@@CupertinorailThey replaced the class 101’s and similar though later latter hung about till 2003 having been built as early as 1956. I went on the very last one in service in 2003 though some are now on private heritage railways just like the pacers.
And then DB realized that you can't make every intercity train an ICE without devaluing the brand, so they invented the ICE Sprinter. Basically NS has slow Sprinters and DB has fast Sprinters.
I’ve never been to the Netherlands yet but I’m happy that NS decided to keep the iconic navy and yellow livery. When I think of Dutch trains a big yellow VIRM speeding past tulips fields and windmills is what automatically pops into my head.
I remember landing at Schiphol after a journey to the USA. At the landing approach I saw yellow doubledeck trains among the fields of flowers and vegetables and knew immediately I am in the right country.
@@295g295 If you mean Norfolk Southern. It would be fun if NS and NS did a swap of liveries on a few units. As CP and CP almost did at some point in the past, using the same orange/red with white striped front ends.
Good example from the area I grew up in southern Germany: my city was roughly an hour from the next greater city. Both cities were linked by an Interstate Highway and a double tracked electrified main line from the railroad. All kinds of passenger and freight trains used that line, and although the high-speed trains weren't going at high speed, they were still faster: - ICE = Inter City Express, a high-speed long distance train which goes directly from central station to central station without stopping in between. Took roughly 55 minutes. - IC = Inter City, still a high-speed long distance train. It stops only once at the largest town between both cities, roughly two thirds down the line. Took maybe 58 minutes - RE = Regional Express, a train serving a greater regional area. It stops 3 times between both cities, serving the largest town and some large villages. Travel time 1 hour 2 minutes - RB = Regional Train, a train serving a smaller regional area. It stops at each and every station along the line, in every small village, adding up to 11 stops. However that train doesn't even go all the way to the other large city, but only to that town two thirds down the line. In that town you have to get off the regional train and get onto the commuter train - S-Bahn = commuter train, a local train serving a greater metro area of the largest cities. They stop at each and every station just like regional trains, but they run on a much tighter schedule. Travel time of regional train + commuter train: 1 hour 32 minutes
This is not the only slow Sprinter. Sprinter is also some Siemens Desiro trains in California and Sprinter is also a locomotive that hauls Amtrak trains that are not as fast as Acela
The version I remember was that the NS thought 'stopping train' sounded to negative, and too easy to make jokes off as they were having serious problems getting their trains to run on time or even to run at all. So they came up with a less negative name and chose sprinter. Sprinters were known for not having toilets on board. When the NS decided to pull the original sprinters off their commuter / metro routes, and onto longer distance routes, that started to give problems. Yes subways and trams don't have toilets, but you're generally only on them for half an hour max. But the new routes, some people rode from start to finish so were sometimes on the train for an hour or longer. The conducter ended up having a stash of plastic bags so passenger could do an emergency bio-stop on those routes in the conductor's room... I think they just finished retro-fitting in toilets on all the sprinter trains that came without them, and the new version came with them build-in.
they didn't finish "retro-fitting" toilets in recently. but we did have a new SNG design with a new toilet design. (i worked at the place where they referbish all the components.) in any case they finished several years ago.
@@Thom-TRA because i'm not a train nut. i just work for them at the components revision centre. i don't disassemble the trains. and NS doesn't treat their workers right. they work with temps. they have a 4 year cycle of 2 busy years. and 2 nothing to do years. they fire all the temps in the quiet years. so at most anyone you ask will only have worked there for 2 years. unless they are close to retirement and part of the old crew. wich is how i can be sure to say that they finished several years ago and not recently. because this happened since before i even started there. (more than 3 years ago) wich means it's NOT recent.
I really like the German terminology and service types. It’s almost universally used across the country and pretty easy to remember. For those who don’t know: We have - U-Bahn = Metro/Light Rail in cities - S-Bahn = Commuter Rail connecting cities and suburbs, typically red with a white stripe DB livery - Regionalbahn (RB) = like Stoptrein, also typically red and white - Regionalexpress (RE) = like Sprinters, also red and white - Intercity (IC) = the slower and worse long distance rail, but in DB long distance livery white with red stripe - Intercityexpress (ICE) = I guess I don’t need to explain those…
@@Thom-TRA True, especially the compartment cars on older IC rolling stock are so comfy if you don’t have to share your compartment with strangers. Although compared to ICEs the interior of those carriages is definitely showing its age.
Ahh, this is exactly why I thought they were called "Sprinters" -- they basically sprint from each small station to the next. And yes, I've enjoyed my two visits to NL and using the trains...although the visits were two decades apart. I like watching the Railcam Netherlands live-feed from Mierlo-Hout Helmond, since Sprinters stop at the small station on-camera, but the ICs just speed on through.
These used to be called stoptrein (stopping train), but they marketed it as sprinter. There is only a few stoptreinen left in the country, those are privatized trains not run by the NS. There used to be sneltrein which is in between an intercity and sprinter (stoptrein at the time), and intercity has always been called intercity.
@@hendman4083 except they are supposed to make a profit and have an executive board and a corporate structure much like any company. Until recently they didn’t even receive any subsidy. So not that much of a reach.
I think one reason for reducing the service types, is that most tracks are pretty much at their limit. More service types reduces how many of each type can ride on a certain track.
That would be a great argument if it were true. See, there might only be 2 service types on paper, but in reality there are still many service types. Sprinters that stop everywhere, sprinters that skip a few stations, slow intercities, fast intercities. So now you have a situation where the infrastructure is dealing with 4-5 service types, but passengers only see 2 confusing service types. They should have kept it at 3.
Hello Thom, I do not know if you are aware of this, however over here in Great Britain, we have the BREL Class 150 Sprinter DMU trains, the Metro Cammell Class 156 Super Sprinter DMU trains and the BREL Class 158 Express Sprinter DMU trains. Then there is the Class 153 Super Sprinter DMU train which used to be the Class 155 Super Sprinter DMU train, however most of the Class 155 were converted from two car units to single car units, hence the change from Class 155 to Class 153. There are seven Class 155 Super Sprinter DMU trains left and these can be found operating passenger services in Yorkshire. Best wishes and take care. Kind regards, Peter Skuce, St Albans. Hertfordshire. England.
Don’t forget that Switzerland has 5 different names for the sprinter service black S-Bahn, red S-Bahn, black Regio, red Regio and Regio Express. Red are train that skip a few stops compared to the other trains. They normally come with numbers after the type except if it is a train that only runs in the peak.
Oh, the NS corporate office in Utrecht is also pretty cool. It's a huge and beautiful 1920's office building called "the inkwell" and it has a fake flying saucer on it as an art installation.
Sprinter is a pretty common name for train stuff in general, here in Melbourne we have the Sprinter diesel railmotor, which isn't very fast, doesn't accelerate especially quickly, and often goes longer distance on the V/Line network, though the "Metro™" Stony Point line is actually a fairly short sprint, they do _blazing fast_ 30 minute headway in peak for 2 trains... only in the peak direction
We used to have 2 servicelevels: Stoptrein (stopped at every station along its route) and Intercity, which stopped only at certain major stations. Somewhere in the late 80s the ‘Sprinter’ was introduced. It is named like that because contrary to the Stoptrain, that took about as much time to reach topspeeds as an intercity, the Sprinter could reach top speed much quicker, making it more ideal for the short distances between stops. So, there you have it. A train that ‘sprints’ to its top speed: a ‘Sprinter’.
0% of this is accurate. There used to be 3 levels, “Stoptrein, Sneltrein, and Intercity.” Sprinter trains entered service in the 80s, but “Sprinter” as a category did not begin until 2006. Which you would know if you WATCHED THE VIDEO!
Thank you for the wonderful video! A future video on the RandstadRail and the conversion to tram-trains sounds very interesting, particularly as many cities throughout the world are building new tram networks that could perhaps become tram-train networks
in germany we have terms for like every type of service: Regionalbahn RB: Stopping train with very long distance S-Bahn: Stopping trains, often only used in big citys but Regional-Express RE: Basically a "Sneltrein" Regio-S-Bahn RS: i dont even know InterCity IC: Long Distance trains but also stopping at smaller stations like "[City]-Weststation" InterCityExpress ICE: Long Distance Trains with few stops, mostly only in main stations InterCityExpress-Sprinter ICE-Sprinter: ICE but it starts at one point, stops 1-2 times and then drives non stop to the destination which can be up to 5 hours
@@Thom-TRAI thought stoptreins were still a thing and sprinters would skip stations, so I was surprised that there now is only one type of local train. But as you explained near the end that non-NS operators have their own classifications I felt a little less dumb. Using the regional express RE18 between Aachen and Maastricht I'm pretty sure I heard announcements for stoptreins near Maastricht.
It's definitely true that the difference between services is not all that clear. Some intercities run like sprinters, stopping at every station. At the very least, the intercity to Vlissingen did until recently, when an actual sprinter service was added. One thing you didn't mention in the video was the intercity direct, which does run like a faster intercity. That being said, intercity direct only runs in a few places and sometimes runs the exact same route as the normal intercity does.
After my (very) short visit to Amsterdam Schiphol Airport on the way to my vacation to Barcelona, I’ve had a newfound fascination with the Dutch railway system.
