In CA, all hunting with a firearm is lead free. It was a learning curve, but now I really like it and will use copper no matter which state I hunt. Like in the video, you need to lower the grain of the projectile to keep the same length for stability, but this is not an issue as the copper has such great penetration that a heavier bullet is not needed. I also found copper to be very accurate. Due to the great penetration, some hunters are down sizing their rifles. Light recoil rifles like .243 will drill copper through and break bones on the way and are more lethal than they ever were. I would be comfortable taking a big pig with a light rifle and copper loads. Copper normally passes all the way through, but the slugs I have recovered expanded perfectly and held together even after breaking bones. Its no fun to have something forced upon you, but I must say that I love copper. This time.... I agree, it was the right thing to do.
the biggest complain is that nonlead bullets are Expenive. if the nonlead ammo was the same as lead, or even cheaper. everyone would be using non lead bullets.
Ken D , I don’t think he’s challenging you or the idea of using non lead ammo . The price on that ammo seems like it could be brought down to incentivize people to use it more. I agree with you , I’m loading the Barnes TTSX ammo but it’s super pricey.
Lead exposure is a very serious matter. This is why most veteran in their old age suffer dementia, alzheimers and many more cognitive retardation diseases. It's triply risky to growing children. I hope we find a cheap alternative soon.
I live in New York state which I feel will soon go the way of California with the lead ammunition ban. My concern with copper solid bullets is proper expansion with lower velocity cartridges. Here in the Northeast many people are still hunting with lever action 30-30s and 35 Remingtons. Now I'm not an expert but I've read that a lot of the monolithic bullets need higher impact velocities to expand reliably, velocities that traditional lever gun cartridges will have a hard time achieving. I could see the use of solid bullets in magnum cartridges, 270, .30-06, etc where I have seen explosive fragmentation of traditional soft points. But any deer I've ever shot with 30-30 170 grain soft points I have seen little to no evidence of fragmentation and the bullet always does a complete pass through and does not remain in the carcass or gut pile. Just my concerns in my observations.
Hi Ed! Your correct that slower moving bullets both fragment less (lead), and may not appropriately expand (copper). With that being said, we usually advise people to keep their velocity above 1800 fps to ensure appropiate expansion. Hornady LeverEvolution with their Monoflex bullet comes out of the muzzle at 2465 so it will perform right out past a few hundred yards. With lead ammunition, it is completely possible to get a pass through while still depositing fragments (see the radiograph at www.huntingwithnonlead.org/bullet_performance2015.html). We are even seeing .22s fragmenting with their very low velocities. As for your state passing regulation requiring non-lead we are actively working with state Fish & Game departments to prevent this from happening, advocating instead for outreach advocating voluntary participation. If you need an further help feel free to reach out me at Nonlead@iws.org Happy Hunting!
@@anthonysurrency7134 We've shot a lot of the Winchester Supreme loaded with E-tip (discontinued now) that was coated with Lubalox and found them to be very accurate. The E-tip was co-developed with Nosler who I believe bought the rights to that projectile and now they only load it as a rare alloy, which is unfortunate because the Supreme was Winchester's best non-lead option. Another one we have tested is GS Customs loaded by Monolithic Munitions (who are now out of business). The HV custom show some good external ballistics but broke apart after being fired into water at 100 yards. In 22-250 they worked very well on coyotes.
With the price of ammo what it is the price of non lead is negligible. I called the gun shop today he said a 20rd box of regular 9mm: $65.00 Other shops had no ammo.
Hi Dave, these are really some unprecedented times in ammo availability and pricing. We pride ourselves on shooting as much as we can get our hands on and our testing has been heavily impacted since the pandemic. I just saw 9mm Aluminum for $56!! Non-lead ammo pricing has really dropped in recent years as a result of increased competition, and technological and procedural advances. Before the pandemic I could find Federal Copper HP at Walmart for just over $20 (30-06, 308, 270, etc), so hopefully that opportunity returns. Happy Hunting
Typically lighter. Copper is less denser than lead so to avoid stabilization issues with copper, manufacturers make their non-lead bullets lighter. This tends not to be an issue since non-lead holds so much of it's weight, it penetrates deep.
Depends. Lead is denser than copper. With solid copper bullets you can get a higher twist rate without your bullet flying apart. And with a higher twist rate you can shoot longer, heavier, and higher BC bullets. That means way better accuracy and velocity/energy at range. Overall this is likely the future of ammo... If we can afford the copper....
@Chad Thomas I don't think alot of people use heavier bullets for weight retention. I use heavier bullets for the bc and ballistics. Heavier projectiles retain velocity better at longer ranges and they also create way more energy.
Hey Rob, something we do in helping folks transition to non-lead ammunition is find ammo for them. May be a little late, but Turners in Norwalk, CA has GMX for $50, Winchester Copper for $40, and Fresno, CA Sportsman's has GMX for $48. Compared to the Partitions ($56) and some of the other lead options non-lead is currently some of the cheapest options on shelves.
