How Spotify Manufactures Gay Culture
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ส.ค. 2022
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Do the vibes changer whether you're listening to Ariana Grande, Taylor Swift, Harry Styles versus Ed Sheeran, U2, and Coldplay? The question of gay music is one that needs to be answered in long-form sociological video essay format.
SOURCES------------
Spotify Editor Interviews***
artists.spotify.com/en/blog/b...
artists.spotify.com/blog/behi...
artists.spotify.com/en/blog/b...
artists.spotify.com/en/blog/b...
Literature***
Distinction (1979) by Pierre Bourdieu
Leisewitz, A & Musgrave, G (2022) Does Spotify Create Attachment? Algorithmic
Playlists, Intermediation and the Artist-Fan Relationship, Culture Unbound: Journal
of Current Cultural Research (Forthcoming)
The Cultural Intermediaries Reader (2014) by Jennifer Smith Maguire and Julian Matthews
Dhaenens, F., & Burgess, J. (2019). ‘Press play for pride’: The cultural logics of LGBTQ-themed playlists on Spotify. New Media & Society, 21(6), 1192-1211. doi.org/10.1177/1461444818808094
Maguire, J. S., & Matthews, J. (2010). Cultural intermediaries and the media. Sociology Compass, 4(7), 405-416.
Bourdieu, P. (2018). The forms of capital. In The sociology of economic life (pp. 78-92). Routledge.
Grazian, D. (2009, December). Urban Nightlife, Social Capital, and the Public Life of Cities 1. In Sociological Forum (Vol. 24, No. 4, pp. 908-917). Oxford, UK: Blackwell Publishing Ltd.
Mattson, G. (2015). Style and the value of gay nightlife: Homonormative placemaking in San Francisco. Urban Studies, 52(16), 3144-3159.
Barrett, D. C., & Pollack, L. M. (2005). Whose gay community? Social class, sexual self‐expression, and gay community involvement. Sociological Quarterly, 46(3), 437-456.
Daniele, M., Fasoli, F., Antonio, R., Sulpizio, S., & Maass, A. (2020). Gay voice: Stable marker of sexual orientation or flexible communication device?. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 49(7), 2585-2600.
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I read that as cartoon lol
Appreciate the video but carbon footprint was only designed by big oil companies to push the blame from themselves to the consumer. You can live like nothing but it wont do anything to climate change because most of it is CAUSED by Oil giants like BP, Shell, etc. So fuck that term and fuck them
the 'carbon footprint' was invented by BP as a tactic to divert responsibility for carbon emissions onto consumers
OP ily ty 4 the fun videos
@@mythicalmeanderings YES tell them like it is
All songs can be gay if you try hard enough.
I stand by this
or if you dedicate it to your gay ships-
im sorry im not gay im genderfluid so ill see myself out-
hard? 😳
@@anica7438if you’re gender-fluid you can’t be straight so what are you?
@@notbatman24601 Genderfluid is a gender identity which refers to a gender that varies, or changes over time. This can be occasionally, every month, every week, everyday. It has nothing to do with sexuality.
My issue with “gay music” is that they really mean gay effeminate men who party a lot. It’s the opposite of what stereotypical lesbian music is. Exactly what the first survey responder said.
I would associate typical "lesbian music" with like... folky singer-songwriter songs with poetic or interesting lyrics, mostly but not entirely by female artists. Maybe because there really are a ton of queer women folk musicians both today and in the past in the "women's music" genre? Maybe also because there's a lot of activism and "earthiness" associated with it, which are also associated with lesbianism? Or a chill/laid-back/relaxed vibe that can simultaneously contain intense emotion?
@@professorrock4698 hozier
spot on for me. so much Ani Difranco! But it's a very white genre too. @@professorrock4698
@@sax0catI listen to both lol. Riotgrrrl, the butchies, hozier, nep, ratwyfe.
I wonder why there’s such a dichotomy, like a gap that hasn’t been bridged. Idunno of any music that has vibes between those two groups that I actually like :p
They literally mean your typical gay, white 30 year old man, instead of like? The rest of the LGBTQ+. I mean madonna is a gay icon, so is cher. But she's a gen x and millennial gay icon, not a gen z gay icon (unlike artists like conan grey)
I always thought that stereotypically
Lesbians would be more likely to listen to soft indie and punk (like clairo, and bikini kill)
Bisexual women emo, punk and pop punk (Panic at the disco)
Pansexuals metal, 'weirdcore' (a genre defined by spotify) and emo
Gay men indie pop, 'bedroom pop' (a genre defined by spotify), and just pop (with mainly female vocalists)
One of the most authentically queer things ive found on Spotify is actually an album that I discovered through a user made playlist completely by accident while on a bit of a rabbit hole. Its not representative of most queers, because nothing is, but it's nicheness is so extreme and intentional that it feels like a perfect representation of the nicheness of my favorite queer things.
The album is The Whale That Ate Jonah by a very gay, very trans, very Jewish, and quite punk band called Schmekel (which translates to just "penis" in yiddish lol). I still cant believe I found it, and I cherish it like nothing else, even if the songs might not "objectively" be that great.
thanks for the rec!
I love that band
Hell yeah i love that album!
I never thought I would find anyone who had heard this before, but I'm so glad you all have!!
also @Charlie 2.0, no I havent, but I will have to now. and also your pfp is on fucking point, I love that painting (thanks to Scott Christensen, or however its spelled whoops)
@@charlie2.048 omg, so glad I listened to that. I didn't even know they had a yt. Thanks!!
"between bisexuals and the Panic at the 1975 Janelle Monae David Bowie" is the most vicious call out I've ever experienced and also why I'm permanently subscribed.
SAME
🙃🙃I failed at the first examples
“Is this song gay”
Me: “oh yeah, straight out of a lesbian’s playlist”
“Tastes a little heterosexual huh?”
