@@cgkase6210 no, he means because Achilles is a fucking beast that even the gods couldn't stop. This is probably why apollo guided the arrow into Achilles' weak spot
I love how achilles is wrapped up in a burrito and It's canon because that one vase painting showing off his sulking is achilles rolled up in blankets like a mad burrito
@@ultradude3447 ACTUALLY, in ancient greece, a man only dies an honorable death if gets buried unharmed; that’s why everyone is so crazily protective of dead guys. therefore, achilles- after killing him- dragging hector’s body across the battlefield strapped to his chariot was meant to paint a permanent stain on his honor, for all of the danaans + the trojans to see. moral of the story; achilles is one petty bitch. (/hj)
@@doriangrayapologist That's actually really interesting, I wanted to know why it was such a huge affront but never got the motivation to look it up lol. But while that is a fascinating piece of cultural history, I was actually making a reference to another one of Red's videos.
Patroclus was a quite skilled fighter. He made the Trojans run back to their gates, killed several of their warriors and he seemed as he would have taken Hector down had Apollo not intervened and clouded his senses. He also had decent medical skills, all his comrades loved him because he was a sweetheart and he was probably the only man who treated Brisyes as a human being and not as a property. Brisyes only talks once in Iliad: when she saw Patroclus' corpse and started mourning him. All in all, Patroclus was more than a plot device and Achilles' boyfriend.
@@blendingwitch6206 *cough* BTS, RWBY and Jacksepticeye and Markiplier Actually - as for RWBY Rooster Teeth did give into the fan girls and the show actively got worse for it.
@@wisemankugelmemicus1701 I mean idc about shipping as long as it isn't real people (dead or alive). I was thinking more about youtubers like markiplier/jack, dan and Phil, etc. Oh and boy bands. Just. No those are real people please stoppppp
@@nokachi3339 The cousins thing came from the movie Troy, which paints them as relatives so they could avoid all that homoerotic subtext and stuff y'know?
@@wandanemer2630 Back then it was customary to leave a lock of hair on the funeral pyre for someone who died who you greatly loved or respected. I think it showed the link between life and death. Patroclus’s funeral pyre was _covered_ in locks of hair.
To add another thing, Hector had announced that he was going to desecrate Patrolcus’s corpse. Like, parade him around Troy, cut his head off and put it on a spike, and then feed his body to the dogs. The Greeks heard him say this and they absolutely could NOT allow this to happen. Not only because they cared for Patroclus, but because they knew Achilles was already going to react _badly_ to Patroclus’s death, but there was also a real fear that Achilles would murder EVERYONE-both the Trojans _and_ the Greeks-if the Greeks lost Patroclus’s body to the Trojans and Hector followed through with the desecration. So just about _everyone_ fought to get his body back to camp so that an already horrible situation didn’t get worse.
@Xx_ĐÃÌĹÝ_ÑÌĞHŤ_xX Actually I think she's being sarcastic. I made this joke before I'd really seen enough of OSP to really get their style and having had more time to analyze I kind of realize in retrospect this is just a joke, and a fairly obvious one at that.
Nah, she’s just poking fun at the “they were totally just bros, that’s just how guys talked to each other back then” trope that some historians use. This channel sells Patrochilles merch for God’s sake. Course we ship it.
“Hetero life partner” in this context comes off to me as part of the joke surrounding how the relationship is straight-washed/censored in many modern interpretations- especially considering the romantic music and close-up shots poking extra fun at their “Totally Straight, Yep, NOTHING TO SEE HERE” dynamic.
Fun Fact: The ‘Achilles heel trope’ aka Achilles weakness because he was dipped into a river to make him immortal, but his heel wasint was NOT in the original writing and was made up as sort of a fan AU by the other Greeks to explain why Achilles was so strong. Achilles was just naturally gifted, in the original Greek writing of the Iliad he dies from an arrow in his back by Paris that shot into his heart, not his heel. I was surprised when I read the Greek version of the Iliad because Achilles Heel is such an iconic part of his character in modern days, turns out it’s not true. See? Even the Ancient Greeks had headcanons to their favorite stories.
When he was a baby, Achilles was dipped in the river Styx by his mother, basically giving him bulletproof skin. Except for his heel, where his mother held him. That's the version of the story that I know.
@@triskel8161I never said my version of the story was the definitive 100% accurate version of the story. But it's at least an explanation for Achilles' heel, which is better than no explanation.
@@octaviovourvoulias3188 *guy shoots an arrow at Achilles's nuts* *arrow deflects off* Homer: "And that was how he was the first man with the 'balls of steel'."
In a variant I´ve heard, Achilles literally roared, together with Athena, so loud that many Trojans ended up dead by their own comrade´s weapons as they fled in panic. *3 times.*
You’ve got me thinking there, would that actually freak ancient the Greeks out. To them doing physical feats naked was the ultimate show of physical prowess. So actually that could have been bloody badass.
Achilles filled a river with so many bodies the River got pissed and attacked him. So Achilles beat it up until it left him alone......just wanna make sure I heard that correctly. 'Cause that's epic.
He absolutely pissed off the local river god for polluting it with so many corpses, but before the river could rise up and drown him, Hephaistos, due to Hera asking him for help, came in with his forge fires and literally boiled it (aka its local god) into submission. That´s the variation I know of.
Achilles could not beat the river. Hera asked Hephaestus to use his fire (he is the god of fire after all) to defeat the river and save Achilles. The only guy that defeated a river was Heracles, who defeated Achelous. And Achilles is not as strong as Heracles, and thus could not defeat the river Scamander.
Well they were. The Song of Achilles was written by Plato, who had no input into the original story or its characters. The story is literally no better than fanfiction ripped off of Tumblr or Wattpadbor any other site. If that's your interpretation fine, but I'd say their more father and son or brotherly myself. Also considering how much Achilles womanized it wouldn't be surprising.
Something I can see Achilles doing: Whaddup guys it's Achilles and today we're going to talk about why you shouldn't let your boyfriend wear your clothes!
Yeah -- because the idea of a guy actually loving another guy can only serve as the butt of a joke -- because everyone knows all 'real' men are hetero. (sheesh)
5:26 Fun fact: Zeus actually tells Ares straight to his face that he hates him the most and that if he weren't his son, he'd be in a position worse than the Titans by now
That's because he's a lesser being in every single way. I'm not joking. He's just as much of an arsehole as Agamemnon. Let me explain: When they take over Troy, Ajax the Lesser r*pes princess Cassandra, who is clinging to a statue of Athena (yep, he violates her inside Athena's temple), which makes the goddess so furious, that she later drowns him on his way home him in retribution.
Anselma Reich I LOVE IT WHEN PEOPLE EXPLAIN AND PUT CONTEXT FOR THINGS!!!! I LOVE THESE MINI HISTORY LESSONS AND WHEN THE COMMENTS GO INTO FURTHER DETAIL BUT ITS *STILL* SIMPLIFIED??!??!??! IT MAKES ME WANNA PTERODACTYL SCREAM IN HAPPINESS!!!!!!!! BRUH YOU ARE MY FAVORITE PERSON RN!!!!!!!!! 💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜
oh yeah, achilles, the guy who fought a FRICKIN' RIVER because his "bestie", but didn't move when his "girlfriend" was taken away... anyways totaly hetero, straight as a ruller..."
@@esuterunokitsune3556 Well, he was on the verge of fighting Agamemnon and he did abandon the Greeks for a long time because of how the king had treated them.
Ah yes, Achilles and Patroclus were truly best bros. Everyone has gone on a *rampage tearing through an entire army, almost singlehandedly ending a war, dragging the man who killed then around a city 3 times to assert dominance* Everyone has done that for their best buddy o chum
In the Iliad Achilles's grief following Patroclus' death is described as similar to the one of a great lion that lost it's cub. And it is also shown that were living together since they were children and that Achilles and his father got Patroclus out of a mess once. And as nothing sexual between them is described in the Iliad, I'd see it more reasonable to conclude that Patroclus was more of a little brother, or an adopted son to Achilles then, you know, a boyfriend. Not to mention that Achilles was already in love with Briseis and called her "wife".
