The Doctor's Most Powerful Enemy Yet? - Doctor Who: The Celestial Toymaker (1966) - REVIEW
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ก.ย. 2023
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Since recording the interview, the project that Mel teased that couldn't be announced yet...has been announced.
"A Meeting On The Common" from Vworp Vworp Zine. More info here - twitter.com/VworpVworpZine/status/1704212516937535909?t=mZH4bxWoG5hwKo7UDJiY1w&s=19
And the award for "Most Accidentally Well-Timed Review of The Celestial Toymaker" goes to Mr TARDIS!
'accidentally' ;)
We've known he's going to be in the special for months.
@@Tillyard86if they go in that direction I would love it!!!!!
This is Neil Patrick Harris character in the new special 💖💝💖💝 I'm so excited!!!
And animated recreation available for preorders now.
Australian here, the reason that part 4 was saved but parts 1-3 were junked is because part 4 is called "The Final Test" and was mistakenly placed in the cricket archives. You can have cricket to thank for episode 4 of this story still existing
The late Michael Gough not only return back to Doctor Who in Arc of Infinity but he was also once married to Anneke Wills ' AKA Polly.'
I think the low budget kind of helped the episode in a way, like the Celestial Toymaker's realm is a giant play set or doll house.
I love how you pointed out Hartnell saying stop meddling with my sh*t
Of course as fate would have it, Neil Patrick Harris would be announced to play the toymaker literally the day after this video was published
I was under the impression that part of the game was that Steven and Dodo had to find the real Tardis BEFORE The Doctor finished his trilogic game. That's why the Toymaker made the moves for The Doctor if he thought he was playing too slowly. It's not enough that he had to win the game, but his friends had to find the real Tardis before he finished the game.
I understood that, to an extent, but I'm surprised he didn't also try and manipulate Steven and Dodo's game.
Part of the Doctor's game is that he has to make over 1,000 perfect moves. No room for error. If the Toymaker is moving the game forward, he is actively making it easier for the Doctor. It's just not an ideal strategy, IMHO.
@@MrTARDIS It arguably *is* an ideal strategy. Even if you ignore that it is a simple logic puzzle, the Doctor obviously from the start knows how to determine the exact 1000+ moves necessary to solve it. Allowed to go at his own pace and without pressure, he is not going to make a mistake.
The threat of the Toymaker advancing the game is part of that pressure. The Doctor knows he needs to stall in order to give Steven and Dodo more time, but he neither knows how much time they need nor does he know how much stalling will trigger the Toymaker to advance the game. Worse for him is that whenever the Toymaker advances the game, the Doctor needs to re-evaluate where he is in the solution, introducing a slight chance for making a mistake that wouldn't have been present otherwise.
Throughout this, the Toymaker can feel that he never cheats. He doesn't sabotage Steven and Dodo's games, nor does he technically sabotage the Doctor. Instead, he only issues punishment for the Doctor's "cheating" (stalling for time), and even there the "punishment" is in the form of "helping" the Doctor to solve the puzzle.
@@MrTARDISI’m guessing he expected the doctor to win, his strategy was to make sure that he was faster than Steven and dodo.
And then of course he had his backup plan
I wish the toymaker had played cards or chess against him instead so there'd be a back and forth and more engagement between the two.
As for your point about the universe being destroyed when the games are won, it's never mentioned whether: (1) the toymaker is able to save his doll slaves and take them with him to the new universe, (2) it even counts as a win for the Doctor if Steven and Dodo don't get the TARDIS back in time.
@@MrTARDIShe kind of did if you think about it,he sent Cheating clowns,chaotic Victorian people,Stuck up Playing cards,and mischievous schoolboys,all of which hinder the characters in one way or another,the cheating clowns try to move the game around and use a thinner blindfold to see through,so it’s easier for them to win,the Sergeant and the Cooks constantly argue while trying to help,which hinders them by having to constantly break them up,the playing cards do a similar thing by constantly making Steven mad at them for their sense of superiority,and mad at Dodo for her trying to tell
him to just suck it up,and Syril most obviously hindered them by rigging traps and straight up making up rules at will
Combining the King of Hearts racial slur with the Jeremy Clarkson n-word controversy from Top Gear was pure hilarity especially with the apology part.😂
The Celestial Toymaker has always had a special place for me, it is just so “out there” and the almost featureless sets etc really add to it.
