The 10 Things Wrong With Contemporary Worship Music
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 มิ.ย. 2024
- The 10 things that are wrong with contemporary worship music.
Clips in the video from:
@CanonPress
@DavidWesley
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It makes me cry seeing the classic hymns overtooken by today's worship songs.
I stay alone in the weekdays as a student. I longed for Sundays the most, to go to church and worship and also meet friends and cheer up.
But recently, the church I attend started singing these CCMs.
I dont feel it anymore. Makes me soo sad.
“Overtooken?” As a student hanging out alone during the week, your time could have been better spent studying English.
@@TenMinuteTripswhat is wrong with you, his English is fine what are you talking. Go get a life
The Hymns WERE the Contemporary worship of THEIR day.
New songs will rise up from New musicians stricken with God's love and grace !!!
You are SPOT ON my friend. Too many songs today fail to connect the congregation with God, which is the main purpose of a worship leader or team. In far too many churches most of the people have stopped singing, as they can't even hear themselves, let alone anyone else, over the volume of the praise team. It is truly sad.
It's sad to say but I doubt the worship leaders goal is to connect with God but disconnect
The main purpose of our worship is to give God honor and His due glory for who He is. It has nothing to do with connecting to Him.
I couldn't sing in any Church as I can't sing. But in a modern Church I wouldn't care as I would drown out in loud pop music. If I went there which I don't
CCM is what you get when you write songs not with the goal of scriptural worship but with the goal of being catchy, chart-topping, and algorithm-driven.
A lot of songs nowadays can be described this way.
This, in a nutshell.
I grew up in the late 80s and 90s, on classical musical and in choir. I love singing Sandy Patty and Sondheim, so as I sat in service today and literally counted us singing the same line over twenty times, not only was I bored to tears but reminds me of more a pagan chant than actually worship. I know that some greatest " worship leaders" were also some the greatest composers in history and your video gives a great explanation.
This is where Catholics are so much better when it comes to their worship services. Nobody is focusing on that expensive electric guitar that they're playing which has no place in church or what's the latest Hillsong/Chris Tomlin/MIchael W. Smith/Elevation worship song they're playing. Instead it's all old hymns to God!
I watch a lot of very knowledgeable pastors who sit & discuss the 'un-harmonics' &/or the droning on & on of many 'New Age' churches . People are walking up after being put to sleep ! It is monotonous it's dangerous besides ; the idea of tempting young vulnerable folks into mind numbing robotism trances is against God's Designs , Jesus speaks against the schemer ; we know who that is ! I also grew up listening to my Mom , who didn't get to attain her goal of an operatic singer , but did join with a lager group of local women known as The Ebell Club that performed plays , 'street operas' & other forms of entertainment for the sake of extensive charity providence . I heard her practice singing & all the highs & lows thruout some sort of scale . On many days , the lady next door would join in & they'd duel away - usually - to my embarrassment when I & my friends were around playing ! Har ! I was proud of her when she was up on some stage & having the tie of her life though & I NEVER forgot what a real NOTE was s'posed to sound like ! Later in Jr Hi , Music Appreciation taught us knuckle heads the hidden world inside finer music - like Peter & The Wolves by Tchaikovsky ! We'd have to write at what time the music reflected the story INSIDE the music , but the varying sounds . Hard at first due to Junioritis minds but neat when we found the way in ! I have never forgotten anything of the musical learning since my first memory of it . Thanks God for Music !
@@jamesjames6601I thought what you're saying about Catholic worship was generally true as well, but then one day I was listening to Hillsongs "so will I" and one of the guys on the site passing me in the stairwell told me they sing that in his church, so I asked where he went to church and found out he was a Catholic. Since then I've found that it's actually much more common than you would think in the Catholic church, at least in Latin congregations. 🤷♂️
Also when the same thing is repeated over and over and over it can put people in a trance. It's what Hitler did.
The Hymns WERE the Contemporary worship of THEIR day. Then Sandy Patti and Larnell Harris and Co. HAD THEIR day. Come
On now...
New songs will rise up from New musicians stricken with God's love and grace !!!
As a side note, I think there is an 11th thing you forgot: when you're only singing new music, you loose the powerful "nostalgia" factor. Tradition is a pinnacle of faith-- whether we consciously think is should be or not. Singing the hymns your mother hummed to herself while cooking dinner, or the one you were told was played at your grandparent's wedding has the power to deeply connect us into a service. Or think of all the classic Christmas hymns that prepare us for the season! I can't think of a single contemporary Christmas song that hits with the same exuberance, power, and.. well, joy, as "Joy to the World". I went to a Christmas service last year that only had one old, "classic" Christmas hymn... I don't even remember which it was. It was un-singable: purely acoustic and slowed waaay down so it would be ~moody~ and ~thought-provoking~. No one knew how to sing along. It was silly-- awkward even.
And I don't have a problem with singing new music: it can be refreshing! Every generation should have songs which reflect what is happening in their time and place! And, sure, a lot of the old hymns are dull, or complicated, or haven't aged well, but plenty of them are still great and worth singing and being part of the lasting history of the church. All this is to say: we need more music selections that are thoughtfully curated, and not just "popular and cool."
Yeah, and the nostalgia factor can shift from generation to generation... I'm nostalgic for Rich Mullins like my mom is nostalgic for marching songs lol
Beautifully articulated, Hannah, major kudos! I think much of the modern evangelical Church, perhaps inadvertently or intentionally, has chosen in its worship mindset to disregard the more seasoned segment of its community and thereby cast off or inanely rewrite traditional hymns in hopes of attracting a much younger target audience. Incidentally, I'm 62, have been a believer for over 44 years, and in 99% of evangelical churches across the denominational spectrum that I've visited or attended regularly, I've not felt at home when it comes to the singing portion of the services.