@@tepesobrejac4360 …except for the fact Patroclus was supposedly older. He was depicted with a beard in pottery and such, while Achilles was clean shaven, suggesting youth
@@cee_ves In the Iliad itself it is said only once that Patroclus was older than Achilles, but as it is also said that they were childhood friends the age gap couldn't have been significant. Moreover, Patroclus lived at Achilles' home, where Peleus made him subordinate to Achilles and Achilles was a king, while Patroclus was not. These three factors alone easily make the age-gap close to irrelevant. And as it is clear in the Iliad that Achilles was the leader in their relationship and not Patroclus, if there was ever to be anyone that would have grieved for Patroclus like a lion that lost it's cub (and not as man who lost his boyfriend), that would have been Achilles, as told by Homer in Book XVIII.318-323 And finally, just as a side-note, read the Iliad, Book IX. 663-669
@Pony Boy No but literary no one said that. It's a joke based on the fact that Achilles and Patroclus were obviously lovers, everything points to it in the text, including them having their ashes mixed together after death so they could be together for all eternity and despite all this, historians up to this day will call them "best friends".
@Pony Boy of course! You also kill the person who mudered your friend, drag their body through the city for days, literally do not care if you're killed now that your FRIEND is dead, ask people to mix your ashes with your FRIEND'S so that you may be united forever in afterlife, your rage is so dangerous that gods have to step in to pacify you! Yes you will do that for your FRIEND!
@@reynaavilaramirezarellano1040 well, in agreement with him, the Illiad is full of explicit sex, but none between Patroculus and Achilles. If they were meant to be lovers, that would've been written explicitly. People can platonically love each other that much, and other people should really understand that, for goodness' sake. I'm not just talking about people of the same gender loving each other platonically, but of the opposite gender as well. Achilles was actually in love with Briseis, not in a platonic way.
@@V-q8is i don't know, he didn't accept the offer from Agamemnon to get back Briseis even though Agamemnon told him he didn't even touch her, he still refused to fight, i think he was madder from the fact that Agamemnon could easily take away his "prize", and at some point after Patroclus dies he even says that it would have been better if Briseis was dead from the beginning
@@jinstan9855 I think he was more pissed at Agamemnon than Briseis there, but okay. Anyway, my point is that when nothing is explicitly written, I choose to believe there's nothing. People of the same or opposite gender CAN love each other that much platonically and it weirds me out when people sexualise it.
“Patroclus and Achilles are gay,” I say into the mic. The crowd boos. I begin to walk off in shame, when a voice speaks and commands silence in the room. “They’re right,” they say. I look for the owner of the voice. There in the third row stands: Hector himself
Patroclus and Achilles do not comment. Mostly because they are too busy staring into each other's eyes. P: Bro, I'm sorry I got myself killed bro. A: Bro, it's not your fault. P: Bro... A: Bro... P: I love you bro... A: Bro, I love you too... P: BROOOO...
The sheer power of the rainbow quotations around Patroclus and Achilles is both incredible and mind boggling how people still think these to were ‘just really good friends’.
In the Iliad Achilles's grief following Patroclus' death is described as similar to the one of a great lion that lost it's cub. And it is also shown were living together since they were children and that Achilles and his father got Patroclus out of a mess once. And as nothing sexual between them is described in the Iliad, I'd see it more reasonable to conclude that Patroclus was more of a little brother, or an adopted son to Achilles then, you know, a boyfriend. Not to mention that Achilles was already in love with Briseis and called her "wife".
"Those who cannot conceive of Friendship as a substantive love but only as a disguise or elaboration of Eros betray the fact that they have never had a Friend." -CS Lewis
. Too many quotes, too many interpretations. So I simply stuck with The song of Achillies take on the story. While not necessary a romantic or sexual relation, to me they are nothing less than soulmates. About the Lion cub comparison I just took it that Achillies feels very protective of Patrocolus. That's it. Usually greek symbolism seems very surface level (Atleast how I felt when reading Saphos poems which is the only Greek text I've properly read).
Book 19 is more like Achilles: I will go fight to avenge my dear friend now Odysseus: But you haven't eat breakfast yet Achilles: And? Odysseus: ... please eat Achilles: *nO* Zeus; This is so saD, Athenna, go feed them
I mean...beauty is the only thing Aphrodite has going for her. Athena is intelligent and Hera is literally the queen of the gods. Of course they have better things to do.
You missed the most important part where Priam goes to Achilles to beg for his son Hector’s body so he can bury him properly and say goodbye. Achilles is so moved by this that his anger subsides and he agrees. The epic essentially begins with the line, “ let us speak of the rage of Achilles”. More or less. Achilles spends nearly all of the story mad at Agammenon, pouting in his tent, ticked off about his girlfriend being held hostage, letting his boyfriend die and killing as many Trojans as possible before finally killing Hector, desecrating his body. Even after this he is still angry til Priam comes to beg his favour. Achilles rage dissolves. In a sense the Iliad is about the destructiveness of senseless anger that can only be defeated by love. If this was not the theme then I doubt the Iliad would be so revered.
With a dose of "War is horrible" because everyone is tired and wants to go home because they've been stuck fighting for the past 9 years and a lot of the random lists of names of people killing and being killed were (probably) well-known heroes from other stories, either saying "This was a big, grand battle!" or "Look at how many people died over something so stupid, war sucks."
The word Orange in Hebrew is Tapuz תפוז which is a shorthand to Tapach Zahav. תפוח זהב. Put those two through a translator. You’ll see it for yourself. So it needs to be specified in Hebrew translations that it was a literal apple made of gold, not a flowery term for an orange.
That's a cool theory, but I don't think the Hebrews had any involvement with the Iliad at all, and the Ancient Greek language is entirely separate from Hebrew, quite literally apples and oranges
Everyone is talking about my boy Plato shipping Patroclus and Achilles but we also have to remember his rival: Aeschylus, who thinks that Achilles is the top and says so in his play "Myrmidons" which is now, unfortunately, a lost text, although we still have fragments of it (so I recommend you still read it, just for curiosity's sake)! Plato says in his Symposium that Aeschylus was wrong in assigning the protector role to Achilles and that Achilles is a definite bottom. Basically, this is the equivalent of modern-day fans fistfighting it over in the parking lot about who tops and who bottoms (which is both hilarious and great).
I love that it a modern view that somehow has difficulty seeing the romantic relationship between Achilles and Patroclus, but for the classical Greeks the discussion was who was top or botton, much like the seme/uke in Yaoi manga.
Achilles- Spends 99% of the book sulking in a blanket burrito until he FINALLY gets up and fights. Famous for having invincibility with a strange weakness that was actually added into the story much later. Actions inconvenience all his friends and even prays that the gods will make his friends lives worse out of spite for one guy. Diomedes- Takes up the slack when Achilles is playing hooky. Canonically blessed by Athena with magic eyesight. Had Athena act as his chariot driver at one point. Wounded Two Olympian gods but was smart enough to not push his luck. Goes on a stealth mission with Odysseus to steal a magic statue so powerful that Tony Stark named the stuff that powered his tech after it! Everyone- Wow Achilles is such an awesome hero! Let's name a tendon after his infamous totally cannon weakness! Diomedes needs more appreciation!
> Odysseus to steal a magic statue so powerful that Tony Stark named the stuff that powered his tech after it! Wait, what? What was the statue, and what did Tony name after it?
@@magiccarpetmadeofsteel4564 The Palladium. A statue of Athena that blessed the city with devine protection as long as it was inside the Trojan camp. (Admittedly, I don't know all the exact details about this part of the story). In Iron Man one and two, Palladium was what Tony called the substance that powered his tech before he invented a new element to replace it with.
@@EliteWarrior1026 Palladium is an actual metal, discovered in 1803. Though you _ARE_ correct that it shares its etymological root with the Trojan Palladium, deriving from Athena's epithet of "Pallas".
"MY HETERO LIFE PARTNER" Uh, sorry Achilles, I couldn't hear you from so far back in the closet. (That is the single best phrase I've ever heard someone describe Patroclus as. My Hetero life partner is pure gold.)
In the Iliad Achilles's grief following Patroclus' death is described as similar to the one of a great lion that lost it's cub. And it is also shown that they were living together since they were children and that Achilles and his father got Patroclus out of a mess once. And as nothing sexual between them is described in the Iliad, I'd see it more reasonable to conclude that Patroclus was more of a little brother to Achilles, or an adopted son then, you know, a boyfriend. Not to mention that Achilles was already in love with Briseis and called her "wife".
@@crofiishy 1. In the Iliad it is mentioned that Patroclus was older, but no exact age difference is mentioned. 2. Despite the age difference, Achilles was the one protecting Patroclus, and not the other way around. Patroclus was Achilles' squire and Achilles was the decision maker. As such, the fact that Patroclus was the older one just simply didn't seem to matter to either of them. Throughout the entire time they're together Achilles takes the senior role. I can recall only one instance when the fact that Patroclus was older than Achilles seemed to matter, and that was when NESTOR asked Patroclus to advise Achilles to save the Greeks from the Trojans, hoping that, as Patroclus was older, Achilles would listen to his advice, and truth be told, Achilles accepted to let Patroclus help the Greeks, but even then he ordered Patroclus not to leave the Greek camp, for his own safety, just like an older brother would. All of this shows that Achilles was for Patroclus an older brother in all but name.