Me: “wait what?”
“How about this one?”
Me: “super straight! Makes me feel like I’m at a party I definitely don’t belong at”
“Now that! That tasted like fresh fruit right?”
Me: 😐….
RIGHT the second one gives me flashbacks to shitty garageband edm 💀
same with the second one. that's fir sure not gay
lmao the first song was like a gay record player vibe and the second song was straight man dances in stock photo club
I thought they both sounded straight, though perhaps the second was a little fruitier. The first one was straight, the second one describes themselves as “spicy straight”
I think it's masculine vs feminine? The second one I definitely imagined my straight girl friends dancing to, though if I imagined men I think it could pass as "fruity"?
As an LGBT person in the Midwest I laughed and then cried at your joke about the Midwest being a modern example of the heterosexual institutions.
it’s so fucked im a midwest queer and the midwest part got me liking sports lmfaoooo
@@morganburt2565 same, I’m really into hockey
Also in the Midwest and can confirm. I need to move.
I hope you're safe
Chappell Roan is a midwest queen and hope more midwest queers are seen.
This is why I have a spotify playlist called "One Person's Queer Culture." It's just stuff I feel is gay based on my taste, the tastes of queer people I know, and my knowledge of queer music history.
Maybe not everyone would say the Eurodance EDM of the artist Basshunter is gay, but to me it is.
@@n48_art thank god someone sees my vision
@@lilja5884 Omg! That's amazing! Nobody knows Eurodance in America, which is super annoying. All my love to the gays of Europe!
YES SOME1 ELSE WHO THINKS LIKE ME.
One thing i LOVE is seeing queer people bonding over shared interests, especially music. But i also dislike the idea that some people hv where there are certain genres, artists, movies etc that are gay while others are straight. It feels like "forcing" things into categories and boxes, which is definitely not something that we as queers should do. Just my personal opinion tho.
@@amiraaziz4599 I see where you're coming from, but I have a bit of a different approach. It might just be my generally flexible approach to life (I'm genderfluid lol), but I don't really see why things can't fit into boxes and exist outside of them at the same time. For me, this music is decidedly queer, but for other people that might not be the case. Both interpretations are equally valid. Calling something "gay" because it's covered in rainbows is one thing, but calling it gay because it's something an LGBTQIA+ person considers to be queer because of its place in their experience is another. It's all about how things resonate with us, things can fit in boxes or not and that's okay
love this one. i can say not enjoying mitski has alienated me from the ONLINE LESBIAN EXPERIENCE in a way that sparks the same annoyance as growing up without the means to consume, own or display markers of personality. like my god NO. I DONT LISTEN TO GIRL IN RED.
IM RUNNIN LOW
@@lysergidedaydream5970 on serotonin 💚🤍🖤
Im the opposite. Im very much straight but I like mitski and a few girl in red songs. I also get very annoyed when people label music i like as gay. I feel very alienated too
Chemical imbalance got me twisting things
@@leafle8134 stabilise, with medicine
This explains so much of my own experience.
As a 60 year old queer-punk - who had been an activist through most of the 80s and 90s - I'd always found that "Gay Music" was something complete opposed to my tastes. Along with what got labelled as gay movies, gay tv shows, and gay books. (So very much of it was created by straight people and centred straight people as the norm and gay people as problems to be understood or solved.)
I do think that there's some feedback going on between the public and private modes. The taste-makers push an agenda of 'gayness' as a consumer group since they sincerely believe that this type of incorporation into consumerist culture will be the best of both worlds; we remain distinct in an acceptable way.
A pretty common experience, I think, for those of us from punk times. I remember the local lesbian club was really on the folkey KD Lang sort of music scheme and really wouldn't touch the Riotgrrrl stuff a lot of us would listen to, call it a different mood. And, you know, I can understand the appeal of just *having* 'gay anthems' and whatnot, and, hard to be too down on people having a good time with that dance music, but for me, that's like, fun in small doses but easy for me to tire of. :) And obviously if we wanted punk music, we'd go to punk shows and stuff.
(laughing at the memory of when the lesbian bar became a general LGBT one and they put on a 'talent show,' only when I showed up with my *band* did they clarify it was a *lip synching to records* thing. :) )
Ok but this kinda reminds me of the Gay space/queer space thing
M
Same as a metalhead, and what's interesting is that I never felt there was queer and not queer metal/punk, peoving the fact that those differences dont occur naturally in our minds
Yeah, I have a queer songs playlist but it's literally songs that mention being gay or trans or ace or something in the lyrics...
This was unbelievably fucking interesting! I was always wondering why these company made queer playlists never ever appealed to me as a bi trans guy or my overwhelmingly queer friendgroup! Thanks for making this, very informative! Also the production value is off the charts, such a pretty set! :)
Edit: grammar
the way i am bisexual but i never call myself as a part of the lgbtq+ community bc i simply can't relate to these cultural things :D
@@anaochoa fair enough, I never know how to reply to people when they ask “do you listen to sweater weather” because I know they’re asking if I’m bi which I am but I don’t listen to sweater weather or enjoy the song too much personally so I’m caught in the middle lol (also never understood it being a bi anthem? It doesn’t mention being bi in the song)? Hm
listen to flowerkid or may-a!!!
@@kittenplush Yeah, it makes noooo sense as bi anthem (and this is coming from someone who's bi and really likes the song). My theory is that some bisexual on Tumblr, TikTok, or wherever liked the song and was able to connect it to their bisexuality, not necessarily through the lyrics but, rather, through a specific personal experience pertaining to the song, and, because of this declared it the 'new bi anthem' and, seeing as bi culture is kinda less expansive (or, at least, less broadly recognizable) compared to gay culture, other bi people who liked the song and wanted more cultural capital went along with it. Either that or it's poking fun at the stereotype of bi people wearing lots of hoodies and jackets in general. As for why that's a stereotype, I honestly don't know, especially considering how common these articles of clothing are.
