Can The 2025 Subaru WRX tS Keep Up With The FL5 Civic Type-R?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.พ. 2025
- 👋 Today I compare the new 2025 Subaru WRX tS with the FL5 Honda Civic Type-R! The new 2025 WRX tS packs the same 2.4L H4 turbo 4 cylinder Boxer motor that all the WRX cars have. With 271 horsepower and 258 torque. Paired only to the 6 speed manual and AWD system the WRX tS does 0-60 in 5.9 seconds and weighs 3,400 pounds. The FL5 Honda Civic Type-R packs a 2.0L inline 4 cylinder turbo engine with 315 horsepower and 310 torque. Only paired to a 6 speed manual and FWD the Type-R can do 0-60 in 4.9 seconds and weighs in at 3,200 pounds. Both cars look pretty cool overall however I'm not a fan of all the plastic on the WRX. Interior of the WRX tS is really nice with a great use of materials and I love the blue accents. Civic Type R has nicer bucket seats that are more supportive and comfortable but lacks in the back with basic cloth. Driving the FL5 Type-R alongside the WRX tS is where things really differ. Both cars coming in around $46,000 I am shocked the WRX is so underpowered. Down 44 horsepower the WRX feels slow compared to the Type-R. Even tho it's smooth power delivery with no lag, it's just not that much power and doesn't put you back in your seat. The Type-R handles like it's on rails and is a joy to rip through turns. Amazing steering feel, responsive brakes and flat cornering. The WRX tS is a planted car with good handling. But the breaks require much more force to work, the steering has a more robotic feel and it's just not as agile. However thee WRX tS has fantastic ride quality and a more upscale interior along with a more comfortable ride. Overall the Type-R is a lot better at being a performance car. It's just more fun to drive spiritedly in the curvy roads. WRX tS has a lot to be desired at this price point for performance but the interior is nice and the ride is refined compared to the Type-R. Why not just get a Golf R that has the power and handling of the Civic Type-R but with all the refinements. The tS should have been a real STI with power and agility to match the other mid $40k sport sedans and hot hatches. I think I'd go for a sub $40k WRX Limited and get pretty much the same car as the tS with the refined ride and interior and still have the sale 271 HP and save a good $7k over the Type-R if I wanted a refined car and was ok with not having the handling and power of the Type-R.
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Can The 2025 Subaru WRX tS Keep Up With The FL5 Civic Type-R?
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#2025subaruwrxts #fl5hondacivictyper #fl5civictypervswrxts
You ain't lying I used to own a Subaru wrx 18' full bolts on 350 whp and it was fun to drive however I was patiently waiting for the new Sti to come out and I was disappointed when they discontinued the STI. Tired of waiting I recently moved into the new 2024 Type R and I wouldn't be happier tbh, and yes the lack of grip for being a Fwd is there but the performance is absolutely a blessing.
Cool to see a previous WRX owner in a CTR. Cold or wet days are not the best for the FWD for sure. But other than that it’s pure fun to drive. Really wish they gave the tS more power for the price
15 wrx here. Lol. I felt like subaru betrayed us after waiting so long for a new sti. Fl5 no regrets! 🙌🏻
I owned the FK8, and im gonna burst your bubble here.... btw I currently own a 22 wrx limited, and a 2005 wrx sti.. once you start turning that FL5 up, it loses its magic. An the lack of grip becomes immediately apparent, the torque steer comes back etc... You simply cannot replace the awd grip of a subaru awd system with the torque vectoring system and LSD of the honda. With just a few thousand in mods, you can take a base vb wrx, to a place the CTR will never be due to a lack of grip... Sure its numbered, and sure its "special" and overpriced. BUt it is still a FWD civic at the end of the day.. Its all marketing by honda, and they lied on the ring run for both the FK8 and the FL5.. Youll learn soon enough once the honeymoon is over, that the honda just isnt that special after all. I sold my FK8 after owning it just 1 year, and bought my VB WRX... It would have absolutley walked my FK8 too.
I can see that!
Yeah I can see that with the power. This isnt a car to go too much more power with. However the biggest thing I'm talking about in this video is buying the tS WRX over the CTR. I'd go for a more base model WRX in the $30k range and modify that. If your only choice was the tS or FL5, what would you go with. Yes the WRX will make better power. But it still won't handle like the FL5 no matter what you do
Thanks for the comparison. Makes me even happier with Type R 😆 Love my FL5 definitely my all around favorite from any car I’ve ever owned . I’m coming from a 2022 BMW M240i that I loved so that says a lot about the Type R.
Yeah this makes me like mine even more! Such a fun car and packs a ton of performance for the money!
I personally chose WRX as I love the looks, I can't quite get used to the civic red interior or dash design. WRX has great low down torque \ response and only needs a couple of mods to get to 300awhp and the last reason is AWD, it's so nice coming from high hp rwd V8's that struggle for traction except in the middle of summer only.
What trim did you get tho? A top level one around $45k, or something in the $30k range?