I read this book as a kid, or at least a heavily abbreviated version (I highly doubt I read the whole epic). The bit that stands out for me is Achilles killing so many people the river god gets angry at him. How many people do you have to kill before the *terrain* feels you're being excessive?
@@GoldieMethransbased on that description…and not knowing the size of the river in question…I’d guess the number is somewhere in the thousands to tens of thousands
Not sure if people pointed it out but the main theme of the Iliad was essentially about Achilles coping with the death of his best friend. He does many things e.g. killing more Trojans, dragging Hector's corpse around, even burying his best friend, but it never found him peace. What gave him peace was when Hector's father snuck in to Achilles' camp and begged him to let him bury Hector. That moment when he begged, kissing Achilles' feet and weeping in tears was the most important scene in the story. the Iliad ends before Achilles was killed.
Kushikimi Minamotto No, actually the theme is futile anger. "Anger be now thy song, immortal one, Achilles' anger:doomed and ruinous". The theme is how holding on to grudges never achieves anything and that resentment will hurt yourself more then the person you resent.
No, actually the theme is futile anger. That is proven with the opening line: "Anger be now thy song, Achilles anger: doomed and ruinous". It is not just Patroclis. He finds every opportunity to target his futile rage on several different characters, some briefly, throughout the poem. He even flashes anger at the God Apollo, for example.
I love how in Percy Jackson they say that the gods can't directly interfere with their kid's lives but Achilles prays to his mom (who isn't even a major god) to convince Zeus to mess the whole war up.
That's because Percy Jackson is an adaptation of mythology lol. It takes heavy liberties with mythology (not that's bad) and different myths can differ in rules like that.
The gods are constant interfiring with their sons lives. Aphrodite literaly goes to battle to carrier her son Aeneas of the battlefield. In percy jackson however is not that the gods do not interfere in their sons lives, but they just have to many sons. Poseidon and Zeus in mythology did not care about all of their sons, but only the ones that they liked the most. Thetis cared about Achilles because he was her only son. The same applies to Percy Jackson, the gods can intervene if they want, they just dont care enough because they have many sons.
8:51 I find that often in Greek Mythology is that these instances are very common. Ares tries to do the one thing he was literally born to do, (insert literally any god here) tells Ares that nobody likes him and that he’s a disappointment and while not a mistake he is usually told he’s a regret, Ares then proceeds to become sad at the fact nobody seems to like Ares, despite the fact when compared to the likes of Zeus, Poseidon, Herakles, Athena, Artemis, Apollo, and basically any other Greek god, except Hestia and Hades, he’s the personification of politeness, kindness and generosity. Seriously nobody likes Ares and it’s actually really sad. Also keep in mind I said compared to, don’t get me wrong Ares has done some very bad things, but when compared to his fellow deities, well he’s a sweet boy by comparison.
Ares: the patron god of the Amazons, Loved his children (especially his daughters), killed his daughter's would-be r@pist, generally, a pretty nice dude, if a bit loud Ares in like 99% of media: A raging sexist warmongering piece of shit (often stupid), only caring about war, sex and bloodshed.
The Illiad was a DnD session with Homer the DM having to use divine intervention over and over again to bail out his dumbass players. Poor Achilles rolled a nat 1.
Oh god, the Illiad. How many chapters of that story are devoted simple to introducing things? Ch. 1: Here's all the peoples! Ch. 2: Here's all da boats! Ch 3: Here's some more peoples!
Okay okay- but imagine a modern day alternative universe or a reincarnation Au Patroclus : why don't you let me borrow any of your clothes ? Achilles : *war flashbacks*
Levon Gevorgyan If you are talking about in the video, that was Achilles wearing armor that was made by Hephaestus. And that was a river spirit not a god. A river with feelings is not a god.
Mr. Ghostly while we're at it Hephaestus even beat ares in a one on one fight one time. He had trapped Hera in a floating throne for throwing him off Olympus and ares volunteered to make Hephaestus let her down. Hephaestus threw some molten metal in ares face and he ran home crying to Zeus.
Achilles: I don't want to go out there and fight for Agamemnon! Patroclus: *that meme of one of the Kardashians saying 'Kim, there's people that are dying'*
**Sees a video of the Iliad (Ιλιάς) by a barbarian foreigner that is actually decent and summarises everything in 12 minutes** As a Greek, I approve 👍.
@@intensellylit4100 Strangely enough, that's actually historically accurate ancient greek slang. The word "barbarian" was used to describe those that didn't speak greek, because to greeks, it sounded like "barbarbar". Not even kidding.
@@corbinbarron8772 so you have chosen to die by the hands of practically everybody in all the non-scandinavian european countries wast of Germany and Italy...
"Man up, you gigantic disappointment" is actually putting it pretty lightly, since the text goes "Do not come whining here, Sir Facing-both-ways. I hate you worst of all the gods in Olympus, for you are ever fighting and making mischief."
Yes! my versions says To be fair, zeus is the kind of guy to just up-front say it to his face, considering in chapter five zeus says, and I quote "don't sit here by me and whine, you two faced trimmer! of all the gods on olympus, I find you are the most hateful".
"Zeus, as you know, loves screwing with mortals" It so true, you can say it in any context it will always work. Edit: Just realized it is the 666th comment. I feel like it is becoming a trend. I wonder what it all means ?
I’m sure I’ll find my way to Whiterun, eventually. Just need to take a few classes in Winterhold, become leader of the thieves guild, and become a master assassin first.
These videos are absolutely hilarious - I love them! And I love the drawings!! I'm really glad you decided to branch out and do classics because I'm currently obsessed with the Iliad (I had to read it for a humanities class, fell in love with it) and nothing has made me happier today than this video :) The only thing I found funny (and this is not intended as a criticism, including it is totally valid) was your choice to include Achilles' death, which isn't actually in the Iliad. The Iliad ends with Hector's funeral - still though like I said totally valid I just thought that was interesting. I can't wait to watch more of these :D Subscribed, instantly.
Well the book is not about Achilles or about Troy, its about the wrath of Achilles, and that wrath starts with the loss of his timé /honour and ends with the burial of Hector. So the book is quite finished.
@@Mmmmmmmmmmmac Historians could literally assume that a man and a woman were married because they were sat beside each other in a mural but two men being really close and literally wanting their ashes to be mixed to be together forever even after death means they were just really close friends to them.
The Aeneid is a masterpiece on its own though, considering Vergil ended up making a critical piece on the person who instructed him to make a propaganda piece Also... Troy story 5: for some reason they all ended up in hell
Tom Sistermans i guess your right. And also they deserve glory on Olympus! Way to go Dante Allegari, you put the coolest people in Greco-Roman history in the one place they shouldn't be! Dante's Revengo: Virgil follows him around on the fall of rome and his banishment from Florence.
2:00 see, this is the answer to everything: Sad: burrito Angry: burrito Not wanting to fight because your general is a jackass: burrito Duvet/blanket/cover-of-somekind fix everything
I just finished watching "The Song of Achilles" the audiobook. And this video was directly underneath in the recommended.😅 Of course I've watched this video already years ago. I'm just watching it again because I love Red's voice and how she tells her condensed version of the story.😌🥰👍
Apollo: "Step off kid some of us gods are sturdier than aphrodite."
Also Apollo: *Gets chased by Achilles because Achilles feels like it.*
@17mohara Hara is this a correction or joke? I want to know before I make assumptions.
@@cgkase6210 no, he means because Achilles is a fucking beast that even the gods couldn't stop. This is probably why apollo guided the arrow into Achilles' weak spot
I think that had more to do with Athena telling Diomedes not to go fight other immortals that day.
@@tatersalad76 No, I was wanting to know if he was trying to correct my spelling of Achilles, not his joke.
So Achilles was once kratos(?)
*Zeus:* I love all my children equally. Athena, Heracles, Perseus... (looking at smudged writing on hand) Arse...
Ares: Fuck you, dad.
Literally everyone hated ares because he was the god of war and he was too extra
@@vickytsak2285 everyone still does lol
@@Analog_Anarchist tru
Oh no one of your kids died
Who cares we have more of those at home
The whole Greek army shares one brain cell
Odysseus and Diomedes share it for most of the time
No, Odisseus is the one with the last three brain cells and he oftenly shares one of them with Diomenes
*Diomedes
*mom said it’s my turn on the brain cell*
They had two for the whole army, and they named them Odysseus and diomedes
Plus the actual motivation from Menelaus
I love how achilles is wrapped up in a burrito and It's canon because that one vase painting showing off his sulking is achilles rolled up in blankets like a mad burrito
omg do you have a link of the painting?