Sorry for typing up such a long answer lol, I just find this kind of stuff (why we see certain things as connected to others, even when there's no obvious reason for them to be) interesting.
@@anaochoa This probably doesn't help much but, at the end of the day, cultural things are just that: Cultural. And cultures grow and evolve over time. So, what we consider "queer culture" isn't set in stone, and therefore can't be used to measure the validity of one's queerness. If this were the case, then any straight person who "dressed gay" and listened to "gay enough music" would be considered gay when, in actuality, sexuality doesn't work like that. (I'm not trying to say that it's silly of you to feel isolated from the LGBTQ+ community or that those feelings don't make sense. They actually felt pretty familiar, which is why I decided to respond to your sentence with an unprompted paragraph.)
Another comment about how this applies in the asexual and aromantic communities: I've seen people asking stuff like "what do aces/aros wear?" since other queer communities have their own styles (eg. bi ppl and doc martens). I always felt that it was kind of inherently exclusionary to suggest that styles of dress correspond to different sexual orientations (especially is they don't develop organically irl), since not everyone is going to like those styles, but I hadn't thought about the classist angle. This was a great eye-opening marxist queer video as always.
The "gay music" stuff has always been isolating for me 'cause I haven't heard 99% of the songs that people consider "gay". Throughout this video the only band/artist/etc mentioned or that I saw on screen that I recognized was PATD and that's only because my mom has been listening to them since they released their first album lul. I've always been into niche and weird stuff, at least from a western perspective. My music taste hasn't changed in the past nearly 11 years since I've started listening to VOCALOID music. Watching this actually makes me want to make my own video about VOCALOID and it's appeal to queer people!
As a bi trans vocaloid fan I fully agree. Rin and Len have definitly helped me in my confidence of my bisexuality before I even knew I was bi (as in I immediately accepted being bi as soon as someone suggested it to me)
However if you do make the video, you need to at least reference the Hamilton Hatsune miku binder.
As a Bi vocaloid fan as well (hi person above me :D), I would love to watch that video if you decide to make it ^^
@@enderphoenix11 hi bi person above and below me
My music taste has changed a lot over time, but in the end, I always come back to Vocaloid -
Vocaloid appeals to gay people specifically ..? Thats kinda crazy yet i cannot deny this
Can we just pause and enjoy the absolute beauty that is this video. I mean the backgrounds, the editing and the content. Awesome job Alex :)
Yes! His videos are getting better every time
And the background music! Really fitting for a video specifically about music too
Yesss!
It was an awesome vid
Everything about this video has been pure art.
I love seeing a video with a title like this and just saying "sure" and laughing to myself before clicking on it. I have no IDEA what this could mean, but it's a great excuse to watch the video anyway
Literally same
You know, I've always felt like folk/opera/indy/jpop was an incoherent set of musical tastes, but I feel validated as an ace to hear that total inconsistency is the mark of my people.
What a combo lol I'm not very into those so I'm feeling a little bit left out 😅 if all ace decided to create an unifying playlist.... it definitely would be interesting XD
@@faceyl We can be united in chaos
J POP! Not ace but also these are all my tastes too (more into jrock and visual kei than jpop ngl)
Same, I like some classical, music in Spanish (since I'm Hispanic and like hearing my language), occasional J-pop that I click on randomly when I want to listen to something I don't understand while studying, a bit of rock, some French pop music, dance music, songs from musicals, I'm just all over the place depending on my mood. 😅 Just that I'm Biromantic and Asexual. I often just say I'm Bi when this topic comes up because I don't really feel like explaining the latter all that often. Bi is a lot shorter than Biromantic Asexual. Although I could shorten it to Bi Ace, but I feel like that would confuse people as well. 😅
I think a big part of what is considered "gay music" is just what drag queens like to perform (I specified queens instead of kings because there isn't a codified music genre associated with them yet due to them not being as mainstream). These are songs that play at gay bars, not what loads of gay people listen to on their own. They're also genres that were popular with POC LGBT+ people decades ago and took time to reach the white LGBT+ tastemakers, so I imagine the average non-tastemaker LGBT+ people have moved on to other genres by now.
Have you ever actually seen a drag queen perform though? They will perform to literally anything, not just a Brittany Spears song
@@danielsimmich1858 That's true, and I'm well aware of that as someone who has done drag performances to a range of songs. However, there are artists that are favourites in the drag community and are commonly performed, like Britney Spears, Lady Gaga and, more recently, Dua Lipa.
I think a lot of the numerical issues here actually have a lot to do with the fact that there's this identifiably gay-club-associated (usually specifically gay dude-associated) chunk or two out of music, which apparently a lot of people like to gather around, but which isn't actually that many LGBT people's *favorite usual music.* Kind of like a lot of people expect to hear Irish music in Irish pubs, but may not actually listen to it that much outside of that context.
In a sense, thisnotion of 'queer music' is kind of centered around the (remaining/perceived) institution of gay dance clubs etc, whereas as individual consumers, we're actually all over the map, variously affiliated with or nostalgic for various subcultures and genres, whatnot. And generally the LGBT clubs still seem to tend to play the gay guy dance music and that's fun once in a while for me, but my usual place to go dancing and stuff was actually the local Goth club, as as it was for lots of other LGBT folks too, and similar with other genres and scenes.
Still, if I go on Spotify and search on 'Lesbian music' I have a pretty good idea what's gonna come up, and I don't expect it to be modeled on actual-me, or necessarily any actual person in particular.
This is a very good analysis. Even outside of gay clubs, here in Portugal when you go nightclubbing there's usually Brazilian funk playing on the speakers, and when you're out partying and drinking it feels really nice... But most of us don't actually listen to it outside of those contexts. Clubbing music can't really be applied to entire communities, because most of us don't go out looking for most of those songs when we are at home and feel like putting on some background noise.