I choose to ride the Sprinter for short journeys when visiting NL over the IC’s because I think it’s fun to make all the stops 😅 There’s not greater thrill than stopping at Krommenie-Assendelft or Gouda Goverwelle!
the term stoptrein is still used by NS when older intercity stock runs as stoptrein on sections like hoorn kersenboogerd-enkhuizen where they still call them either intercity(because after reaching hoorn station they switch to IC from stoptrein or stoptreinen altho its more because they cant run sprinters along the line together with IC so the IC has to serve all stations due to NS and these days prorail never bothering to double track the line to enkhuizen altho they did double track hoorn-hoorn kersenboogerd to make better use of the siding at kersenboogerd for turning around the sprinters without taking up space at hoorn
Quick correction, the NS has not always been a private company. The NS is what became after the rebranding of the SS (the StaatsSpoorwegen, not the other SS) and was a semi-governmental company and got completely privatised over the years 1995 to 2002. This is when they also stopped their freight services.
Not true. NS has always been a naamloze vennootschap, with 100% of shares owned by the government. What changed in 1995 is that NS Reizigers was founded, and the other tasks were given new companies. It is crazy to me how many people don’t know their history. Yet feel like they can correct me.
Originally the train types (diesel locs, diesel trains, electric locs and electric trains) had a different color each. Dark-green, a bit lighter green, grey, azure-blue, dark blue, light blue, red, brown, turquoise, lilac to indicate if they were diesel for passengers, diesel for freight, electric for passengers, electric for freight, if they were locs, a complete trainset or freight cars. Older trains would also have a 'moustache' like mat '54 aka 'Hondekop' (lit. doghead) or 'angel wings' like mat '36 aka 'Blauwe Engel' (lit. Blue Angel and a special one called 'The Camel'). If you want to see pictures, just search for the Dutch names: Mat '24/Blokkendoos, Mat '34, Mat '36/blauwe engel, De Kameel (which transported the rockband Queen at one time), mat '46/muizekop (lit. mouse head), mat '54/hondekop, mat '64/Apekop (lit. monkey head), NS 1000, NS 1100, NS 1200, NS 1300, NS 1500, NS 1600/1700/1800 (the original 1600's had the name of cities), NS 2400/2500 (there is a special one: 2530 which is called Bishop), NS 2200/2300. The NS 1400 exists only as a concept, it was never made. Then there was also the NS100/200/300 (locomotor) and NS 500/600/700 (the English class 08) nicknamed 'Hippel'.
It is called sprinter because it is lighter and faster than the stoptrein it replaced. Lighter means faster accelleration in both starting and stopping. It also means they are faster out of the way of intercities in places where there are no four parallel tracks.
Hoi Niels. Dacht je echt dat ik een vraag zou stellen, een 12-minuten-lange video zou maken, en de vraag niet zou beantwoorden? Kijk alsjeblieft tot het eind voordat je zelf antwoord geeft. En nog even inhoudelijk, de SGM was niet veel lichter dan de eerdere intercity treinen. En ze hebben niet meteen de stoptrein vervangen. De naam stoptrein verviel pas in 2011, 30 jaar na de eerste sprinter.
Recently, I was in an intercity train and we left the station more or less at the same time as a sprinter. The sprinter left first, but the intercity was quickly overtaking it. But then the sprinter came up to speed and clearly moved faster than the intercity. So it seems that the intercity got to mid speeds quicker, but then the sprinter either had a higher top speed or just reached the higher speeds faster. It wasn't at all what I had been expecting. I don't know if this was down to the capabilities of the trains. Both trains were making unplanned changes in their scheduling and the they had different destinations, so it might have been down to the track capabilities or just how the crew approached an unplanned situation...
Thank you so much for finally giving me confirmation! This always "annoyed" me. But my conclusion was the same reason stoplight became traffic lights. Speed cameras became safety cameras. The Dutch social security number used to be called sofi number (social fiscal) but needed to be changed for some reason. It is a number given to every citizen, let's call it a citizen number? No, that makes the citizens feel like a number. Let's add the word service. It is now called citizen service number or BSN (burger service number). Many people call it their BSN number and my autism really doesn't like that:-) BS number or BSN. (BSN bit is from Harry Jekkers). My mother in-law was in a committee that had a budget of over €200,000 to think of hew names for 10 things in the city, not the actual renaming, just to come up with names.
Thom I have a question, since you love buses and trains, you think you could do sun rail, the Miami Dade busway, and the metro mover? I would to see more Florida related content on this channel! I think it’s great to see our state on here!
you also have the ICD (intercity direct), normaly the dutch rails runs at max 140km/h but the ICD also goes on the high speed tracks at 160km/h on some parts of there line (the high seed track in the netherlands cant go up high at all i think the max for all trains is 200km/h cause the ground in the netherlands isnt fit for any higer speeds)
@@Thom-TRA do they also go 300 when they are on the ground in the netherlands or just when they are ontop off a bridge or in the ground. i know that the ground is weak here if you look at den haag going to leiden the rail moved a lot, there are also corners where you cant go the speed it was origanlly build for cause the rail moves more if you go faster. i know this because my dad drives for NS, he doesnt drive high speed tho but i tought there was a lower limed.
From 2002 to 2006 ÖBB had a train category "Sprinter" on some lines, with fewer stops than REX (Regionalexpress) and both first and second class. Since 2019, CJX (cityjet xpress) is something similar, though with no first class: Offering shorter travel times on select routes without the restrictions of intercity trains (bicycles must be reserved, some local tickets not valid). When NS introduced the doubledeck intercity trains in 1994 they were called DD-IRM (Dubbeldeks-Interregiomaterieel) and at some point there was a plan to run them as IR (Interregio) but that was never put into practice, they are almost always used as Intercity since their introduction. Food service only seems to be offered on international services such as ICE and Eurostar (ex Thalys). Even the Intercity Amsterdam - Berlin lost its Bistro car (too old even after numerous modernizations, though that will come back once it is converted to ICE L Talgo as planned). I'm skeptical about using trains indifferently for short and long distance connections. There are still different needs: Trains with many stops need a lot of doors and short ways from the entrance to the seat and back without any interior separation. Tables would just be in the way. When distances are longer and stops are less frequent, the number of doors is reduced and passengers are given more space instead, there are separations between the seating areas and entrance rooms, and seating comfort as well as amenities such as tables and electric charging plugs become more important. (And food service as well, be it in the form of dining cars, minibars or automatic food dispensers.) Technically for a train with a lot of stops acceleration is important (as already seen in the SGM trains which were a lot faster than the Mat54 and Mat64 units that dominated until then). For a longer distance train that's a little less important than maximum speed. But to go 200 km/h or faster you need a lot of power, airtight doors, enhanced braking systems, better aerodynamics ... Among Dutch trains the ICNG is the first that can go 200 and there aren't a lot of lines allowing that yet. I like that they keep the yellow accents in the livery but there should still be a distinction between fast and slow trains. In Germany that's very emphasized with most fast trains being white and most slow trains being red.
I thank you for this great video, giving deep insights into the dutch way of passenger railroad operations and their history, including those important informations like the invention of the "starre dienstregeling" with every-hour-on-the-same-minute departures. Even before "spoorslag 70" - when the trains changed their color to a bright yellow and beneath the timetables a lot of other things changed, there were some hourly services on a repeating schedule pattern introduced as early as in 1938 - but at first only on selected very important lines where electrification had taken place and the then new "stroomlijnmaterieel" was introduced. Please allow me one annotation about one of the historic trains shown in this video: The train at 4:35 is not a dutch one, but a german steam loco, operating at the Historische Eisenbahn in Frankfurt am Main, next to Eiserner Steg station.
I know it’s a German locomotive: I filmed it. But similar locomotives have run in the Netherlands and it was just b-roll. I only have so much steam footage.
sprinter is a really good name when you think about the passenger. sprinting is quickly traversing short distances. the sprinter is a perfect train for this. because there are many more of them. in the city i lived in. there was a sprinter train in the station about 4 times more often than there is an intercity. aside from that. there are multiple stations in the city. and only one of them the intercity stopped at. so we would take the sprinter to the main station and then get on the intercity from there. the sprinter is the sprinter because we used it to quickly get from our homes to the city centre. or to neighboring villages. it was much faster than taking the bus. or even the car.
@@Thom-TRA each stop is a short distance. what part of this aren't you getting? if you need to go the full route. did it ever occur to you to just use the goddamn intercity and only use the sprinter for the last bit?
@@darkracer1252 ik ben een Nederlander die jaren met IC en sprinter heeft gereisd. En ik accepteer niet dat je zo brutaal tegen me doet, dat is nergens voor nodig. Stel je vraag op een normale manier en dan kunnen we verder praten.
@@Thom-TRA de gene die de autist is. is de gene die denkt dat de maximum constructie snelheid hetzelfde is als de maximum toegestaande snelheid. of dat een van die twee hetzelfde is als de gemiddelde snelheid. die intercity is niet veel sneller dan de sprinter. het enige waar de intercity zijn "snelheid" vandaan krijgt is het overslaan van stations.
I love Sprinters. Every time I come to visit my friends in the Netherlands I love to ride one of these trains. Even if they stop at all stations in my opinion they look better than the old Intercity trains. Actually I think they have also upgraded the Intercity trains in the Netherlands but I have not yet ridden one of these new trains yet. So for now I prefer the way these trains look compare to the Intercity ones.