I need to see that. Ancient blanket burrito!
I had to look up "Achilles blanket vase" and you were not kidding
@@chicken595 just found it. Was not disappointed
The murderiest burrito
Achilles: * dragging hectors dead body around Troy *. Everyone else: “weird flex but ok”
Unorthodox display of hubris, but very well.
@@ultradude3447 ACTUALLY, in ancient greece, a man only dies an honorable death if gets buried unharmed; that’s why everyone is so crazily protective of dead guys. therefore, achilles- after killing him- dragging hector’s body across the battlefield strapped to his chariot was meant to paint a permanent stain on his honor, for all of the danaans + the trojans to see.
moral of the story; achilles is one petty bitch. (/hj)
@@doriangrayapologist That's actually really interesting, I wanted to know why it was such a huge affront but never got the motivation to look it up lol. But while that is a fascinating piece of cultural history, I was actually making a reference to another one of Red's videos.
@@ultradude3447 lmao yes yes. now that u point it out, i love it. it totally slipped my mind, ngl!
@@doriangrayapologist No problem my dude
Patroclus was a quite skilled fighter. He made the Trojans run back to their gates, killed several of their warriors and he seemed as he would have taken Hector down had Apollo not intervened and clouded his senses. He also had decent medical skills, all his comrades loved him because he was a sweetheart and he was probably the only man who treated Brisyes as a human being and not as a property. Brisyes only talks once in Iliad: when she saw Patroclus' corpse and started mourning him. All in all, Patroclus was more than a plot device and Achilles' boyfriend.
Achilles picked a good one.
Everyone also constantly spoke highly of his ability as counselor throughout the war. Sad all of it was hidden behind the scenes in the Iliad.
My guy even killed a son of Zeus minutes into the battle like IT WAS NOTHING-
You’re right, Patroclus wasn’t his boyfriend at all lol
We don’t know what made petroclus go out and fight in Achilles armor
Aphrodite is basically the Tumblr fan girl who ship characters based on nothing beside being hot.
EDIT: I changed it back, got tired of my joke.
...but with actual power. Scariest thing in the goddamn world.
OOOOOOF
@@HaydenX I dunno. Lives and relationships have been ruined by obsessed fangirls shipping real people and going rabid when they dont cooperate
@@blendingwitch6206 *cough* BTS, RWBY and Jacksepticeye and Markiplier
Actually - as for RWBY Rooster Teeth did give into the fan girls and the show actively got worse for it.
@@wisemankugelmemicus1701 I mean idc about shipping as long as it isn't real people (dead or alive). I was thinking more about youtubers like markiplier/jack, dan and Phil, etc. Oh and boy bands. Just. No those are real people please stoppppp
The three types of historians:
"Achilles and Patroclus were just friends."
"They were gay."
"They were GAY."
I was told they were "cousins" or "friendly"
Then told that Greece was a bisexual society and that I could come to my own conclusion lmao
@@nokachi3339 The cousins thing came from the movie Troy, which paints them as relatives so they could avoid all that homoerotic subtext and stuff y'know?
I’m soooooo in the last category
I’d say I’m between the last two
Personally I think Achilles was super gay for Patroclus and Patroclus was simply gay
@@dontrefertomethanks sure, my teacher just always referred to them as "cousins" lol
I love how Odysseus’ headband is always flowing in the wind even when he is in doors
Cause he's such a beast that even nature works for him.
DragonGuy GTO tell that to Poseidon
Where ever he his, the wind follows.......and the wind smells like rain
It's like Judge Doom's cape from Who Framed Roger Rabbit.
His headband does it out of respect,just like nick fury's coat
Let us all give thanks to _Troy_ for being awful and making Red start hand-drawing animatics for all her videos on this channel.
AGREED!
HUZZAH!
Hurrah
HERE HERE!!! 💜💜💜💜💜
🤣
Huzzah
At least the fight scenes were okay
I love Achilles so much in this book, considering the fact he spends 90% of the story doing actually nothing.
And then at the end he throws a raging hissy fit bc his boyfriend died lmao
@@slimjimjr96 hes mad he doesn't have a CBT partner
And also considering that the Iliad is HIS story. ("Recite to me the rage of Achilles" or something, I didn't read the English version)
@@ΚικηΑντιπατη imagine having the same amount of relevance as a minor character in your own story I'm laughing shsjsklslsp
@@slimjimjr96 r/woooosh
The fact that all the main Greek heroes minus Achilles help protect Partocles body is so wholesome
True. Aparently everybody loved him.
@@wandanemer2630 Back then it was customary to leave a lock of hair on the funeral pyre for someone who died who you greatly loved or respected. I think it showed the link between life and death. Patroclus’s funeral pyre was _covered_ in locks of hair.
To add another thing, Hector had announced that he was going to desecrate Patrolcus’s corpse. Like, parade him around Troy, cut his head off and put it on a spike, and then feed his body to the dogs. The Greeks heard him say this and they absolutely could NOT allow this to happen. Not only because they cared for Patroclus, but because they knew Achilles was already going to react _badly_ to Patroclus’s death, but there was also a real fear that Achilles would murder EVERYONE-both the Trojans _and_ the Greeks-if the Greeks lost Patroclus’s body to the Trojans and Hector followed through with the desecration. So just about _everyone_ fought to get his body back to camp so that an already horrible situation didn’t get worse.
@@Mia-dt3gl So Héctor was planing to destroy Patrocolus body and Achilles decided to do it to him instead
@@angeljafbenitez1843 Pretty much yeah.
Chibi Athena with the "Your the Best, Around" line was the cutest thing imaginable.
ya :)
Personally I think it goes to Lesser Ajax telling Full-Size Ajax to kick Hector's ass.
no
Yeeessss!!😄😄😄😄
yeah it pretty much sums up her feeling towards aris
Red literally anywhere else: "Patroclus + Achilles = True Love"
Red here: "Achilles goes 'My Hetero-life partner, No!!!' "
@Xx_ĐÃÌĹÝ_ÑÌĞHŤ_xX Actually I think she's being sarcastic. I made this joke before I'd really seen enough of OSP to really get their style and having had more time to analyze I kind of realize in retrospect this is just a joke, and a fairly obvious one at that.
Nah, she’s just poking fun at the “they were totally just bros, that’s just how guys talked to each other back then” trope that some historians use.
This channel sells Patrochilles merch for God’s sake. Course we ship it.
the entire Iliad: Achilles and Patroclus were very, every gay.
Historians: two bros, chilling in a hot tub, five feet apart cause they’re not gay
It’s also one of her first videos so... y’know, ya learn.
“Hetero life partner” in this context comes off to me as part of the joke surrounding how the relationship is straight-washed/censored in many modern interpretations- especially considering the romantic music and close-up shots poking extra fun at their “Totally Straight, Yep, NOTHING TO SEE HERE” dynamic.
Fun Fact:
The ‘Achilles heel trope’ aka Achilles weakness because he was dipped into a river to make him immortal, but his heel wasint was NOT in the original writing and was made up as sort of a fan AU by the other Greeks to explain why Achilles was so strong.
Achilles was just naturally gifted, in the original Greek writing of the Iliad he dies from an arrow in his back by Paris that shot into his heart, not his heel. I was surprised when I read the Greek version of the Iliad because Achilles Heel is such an iconic part of his character in modern days, turns out it’s not true. See? Even the Ancient Greeks had headcanons to their favorite stories.
That makes SO much more sense!
When he was a baby, Achilles was dipped in the river Styx by his mother, basically giving him bulletproof skin. Except for his heel, where his mother held him. That's the version of the story that I know.
@@justafallperson2108 It does answer the question of "so why does Achilles wear armour?"
@@Vecchio_Rhosod85 Yeah and Achilles heel does not come up in the original story. This version was published 500 years after the original.
@@triskel8161I never said my version of the story was the definitive 100% accurate version of the story.
But it's at least an explanation for Achilles' heel, which is better than no explanation.
I believe that once Achilles learns about Patroklos' death, he actually runs towards the Trojans naked, which freaked them out so much they all fled
Hephaestus actually makes him a new suit of armor, but I almost wish he had gone in naked instead 😂
@@octaviovourvoulias3188
*guy shoots an arrow at Achilles's nuts*
*arrow deflects off*
Homer: "And that was how he was the first man with the 'balls of steel'."