Popular and cool means dull and repetative. All the good stuff was labelled cheesy and relegated to the past.
I thought I was the only one exhausted by contemporary worship. It's so vapid. I miss growing up and having congregational worship. One of the differences - in some songs we used to sing verses just for men, verses just for women, and choruses all together. Was the best.
Now I am encouraged to stand in the spot I am in and have "my own moment with God" while everyone starts individually singing random melodies in a lyric less transition. We might as well all go home and do that!
Jesus, you're my space lover. Your powerful love thrusts in an out of my willing mush. I feel you inside me, filling me, energizing me. I get on my knees and worship you oh Jesus until your Spirit covers me!
I have been troubled by the incessant, albeit seemingly benign push towards rockin, trendy, edgy, four-chord, tear jerking "worship" music in church. Unless you attend Hillsong church, typically, only a handful of people try to get into it, while most stand there alienated with bovine stares, not really able to participate, as the music is simply not structured (let's be honest) for optimal congregational singing. Many churches have basically just bought into this movement, perhaps due to peer pressure, and the mantra of success, with not much clear thinking, because, well.... Newsboys rock, and....... that really big successful church near you - with caramel lattes. Ironically, as a hip drummer and drum&bass enthusiast, I am mustering the courage to come out of the closet and lead worship more using Psalms, hymns, and responsive readings. I think that the church has spent 3-4 decades focusing on relevance instead of God, and has just wasted so much time, while alienating a large chunk of it's adherents. So , thank you for that informative, intellectually robust, truthful but not mean, critique of modern "worship". As the Bible says, "test all things".
While we all pat ourselves on the back saying “this is fine.” “we’re all good.”… clearly something is wrong and nobody wants to acknowledge it.
I agree with you that we could use more lyrics based on Psalms. We used to have that back in the 1980s. Did you see the movie "The Jesus Music" that came out in 2021 ??? I enjoyed the first part of it, but in the end they seem to conclude that contemporary Christian music had a rebirth in the 2000s with a strong focus on worship music. That may be true when looking at $$$, but we have lost something in our almost total departure from Psalms etc.
A sense of relief after watching this video I thought I am being overly sensitive. Subscribed to your channel. Very thoughtful and educational. Thank you! ❤❤❤
Excellent Video and Lesson! There really is a lot to consider here. As a lifetime pianist and organist in church, my personal belief of what we are seeing now is a result of few things. First, people who are up on the platform do not deserve to be up there. I find this especially with guitarists, as so many can't read music, and know just a few chords. Second, the "dumbing down" of the lyrics, by just repeating the same thing over and over and over again. Third, because of the lack of educated musical knowledge, many "songwriters" just don't have the skill to produce excellent content at the highest level. Remember, it's not about YOU! God expects "EXCELLENCE" and today, most of the stuff I hear is mediocrity at best!
This goes for visual media as well, something many producers of christian movies don't seem to understand.
YES AND AMEN. I covered much of this in a class at our church recently. We've been moving back from garage band contemporary to classic, congregational hymnody. SO good to hear this from another voice!
@Sarah Hodgins HAR ! INdeed ! Your Reply is so valid !! ' I Love To Hear The Story ---' !
John, this is a great talk. I lead worship in my church, more often than not using contemporary songs. Often times I see these kinds of lists and they're full of straw men and cheap shots - they give me nothing but eye rolls. Your solid, well presented, arguments give me something work with - practical ideas to help me do music better. I appreciate the effort here, it's much appreciated.
Yeah, I think a lot of those articles are produced haphazardly and just to get attention. I’ve been keeping a list for a long time And then just decided to make a video about it. I also noticed that there were a lot of technical musical reasons that are often overlooked that I wanted to highlight.
@@TheBibleisArt I think an interesting technical matter leading to diminished chord variety is the movement from keyboard instruments to guitar. In a small, local, church where you don't have pro musicians, it's much more realistic for Sally piano player to work in some oddball chords than it is for a middle of the road guitar player to get to some Eb minor add9 or some such. Speaking as a mediocre guitar player myself.... Though I think the guitar can be better suited to some rhythmic styles than a piano (which serves a different role than an organ...) so I can see pluses and minuses however you go. It's probably good to play to the strengths of your medium while also being conscious of its shortcomings and not letting them box you into a certain musical corner.
And most of your points sparked similar internal dialogue for me so, again, we'll thought out video.
@@dalelarsonmusic thanks. Yeah, I completely agree.
I'm glad you mentioned harmony as well as melody. The old songs in the hymnals had the musical notes printed which makes it easier to follow whereas the new songs have only the lyrics printed on the screen.
I think the printed hymnals did more for society than notate the harmony parts for worshippers -- they helped a lot of us learn how to sing, and how to sing harmony. I am surprised by how many younger people, even people majoring in music in college, are weak when it comes to harmony.
I always found it odd how they never provide the sheet music for songs. Though it’s not too difficult to follow along with the worship team since the melodies are so generic 😅 but having hymnals allowed me to learn a lot about music and how to harmonize
This was great it hits all the reasons why we need to go back to hymns and Psalms and why I feel so frustrated with singing in church.
amen
This identified many of the technical details of the "contemporary" "Christian" music I never understood. Hearing and seeing your production in this video helps me explain the problems to people I know. The music of the church should not be shallow, cheap, or unchallenging. Now I know why my categories of shallow, cheap, and unchallenging are insufficient. Thank you for going to this depth, organizing it so clearly, and helping people like me understand intellectually why we are so put off by the new church music. You have used your God-given talents and knowledge to serve the Lord well, brother!