@@BrosFOURRSpeed I'm not in the usa but it would be TR equivalent. Recaros, brembos, sti suspension, oem STI wing, manual but has eyesight.
Oh nice! Yeah the TR is a good setup around $40k in our market. That's a good way to go since thats still a good chunk less then the CTR, GRC and Golf R. This tS just makes no sense
Not sure about the Type R but the WRX is a very capable platform for modding. Just a downpipe and dyno tune gets it up to around 340-350WHP and the block is reliable with decent power levels.. the transmission is the main weak point. Only other downside I see is the infotainment system. I've had my 06 STi since 2008, so I'm ready for a different platform (plus I'll still be keeping my STi for life), otherwise I'd be all over the WRX tS. Type R is definitely a better track weapon but for a daily driver, especially where you need AWD for snow, the WRX can't be beat, even at a lower trim for a cheaper price.
WRX can make good power. Aren’t the engines still prone to blowing up once you up the power?
Handling is the big think for me tho. Just now are as nimble in the turns. TypeR can make good power. However I wouldn’t want much more being FWD.
but stock for stock at least. TypeR seems much more performance focused. The tS I don’t really see the point at its price. A limited for $39k would be the good sweet spot
Engine is good for 450-500 but anything after that it’ll lift the head. Trans is the weak point for sure, lot of people swapping in sti drivelines
@@deepydeepsinteresting. At that point I’d just get a last model year STI. The drive modes also were a big bump on the STI
@@BrosFOURRSpeedstock block is good for up to 500 whp/wtq. Internals on the FA24F is better in every way than the FA20F. The bottleneck for building a lot of power is the transmission. Then it’s the lack of port injection, but that’s only if you want to build your WRX to like 700whp lol. The best way to build out a new WRX is to buy a used base or premium for around 30-35k. Costs somewhere around 2k to get up to 350whp/wtq. But if you want to make the WRX more track capable, then invest in suspension and brakes.
@@BrosFOURRSpeedDCCD helps a ton in snow and gravel but really isn’t a game changer on the track unless you’re like a pro driver. I was able to keep up with a slightly modded STI in my VB around Streets of Willow track and wasn’t pushing the VB to the limits. So yeah I guess also depends a lot on the driver too, but speed wise, VB and STI are about neck and neck when stock.
I can't believe they want that kind of money for any wrx. I have a 2023 that I really like. It's a base model with a 6-speed. I paid $29k for it brand new. It's a blast in the snow.
Nice! That's the way to go! I think the mid to low $30k range is great for that car. Can't see how this costs over $10k more then a base with the same performance
I had a pretty modified 22 WRX; switched to a used Audi b9.5 S5. Love that the performance ceiling is a lot higher. The WRX just needed too many aftermarket items to compete with stock cars
Oh nice! Yeah it seems even modified WRX's owners are only talking about mid 300 HP range after spending a ton of money. Plus it just doesn't handle like the Type-R. They could have done more with it. The S5 is a great car!
@ right yea I spent close to 12k on mine; intake, downpipe, turbo, coilovers the whole 9. But all the other competition is just better. Wish they put more into development. But keep up the good work 👍🏾 always love seeing the reviews. And the lambo content now since the GTR and R8 are gone 😭
Lol.. my 22 was making 340WHP/380 torque for around 2500 all in including dyno tuning at TPG tuning who hold the quarter mile record for VBs.
@ with no supporting mods I’m sure. Supporting mods are key to make and maintain the power reliably
@@siezethedays yeah I can see that!
R8 is still here 😎
The new WRX is the new Si, IMO. The SI is dead with it's power these days. And it's almost the same price for a base WRX as a slow Si.
Yeah you get a lot more pep out of the WRX. I can see them competing much better. Just crazy to see the tS be priced with the CTR, GRC and Golf R tho
@BrosFOURRSpeed Yea. No way I'd even entertain a tS. I paid that for my low mileage, 1-owner 21 Supra 3.0 Premium with carbon fiber.
Wow yeah! I'd go Supra all day at that price point. The tS should be a true STI with the rally inspiration and power/handling to back it up
unfortunately the FWD SI that has front LSD handles million times better than the new WRX that runs open front diff and open rear diff with brakepad torque vectoring taking straight from the SUV Ascent. Now if Subaru still made a STI, that would make sense since it has front LSD, center DCCD diff, and rear LSD.
@zombielivesmatter7294 It does handle good but man I really hate the 1.5T
I have the 21 STI and I Love it as far as these two Go im taking the Type R over the thrice rebadged wrx ts with no bump in power and the Hideous Plastic cladding .. sure you can bump up the power but for that price at least give it 300 HP
Yeah that’s what kills it for me. If it’s going to be STI money, it should compete with the cars at this price point. Great car but just not on the same level anymore. I’d go old STI or a Limited WRX
I had it, and for 6 months, the premium model, even after some mods i trade in the car, i prefer the 2020 sti or other sport car like type R or Supra 👌🏻
Oh cool! Yeah it seems like the WRX just falls a bit short compared to most cars. STI was a great car!