It’s the equivalent of the 2nd Doctor’s “The Mind Robber” story which has lots of white sets to save cash too!
As an 11 year old child, I absolutely loved this story back in 1966. You had to be there to really appreciate this. Today's generation have been spoilt with CGI effects and don't always see the value of the early days of TV Sci-Fi.
My dad often shown some of the old episodes, and I must admit it I love them, due to how original they were, which is why I love them.
The Celestial Toymaker is about to make his grand return for another game.
🎉
I always took celestial as in the heavens, space.
Its so sad that so much of Hartnells and Troughtons episodes are missing.
I watched this story about 5yrs ago.
I suppose this is why the 60th anniversary is so exciting, if Russell T Davies had used the Daleks or the Cybermen the hype around it wouldn't be as big as we have seen The Doctor defeat both what feels like hundreds of times at this point whereas the Doctor has never actually defeated The Celestial Toymaker, however Davies has brought back a character that we havent seen in 57 years, so nobody knows what to expect especially since the original episode is missing. Very excited for the episode but also nervous about what will happen to Donna.
Edit - This probably explains why the Doctor screams "Why does it have to be this!" in the trailer
I’m an America raised in the 1960s and I never heard the term “celestial” used as a racial slur. This video is the first time I’ve heard that.
It was mainly a slur used during the Californian and Australian gold rushes in the 1800s, so the slur meaning was a century out of date before the toymaker serial was ever made
Looking up the word "celestial' as a slur it seems it was mainly used in the 19th century in America, Australia and somewhat England, and it came as a translation of how Chinese emigrants were referring to themselves at the time (people of the celestial empire 天朝). After the 19th century it pretty much wasn't used as a slur anymore at all so it was most likely just an unlucky accident here
I was currious about that too, it felt like a pretty deep-cut forgotten slur.
@@quentinchoumont3437 Yeah. Never knew that was a thing until this video.
Yeah, I'd never heard of that before and I'm a language nerd. So I agree, it's pretty unlikely that there was any connection.
Not exactly a slur - more a rather supercilious metonym.
This seems like one of those words that were never actually slurs, just slang, like when British people call Americans yanks or Aussies call British people pommes. It takes a handful of people to take offense and something not offensive and suddenly the celestial toymaker can't have a mandarin outfit.
Interestingly, given the original use of the Toymaker's costume, there's a variant version of Blind Man's Buff, played in a swimming pool, called "Marco Polo".
Interestingly enough, “The Ark” remains just the first of the last three fully intact serials of the Hartnell era…with the other two being “The Gunfighters” and the finale for Season Three, “The War Machines”…
Regarding the word "Celestial" being considered a racist term, especially in America: I'm in the states and I can honestly say that I have never heard of "Celestial" being anything else than having an association with the Cosmos. Celestial Heavens, Celestial Stars, Celestial Universe. In fact, I even associate it with Scientist Carl Sagan and his "Cosmos" spacial sciences TV series. (If you've heard of that.) So I have always linked the Celestial Toymaker with the Universe and it's Infinities. Again, I have never before known anything about the word having racist overtones. Just saying, is all. Oh, and Great Vid! Thank you for your hard work.
Cyril's death used to make me laugh at a younger age. But your head-canon makes it even funnier 😂😂
Q against Picard! It's only just clicked in my head.
I always looked at the celestial toymaker as a classic without even watching it but l did hear the premise of it with sounded incredible. If this story was ever to be animated then I do hope they make everything look endless and dark to capture the premise of the story on screen. I also didn't know that the Toymaker had the same costume as Marco Polo witch l found very interesting.
Cyril exploded as if he were a bag of Jelly Babies getting slapped by Davros
Can Davros even slap?