I have a B.A. and M.A. in music composition (my neo-romantic piano concerto is on youtube). This man knows what he's talking about, and his conclusions are sound. The minimalist approach he observes is often found in new classical music, as well. This man has done his homework and persevered through a difficult subject. So thankful for this video.
Excellent, John!! And I love the comments from others since they confirm that I'm not the only one who thinks this. One thing I'll add... contemporary church music is the primary reason I don't invite non-Christian friends to Sunday services. Their eyes would roll and they would check out before the sermon begins, perhaps distracting them, making them less open to hearing God's word, and less willing to return to hear more and connect with Christians.
Excellent video! Thank you for covering this topic in such great detail. For the past 6 months, I’ve been attending a church which uses contemporary worship music and I feel like a spectator for the first half an hour of the service. Even when some of the songs do start becoming a little more familiar to me, I won’t hear them again until another few weeks and they are still too difficult for me to sing due to the rhythms & range. I don’t know what to do with myself during the worship and I feel a bit useless since I’m not able to praise God in the way that I should be able to. It’s actually made me feel quite sad and anxious at times. I’m conscious of the fact that I’m not participating and feel guilty for it even though it isn’t my fault. Last Sunday, I went to a church that sings traditional hymns and the difference was like night and day. I didn’t know most of the songs, but I was able to join in and felt myself naturally becoming in-tune with the melodies since they were predictable and consistent. For the first time, I felt I was truly worshipping God and was happy to do this amongst other believers. I felt like I was part of the congregation rather than an outsider. My mind was more focused too, since I wasn’t stood for half an hour wondering what to do with myself whilst everyone else was singing.
… every word you said is my experience exactly. It is disheartening because sometimes the sermons are so good at churches with CCM while some churches with old fashioned hymns have terrible quality sermons. Not really sure which way to lean…
You make so many good points in this video, both musical, lyrical, and theological. As a frequent worship team member, and occasional worship leader, I bring up these kinds of points often and am usually met with glassy stares.
You put into words what I’ve been feeling for years
Thank you for this video. I personally enjoy singing and worship at church, but whenever it comes to these types of music I always feel like something is missing- I rarely ever listen to Christian music on its own, whether that be on the radio or in Spotify, but I never understood exactly why. Before watching this I recognized a few of the points somewhat on my own like the lack of unity in the lyrics or that the music sounded plain in some way, but since I’m not as well educated in Music I didn’t understand it very well. So yes, this was a fantastic video essay, and I’m looking forward to whatever you have next.
This is such an excellent analysis! And it resonates so much with me! I’ve struggled to find worship music that is truly inspiring, and as a musician this analysis makes so much sense to me.
I grew up in a church that used the old hymnal and basically a piano. I love the "old" Gospel songs. The new stuff is one of the reasons I cannot seem to find a church. It's all a bunch of canned music played too loud, the "praise team" is putting on show in most churches I have been to. I don't want to be entertained, I want to sing the songs I already know and actually mean something to me other than "Jesus is my boyfriend".
This is the same for me. I got exposed to contemporary worship when I started university, and had a hard time fitting in as well.
Wow, thank you John. This was really refreshing and enlightening.
Wonderful video. Thought provoking. You are a talented man. God bless.
It's a shame. At my church all I want to do is open the hymnal. The answer is right in front of us.
Excellent video. Thank you for putting the work in on this. You've stated very well, what I've had a hard time describing at times because I am not a musician.
A friend from long ago shared this clip with me. It struck me as a thoughtful, well-organized introduction to the topic. As a worship leader, I find myself in conversation with church members all the time about what they prefer and don't prefer regarding worship music. And often, their tastes are shaped by what they hear in contemporary culture. That''s always been the case, of course. Your video provides a framework for discussion. I'm very grateful for your work, and I wish you felt that you had more time to elaborate on your arguments. You seemed rushed and I wanted you to feel like you could elaborate more fully.
Wouldn't it be interesting to hear you in discussion with someone who advocates for contemporary Christian worship music? What an enlightening dialogue that would be. Bless you, sir.
The problem is that types of music can cause emotion, but that emotion is not necessarily spiritual. A person living in sin can come out of a ccm concert feeling great, emotionally. Ideally they should come out of worship under conviction.
AMEN!!!!
sir you made great sense in your explanation in the video. This is something I have said to friends in the past . Too many of the songs today do not take you to the throne of God in worship and they are not congregational. in Psalm 133 It speaks of the unity "and where there is strength " and it's there God commands the blessing " that is in the congregation singing.
So true. If i hear another song in 6/8, 70-80bpm, in Ionian/Major key, my head gonna explode
Technical problems, yes. Excellent reasoning. Excellent work, sir.
Also more things wrong with the people of CCM: Among the best-known names does this before the confirmed play-date. 1st, the hosting church or hosting entity will send a non-refundable check for $2500. After that clears, then contractual negotiations will begin. Among requirements: Guaranteed minimum house sales. Guaranteed minimum merchandise sales. Before the show there will be a very comfortably furnished "green" room. Above and beyond the contractual money, the host will provide a catered buffet to include a minimum of 40% organics. Each musician and singer will have 6 bottles of water, 3 at room temperature, 3 chilled to a certain temperature. A licensed chiropractic is highly recommended to be on-site.
