing diversity as a hero is a harder concept for some to get... as some in the comments are proving
@@DaveKnowsWrestling Good point, I get u
But have they? Drew McIntyre, Seamus...being Celtic is part of their character identities-even Hulk Hogan was named to represent the Irish...
Ferox965 again, I specified it multiple times, that the story being told must also fit a specific criteria
Good video Dave if you ask me there's nothing wrong about a wrestler with an ethnic gimmick appealing to his or her perspective ethinic demographic.
There isn't, but I find that it is often the case, those individuals end up speaking to all of us
I don’t if this count or not but triple h done it in nxt a few times
It has happened in the midcard and in NXT, but I am more focusing on the top title for this video
When Kofi won he was booked as an ethnic hero
Yes that's true
If only they booked him well after the fact
Thing is i liked kofi in his 2010 run but after the new day it was a goofy comedy skit because they were presented as idiots
And The Rock?
Does not fit the description
The reason Vince isn't a fan of the ethnic hero... He is too preoccupied with the stereotypical foreign heel.
He sure is
What about The Rock as Babyface Champion?
Forget it. Should've waited till furhter in the video. :-D
Always gotta wait till the end of the video to comment
@@DaveKnowsWrestling Sometimes I'm too fast for my own good. :-D
I think this is what andrade will try to do since he's calling himself "the face of latinos" now in aew.
Can't do it no more. Ethnic heroes are Racist to some people, myself I'd like to see a Col. Debeers angle. Get some real Heat
I do not see how you arrived at that conclusion
@@DaveKnowsWrestling jumped before I looked meaning I wrote b4 I heard u out. Having a Bruno, Pedro or JYD seems like a thing of the past tho8
Hogan speaks three languages, American, English and bs
Also Bruno was just better in general
Better than who?
Is that girl your sponsor?What was Bruno fined for?Vincent SR stopped using Ethnic Champions because he was tired of riots every time a heel did something to them. Where are ethnic heroes anywhere?
Xenia is a fellow TH-camr that I collaborated with. Bruno was banned from wrestling for missing shows in the NWA. It has been speculated that he was double booked and was never made aware of the other shows which caused him to miss them. Vince SR only "stopped" at the end and even during Backlund's run he kinda did it with Inoki, although it was retconned. So I don't know if "stopped" is the right word. And they are everywhere... like in MSG at the G1 supercard show where the IWGP Heavyweight Championship changed hands outside of Japan for the first time and I was there live to see it
So, dose The Rock, and Randy Savage counts as ethnic champion hero.
As far as I remember, the only times WWE acknowledged The Rock's ethicity was during the Nation (when he was still a midcarder) and during the Rikishi/Stone Cold thing. Most wrestling fans probably don't even know he's half black and half Samoan.
I don't know what ethnicity Randy Savage was and I don't think it was ever important to his character.
The Rock with a Canadian dad and Samoan mother and Savage with a Russian mother and Italian father....how will that be worked out?
@@Millwall77 They are not regular white
I will say it again, this is not about race
You may say Vince McMahon isn't racist but he was definitely racially insensitive with... many segments he OKed. Peacock is currently deleting them on their network as we speak.
What I said was that I wasn't calling him a racist... I didn't say he wasn't either
Sadly political correctness has killed any ethnic anything in wrestling 😢. Which is really bad, sorry ethnic rivalries made wrestling!!!! Not racism!! But ethnic rivalries!! I absolutely love Japanese culture and there ppl.. But, they had every right to hate us Americans, obvious wrestling gold done right!! (Like giant baba and inoki, they knew how to book). Good video! Wrestling is missing this!!! This kept wrestling alive! I was born in 1974, and my parents are European immigrants.... yeah they all love Bruno back than....
I don't know, as I mention Kofi is a great example and that happened just a couple years ago
Dave knows race, nationality ,ethnicity, awesome video man the rock (samoan race ) Chris benoit (canadian nationality ) Eddie gurrerro Mexican American ethnicity
The Rock is 1/2 Samoan and 1/2 African-American/African-Canadian. No mention of Former World Champions such as Yokozuna, Mark Henry, The Great Khali, Booker T?
I think WWE should Re-Push Nakamura as a Hero to Asian Americans.
I do too... I don't think it'll happen, but..
Well Vince in his old age has proven to be unapologetically xenophobic and racially biased towards the talent he pays, he'd rather portray them as crude stereotypes then as credible competitors just look at Asuka
Well I won't argue that
Vincent Kennedy McMahon is an out-of-date boomer who don't know Jack schitt about these days wrestling he's only recently warmed up to the idea of women's wrestling being a real thing even though it's been a real thing for the past 25 years at least.
*his storytelling method is lazy his most common story tropes are:*
*Your foreign so you must be the heel*
*Big men are best men a little guy can't be the world Champion*
*Babyfaces can't be smart*
*Heels must not be cheered for under any circumstances*
*Women can't be wrestlers*
*Like give it a rest grandad. this ain't the 1970s anymore.*
Vince McMahon is a creative genius sometimes, Triple H is there most likely there to try and talk him down from things most of the time
Might I point out that Vince didn't actually run WWF till the 80s and not the 70s
Holy fuck is that Xenia girl's ad annoying!!
Unlike Vince, His Dad had the Balls to push Foreign Wrestlers to be The Face & World Champions.
Yeah apple fell far from the tree on that one