ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 มิ.ย. 2021
- [Updates]
Since the making this video, there have been some upgrades to the PC:
- Graphics card has been upgraded from an FX5200 to an FX5500
- Sound card has been upgraded from a Creative Ensoniq AudioPCI 5200 to an AOPEN aw744L II
- Ram was upgraded from 444mhz to 800mhz (Still 2x 512mb - 1gb total)
- The CF card adapter was removed and the cards were cloned to two HDD's that were added for Win98 and XP; I now switch between them by turning on or off the drives in BIOS
[Original]
I build a computer with the intent to run both Windows 98 Second Edition and Windows XP so I can play my favorite 90's and 2000's games that can't run on modern machines or without the stuttering and sound problems from emulators.
During the process, I run into several problems where certain parts were either not compatible with each other or win98.
NOTE: It is not recommended to use Compact Flash Cards as a long term operating system solution, I'm doing this because I want to quickly switch between systems and only use them in short bursts to play some games while having the ability to quickly add files from my main pc. I will later clone these to hard drives when I have everything the way I want them.
I did not capture this during any recordings, but while waiting for replacement parts to come in the mail, I did use an Auto-Patcher For Windows 98SE to apply select system updates and program upgrades, I chose only the official ones and did not include the unofficial patches. (Link below)
Additional AudioPCI-5200 Sound Card Notes:
Although the sound card I ended up using does have DOS emulation, I've had mixed results with what games actually work with it.
Games like Descent and Epic Pinball work with both music and sound fx, but others like Tyrian 2000 would only have music, or Wolfenstein 3D would only have sound fx. I will likely change to a different card once I find something else that does not require ISA slots. (update above)
Links:
Unofficial GPU driver:
toogam.com/software/archive/d...
Auto-Patcher for Win98SE:
www.softpedia.com/get/System/...
(Win98 Sticker) Geekenspiel's eBay store page:
www.ebay.com/str/geekenspiel
(see updates at the top for additional parts)
End Result:
Case: In-Win C589
Motherboard: ASUS P5N-D
Processor: 2.83GHz INTEL Q9550 Core 2 QUAD
RAM: 2x INFINEON 512mb; 1GB Total
Graphics Card: PNY 128mb NVidia FX5200
Sound Card: Creative Ensoniq AudioPCI 5200 ES1373
Storage Device: Compact Flash to IDE with SanDISK 64gb CF
Floppy Drive: Dell NEC FD1231M Dell RP434
Optical Drive: HP dvd640
Games shown at the end:
Baldur's Gate, Star Wars Jedi Knight: Dark Forces 2, Moto Racer, Star Craft, X-Wing vs. TIE Fighter, Janes WWII Fighters, Quake, Epic Pinball, Solitaire 3.1
Music (Played at 85% speed):
Time Rider by | e s c p | escp-music.bandcamp.com
Music promoted by www.free-stock-music.com
Attribution 4.0 International (CC BY 4.0)
creativecommons.org/licenses/... - เกม
Bro thats good even for win7, thats overkill for win98, but good build bro, i love see building old computers, especially from 2000s
i actually used the sound blaster z and the audigy sound cards no problems in my windows 98 se p4 and p3 builds i have both original cd drivers , also had dos drivers , working on computers since windows 98 came out ,, love building old retro computers great you tube video,, the p4 has the dual slot fx 5950 nvidia video card and the p3 has the fx 5500,, and built other computers
This is really impressive. I thought about doing something like this as I have a windows 98 hardrive and a windows xp computer. After watching this though I see how complicated it would be to do both on one computer tower. Awesome video thank you for posting.
Great vid and sterling effort but it proves that major sacrifices had to be made to the xp hardware build to account for win 98. Ended up being a great win 98 machine but fairly poor xp gaming pc due to ram and fx5200 compromise. And even an fx5500 is underpowered for xp. Ideally you have 2 separate retro builds for win 98 and xp but appreciate not everyone has the space, budget or desire. You persevered well to fix the issues!
