ALL BOOST CONTROL setups EXPLAINED - Boost School #3
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ส.ค. 2020
- AEM boost controllers: bit.ly/D4AtruboostX
AEM ECU: bit.ly/D4Ainfinity5
AEM high flow fuel pumps: bit.ly/2D4Ahighflowfp
AEM wideband AFR gauge: bit.ly/D4Axserieswb
AEM digital racing dash display: bit.ly/D4Acddash
Welcome back to Boost School! Today we're talking about something that is as important as boost itself, and that something is control and we will cover all the boost control setups, starting with the most basic level 1 setup and proceeding to the most complex and performance oriented level.
LEVEL 1 BOOST CONTROL - wastegate + wastegate actuator
The most basic setup consists of nothing but your wastegate and your wastegate actuator. This simple setup works by having a boost reference line connected to a boost source. Boost pressure is exerted onto the spring and diaphragm inside the wastegate actuator. Once boost pressure gets high enough it compresses the spring and opens the wastegate. Having quick turbo spool up with this setup is next to impossible as the spring inside the actuator is exposed to boost pressure all the time. Your wastegate will be fully opened when you hit the boost the spring is rated for, but your wastegate will actually start to open way sooner than target boost.
LEVEL 2 BOOST CONTROL - manual boost controller
A manual boost controller will alloy you to make boost than your spring would allow by delaying the boost going through the reference line. Inside a manual boost controller is a spring and a ball. Adjusting a knob or turning the controller itself will change the spring pressure on the ball. Lifting the ball up from it's seat will require more boost pressure than compressing the wastegate spring so your turbocharger generates more boost. Although the manual boost controller is very simple to install and increases boost pressure it doesn't do anything else. It's dumb just like the level 1 setup and references nothing other than boost. It has no idea about your throttle opening, intake air temperature etc. which can result in full boost at half throttle or a setting that needs readjustment for different weather or or altitude.
LEVEL 3 BOOST CONTROL - 2 port boost control solenoid
The simplest electronic setup involves a 2 port boost control solenoid. The 2 port solenoid is connected into the boost reference line with a T fitting and it bleeds boost pressure from the line between the turbo and wastegate actuator. Essentially the 2 port boost solenoid is lying to the spring in the wastegate actuator by making it "think" there's less boost being made than actually is. The great advantage between a 2 port boost solenoid and any manual boost controller is that the solenoid is connected to the ECU and the ECU can manipulate the solenoid's duty cycle based on throttle opening, air temperature, coolant temperature, etc. so you'll never get full boost at half throttle again. The downside is that with the 2 port solenoid and the t-fitting the spring still sees boost pressure all the time so the 2 port solenoid still can't prevent it from being slightly opened before it needs to be.
LEVEL 4 BOOST CONTROL - 3 port boost control solenoid
Unlike the 2 port solenoid which is installed with a t-fitting, the 3 port boost control solenoid is installed directly into the boost reference line and it interrupts the boost pressure going from the turbo to the wategate actuator. Because it has one more port the 3 port boost solenoid can control boost more accurately and with less duty cycle compared to a 2 port solenoid resulting in better turbo responsiveness, quicker spool up and more power, as well as more headroom to increase boost later on.
LEVEL 5 BOOST CONTROL - 3 port boost control solenoid + external wastegate
When hooked up to an external wastegate a three port solenoid can be used to direct boost pressure to the top port of a two port wastegate helping reinforce the spring and keeping it closed. This is a superior setup to "lying to the spring" and it results in even better turbo responsiveness and more aggressive spool up.
LEVEL 6 BOOST CONTROL - 4 port boost control solenoid / 2 X 3 port solenoids
The 4 port boost control solenoid can do something a 3 port cant'. It can control the top and bottom of a 2 port external wastegate at the same time. A 3 port solenoid can make twice the boost pressure of your base spring, but a 4 port solenoid can make 5-6 times that which means it's capable of generating some extreme boost. The only real downside is poor resolution. Changing a 4 port solenoid duty cycle by just 1-2% can result in 3-8 psi of boost pressure change. To correct a bumpy boost curve generated by a 4 port solenoid you can use two 3 port solenoids, but this will require a very capable ECU and some pretty complex tuning.
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AEM boost controllers: bit.ly/D4AtruboostX
AEM ECU: bit.ly/D4Ainfinity5
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You missed a style of turbo controller.
For mechanical control of variable turbo (vnt)
(This is my vw truck):
m.th-cam.com/video/iD4bOiggdW4/w-d-xo.html
m.th-cam.com/video/MtIugEqjkHk/w-d-xo.html
Gfb (go fast bits) sells a controller.
