I had a fitting and the upgraded Ventus Red w/Velecore was only slightly better for me. 1 or 2 yards more and 1-2 yards straighter. In the end, not worth the extra dollars.
I'm not convinced that the average golfer would see that much of a difference. I would think that most golfers can grab a set of clubs off the shelf and can knock it round in 85. Give them a £3000 set of custom fit clubs and they'll knock it round in 85 🤷
It all comes down to your ability to adjust to ill fitting clubs. Tour pros such as Jon Rahm can adjust after just one swing, most recreational golfers have a more difficult time. Getting fit and getting the right equipment helps with confidence and subsequently scores. Easier to improve your swing if the clubs aren’t holding you back.
I’d say you get what you pay for, sometimes it is a little more and sometimes it’s a lot. But the main thing was how much confidence Sam had in you! Standing in front!
I have 4 Stealth woods with stock shafts. Your test shows that Velocore gives a bit better dispersion but I don't think it's enough to justify an extra $1200 to upgrade my clubs. Also, keep in mind that the 2nd gen stock Ventus says TR but is also non Velocore. The only ones with Velocore actually say Velocore on the shaft so please refer to the upgrade shaft as a Velocore (not a TR) in future. One last thought. You should do a 3rd video testing the ultra cheap Ali Express version! 🤣
I think you can go back and forth all day on this particular subject. If you are happy to fork out the cash for better dispersion and a little more consistency then that's fine. I would advise that you stop second guessing yourself or you'll never be satisfied. I keep thinking that my next wife will be better and that's why I'm sitting here watching TH-cam videos 🤣
Agreed, ultimately you have to just stop tinkering and settle down and play your game. The dispersion is worse with stock shaft, would you have been happy with that enough to buy it? The Velocore gave you consistency and importantly confidence. What price for that?
Make sure your next wife isn't stock. Definately worth the extra cash to buy the proprietary wife, with all the added benefits including better consistency and a more stable deflection point. No matter how much you turn a blind eye to the inconsistent behaviour of the stock one, you will always yearn for the more expensive, better-looking, lower flighted old cow.
Another world class video with Sam and I hope he gets some business out of some of your followers who live local to him. Looking forward to seeing your numbers when you play around with the loft sleeve Gaz
don't shank to his 🥜 don't shank to his 🥜 "omg im so sorry dude" . That would be my fear. Love this vid though on a serious note, I'm considering this upgrade as well.
The biggest trick to the ventus line is tipping. If you tip the non-velocore shaft it becomes the stiffness of the velocore. it will save you $200 to $400 bucks. lots of fitters out there pushing the upcharge, which is great for business, but you don't need to do it. little insider knowledge for you.
Appreciatethe information from these videos. Yea, the launch can make a big difference. People focus on speed a lot, but if you can get a higher launch and keep that lower spin, it should go a lot further.
I think it’s all in your mind, as soon as you it the second one, that first ball, was just perfect, and then after, when you realize that, all your hits, after, were so so
My current irons are Titleist AP2 718 with AMT shafts. Just bought them via our pro shop and never tried them or never was fitted. After a few months I went for a golf lesson that does also fitting. He told me "You see that those irons are perfectly fitted for you" 😀
I had a fitting recently and couldn’t believe how much better the velocore shaft was. The dispersion is soo much better, and I found the middle of the club more often. It’s expensive, but I’ve wasted so much on keep changing driver, when maybe I should of just paid for an upgraded shaft 🤷♂️
The question I have is you pay for an upcharge shaft but shouldn’t you get the stock shaft also. A driver is £529 with a shaft from AG for example then pay £329 on a shaft but you only get one. Shouldn’t you get both?
You wouldn’t if you order it through a brand, as you’re paying an extra charge to upgrade the stock shaft. When you buy from an independent fitter like sam, he orders more exotic shafts, so he can charge you less to buy the shaft than brands can to upgrade into the shaft, so you’d get both shafts.
The placebo effect means if you think it’s better you will hit it better , the spin rate and efficiency are most important and on those the standard shaft worked well . I expect if the club has enough variety of stock shafts you will get a driver that works for you.
If that was true, we’d all be better golfers and the richest people would be the best. There’s a definite difference, but is the amount of difference worth the cost. I swap between ventus black (vocore) and the autoflex depending on how I’m hitting them on the range. If I use the autoflex, I have to remove the back weight of the TSR3 to get a swing weight in the recommended range for that shaft.