@@BrendanJSmithhe did in Destiny of the Daleks
I really hope we see Micheal Gough and William Hartnell in archive footage in the 60th Anniversary now we know Neil Patrick Harris is playing the Toymaker and in the latest trailer the Doctor says he has a memory from a very long time ago
15:25 I’ve always thought that the rules of the Trilogic Game is that if The Doctor wins (tho after Steven & Dodo win their 5 games), he, Steven & Dodo will get to go free from The Toymaker’s realm. But if The Doctor loses, The Doctor will be forced to become his perpetual opponent forever. The Toymaker doesn’t want to kill The Doctor, but he doesn’t want The Doctor & Co to win & escape, so he blackmails them with the threat of dying when they win. He bends the rules he set up from the start so he gets his way. He’s a ‘bad loser.’
Also, 15:39
You say that but there is an entire genre of Internet Entertainment built on people watching TH-camrs & Streamers playing games. There is always an audience for any type of game 😅
If the universe only collapses when someone other than the Toymaker wins, then it isn't a plothole that it seems to conflict with the Toymaker's goal of continued play. After all, the Toymaker expects to always win.
The timing of this review is too perfect, you can't tell me this wasn't planned, somehow...
Thanks, this pretty much covers my thoughts on the serial (but this is more eloquent). Episode 3 recreation was probably the longest 25 minutes of my life.
It's a shame that much like the Medding Mork the Toymaker only appeared once in the classic series, He came close to making a come back in The Nightmare Fair but of course that got canned, Thankfully the book and of course Big Finish made that happened again.
The meddling monk actually appears in a few episodes of Daleks masterplan, which I didn’t know until I watched it.
@@gruffyddwilliams7633 I know about that but that's still a shorter appearances that the Meddling Monk had in the classic series than he had on Big Finish which is tons, Same for The Toymaker only less Big Finish appearances.
@@lexruptor I am aware of that.
The Meddling Mork did eventually get his own TV show in the US.
@@stephennoonan8417 What's it called?
A far more interesting confrontation than yet another runaround with the Daleks.
I love The Celestial Toymaker. When I was a kid I had the novelisation of this and it was maybe the first Dr Who related piece of media I had encountered at that point. I really hope they make an animation for this at some point, even if they have to edit it. The weirdness of the premise is something that has been missing in modern Who, except maybe in The Doctor's Wife or It Takes You Away.
I would love to see a Toymaker themed escape room.
Hell, they could make it a series! The Toymaker Trials. Teams go through a series of whimsical yet slightly sinister games.
I know it's been done- Trapped, Crystal Maze, The Adventure Game... but c'mon, a Toymaker themed game show would be brilliant.
This is actually one of only two mostly missing stories I've watched via Loose Cannon recons, the other being The Evil of the Daleks.
What’s that?
Yeaaaaah, I never picked up on the 'Celestial' thing, but now you mention it, I can totally understand why NPH is in a different outfit (if he IS the Toymaker). That said, they should defo keep the full name, The Celestial Toymaker is way too badass a villain name to cut in half 😂
It's also worth noting that mentions of the character in the revived series refer to him only as The Toymaker (mostly recently in "Can You Hear Me?"), so if he IS returning I wouldn't be surprised if NPH's character drops the word "Celestial" entirely due to the connotations of his prior incarnation.
@@BlueSparxLPs Which would be a shame, but understandable. It seems like it was maybe just a bit of poor thinking from the original writers, after all the term celestial in its original sense refers perfectly to the Toymaker, its just the slang version of that word and connotations from it that tip it over the edge.
Not like they could cast an Asian actor to play the part with the original name either, cause that'd probably make it look even worse
Michael Gough was in the BBC Alice in Wonderland, that same year (1966) playing the March Hare. It also seems to me that some of the props (specifically in the kitchen scene) and also maybe some aspects of the hastily rewritten story (as you say - "Lewis Carroll logic") and the whole surrealist approach were borrowed from that production.
super in depth video, thank you!
Dinopuffs animation is the first one to improve the source material. A shame they aren't able to finish it, including part 4. I think it would transform a failure of a story to a triumph. I'd prefer to see the animation completed over the story being returned at this point
Having just watched the animated recreation, I think the surreal abstract visuals and grander scale really improved the story. Very repetitive but i loved it!