What did you end up getting
I got the 2024 WRX TR and I’m glad I did. To me it’s superior to the TS. For power the VB WRX just needs a few bolt ons and a tune to make it really fun to drive. A tuned VB is a totally different car than what comes from Subaru.
The TR is about $43k right? A nice amount less than these. Great for more power. But still doesn't have the agility of the Type-R. Really wish the tS was an STI with everything to make it more competitive at this price
@@BrosFOURRSpeedI got my TR for right at $40k. I haven’t driven the Type R so I do not have a direct comparison but I do agree that the steering feel is a bit lacking. I as well wish they would have made an STI but I love my WRX and the amount of easy modifications that are available for it.
@@BrandonStith-p6x oh nice! $40k is a solid price for these I think! The TS really should have been the new STI so it could compete with the others at the $45k+ level.
Glad you’re enjoying yours!
I have the WRX and also a GRC. The difference between them is might and day. It's the GRC that should be compared with the type r.
I have that video already th-cam.com/video/vPHdFD9E244/w-d-xo.html
WRX tS costs the same tho. So it's competing. I don't really see why you'd buy the tS when the competition is better. But a normal WRX under $40k is a solid choice
you're 100% right, WRX TS is a daily car that uses the front open diff and rear open diff with brakepad torque vectoring straight out of the SUV Ascent. The GRC with optional track pack is like the previous STI models with front limited-slip differential, center auto/controllable diff, and rear limited-slip differential.
I hope to see you drive a used GR corolla as hard as this wrx one day and hear your thoughts. Your recent GRC videos were so tamed, not going through the whole rev range in sport mode and hard acceleration from rolling initial start. I’m curious if the GRC feels faster than the FL5 and if it pushes you back in the seat more than the FL5
th-cam.com/video/Nlat38yaDwk/w-d-xo.html
Here's me driving the GRC on the racetrack. Also I do have a video deriving a used GRC and this WRX tS coming soon. Drove them both very similar.
GRC and CTR feel very similar overall. Just in wet or cold conditions the AWD is better for traction. But I like the GRC too quite a bit
@ thank you for the response and insight. I did enjoy the GRC track video but looking forward to the GRC and wrx tS. Your audio setup picks up the engine sounds really well so been enjoying the local drives videos with the slowing down for a stop sign or light and accelerating off
Basic bolt ons on the Wrx- makes it a different animal. The base model can be had for 30k and is a blast to drive!
Yeah it can make some power. But still doesn't have the handling of the Type-R. I can see getting a more basic WRX. But spending $45k on the tS makes no sense when the competition is faster and better handling
I hope these cars have a great air filter for the hvac system for clean air in the cabin!
I'm sure like any car they have a good sized cabin filter
Subaru WRX just needs more HP/TQ stock. Mine does 360HP/370TQ, but I had to tune it. Tuning is something a lot of people want to avoid to keep their warranty.
Yeah you can make great power with the WRX and have the traction. But handling still won't be on the same level as the Type-R. I'd go Limited or Premium on a WRX. The tS I would expect it to have the same power and agility as the other cars in this class
Thank you for making this comparison. I was torn between these 2 or just getting a tesla model 3 performance since its practically in the same price range.
Cool way to go for an EV. However it won't offer the fun factor of these in terms of handling and character. Or resale. But it's a fast EV for cheap!
@BrosFOURRSpeed your absolutely right. Very challenging decision!
Crazy that fwd can beat the wrx awd 0-60 by a full second
Yeah the power and weight makes a huge difference! Subaru needs to make an STI!
@BrosFOURRSpeed what a shame they stopped. IMO, if you like suburu, get a brz and turbo it for less/same as a base wrx. But u lose the 4dr
But tbh less than 300lbs shouldn't be that big.. but that along with the power the WRX? Ok.. but still, AWD?
@@ThatWhiteGLI yeah that’d be some fun!
@@ThatWhiteGLI it makes a difference at this power level. If I have a large passenger I can feel the weight effecting the power and handle on a car of this level. WRX just needs a real STI trim to compete at this price
I own a 23 Prem WRX, coming from a 20' WRX/21 STI the VB is good in terms for commuting and making easy power for cheap prices. A custom tune alone can net 320+ without any mods. The 2.4 is worlds better then the FA20 engine in the 15-21 WRX models.
I've had the VB since March with 9k miles. Overall the car is good for what it is but for 37k for a premium with a few add ons OTD I am not that impressed with it. Its a bigger car so that makes it feel like a big boat while driving, the screen was cool in the beginning but I am sick of it lol, not having any knobs to turn besides music is a let down. Honestly I am bored with the VB even after having it tuned with intake, that's just my thoughts on my VB
I am actually looking at either going back into a low mileage 21 STI or a 25' CWP Type R to get into a different family fun car. Only downside for me is being FWD having owned Subaru's for 5 years I got use to having the AWD.