CCM has become JUST another industry, similar to ATT or NIKE or building homes or grocery stores.
CCM is a never-ending talent show with everyone maneuvering and posturing and writing for the biggest audiences, pay-off and awards.
How many original disciples were multi-millionaire stars for Jesus? How many industry awards have been given posthumously to Fanny Crosby or the writer of Amazing Grace?
You cannot find the old hymns from the old hymnbooks on any "christian" radio station these days. Why not? Bcz there is no money in that.
The "christian" community in America loves the world and loves the things of the world. The American "christian' community doesn't even want the Rapture.
I grieve for the America that no longer exists. I may have presented this a bit harshly, but what will be put through on Judgment Day? Judgment Day does not bode well for you or me. Nowhere in the Bible have I found any suggestion that "christians" skip-out on Judgment Day.
Time to humble ourselves (including me) more and more before the Lord.
Very well said!
I was curious if anyone felt how I felt and you explained better then I could. Very high quality and interesting and you pointed out things I missed. Great job.
This was an amazing video essay. Easy to follow even as an amateur musician. Thank you.
Thanks
Thank you so much for your hard work in making this video. I really appreciate it. I've just begun leading worship at my church and the pastors have asked me to lead a small "creative team". Leading and being in front of people makes me nervous, but I knew if I didn't just do it, all the older folks in our church wouldn't get to sing any hymns! I've been reading scripture between songs as well because God's Word is more powerful than anything we could ever say. Especially in a biblically illiterate culture.
I really dislike a lot of contemporary worship as it feels very lazy musically and very me-centered. All the Hillsong music sounds alike to me. Currently, my favorite band is Celtic Worship. 🙂
Thank you for giving me a lot to think about as far as how to move forward. Keep making videos!
Awesome knowledge and wisdom!
I noticed a few years ago that today's worship songs replace the original Trinity with the new, namely "Me, Myself and I".
This video was very informative and explains why some people say that contemporary Christian worship music sounds the same. And it really does.
It was so interesting to hear your thoughts on this. I'm not a music student but I really enjoyed listening and learning. The video was well thought out and had logical opinions. God bless you brother. I learnt so much.. And this has me thinking about modern music in a whole new way. I truly think we have taken lightly the faults found in modern worship music. What a powerful message.
Awesome vid, More music related videos please 😊
Thank you for this excellent in depth explanation! I have known there was something missing in modern songs and preferred what you described as more complex yet simple style. I didn't know why till I came across your video. You have done the Lord and the world a tremendous service thru this video. I am forever indebted to you for shining the light on this topic. I am sharing your video with others.
Just a clarification... Dynamic range actually refers to variability in volume/intensity, not the range of pitches/notes. I'm glad my analysis was helpful otherwise. :)
Thanks, David.
Thank you for the video, it really consolidated many of the misgivings I have/had with CCM sung in our local church. I am absolutely not against CCM, happy to work with both traditional and contemporary music, but one thing that really bugged me was this habit of just "aping" how the song was performed, regardless that the videoclip was for "performance, sales and promotion" as well.
Extraneously long intros with lots of solo instrument show-off lines is one thing, but the thing I really had to fight against was the inclusion of "vocables" (lalala, oh, oh, oh etc). So many times, I had to remind the WL and team that singing, "Oh" including one egregious example where each time they went to the start (da capo), there were 14 "oh's"! Had to remind them seriously that in the same number of syllables, we could have sung, "Oh for a thousand tongues to sing, my great redeemer's praise", which ironically is the first hymn in the hymnal! So much doctrinal truth that could be unpacked in that first line, but instead, we'd wasted congregational time (x100s of attendees) singing these "on trend" syllables instead.
Honestly, I had to work so hard to remind them that if they sang any more oh's, we'd have a Beyonce or Kanye West concert; embarassed laughs and sheepish looks then, but I hope I had made my point then and it stuck. My concerns that words used for praise of the Almighty needed to be special, reserved and set apart. Each of the lines of traditional hymns when Googled (not a rigourous method of course) instantly links to its text in part of the hymn. But all these vocables, ah, oh, yeah are just part of really poor songwriting and simply copying the current trend that to write a hit song, you need to include them quite mindlessly.
Brother , thank you for this comprehensive input on what problems plague the contemporary state of Christian music. I would now like to offer my input on this as a Christian musician.
For the most part, I found myself in very strong agreement with what you said, and I commend you for your wisdom and insight. However, I believe that some additions and corrections should be made, and I will try to explain them in a concise manner, following the chronological order set by the video. I hope you will accept this as constructive criticism.
-- On point #2. You are absolutely right that tempo ought to be informed by the hymn text, but that is not its only extent of it; text should also inform other aspects of music such as volume, registration, orchestration, and harmonisation. I am very sad to see that many Christian musicians nowadays (both classical and CCM) fail to adhere to this standard.
-- On point #4. "The great hymns of the faith are both wildly interesting and singable", amen! Two of the most telling case studies are, I think, "Hills of the North" and "My song is Love Unknown".
-- "Minor keys are completely absent from CCM", it is true. I think it's because of the overall thrust to make everything as steamrolled and inoffensive as possible, but also because of the ever-undying falsehood that "major is happy, minor is sad", which is a whole topic of discussion of its own. (Seriously, though, in what way is "Abide with me" (E flat major) a happy hymn? In what sense is "At the name of Jesus" (E minor) a sad hymn?)