I'm a 41 year old American and I've never heard the word "Celestial" used as a slur. This is actually my first time hearing that. It must have been more common in the 1960s. I always assumed he was called that because he's God-like.
More like 1800s, it was a really outdated term at this point that I don't think anyone would've really understood what it meant if they heard it in the '60s.
There was a Billy Bunter television series called Billy Bunter of Greyfriars School which ran from 1952-1961 in which Bunter was played by Gerald Campion wearing a virtually identical costume.
Wouldn't you belive it that th next day it was announced that the Toymaker woukd indeed make his big return for another game.
Fun fact: Michael Gough would later appear in the 1980’s Blake’s 7 episode, ‘Volcano’ as Hower, Leader of the Pyroans on the planet Obsidian.
I think the king of hearts racist rhyme was a version of the rhyme more commonly used way back when.
There's an episode of Dad's Army where Private Pike says that exact rhyme on who's going to talk to captain Mainwaring about his wig.
Was it really still common to use the racial slur in 1966? 🤮 that’s not even that long ago
@@mujiescomedy279 the rhyme was probably common to those who grew up hearing it as children as simply a nursery rhyme and thought of as just that without any need of analysis or anything as that was just the lyrics at the time. As culture and society changed, naturally the rhyme changed to a variant without the n word to who didn't want to be racist to their kids.
Maybe, it was a different time, different standards. There's no way i can get you stats. There have been and likely will be racist and non racist people throughout humanity since racism began. Since whoever invented the n word, there's have been and are going to be someone using it. Not necessarily for racist reasons.
Of Mice And Men use the n word and that was written and set in the 1930s. It's still a good story despite that. Racism isn't a key focal point in the book but you can analyse the racism being cleverly used in the book to highlight the segregation non whites faced at the time which was true of the time period and it makes you feel sympathy for the black character, Crooks, who's just trying to make a living.
Some Quentin Tarantino films use the n word and they are entertaining film stories. He's no racist, his films aren't pro racism. He uses it to suit the characters using that language. To be true to the time his films take place without white washing. Racist or not of their own accord.
It's why I think the king of hearts wasn't being intentionally racist. He was just humming a rhyme to himself to sort chairs or whatever. Back then it was probably a common place rhyme the cast and crew knew, grew up with or excused as it was a rhyme. The king of hearts isn't intentionally racist, the celestial toymaker serial isn't pro racism. Same with Private Pike. It's just a rhyme variant that was ok to use then but compared to standards nowadays is un PC.
Oh boy! A birthday upload! What a wonderful gift!
From what I understand, the companions have to finish the games in the time that it takes for the Doctor to finish the puzzle, so it does make sense that the Toymaker would skip his moves ahead because that makes it more difficult for the companions. So the Toymaker skipping moves could be considered to raise the stakes, right?
Great review. Thank you!
I actually really liked the voice twist at the end. It's established in all 3 parts that the toymaker's voice is used to move the pieces. As you said in your review too, this is a man who has won everything. He doesn't freak out or scream simply because he has spent god knows how long winning in his games. That's why he was never prepared or at least was too relaxed to realize that the Doctor could outsmart him. I feel like in 2024 the explanation for the Doctor mimicking the voice could be the Tardis recorded The Toymaker's voice and ai generated it to say the final move.
Hell I think the only good part of the toymaker's return with Neil Patrick Harrison was the fact that he constantly changed accents. It was almost like he had been mentally scarred for life by that single defeat.
Thanks! I will follow up on watching the animation.
I can't help but be reminded of the much maligned (but I'm kinda fond of it) Star Trek Deep Space Nine episode, "Move Along Home."
While the ending is essentially reversed, the core concept is much the same.
I can understand why the Toymaker's reappearance- without something of an overhaul- could be problematic for the BBC, but they could really go all out with the character now.
It took me a second to read that this came out before the spine chilling announcement this weekend.
The Doctor Who yt channel just posted a clip from this story. Either that's one hell of a coincidence, or MrTardis *is* the Doctor!
I didn't know too much about the original story, I only read the novelization. Very interesting, thanks for the insight!