Also, I just wanna say, I would love to have a goth club where I live. Can you rec any songs? That part of your comment really caught my attention
@@nicolautorgal9298 These are my goth recommendations, a mix of old and new, industrial and wave. My taste slants German since that's where I live. I don't know of any Portuguese or Brazilian goth music, but maybe Hocico could help as a starting point for your search.
Light Asylum - Dark Allies th-cam.com/video/cUyv3HTjNRU/w-d-xo.html
Too Dead to Die - Tropical Gothic th-cam.com/video/UtdRjn1h930/w-d-xo.html
The Cure - A Forest th-cam.com/video/xik-y0xlpZ0/w-d-xo.html
Mistress Violet - Violet Chachki & Allie th-cam.com/video/PDykBK498II/w-d-xo.html
The Sisters of Mercy - More th-cam.com/video/BURM7l6_pvg/w-d-xo.html
Hocico - Bienvenido a la Maldad th-cam.com/video/81G9VGw2kCo/w-d-xo.html
She Past Away - Kasvetli Kutlama th-cam.com/video/oy2x_kHCy4w/w-d-xo.html
Linea Aspera - Attica th-cam.com/video/KhLogaOufG0/w-d-xo.html
Die Krupps - Schmutzfabrik th-cam.com/video/jvyOp1_mFDs/w-d-xo.html
Lebanon Hanover - Du Scrollst th-cam.com/video/nSqJhKUTJbA/w-d-xo.html
Siouxsie and the Banshees - Happy House th-cam.com/video/amR6-neQBPE/w-d-xo.html
Audra - Cabaret Fortune Teller th-cam.com/video/zPczkYNO7RE/w-d-xo.html
And One - Military Fashion Show th-cam.com/video/l9q_KrrdEB8/w-d-xo.html
Randolph & Mortimer - Citizens (Schwefelgelb Remix) th-cam.com/video/hV6HzfpEXos/w-d-xo.html
Clan of Xymox - Loneliness th-cam.com/video/wBvCWPbA8UA/w-d-xo.html
Björn Peng - At Night (feat. Luna Nogood) th-cam.com/video/mLNVEGJb0NI/w-d-xo.html
And for OllamhDrab ;)
Drab Majesty - 39 by Design th-cam.com/video/Yqn9fXzYWoo/w-d-xo.html
@@dougalsii thank you so much kind stranger, I'll put all of those on a playlist! You're doing gods work right now!
I've only seen basically the title of your "the end of are they gay" video, but I have to say. If this is the sort of thing you're hoping to produce more of? These broader anthropological essays with a queer theory lens? I am ecstatic to see it. The simple and down to earth way in which you quickly define your terms in easy to understand ways before moving on is especially impressive. Eg, the use of your white friend to illustrate what you mean by the ability to identify whiteness visually in many cases. I find that remembering to define potentially nebulous concepts is both so important when discussing these subjects, and so hard to do. You make it looks effortless and sound natural, which I imagine is the product of honed skill, but you do many is seem easy. I lack the vocavbulary to compliment the camerawork and visual editting as completely as I would like to, but honestly, that was also spectacular.
Oh I've just gotten to the data tables, and you're right, you can tell I'm a sociologist orz
so true, if this is the content he's going to be producing, I'm here for it
This was an excellent video, and perfectly articulates my feelings about "queer playlists" as a queer POC even if I never understood them myself! Thank you for making this!
For the asexuals, if I were to hazard a guess, there aren’t many songs in any genre that are “relatable”, given that many songs have sexual undertones. So there’s a lot of genre bouncing.
Or maybe it would be better analyzed by romantic attraction than sexual. (Though I assume there would be similar results for aromantics)
Drink a glass of warm milk about it
Yes, I've only recently found a few songs I relate with, like "We'll never have sex" or songs by Banshee
I always get disheartened when I start really paying attention to the lyrics and its so sexual. But that's just me (Mostly cause my ex made me self conscious abt the music I chose to listen to as an acespec person)
I'm ace and aro-spec and I don't need every song I listen to to be relatable to me. That being said, I do like when songs are relatable.
"D&D + Asexuality" by Skull Puppies, and "For Me" by Dearlie are both intentionally about being asexual. "Aromantic Moodboard" by Maxwell Anthony is about being aro (but kind of sad. Most songs by allos that people put in aro-themed playlists are as well and it's honestly frustrating. Positive songs I see added often are "Never Been in Love" by Will Jay, and "I'm Good" by The Mowgli's, a welcome change).
true, i dont look for relatability in music. i do however always appreciate a song that is, at the very least, not glamorizing romance. sad songs about how futile and empty love is seem to be my type! but also, obviously, we all view music through many different lenses. i love a lyric that makes you think. i love a tune that gets stuck in your head
This definitely applies in aro spaces too! Expect for the few songs written with aros In mind or at least written with a sort of “ fuck anatanormativity” attitude ( for example like TheSnowBallet mentioned,never been in love and I’m good. or one of my personal favourites, ribs by the crane wives )
there is a lot of subjectiveness and personal interpretation going on, what I might interpret as a song about platonic love another aro might interpret as being about romance and a third aro might interpret as a whole different thing. I suppose this could be said about almost any community searching for representation but do I think it’s heightened by the prevalence of romance in almost any creative work
"Marriage wasn't about romantic love.....it was about exchange of property."
My favorite way of playing the sims. Minus the "drowing in the pool" part.
Sometimes about forming aliances too.
i like making families
@@cometischeese I like ending them. Lol.
Hurley pfp
Do you like weezer? Would you say they're gay?
in class so I can’t watch but I really hope you bring up the rebranding of the sad girl starter pack playlist to be queer I’ve been wanting to talk about it for WEEKS. your videos are incredible, can’t wait for my lunch period to find out what’s in store for this one!