I can see that! The downsides with FWD is lack of acceleration in wet/cold conditions. And adding more power than a basic tune is probably all you’d want. But this car has plenty of power stock. It’s amazing in the turns and is very exciting. I’d go CTR over an STI. Even though I’d rather it be AWD. The handling is just on another level!
@@BrosFOURRSpeed If I did get the CTR I would just do intake/type s module and exhaust and enjoy the car! Ill start looking for one and doing more research!
@@NexGenSubies Thats a solid choice! Exhaust and springs also were a nice improvement. I haven’t messed with the suspension mod. But I’ve heard great things. It’s so capable stock. Definitely a great way to go!
The issue is the VB has no nice turbo spool as before which imo makes a huge difference for someone like me who takes sound as a top 3 need of all my cars I dont want my Wrx to sound like my Si and the vb definitely is deep toned not a lot of turbo spool like the 1.5 in my si
Imo type s is the go to with its burble tune and exhaust with a full downpipe no res setup is wayyy better than a Type R and I love the R but the type S tune is perfect
The civic is larger than I expected compared to the WRX
Yeah it's very roomy!
If I could only have 1 car I'd get the tS for its practical/daily functions while still having fun driving. If i already had a daily driver in the garage, I'd take the Type R for the weekend more focused and engaging backroads driving. Its crazy they didnt bump the hp though. does anyone understand what subaru is doing lol. If anyone is wanting the tS its a much better value to grab a used TR.
Yeah I can see that. But I'd go for a WRX Limited to keep it under $40k. Can't see spending another $6k just to have a tS
I think the TR is the way to go. I’d prefer the analog gauges anyway over digital and you still get the Brembos, recaros, tuned steering and tuned suspension (just not adaptive) and new ones still around near me are significantly under MSRP and used market will be a nice option.
It's interesting to me how Japanese performance has survived and in rare cases thrived over the last 25 years. Long after the death of the real bespoke sports car platforms like the MK4 Supra, FD3S, GTO, and so on, a handful of Japanese cars remain competitive, and they usually have one thing in common, that they are derived from economy cars. The Civic Type R, the GR Corolla, to a lesser degree the WRX (base/Premium versions of it anyway, not these very expensive trims), all thriving to various extents. In a way, it's not surprising that Toyota wasn't capable or willing of creating a MK5 Supra and had other outsource it to BMW, or that Nissan wasn't capable/willing to create an all-new Z, neither of those cars could possibly derive from any extant economy car platform, which meant significantly expanding their companies for niche products. In that light, that we still have an excellent Miata or the BRZ/GR86 seems like a miracle, made possible by using versions of ordinary mainstream engines as opposed to high-performance V6s and V8s that would have required bespoke development.
Yeah there have been some really fun cars lately! New Supra ended up being a great car and the bMW collaboration worked well. Z was a bit of a let down. But these economy car based vehicles seem to offer a lot without breaking the bank!
@@BrosFOURRSpeed And in a lot of ways I think they're more fun. I'm very much in the minority here, but I think street cars have become way too fast, such that you have to drive them at 25% all the time or risk jail time. I'd rather have an ND2 or CTR that I can use most of its performance and have fun day to day. In the real world, the M4 owner or Mustang GT owner is holding back so much that I wouldn't be surprised if the horsepower numbers they're actually accessing aren't any more than the CTR is accessing at a specific point on a backroad, but by giving up this inaccessible horsepower (on the street anyway), cars like CTRs and Mini Coopers can be much lighter and therefore more fun.
@@elenchus I can see that in many ways! I love being able to use all the Type-R’s power on the street. In my old GTR and Lambo, there is so much I can’t use. But that also is fun in its own way knowing you’re holding back more. So to me they are both fun, just in different ways. You can still find the right time and place and use all the power of the fast cars. So it’s more special. But the fun affordable cars are a blast!
@@BrosFOURRSpeed Yeah, there is a sort of giggly fun to opening up a super powerful car in the middle of nowhere from time to time, I won't deny that.
@@elenchus plenty of fun to be had in a wide verity of cars these days. Just gotta drive them differently 😎
FL5 Type R. The best STI was 04-07.
Yeah Type-R is a blast! The STI needs to come back!
tS stands for "this Should've (been)"
Can you elaborate?
@BrosFOURRSpeed Just a lame joke on my part. I was saying that the TS SHOULD'VE been an STI instead.
lol that is a good one ;)
Really should have been an STI
gimme the wrx all day!
Why would you pick the tS over the CTR? I struggle to see a valid reason. Can get a nice Limited WRX for under $40k and it's nearly the same car as the tS. So why?
@@BrosFOURRSpeedit’s the top of the line wrx that Subaru offers with a 6 speed. If you want a manual, awd sedan with all the bells and whistles, people are out there that will be willing to pay.
@@waykool698 But why would you not just get a 2024 Golf R? Has the power and agility of the CTR. And an even more refined interior over the WRX. For the same price. Now for 2025 the Golf R looses the manual apparently. But then why spend this money on the TS when a Limited for $39k has all the same performance and almost the same interior.