What of patroclus was alive to see that
In a variant I´ve heard, Achilles literally roared, together with Athena, so loud that many Trojans ended up dead by their own comrade´s weapons as they fled in panic. *3 times.*
You’ve got me thinking there, would that actually freak ancient the Greeks out. To them doing physical feats naked was the ultimate show of physical prowess. So actually that could have been bloody badass.
Zeus: hera, can we have kids.
Hera:we have kids at home
Kids at home: ares
Oof TvT Hera: wait who’s nephaestus
@Oof TvT *yeets baby*
Angelos, Hebe, Eileithyia, and Enyo siting in the background be like-
@@yizao9289 god of war
@Renai Circular Motion Hephaestus is awesome, although Hera may disagree.
Troy Story
*flashes to Trojan Horse*
You've got some men in me.
.............?,... this physically hurts me
That is mentally painful on multiple levels.
This made me laugh way too hard xD
Wheeezeeeeee- XD
Why doesn't this comment have more upvotes?!
"Then Achillies gets sidetracked chasing apollo because all the best hero's have ADD"
*looks at Percy*
LOL, I thought about Percy Jackson too 😆
Yeah, pretty much.
I think that Leo is worse than Percy in the “I have ADHD and I’m so distracted” category
exactly
That’s exactly what I was thinking 😂
Achilles filled a river with so many bodies the River got pissed and attacked him. So Achilles beat it up until it left him alone......just wanna make sure I heard that correctly. 'Cause that's epic.
Meanwhile, Charon: YO DUDE WHAT THE HADES BRO. I HAVE TO CLEAN THIS UP!!
@@Phoebe5448 Hades do you think we can make a chair?
Reminds me of that video where a guy slaps everyone during a barbeque. Achilles just does not give a shit.
He absolutely pissed off the local river god for polluting it with so many corpses, but before the river could rise up and drown him, Hephaistos, due to Hera asking him for help, came in with his forge fires and literally boiled it (aka its local god) into submission.
That´s the variation I know of.
Achilles could not beat the river. Hera asked Hephaestus to use his fire (he is the god of fire after all) to defeat the river and save Achilles. The only guy that defeated a river was Heracles, who defeated Achelous. And Achilles is not as strong as Heracles, and thus could not defeat the river Scamander.
"Troy Story"
You've got a friend in horse
YOU DO *N O T* HAVE A FRIEND IN HORSE
@@thespacedoutace I was literally just about to say that. 😆
NO YOU DO NOT
how does it feel to be the funniest person in this comment section
You've got a horse in me
i didn't cry for three hours after reading the song of achilles to be told by historians that achilles and patroclus were straight
They were gay as all fuck
Well they were. The Song of Achilles was written by Plato, who had no input into the original story or its characters. The story is literally no better than fanfiction ripped off of Tumblr or Wattpadbor any other site. If that's your interpretation fine, but I'd say their more father and son or brotherly myself. Also considering how much Achilles womanized it wouldn't be surprising.
Same :')
@KKK Revolution Fair point, they were kinda liberal with sex.
Were they there? NOOOO
Something I can see Achilles doing:
Whaddup guys it's Achilles and today we're going to talk about why you shouldn't let your boyfriend wear your clothes!
This deserves way more likes
modern au lmao
True, sadly 🥺😭
Good one!
“i’m a healer, but-“
- patroclus
"I have actual cognitive faculties, quite rare among this army"
- says Odysseus, and Homer's verses in a nutshell.
"Now Ares hurts on the inside, and the outside!"
I relate,,
Sxlty Aye Kratos in the Background: Serves him right!!!!! HAHA
Kratos be like: "FINISH HIM, BOI!"
Sxlty Aye
Hah hah
Marching band
Sxlty Aye at that time, Ares was my spirt animal
Every. single. day.
Diomedes: Fights the literal god of fighting and wins.
And he DOESN'T get to be the new God of War?
At this point, you'd think the Olympians would be like "you know what, Ares is clearly unqualified for his job, let's find someone else".
He attacked Aphrodite’s hand. *HE IS NOW THE GODDESS OF LOVE*
Diomedes is the original Kratos if you think about it.
Ares too used to not ever being hit XD. He could smite a mortal with his thoughts if he wanted, being a god and all.
@Sadrien I’m not disagreeing with you, but if he could indeed do that why couldn't he defend himself against Diomedes?
Red: "Zeus likes nothing better than screwing with mortals"
Me: "I don't believe I remember the word 'with' in the original text"
Yeah, that's a typo, Red must have missed it back in the day
Holdup- wait a minute
In more ways than one!! *heh heh*
He likes to multitask.
It's interpretive.
ok WHO PISSED OFF APOLLO _SO MUCH_ THAT WE GOT _ANOTHER_ PLAGUE-
edit: the replies are priceless-
Don’t worry, his son will take care of it.
Fun fact: the mother of Apollo’s son Asklepios, aka the world’s greatest healer? Her name was _Coronis._
@@CJCroen1393 ah fuck. That explains it
@@CJCroen1393 Guess the Greek jinxed us
Lore Olympus happened
so now Ares hurts on the outside ANd the inside
Same
mood
I can't stop laughing at that part
he was hurt in the inside before being told he's a wimp (as there was a weapon inside him)
Ares is the most relatable Greek god.
Why? Well that’s because he’s constantly being told he’s a failure!
Lol.
“Hetero life partner”
is that what the kids are calling it these days?
Yeah -- because the idea of a guy actually loving another guy can only serve as the butt of a joke -- because everyone knows all 'real' men are hetero. (sheesh)
Yes granpapa
I say Hetero Homies
@@Adelei42069 heteromies.
@@MR-tf8lh Nice
The Trojan War: A literal ship war.
Grey Avery the best kind of war is war were Aphrodite is involved X3
Well we can all savely say that this is canon.
You have NO IDEA how true that is!!!
Yesssssss
You are right
5:26
Fun fact: Zeus actually tells Ares straight to his face that he hates him the most and that if he weren't his son, he'd be in a position worse than the Titans by now
OUCH! I mean, I know it’s Ares but STILL
I love how Ajax The Lesser is just a tiny chibi clinging to The Greater's helmet XD
That's because he's a lesser being in every single way. I'm not joking. He's just as much of an arsehole as Agamemnon. Let me explain: When they take over Troy, Ajax the Lesser r*pes princess Cassandra, who is clinging to a statue of Athena (yep, he violates her inside Athena's temple), which makes the goddess so furious, that she later drowns him on his way home him in retribution.
Anselma Reich I LOVE IT WHEN PEOPLE EXPLAIN AND PUT CONTEXT FOR THINGS!!!! I LOVE THESE MINI HISTORY LESSONS AND WHEN THE COMMENTS GO INTO FURTHER DETAIL BUT ITS *STILL* SIMPLIFIED??!??!??! IT MAKES ME WANNA PTERODACTYL SCREAM IN HAPPINESS!!!!!!!! BRUH YOU ARE MY FAVORITE PERSON RN!!!!!!!!! 💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜💜
@@carrioncrow13
Whoa-
Ffs he should have had a worse death, the jerk-
@@madisonmorris7394
NCKKFKDKF IKR
I love it too aaaaaaaa
@@carrioncrow13 You'd think that just trying would get Athena to smite him before he can go further, but welp...
3:56 I love that Dionysus is just passed out drunk on the floor. Also you should make chibi Olympian plushies. I'd buy one.
Please. I need this
I would so buy one too!
I would get the full set.
Yeah same
YES. I WOULD BUY ALL 12
I can't handle people straight up calling Patroclus and Achilles "Besties", it's just fucking hillarious
Well, it depends on your interpretation. Personally, I like to think them as such.
oh yeah, achilles, the guy who fought a FRICKIN' RIVER because his "bestie", but didn't move when his "girlfriend" was taken away... anyways totaly hetero, straight as a ruller..."
@@esuterunokitsune3556 Well, he was on the verge of fighting Agamemnon and he did abandon the Greeks for a long time because of how the king had treated them.
@@sauron8838 yeah, you're right....
@@esuterunokitsune3556 It's still valid to say that they're gay for one another but I don't think that they are, which is equally valid.
Normal people: Cry me a river
Achilles: *fill me a river -of dead trojans*
I love the way Red portrays the gods here. Aphrodite the shipper, Athena the hypeman, and Ares the disappointment to his father are all hilarious.
I like the ajaxes tbh
Fun fact: The plural of 'Ajax' is 'Aeantes'.
Athena: You know, we could probably solve this in 5 minutes by telling them this was Aphrodite doing her ships again.
Ares: Where's the fun in that?!!