Yessss
yeah I mean the icon is now just two girls making out lmao
im pretty sure the "yearning" category on my wrapped was just spotify code for sapphic LMAO
@@swirlingsun I've heard about the "Sapphic Yearnings" playlists out there.
I laughed at your ace joke about not having any musical attraction. I love this breakdown of consumerism as a form of queer expression. Very enlightening.
I love spotify's algorithmic recommendations. I have discovered so much great music from my weekly generated playlist and from "starting a radio" from a song or artist. But like 75% of their editorial playlists are so bad. I would have called Deserved the "basic" playlist. Gracias Roberto.
As a trans masc bisexual I don’t really find myself ever listening to music catered to gay men which makes me listen to weirdly obscure game music catered towards trans masc bisexuals. It’s strange how a lot of us will gravitate towards the same types of music. Like their are so many playlists and people I have seen that have to music I like to listen to and then will describe it as “gender indusing rage fueled by the gay agenda”
so, like, spider dance? bc that shit absolutely slaps
Any song recs? That description intrigues me haha
i'm dumb u were responding to op ignore me lol
Why do we bi trans mascs be like this? It's always intense internet music like, Lemon Demon, Hozier, the Undertale Soundtrack, Saint Motel
Can I recommend DeReconstruct by Penny Parker? Transness is very weaved into some of the songs, and the first three have a video game vibe if that's what you like
So excited to watch this, I made my whole gaymosexual discord server take that survey and we were debating it for AGES (with the eventual conclusion that each playlist was gay)
ETA stellar vid!! I guess whiteness is just *that* heavily conflated with affluence and influence within the queer community, despite the fact that many lgbtqs are in fact lower class white people, and many others of significant status are not white. Association of wealth and power with just one specific race is continually proven to be an imperfect supposition, but it is very difficult to avoid. 🤔
Just for fun, here's some quotes from our server discussion, lol:
"for the first one there are so many artists on there that are like For The Gays it almost feels like a setup lmao but also looks like a playlist several ppl i know would make"
"both of these playlists are unpleasant tho tbh"
"Gay playlist: Just 'Fast Car' and nothing else"
"I have shape of you in my very large shuffle playlist because it makes me think of a Sportacus/Robbie Rotten video I saw once and nearly choked to death watching."
"I think any music that speaks to the impoverished and the downtrodden is, in a sense, gay"
Interesting stuff. Oh, also, the lighting in this vid was gorgeous. Loved the shimmering drapery
Can you elaborate on the whole Sportacus/Robbie Rotten video situation please and thank you?
omg the last quote I feel so hard. im not like an expert on the queer community, im pretty new around these parts, but i have a playlist of social justicey music, and even the songs that arent explicitly gay still feel gay,, even the spanish language ones from the 70s-80s.
part of it might be the nicheness of most of the stuff on there that makes it feel gay, idk, but i still love that idea.
@@Maggie_crochet +1
@@amycox5733 i mean, i can't hope to explain why my dear friend was browsing lazytown amvs besides being queer and online (deadly combination), but uh - pretty sure it's this: th-cam.com/video/HbE8W5_hmdQ/w-d-xo.html
@@Maggie_crochet i am so sorry my dove but it's a closed server for people i've known for a minimum of five years. it's like a boomers keeping in touch group chat more than anything, and as old gays we value our privacy. i'd recommend starting up a server with your own cherished friends and mutuals though - it's free! and fun!
As an asexual, I laughed at that "musical attraction" joke xD But yeah, the results there definitely fit me! It's because I can never decide to pick a genre and stick with it ^^'
I'm pan ace and my playlist is a mess of different genres cuz I can't pick a fav genre. Once I like a song, idc about the genre
Nobody asked for the Virgin Brigade in here
@@gearbear4530 no need to be so mean you ace exclusionist
@@MagmaMonika I think that statement counts as acephobia
@@MagmaMonika i’m a proud aphobe
shut up aces
46:20 was a really interesting point to me because from a closer perspective of being trans and hearing that, it gets me thinking about the isolation of people pre and post surgeries. A lot of the time in trans spaces its considered a requirement to get some kind of surgery/to be on hormones to be properly seen as trans. without it, you get judged, pretty intensely at times. i see it as one of the reasons why trans people will resort to unsafe methods of binding/tucking, not even to present more traditionally to cis people, but to be viewed as more legitimate for other trans people. its a whole different issue with trans people and its super surface level what im saying, but just reminded me of that. Love your video! Glad to see you doing stuff that interests you more closely, very aesthetically pleasing too :)
as a bi woman who most listens to music in the metal-rock-punk sector I feel seen by these statistics
I can honestly say that watching this has reignited my passion for queer theory and sociology. I've been putting off planning my dissertation but this has inspired me :)
What's queer theory?
i, a bi, do like punk. but i wondered what the connection is between that and rap, my favorite genre. both are rhythm centered and anti-oppression. maybe we listen to them because we are angry about trying to fit ourselves into the het mold?
amazing video!! all the gorgeous sets
Yup, that says a lot about refusing to "pick a side," as they say.
I’ve never been a huge fan of music that stereotypically is associated and enjoyed by people of my demographic: that being teenage lesbians. I think this might be considered blasphemy but I cannot stand Girl In Red’s music. I think that associating certain interests or tastes with any culture leads to nothing but a feeling of deep alienation and eventual separation, which I would say defines my opinion of the LGBTQ community pretty well. While personally I have a good paying job where I work myself half to death and could probably afford to dress and consume the media that people of my demographic are supposed to be into, I simply do not want to. I don’t relate to the wider culture of queer people my age, as much as used to wish I did, because the wider canon of “gay interests” is just a whole array of things I am absolutely not interested in. These kinds of algorithms seem like the capitalist incarnation of the social alienation that I used to feel, back when I thought forcing myself to have similar interests with queer people my age would give me a sense of belonging and community.