@ for people that like Subaru, they won’t go to other brands. Plus limited don’t have recaro seats, and factory brembo brakes. It’s a niche car, but some will buy it. Basically if you don’t wanna slap on parts later, this is an option. lol
Which car has a better clutch feel? Any jerkiness with 1-2 shift from either cars?
Type-R for sure. Sometimes the WRX lurches forwards once I release it.
real drivers rev match it themselves
ok. You can turn it off on the Type-R.
As a Subaru guy I’d rather have the type R
Yeah the tS should have been a real STI
Own a’23 Premium and I think anything above that is a waste given that you’re really only getting brakes and seats or leather and a stereo. All can be upgraded for less.
Agreed! A Premium or Limited is the sweet spot I think. Very good car for under $40k. I don't see why this isnt an STI given what the same price point competitors have
As much as I love Subaru and STI, I’ll pick typeR, no doubt.
Yeah the handling and power is just a big step up. Not sure why they won't make an STI
Hondas have a short 3rd gear for super acceleration! Don’t know about 4th though.
Seems to be well spaced out. Fun car!
What drive mode was the WRX in? It seems like the steering gets significantly heavier as you move up to race+, and the suspension really tightens up
Was in Sport+ on the fun roads. It's just not on the same level as the CTR. Sport+ is much more responsive then Comfort for sure. But this car is just not on the same performance level as the competition
@ darn that’s too bad, it seems like they’re inching as close as they can to an STI without going all in. I’m guessing it wont make a return until hybrids are in full swing for Subie
So true! They gave it everything, except the two things that make a performance car truly perform. Not sure why ever WRX from $32k to $46k has the same performance. makes no sense
@@BrosFOURRSpeed :( and that price point pits it against such steep competition, great content btw!
Honestly It's a steep price, but the other cars have cons too. People just think of the paper specs.
CTR is definitely the best of the bunch on track. But the heating issue still persist from the last gen.
They way overturned the dampers too. Great resale value if you just daily it.
GR Corolla has a rent a car interior, bumpier ride due to a shorter wheel base. Toyota still hasn't fixed the diffs overheating after 2-3 hot laps.
Golf R has weaker on track performance because they went more towards premium market. But it will dog all 3 on the streets with the DSG.
B888 also tunes the easiest.
Also no more manual on 25+
WRX TS. Decent handling from the most reviews, and you probably get it in discount since that happened with the TR. You gotta Hunt a dealer that sells at msrp for the other 3.
The biggest con? You're buying a 4 cly hot hatch when you could just get a discounted Mustang GT.
Used market you can get the new Z or GT loaded up for $42k.
A little older Supra or BMW M40i.
Yeah lots of good used cars in this price range too. All cars have their drawbacks. But when comparing new for new at this $46k price point. The WRX falls short by a lot compared to the others.
Mr Fourr Speed, for a winter commuter in the Midwest, I’m looking for an experience, but also somewhat comfortable. You have experience in each, what horse would you go with, RS3 or WRX? Thanks!
RS3 is a much better car for sure. However it costs a lot more. So depends on your budget. I'd rather have an RS3 than any WRX. But a Limited or Premium WRX would be a great choice to stay in the $30k range. Audi S3 is a good choice too. We had a 2016 for a few years and loved it! Was about $32k
For 34k brand new you can get in an Elantra N that is arguably faster then the type R
Hopefully I can test one in a few weeks! I've heard good things! But it probably won't hold the same value. So we'll see how it stacks up tho at it's price and performance level
Honda boy here. The type R finally beat the WRX but at what cost 😢
You know that feeling of being defeated even though you won, ‘cause if you know the WRX is intentionally underpowered for emission reasons.😞
Glad you'll enjoy it!
I would get a regular new gen wrx with manual ... Atleat where iam from having awd is good and i aint a fan of new turbo hinda engine ....
But if honda still had that 200 hp N.A 2 litre ..i would have definitely but that ....
Yeah I'd go for a limited WRX for under $40k. However the new Type-R engine is pretty solid and quick. 200 HP N/A would be so slow to drive
@BrosFOURRSpeed yes you kinda have to revv up above 4 k for the magic but it's a different experience and with performance mod it will be fun ... It's less complicated than a turbo ones right ... I am paranoid about the whole turbo and it's plumping
I tested drive both wrx sti and the civic type r back in 2019 to see which one is better so I can get one, but it turns out the civic type r is a better car, I know the sti got 310 hp vs type r got 306 hp but the type r handle better in corners and feels faster, so I ended up with the type r, I love it so much but that's me and I know some people rather have the sti and I get its.
Oh cool! Yeah the CTR is on rails in the turns. Cool to see you pick one over the STI. Now with less power I find it really hard to see a valid reason to get a loaded WRX over a FL5.
The WRX is available for invoice. Everywhere. 42K. Add a $1500 intake+ETune and it destroys all the competition for less money. Unfortunately it is artificially detuned from the factory.