Believe it or not, even traditional church music suffers from the effects of this mentality -- among others, in the form of the unspoken assumption that all minor-key hymns must end on a Tierce de Picardie. Needless to say, I refuse to abide by that rule.
-- "Church music is congregational music". Here lies my first major point of disagreement. Though it be self-explanatory that congregational hymnody gets the lion's share of the music in a church service, such a blanket equation unfairly chucks into the dustbin a whole treasure trove of music, assembled over the course of many centuries, which can and ought to edify all believers, and does not constitute mere concert music (I am primarily thinking of choral compositions and plainchant).
-- On harmony. First off, removing the tierce from a chord (or, as we say, "open fifths") does not necessarily make it more fuzzy or "floating". Open fifths are a very Mediaeval-typical way to conclude a piece of music, and I usually employ them to convey some sort of strictness or seriosity. Also, by way of example, the first 14 bars of Anton Bruckner's monumental "Te Deum" are written exclusively in open fifths, yet it is one of the most regal and decisive passages ever composed. Suspensions are a whole different issue.
-- On point #5, Introductions, I disagree with your assessment for at least one reason. One of the most effective ways to introduce a really grand hymn is with a fanfare, and in fanfares the main theme of the following hymn is either hidden (D. Willcocks, "Hark the herald angels") or absent (G. Jacobs, "God save the King").
However, I believe that there is a problem, and that is overuse; when such an overwhelming majority of hymns/songs start with unrelated introductions, something is not quite right.
-- On point #6, Range. No, no, no, no, no, no, the dynamic range is not the same as the vocal range! The dynamic range is, as the name, suggests the range of dynamics in a hymn, which is highly dependent on the musicians involved (and unfortunately, some are not too creative in this regard; they stick on a grand forte from beginning to end and never attempt anything creative).
Also, with regard to the vocal range itself, one octave (which, as it seems to be suggested in the video, is from C to C') is far too conservative. In writing and leading hymns, as an organist, what I consider a rational range for most people is C3 to D4 for women, plus a tolerance for occasional runs up to E4 and down to Bb2, and the same one octave lower for men. Most of the classic hymn tunes which I can quote off the top of my head (Love Unknown, Old 100th, Kings Weston, Aberystwyth, Adeste Fideles, Easter Hymn) easily fail your C-to-C' criterion, yet they are all but singable by most people.
-- On point #8, I have often said, verbatim: "Most hymns and songs written nowadays constitute not self-consistent unities with a developing but constant theme, but rather hodgepodges of biblical or biblicoid statements." Thanks for letting me know I'm not the only one.
And let's not even discuss how simplistic the vocabulary and linguistic arsenal of CCM is.
-- On point #9, on too many new songs. Though I absolutely agree with you, I can guarantee from personal experience that discretion is sorely needed in order for the exact opposite situation to be avoided. At a church where I served as organist in the past, there was a lovely old hymnal with more than 400 beautiful traditional hymns; it is doubtful whether we ever sang more than 50 of them. Every time I tried to introduce an item from the hymnal which was not well-known, I was dismissed out of hand with the excuse that "the congregation doesn't know it".
I will dedicate a separate comment to the additions which I would like to make to your list. Thanks for your time.
This is fabulous! Thank you so much! I have been subjected to so-called worship music for five years, and am around people who love it, and I’ve been analyzing my objections to it. You hit on every one of them, except for the money issue: these artists seem to care most about getting their songs copyrighted so they can earn money from them. They even take traditional hymns, add a little twist, and copyright them.
Now I have something concrete and well stated to ask people to listen to, so they understand why I object so strongly to this music.
God bless you!
Thank you for confirming my thoughts that the new songs (as they are currently written and performed) are not meant for congregational singing. Also, when I’m singing in church I feel like the congregations voices are more often than not, completely drowned out by the loudness of the instruments. I would have to sing very very loudly almost to the point of yelling to feel like I’m even contributing at all. Isn’t that an issue in of itself?
Absolutely it's a genuine and irrefutable issue, which sadly most so-called 'worship leaders ' are blind and deaf to acknowledge. Whenever I hear my pastor say, "didn't they do a great job", after the praise band's performance is completed, I want to puke (metaphorically 😅) and I'm tempted to yell out, "a great job of doing WHAT?"
Pathetically, this is the unavoidable result when churches pursue pragmatism and popularity at the expense of holiness and biblical fidelity 😢. God grant His people authentic repentance in this vital area of the Christian life 🙏.
I am a songwriter and have recently uploaded videos
on TH-cam. Hope to hear
from you
Exactly especially guitars and drums
Brother, you absolutely nailed this video. Kudos to you on this. Thank you for making this, and saying all you say with a kind attitude (which you do much better than I do). Blessings for this content!
Thank you for this excellent, in-depth analysis! This is way more approachable than videos that condemn modern worship music for more superficial reasons.
Amen. Thanks for reaffirming what I've felt for some time. I don't feel so weird now.
Thank you for this! I no longer can listen to CCM as it all sounds the same-same range, no musicality-does no one study music theory anymore? In addition, I have walked away from leading worship as the younger team members insist on singing the contemporary radio "hits" rather than songs that are singable. I really appreciate your explanation of range. Most of these contemporary worship songs are lead by men with high tenor voices, making it nearly impossible for women to sing along with them. God bless you!
This was brilliant. God bless you sir.
Your welcome
This was a good video essay. I wished you had made a video essay on creating music that is transformational and meditative on the truth of who Yahweh is like the beautiful construction of scripture
You hit the nail on the head. Musical skill isn't considered anymore. It's how hip the leaders are and can they strum 3 chords
My guy, excellent video! I rejoice to see it! I want to see more worship songs like what you're describing! One of my favorite points of yours was that a song has internal integrity, like you described; no circus tent hospitals. I lead worship at my church, and this gives me a lot to consider when picking and playing songs.