Thank you for mentioning the german system. I want to add a "few" things: It is kinda messy as well when you have systems with an S-Bahn, Regionalbahn and Regionalexpress, all doing basicly the same but slightly different. In Berlin it clear cut. S-Bahn has its own infractructure (build on the third rail system), Regionalbahnen link to the surrounding countryside and Regionalexpress connects cities that are farther away but still kinda in the same region. Then you go to Munich or Frankfurt where the S-Bahn is basicly a kind of Regionalbahn (using the same infrastructure and overhead wires like all other trains) and the Regionalbahnen behave like S-Bahnen or Regionalexpress sometimes. And that is just the local traffic. Which is usually done by by several companies within the Deutsche Bahn concern, which are themselves united (somehow) under the umbrella of a regional subcompany of the local traffic division of the DB, DB Regio) or even a private operator. Long distance trains are operated by whole separate company within Deutsche Bahn, DB Fernverkehr. At that is ignoring all the local public transport companies, owned by cities or counties, which are kinda linked as well.... It is a mess, escepially for foreigners... At least there is some kind of a unified fair structure in this whole mess and you can use the DB Navigator APP everywhere in germany. THOM, are the fair structures between NS and the private operators linked. Do you have something similar to the Deutschlandticket? Also, I am still stunned when you told as some videos ago that the Netherlands did not bother to open up the whole network, but only branch lines for local operators. While NS kept the mainlines. IMO that is not a fair competition.
The Dutch government actually has some major arguments with the European union about the fact they give most of the network to NS. Personally however, I don't know if it's a good idea to give more lines to other companies. NS now has a schedule that's very tightly packed, the transfer times are minimal and it's already so much work to make a nationwide schedule. If more lines are given to other companies, it will probably require more transfers when you make a trip and therefore more time. And the transfer times might get bigger when the companies compete for time slots. It can potentially reduce the costs if more companies compete, but that's never a guarantee. There are also arguments to nationalize the entire rail system.
Good video, but you forgot one unique train type the Netherlands has: The IntercityDirect. Which only has 4 major city stops: Amsterdam, Schiphol, Rotterdam and Breda. Which makes it a faster Intercity :)
I did not forget. It’s not relevant to this video, since it’s just a variation of an intercity. I also skipped ICE, Eurostar, etc. I’ve made several videos about Intercity Direct, maybe you should watch those.
I have a question concerning Dutch trains: As far as I know the maximum speed on standard tracks (non-high-speed tracks) in the Netherlands is 140km/h. Why exactly is that?
There's a number of reasons. First, distances between stations are generally pretty short. Second, not all trains have historically been capable of speeds above 140. But most importantly, in many places, the ground is too soft, where higher speeds would damage the tracks. The line between Zwolle and Lelystad, between Schiphol and Leiden, and between Amsterdam and Utrecht are designed for higher speeds, but domestic trains still only do 140.
@@frafraplanner9277 the safety system is also a large problem in addition to ground/infra in some places. A lot of lines can also support 160 but, the main safety system can only handle 140 (although the European system is being introduced allowing for higher speeds)
@@5mnz7fg And we are a really small country, if I go all the way from Groningen to Maastricht which is almost the longest possible route in the country from top to bottom its like max 4 hours Most trips of course much shorter. So no need for high speed trains. It makes sense in Germany France etc because they're much bigger.
Railway classifications are always tricky. Something that's happening your larger neighbor is IC services getting scrapped and replaced by ICE, all it does is water down the premium brands and leave you with two options: Always expensive but often not really fast and the other option is cheap but takes eons to get places. I'm a big fan of proper train classification tho, it beats systems like the UK where its just the 17:26 to Woolbridge-upon-River without any further information.
I've always thought of Sprinter as a British name, so I had to look it up. Turns out our first Sprinter (the class 150) was introduced in 1984, but the Dutch SGM has been around since 1975, so I guess we "stole" the term from the Dutch? Was the SGM the first ever Sprinter train internationally?
Aw Sprinter is in San Diego too but word on the street is that it isn't fast as expected too. That's what I heard from a friend. Also in France I think it's called TER and RER. Found out about the French stuff because I am 1. a diehard railfan 2. Other train TH-camrs talk about it.
I agree that merging the sneltrein and intercity is a shame, and I would add that removing the distinctive looks of sprinters is a detriment to travelers as well. Having a distinct look really helps you know what type of train you're about to board
1:00 Thats quite a lucky fetch. Most of the times, you don't see CP 2600's running IC trains. Then again, that might be the Interregional train from Figueira da Foz/Porto-São Bento to Valença, in that case it would be quite common seeing that they are the only locomotive that runs that service.
Regional Bahn stop everywhere and might go shorter routes. Like the RMV RB51 Frankfurt to Wächtersbach. RB51 is the same trainset, which serves the RegionalExpress RE50 from Frankfurt to Fulda. Same Dosto bilevel trains. But the smaller stops like Wirtsheim and Hanau Wolfgang are left out here. In Europe, the train categories are regulated and harmonized by CIV rules.
I find it a shame that we might be losing the difference between Sprinter and Intercity train liveries. Besides the fact that I abhor the "Flow" livery, the colours of the Sprinter make our rail network a bit more colourful! On the other hand I prefer the older stoptrein livery of the Plan V and Mat '54 over the Sprinter livery, even though back in the 80s and 90s all NS trains were "Yellow with some shade of blue"... It's difficult to pick a side for me😂
Holy crap you might be onto something. I wonder if the guy who made the video knows this. Why don’t we watch the video and actually see for ourselves??
Very good explanation. NS has ordered new trains from CAF. These trains are combined single and double decker trains like the German Siemens Desiro HC. The trains would fit the new NS strategy perfect.
@@Thom-TRA When they are as good as the Desiro HC, then NS would have a pretty impressive new train. Living near Herzogenrath station i have some experience with the RRX Desiro HC trainsets and i find them very comfortable.
Half of the Intercity trains in Zeeland only stop at Goes and Middelburg. Plus, if you watched the rest of the video, you would know how I feel about slow intercities like the one in Zeeland.
I'm surprised that my town has NO sprinter at all. (Just like you said in the video) And I'm surprised that it can be faster at routes to use the sprinter instead of the intercity. I miss the sprinter in my town. I only see ONE type of train. I like to see more difference in trains here. Not only the VIRMm
Hold on, you missed something. The slowest type of train in The Netherlands is called the 'Stoptrein'. A Stoptrein stops at every station. Then there is the Sprinter, which skips certain stations, but will still stop at the more popular smaller stations. Lastly there is the Intercity, which only stops at the most important stations. Sprinting is indeed a fast activity, but it also suggests a short activity. So a sprinter is for short-distance fast travel. If you travel long distance, you would be looking at a marathon... though we don't have a train named after that, which is probably where the confusion comes from! EDIT: NEVERMIND, apparently the NS phased out the term Stoptrein entirely... though unlike a Stoptrein, a Sprinter CAN skip many smaller stations... Why did the NS do this lol. Good video. Even this Dutchie learned something new...
Kinda funny take on the Dutch Sprinter. Absolutely agree on the fact that the abolishment of the ‘sneltrein’ by NS is indeed a bad move. Let’s say that this policy definitely doesn’t increase the ‘sprinting’ capacity of the Dutch railways. On sprinting in to action trains; most metro systems operate with a ‘bump track design’ for station locations. This means an arriving train will be able to brake more efficiently at higher entrance speed, whilst at departing from the station the small dip in the track geometry will bring the train back to normal speed quicker. As far as I’m aware this kind of track arrangement wasn’t possible on all Zoetermeerlijn and Hofpleinlijn stations. This also for the very short distance of travel between station stops. Hence the NS was incentivized to come up with a solution, which indeed led to the SGM. It’s kinda silly the initial lines the Sprinters were designed for, are now operated by a dedicated metro system. Whilst on the other hand the name Sprinter stuck to the NS local services. Interspersing Intercity and Sprinter traffic has been convenient for NS to take pressure away from its large transit hubs. Hence, Intercity trains can often be found at terminals that wouldn’t necessarily need Intercity service. This led and still leads to a significant devaluation of Intercity transit, where these dedicated trains follow local routes in combined service until they end up at their first hub, from where these trains then start their true Intercity service. An absolute lack of passing sidings makes it almost impossible to up the service speed Intercity traffic on the local feeds to Intercity hubs. Cheerio
yo Stoptrein and Sneltrein arnt used by dutch comapny's anymore its now only RE, RS, and IC (IC is only Keolis) all stoppings trains to Belgium use still stoptrein and the line form Enschede to Gronau in Westfalen also uses stoptrein
The reason for the downgrading of the IC type is basically that they needed to increase frequencies on a lot of routes, and having three train types (with some even faster services) would mean extra infrastructure. That infrastructure unfortunately ain't coming any time soon.
That doesn’t make sense. There are still multiple train types. They just call them all Intercity or Sprinter. So clearly the infrastructure allows for multiple service types.
@@Thom-TRA Nah. Look at stopping patterns such as The Hague -> Utrecht. None of the ICs are stopping in Zoetermeer anymore (whereas the Sneltrein did). There's a lot of examples like that, just compare the with-sneltrein timetable to the one where it got cancelled. Most of the Sneltreinen got removed around 2006-2007, with the last one indeed going later. The combination of PHS (project high frequent railways) with having more train types just didn't fit. The extra overtakes on a lot of routes would be awkward, unreliable, or plainly miss infrastructure. On some routes the Sneltrein got removed, and the Intercity remained (such as The Hague -> Utrecht, but also Utrecht -> Eindhoven), whereas on other parts the Intercity got removed and the Sneltrein renamed to IC (eg. Rotterdam -> Amsterdam old route). Except for a rare few cases, most ICs on the same route run the same stopping pattern. This lowers the number of overtakes required. An example of a Sneltrein of the old type that got cancelled is the old Sneltrein Den Haag/Rotterdam -> Arnhem -> Nijmegen, which made a transfer necessary for all passengers, and two transfers for select routes (eg. Zoetermeer -> Arnhem) if you want the fastest route.