@@michaelbarker3749the effect just makes you better than you would otherwise be. All medical tests are blind for that reason. Gary may have hit his first shot with the stock shaft the best because of him feeling he had to concentrate using the perceived weaker shaft. Can you do a blind test with your two shafts and see if the difference is less than if you know which shaft is which ?
Genuinely have no idea what shaft or driver specs I should be using - and desperately need to get a fitting for some base settings. Of course, then I'd want a driver costing me a stack of cash....On top of that, the youth is hitting a growth spurt and I suspect will be moving up from his Cobra Junior Driver into an adult spec in time for the summer = expensive.
I am looking to get a 7 wood in the Qi10 Max and was wondering what type of KBS shaft i should put in it i have a swing speed of 90-94 mph with my driver 59 years old handicap of about 7 i normally hit a high ball pretty straight I am unable to go for a fitting due to my location i look forward to your thoughts thx cheers from Canada
Gaz. You just yot fitted for your driver with your swing. Now you have want to hit up on it, changing your swing again. Wont that affect the adjustment made to the head? Might be easier to see a shrink
I personally really like the ventus, theirs a lot of tour players using them now, and I don’t think that’s coincidence. Great shaft. If there is an option for you to try them, that might be best though ⛳️
Why not? you can be happy with the results but if you know there's a little more in there then you keep tweaking. If you see a negative impact then you just reverse said change. Overtime as you get more comfortable with the club and have a lot more feedback on the shots and data then it makes sense to see if a certain area can be improved on.
Same with me. I can understand why people would be satisfied with the stock as the numbers were good, but the velocore just feels more stable and has less dispersion.
Thanks for the video! I've been researching the difference and from what I got is that with velocore is a more stable shaft throughout with a stiffer tip than the non-velocore which is a little more whipy.
The numbers don’t flatter the velocore, but if you get the opportunity to try them side by side, the feel is chalk and cheese. I’m not saying the standard ventus is bad, but when you try it after the velecore, it doesn’t feel so smooth. I also definitely felt less stability at the bottom of the shaft which I’ve never felt before, most likely because that was just normal to me before I’d had a month using the velocore.
Looking to get fitted, also dont want to pay $500 Canadian for a shaft. On the fence of buying a ventus blue velocore for $200, but is it worth the risk?
Hi I asked someone to buy me a Ventus blue shaft but didn’t specify that I want Velocore. He got me a blue shaft which doesn’t mention Velocore or TR and he charged me $400 for it. He probably got the stock version! My question is that is the stock version supposed to be $400? Even its brand new shaft. I am really confused and worried that I have overpaid for it.
I tried the stock Ventus red 5R and my misses were high right. Then I switched to the stock Ventus blue 6R and I eliminated the big right miss. My swing speed is 95 with driver. I would have stayed with the Red 5R because it’s longer but I could not controlled it.
Hi Gary i love these videos busting the myths of cost vs performce. What would be interesting to understand is how the stock vs exotic shafts differ in flex, kickpoint and contact with the ball. I guess very expensive high speed video equipment is necessary to film and view which im sure the shaft co have but woukd be reluctant to share. Also another factor is altho the weight ofbthe shaft is the same how is the weight which leads to torque distributed. Shaft discussion can become a rabbit hole if you search for answers and explanations.😮
Taylormade stock Ventus shafts are unusually excellent for oem. The stock Ventus Blue + Sim2 combo was truly excellent, and just replacing with premium Velocore shaft and others tended to throw off the balance. Of note, stock Ventus Blue is a lot stiffer than same spec Velocore Blue, which in turn has lower torque!
That’s interesting! I tried the ventus blue stiff in a sim max 2 3 wood and it really did feel great! Because we’ve lowered the loft, lower than I’d normally use (to open the face) and used a stiff flex instead of x, he’s gone for velecore red to give me the feel I want, with stability and launch. The standard ventus red actually gives me better launch and spin but I could feel the torque.
I bought a Velocore shaft a few months ago. A Blue 6X for my driver. It was probably the best equipment purchase I've ever made. My miss was always a high push out to the right, usually out of play. The shaft seems to square up the face, so that shot never happens. It's weird because I can still feel when I make that swing but the ball stays in play up the right instead of tailing into the trees. I don't actually hit any farther when I square it up, it just keeps the ball in play so I can swing freely.