Yes in a straight line you can make good power. But the handling characteristics are just not on the same level of the FL5, GR Corolla or Golf R. Might as well just get a more basic WRX if you only want power. Handling and agility are a lot more fun to enjoy in the rest of the cars at this price level
looks like subaru let sombody's mom design the VB model wrx
lol I wish all the plastic was body colored. Looks so much better
@@BrosFOURRSpeed idk about you, for me that giant screen is way too commercial and not luxury at all and pretty much draws all of the attention from the rest of the interior of the car, if im buying a wrx to have fun the last thing i need a 1 foot tall screen and the wrx is definitely not an economy car! subaru is confused. with a little more power and some luxury upgrades the new wrx would be amazing. i also just got a 2020 series white for 26k with 14000miles which is basically the same car as the TS for 20 thousand less and less plastic lol
Why would anyone design a hood scoop when there is already so much room in the front end for cool air like the air dams.
Which car are you talking about? WRX has a hood scoop for air to go onto the intercooler. Front bumper has openings to provide air to the radiators. Type-R has a heat extraction vent in the hood. Front bumper has openings for brake ducts, radiators and intercooler
Honda definitely looks nicer only thing better the Subaru has is the all wheel drive wrx went backwards in my opinion disappointed
Yeah I'd like to have AWD. That would really allow for some serious HP gains! Not sure why Subaru makes all the WRX lineup the same power. Makes no sense
What engine responds better to a 93 octane tune?
Either. But with tuning and premium will have nice power.
Lastly, its not the same price, you can get a TS at MSRP or less if you are savvy, the FL5 CTR is still being marked up to almost 60k... so keep that in mind.
I bought my FL5 for $45k with 2k miles. Both my local Honda dealers have 4 new ones come through since I bought mine. All MSRP around $47k. Nobody is paying over sticker for an FL5. And plenty of super low mileage ones under sticker
How is the rev hang on these and what about the clutch feel/engagement ?
Don't really notice rev hang on either. Type-R has a nicer engagement and feel for the manual
how is this even a comparison? WRX TS is daily commuter that can't handle well, it uses the drivetrain and engine from Ascent SUV with open front diff and open rear diff and brakepad torque vectoring, that's why new WRX owners only ever talk about how much HP they can make for drag racing, Type R is amazing handling car with front LSD. Now if Subaru still made a STI, that would make sense since it has front LSD, center DCCD diff, and rear LSD.
Yeah I was hopeful the tS since it costs as much at the Type-R would compete in performance. They really should have made this an STI with the power and agility of the Type-R, GR and Golf R
Same thing I was thinking
What mods are on the fl5? I hear a blow off valve?
Armaspeed intake and AWE exhaust! We have lots of FL5 parts on our site. www.brosfourrspeed.com
Do you guys still have the Veloster N?
We never owned one. Might of had one as a press car 2-3 years ago for a week
@@BrosFOURRSpeed ohh mb, I just saw you do a POV drive some years ago
Yeah if we own a car you'll know lol. We'll have tons of videos on cars we own
SUBARU FOREVER
Certainly a way to go. But I'd go for a Limited or Premium. Can't see spending Type-R money for a car thats much slower and doesn't handle as well as the competition
I had the WRX limited, and the Acura Integra Aspec, pretty boring both.
I now have the 2024 BRZ limited, so much fun even with less hp and the price is really good compared to those two.
Well the A-Spec is pretty slow. The Type-S is the one with the power and fun factor. BRZ is pretty fun! We had the GR86 at it's pretty fun. Test out a Type-R or Type-S. Even more fun I think with more power and practicality
What the he j there is a gallardo in that garage!
Yeah that's my baby. Owned that for a year now th-cam.com/video/jInp7TVsZJs/w-d-xo.html
Just go with premium wrx for 34k, a new type r is gonna have a ton of dealer markups (if you can even find one) its just not worth it
Non of our dealers have had markups on their Type-R's. Not sure why people think thats still a thing. But yeah a Premium or Limited would be a much better value. tS needs to have Still power and agility to compete with the other $46k cars
Its Porsche and Honda 1 and 2 shifters .
Yeah both make great manuals!
I'd buy the basic wrx and buy an old school type r with the rest of the money
Yeah that'd be a great way to go
I know it is a minor thing but all that debris on the WRX's intercooler should have been removed prior to filming. Hope it was before closing the hood.
I actually did pull all that off before driving. However thats going to happen on the day to day with a big hood scoop
I guess it can't really avoided when there is a huge opening in the hood. Great review though.
My wrx, a 2011 stock, has three less hp, why is Subaru allergic to making the wrx faster?
That’s crazy! Not sure why they just don’t want the STI around
Subaru is just a cheaply built car even see the shifter wobble when you released the throttle
Yeah the shifter lacks a lot. I'd go for a base WRX if I had to get one. Not even close to the TypeR
The TS is trash...46k is way to much for these overpriced premium wrx....
Yeah I just can’t get on board with the $40k+ WRX trims. Same performance overall as a basic one. Needs to be an STI to compete with these new 300hp cars
Yeah no way this costs 46k. Disgrace. Ugly (Only nice things is front seats, it seems it has more bolster than prev gen STI) inside out. And 6k redline? Are they trying to see how low rpm redline they can go??