I want to correct you on just one point, because it's important to me. Don't mix individualism up with subjectivism. You made a quick comment about that being a major problem in modern worship music. I actually think MORE individualism, not less, is what worship music needs. Subjectivism denies objective reality in favor of personal experience. Individualism accepts objective reality AND personal experience, but doesn't allow a person's experience redefine reality as with subjectivism. Individualism just acknowledges human beings ontologically as individuals, accepting that each person has their own rational faculties to assess values. I don't share a mind or a body with you, though we are Christ's body and are being renewed individually after the mind of Christ. I have my own mind and body, and I live according to what I rationally assess to be my values. We want that; we want people to value God individually for themselves using their minds, to worship him in Spirit and truth. The great hymns weren't written subjectively, but they were written individualistically. Consider this line:
Great is thy faithfulness, o God my Father
There is no shadow of turning with thee
Thou changest not, thy compassions they fail not
Great is thy faithfulness, Lord, unto me
The writer assesses God's objective nature, then acknowledges how God has been objectively faithful to HIM, and returns gratitude to God for it. He is thinking of God in relation to himself as an individual. You'll find that pattern across many songs, hymns, and psalms. Many people criticize modern worship songs for using I and me a lot, but older hymns do it to. The problem isn't the use of I and me, but that the focus is on subjective feeling over objective reality. God is objectively good for every individual, whether that person subjectively feels it or not. We want people to value him, both objectively and for themselves.
TL;DR We want people to use their minds to rationally assess God as their highest personal value, because he is objectively the most precious thing that is, but must be embraced by every individual heart and soul. That is not subjectivism; it is individualism, and more, not less of it, needs to be applied in worship music.
Great and objective analysis of contemporary worship. You presented your arguments clearly without necessarily being “personal” against those who cater and practice contemporary worship. Other YT channels on contemporary worship issues are simply so negative criticising and worse, being judgmental to the point that there seems no good or something valuable when someone or a church is engaged in this type of worship. My concern is they are just being utterly unreasonable in their crituque.
Good day Sir! More power to your YT channel.
So well done. Thank you.
As a musician/singer I’ve been in many services where so many new songs are used, the whole congregation just stands there waiting for a song they know. Then, when one is played, they all come alive singing and praising God!
I myself only practice hymns and older well written choruses. And as an acoustic guitar player, I use all the chords for harmonic content with passing chords, slash chords, secondary dominants, moving bass lines, and sometimes chord substitution. Lately, I’ve been attending a traditional service where hymns and good older choruses are all they sing/play.
Thank you for this. You made excellent points. I would add a few, more things:
1/ traditional hymns came from a place of personal experience with God. Songs like Be Still My Soul or How Great thou Art touch us in a different level, from meditation to joyousness, to uplifting to melancholy to prayerful …. Modern Christian songs all seem to be “Praise God”. Not saying we shouldn’t praise God, but can we have diverse lyrics please?
2/ standing up in church to sing a song, and not finding musical notations to guide you, is disconcerting, and alienating. Us older people would like to sing too.
3/ many of these famous contemporary songs utilize chanting - which can become a mindless exercise, instead of focusing the mind. Point in case is These are the days of Elijah.
4/ many of these songs do not have either a rhyming structure in the lyrics or resolution in the melody where it’s expected or both. This makes it harder to learn the song.
Our music leader needs to hear this, he cannot play anything but contemporary. I am going to share you and the other two guys you mentioned with him. I pray he will listen and apply.
Thank you for this cogent discussion of a serious problem. You were able to speak to it factually, without a judgmental or dismissive tone. I admire you for that. One thing I might add/clarify is that in traditional hymnody, the metric of the lyric matched the accentual pattern of the melody. This was the key in making the phrasing easy to follow and learn; indeed, when the two match, it is easier for the congregation to sing the phrasing right than it is to sing it wrong. This concept has been lost in much or most contemporary worship music, greatly increasing its difficulty. Ironically, the very phrasing that makes performance music interesting makes it all but nonfunctional as congregational worship. Again, thank you for this clear and helpful presentation. You were able to make challenging concepts understandable.
Very much appreciate you sharing this..
I found a church home 4 years ago, and I love it there, but I’ve always had a hard time with the music. I grew up in a cathedral and my music there would leave me with connection to God and sense of grandeur and awe, sometimes overwhelming sadness or excitement etc. The modern worship songs here always make me feel… cringey and disingenuous. For four years I’ve been trying to make myself connect to this music and I just can’t, and I feel like I can’t saying anything because it will come of as petty, not caring about the “message” enough, or trying to put down the people who seem to like it. It’s nice to know that there are some musical reasons why this just doesn’t land for me. The pastor and worship team have tried to get me to join the music because I sing in a chorus outside of church, and I keep skirting because I don’t know a gentile way to say “yes I do like to sing, but I hate all your music and it makes me feel like a phony when I try to take it seriously to the point where my stomach flips” 😅 anyone have any advice?