If you said to most golfers that they could spend up to £200 but it would increase dispersion on driving I think a lot would throw that money at you. I think it’s personal. Get playing with it
I thought I had a low ball flight! Wow, and for a dude as tall as him that ball flight is crazy flat. If he could add another few hundred revs of spin and launch higher he'd be 30 yrds longer easy. Get another 15 in the air. His roll is sometimes 15% of his distance. It's hard to have ball control with that flat flight of the driver. Spin = higher launch = more control = tighter dispersion.
Lol, first swing with stock and knocks it long and straight - instant doubt😂 Honestly, should turn off the projector and hit into blank screen for these short tests. Way too much confirmation bias when you see the shape/distance.
@@garymartingolf I bet, the cost isn't worth it for myself lol. I'm in my mid 50's and started golfing more seriously about 2-3 years ago. I think I'm decent at a 8-9 handicap lol. I'm not going to be playing for money lol
Your shoulders are at least 20 yards open at address. At address before you swing get set and stay in posture. Put the club across your shoulders grip end on right shoulder and the shaft across the other shoulder with the club head furthest away from you and u can see where your aimed and how open you are. Like looking down a rifle barrel. You drift on your takeaway. Too many variables going on and a 2 way miss. That will be $150 US we can start a tab.
I admire Sam's bravery in standing in front of you!
These videos with Sam have been great. Interested to see an iron fitting with him.
I had a fitting and the upgraded Ventus Red w/Velecore was only slightly better for me. 1 or 2 yards more and 1-2 yards straighter. In the end, not worth the extra dollars.
Congrats on getting to 20k subscribers Gaz. The content with Sam is really generating a lot of interest.
I'm not convinced that the average golfer would see that much of a difference. I would think that most golfers can grab a set of clubs off the shelf and can knock it round in 85. Give them a £3000 set of custom fit clubs and they'll knock it round in 85 🤷
85? Much. Higher than that,but your point is valid.
It all comes down to your ability to adjust to ill fitting clubs. Tour pros such as Jon Rahm can adjust after just one swing, most recreational golfers have a more difficult time. Getting fit and getting the right equipment helps with confidence and subsequently scores. Easier to improve your swing if the clubs aren’t holding you back.
this will actualy benefit a worse golfer more. the velecore twists waaay less on mishits results in better flights on bad strikes
The average golfer does not shoot 85
I’d say you get what you pay for, sometimes it is a little more and sometimes it’s a lot. But the main thing was how much confidence Sam had in you! Standing in front!
He still didn’t dare stand to the left though did he 😒😏😄😂
I don't care what shaft ya use, just bloody well beat Robo already would ya?! 🤣✌🏽😉
🤣🤣😂😂 I’m on it 😅
I have 4 Stealth woods with stock shafts. Your test shows that Velocore gives a bit better dispersion but I don't think it's enough to justify an extra $1200 to upgrade my clubs. Also, keep in mind that the 2nd gen stock Ventus says TR but is also non Velocore. The only ones with Velocore actually say Velocore on the shaft so please refer to the upgrade shaft as a Velocore (not a TR) in future. One last thought. You should do a 3rd video testing the ultra cheap Ali Express version! 🤣
Good idea!
I think you can go back and forth all day on this particular subject. If you are happy to fork out the cash for better dispersion and a little more consistency then that's fine. I would advise that you stop second guessing yourself or you'll never be satisfied. I keep thinking that my next wife will be better and that's why I'm sitting here watching TH-cam videos 🤣
😂
Agreed, ultimately you have to just stop tinkering and settle down and play your game. The dispersion is worse with stock shaft, would you have been happy with that enough to buy it? The Velocore gave you consistency and importantly confidence. What price for that?
@@guyr7351 definitely! You could see the difference in Gary's confidence as soon as he started using his new driver.
😂😂
Make sure your next wife isn't stock. Definately worth the extra cash to buy the proprietary wife, with all the added benefits including better consistency and a more stable deflection point. No matter how much you turn a blind eye to the inconsistent behaviour of the stock one, you will always yearn for the more expensive, better-looking, lower flighted old cow.