Yeah, what about BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD
@@mr.potato2223 I SWEAR TO GOD IF THAT WAS TECHNOBLADE REFERENCE-
@@Fisinocean it was a warhammer reference
@@mr.potato2223 THANKS GOD
@@Fisinocean *thank Khorne
Just saying that Achilles "burritoed himself in a blanket" sulking somehow makes Achilles insanely cute. lolz.
Irisviel best girl! :)
IKR!!
I love your profile picture 😊👍
Yeah, it makes a grim war cozy.
I mean... she’s not wrong
Ah yes, Achilles and Patroclus were truly best bros. Everyone has gone on a *rampage tearing through an entire army, almost singlehandedly ending a war, dragging the man who killed then around a city 3 times to assert dominance*
Everyone has done that for their best buddy o chum
i believe they were lovers but we dont know whether they had sexual intimacy or not, but definitely lovers
Nice
In the Iliad Achilles's grief following Patroclus' death is described as similar to the one of a great lion that lost it's cub. And it is also shown that were living together since they were children and that Achilles and his father got Patroclus out of a mess once. And as nothing sexual between them is described in the Iliad, I'd see it more reasonable to conclude that Patroclus was more of a little brother, or an adopted son to Achilles then, you know, a boyfriend. Not to mention that Achilles was already in love with Briseis and called her "wife".
@@tepesobrejac4360 …except for the fact Patroclus was supposedly older. He was depicted with a beard in pottery and such, while Achilles was clean shaven, suggesting youth
@@cee_ves
In the Iliad itself it is said only once that Patroclus was older than Achilles, but as it is also said that they were childhood friends the age gap couldn't have been significant. Moreover, Patroclus lived at Achilles' home, where Peleus made him subordinate to Achilles and Achilles was a king, while Patroclus was not. These three factors alone easily make the age-gap close to irrelevant. And as it is clear in the Iliad that Achilles was the leader in their relationship and not Patroclus, if there was ever to be anyone that would have grieved for Patroclus like a lion that lost it's cub (and not as man who lost his boyfriend), that would have been Achilles, as told by Homer in Book XVIII.318-323
And finally, just as a side-note, read the Iliad, Book IX. 663-669
"What information, you just cut off his bloody head!"
"War has changed."
This part made me choke a little.
Starring: Punished Venom Odesseus
B A L L I N
Historians when having to explain Patrochilles' actions as Totally Heterosexual: I couldn't save my hetero lifepartner so imma let myself get killed
@Pony Boy No but literary no one said that. It's a joke based on the fact that Achilles and Patroclus were obviously lovers, everything points to it in the text, including them having their ashes mixed together after death so they could be together for all eternity and despite all this, historians up to this day will call them "best friends".
@Pony Boy of course! You also kill the person who mudered your friend, drag their body through the city for days, literally do not care if you're killed now that your FRIEND is dead, ask people to mix your ashes with your FRIEND'S so that you may be united forever in afterlife, your rage is so dangerous that gods have to step in to pacify you! Yes you will do that for your FRIEND!
@@reynaavilaramirezarellano1040 well, in agreement with him, the Illiad is full of explicit sex, but none between Patroculus and Achilles. If they were meant to be lovers, that would've been written explicitly. People can platonically love each other that much, and other people should really understand that, for goodness' sake. I'm not just talking about people of the same gender loving each other platonically, but of the opposite gender as well. Achilles was actually in love with Briseis, not in a platonic way.
@@V-q8is i don't know, he didn't accept the offer from Agamemnon to get back Briseis even though Agamemnon told him he didn't even touch her, he still refused to fight, i think he was madder from the fact that Agamemnon could easily take away his "prize", and at some point after Patroclus dies he even says that it would have been better if Briseis was dead from the beginning
@@jinstan9855 I think he was more pissed at Agamemnon than Briseis there, but okay. Anyway, my point is that when nothing is explicitly written, I choose to believe there's nothing. People of the same or opposite gender CAN love each other that much platonically and it weirds me out when people sexualise it.
“Patroclus and Achilles are gay,” I say into the mic.
The crowd boos. I begin to walk off in shame, when a voice speaks and commands silence in the room.
“They’re right,” they say. I look for the owner of the voice. There in the third row stands: Hector himself
*GAAAAAAAAAAAAASP*
-the crowd
anyone who doesn't think the greeks spent a majority of their time fucking men and women alike are brain dead
Patroclus and Achilles do not comment.
Mostly because they are too busy staring into each other's eyes.
P: Bro, I'm sorry I got myself killed bro.
A: Bro, it's not your fault.
P: Bro...
A: Bro...
P: I love you bro...
A: Bro, I love you too...
P: BROOOO...
@@Ray-hk1zm They are cousins!!
The sheer power of the rainbow quotations around Patroclus and Achilles is both incredible and mind boggling how people still think these to were ‘just really good friends’.
They were tent mates! *Oh my Zeus they were tent mates*
In the Iliad Achilles's grief following Patroclus' death is described as similar to the one of a great lion that lost it's cub. And it is also shown were living together since they were children and that Achilles and his father got Patroclus out of a mess once. And as nothing sexual between them is described in the Iliad, I'd see it more reasonable to conclude that Patroclus was more of a little brother, or an adopted son to Achilles then, you know, a boyfriend. Not to mention that Achilles was already in love with Briseis and called her "wife".
"Those who cannot conceive of Friendship as a substantive love but only as a disguise or elaboration of Eros betray the fact that they have never had a Friend." -CS Lewis
. Too many quotes, too many interpretations. So I simply stuck with The song of Achillies take on the story. While not necessary a romantic or sexual relation, to me they are nothing less than soulmates.
About the Lion cub comparison I just took it that Achillies feels very protective of Patrocolus. That's it. Usually greek symbolism seems very surface level (Atleast how I felt when reading Saphos poems which is the only Greek text I've properly read).
1:48 Achilles is upset about lossing his lover...a woman..at the start of this story
No sure you know what "gay" is..
Someone: Gen Z is the gayest generation
Me, equipped with the knowledge this video provided: *You fool*
''Oh! You fools have seen nothing Greek yet!''
To be fair even with the greeks i think even they will still call modern people insufferably gay while they go back to fucking the serving boys
@@ZeroOmega-vg8nq calm down there, my guy
@@CoRLex-jh5vx don't be so offended you sensitive b word.
@@wenbluepirate3954 was I ever offended? Nope. Are you offended by my imaginary offended-ness? Seemingly so, B-word
Book 19 is more like
Achilles: I will go fight to avenge my dear friend now
Odysseus: But you haven't eat breakfast yet
Achilles: And?
Odysseus: ... please eat
Achilles: *nO*
Zeus; This is so saD, Athenna, go feed them
“Friend”
Feed them to who
Zues: Dionysus, play despacito!
Cortegard0 3 Zeus*
@@nicholasloremann4741 apologies and appreciations
"The other two contenders for the golden apple were Athena and Hera, who you'd think would have better things to do."
LMAO 😂😂🤣🤣
Well they are immortal, it's not often they get challenged like this
Hera was probably pissed (as in angry and jealous) while Athena probably just wanted to join in for giggles.
I mean...beauty is the only thing Aphrodite has going for her. Athena is intelligent and Hera is literally the queen of the gods. Of course they have better things to do.
You missed the most important part where Priam goes to Achilles to beg for his son Hector’s body so he can bury him properly and say goodbye. Achilles is so moved by this that his anger subsides and he agrees. The epic essentially begins with the line, “ let us speak of the rage of Achilles”. More or less. Achilles spends nearly all of the story mad at Agammenon, pouting in his tent, ticked off about his girlfriend being held hostage, letting his boyfriend die and killing as many Trojans as possible before finally killing Hector, desecrating his body. Even after this he is still angry til Priam comes to beg his favour. Achilles rage dissolves. In a sense the Iliad is about the destructiveness of senseless anger that can only be defeated by love. If this was not the theme then I doubt the Iliad would be so revered.
Absolutely!
With a dose of "War is horrible" because everyone is tired and wants to go home because they've been stuck fighting for the past 9 years and a lot of the random lists of names of people killing and being killed were (probably) well-known heroes from other stories, either saying "This was a big, grand battle!" or "Look at how many people died over something so stupid, war sucks."
@@quinnholleman1547 until the odyssey...
Fun fact: Golden Apple translates in Hebrew to “Orange”.
This whole war started because of an orange.
Think about that
Wha... No nonononononononono, you're bullshitting. What??? XD HOW THE FUK???
The word Orange in Hebrew is Tapuz
תפוז
which is a shorthand to Tapach Zahav. תפוח זהב.