Hi Chelsea, I'm sorry to hear about your situation and I completely empathize and agree with you. I lead music at my church, and it's a pretty decent mix of old and new, band and choir, performance and service music; if I could have things my way, I'd have a cathedral with a full choir, pipe organ, and orchestra and sing primarily historic hymns. One thing I immediately thought was that I often feel like a phony when I lead, because my life doesn't always match the lyrics or because I think the contemporary song is not the best option for our church, but it's in our canon and what I can use; I also have musicians that I know wish our service was either more "traditional" or more "contemporary" and I am thankful that they serve regardless. So I would highly encourage you not to let feeling phony deter you from serving. However, I completely understand the feeling that the music is so shallow, commercial, performance-driven, and banal that it's hard to truly feel that it's worshipful or God-honoring to the extent that service music can and should be. Perhaps ask to sit down with the pastor and/or music leaders and express your thoughts/feelings in an honest and gentle way. Let them know why you hesitate to serve, and what the service music is like from a congregant's perspective. Perhaps you could ask them to hold some classes or studies on church music and what role music is supposed to have in a service. Bring them the points brought up in this video; there's more to an argument against the "contemporary model" than just "well I don't like it". John had a ton of thoughtful, data-driven points in this video.
I think the root of the transformation of current church music is the ever increase use of technology to compose, play and broadcast the music.
Thats Why i listen Rich Mullins, Keith Green and old songs, even orthodox chants
Yes! Love orthodox chants
I don't have time to watch this whole video but the repetition of notes(lack of melody) thing is something that I haven't noticed very much. Thanks for pointing it out. I want to see people use the vast range of instruments, genres, and talents existing today to make beautiful art for God.
Well-made video! Thank you for breaking it down sir
When I express similar points, I am said to have "a critical spirit". I play guitar and bass. I hate the fact that people playing and leading the "worship" don't care too much about their own skill and improving it. I don't have a problem with the congregation singing out of key, but the musicians are supposed to play skillfully as noted by David and help lead the congregation. I understand that we are all at different levels of musicianship, but it kills me that these people don't see it important to give their best in P&W. On top of that the CCM songs are not suitable for P&W for points mentioned, but are of too low a standard to be concert worthy. Thanks for your input.
You answered so many questions for me with this video. I grew up on hymns and was in a Southern Gospel trio for 20 yrs. When the new music came along I always wondered why it was hard to find a harmony part to sing and why you had to listen to a song 10 times to pick up the melody. Before I make the next statement, keep in mind I am 59: We have diluted the gospel in song and therefore diluted our worship by leaving the hymns and traditional Christian music behind.
whew... this is meaty... i like it!!!
The evidence supporting all of these points is that in contemporary services, almost none of the congregation actually sings. Some sort of mumble.
But the musicians don't care...they are too busy being "rock stars". It's all about their egos...under the guise of being hip to God.
Conversely, go to a traditional service and everyone is belting it out.
Great commentary that echoes a lot of the thoughts I've had on the subject.
I think that one contributing factor to the staleness/lack of quality in modern worship music is that we somehow went from Bach composing some of the most incredible music ever written "for the glory of God" to the point where displaying any kind of exceptional skill is seen as "showing off". We worship musicians (I'm not any longer, but I was my church's bass player for 22 years) get told to put a throttle on our God-given talents so that we're not perceived as "showing off". I mean, this even goes to the point that the musicians in the church don't stand/sit on a "stage". Yeah, every other musician in the world gets "on stage", but don't you dare call it that in church. It's not a stage, it's a ... platform?
I've also seen a lot of modern worship leaders whose only real musical talent/skill is that they have a nice voice, and they can carry a tune. Other than that, they don't really understand how music works.
There's another mind-boggling thing that pervades modern worship, contributing to this "slow, simple songs" problem. Way back in the late 1960s/early 1970s, when "Christian rock" music started being introduced into worship, there was a certain amount of keeping the "rock" sort of "low key", so as not to unduly offend the "old people" ... and 50+ years later, that mentality seems to persist, completely oblivious to the fact that today's "old people" (say, anybody over 50 - I'm 57) are *the very people who grew up on rock music*. We're certainly not going to be "offended" if the music is a bit loud and has a good beat.
One conviction I hear from the holy spirit at modern churches is "I don't know these songs..." I don't mind modern songs but they are too similar to secular music.
Amen. Lyrics must be based on scripture
very good explanation and relevant points
Really interesting, I’m really helpful thank you very much
Excellent!
Enjoyed this video
How did I miss this in my feed?!? Here from Bnonn & Michael
I feel grieved by most music and movies. It takes crushing to have an anointing. I won’t go to a place that forces MY worship. Touch not the Lord’s anointed!
Very good! Lots to chew on here.
I knew I wasn't crazy for not liking contemporary worship XD
Great analysis.
Thank you very much for this. I have had my own thoughts on worship music and you have helped me to extend my rationalisation and vocabulary on the subject. I have seen churches mindlessly embrace the style which to them is ‘cool’ but it really does not do them any favours. There is also a worrying attraction for copying the secular agenda. One of my organist friends troubled over worship music sounding more like pop culture than worship. I fully understood all that you have said and it comes as a relief to know that I am not totally alone. My background is holding a music diploma, knowing the eight grades of theory inside out, having written music and studied music at degree level… though this was not my main discipline. I lead music at my church and worship music in school assemblies. I like to cover a wide breadth of style but mainly centre on the traditional. Why? Because it has the most to offer in educating people and has a depth of spirituality which is often missing elsewhere. In the long term, people usually prefer it. This is particularly evident in school where the children have a wide bank of styles from which to draw from. The traditional leaves a deeper impression upon them. It is good to look so objectively at this so I can articulate the reasons for what is happening.
Wow, absolutely nailed it.
Love that Doug Wilson clip.
Yes, bring back the good old hymns!
Thank you.