GAZ, just tip the non velacor 1 inch and I the numbers will be close !!!, just a thought 😁
Better numbers !!!
Another world class video with Sam and I hope he gets some business out of some of your followers who live local to him. Looking forward to seeing your numbers when you play around with the loft sleeve Gaz
don't shank to his 🥜 don't shank to his 🥜 "omg im so sorry dude" . That would be my fear. Love this vid though on a serious note, I'm considering this upgrade as well.
They’re great shafts.
The added tips stability means you can really fine tune flex and swing weight without the shaft becoming too torquey.
The biggest trick to the ventus line is tipping. If you tip the non-velocore shaft it becomes the stiffness of the velocore. it will save you $200 to $400 bucks. lots of fitters out there pushing the upcharge, which is great for business, but you don't need to do it. little insider knowledge for you.
Thanks! I'm going to buy an old ventus model so this definitely helps
TM tip the upgraded Velocore shaft, so I thought the same...
What if you tipped the ventus?? And made it more stable
Great video once again please keep them coming .
Appreciatethe information from these videos. Yea, the launch can make a big difference. People focus on speed a lot, but if you can get a higher launch and keep that lower spin, it should go a lot further.
I just ordered a Ventus Red and the Ping G430 LST head. Higher launching shaft with low spin head. In theory high launch low spin.
Gaz...you gonna back in Jan for the new TM QI10 fitting 🤷
Noooo! I love the stealth 2 head. May do a comparison, but I can’t see it being any better!
I think it’s all in your mind, as soon as you it the second one, that first ball, was just perfect, and then after, when you realize that, all your hits, after, were so so
My current irons are Titleist AP2 718 with AMT shafts. Just bought them via our pro shop and never tried them or never was fitted.
After a few months I went for a golf lesson that does also fitting. He told me "You see that those irons are perfectly fitted for you" 😀
Upgrade shaft spin is too low for a driver shaft you are using all the time, even pros like to be in and around 2200.
There’s no way I would be paying £200 extra for that shaft! The stock version was fine! You could easily make that work!
There’s a lot of things in life I cut costs on, but after 10 years of hitting a 3 wood, being confident with driver is priceless to me. Cheers
Experts don't need good clubs, and beginners can't tell the difference even with good ones.
I was fit into the 6S Ventus TR Red a few weeks ago. Excited to get my Ai Smoke Max soon!
It’s so nice! I’ve just been for a fit on fairway and it felt the best again 👌🏼
Great show mate, regardless of what shaft, how confident in your driving is Sam, standing so close could lose a ball or two 😂 keep them coming mate.
I had a fitting recently and couldn’t believe how much better the velocore shaft was. The dispersion is soo much better, and I found the middle of the club more often. It’s expensive, but I’ve wasted so much on keep changing driver, when maybe I should of just paid for an upgraded shaft 🤷♂️
Same!!
Taylormade also has a stock version on the ventus TR I wonder if that different as well
I've got the stock Ventus blue in my driver and hybrids and they are the best, most consistent shafts I have ever had.
The question I have is you pay for an upcharge shaft but shouldn’t you get the stock shaft also. A driver is £529 with a shaft from AG for example then pay £329 on a shaft but you only get one. Shouldn’t you get both?
You wouldn’t if you order it through a brand, as you’re paying an extra charge to upgrade the stock shaft. When you buy from an independent fitter like sam, he orders more exotic shafts, so he can charge you less to buy the shaft than brands can to upgrade into the shaft, so you’d get both shafts.
Nice one gaz love these vids cocker
Cheers 😃
So basically save the 200 lol
If you’re the person that doesn’t feel too much difference in shafts, you could do lol
The placebo effect means if you think it’s better you will hit it better , the spin rate and efficiency are most important and on those the standard shaft worked well . I expect if the club has enough variety of stock shafts you will get a driver that works for you.
If that was true, we’d all be better golfers and the richest people would be the best.
There’s a definite difference, but is the amount of difference worth the cost.
I swap between ventus black (vocore) and the autoflex depending on how I’m hitting them on the range.
If I use the autoflex, I have to remove the back weight of the TSR3 to get a swing weight in the recommended range for that shaft.