Yeah the bolsters are nice. Still not as comfortable as the CTR tho. Not sure why the STI isnt back
You can get them for 39k since they are selling bad. While a type r will always go over 10k msrp.
@@GokuTheHusky cool to get discounts on the WRX. However anyone can get an MSRP FL5. My dealers have had 4 come through at sticker in the last 3 months. Mine only had 2k miles and I was $45k otd
This Civic is one of the best car of all time in world car history
Yeah it's a blast for the money for sure!
This car is the biggest scam Subaru could pull off 💀
Can you explain?
@BrosFOURRSpeed First pricing, there's nothing in this car that can justify the pricing, second this car is tuned by Sti yet looks and feels like a glorified WRX there's almost no Sti parts in it. GT gearing feels better, and lastly no changes in the powertrain. There's nothing that scream STi on it. This vehicle should've feel like m340i vs m3.
Yeah hard to understand how a base model WRX is the same performance as this top level. They should have capitalized more and made this a true STI.
@@BrosFOURRSpeed Absolutely! This a disgusting attempt to rip off customers.
Does the Ts have LSD front and back?
I don't believe it has any LSD. Not 100% sure tho
Centre viscous only.
Out of the box, the FL5 will be better, but with mods, the wrx will always leave the FL5 in the dust... its that simple... If you want a slightly more rare, civic... thats still FWD... then over pay for an FL5, and enjoy it, just dont mod it for power because you will be disapointed with anything except roll racing on teh freeway
I'd happily pay the premium for the FL5 to avoid the embarrassment of driving the WRX.
In some ways yes. FWD has its limitations for more power by far. However it will take a lot of money and parts to get a WRX to handle like the Type-R. If you want real power I'd go for something completely different then either of these like and RS3 or M2. But at this level of car the CTR just drives so much better. Regardless if you can make the WRX faster in a straight line, is that really the point of these cars? I'll take handling over speed. If you just want the speed go for a base WRX for $32k. The tS specifically I just don't understand. Shouldn't have to highly modify it to be as good as a stock CTR, GRC or Golf R
lol plus these hold value extremely well. So pretty cheap to own overall
Absolutely not. Stock subi sti makes around 240-250 whp. Type R is making over 300 whp from factory. FBO with a little corn ctr makes around 450 at crank whereas sti will be lucky to make 350. Literally everything about the type R is superior other than comparison while driving in wet or slippery conditions, dig, or building a race car. The sti will get absolutely smoked on any track or canyon, too, unless wet conditions- which who cares about racing in those conditions. Better resale, reliability, engine, transmission, handling, etc.
@@Dailyshart Wrong. The FA24 isn't the EJ, and it has already to 500+ whp on corn.
You can easily get 320 with a 93 pro tune and up to 400whp with Full bolt-ons and exhaust
And you can get too 400 with just an E35 conversation.
Transmission is can a dice roll at 400+, but you can swap in the STI trans and diffs.
Funny enough there's even holes already for it from the factory.
2021 VA WRX 26k MSRP
2021 VA STI 36k MSRP
2022 VB WRX 35k+ MSRP
Subaru.... explain your pricing
You can say that about any brand since 2021, prices have gone up with every manufacturer...not just suabaru..
@BrosFOURRSpeed
What Subaru did is like Mc Ds canceling the Big Mac and started selling their cheeseburger for Big Mac prices.
@@fadmap9676 ok, what would you buy instead?
@BrosFOURRSpeed honestly, right now, nothing. Both of my cars are paid off, and the economy is upside down, not a good time to get into a new car. BUT I'd likely get a G80 M3 Comp X Drive if rates ever came back down to reality.
@@fadmap9676 amazing car. But this video is talking about cars at $46k price range. So meaning at this price level what car would be ideal
For gods sake , the WRX TS isn’t any different than the rest of the WRX line. Same engine , only difference is wheels , dampers and brakes.
Yeah that's what doesn't make sense to me. Should have some power increases and more agility for this price
WRX is way better car then civic.Its an all weather car when Civic is not ! Above all its a TUNER car you make it any thing you wish for.
Yes for cold and damp conditions the AWD is superior. But the WRX is much slower and doesn't handle even close to this. You can make power in the WRX better, but it still doesn't handle like the Type-R. Might as well get a Golf R to get the AWD, power and agility. I don't see a place for a loaded spec WRX like the tS. If you want a WRX get a base model at $32k and build it up. Starting at $46k and already being down on power and handling doesn't make sense.
@BrosFOURRSpeed Golf is trouble , German garbage, good when it works, but you soon will know every VW mechanic by first name in your dealership. WRX is tuned down on purpose so you will get next year model. In life it can do 0 to 100 in about 5
@@marksphotoperry356 TypeR is still much better the the WRX. Cant beat the handling. But we’ve had good luck with VW products. Audi particularly. Not sure if VW would be different tho
@@BrosFOURRSpeed Do not Lie to your self ! Any German car is trash ! I been trough 1 VW ,2 BMW cars all 3 ,New cars with full Guarantee ! All solid Trouble ! For every German car you would own you need a Japanese car to drive. Because the German trash would be sitting at the dealer half of the time. Remember i said that !