My first PC ran on DOS. My first experiences with Windows were with W98 and my favorite versions were W2000 and XP for a long time. The last current Windows that has accompanied me for a long time was W10. - But for some time now I have already switched to Linux. I still do a bit of distro hopping, but my favorites are MX (for old computers /my Notebook with Core Duo) and Big Linux on Manjaro/Arch base for gaming on stronger computers. - I would NEVER want to have the stress with old PCs again if I had to use the old Microsoft products for that. All the many crashes and compatibility problems (how often did I look enviously at Apple users back then). When I want to play old games today, I usually use Lutris and for old consoles I start Batocera from USB. I want to play the games, and I mean all the games on one PC and without having to worry about problems that shouldn't be there and only cause headaches. - But I admire the perseverance and ingenuity with which this project was pursued here. But when I imagine the costs for the old hardware (and retro hardware is slowly getting really expensive... I don't want to know what the PCI graphics card cost) on top of that. For me, that would be nothing. I have a computer that I have been maintaining and upgrading for many years. I don't need more. Still, I take off my hat to the performance and ingenuity.
Thank you for the kind words, and I completely understand where you're coming from. For me, this is a hobby, I like the idea of running programs in the original os that they were designed for, however, I also use Win11 as my daily PC, as well as Linux on the side. Maybe I'm just weird, but I actually enjoy figuring out compatibility problems and building a system that, when its done, just works with little to no tinkering afterwards. As for costs, most of the parts come from 20 years of collecting throw away pcs, tearing them down, and filling various drawers full of all types of parts. Again, thank you! 🙂
This is pretty damn slick. I love this build. Has me thinking about doing something similar.
disassemble all parts, and re-assemble parts again, good job , bro!
sweet pc! i'm actually really surprised you got a soundblaster pro compatible card working at all on that new chipset. the potentiometer on the pc speaker - great idea! stunts never sounded so good :D
Thank you!
And yes! The sound card part was very frustrating. Supposedly there's another sound card that would work with this setup: Cobra - AW744L II
Might end up trying that out at some point to see if I can get a few things to sound better.
@@DS08 fingers crossed 🤞
Your wire management looks good
Nics build. I am collecting parts to make something similar. Not that I need to, as I already have dedicated setups for Win98 and WinXP. But I want to try this just to see what compatability issues there are. I will be trying to use a PCIe Radeon X850 XT PE and a 3Ghz Quad Core Xeon. I have a nice 15" 1024x768 monitor to go with it. Hopefully this will allow XP era games to run well due to the low resolution.
Pretty cool, got myself a Core 2 Duo capable of 2000 & 7 (with functioning Aero) on one machine.
just beautiful.
Using an intel 865 based socket 775 like Asrock 775i65g r2.0/r3.0 then pair it with an Intel E5800 + ATI Radeon X800 Pro AGP or Geforce 6800GT AGP will be a good 98/XP machine.
There's a patch for Windows 98 that will allow 2GB of RAM which is advantageous on the Windows XP side.
Anyway nice video. Watching videos of building retro machine relaxes me.
Thanks!
That does sound like a good build.
I have tried the 2gb ram patch before and got into a bad compatibility mode state and had to revert it. Maybe I'll look around and see if there's a different one (the one I used was all in German)
I have exactly this rig except for the graphics card which is a Radeon 9800XXL (by Medion). Dual boot, rock solid. For Win98SE there is the memory patch by Rudolph Loew, and the Unofficial Windows 98SE. Service Pack
Your channel is awesome!
Thank you! 😁
Saving this video in my watch later so I can watch it years from now when I get the urge to do this xd
If you can find the sound card I upgraded to in the description, get it now, they're getting hard to find.