@@michaelbarker3749the effect just makes you better than you would otherwise be. All medical tests are blind for that reason. Gary may have hit his first shot with the stock shaft the best because of him feeling he had to concentrate using the perceived weaker shaft. Can you do a blind test with your two shafts and see if the difference is less than if you know which shaft is which ?
Love these fitting videos
Im loving making them 😂 Any ideas, throw them our way 😃
Genuinely have no idea what shaft or driver specs I should be using - and desperately need to get a fitting for some base settings.
Of course, then I'd want a driver costing me a stack of cash....On top of that, the youth is hitting a growth spurt and I suspect will be moving up from his Cobra Junior Driver into an adult spec in time for the summer = expensive.
I am looking to get a 7 wood in the Qi10 Max and was wondering what type of KBS shaft i should put in it i have a swing speed of 90-94 mph with my driver 59 years old handicap of about 7 i normally hit a high ball pretty straight I am unable to go for a fitting due to my location i look forward to your thoughts thx cheers from Canada
Gaz. You just yot fitted for your driver with your swing. Now you have want to hit up on it, changing your swing again. Wont that affect the adjustment made to the head? Might be easier to see a shrink
I’m not changing this shaft, it was just for other people’s knowledge of stock vs tour shaft.
should i get ventus blue non velo core or hzrdus smoke blue or tensei 1k blue in my new smoke driver?
I personally really like the ventus, theirs a lot of tour players using them now, and I don’t think that’s coincidence. Great shaft. If there is an option for you to try them, that might be best though ⛳️
You had a fitting. You have been happy with the outcome. Now you think it is time to fine tune. Really! 🤔
Why not?
you can be happy with the results but if you know there's a little more in there then you keep tweaking. If you see a negative impact then you just reverse said change.
Overtime as you get more comfortable with the club and have a lot more feedback on the shots and data then it makes sense to see if a certain area can be improved on.
I have ventus blue Velocore and stock one. Dispersion was the only real difference for me also but worth the extra $ for me
Same with me. I can understand why people would be satisfied with the stock as the numbers were good, but the velocore just feels more stable and has less dispersion.
Thanks for the video! I've been researching the difference and from what I got is that with velocore is a more stable shaft throughout with a stiffer tip than the non-velocore which is a little more whipy.
The numbers don’t flatter the velocore, but if you get the opportunity to try them side by side, the feel is chalk and cheese. I’m not saying the standard ventus is bad, but when you try it after the velecore, it doesn’t feel so smooth. I also definitely felt less stability at the bottom of the shaft which I’ve never felt before, most likely because that was just normal to me before I’d had a month using the velocore.
Looking to get fitted, also dont want to pay $500 Canadian for a shaft. On the fence of buying a ventus blue velocore for $200, but is it worth the risk?
Ventus Velcocore Blue for $200 is cheap 😮 They’re quality shafts if installed right.
Hi I asked someone to buy me a Ventus blue shaft but didn’t specify that I want Velocore.
He got me a blue shaft which doesn’t mention Velocore or TR and he charged me $400 for it.
He probably got the stock version!
My question is that is the stock version supposed to be $400? Even its brand new shaft. I am really confused and worried that I have overpaid for it.
I tried the stock Ventus red 5R and my misses were high right. Then I switched to the stock Ventus blue 6R and I eliminated the big right miss. My swing speed is 95 with driver. I would have stayed with the Red 5R because it’s longer but I could not controlled it.
If the goal is a better golf score - getting a $500 shaft is not it.
Crazy how he stands infront of you. It only takes once
You could Chuck a lolly pop stick in and carry 270 Gaz…….. what more do you need🤣🤣🤣
Hi Gary i love these videos busting the myths of cost vs performce. What would be interesting to understand is how the stock vs exotic shafts differ in flex, kickpoint and contact with the ball. I guess very expensive high speed video equipment is necessary to film and view which im sure the shaft co have but woukd be reluctant to share. Also another factor is altho the weight ofbthe shaft is the same how is the weight which leads to torque distributed. Shaft discussion can become a rabbit hole if you search for answers and explanations.😮
Just get a stock shaft lol then you can change them when you fallout with them! Or just buy a new driver lol
Dude you’re hitting a driver better than you ever have what are you complaining about….