Put those two through a translator. You’ll see it for yourself.
So it needs to be specified in Hebrew translations that it was a literal apple made of gold, not a flowery term for an orange.
Yeah but, a delicious orange/golden apple!
But its a greek story, not isreali
That's a cool theory, but I don't think the Hebrews had any involvement with the Iliad at all, and the Ancient Greek language is entirely separate from Hebrew, quite literally apples and oranges
"Somewhere between two hundred and too many!" is a brilliant expression. I am hereby stealing it!
Everyone is talking about my boy Plato shipping Patroclus and Achilles but we also have to remember his rival: Aeschylus, who thinks that Achilles is the top and says so in his play "Myrmidons" which is now, unfortunately, a lost text, although we still have fragments of it (so I recommend you still read it, just for curiosity's sake)! Plato says in his Symposium that Aeschylus was wrong in assigning the protector role to Achilles and that Achilles is a definite bottom. Basically, this is the equivalent of modern-day fans fistfighting it over in the parking lot about who tops and who bottoms (which is both hilarious and great).
I love that it a modern view that somehow has difficulty seeing the romantic relationship between Achilles and Patroclus, but for the classical Greeks the discussion was who was top or botton, much like the seme/uke in Yaoi manga.
Achilles- Spends 99% of the book sulking in a blanket burrito until he FINALLY gets up and fights. Famous for having invincibility with a strange weakness that was actually added into the story much later. Actions inconvenience all his friends and even prays that the gods will make his friends lives worse out of spite for one guy.
Diomedes- Takes up the slack when Achilles is playing hooky. Canonically blessed by Athena with magic eyesight. Had Athena act as his chariot driver at one point. Wounded Two Olympian gods but was smart enough to not push his luck. Goes on a stealth mission with Odysseus to steal a magic statue so powerful that Tony Stark named the stuff that powered his tech after it!
Everyone- Wow Achilles is such an awesome hero! Let's name a tendon after his infamous totally cannon weakness!
Diomedes needs more appreciation!
> Odysseus to steal a magic statue so powerful that Tony Stark named the stuff that powered his tech after it!
Wait, what? What was the statue, and what did Tony name after it?
@@magiccarpetmadeofsteel4564
The Palladium. A statue of Athena that blessed the city with devine protection as long as it was inside the Trojan camp. (Admittedly, I don't know all the exact details about this part of the story).
In Iron Man one and two, Palladium was what Tony called the substance that powered his tech before he invented a new element to replace it with.
@@EliteWarrior1026 Palladium is an actual metal, discovered in 1803. Though you _ARE_ correct that it shares its etymological root with the Trojan Palladium, deriving from Athena's epithet of "Pallas".
I don’t think Palladium powers the arc reactor, it’s just one of the components.
1:56 “And refuses to come out for anything”
Years later: We’ll I’m a big gay and I’m coming out as the biggest gay in the world.
Oh god, why haven't I commented this sooner?
Why has no one said this before
When did that happen?
batshineman , á vine compilation made by Red
LOL Mood >D
"all the best heroes have ADD"
see also: Percy Jackson
Not that shit again
He's not a hero
You’ve read it I hope
The books right??? Cause the movies are awful
The Nerd
Does that mean I’m a hero🐒
Instead of "Zeus screwing with mortals"
It's really "Zeus screwing mortals"
tesshas4cats
Yes, but the first is true as well.
It’s both
tesshas4cats nice pfp my dude
*ba-dum tssh"
(Angery Hera Noises)
"MY HETERO LIFE PARTNER"
Uh, sorry Achilles, I couldn't hear you from so far back in the closet.
(That is the single best phrase I've ever heard someone describe Patroclus as. My Hetero life partner is pure gold.)
In the Iliad Achilles's grief following Patroclus' death is described as similar to the one of a great lion that lost it's cub. And it is also shown that they were living together since they were children and that Achilles and his father got Patroclus out of a mess once. And as nothing sexual between them is described in the Iliad, I'd see it more reasonable to conclude that Patroclus was more of a little brother to Achilles, or an adopted son then, you know, a boyfriend. Not to mention that Achilles was already in love with Briseis and called her "wife".
@@tepesobrejac4360 you know patroclus was older than him by like three or four years right
@@crofiishy
1. In the Iliad it is mentioned that Patroclus was older, but no exact age difference is mentioned.
2. Despite the age difference, Achilles was the one protecting Patroclus, and not the other way around. Patroclus was Achilles' squire and Achilles was the decision maker. As such, the fact that Patroclus was the older one just simply didn't seem to matter to either of them. Throughout the entire time they're together Achilles takes the senior role. I can recall only one instance when the fact that Patroclus was older than Achilles seemed to matter, and that was when NESTOR asked Patroclus to advise Achilles to save the Greeks from the Trojans, hoping that, as Patroclus was older, Achilles would listen to his advice, and truth be told, Achilles accepted to let Patroclus help the Greeks, but even then he ordered Patroclus not to leave the Greek camp, for his own safety, just like an older brother would. All of this shows that Achilles was for Patroclus an older brother in all but name.
The mere concept of brotherly love: "What am I, chopped liver?"
I read this book as a kid, or at least a heavily abbreviated version (I highly doubt I read the whole epic). The bit that stands out for me is Achilles killing so many people the river god gets angry at him. How many people do you have to kill before the *terrain* feels you're being excessive?
A lot, probably
An absolute megaton, since the local river god actually complained to Achilles that his river is struggling to flow due to so many bodies.
@@GoldieMethransbased on that description…and not knowing the size of the river in question…I’d guess the number is somewhere in the thousands to tens of thousands
@@WorldWeave Oh yes!
@@WorldWeavethe river is the Scamander and it exists there in Turkey
Not sure if people pointed it out but the main theme of the Iliad was essentially about Achilles coping with the death of his best friend. He does many things e.g. killing more Trojans, dragging Hector's corpse around, even burying his best friend, but it never found him peace. What gave him peace was when Hector's father snuck in to Achilles' camp and begged him to let him bury Hector. That moment when he begged, kissing Achilles' feet and weeping in tears was the most important scene in the story. the Iliad ends before Achilles was killed.
Wrote a whole paper on this. Definitely agree.
Kushikimi Minamotto No, actually the theme is futile anger. "Anger be now thy song, immortal one, Achilles' anger:doomed and ruinous". The theme is how holding on to grudges never achieves anything and that resentment will hurt yourself more then the person you resent.
Kushikimi Minamotto 'best friend'
No, actually the theme is futile anger. That is proven with the opening line: "Anger be now thy song, Achilles anger: doomed and ruinous". It is not just Patroclis. He finds every opportunity to target his futile rage on several different characters, some briefly, throughout the poem. He even flashes anger at the God Apollo, for example.
Okay I know none of y'all are discussing this but rewatch 11:06 bc he dies after the Iliad cuts off
I love how Odysseus is basically Solid Snake in Greek armor!
I love how in Percy Jackson they say that the gods can't directly interfere with their kid's lives but Achilles prays to his mom (who isn't even a major god) to convince Zeus to mess the whole war up.
I mean, technically she isn't interfering with her sons' life- she's just asking zeus to fucking kill all the greeks
That's because Percy Jackson is an adaptation of mythology lol. It takes heavy liberties with mythology (not that's bad) and different myths can differ in rules like that.
The gods are constant interfiring with their sons lives. Aphrodite literaly goes to battle to carrier her son Aeneas of the battlefield.
In percy jackson however is not that the gods do not interfere in their sons lives, but they just have to many sons. Poseidon and Zeus in mythology did not care about all of their sons, but only the ones that they liked the most. Thetis cared about Achilles because he was her only son. The same applies to Percy Jackson, the gods can intervene if they want, they just dont care enough because they have many sons.
in Percy Jackson that’s just to make his life harder lol…..
8:51 I find that often in Greek Mythology is that these instances are very common. Ares tries to do the one thing he was literally born to do, (insert literally any god here) tells Ares that nobody likes him and that he’s a disappointment and while not a mistake he is usually told he’s a regret, Ares then proceeds to become sad at the fact nobody seems to like Ares, despite the fact when compared to the likes of Zeus, Poseidon, Herakles, Athena, Artemis, Apollo, and basically any other Greek god, except Hestia and Hades, he’s the personification of politeness, kindness and generosity. Seriously nobody likes Ares and it’s actually really sad. Also keep in mind I said compared to, don’t get me wrong Ares has done some very bad things, but when compared to his fellow deities, well he’s a sweet boy by comparison.
Well he does have a bad rep as the god of war, but he doesn't seem to be among the worst of his kind.