But there are many styles.
As someone who pushed an old t3 turbo to the limit...
Variable turbo is where it’s at brother.
It’s a whole different ballgame.
Controlling a wastegate.
Just imagine if all that energy wasn’t wasted.
Bro you make the best vids I love you.
I strive to be more like you.
You have taught me not only so much, but also how to see cars in a new light after many years of dark times as a professional mechanic.
Why two port solenoid can't be installed inline instead using T connector? Why we need three port solenoid and vent boost to atmosphere?
And why we need mess with ait at all? We can use solenoid directly to open wastegate exactly when we need it.
Bro whats the difference between a supercharger and a turbo if we assume that both provide the same boost level?also why in a NA engine you feel more and more power as the revs rise while in a turbo engine you dont have a linear power delivery?
@@eliasaggeli1225 A supercharger gets its power via a belt attached to the crank. This causes a small power loss, but the power gain from the supercharger always overcompensates for this loss. However, due to the initial power loss, there is lower fuel efficiency. A supercharger, since it is directly connected to the crank, the power that you ask for (depending on amount of throttle, as well as the type of supercharger (which make peak boost at either low revs, like your screw types, or make high power at high end of rev range, like a centrifugal supercharger)) power is immediately delivered.
Turbos on the other hand, get their power through the exhaust gases, just after leaving the exhaust manifold. However, the air pressure + flow is a bit random and can cause inconsistencies when you ask for power that the turbo may or may not be currently making since it takes time for the turbo to spool up. Additionally, turbos can only operate over a small bandwidth of the rev range since the turbo exhaust housing can always have an ideal amount of air since it has a fixed shape. (Unless you are some rich kid and/or tech nerd who can buy/make a variable turbo which operates over an extremely large amount of the rev range). And due to this bandwidth issue, the power is increased in one part of the rev range, but not the whole rev range. But, since turbos are generally cheaper and operate off of exhaust gases, they are usually the primary choice of car consumers/enthusiasts.
Finally, NA engines operate dependent on the air supply present, which is always consistent (unless you plummet your car 40km vertically down a mountain, where air density makes a difference). So, since the air is consistent (and the car is designed to have close to linear power delivery, which it should be), the amount of throttle that you apply will translate to some amount of power increase as intended by the engineers.
Also, if you are still confused, just search it up on YT.
What makes more power and/or torque: a low cr engine with turbos fitted to the engine to make as much power as possible without running into knock, or a highly optimised high cr engine which is na?
If likes and comments help you out on the algorhythm, consider this me doing my part to help. Thank you for making the content.
Me too
@@muslimtommyshelby2624 1rr4
@@muslimtommyshelby2624 ok
Ditto😊
I will comment and say that this video was on my FYP
I needed this breakdown. Its so hard to get real and clear info on boost control and i believe you earned a trophy on this! 🎖🏅🥇🥈🥉🏆
no its not just go buy a turbosmart eboost2
The animation is on point 👌🏻
Golden video man. An excellent explanation on why my 4-port solnoid had some of the most erratic behavior and it was so frustrating
Hi Greg 👋 fancy to see you here
@@guidosaur7506 making sure my ebc strategy is dialed in for next weekend 😈
@@TheCarPassionChannel I'm just going to fix my Maxpeedingrods turbo and enjoy spinning the tires with a mbc lol. Still good to learn though
Greg helped me swap my Miata back in the day 2016 I think
That little shimmy, look to the left, and then wink @ 2:57 lmao that was slick bro. You have literally taught me everything I know. I just realized I fully get how a turbo works now. Exhaust gases! Duh. I knew that but I realized I didn’t completely KNOW what that meant and how it needs to be regulated and just all of it is more clear now lol. Thanks for what you do!
This is one of those channels that any and everyone who's into modifying cars should be subbed to. I feel like everything explained is so easy to understand and follow it makes me make better choices in my own setup.
Cool stuff, im on it🤘😀👏
I’m so glad I found this channel
Hah, was thinking the exact same thing just now!
Next topic we should discuss about antilag.
*bang bang bang bang!!!*
That is 2 step redline limiter
@Darren Munsell anti lag has nothing to do with a supercharger. Unless you mean buy supercharger so you don’t have lag like a turbo. Anti lag retards timing where it pretty much backfires in exhaust manifold to spool up the turbo faster.
Its only been 2 years for me with a Turbocharged car and its my FIRST EVER
and you Sir have helped me so much in understanding and appreciating the machine that I have. Even in its Stock form, i like how its set up and now based on you explaining some basic concepts
I can make well informed decisions to do subtle changes to my set up :)
THANK YOU SO MUCH!