Why don't you like girl in red? What knid of queer things do you like?
I am honestly in the same position
I'm in a similar boat myself, actually
@@daniellarkins3849 I just really don’t enjoy her music. And the point of this comment was that I felt alienated because I am not interested in typical queer things.
I like your SBG profile picture
Excellent video!!! When you put up the stat about Bisexuals liking pop punk I felt so called out. Glad I could contribute to that statistic, lmao
Me when I'm bi and also like pop punk:
I think I'm actually gonna like your new direction better. I like fun characters theories but I am a nut for historical recounts and company retrospectives. Or anything you can make an video about.
I'm hyped for where this is going!
this is wild because i was recommended their “Obsessed” playlist the other day which led me to “Deserved” and i immediately knew who they were targeting but was disappointed (but not surprised) that the Deserved playlist had so little POC representation. so excited to hear your thoughts on this whole thing!!
This is totally interesting video but the fact that the age factor here was largely glossed over in the statistical research portion - by no fault of your own since this was highly dependent on your audience reach and the responses you recieved - stands out quite a lot to me. As a Black queer nonbinary sapphic watcher over 30, one of the most obvious factors in discussing cultural gayness is whether or not you experienced formative queerness moments pre- or post- social media. All-in-all, though, this was a really cool look at how capital-driven tastemaking works around marginalized cultural identities.
Totally agree. Loved the video, but had the same observation.
It's always been incredibly invalidating to my experience that "gay music" isn't sad folk punk. I hope all y'all more conventional bottom tastemakers can live with the fact that you made me feel alone among straights for my best twink years. You WILL hear from my lawyers.
@@n48_art everytime I google lesbian music is sad soft music
@@drawingsticks5333 the lesbians love the front bottoms
- a lesbian
@@drawingsticks5333 as a bi girl that doesn't like sad soft music i've been annoyed by that bc i wanted to relate to other wlws but i just realised i do listen to the stereotypical bi music noo i'm part of the problem lmao
@@n48_art sapphics looove sad folk punk
@@wm8840 yeah same problem with sad soft music... I kinda gave up, although I found a good latm singer recently
I am here for the chaotic good energy this man brings with each and every one of his fantastic and well researched videos 💜💜💜
I've been watching you since the 'are they gay videos' and at that time they were the only comfort for me as I was surrounded only by heterosexuals telling me I was sick and weird for thinking some tv characters could ever be gay. I'm so happy to see the direction your channel is taking and I absolutely loved this video, the format the humour the depth of the research and the way you say Bourdieu lmao
Hey, Alex!
This video was absolutely fantastic. I loved it the whole way through. I found your channel through the "Encanto" video, and I gotta say, you're shaping up to be one of the best video essayists on the platform today. I reeeeeally missed the more theory-oriented videos after the post-pandemic 'commentary' boom which recentered video essay from the 2018-2020 "Left Tube" phase into a new, media criticism-oriented wave. I also relate to you _a lot,_ as I'm also a male bisexual Latino (though, white -- I'm Brazilian) social sciences major and musician who's working on an album. I fully support this new phase of your channel (having watched your "The end of AreTheyGay" video), especially considered since that's exactly the type of video I first subscribed for. I'm also considering donating to your Patreon soon, though I don't have money to spare _right now_
All that said, I have a question for you. The one thing that completely sold your TH-cam project to me was your citing "Hegemony and Socialist Strategy" by Laclau and Mouffe in the "Encanto" video, and actually exploring the concept of 'subject position' in a way that left me very satisfied. See, I've been working on Laclau and especially Mouffe's work since 2019, and they're definitely my favorite social theorists, and seeing their work being actually used in a video essay got me jumping in excitement in my room. The only other video essayist I've seen mentioning them was Abi Thorn from Philosophy Tube, in her Steve Bannon video, who positively cited, though in passing, Mouffe's recent work on left populism.
The question is: having positively cited their work in a previous video, I think you read and liked at least the core of their theory (labeled post-Marxist, and later renamed "discourse theory"), but you also seem to cite more 'orthodox' Marxist theory a lot (vis-à-vis your "Communist Manifesto" joke in this video, which I liked a lot; but also the general class-centering of this video's thesis -- with which, don't get me wrong, I fully agree). So I'd be curious if you'd be able to expand a bit on your views concerning Laclau and Mouffe's work? Do you also agree with the first two chapters of their book as well (that is, their critique of class reductionism and economism), or do you find their theory to be only a useful tool in a toolbox which centers other types of analysis?
Would be really glad if you replied! Also, _very much_ looking forward to your next videos, the work you've been doing with these well-researched and highly intellectual but also gorgeous and highly produced video essays is _sooo_ invaluable, you're exactly the kind of content creator TH-cam need right now! Thank you so much!
Great video! Very interesting. One important thing to add in the creation of playlists (and culture) is MONEY. Certain artists from certain major labels will earn a higher spot on curated playlists for the right price. At the same time, marketing campaigns also heavily influence what society considers "gay music"
I guess to provide my stats: I am queer on the MLM end of the spectrum; that playlist is definitely something I would have called "gay"; very little of it is music I would ever turn on and I would likely skip if I was in control, although I would be ambivalent if it was playing and I didn't have the option to skip; and the only person I know who'd like it is a straight male colleague that everyone jokes is gay for his taste in music and-- my dad. Well, my dad's playlist would have artists from 20 years ago - but his favourite albums/CDs growing up were compilations of female vocalists who sung rock/power ballads. I remember some (paraphrase) "Powerful Women in 80s/90s Music" album being on repeat in his car for years (with songs from the likes of Tatu, Texas, Pink! and Dido).
Serious question, why are Nirivana not considered queer? They weren't actually queer themselves afaik (although I've heard speculation about this) were very open about their ally-ship, at a time when it was far less popular, even occasionally wearing dresses on stage to piss off homophobes (the early 90s were a very different and strange time.