Windows 98 will only allow 1gb of ram in the machine for the installation, once installed then there is a "Ram Limitation Patch" available online so you can run 2gb of ram, newer motherboards may allow more; but, my older ASUS motherboard would only allow 2gb of ram in total with the patch installed. Here's the thing though, while Windows 98 will see 2gb of ram, as an example, it will only "cache" 256mb; therefore, it is recommended you use only 256mb of ram in the computer, otherwise it will slow the computer down; but, I went with 2GB anyway. I have two Windows 98 PC's, one is a K6-2/500mhz running 256mb of ram, Nvidia Geforce 2 MX400 paired with a 3dfx Voodoo 1, and a SoundBlaster Live. There is a SoundBlaster Live driver on Phil's Computer website, it is meant for an Audigy ZS card; but, works with a large number of SoundBlaster Live models, including the one shown here, that is the driver I use in my K6-2 machine. My second Windows 98 PC is a Pentium 4 build, I used an Nvidia Geforce FX5700 video card with 256mb onboard, DirectX 9.0a, Nvidia driver version 56.64, nGlide version 1.05, and a SoundBlaster Audigy 2 ZS Sound card. Games like Unreal Tournament look, and sound amazing, so does Quake III.........and over 60 more Windows 98 era games. I knew the Geforce 6200 caused issues in Windows 98 because it requires too new of a driver, that is why I never used it. I have a third computer rocking Windows XP, it is a high end machine, I won't bother with the specs. The reason for three machines is simple, the 90's era PC games, and games from the 2000's with their respective video cards demands it!
The drives not being detected could have been jumper settings on the drives. They could be set to Master, Slave or Cable Select.
Maybe, I could have definitely missed something. It has been a couple years since I built this, so my memory is a bit rusty, but I think it might have been because the 5.25" floppy drive was not compatible with this motherboard.
I agree it's more than likely a compatibility issue with the drive. Can you get drivers for that 5.25" even? Thanks for the video though. It took me back to the good old Dos/Win98 days@@DS08
@@Reevesi my guess is for that motherboard I'd have to see if there is a bios update that has 5.25" drive support, but that mobo is from 2007, so probably not. 😂
Ended up building a P2 PC later that has 5.25" floppy along with 3.5" floppy and DVD too, so I'm set on that end now.
Very nice. Too bad the first cooler did not fit, it looked awesome!
You don't see it anyway.
IMO a Core 2 Quad Q9550 and socket 775 is total overkill for both XP and 98SE. I'm still very fond of those chips and their 12MB of L2 Cache. The final evolution of the OG Core arch and competed very favorably with Nehalem.
There are two major issues with what you are doing : 1. Having more than 1GB of RAM will cause problems with Win98SE (which you found out) but 1GB is not quite enough for WinXP. 2. The dream video card for Win9X games and applications is the later 3dfx Voodoo series of AGP cards (V3 3000 or 3500 and Voodoo 4 or 5) which are a- underpowered for XP games and b- incompatible with the motherboard you have chosen.
That's why my Win98SE and WinXP systems are two different computers.
Absolutely! But it was a fun project, and after a few modifications is still set up and being used.
@@DS08 The ASUS P5P800 has drivers for both 98SE and XP and support for RAM from 512MB up to 4GB and an AGP slot so you could have a dual OS system which reaches both ends of the spectrum with an ATI Radeon 9800 Pro (it has drivers for both 98SE and XP), P4 CPU and RAM configured as follows:
2 DDR DIMMs of 256MB each in the blue banks and 2 DDR DIMMs of 1GB in the black banks.
You'll get 512MB in Win98SE and 2.5GB in XP.
@@francoisleveille409 sounds like a future project 😁
@@DS08 If you ever do, please DON'T do what MattKC did here: th-cam.com/video/7D01We2aAu8/w-d-xo.htmlsi=oDxUJ6TdAiKbnDNC
There are drivers for Win98 from ASUS for the P5P series of boards which would have saved him a lot of trouble.