Here is a comment to boost you on the algorithm
Which solenoid did you use?
Student 😂
@@alexsm3882I think he's using straight wastegate spring
This is a great and very comprehensive video. In these 22 minutes are the contents of what took me weeks of independent research. Very accurate, well organized, and well articulated. Thanks for the great video and keep them coming!
Best explanation i've ever seen. My tuner put a 3 port solenoid, i never understood the advantage. Now i do, thanks for the video!!!
At 13:31, the 3 port solenoid with 2 port wastegate (WG), where boost reference is to the back of WG & solenoid to the front, is also best for safety measures, in that if your solenoid fails the WG will force open. Now on more extreme racing situations, many reverse these, in getting the most boost to hold the gate closed.
Bro I’m an inspiring mechanic. And you’ve helped me a ton with this video. Hats off to you my man 🎩
love the way you explain everything, it was so easy for me to understand... also the way you designed the visual aide is perfect! killer video!!
Wow, you got it ALL down and you are great at getting it out and across to some of us less educated. Very clear and concise. Thanks for your efforts. Great video !
It's amazing how hard it was to find a good concise explanation of boost control methods. Well done!
Excellent work! Watching your channel grow and improve has been a treat.
Thank you. I’m installing a turbo on my car right now and this is helping a lot.
Man...I know you've read it before but thankyou so so much for the info in your videos. Hands down one of the best at teaching and explaining about boost setups,etc..
Very informative. Thank you. My modern turbo setup is slightly different than all those. It has big electric motors to control the wastegate and no vacuum lines off the turbo.
Awesome video and great illustrations for teaching about the turbo, waste gate and the various Boost Controllers and setups. Now I have a better and clearer understanding of them! Wonderful! Thx a lot!
I watched a few videos from this channel a couple months back, the channel is growing quickly and for good reason! Great job putting things in terms that most people can understand.
Nicely put! Clear and concise. Neat thing is, the old fully mechanical systems on aircraft back in the 40's have the same degree of controll as the modern computer boxes. They are, however, very complex and bulky for such simple actuation.
Very well explained - I had zero understanding of boost control, only had a basic understanding of what the wastegate does. Excellent video
Absolutely best video on turbo boost control out there! Great work, very informative video.
That was brilliantly presented, so understandable, and your style of talking and speed of commentary is so easy to listen too and the data is capture-able on the first time listening! I wish I could take you everywhere so you could explain everything to me, in your style…I would be a genius in no time! I could skip the data chip implant that is sure to come some day, simply to attempt to keep up with AI…yikes! Great work, you are doing your gift! Keep on keeping on! Thank you much!
You guys probably see it too much to soak in the individual comments, but this channel and whoever is behind putting together these videos are fkn awesome. You know what the people want!!! No other channel or publisher has put out the content you do in the coherent and comprehensive way you do! Fkn can't say it enough- everything you do we fkn love, don't stop making vids !!
Great video, very well explained. I had a 4 port solenoid for ages and it baffled me why so many ports and just fitted a basic Manuel adjuster instead for ease. Turns out then the 4 port would of been good, bloody Shane I didn't no how to install 20 years ago 👍
This channel need more recognition. This is a NO bs video NO bait bs
Dude I’ve never watched such an informative video on this subject, incredible job, thank you so much
Gotta say, love your videos, having seen donut media go from ok to rediculous, MCM going quite far away from the concept, this and driver61 are absolute favourites right now, awesome explanation and super clear
Thanks for making this video series! I'm at Hennessey's Tuner School and your videos are a great supplement to my education. You would make a great Tuner School teacher!
Unless I missed it, another nice topic to follow-up this video would be the advantages of dual port wastegates.
Also, great timing. I decided on running twin solenoids in my truck earlier today and it was nice to see you agree that my choice was not a bad one. :)
This is one of the best videos you’ve ever made.
Not that crap about inline 5 can’t be carburetored
At last i understood the types of boost control, Great vid as always !
if i may comment from an electromechanical perspective that the signal going to the solenoid changes multiple times per second, but the solenoid actually doesn't. It floats in an a state in-between open and close, sort of hanging in the balance, leaning more towards the higher percentage.
Thank you for making this video it helped a lot with my d16 turbo. This video really sum-up the understandings of boost controls.
Very nice video with nice images that help to understand and teaching style is very patient manner that makes it easy to follow in the right pace. 👍
Perfect video. I had my mind on trying to understand boost pressure systems and this video popped right up.