This video almost single-handedly changed my entire outlook on culture, how it works and why it is the way it is. This is truly one of the most insightful videos I have ever watched, AMAZING JOB!!!
I searched “gay music by gay people” in google and I got a list of “gay anthems” with some gay artist but not 100%gay artists.
Nice to have something to watch while I’m waiting out a medical flare up under a tree.
Take care!
This was fascinating Alex! I love when your sociology background shows up to shine a light on a topic
all with data collection and statistics too!!!
I'm staring my sociology degree soon and I'd like to thank you for being such an inspiration for this life choice ! You make each video interesting, exiting and educational in a way that's eye opening. I hope one day I am as perceptive as yourself!
the WHIPLASH of the first minute of this video is perfect. thank you aretheygay for yet another banger
I love these videos because it feels like you are bringing the sociology to bear... a lot of what I learn from you could be applied to many subcultures. I'm definitely not a minority (being old, white, cis, straight and male... heck, I'm even from the midwest). Consciously, I view myself as an ally of other races, genders, sexualities, etc, but do catch that institutional bias creeping in at times, and videos like this help me understand how to be aware of and guard against those subconscious stereotypes. Thank you for helping me resist the slide into "Boomerdom."
My jaw dropped several times while watching! This was extremely informative, the research the DATA the history are so on point! also the settings, the props, the bottom jokes and the tying it back to your album *cheff's kiss*
I've been here since the beginning and I'm so damn proud of you and happy FOR you that the channel is evolving. Your approach is so fascinating and I've truly felt honored to watch you blossom and become ever more confident in your content and film making capabilities!
I love this style of video because I'm getting LGBTQ+ content and topics while also learning sociology
i guess it all makes sense now that i don't listen to curated playlists on spotify and also picked the second playlist as the gayer one (though i barely knew any songs in either playlist). but yeah, especially the last part of the video really got me thinking... i never realized the consumption part of "queer culture" or how inaccessible this is to a lot of people
I have so many comments to make, I feel like I need a whole conversation with you! This video was so good!! As one of those three sociology graduates in this audience, I very much appreciate the research aspect and the time you took to look into the literature. This is such an interesting and in-depth take on culture and basically cultural hegemony. Culture was my weakest subject to teach when I taught an Intro to Soc class, and I feel like you made it so interesting to learn more about it!
As a queer person, even my most "queer" playlist doesn't give me enough of the same vibe as the Deserved playlist Spotify made (supposedly) with queer people in mind. Even though our playlists have similarities (both Spotify's and my playlists include pop & uk pop into our playlists), we don't share the same artists. albums, or songs.
Ah! My curiosity about the surveys is now satisfied! This was a beautiful video - the sets were amazing!
Any song is gay if I can imagine James McAvoy dancing to it...
I'm so upset with myself for letting this sit in my Watch Later for so long. Everything is so brilliant-- the editing, the research, the shots, the Mitski references, everything!!
Mr. Avila, this was a very entertaining and educational video; I'm glad I watched it. Great delivery of a lot of information. I particularly liked the changing of sets as you moved through your presentation. The "banana joke" brought a smile to my face.
I’m so happy about the new direction ur channel is taking I love listening to u talk this is so interesting and the production value is so high and beautiful thank u so much for ur work and mind
Also I’m a transmasc bisexual and I listen to electronic music from the 2000s lol
As an aromantic-asexual person, I really liked this for a lot of reasons. The history part with the two different ways queer culture could exist was interesting to me, because even if most gay people I know don’t like ideas of community as much, I didn’t know they used to. Nowadays the idea of physical queer communities is what a lot of aromantic want (without wanting a spouse, a nuclear family unit is far from ideal) because society deems romance as the best human connection. So when aros don’t have that, community and friendship seem very appealing. Also, as most of queer culture is geared towards allo queer people, it’s easy to feel isolated form it. Like queer anthems don’t resonate with me much. Better than straight, but not close to my experience as a queer person.
It took me way too long to finally start watching this, but WOW. Ths is wonderful Alexander, the visuals are amazing and you had me hooked on every single sophisticated word! Great Job on this, I hope we get to see more of this format.
I love this channel so much. The videos are insightful, informative, and incredibly funny. Queer culture and history is such a fascinating topic, and unfortunately there aren’t that many people dedicated to discussing it. Keep up the great work!
As a statistic-loving person, I can't thank you enough for both the coding method AND the many comments about how certain variables affected the likeliness of a result. Thank you thank you thank you!!! (evidently I do love data and am not bored yet.)
I love how you saw a playlist on Spotify and just decided to make a sociological dissertation about it
Thank you for another incredible video. The way you make these complex and academic ideas accessible, fun, and easy to understand is amazing, and I really appreciate all the work you do.
incredible video, im excited for the direction that your channel is heading!
38:31 hey happy and sad transhets exist (me). I completely fall into the pop + musical theater + anime mismash of a stereotypical trans girl.
These videos are so fascinating and well produced! :) Alex is actually one of the reasons I’m going to study sociology next year
I see you with that set design fucking go!
This video is soooo good! Your research is top notch, really. Are you a scholar? I would love to read your takes on the matter on a few papers (or maybe a dissertation?). Congrats!
i think he is working on a paper at the moment! i don't know where we could read it though :[
I'd also be really interested in reading some of Alex's academic work!
2 minutes in but damn i'm really appreciating the production behind this video
gurl the amount of effort we can appreciate in this video. you're great and your work is underrated, you deserve the best we love u sweetie
Thank you for your hard work Alex, this video is very insightful and informative. This topics about taste, music and class have always been in the back of my mind and I can't quite describe it, your video helps me to conceptualize them perfectly. This must take you a lot of research to be done and also the effort going into the background is stunning! Keep up the great work man!
the production quality and points made in this video are EXCELLENT. well done!