You need to re-read your previous statements prior, then convince me that you are not grouping "all conservatives" as you blame me for so to liberals. I do not need to defend Trump, or anyone else. I do know that he is a "deal-maker." Not my style, except for un-important things. Some deals benefit both sides, and that is how Trump sees it. Personally, bump-stocks are of no importance to me, but if it leads to the continuation of our rights being trampled on, then that upsets me. Another thing. There is no, nor ever will be the perfect candidate. I, nor you, will ever agree with everything any candidate says or does. We have never been privileged to vote for the perfect candidate, neither often for a candidate who best represents our own values ... *but only for the one who is the lesser of 2 evils!* I take exception to this paragraph: *''Women have the right to choose, the fact that you disagree with this, shows how simple-minded and uneducated you are on the issues that cause women to require an abortion in the first place. If there are 100 mass shooting a year, do we ban all guns? No? Then we will also not ban abortion if 100 woman get "unnecessary" abortions. We all have our rights, or no one does.''* --- 1st of all, when one tries to insult or diminish an opponent, by accusing him of being stupid, his goal is to usually try to insult & chase-off his opponent. *NOT ME* So, I am uneducated and stupid for believing it is wrong for a woman to slaughter the off-spring living in her womb. Would that mean, I could rightfully define you as a "supporter of murder and child abuse or the fact that you cannot see in a simple ultra-sound, that a living, innocent human being is present? Anyway, please enlighten me & explain the issues that justify &/or "require" a mother to have her infant burned or mutilated in her womb, yanked out in pieces & tossed into the waste-basket? Don't say these questions are loaded, because this is exactly what occurs during an abortion ... unless of course, you can explain how abortion is a pleasant experience for all involved. To say I am framing you would be cowardly. Your comparing shooting with abortion is pathetic. We can touch on that later.
Really cool. I wish the fishing activities used non lead weights as mandatory. The lead polution in the water is huge also
@NiggaSniffa @NiggaSniffa didnt know that. Thats cool. But in case i lose the sinker, how long will the wax last? Kinda... Forever?
In CA, all hunting with a firearm is lead free. It was a learning curve, but now I really like it and will use copper no matter which state I hunt. Like in the video, you need to lower the grain of the projectile to keep the same length for stability, but this is not an issue as the copper has such great penetration that a heavier bullet is not needed.
I also found copper to be very accurate.
Due to the great penetration, some hunters are down sizing their rifles. Light recoil rifles like .243 will drill copper through and break bones on the way and are more lethal than they ever were. I would be comfortable taking a big pig with a light rifle and copper loads.
Copper normally passes all the way through, but the slugs I have recovered expanded perfectly and held together even after breaking bones.
Its no fun to have something forced upon you, but I must say that I love copper. This time.... I agree, it was the right thing to do.
the biggest complain is that nonlead bullets are Expenive. if the nonlead ammo was the same as lead, or even cheaper. everyone would be using non lead bullets.
Ken D , I don’t think he’s challenging you or the idea of using non lead ammo . The price on that ammo seems like it could be brought down to incentivize people to use it more. I agree with you , I’m loading the Barnes TTSX ammo but it’s super pricey.
now you can find lead free rounds for similar or lesser prices than the standard ammo. Real issue now is a much smaller selection.
Lead exposure is a very serious matter. This is why most veteran in their old age suffer dementia, alzheimers and many more cognitive retardation diseases. It's triply risky to growing children. I hope we find a cheap alternative soon.
Hmm...I just wonder where that bullet lead came from originally?
Most lead used in cartridge manufacturing is smelted overseas (the US no longer smelts lead) from recycled materials
@@huntingwithnon-lead2899 I think you missed his point
Depleted uranium is still legal in California. Smoke them if you have them.
they shoot pigeons with DU over Tucson with the A-10, just for fun. people think it's contrails but it's feathers... vaporized feathers
I live in New York state which I feel will soon go the way of California with the lead ammunition ban. My concern with copper solid bullets is proper expansion with lower velocity cartridges. Here in the Northeast many people are still hunting with lever action 30-30s and 35 Remingtons. Now I'm not an expert but I've read that a lot of the monolithic bullets need higher impact velocities to expand reliably, velocities that traditional lever gun cartridges will have a hard time achieving. I could see the use of solid bullets in magnum cartridges, 270, .30-06, etc where I have seen explosive fragmentation of traditional soft points. But any deer I've ever shot with 30-30 170 grain soft points I have seen little to no evidence of fragmentation and the bullet always does a complete pass through and does not remain in the carcass or gut pile. Just my concerns in my observations.
Hi Ed! Your correct that slower moving bullets both fragment less (lead), and may not appropriately expand (copper). With that being said, we usually advise people to keep their velocity above 1800 fps to ensure appropiate expansion. Hornady LeverEvolution with their Monoflex bullet comes out of the muzzle at 2465 so it will perform right out past a few hundred yards. With lead ammunition, it is completely possible to get a pass through while still depositing fragments (see the radiograph at www.huntingwithnonlead.org/bullet_performance2015.html). We are even seeing .22s fragmenting with their very low velocities.