You need to add the new generation of Turbosmart wastegate that don't have a spring and are completely controlled electronically via ECU. It debuted last year at SEMA
Yep i have 1 on my 2018 F150 2.7L 😁
I had the previous version that was spring actuated but it was annoying taking all the vacuum lines off n on once i randomly had to go to the dealership for a failed Oil PSI sensor.
So the new one, although not as loud as the spring actuated model, it is literally one si gle connection into the factory harness. (Old model also makes you T Tap and cut into ur factory harness to bypass the sensor).
Not anymore 🙂
(Also its a Blow-Off Valve, not a Wastegate if that is or isnt what you meant)
@@nickh3809 I was referring to the wastegate specifically. But the BOV is nice as well. I have one installed on my Subaru WRX 😁
The channel is sponsored by AEM. If Turbosmart sponsors him then maybe he'd feature them too.
@@sepg5084 agreed, it is sponsored by AEM. I thought that if he was trying to make a complete list of boost control, he would include it, even if he left out the brand name and only described the functionality
@@BoNosKG09 Haha ok was just making sure, but very nice im sure you enjoy every second of letting off the throttle especially underneath bridges and over-passes as much as i do😂
Fantastic clear lesson on boost control systems. Thank you I’m really loving your videos. Keep it going
Awesome video, really detailed and thorough. I do have a question tho: how do you control a compound turbo and what ecu could fit such an application. A dedicated video would be really awesome. Keep up the good work and we'll be here watching
This video helped me so much. I am looking at a small moni me swiped civic with small turbo kit on it an haven't a clue about how the hole boost would be controlled. I know the ecu or stand alone system is part the equation, but never had any experience with boost control. Thanks alot man.
I’ve looked all over the internet for a good explanation ! You my friend are a very talented man bravo
This is one of the best illustration on how that works. Thank you so much 👍🏼🍻
Great video. It made me understand why I need a 3-port & not a 4-port. Using IWG.
Planning on starting a project in spring and the engine has absolutely 0 kits and tuning following so I have to do everything myself this video helped so much to get my head around the subject thank you
Droppin knowledge ♥️🙏 I knew I'd be getting a 3 port EBCS and now I understand why that's a good thing. Thx
Im building a turbo k24 and this video helped me alot understanding boost controllers. Great video 👍👍
The whole concept and explanation are so beautiful that I get emotional.
Never found another explanation this effective and easy to understand. Thanks brother!
Really appreciate all the info given in this very informative video. Thanking you Robbbert from Melbourne Australia.
This video was extremely helpful thanks !!! Continue to keep up the good work and keep those vids coming
Thanks for this good and informative video.
It helped me better understand what I should do to my turbo setup.
Good job👍😉
I love your channel man, you are a natural at teaching and your videos are fun to watch! 🤙
This explainer is so on point. Made me understand the 3-port solenoid like never before.
My type of Online classes 🤝 I should be taking notes for the final exam tho 🤭
Another way of boost control is using a external wastegate, with the boost signal going to the bottom side of the spring and a 3 port boost controller solenoid with a canister of CO2 in the inlet providing pressure and the outlet to the top side of the WG. It provides a linear boost curve with easy tunning on inexpensive ECU management at the expense of filling the CO2 canister from time to time. For high boost racing aplications it works like a charm, You can carry two bottles, switch them and keep racing
I wonder if I could use a bleed valve and a pressure holding canister on my super plus turbo twincharger system. Seen people do similar to help turbo lag in conjunction with the super reducing it as well, but In theory when the super needs to blow off pressure I wonder if I could use it and some other excess gas pressure to essentially make a self recharging version of the c02 set up.
Such a good clear explanation. Thanks so much for making this video. Its really helped me to understand my setup 👍
Thank you so much for the explanation.
Makes my quest to boost controller much easier. Thank you!
This is a very great and informative video - however I have to call you out on something. Boost control can go down to 0psi technically, BMW uses vacuum operated wastegate actuators which are controlled by solenoids allowing stored vacuum to close them, by default these wastegates are completely open and would make 0psi of boost pressure if all of the boost control gear was disconnected or malfunctions.
They're essentially the same as a normal wastegate actuator, however operating in reverse.
Fantastic video, this is just what I needed to plan the turbo setup for my miata.
Great diagrams, clear explanation with a very pleasant voice.
Can't wait for episode 4!
It's such a nice series
This randomly showed up for me and wow this is awesome stuff! Keep it up!
My fav series on youtube is back, hell yeah!
Excellent as always. Love the still of Jeremy Clarkson’s face from his lap in an Ariel Atom (and yes they do make your face inflate like that).
Great video my man!