@@marksphotoperry356 Well we’ve had two R8’s and A3, S3, RS3, MK5 Supra and X5. Only issue we’ve ever had was the X5 having a software update that killed the battery. Everything has been flawless on the rest of them
To answer your question, no!
lol yeah this needs to be an STI
why did they axed the sti, again?
No clue! Makes no sense
This is comparing apples and oranges.
They cost the same. So these are two cars buyers would be cross shopping. Overall yes the FL5 is a significantly better driving experience. tS should have been an STI to compete in this price range
Disrespectful to compare Type R with a wrx
How so? These cost the exact same
Why would you not compare the Type R against the STI? Makes zero sense comparing the two models you did. Sorry. Try again with the proper comparison.
They don’t make the STI anymore, so that would be an old car.
A stock Subie Legacy can be optioned to be a sleeper WRX. A turbo Legacy, without the insurance eye-catching WRX badges, big wing, etc., is a worthwhile purchase. The Civic R only comes one way. Your insurance company will smell it out and smack you with "hot car" premiums. No other way about it.
Not at all, just because the car is more expensive or a higher trim level doesn’t mean higher rates. All that depends on the individual.
Both are overpriced to the moon! Both should be 25-30% cheaper to even be considered “valuable”.
Well overpriced is subjective. The Type-R's still hold near MSRP on the used market. So clearly the majority of people value them highly. Not sure what the WRX tS will depreciate to on the used market. But cars that are truly 'overpriced', depreciate heavy once they hit used market. FL5 is not a car that depreciates much. It's very well worth the money. A lower level WRX is a fin car for under $40k.
the wrx looks like a white dog with a black nose, i cant unsee it
lol maybe
Subaru is hot garbage compared to the Type R
Yeah it just falls short for the price. They need to do an STI at this price
Wrx tS is a 30k car. I wouldn't even buy it at that price point. 😂😂😂
Aside from the cool looking interior. It pretty much drives the same as a base. So the price is very hard to understand. Especially when you drive a GRC, CTR and Golf R
You answered your own question. I'm choosing the WRX for the better back seat (I got 2 small kids), and the AWD. AWD drive is king in the rain, snow, mud, etc. Plus the WRX can get to 400HP with way fewer mods and AWD actually puts that power to the road better. Golf R is a NO for me, because it is the ugliest car on the planet to me.
So would you get the tS for $46k or just get a more normal trim like a Limited or Premium for under $40k? THat's what I'd do. Why spend $46k on a WRX that has no more performance than a base WRX at $32k. If you're seeing $46k might as well get the car thats already faster and better handling
GolfR 8.5, hm k, bye!
Yeah I talked about the Golf R in this video. Here's my comparison with the Type-R to the Golf R. th-cam.com/video/AZnbuN1pDy0/w-d-xo.html
We have a WRX vs Golf R coming soon
the better car is the one you want
Which one is “better” to you?
You didn't like wrx.its ok what about gr corolla 2025
GRC is a cool option! I have a video comparing it to the CTR.
th-cam.com/video/vPHdFD9E244/w-d-xo.html
And one coming comparing it to this WRX coming soon.
That Subaru’s depreciation gonna be ridiculous
How do you know that?
Both are not worth the $$$$$$$
Well the FL5 holds its value extremely well. So clearly they are worth the price to enough people. What car would you buy at $47k?
Doesnt sound like you are the correct demographic for this honda.
How so? I do own it and have enjoyed it over these first few months. Who is supposed to buy it?
Both are so big that they feel like boats when you’re driving them 😅
FL5 certainly doesn’t feel like a boat 😂
That’s not true 😂. If you want to see a boat on the road, check out BMW.
@@Vtecpower-lu5ye def does, it’s such a big car
@@Xchax3 an m2 feels better than an FL5 lol
Really? These rent Dodge Challengers
Why? WRX has no chance against FL5. Just saying.
Yeah the tS needs to be a real STI for this price
type r all the way, the only thing the subi got is awd. No hate to subi
WRX is just too expensive at this trim level. Not even close!
@ and plus you can’t go wrong with a FL5 Type r, the road presence, the space, simplicity of the interior, Honda reliability like what more can I person need😂😂😂
As much as Honda wants you to believe that the fl5 can be a daily driver, it aint, it's a track-focused car, from the driver modes,to the weight reductions of the fl5 without a sunroof, power seats, etc.....I own a 2023 fl5, she up on dollys, until spring. And my daily is a 2022 Honda Accord Touring 2.0T.
Depends on what you like. For me I have zero issues daily driving it. So comfortable and fun to drive with good tech. Put 400 miles in two days the other week and loved every bit. So depends on what you find to be a good daily