@@Thom-TRA Of that list, around half is fair. Of that list, only Laan van NOI, Schiedam C, Blaak, Woerden are really fair. De Klomp & Driebergen-Zeist just get skip-stop service (both being sprinter stations with IC services), Sloterdijk has all IC's stopping there, only getting skipped by Intercity Direct (different train type). Bijlmer-Arena is again Skip-stop with Amstel. Sure, there's a couple of trains that do weird stuff (like everywhere in the world), but there's wayy less of that than in earlier timetables (and among the lowest irregularity of any European country). The fact that they even put on the sign "Stopt niet op hollandse rading" says a lot about the level of consistency NS expects the trains to have.
@@nanderv way more than half those are fair. Did you just skip over the sprinter stations that are skipped by sprinters? I think all of them are fair, that’s why I chose them. And skip-stop is still a type of different service patterns. But regardless, that list is long enough to invalidate what you are saying. The truth is, NS could switch over to 3 services today without making a single change to the schedule. The slow ICs Schiphol-Dordrecht-(Vlissingen) or Leiden-Utrecht should not be called IC. The fast sprinter Utrecht-Almere should not be called Sprinter. There should be a third category, because there are too many “exceptions.”
Kinda sad you didnt mention the fact that Germany uses the term Sprinter too. But if they use that term for ICE's it means that its a even faster service than the ICE, If you catch a Sprinter inbetween Berlin and Munich you will only make 2-4 intermediate stops **AND** hit 300kph
@@Thom-TRA They use ICE Sprinter as a category of trains So you'd have RB RE IRE IC ICE ICE Sprinter You could have mentioned the ICE Sprinter category compared to NS Sprinter saying that in this context it would be complete opposite ends of the spectrum. NS Sprinter being the slowest category while ICE Sprinter is the fastest category of trains
Arriva uses the word Sneltrein on some routes. So the three name system is still around and kicking in the regional game, as a lot of routes in the north (Friesland, Groningen), east (Drenthe, Overijssel) and southeast (Limburg) have routes that feature a train that stops everywhere, so a Stoptrein, and a train that doesnt stop at the small village stations but does at towns, but would be weird to call it Intercity as it stops at a lot of what arent cities and more big villages/towns. InterCity isnt used as much by regional operators as they mostly operate smaller routes, but Keolis (Blauwnet) uses it on Enschede-Zwolle. Arriva and Keolis also introduced the two letter + two number system that Germany also has, but with RS (Regionale Stoptrein), RE (Regionale Expresstrein, so confusingly, thats Sneltrein) and IC (InterCity) Adding a bit more confusion to the mix, Blauwnet seems to be unsure if RS means Regionale Stoptrein or Regionale Sprinter. The NS app says Blauwnet Sprinter. Edit: on that last one, seems the inconsistency is partially Keolis? RS23 Zwolle-Enschede and RS22 Zwolle-Kampen are called Sprinter, all others Stoptrein. However, Keolis used to operate RS20 Oldenzaal-Zutphen, which they always called Stoptrein... is the criteria diesel? Im going crazy here
@@Thom-TRAYeah i did, just felt like it could perhaps used a bit more then a brief mention (great video however, ive heard of more foreigners that the term Sprinter feels weird to them whilst NL is used to it), though regional operators use the terms in a bit weird way sometimes so thats why i wrote that up and... rambled on for too long
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Honestly Thom you should become an actor. It's the type of transit content I never knew I needed. But it's fantastic 🤩
I’ll let you be my agent! It’s a partnership destined to succeed
@@Thom-TRA Deal. 50/50 split 😘
@@NonstopEurotripyou’ve hit the MOTHERLODE!
@NonstopEurotrip i agree with tom that the sprinter category is confusing
Sprinter: short distance, fast pace (compare pacers in the UK) usually light(er)weight stock with high accelleration..
Heard about the Pacers, rode one in 2017. Pretty terrible from my POV
@@CupertinorailThey replaced the class 101’s and similar though later latter hung about till 2003 having been built as early as 1956. I went on the very last one in service in 2003 though some are now on private heritage railways just like the pacers.
In Germany a Sprinter is literally the fastest train out there. For example nonstop from Cologne to Berlin with an ICE.
In the USA, we have Stucktrains, Oldtrains, and Randomtrains.
Yes we do
You forgot the most important category. Notrains.
Good one!
Also twomilelongfreighttrainsthatdontfitinthepassingloops
And, of course, Kaboomtrains.
10:40 I feel so sorry for her, happened a lot to me as well...
And then DB realized that you can't make every intercity train an ICE without devaluing the brand, so they invented the ICE Sprinter. Basically NS has slow Sprinters and DB has fast Sprinters.
I’ve always thought the ICE Sprinter was funny knowing what sprinter means in the neighborhood country
That has to be confusing when interlining cross border service...
And that maybe explains European cross-border rail service...
The ICE sprinter does not go to the Netherlands. And no Dutch "Sprinter" goes international. @@PrograError
I’ve never been to the Netherlands yet but I’m happy that NS decided to keep the iconic navy and yellow livery. When I think of Dutch trains a big yellow VIRM speeding past tulips fields and windmills is what automatically pops into my head.
I remember landing at Schiphol after a journey to the USA. At the landing approach I saw yellow doubledeck trains among the fields of flowers and vegetables and knew immediately I am in the right country.
@@295g295 If you mean Norfolk Southern. It would be fun if NS and NS did a swap of liveries on a few units. As CP and CP almost did at some point in the past, using the same orange/red with white striped front ends.
@@295g295 Comboios de Portugal (CP), the Portuguese state railway operator.
@@295g295 Comboios de Portugal
Good example from the area I grew up in southern Germany: my city was roughly an hour from the next greater city. Both cities were linked by an Interstate Highway and a double tracked electrified main line from the railroad. All kinds of passenger and freight trains used that line, and although the high-speed trains weren't going at high speed, they were still faster:
- ICE = Inter City Express, a high-speed long distance train which goes directly from central station to central station without stopping in between. Took roughly 55 minutes.
- IC = Inter City, still a high-speed long distance train. It stops only once at the largest town between both cities, roughly two thirds down the line. Took maybe 58 minutes
- RE = Regional Express, a train serving a greater regional area. It stops 3 times between both cities, serving the largest town and some large villages. Travel time 1 hour 2 minutes
- RB = Regional Train, a train serving a smaller regional area. It stops at each and every station along the line, in every small village, adding up to 11 stops. However that train doesn't even go all the way to the other large city, but only to that town two thirds down the line. In that town you have to get off the regional train and get onto the commuter train
- S-Bahn = commuter train, a local train serving a greater metro area of the largest cities. They stop at each and every station just like regional trains, but they run on a much tighter schedule. Travel time of regional train + commuter train: 1 hour 32 minutes
Darf ich fragen wo das war?
Ich komm irgendwie nicht drauf....
@@RonnieOP Regensburg - Nürnberg
@@EnjoyFirefighting Danke
Haben ICs früher Mal in Neumarkt gehalten?
Mir wäre das nämlich nicht bekannt
@@RonnieOP ja die IC haben immer in Neumarkt gehalten
This is not the only slow Sprinter. Sprinter is also some Siemens Desiro trains in California and Sprinter is also a locomotive that hauls Amtrak trains that are not as fast as Acela
True, though the locomotives you are talking about are called the "Cities Sprinter"
Or the old class 150s in the UK that probably are due for the scrapyard?
I love their rail transportation. They have a couple of guys that have channels and do cab rides.
Sadly Dutch trains don't have cab windows for passengers like other countries do, so these cab ride channels are great!
The version I remember was that the NS thought 'stopping train' sounded to negative, and too easy to make jokes off as they were having serious problems getting their trains to run on time or even to run at all. So they came up with a less negative name and chose sprinter.
Sprinters were known for not having toilets on board. When the NS decided to pull the original sprinters off their commuter / metro routes, and onto longer distance routes, that started to give problems. Yes subways and trams don't have toilets, but you're generally only on them for half an hour max. But the new routes, some people rode from start to finish so were sometimes on the train for an hour or longer. The conducter ended up having a stash of plastic bags so passenger could do an emergency bio-stop on those routes in the conductor's room...
I think they just finished retro-fitting in toilets on all the sprinter trains that came without them, and the new version came with them build-in.
I’ve never heard any of those stories before
@@Thom-TRA
who would talk about them. it's just something they expect everyone to just remember.
they didn't finish "retro-fitting" toilets in recently. but we did have a new SNG design with a new toilet design. (i worked at the place where they referbish all the components.)
in any case they finished several years ago.
@@darkracer1252 SLT was retrofitted with toilets. How you don’t remember that, I don’t know.
@@Thom-TRA
because i'm not a train nut. i just work for them at the components revision centre. i don't disassemble the trains.
and NS doesn't treat their workers right. they work with temps. they have a 4 year cycle of 2 busy years. and 2 nothing to do years.
they fire all the temps in the quiet years. so at most anyone you ask will only have worked there for 2 years. unless they are close to retirement and part of the old crew.
wich is how i can be sure to say that they finished several years ago and not recently.
because this happened since before i even started there. (more than 3 years ago) wich means it's NOT recent.