Cleared up a lot of my confusion about boost control solenoids.
Have you heard of Turbosmart's Electronic wastegate? I kinda wished it would've came up, but it's fairly new, and quite expensive, so I get it, probably won't be a topic soon.
It is cool though, no spring, pretty much just an electric motor on the wastegate, you do all your boost control from that, no solenoid, no spring. Probably amazing control.
Still, quite expensive.
Thanks for rounding this all up so nicely
Dude , I’m not going to lie I was going to jump the gun on buying a sc for my car and it was because I had no real understanding how a turbo really works but looking at this I see more of an appeal and understanding of how this system is better . . . . Holy shit man thanks for all your vids man .
Hell yes, thank you for this very informative video I wasn't 100% sure how the boost solenoids worked exactly. long time subscriber from the start of the channel absolutely love it keep up the good work mate. 😎
this explenations isn't really correct though. it doesn't really alternate between opened and closed. the duty cycle of the PWM signal just adjusts the total energy going to the actuator by switching on and off very rapidly. a lot quicker than the mechanical side coul actually react to. that means at 50% duty cycle the plunger will stay approximately at 50% position, and won't be closed 50% of the time and fully open 50% of the time
@@BassistUndStolzDrauf Not with the frequencies most boost solenoids run at (10Hz or so.) PWM idle valves do operate as you describe.
Man this is awesome 👍. Can you talk about vaccum controlled wastages as well🙏
Really good stuff man! These videos are killin' it.
I didnt knew about the "4 way" solenoid! It's a really nice concept, BUT, using 2 "3 way" solenoid seems to be more efficient and provides a bettter tuning
You didn't mention electronic waste gates. No springs and total control of boost all the time. I'm guessing that's more because of your sponsors not having them yet. Great video otherwise and the clarification of the boost control systems was the best I've seen.
Only a fool trusts a computer to last forever.
@@fastinradfordable Only a fool trusts his cars ECU, TCM etc. etc. Electronic waste gates have no computer, they are controlled by the ECU without which no modern car will run.
This was a great video, thank you for going in depth on the setups. Subbed and will definitely be checking out your other videos
now i wonder... is anyone out there making custom ecu's like the AEM infinity for diesel applications? been looking into doing some absolutely dumb things with those....
you my friend keep shovin that high quality knowledge please, its fantastic!
I agreee with all the folks commenting here, thank you very much for this information and knowledge. You are the best 👏
I wish this video was available months ago before I did hours and hours of research to figure a 3 port was the way for me to go. Great video none the less
Awesome explanation thanks very much
Never realized the source was supposed to be tee'd to the under side of the external and the top is controlled by the 3port
I have a gt3071r on my gtir that I can't control the boost it spikes to 25psi and falls to 20 but its also an internal gated turbo with a spring that must be 8psi
Excellent video, I love the explanation however you forgot one other trick people use, that's a co2 bottle to control a 7psi spring and achieve 70psi of boost if required. Although only really used in drag cars but still another trick to run low boost off the line and feed it high boost down the strip. Either way I love your videos, svaka cast, samo napred!
Best video iv ever seen when it came down to breaking it down and how it’s set up exactly! I give a A+++++ lol
Your videos are pure gold! Can you make one about which boost format Kawasaki uses on Ninja H2R?
Best guide to boost controller on TH-cam. Thanks!
Extraordinarily well done! Thank you!
You save so much time for us, thanks for these videos!
Awesome vid exactly what I needed to know! I don't think this could be better explained!!!!
THE BEST video on boost control, thankyou helped me alot
Thanks to this video, I figured out what was going on with my Golf TDI lack of power. The solenoid was incorrectly plugged to the turbo.
one of the best informal videos i have seen in a long time
Excellent, excellent channel. Thanks very much for sharing.
Fantastic..thanks so much for doing this and doing it so well. Best I've seen. I've smashed the like button and subscribed....Cheers
Such a perfect explanation!
Now, i'd enjoy very much if you explain about the new electronic wastage, and why is so revolutionary !!!
Very good and informative to understand how things work. Do you have a video on utilizing CO2 (carbon dioxide gas) on the wastegate presumably for cooling effects and better control? Was wondering if you also have a video on how anti-lag works? In the meantime I will look for videos on anti-lag systems.
Awesome channel and thank you for the information and interest you have in the automotive industry.
Your video is amazing .. thanks for making it so clear 🙏🏽
Such a great explanation video !!! Fully understood !
Love the info presented for easy understanding. Comment for the algro
(Even though it’s a giant advertisement for AEM)
Amazing videos. By far the best out there
best explanation of boost so far i've ever seen.