I'd love to hear thoughts along these lines when it comes to Black Gospel music, as well as Latino Gospel. These genres traditionally are much more musically complex than CCM, from grooves, to chord structure/changes/harmony, to vocal melodies and harmonies. I think it's DOPE
1000% Black Gospel music is unbelievably complex. Those musicians are on another level.
I think the whole point is that music should be like traditional classical and hymn music or in other words “white” music. Black and Latino would be the opposite of what he is talking about. That type of music is too rythmically challenging for us white people and he really didn’t include african americans or Latinos in the conversation. Unlike us white people, they may be able to comprehend the confusing rythmn. They may even have a better vocal range, but I assume that since this music is wrong for whites it is wrong for everyone or maybe he just doesn’t care about other races. Either way if red is not blue it must be wrong. Seems arbitrary to me and narrow, but maybe thats because I’m a rare breed of white man who can clap on 2 and 4.
@@andrewfarmer5740 This is simply a questions of statistical averages. My experience in my churches is reflected in these videos. If this doesn't apply to you or other churches, then you can simply ignore them. I'm addressing a large trend that absolutely exists: e.g. vocal ranges out of range, rhythms too complex. And just because these realities exist does not deny other liturgical realities. I'm just addressing one. If other communities have different vocal ranges and are more rhythmically skilled, wonderful.
The musical lingo and understanding is way over my head. So far I haven't had much exposure to contemporary worship music (I've met mostly with others who sing mostly "old" hymns) but I get that talking more with each other about how we feel and what we think about our worship music 'in the light of the LORD' could be helpful. A focus on praiseworthy aspects of worship music could be helpful.
Excellent insight, we shouldn't assume that our musical tastes are automatically transferable to the congregational setting. What we like when we're singing and listening in the shower, working in the kitchen or at the gymn is exactly that ; its what we like. When we assemble for corporate worship the focus is no longer our pleasure being the only consideration. We are also to think about what gives God and others pleasure.
Perfect!
thank you !
Another thought. Ever since the 70s, when many young people decided that hymns were old fashioned and boring and preferred recently written choruses, music has become a point of dissension in the church. I like some of those choruses (Father I Adore You sung as a round is beautiful), but they lack the theological depth of the older hymns. And the introduction of a newer style of music introduced division. Anything that creates division among God’s people cannot be of Him. It is very troubling that so many Christians are so devoted to simplistic Christian rock that they don’t even want to ask God whether this music pleases him.
Time stamp 4:32. Exactly! You hit the nail on the head.
Wow! I really enjoyed your explanation (some music theory beyond my understanding but that's ok). You really did some research! Thank you. I was raised on good old Lutheran hymns. I sure do miss them, but that's ok. I have my Lutheran hymn book and play them for myself on my piano.
I can truly attest to this, my parents go to a Calvary Chapel and we rarely ever sing just quietly speak the lyrics in the screen. Visiting the small Lutheran churches here in PR which have barely even been here for 5 years it’s a tiny congregation but wow the singing out of the hymnals is not just the first time I easily sang it sounded powerful it was glorious, and everything had scriptural references throughout it. One of the other big things I notice is that all the hymns were all cathecatical, they all thought you the faith or about doctrine.
Also important, and maybe related to content is the the evaluation of Doctrinal Content and whether a song aligns to, or veers away from scripture.
Songs from Bethel and Elevation are based on the kenosis heresy that their leadership teaches (that Jesus was ONLY a man and did his miracles apart from his divinity) and that false teaching they believe is reflected in their music - which is then distributed to the rest of unassuming churches worldwide by worship leaders who don’t realize the importance of evaluating songs for sound doctrine and that music teaches our congregations. And that these type of songs lead people further away from Scripture and God.
Something not mentioned besides shallow content is the constant repetition often 12 times..seems to be a pattern in contemporary music on the radio and in worship times.
Agree, there's to much repetition, also to much. Volume.
Repitition was a standard for hundreds of years.
The Protestant Church started losing its way when it stopped singing the Psalms.
There's a book (possibly out of print) called "Why Catholics Can't Sing". Worth a read.
Sir, thank you for this. It is a cogent, well thought out and very well presented statement of the reality of the “Folk music” ideology. It started with the Roman church and it has been “aped” by practically every brand of Christianity out there. I won’t preach to the preacher - I will say that I started in a Catholic Church in 1963 as a Lutheran and slowly infiltrated the entire worship scene and modeled them after the services held in my home (Lutheran) church. Nothing - as we both know - is better than singing the hymns of praise to God in the worship service - the liturgy in my adopted church was sung as well by my getting a (very rare) 4 part Catholic hymnal and my congregation was always heralded by all - visiting clergy, hierarchy and worshipers as the best they had experienced. The reason was that I got up in front of all the people at all the Masses and taught them solid traditional hymns and sang them with them with a microphone from the console and the music was incredible. And we had a Folk group and the only time those congregants really sang was when I was playing and using the traditional hymns. Within recent history - I have been watching TH-cam videos of Catholic Funerals and am horrified that no matter where of what - they were all piano music and piano accompanied pretty much solos. That is against the documents of Vatican 2 which states that the organ is the traditional instrument of the church and definitely goes against the fact that there MUST be congregational singing NOT solos. No one seems to care and the Roman Church is in more turmoil now with more than just the music - God bless you for your words and I will use your video as often as possible to try to show that there is more than just me out there fighting!
Great observations. There's far too much "performance music" being played in church today. But good luck changing this. Its been going on for more than 20 years. (music teams love it!)