I really like the German terminology and service types. It’s almost universally used across the country and pretty easy to remember. For those who don’t know: We have
- U-Bahn = Metro/Light Rail in cities
- S-Bahn = Commuter Rail connecting cities and suburbs, typically red with a white stripe DB livery
- Regionalbahn (RB) = like Stoptrein, also typically red and white
- Regionalexpress (RE) = like Sprinters, also red and white
- Intercity (IC) = the slower and worse long distance rail, but in DB long distance livery white with red stripe
- Intercityexpress (ICE) = I guess I don’t need to explain those…
I have to say the seats on the loco-hauled DB intercities and on the ICEs are very comfortable
@@Thom-TRA True, especially the compartment cars on older IC rolling stock are so comfy if you don’t have to share your compartment with strangers. Although compared to ICEs the interior of those carriages is definitely showing its age.
Ahh, this is exactly why I thought they were called "Sprinters" -- they basically sprint from each small station to the next. And yes, I've enjoyed my two visits to NL and using the trains...although the visits were two decades apart.
I like watching the Railcam Netherlands live-feed from Mierlo-Hout Helmond, since Sprinters stop at the small station on-camera, but the ICs just speed on through.
Honestly both the official version and Thom’s version of the Sprinter sound logical in my mind. Great Work Thom!
Thank you!
The SGM is such a sweet sprinter!!! Thanks for explaining this awesome transit system to all of us!!!
I miss them. I disliked them as a teenager because they were so old, but now they’re gone, I realize I miss them…
I'd love to see a video on Randstadrail!
Noted!
RM Transit made a video about the Rotterdam transit Systems, in wich he mentioned Randstad rail. Maybe you can add something to that
@@georgobergfell with the advantage that I am actually from the area and can make a video based on my experience
1:16 De brug bij Zutphen herken ik direct, ik kom daar zo vaak langs
Well Pacers don't exactly keep up to pace either.
Good point
Even in the UK they call their DMUs for regional (yes, regional not intercity) services Sprinters
These used to be called stoptrein (stopping train), but they marketed it as sprinter. There is only a few stoptreinen left in the country, those are privatized trains not run by the NS. There used to be sneltrein which is in between an intercity and sprinter (stoptrein at the time), and intercity has always been called intercity.
Thanks for repeating everything I say in the video.
Two things:
NS is also private.
Intercity didn’t exist before 1970.
With the government owning 100% of the shares, the term "private" seems a bit of a reach. 😂
@@hendman4083 except they are supposed to make a profit and have an executive board and a corporate structure much like any company. Until recently they didn’t even receive any subsidy.
So not that much of a reach.
When I was in England, they had stopping trains and fast trains. Express trains to them sounded like trains that carried freight in baggage cars.
Great job and analysis, Thom!
Thanks!
I think one reason for reducing the service types, is that most tracks are pretty much at their limit. More service types reduces how many of each type can ride on a certain track.
That would be a great argument if it were true.
See, there might only be 2 service types on paper, but in reality there are still many service types. Sprinters that stop everywhere, sprinters that skip a few stations, slow intercities, fast intercities. So now you have a situation where the infrastructure is dealing with 4-5 service types, but passengers only see 2 confusing service types.
They should have kept it at 3.
Here I am thinking that you were going to talk about the Sprinter in San Diego LMAO.
Someday
Hello Thom, I do not know if you are aware of this, however over here in Great Britain, we have the BREL Class 150 Sprinter DMU trains, the Metro Cammell Class 156 Super Sprinter DMU trains and the BREL Class 158 Express Sprinter DMU trains. Then there is the Class 153 Super Sprinter DMU train which used to be the Class 155 Super Sprinter DMU train, however most of the Class 155 were converted from two car units to single car units, hence the change from Class 155 to Class 153. There are seven Class 155 Super Sprinter DMU trains left and these can be found operating passenger services in Yorkshire.
Best wishes and take care. Kind regards, Peter Skuce, St Albans. Hertfordshire. England.
Yes, I have heard of the British sprinters!
I should have mentioned that all of these Sprinter trains were new to British Rail's Regional Railways sector.
Sprinter as opposed to cycling or walking
Don’t forget that Switzerland has 5 different names for the sprinter service black S-Bahn, red S-Bahn, black Regio, red Regio and Regio Express. Red are train that skip a few stops compared to the other trains. They normally come with numbers after the type except if it is a train that only runs in the peak.
Oh, the NS corporate office in Utrecht is also pretty cool. It's a huge and beautiful 1920's office building called "the inkwell" and it has a fake flying saucer on it as an art installation.
That’s ProRail.
Not anymore. Its just behind the Inktpot, the silver tower, former HGB4.
Sprinter is a pretty common name for train stuff in general, here in Melbourne we have the Sprinter diesel railmotor, which isn't very fast, doesn't accelerate especially quickly, and often goes longer distance on the V/Line network, though the "Metro™" Stony Point line is actually a fairly short sprint, they do _blazing fast_ 30 minute headway in peak
for 2 trains... only in the peak direction
I've taken a Sprinter filling in as a Intercity twice now.
Utrecht to Rotterdam a few weeks ago was the 2nd time.
Humming along at 140mh!
That was my old commute! Can’t believe they do that there now.
We used to have 2 servicelevels: Stoptrein (stopped at every station along its route) and Intercity, which stopped only at certain major stations. Somewhere in the late 80s the ‘Sprinter’ was introduced. It is named like that because contrary to the Stoptrain, that took about as much time to reach topspeeds as an intercity, the Sprinter could reach top speed much quicker, making it more ideal for the short distances between stops. So, there you have it. A train that ‘sprints’ to its top speed: a ‘Sprinter’.
0% of this is accurate. There used to be 3 levels, “Stoptrein, Sneltrein, and Intercity.” Sprinter trains entered service in the 80s, but “Sprinter” as a category did not begin until 2006.
Which you would know if you WATCHED THE VIDEO!
Thank you for the wonderful video! A future video on the RandstadRail and the conversion to tram-trains sounds very interesting, particularly as many cities throughout the world are building new tram networks that could perhaps become tram-train networks
The verdict is in: the people want a Randstadrail vid.
Nowadays you see these trains all over the place. A sprinter train on an intercity service or vice versa 😅
in germany we have terms for like every type of service:
Regionalbahn RB: Stopping train with very long distance
S-Bahn: Stopping trains, often only used in big citys but
Regional-Express RE: Basically a "Sneltrein"
Regio-S-Bahn RS: i dont even know
InterCity IC: Long Distance trains but also stopping at smaller stations like "[City]-Weststation"
InterCityExpress ICE: Long Distance Trains with few stops, mostly only in main stations
InterCityExpress-Sprinter ICE-Sprinter: ICE but it starts at one point, stops 1-2 times and then drives non stop to the destination which can be up to 5 hours
As an occasional user of trains in the Netherlands I obviously had some misconceptions about the train types. Thanks for clearing this up.
You're welcome! What part is clearer now?
@@Thom-TRAI thought stoptreins were still a thing and sprinters would skip stations, so I was surprised that there now is only one type of local train. But as you explained near the end that non-NS operators have their own classifications I felt a little less dumb. Using the regional express RE18 between Aachen and Maastricht I'm pretty sure I heard announcements for stoptreins near Maastricht.
Ik heb een nieuw favoriet “kijken tot 4 uur sochtends” kanaal gevonden denk ik
Kijk, dat horen we graag. Slaap lekker!
I literally thought this was a video about the San Diego Sprinter train
Except of course the picture on the thumbnail
It's definitely true that the difference between services is not all that clear. Some intercities run like sprinters, stopping at every station. At the very least, the intercity to Vlissingen did until recently, when an actual sprinter service was added. One thing you didn't mention in the video was the intercity direct, which does run like a faster intercity. That being said, intercity direct only runs in a few places and sometimes runs the exact same route as the normal intercity does.
Intercity direct didn’t really feel relevant here since it’s basically just the branding of one service and I’ve already made so many videos about ICD
As someone who has worked in the depicted HQ - quite accurate! ;)
Hahaha no offense!
After my (very) short visit to Amsterdam Schiphol Airport on the way to my vacation to Barcelona, I’ve had a newfound fascination with the Dutch railway system.
Definitely come back!
I choose to ride the Sprinter for short journeys when visiting NL over the IC’s because I think it’s fun to make all the stops 😅
There’s not greater thrill than stopping at Krommenie-Assendelft or Gouda Goverwelle!
Or De Vink or Lansingerland-Zoetermeer or Twello 😂
@@Thom-TRA I changed for the better when Halfweg-Zwanenburg came into my life. Those woonbootjes in the Zijkanaal were top tier
id love to see a video ab the Rotterdam metro that was sent to the Hauge, kinda of crazy a metro runs thru farmland.
That can be arranged
the term stoptrein is still used by NS when older intercity stock runs as stoptrein on sections like hoorn kersenboogerd-enkhuizen where they still call them either intercity(because after reaching hoorn station they switch to IC from stoptrein or stoptreinen
altho its more because they cant run sprinters along the line together with IC so the IC has to serve all stations due to NS and these days prorail never bothering to double track the line to enkhuizen altho they did double track hoorn-hoorn kersenboogerd to make better use of the siding at kersenboogerd for turning around the sprinters without taking up space at hoorn
No, NS does not use the word stoptrein anymore. Even when they stop everywhere, those trains are called Intercity.