Wow, so many comments on this! Not sure if anyone else mentioned it, but the image of Hartnell with the clowns behind him was used for the card of the First Doctor in the Doctor Who Collectible Card Game from 1996 (published by MMG Ltd)
Thanks for this excellent video, I learned a ton!
Don't know if this was mentioned in the video, but there was a person who actually had all 4 episodes of this story and the gunfighters, but after he watched all the episodes he junked them all because he thought they were absolutely terrible. He didn't knew the episodes from The Celestial Toymaker were lost
That was Graham Strong, who recorded the audio tracks for a large chunk of the missing episodes. The Celestial Toymaker and The Gunfighters were recorded as well but, as you stated, he didn’t think too highly of these stories, so he junked his audio recordings. Fortunately, The Gunfighters’ episodes were recovered, and the audio tracks for TCM were also recorded by David Holman (?).
@@SirDanFilmsUnltd there was also the randolph tapes that kaleidoscope found that has the celestial toymaker too.
In the “Billy” episode, the companions do go on to explain that he set and fell into his own trap and that is why he was died 😅 Not sure how you missed that
A couple of points: while the Knave is played by Peter Stephens, the Jester is played by Reg Lever. You appear to have muddled the two characters up during editing. Also, during the Jeremy Clarkson skit, you've used Stephens's Knave where you should have used Campbell Singer's King. Talking of the King, Singer improvised the n-word during filming, it seems. There's certainly no evidence of it ever being in the script.
Of the Toymaker's decision to hurry the Trilogic game along, don't forget that the Doctor is competing against Steven and Dodo. Seeing as the Toymaker wants neither side to win, it makes sense that he'll cheat at any given opportunity. This is why the realm will be destroyed if the Doctor wins; in his arrogance, the Toymaker believed he could never lose. It's hubris, basically.
The doctor deliberately plays slowly to give his companions time to win their games.
I really did like and love The Celestial Toymaker as this was my third favorite story from the First Doctor's era even though that it is pity for me that this story was missing as three episodes were missing from the BBC archives and one episode had survived but it would be better if this story should be the next one to be fully animated in the future in my opinion. Also, the Toymaker is in fact one of my favorite villains from the Classic Doctor Who era that I really enjoyed since he was played by Michael Gough and I did enjoy his preformens even though that in Divided Loyalties did revealed that the Celestial Toymaker was the Crystal Guardian Of Dreams as he was one of the Guardians of Time and by that time when I was reading this book I did not see it coming. However I would be happier if the Toymaker should have return to the Classic Doctor Who era on screen as The Nightmare Fair was a good story to feature the return of the Celestial Toymaker and part of finally of Season 22 for Doctor Who in my opinion but I still like and enjoy this story.
I love Jackie Lane as Dodo, but she was never given anything to work with at all. Her entrance into the Tardis was one of my favourites - absolutely unfazed except for the lack of police/phone!
Mel's animation was amazing! I think that kind of creative enhancing/editing could really benefit Wheel in Space.
As an American I've never heard celestial used as a slur for Asians. Oriental however...
Me too
Why can’t he do the other two missing episodes? Saw and really loved the first one he did…we NEED the rest of the story!
Michael Gough is absolutely one of the most well known guest stars up to that point, but I'm not sure if he's the most well known, as I've been given to understand that Derek Francis who played Nero in The Romans was a big get the show, even though I don't really know who he is outside that series. And Andre Morell who started in The Massacre is well known for playing the titular character in Quatermass and the Pit (which if you haven't seen you should, its influence on Doctor Who and a lot of sci-fi in TV and film in general is very evident), as well as being a prolific actor on the big and small screen. So I'd say that that Michael Gough is the biggest guest star in the series to that point retrospectively, owing to his Alfred and appearances in some of the Hammer Classics.
And the less we say about Arc of Infinity the better.
I hope he does eventually do Big Finish. He'd do amazing with Chimes of Midnight.
The Toymaker deserves to make a grand return wether or not Neil Patrick Harris is playing the character in the 60th anniversary specials though the hints seem very likely he is the Toymaker.
His inclusion in The Nightmare Fair sounds really awesome and it’s a shame we never got to see that vision of season 23 be made even with Big Finish.