I’m so happy to see a new video. Also, all the best for your future endeavours!
duudeee i saw u on jack edwards' channel too hii
@@stevethepaidintern196 Oh hello!
I thought I was going to miss 'Are they gay'. But no.. I am gonna miss these detailed essays! Don't leave us hanging for long.. Always here to support you as much I can! Thanks for the wonderful work
brilliant video, so interesting!! I can't wait to dive deeper into this new phase of yours into video essays, sociology, and all of it. thanks for sharing!
can we appreciate how absolutely stunning are the backgrounds
It's only recently that I came across your channel and saw you break down the queer nuances of the Dead Poets Society. I must tell you, as a queer person who seems to incessantly scan for homosexual subtext, it was immensely liberating to find - and here comes the phrase - that I'm not alone. I adore the fact that you provide a socio-philosophical basis for your content because it helps me reframe queerness as something that doesn't only concern my own (individual) self-perception, but which is so packed with social influence. I can't thank you enough for the distinction made between queer integration into heteronormative social order vs. the restructuring and reshaping of the social order - it gives so much perspective. Sociology articulates the queer condition so succintly and beautifully, doesn't it? Again, I can't thank you enough, for both the content you produce and its inspiring logistics and conclusions :)
This video well very well calculated and healthfully manufactured. I applaud you for your hard work. It was fun participating in and I will happily support you on the upcoming album Thank you for teaching me the world of gay.
Absolutely amazing video! The research the set, the lighting, the subject material all 5 stars! Super interesting stuff! I can't wait for more and am also super hyped for October Conspiracy!
Also 38:12 that ace joke got me 😂💜🖤
FINALLY i've been looking for the language to describe the way gaydar&queer culture work for SO LONG ThANK YOU and thank you for the theory of cultural capital
I was just thinking about your videos yay so excited for this one!!!
The hard work you did for this is INSANE! And on top of that it is funny 😭 It got me v interested the whole time. Thank you soo much!!
My worldview has completely changed because of this video. My brain just rewired. I feel so free now and i love it. Thank you so much for this video. Instant sub ❤️
I appreciate you. I am sitting here, early in the morning at a café, drinking a latte and planning out the next few weeks until I have to hand in my masters thesis. This is giving me some high key high quality nostalgia from my first year on the masters where one of my classes was basically: 'Apply Bourdieu to high society Hellenistic Greece' and I was like thanks, I hate it here, and now I miss it so much!
(It is not that I hate my thesis (I am not a big fan of the hype people have for it, but I digress) but the whole process ... In a fit of queer coded drama (and an over-abundance of personal cultural capital that sadly translates to no social capital what so ever with my friend group) I spend one of my breaks yesterday, rewriting 'I dreamed a dream' from Les Mis and renamed it 'lament of a thesis writer'.
Fin fact about the voice thing, new studies seem to indicate that women's voices are deeper in societies with more equality.
Also, lastly, the idea of a society where social capital is also measured by your heritage is fascinating and strange to listen to. As a scandinavian person, I am as white as they come but I have never seen a 'white people' meme that fits the society I live in. Or a 'black people' meme that might fit black people I know here either for that matter. From my perspective, queer culture is American. It was made there, exported from there and very little input has really been able to break through from other societies. Even the 'ingo' is mostly in English.
Two things you said stood out. 1. Marriage was formerly about property, not love. 2. Lower class people are less likely to identify as LGBT. I have no doubt that lower class queer people feel alienated from the "tastemaking culture" you have described. However, is it additionally possible that lower class people are still more socialized to see romantic relationships in terms of economics? For example, finding a rich man as a provider so you don't have to work as much/ can ascend the class hierarchy easier. Or finding a beautiful woman as a marker of status. If this attitude towards traditional gender norms has a subconscious class element that is more materially important to lower class people who dream of upward mobility it's probably on a subconscious level so not sure how much it would affect the numbers. Just food for thought.
The overall effort put into this video is so outstanding, thank you for making this!!!
Would also like to add that their where and continue to be 2 spirit/queer/LGBTQIA+ communities within indigenous communities around the world since time and millennia. While there is a totally different structure and life way; it’s important to talk about this because many folks (especially yt queers) have no idea about this!
This might be my favourite video yet! I have never heard my alienation from the queer community explained so beautifully before! For a cute example: I could not afford Doc Martins until I started working a full time office job. So until that time, how was everyone supposed to know I'm bisexual if I couldn't wear Doc Martins? A single flannel or tucked in t-shirt doesn't always cut it. An over simplification of course, but I think the access to signifiers of "queer identity" or simply access to "queer culture" had some impact on my and others' willingness to come out.
This video is an incredible companion piece to CJ The X's "Subjectivity in Art" video (i just watched it again last night and i have so many brain worms)
im a stem guy myself but i just love sociological data analysis! please talk more about how sample sizes, the visibility of your link, the demographic that watches your video affects data! i just lov e dataahuıasdhakj
so proud that this is the first video my patreon pledge went to! amazing work!
all my gay friends listen to they might be giants and oingo boingo and those only have the common link of "someone's gonna make fun of you if you say you like this"
It's so interesting! I always concluded that these editorial playlists were made in part with the algorithm? (I'm not that tech savvy lol) But knowing that these playlist are made by actual people makes a lot of more sense now. It's interesting how Spotify decides to sorta push that detail to the shadows? I mean we as an audience do not have info on the editors. We don't have that natural moment of drawing a conclusion as when we see the picture of an editor-in-chief of a magazine or read the about the author part of a book.
Dang what a journey. I always end your videos feeling like I've watched five other videos smushed together. And I mean that in a good way.
And good luck with the name change!
Good stuff, I like the set design !!
I do subscribe to a music streaming platform but the idea of listening to a playlist curated to fit someone else's conception of what my identity may be is pretty repulsive to me. I mostly just listen to own playlists and favourite albums.