Sadly that’s the case for LA A and E lines. They’re very slow and stop for tens of stations. Why no express trains in LA? So sad!
Probably no passing tracks
Today i realized that i am old enough to remmember our trains rocking Adidas stripes, and damn i feel nostalgic and old now.
I’m old enough to remember the stripes too!
Quick correction, the NS has not always been a private company. The NS is what became after the rebranding of the SS (the StaatsSpoorwegen, not the other SS) and was a semi-governmental company and got completely privatised over the years 1995 to 2002. This is when they also stopped their freight services.
Not true. NS has always been a naamloze vennootschap, with 100% of shares owned by the government. What changed in 1995 is that NS Reizigers was founded, and the other tasks were given new companies.
It is crazy to me how many people don’t know their history. Yet feel like they can correct me.
Also NS is not a rebranding of SS, it’s when SS, HIJSM, and some other companies merged into a new company.
LOVE the history you include!
Originally the train types (diesel locs, diesel trains, electric locs and electric trains) had a different color each. Dark-green, a bit lighter green, grey, azure-blue, dark blue, light blue, red, brown, turquoise, lilac to indicate if they were diesel for passengers, diesel for freight, electric for passengers, electric for freight, if they were locs, a complete trainset or freight cars. Older trains would also have a 'moustache' like mat '54 aka 'Hondekop' (lit. doghead) or 'angel wings' like mat '36 aka 'Blauwe Engel' (lit. Blue Angel and a special one called 'The Camel'). If you want to see pictures, just search for the Dutch names: Mat '24/Blokkendoos, Mat '34, Mat '36/blauwe engel, De Kameel (which transported the rockband Queen at one time), mat '46/muizekop (lit. mouse head), mat '54/hondekop, mat '64/Apekop (lit. monkey head), NS 1000, NS 1100, NS 1200, NS 1300, NS 1500, NS 1600/1700/1800 (the original 1600's had the name of cities), NS 2400/2500 (there is a special one: 2530 which is called Bishop), NS 2200/2300. The NS 1400 exists only as a concept, it was never made. Then there was also the NS100/200/300 (locomotor) and NS 500/600/700 (the English class 08) nicknamed 'Hippel'.
NS had inderdaad heel veel mooi oud materieel! Ik heb een keer ooit de Kameel langs zien rijden, in Leiden.
to be fair, the UK also has sprinters operating on regional services (classes 150 through 159)
It is called sprinter because it is lighter and faster than the stoptrein it replaced. Lighter means faster accelleration in both starting and stopping. It also means they are faster out of the way of intercities in places where there are no four parallel tracks.
Hoi Niels. Dacht je echt dat ik een vraag zou stellen, een 12-minuten-lange video zou maken, en de vraag niet zou beantwoorden? Kijk alsjeblieft tot het eind voordat je zelf antwoord geeft.
En nog even inhoudelijk, de SGM was niet veel lichter dan de eerdere intercity treinen. En ze hebben niet meteen de stoptrein vervangen. De naam stoptrein verviel pas in 2011, 30 jaar na de eerste sprinter.
Well the b roll at 4:36 is definitely not from the Netherlands, this in Frankfurt Germany in front of the Eisener Steg.
Indeed, it's the harbour line along the Main.
Recently, I was in an intercity train and we left the station more or less at the same time as a sprinter. The sprinter left first, but the intercity was quickly overtaking it. But then the sprinter came up to speed and clearly moved faster than the intercity.
So it seems that the intercity got to mid speeds quicker, but then the sprinter either had a higher top speed or just reached the higher speeds faster. It wasn't at all what I had been expecting.
I don't know if this was down to the capabilities of the trains. Both trains were making unplanned changes in their scheduling and the they had different destinations, so it might have been down to the track capabilities or just how the crew approached an unplanned situation...
@5:33 this dude used some footage from madurodam. Respect.
Was my most-watched video for many years
You kind of did forget 1 service. The intercity direct. Functioning as a the old intercity/super express on some routes.
I didn’t forget. I left it out on purpose. It’s totally irrelevant to this video and I’ve already made many videos about ICD.
Thank you so much for finally giving me confirmation! This always "annoyed" me. But my conclusion was the same reason stoplight became traffic lights. Speed cameras became safety cameras. The Dutch social security number used to be called sofi number (social fiscal) but needed to be changed for some reason. It is a number given to every citizen, let's call it a citizen number? No, that makes the citizens feel like a number. Let's add the word service. It is now called citizen service number or BSN (burger service number). Many people call it their BSN number and my autism really doesn't like that:-) BS number or BSN. (BSN bit is from Harry Jekkers). My mother in-law was in a committee that had a budget of over €200,000 to think of hew names for 10 things in the city, not the actual renaming, just to come up with names.
Thom I have a question, since you love buses and trains, you think you could do sun rail, the Miami Dade busway, and the metro mover? I would to see more Florida related content on this channel! I think it’s great to see our state on here!
I don’t love traveling to Florida, but I have uploaded a TriRail video just recently, so maybe check that out.
Ok
I fele for that woman around the 10 min mark.. happens so much :P oh and the transition to explain sprinter was so well done!
Thank you! And she seemed to have a good attitude
With buses limited stop ones often have an X for express in front of the number ie/X10 but occasionally you see it the other way around ie/22X.
Wearing a jacket you kinda look like Dave Foley from the Canadian comic troupe/ TV show "The Kids In The Hall"
I guess I'll have to look them up
you also have the ICD (intercity direct), normaly the dutch rails runs at max 140km/h but the ICD also goes on the high speed tracks at 160km/h on some parts of there line (the high seed track in the netherlands cant go up high at all i think the max for all trains is 200km/h cause the ground in the netherlands isnt fit for any higer speeds)
Nope, Eurostar trains go 300 km/h. And Intercity Direct is just a rebranding to make people forget all the negative feelings about the Fyra.
@@Thom-TRA do they also go 300 when they are on the ground in the netherlands or just when they are ontop off a bridge or in the ground. i know that the ground is weak here if you look at den haag going to leiden the rail moved a lot, there are also corners where you cant go the speed it was origanlly build for cause the rail moves more if you go faster. i know this because my dad drives for NS, he doesnt drive high speed tho but i tought there was a lower limed.
@@JelleCraftYT yeah the ground is very weak. They have to rebuild a lot of the HSL because of that, you’re right.
The class 150 stopping trains were called "Sprinters" by British Rail...
It’s a common name!
From 2002 to 2006 ÖBB had a train category "Sprinter" on some lines, with fewer stops than REX (Regionalexpress) and both first and second class.
Since 2019, CJX (cityjet xpress) is something similar, though with no first class: Offering shorter travel times on select routes without the restrictions of intercity trains (bicycles must be reserved, some local tickets not valid).
When NS introduced the doubledeck intercity trains in 1994 they were called DD-IRM (Dubbeldeks-Interregiomaterieel) and at some point there was a plan to run them as IR (Interregio) but that was never put into practice, they are almost always used as Intercity since their introduction.
Food service only seems to be offered on international services such as ICE and Eurostar (ex Thalys). Even the Intercity Amsterdam - Berlin lost its Bistro car (too old even after numerous modernizations, though that will come back once it is converted to ICE L Talgo as planned).
I'm skeptical about using trains indifferently for short and long distance connections. There are still different needs: Trains with many stops need a lot of doors and short ways from the entrance to the seat and back without any interior separation. Tables would just be in the way. When distances are longer and stops are less frequent, the number of doors is reduced and passengers are given more space instead, there are separations between the seating areas and entrance rooms, and seating comfort as well as amenities such as tables and electric charging plugs become more important. (And food service as well, be it in the form of dining cars, minibars or automatic food dispensers.)
Technically for a train with a lot of stops acceleration is important (as already seen in the SGM trains which were a lot faster than the Mat54 and Mat64 units that dominated until then). For a longer distance train that's a little less important than maximum speed. But to go 200 km/h or faster you need a lot of power, airtight doors, enhanced braking systems, better aerodynamics ... Among Dutch trains the ICNG is the first that can go 200 and there aren't a lot of lines allowing that yet.
I like that they keep the yellow accents in the livery but there should still be a distinction between fast and slow trains. In Germany that's very emphasized with most fast trains being white and most slow trains being red.
I didn’t even know about the ÖBB Sprinters!
I thank you for this great video, giving deep insights into the dutch way of passenger railroad operations and their history, including those important informations like the invention of the "starre dienstregeling" with every-hour-on-the-same-minute departures. Even before "spoorslag 70" - when the trains changed their color to a bright yellow and beneath the timetables a lot of other things changed, there were some hourly services on a repeating schedule pattern introduced as early as in 1938 - but at first only on selected very important lines where electrification had taken place and the then new "stroomlijnmaterieel" was introduced.
Please allow me one annotation about one of the historic trains shown in this video: The train at 4:35 is not a dutch one, but a german steam loco, operating at the Historische Eisenbahn in Frankfurt am Main, next to Eiserner Steg station.
I know it’s a German locomotive: I filmed it. But similar locomotives have run in the Netherlands and it was just b-roll. I only have so much steam footage.