As for your state passing regulation requiring non-lead we are actively working with state Fish & Game departments to prevent this from happening, advocating instead for outreach advocating voluntary participation.
If you need an further help feel free to reach out me at Nonlead@iws.org
Happy Hunting!
@@chadthomas4182 what about powder coated cast bullets? Theyre harder than lead bullet cores and tend to stick together
@@anthonysurrency7134 Hi Anthony, what specifically about them?
@@chadthomas4182 have you tested with them?
@@anthonysurrency7134 We've shot a lot of the Winchester Supreme loaded with E-tip (discontinued now) that was coated with Lubalox and found them to be very accurate. The E-tip was co-developed with Nosler who I believe bought the rights to that projectile and now they only load it as a rare alloy, which is unfortunate because the Supreme was Winchester's best non-lead option.
Another one we have tested is GS Customs loaded by Monolithic Munitions (who are now out of business). The HV custom show some good external ballistics but broke apart after being fired into water at 100 yards. In 22-250 they worked very well on coyotes.
With the price of ammo what it is the price of non lead is negligible. I called the gun shop today he said a 20rd box of regular 9mm: $65.00 Other shops had no ammo.
Hi Dave, these are really some unprecedented times in ammo availability and pricing. We pride ourselves on shooting as much as we can get our hands on and our testing has been heavily impacted since the pandemic. I just saw 9mm Aluminum for $56!!
Non-lead ammo pricing has really dropped in recent years as a result of increased competition, and technological and procedural advances. Before the pandemic I could find Federal Copper HP at Walmart for just over $20 (30-06, 308, 270, etc), so hopefully that opportunity returns.
Happy Hunting
Are lead bullets usually heavier then copper ?
Typically lighter. Copper is less denser than lead so to avoid stabilization issues with copper, manufacturers make their non-lead bullets lighter. This tends not to be an issue since non-lead holds so much of it's weight, it penetrates deep.
Depends. Lead is denser than copper. With solid copper bullets you can get a higher twist rate without your bullet flying apart. And with a higher twist rate you can shoot longer, heavier, and higher BC bullets. That means way better accuracy and velocity/energy at range. Overall this is likely the future of ammo... If we can afford the copper....
@Chad Thomas I don't think alot of people use heavier bullets for weight retention. I use heavier bullets for the bc and ballistics. Heavier projectiles retain velocity better at longer ranges and they also create way more energy.
Peregrine bullets! Check them out. They are very very good.
Dream job right there
wfscjobs.tamu.edu/jobs/hunting-and-conservation-outreach-coordinator-california-2/
Anyone know where I can get lead free 9mm hollow point? One where the primer is lead free as well.
No one to my knowledge makes a loaded cartridge but you can get the components
Federal American Eagle have in some 9mm ammo "Catalyst high-performance lead-free primer", not sure exactly which ones though.
I just purchased a box of 20 non lead .270 win. 130 grain ballistic tip for $ 72.30. You gotta love living in California...
Hey Rob, something we do in helping folks transition to non-lead ammunition is find ammo for them. May be a little late, but Turners in Norwalk, CA has GMX for $50, Winchester Copper for $40, and Fresno, CA Sportsman's has GMX for $48. Compared to the Partitions ($56) and some of the other lead options non-lead is currently some of the cheapest options on shelves.
You need to re-read your previous statements prior, then convince me that you are not grouping "all conservatives" as you blame me for so to liberals.
I do not need to defend Trump, or anyone else. I do know that he is a "deal-maker." Not my style, except for un-important things. Some deals benefit both sides, and that is how Trump sees it. Personally, bump-stocks are of no importance to me, but if it leads to the continuation of our rights being trampled on, then that upsets me.
Another thing. There is no, nor ever will be the perfect candidate. I, nor you, will ever agree with everything any candidate says or does. We have never been privileged to vote for the perfect candidate, neither often for a candidate who best represents our own values ... *but only for the one who is the lesser of 2 evils!*
I take exception to this paragraph: *''Women have the right to choose, the fact that you disagree with this, shows how simple-minded and uneducated you are on the issues that cause women to require an abortion in the first place. If there are 100 mass shooting a year, do we ban all guns? No? Then we will also not ban abortion if 100 woman get "unnecessary" abortions. We all have our rights, or no one does.''* --- 1st of all, when one tries to insult or diminish an opponent, by accusing him of being stupid, his goal is to usually try to insult & chase-off his opponent. *NOT ME* So, I am uneducated and stupid for believing it is wrong for a woman to slaughter the off-spring living in her womb. Would that mean, I could rightfully define you as a "supporter of murder and child abuse or the fact that you cannot see in a simple ultra-sound, that a living, innocent human being is present?
Anyway, please enlighten me & explain the issues that justify &/or "require" a mother to have her infant burned or mutilated in her womb, yanked out in pieces & tossed into the waste-basket? Don't say these questions are loaded, because this is exactly what occurs during an abortion ... unless of course, you can explain how abortion is a pleasant experience for all involved. To say I am framing you would be cowardly. Your comparing shooting with abortion is pathetic. We can touch on that later.