I love this great review
I like The Celestial Toymaker
The celestial toymaker is a very visual story, much like the Mind Robber, and without the visuals, it cannot be fully appreciated and enjoyed.
Love this story
Cookie 60s Who episodes: Samuel Beckett meets Irwin Allen
Apart from the King needing to B redubbed for one line, I think the animation is gonna B easy & I look forward to it.
I have seen some animated reconstructions of random scenes from this serial on You tube
Since so many Doctor Who fans recognise the celestial toymaker although being that old and also- almost completely missing- I thought this might be a very important part to watch before the 60th. But... I guess only the toymakers backstory might be transfered but I guess mostly everything else around him will be totally different
Brian Hayles the writer of this story returned to the show involving green creatures from the planet Mars with Lego hands before Lego was a thing, Of course I'm talking about the Ice Warriors.
I'll just be pedantic and mention that Lego has been made since 1949, however the minifigs with Ice Warrior hands didn't turn up until 1978, so I will give you that.
18:13 - CLARKSON!!!
I never picked up on that slur... back in those days it was so institutionalised that they thought nothing of it. I mean, just look up what the original title of Agatha Christies classic novel "and then there were none" was. Hoooo Boy
It’d be cool if they sorta redid it and also played with the concepts of time, like the doctor plays his game and it’s one hour but it’s ten years for one person and 3 for another. Maybe it’d work better as a Torchwood episode where they really deal with more concepts of abandonment death and madness
Heeeeees baaaaack
And you can see the wheels on the Tardis lol
Where can I watch these photo reconstructions? I feel like I’m missing out on a great set of classics
Good review! I have seen some parts of the story before, but I haven't watched the whole story. I have heard of The Celestial Toymaker before, and I do have the novel of The Nightmare Fair. I might have to watch this story before the 60th Anniversary comes. I also have to mention when I saw the picture of the sign of the sad clown it does look similar to the one in the story, and I didn't see it on Facebook, and I was like how did I miss that? I have a feeling that Neil Patrick Harris is The Celestial Toymaker and there are signs pointing to it.
Amazing and timely! I’ll run down Mel’s work!
Thank you!
The Doctor sure spends a lot of season 3 missing or unable to speak. I thought it was due to Hartnell's inability to remember lines, but the producers hating him might have also contributed to that.
I'm devastated that Mel cannot do Parts 2 and 3. My presumption is the BBC are actually doing an animation and it will more than likely not be as good as Mel's.
actually, i quite liked that story. okay, i was young at the time, but it did make an impression.
Shame season 23 was cancelled as part 2 was the first story of that season and to be made in Blackpool.
I watched animated versions of parts 1 & 3, which is probably why I found it way more enjoyable than you probably did.
6/10
How is it this serial has not been animated yet??
The Costumes and Sets change a lot so it takes a while...
I have never heard the term ‘celestial’ as a slur for Chinese people.
10:42 I have always loved the fact you can see the casters on the bottom of the TARDIS prop
HEY BBC, WAKE UP AND SUPPORT INDIPENDENTS LIKE THIS GUY!!!!!!!!!!!!
I live in the US, and I'm 60. I've never heard the word celestial used as a slur.
I am today years old when I realized he was Alfred
not sure what people have against the Dodo outfit, that looks great to me very 60s. Now I would make the loops on the skirt a variety of colours, but apart from that I think its a good look. Other than that, I would just give her shoulder length hair.
Given what Mel was saying, about wanting feedback, there you go creators, and wardrobe of 60s Doctor Who, this is what I think you should have done with Dodo.
I'm American and have never heard the word Celestial used as a slur for Chinese people. I do know the Chinese used to refer to their nation as the "Celestial Empire".
I watched it recently and thought that it wasn't as bad as people say it is. Also the last challenge guy dies in the most goofy way
Haven't 'seen' this one in so long that I'd forgotten that Carmen Silvera was in it!
I am an American and I have never heard a Chinese person referred to as Celectial.
One more major slip-up, the Doctor mimics Toymaker's voice cast final game move and destroy Toymaker dimension. But, the Tardis door was open...Would that seriously impact inside of Tardis?
I always assumed Cyrill messed the jump up and hit his foot on the platform