Taylormade stock Ventus shafts are unusually excellent for oem. The stock Ventus Blue + Sim2 combo was truly excellent, and just replacing with premium Velocore shaft and others tended to throw off the balance. Of note, stock Ventus Blue is a lot stiffer than same spec Velocore Blue, which in turn has lower torque!
That’s interesting! I tried the ventus blue stiff in a sim max 2 3 wood and it really did feel great! Because we’ve lowered the loft, lower than I’d normally use (to open the face) and used a stiff flex instead of x, he’s gone for velecore red to give me the feel I want, with stability and launch.
The standard ventus red actually gives me better launch and spin but I could feel the torque.
I bought a Velocore shaft a few months ago. A Blue 6X for my driver. It was probably the best equipment purchase I've ever made. My miss was always a high push out to the right, usually out of play. The shaft seems to square up the face, so that shot never happens. It's weird because I can still feel when I make that swing but the ball stays in play up the right instead of tailing into the trees. I don't actually hit any farther when I square it up, it just keeps the ball in play so I can swing freely.
Really enjoying these videos. Out of interest what is your hcp Gaz?
It’s -0.2, but now I coach and vlog, I just don’t prepare to play like I used too when I played county golf.
@@garymartingolf keep making the videos mate. Really enjoy the content. Would be good to see some more videos against James as well
What about ventus red velocore vs TR ventus... I have the 2 shafts you tried just about the same results
If you said to most golfers that they could spend up to £200 but it would increase dispersion on driving I think a lot would throw that money at you.
I think it’s personal. Get playing with it
I have ventus stock shafts in my stealth s gaz n I love em I think its getting the right flex and weight n some golfer s go on feel 💪 😊
I thought I had a low ball flight! Wow, and for a dude as tall as him that ball flight is crazy flat. If he could add another few hundred revs of spin and launch higher he'd be 30 yrds longer easy. Get another 15 in the air. His roll is sometimes 15% of his distance. It's hard to have ball control with that flat flight of the driver. Spin = higher launch = more control = tighter dispersion.
If you’re bothered about geeky stuff, this is why my flights so low! th-cam.com/video/RxfpTNVYrTo/w-d-xo.htmlsi=hlrnf56i6hixJeGY
Lol, first swing with stock and knocks it long and straight - instant doubt😂
Honestly, should turn off the projector and hit into blank screen for these short tests. Way too much confirmation bias when you see the shape/distance.
Interesting video, cheers
Thanks
Hi Garry does Sam do puring on golf shafts ?
I cant believe hes standing right there, lol.
And he could of hit the velocore TR shaft......
I got fitted for a new driver last month and tbh it goes no further than my 2017 M2....
Did you buy it? Distance is sometimes hard to find, unless you the wrong launch and spin going into a fit.
Why test Ventus Red TR against a 2 year old Ventus Red? Instead of TR vs TR?
We don’t have the new Ventus Red TR 5S. We’re trying to build a channel on a wing and a prayer atm 😃
This simply shows yet again that the equipment is far less important than the person swinging the club.
That will always be the case, although I felt better with the £300 shaft unfortunately.
@@garymartingolf I bet, the cost isn't worth it for myself lol. I'm in my mid 50's and started golfing more seriously about 2-3 years ago. I think I'm decent at a 8-9 handicap lol. I'm not going to be playing for money lol
Your shoulders are at least 20 yards open at address. At address before you swing get set and stay in posture. Put the club across your shoulders grip end on right shoulder and the shaft across the other shoulder with the club head furthest away from you and u can see where your aimed and how open you are. Like looking down a rifle barrel. You drift on your takeaway. Too many variables going on and a 2 way miss. That will be $150 US we can start a tab.
nothing like a keyboard golf pro
@@justthrowitgolfeveryone's an expert 😂
@@justthrowitgolfhaha indeed 😀
Would be interesting to see a blind test 🤔
Now I'm REALLY looking forward to the next one Gaz.
I'm loving these more technical bias vlogs 👍👍👍
ONWARDS 👉👉👉
Thank you! Next up is a hybrid fit, and then the follow on 😃
Gaz it doesn't matter mate.Your not a tour player you only play social golf in the main and Robbo will talk you out of it anyway.LOL
Love the video Gaz, interesting results. Loving the videos, keep up the great work in 2024! 👍😎😎⛳️🏌🏼♂️
Thank you! All the best for next year 🙌🏽