When i saw Sprinter, i thought this was going to be a video of San Diego's north county transit train that goes from Oceanside to Escondido
You’re not the first
sprinter is a really good name when you think about the passenger.
sprinting is quickly traversing short distances.
the sprinter is a perfect train for this. because there are many more of them.
in the city i lived in. there was a sprinter train in the station about 4 times more often than there is an intercity.
aside from that. there are multiple stations in the city. and only one of them the intercity stopped at.
so we would take the sprinter to the main station and then get on the intercity from there.
the sprinter is the sprinter because we used it to quickly get from our homes to the city centre.
or to neighboring villages.
it was much faster than taking the bus. or even the car.
It makes sense for rolling stock but not as much for a train service. Or do you consider Zwolle-Meppel or Purmerend-Hoorn a short distance?
@@Thom-TRA
each stop is a short distance.
what part of this aren't you getting?
if you need to go the full route. did it ever occur to you to just use the goddamn intercity and only use the sprinter for the last bit?
@@darkracer1252 ik ben een Nederlander die jaren met IC en sprinter heeft gereisd. En ik accepteer niet dat je zo brutaal tegen me doet, dat is nergens voor nodig. Stel je vraag op een normale manier en dan kunnen we verder praten.
Wat een kinderachtig gedrag 😂 het is wel duidelijk wie de autist is. Als ik onder een trein beland, zie ik je in de hel. Goed?
@@Thom-TRA
de gene die de autist is. is de gene die denkt dat de maximum constructie snelheid hetzelfde is als de maximum toegestaande snelheid.
of dat een van die twee hetzelfde is als de gemiddelde snelheid.
die intercity is niet veel sneller dan de sprinter.
het enige waar de intercity zijn "snelheid" vandaan krijgt is het overslaan van stations.
I love Sprinters. Every time I come to visit my friends in the Netherlands I love to ride one of these trains. Even if they stop at all stations in my opinion they look better than the old Intercity trains. Actually I think they have also upgraded the Intercity trains in the Netherlands but I have not yet ridden one of these new trains yet. So for now I prefer the way these trains look compare to the Intercity ones.
There are lots of upgraded intercity trains running around now! But nothing will beat the classic Koploper Intercity trains...
Thank you for mentioning the german system. I want to add a "few" things: It is kinda messy as well when you have systems with an S-Bahn, Regionalbahn and Regionalexpress, all doing basicly the same but slightly different. In Berlin it clear cut. S-Bahn has its own infractructure (build on the third rail system), Regionalbahnen link to the surrounding countryside and Regionalexpress connects cities that are farther away but still kinda in the same region. Then you go to Munich or Frankfurt where the S-Bahn is basicly a kind of Regionalbahn (using the same infrastructure and overhead wires like all other trains) and the Regionalbahnen behave like S-Bahnen or Regionalexpress sometimes. And that is just the local traffic. Which is usually done by by several companies within the Deutsche Bahn concern, which are themselves united (somehow) under the umbrella of a regional subcompany of the local traffic division of the DB, DB Regio) or even a private operator. Long distance trains are operated by whole separate company within Deutsche Bahn, DB Fernverkehr. At that is ignoring all the local public transport companies, owned by cities or counties, which are kinda linked as well.... It is a mess, escepially for foreigners...
At least there is some kind of a unified fair structure in this whole mess and you can use the DB Navigator APP everywhere in germany.
THOM, are the fair structures between NS and the private operators linked. Do you have something similar to the Deutschlandticket?
Also, I am still stunned when you told as some videos ago that the Netherlands did not bother to open up the whole network, but only branch lines for local operators. While NS kept the mainlines. IMO that is not a fair competition.
No, the fares are not integrated unfortunately.
The Dutch government actually has some major arguments with the European union about the fact they give most of the network to NS. Personally however, I don't know if it's a good idea to give more lines to other companies. NS now has a schedule that's very tightly packed, the transfer times are minimal and it's already so much work to make a nationwide schedule. If more lines are given to other companies, it will probably require more transfers when you make a trip and therefore more time. And the transfer times might get bigger when the companies compete for time slots.
It can potentially reduce the costs if more companies compete, but that's never a guarantee. There are also arguments to nationalize the entire rail system.
Good video, but you forgot one unique train type the Netherlands has: The IntercityDirect. Which only has 4 major city stops: Amsterdam, Schiphol, Rotterdam and Breda. Which makes it a faster Intercity :)
I did not forget. It’s not relevant to this video, since it’s just a variation of an intercity. I also skipped ICE, Eurostar, etc. I’ve made several videos about Intercity Direct, maybe you should watch those.
9:57 not just the NS, water connection between Rotterdam and the sea is called “de nieuwe waterweg” even though it was opened in 1872.
New College Oxford is from 1379...
After the Sprinter NG, they will introduce the Sprinter Max.
I have a question concerning Dutch trains: As far as I know the maximum speed on standard tracks (non-high-speed tracks) in the Netherlands is 140km/h. Why exactly is that?
There's a number of reasons. First, distances between stations are generally pretty short. Second, not all trains have historically been capable of speeds above 140. But most importantly, in many places, the ground is too soft, where higher speeds would damage the tracks.
The line between Zwolle and Lelystad, between Schiphol and Leiden, and between Amsterdam and Utrecht are designed for higher speeds, but domestic trains still only do 140.
I believe it's the signalling system they use
@@frafraplanner9277 the safety system is also a large problem in addition to ground/infra in some places. A lot of lines can also support 160 but, the main safety system can only handle 140 (although the European system is being introduced allowing for higher speeds)
@@Thom-TRAI see. Yes, I can imagine that a good deal of the Netherlands is build on swamp and peat.
@@5mnz7fg And we are a really small country, if I go all the way from Groningen to Maastricht which is almost the longest possible route in the country from top to bottom its like max 4 hours
Most trips of course much shorter. So no need for high speed trains. It makes sense in Germany France etc because they're much bigger.
Right now because of the SNG and Flirt trains, SLT trains are used more frequently for Intercity services
Oof, SLT on intercity, that’s brutal
Funny this would drop today... I sprinted for a red line train in Portland today :)
Hope you’ve caught your breath!
7:16 Dang I thought Cleveland transit were weird, unusual, and I thought that the only Lightrail and Metro in one rail
Nope, you can actually find several examples in Europe! Duisburg in Germany is another example
Railway classifications are always tricky. Something that's happening your larger neighbor is IC services getting scrapped and replaced by ICE, all it does is water down the premium brands and leave you with two options: Always expensive but often not really fast and the other option is cheap but takes eons to get places. I'm a big fan of proper train classification tho, it beats systems like the UK where its just the 17:26 to Woolbridge-upon-River without any further information.
Good points!
I've always thought of Sprinter as a British name, so I had to look it up. Turns out our first Sprinter (the class 150) was introduced in 1984, but the Dutch SGM has been around since 1975, so I guess we "stole" the term from the Dutch? Was the SGM the first ever Sprinter train internationally?
Oh, I’d never even thought of that! I guess I too had assumed the British sprinter was older
Aw Sprinter is in San Diego too but word on the street is that it isn't fast as expected too. That's what I heard from a friend. Also in France I think it's called TER and RER. Found out about the French stuff because I am 1. a diehard railfan 2. Other train TH-camrs talk about it.
Nice video! One thing: Keolis operates also with the name 'Sprinter' at the lines Kampen-Zwolle, Zwolle-Enschede and Amersfoort-Ede.
That is true. I never really understood why.
nice frankfurt spotted at 4:37
i think a train of this kind in the footage drives there every so often
Woerden Utrecht you have that 3 stations are skipped
10:45 I felt that
We’ve all been there
It's true, the same goes for sprinter trains in oceanside california
I agree that merging the sneltrein and intercity is a shame, and I would add that removing the distinctive looks of sprinters is a detriment to travelers as well. Having a distinct look really helps you know what type of train you're about to board
1:00 Thats quite a lucky fetch. Most of the times, you don't see CP 2600's running IC trains. Then again, that might be the Interregional train from Figueira da Foz/Porto-São Bento to Valença, in that case it would be quite common seeing that they are the only locomotive that runs that service.
I think it might have been the IR but honestly you’d only know if you’re an expert such as yourself
Regional Bahn stop everywhere and might go shorter routes. Like the RMV RB51 Frankfurt to Wächtersbach. RB51 is the same trainset, which serves the RegionalExpress RE50 from Frankfurt to Fulda. Same Dosto bilevel trains. But the smaller stops like Wirtsheim and Hanau Wolfgang are left out here.
In Europe, the train categories are regulated and harmonized by CIV rules.
Then there is the hard separation of Regionalverkehr and Fernverkehr in Germany, which is more softer in other countries.
Excellent good Video👍Thumbs Up 👍Best Greetings😀
Thank you
I find it a shame that we might be losing the difference between Sprinter and Intercity train liveries. Besides the fact that I abhor the "Flow" livery, the colours of the Sprinter make our rail network a bit more colourful! On the other hand I prefer the older stoptrein livery of the Plan V and Mat '54 over the Sprinter livery, even though back in the 80s and 90s all NS trains were "Yellow with some shade of blue"... It's difficult to pick a side for me😂
I love the flow livery. It’s much better then whatever Microsoft paint job the VIRMm1 and DDZ have.
I mean "sprinting" is running fast for a short distance, that's exactly what the train is doing.
Holy crap you might be onto something. I wonder if the guy who made the video knows this. Why don’t we watch the video and actually see for ourselves??