@@francoisleveille409 Noted. Thank you!!!
i managed to make a 3 in 1 98/XP/10 gaming pc, was more effort than it's worth tbh but heh, it's at least doable.
here's the config i went for EP45T-UD3P motherboard, Q9650@4ghz cpu, 4x2gb DDR3, X850XT gfx card under 98, GTX 960ti 4gb under XP/10, Audigy 2 ZS soundcard and 500gb ssd.
took quite a bit of fiddling just to get the 98se install to run with more than 512mb of ram but it's doable using custom memory managers, still limited it to 512mb tho for compatibility purpose.
under 98 the X850XT is powerfull enough to emulate a 3DFX at 1600x1200/1920x1200 60fps locked, under XP the 960ti is enough to run every games of the XP era @4k resolution max details.
even run modern indie games quite decently all things considered, especially the almost 15yo CPU.
ive honestly been curious about how low indie games can go. if i had more hardware id test that and maybe make a vid. maybe this summer ill screw around with some old hardware my dad has
Hi,
I'm about to do your build with some minor HW differences. I looking for the ASUS P5N-E SLI motherboard instead that has 2 IDE connectors onboard. With this I think of utilizing a SSD with a SATA2IDE adapter + like you a CF adapter with CF card on one of the IDE connectors and on the other connector a DVD-ROM drive.
Reason is I wanted both a SSD with dual boot Win98 + WinXP and also the possibility to easy move files with the CF. What do you think of this? It should work, don't you think?
I'm thinking this:
Motherboard: ASUS P5N-E SLI
Processor: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9505
RAM: 2x 512MB DDR2 PC2-5300 667MHz Kingston KVR667D2N5/512
Graphics Card: PNY 128mb NVidia FX5200
Sound Card: Creative Ensoniq AudioPCI 5200 ES1373
Storage: WD Blue SA510 Solid state-drev WDS250G3B0A 250GB 2.5" SATA-600
SATA to IDE adapter
Storage Device for moving data: Compact Flash to IDE with SanDISK CF card
Floppy Drive 3.5"
Optical Drive: ASUS DVD-RW
Dell PS2 Keybord
Mouse PS2
DELL E197FPf Monitor
@@cmpgoa I think that should all work for the most part in XP, but I would be a little worried about Win98 working properly with the SSD - there is a chance that win98 might not like it and set itself into compatibility mode, if that happens it will run slow and limit some functionality as well as graphics. But with the SATA to IDE adapter, that might not be an issue.
When you get there, if it does have issues, you'll need to edit the registry and find "NOIDE" and set it to 0 (or delete the entry, I can't remember) to fix it once you figure out a better solution. (again, only if it has issues) - I had to do this at one point while trying to figure out the drive situation on my build.
As for the sound card, it will work but will most likely have issues with older games. I upgraded my "Creative Ensoniq AudioPCI 5200" to an "AOPEN aw744L II" which has worked with everything I threw at it with the exception of Tyrian 2000, which crashes the whole pc when I set the sound settings.
I also later upgraded my FX5200 to an FX5500 to get some better performance for my XP games.
Also another note, the quad core cpu won't be detected in XP unless you have XP Pro since Pro has multi-core support.
Best of luck! Let me know how it goes!
@@DS08 very nice tips indeed, 🙏. You might be right about the SSD. I saw another guy actually using a SSD 500GB installing Win98 using the adapter. For sure no experience on the aftermath 🙂
@@DS08 The AOpen AW 744L II is a bit hard to get and somewhat pricey. (I'm from Denmark 🇩🇰) 😉
I think I'll go for the Terratec ESS Solo-1 with the ESS1338S chip. Seems to be at least as game compatible in DOS. It is also a little cheaper but importantly also more widely available.
I used the Rloew Patchnvc on the 82.69 to cure the shutdown bug.
What’s the name of the adapter that you used for your front panel mb headers?
It's called a "Q-Connector", it came with this motherboard when it was new.
Does nividia geforce fx 5500 is really good for this pc and also is it necessary to add the ide memory card thing? as you show in the video at 2:31 or is there any other way to install windows 98 on that pc?
The fx5500 has been working great for windows 98se, it also does really well in XP but can't run everything.
As for the compact flash ide, it isn't required, you could always just use a regular ide hard drive. As long as it's not SATA, win98 does not work right with SATA.
@@DS08 okay but atleast does the 5500 fx does run games from late 90s to mid 2000s?