Very good explanation. NS has ordered new trains from CAF. These trains are combined single and double decker trains like the German Siemens Desiro HC. The trains would fit the new NS strategy perfect.
I am looking forward to the DDNG!
@@Thom-TRA When they are as good as the Desiro HC, then NS would have a pretty impressive new train. Living near Herzogenrath station i have some experience with the RRX Desiro HC trainsets and i find them very comfortable.
@@rbrouns9569 I've been on the RRX Desiro HC once and I was impressed too!
08:28 this is not true in Zeeland the Intercity operates as a stoptrein (like the sprinters) to service smaller villages.
Half of the Intercity trains in Zeeland only stop at Goes and Middelburg. Plus, if you watched the rest of the video, you would know how I feel about slow intercities like the one in Zeeland.
I'm surprised that my town has NO sprinter at all. (Just like you said in the video)
And I'm surprised that it can be faster at routes to use the sprinter instead of the intercity.
I miss the sprinter in my town. I only see ONE type of train. I like to see more difference in trains here. Not only the VIRMm
What town? Do you live near Enkhuizen?
Hold on, you missed something. The slowest type of train in The Netherlands is called the 'Stoptrein'. A Stoptrein stops at every station. Then there is the Sprinter, which skips certain stations, but will still stop at the more popular smaller stations. Lastly there is the Intercity, which only stops at the most important stations.
Sprinting is indeed a fast activity, but it also suggests a short activity. So a sprinter is for short-distance fast travel. If you travel long distance, you would be looking at a marathon... though we don't have a train named after that, which is probably where the confusion comes from!
EDIT: NEVERMIND, apparently the NS phased out the term Stoptrein entirely... though unlike a Stoptrein, a Sprinter CAN skip many smaller stations... Why did the NS do this lol. Good video. Even this Dutchie learned something new...
Wow, this comment is a perfect example of why you *watch the entire video BEFORE* you rush to comment.
Kinda funny take on the Dutch Sprinter. Absolutely agree on the fact that the abolishment of the ‘sneltrein’ by NS is indeed a bad move. Let’s say that this policy definitely doesn’t increase the ‘sprinting’ capacity of the Dutch railways.
On sprinting in to action trains; most metro systems operate with a ‘bump track design’ for station locations. This means an arriving train will be able to brake more efficiently at higher entrance speed, whilst at departing from the station the small dip in the track geometry will bring the train back to normal speed quicker. As far as I’m aware this kind of track arrangement wasn’t possible on all Zoetermeerlijn and Hofpleinlijn stations. This also for the very short distance of travel between station stops. Hence the NS was incentivized to come up with a solution, which indeed led to the SGM.
It’s kinda silly the initial lines the Sprinters were designed for, are now operated by a dedicated metro system. Whilst on the other hand the name Sprinter stuck to the NS local services. Interspersing Intercity and Sprinter traffic has been convenient for NS to take pressure away from its large transit hubs. Hence, Intercity trains can often be found at terminals that wouldn’t necessarily need Intercity service. This led and still leads to a significant devaluation of Intercity transit, where these dedicated trains follow local routes in combined service until they end up at their first hub, from where these trains then start their true Intercity service.
An absolute lack of passing sidings makes it almost impossible to up the service speed Intercity traffic on the local feeds to Intercity hubs. Cheerio
Appreciate your perspective
4:31 ** Plop! **
yo Stoptrein and Sneltrein arnt used by dutch comapny's anymore its now only RE, RS, and IC (IC is only Keolis) all stoppings trains to Belgium use still stoptrein and the line form Enschede to Gronau in Westfalen also uses stoptrein
They’re still technically Stoptrein and sneltrein, even if they’ve been given the labels RS or RE.
@1:03 If my eyes don’t deceive me, that looks like an old NS 1600/1700/1800 series right? 😅
Very similar! But built for Portuguese standards
Newerest Generation Sprinter. You're welcome. :)
And after that?
The reason for the downgrading of the IC type is basically that they needed to increase frequencies on a lot of routes, and having three train types (with some even faster services) would mean extra infrastructure. That infrastructure unfortunately ain't coming any time soon.
That doesn’t make sense. There are still multiple train types. They just call them all Intercity or Sprinter. So clearly the infrastructure allows for multiple service types.
@@Thom-TRA Nah. Look at stopping patterns such as The Hague -> Utrecht. None of the ICs are stopping in Zoetermeer anymore (whereas the Sneltrein did).
There's a lot of examples like that, just compare the with-sneltrein timetable to the one where it got cancelled.
Most of the Sneltreinen got removed around 2006-2007, with the last one indeed going later.
The combination of PHS (project high frequent railways) with having more train types just didn't fit. The extra overtakes on a lot of routes would be awkward, unreliable, or plainly miss infrastructure.
On some routes the Sneltrein got removed, and the Intercity remained (such as The Hague -> Utrecht, but also Utrecht -> Eindhoven), whereas on other parts the Intercity got removed and the Sneltrein renamed to IC (eg. Rotterdam -> Amsterdam old route).
Except for a rare few cases, most ICs on the same route run the same stopping pattern. This lowers the number of overtakes required.
An example of a Sneltrein of the old type that got cancelled is the old Sneltrein Den Haag/Rotterdam -> Arnhem -> Nijmegen, which made a transfer necessary for all passengers, and two transfers for select routes (eg. Zoetermeer -> Arnhem) if you want the fastest route.
@@nanderv You: “Except for a few rare cases…”
Laan van NOI, Schiedam C, Blaak, Woerden, Driebergen-Zeist, De Klomp, Duivendrecht, Sloterdijk, Bijlmer ArenA, Almere Buiten, Heiloo, Hollandsche Rading, Mediapark, Bussum Zuid, Mariënberg, Nieuw Amsterdam, Landgraaf, Eygelshoven Markt, Arnhem Zuid, Buitenpost, Zuidhorn, Mantgum: “Are we a joke to you??”
@@Thom-TRA Of that list, around half is fair.
Of that list, only Laan van NOI, Schiedam C, Blaak, Woerden are really fair. De Klomp & Driebergen-Zeist just get skip-stop service (both being sprinter stations with IC services), Sloterdijk has all IC's stopping there, only getting skipped by Intercity Direct (different train type). Bijlmer-Arena is again Skip-stop with Amstel.
Sure, there's a couple of trains that do weird stuff (like everywhere in the world), but there's wayy less of that than in earlier timetables (and among the lowest irregularity of any European country). The fact that they even put on the sign "Stopt niet op hollandse rading" says a lot about the level of consistency NS expects the trains to have.
@@nanderv way more than half those are fair. Did you just skip over the sprinter stations that are skipped by sprinters? I think all of them are fair, that’s why I chose them.
And skip-stop is still a type of different service patterns.
But regardless, that list is long enough to invalidate what you are saying. The truth is, NS could switch over to 3 services today without making a single change to the schedule.
The slow ICs Schiphol-Dordrecht-(Vlissingen) or Leiden-Utrecht should not be called IC. The fast sprinter Utrecht-Almere should not be called Sprinter. There should be a third category, because there are too many “exceptions.”
Kinda sad you didnt mention the fact that Germany uses the term Sprinter too. But if they use that term for ICE's it means that its a even faster service than the ICE, If you catch a Sprinter inbetween Berlin and Munich you will only make 2-4 intermediate stops **AND** hit 300kph
I’m not entirely sure why I would mention German sprinters when this video is about the Netherlands? I didn’t mention the British Sprinters either.
@@Thom-TRA They use ICE Sprinter as a category of trains
So you'd have
RB
RE
IRE
IC
ICE
ICE Sprinter
You could have mentioned the ICE Sprinter category compared to NS Sprinter saying that in this context it would be complete opposite ends of the spectrum. NS Sprinter being the slowest category while ICE Sprinter is the fastest category of trains
Arriva uses the word Sneltrein on some routes. So the three name system is still around and kicking in the regional game, as a lot of routes in the north (Friesland, Groningen), east (Drenthe, Overijssel) and southeast (Limburg) have routes that feature a train that stops everywhere, so a Stoptrein, and a train that doesnt stop at the small village stations but does at towns, but would be weird to call it Intercity as it stops at a lot of what arent cities and more big villages/towns.
InterCity isnt used as much by regional operators as they mostly operate smaller routes, but Keolis (Blauwnet) uses it on Enschede-Zwolle.
Arriva and Keolis also introduced the two letter + two number system that Germany also has, but with RS (Regionale Stoptrein), RE (Regionale Expresstrein, so confusingly, thats Sneltrein) and IC (InterCity)
Adding a bit more confusion to the mix, Blauwnet seems to be unsure if RS means Regionale Stoptrein or Regionale Sprinter. The NS app says Blauwnet Sprinter.
Edit: on that last one, seems the inconsistency is partially Keolis? RS23 Zwolle-Enschede and RS22 Zwolle-Kampen are called Sprinter, all others Stoptrein. However, Keolis used to operate RS20 Oldenzaal-Zutphen, which they always called Stoptrein... is the criteria diesel?
Im going crazy here
I appreciate you laying this all out, but I should tell you that if you had watched to the end of the video you would hear me say this.
@@Thom-TRAYeah i did, just felt like it could perhaps used a bit more then a brief mention (great video however, ive heard of more foreigners that the term Sprinter feels weird to them whilst NL is used to it), though regional operators use the terms in a bit weird way sometimes so thats why i wrote that up and... rambled on for too long
10:38, too relatable
It’s painful