@@symboss953 yes, it hasn't had any problems with any games I've tried so far. But I can't guarantee that it will work with everything.
@@symboss953 sorry, one correction, it has a little trouble with F.E.A.R. and runs good on Republic Commando on low settings.
@@DS08 oh okay
Would a build like this work well with a Dell Dimension 3000?
Maybe, looks like that mobo should take a pentium 4, would still need a sound card for DOS games, sound blaster live might work.
Why did you use a boot disk when windows 98 cd is bootable.
Good setup and looks modern even though running a retro software.
Good Job
Thanks!
I used a boot disk because it wasn't letting me boot from the CD 😂
@@DS08 strange the version i have booted from CD no both, could be your cmos setup on the computer, or something else.
but all installed now and as long as you happy with it.👍
Is there a way to make XP not see the CF card as a removable?
From my understanding there is, but it requires a different type of cf card designed to be used as a drive which are more expensive. But I haven't tested that out cause I don't have one.
There might be some hack or patch for it too, but I don't like messing with that too much.
After several months of use, I eventually cloned the cf cards to real hard disk drives and pick the OS I want on bootup.
Hey, would you sell a copy of that computer? But with a different case
Probably not, don't have the time to do that, hard to find time for the projects I have lined up as it is.
What model is the soundcard
What did you do for chipset drivers in win98?
Was having a hard time remembering what I did so I had to dig into my install files.
I basically brute forced it with multiple nForce driver packages until I installed everything I could, then used generic drivers for the ones left over.
@@DS08 ok. Was just wondering. I wanna try to do that with 775 motherboard I have laying around. Or am AM2 board with an nForce4 chipset
@@mOddEdLiKeHeLL best of luck!
You gave me anxiety as I HATED ribbon cables and IDE shit so much
It would be good if they make 64 bit version of 98 Second Edition
That would break so much compatibility
@@ExtractedSamplesG210 I meant that in present or future tense. Microsoft could see profits from this. A lot of people would be willing to pay for this. Less hardware requirements and a lot of nostalgic old software from the closet.
@@ExtractedSamplesG210 just use xp64 in classic theme
@@lachietgDOS: Am I a joke to you?
@@Tale3339 dos is not 64 bit
Would you be open to commission build one or sell me one youve built?
I'm humbled by the thought, but probably not. This is a hobby for me and I don't have the time to do that, it's hard to find time for the projects I have lined up as it is.
I also actively use the ones I've built.
Upload more videos with that pc
I've been thinking about doing an update video showing some upgrades I've done to it. So maybe!
@@DS08 Can we dm? I want the pc specifications may be I can build it, I build pcs as well, but I need this pc specifications, do you have instagram or something to dm?
@@strikdevroblox9079 I actually have the parts listed near the bottom of the description for this video, as well as updates for parts I changed over time at the top of the description.
I would suggest using an older motherboard if possible though since the chipset is not officially support for win98.
@@DS08 Thank you
U have a 3d printer, cmon, print a front panel for both pc speaker volume and cf card, make a life easier 😂. A think about 3d printer too
Not a bad idea, but the 3D Printer I have does not make very good quality prints, I'd rather have it look good and be more difficult to access. 😂
I'm gonna guess that you are a Sagittarius.
Nope!
@@DS08 What is your actual sign?
@@austinstitzel Taurus
This build is NOT fully compatible with Windows 98 and Windows 98 software. Half the hardware he used does not support Windows 98. No motherboard with PCIe will work well with Windows 98. This has been known ever since PCIe boards came out.
Hey, thank you for your comment, its been over two years since I've built this pc; I still regularly use it to play games and it still runs great. I'm not sure what software you're talking about but I haven't had any trouble running anything on this with Windows 98. Additionally, PCIe works but I'm not using it - I changed the GPU to a PCI FX5500 later on.
If you want to know more about PCIe working with Windows98 PhilsComputerLab made a good video about it and goes over how he got it to work and it was pretty close to the same thing I did with the PCIe GeForce 6200LE card, but again, I stopped using that and went to PCI so I could have support with all the important components.
Have a nice day!