Sauron Yeah Ares compared to the likes of Ishtar and you can see why he isn’t as bad as the others.
The Spartans liked him...
@@mallory2897 So did the Thracians, but neither ever wrote anything down.
Ares: the patron god of the Amazons, Loved his children (especially his daughters), killed his daughter's would-be r@pist, generally, a pretty nice dude, if a bit loud
Ares in like 99% of media: A raging sexist warmongering piece of shit (often stupid), only caring about war, sex and bloodshed.
I want my own Mini Shoulder Athena plushie.
Aberrant17 OH MY GOD YES I WANT ONE
I want a lesser Ajax
Who doesn't??
I wantboth mini athena and lesser ajax
I think WE ALL NEED A MINI SHOULDER ATHENA PLUSHIE
The Illiad was a DnD session with Homer the DM having to use divine intervention over and over again to bail out his dumbass players. Poor Achilles rolled a nat 1.
Odyesseus being the greatest Fighter-Rogue Multiclass build ever.
@@alnu8355 Until he had bad rolls for 10 years.
@@Silverwind87 Even great builds are powerless to the almighty Nat One.
You guys are legends.
I assumed Achilles' player was absent for most of the game, and when he finally did come back, he was critted
Ah yes, the male counterpart to r/SapphoAndHerFriend, Achilles and his Cousin
r/Achillesandhispal
r/AchillesAndHisRoommate
r/AchillesAndHisHeterosexualLifePartner
Oh, god, this is Sailor Moon all over again
r/AchillesandHisCompanion
Ah, the video that started the whole anime Chibi story telling format I love this channel for.
I am here after reading “The Song Of Achilles” such a good book. So emotional, intense, and gay. 😭
I just read that as "such a gay book." And didnt noticed a mistake :>
@@lyanecalico676 it's not wrong.
I am reading it at the mo, can confirm.
Edit - I just finished it and I feel empty.i need more gay content.😭
@@yuki_eerhs4591 I finished it this morning, and since then I've just been moping around, likewise feeling empty and sad 😢
@@daneroberts1996 i finished it like two weeks ago and im still having an existential crisis so i decided may as well read circe 🙌🏼
Oh god, the Illiad. How many chapters of that story are devoted simple to introducing things?
Ch. 1: Here's all the peoples!
Ch. 2: Here's all da boats!
Ch 3: Here's some more peoples!
'cause I ttotally lied before, those weren't all the peoples!
Leo Ryff well, your not wrong
You reminded me of that dreadful chapter that make Game of Thrones books look pale in comparison. That was awful.
Here’s a shield
That part was cool actually
And this, my friends, is how *NOT* to do exposition.
Okay okay- but imagine a modern day alternative universe or a reincarnation Au
Patroclus : why don't you let me borrow any of your clothes ?
Achilles : *war flashbacks*
Literal war flashbacks 😭
Someone write this…PLEASE
Aphrodite = every shipper ever
drageben So nobody likes her?
drageben I'm Aphrodite???
drageben so Aphrodite is basically a shipping god instead of the goddess of beauty and whatever type of love she is? Seems legit
Nah she’s be shipping Achilles and patrolocus together to
Given she's partially responsible for this whole fucking thing? Damm straight no one especially likes her right now.
"Man up you Gigantic Disappointment!"
I could not have summed up the relationship of Zeus and Ares better myself
What makes it even funnier is that while Ares got his ass handed to him by a human, his cripple brother Hephaestus beat a river God into submission.
Levon Gevorgyan
If you are talking about in the video, that was Achilles wearing armor that was made by Hephaestus. And that was a river spirit not a god. A river with feelings is not a god.
But still,Hephaestus has a deformed leg,bad back AND a couch potato.I think you see what I mean.
Mr. Ghostly while we're at it Hephaestus even beat ares in a one on one fight one time. He had trapped Hera in a floating throne for throwing him off Olympus and ares volunteered to make Hephaestus let her down. Hephaestus threw some molten metal in ares face and he ran home crying to Zeus.
The actual rant of Zeus is even worse though, wouldn't like it to be Ares, he's really the pissing pole of Olympus
I almost spat out my water when Aphrodite said "Now kiss"
My Latin II teacher exclusively calls this book the “hissy fit of Achilles”
They're not wrong
That's amazing! I might start calling The Iliad that now.
that's actually so real though
Achilles: I don't want to go out there and fight for Agamemnon!
Patroclus: *that meme of one of the Kardashians saying 'Kim, there's people that are dying'*
OMG YOUR COMMENT MADE MY DAY
Peak gay culture.
**Sees a video of the Iliad (Ιλιάς) by a barbarian foreigner that is actually decent and summarises everything in 12 minutes**
As a Greek, I approve 👍.
"barbarian" hmmmmmmmm
@@intensellylit4100 Strangely enough, that's actually historically accurate ancient greek slang. The word "barbarian" was used to describe those that didn't speak greek, because to greeks, it sounded like "barbarbar". Not even kidding.
@@JohnSmith-dr5zn nice.
As an american, I disapprove anyone else being patriotic, and therefore you have to leave the internet
@@corbinbarron8772 so you have chosen to die by the hands of practically everybody in all the non-scandinavian european countries wast of Germany and Italy...
So the illiad is just Achilles staying in his tent threatening to call a Uber
"Man up, you gigantic disappointment" is actually putting it pretty lightly, since the text goes "Do not come whining here, Sir Facing-both-ways. I hate you worst of all the gods in Olympus, for you are ever fighting and making mischief."
Yes! my versions says To be fair, zeus is the kind of guy to just up-front say it to his face, considering in chapter five zeus says, and I quote "don't sit here by me and whine, you two faced trimmer! of all the gods on olympus, I find you are the most hateful".
We watched the clean version in English class and were laughing our butts off XD
Especially Achilles and his "Hetero buddy"
@Andrew Gray I mean, I don't think a lot of people think Achilles is gay, but y'know, being bisexual is a thing
🎵You got a friend in me🎵 playing while Achilles tears a bloody canyon through the enemies forces
It's been 4 years and that sexy saxophone interlude is still the best part.
You mean the intro from "Careless Whisper" by George Michael?
I just want to thank Red for making this video. Because of her, "I only promise to try" has become an official part of my lexicon.
Chibi Athena is ADORABLE
Yeahhhh!!!😄😄😄😄😄
Most of her artwork is adorable
*Careless Whisper intensifies*
Damn Achilles
It’s crazy how much her art style has changed over the years
I love how Ares no matter what in any story he’s just bullied by both mortals and gods no matter what
Ares never has a break lol
I hope Odysseus doesn't cut himself on all that edge.
Popalupa fun fact: he's the grandson of Hermes.
And he is the star or his own spin-off sequel where him and his gang go on a wacky trip across the Mediterranean so he can get home for dinner!
“my hetero life partner” is the new no homo
lol.... "new" ?
100% Heterosexual
"Zeus, as you know, loves screwing with mortals"
It so true, you can say it in any context it will always work.
Edit: Just realized it is the 666th comment. I feel like it is becoming a trend. I wonder what it all means ?
i saw that part and thought "any definition of the word fit this sentence"
He also loves screwing mortals, as half of everyone in Greek mythology is a direct descendant of him.
Yes. That was the joke.
Mia Binachon illuminatatatatat confirmed
It's Greek mythology in one sentence
"Because all the best heroes have ADD, just ask any sidequesting Skyrim character."
I laughed too hard at this call out
I’m sure I’ll find my way to Whiterun, eventually. Just need to take a few classes in Winterhold, become leader of the thieves guild, and become a master assassin first.
God the part where Achilles learn patroklos died is so beyond epic. Him tearing his hair and eye. The living embodiment of vengeance
These videos are absolutely hilarious - I love them! And I love the drawings!! I'm really glad you decided to branch out and do classics because I'm currently obsessed with the Iliad (I had to read it for a humanities class, fell in love with it) and nothing has made me happier today than this video :)
The only thing I found funny (and this is not intended as a criticism, including it is totally valid) was your choice to include Achilles' death, which isn't actually in the Iliad. The Iliad ends with Hector's funeral - still though like I said totally valid I just thought that was interesting.
I can't wait to watch more of these :D Subscribed, instantly.
***** Ha me too! I kind of get why it does that, but it still seems unfinished when he doesn't die at the end.
Well the book is not about Achilles or about Troy, its about the wrath
of Achilles, and that wrath starts with the loss of his timé /honour and
ends with the burial of Hector. So the book is quite finished.
I feel so bad for Helen, she can never catch a break
I love that the statement “Zeus loves screwing with mortals” is a double entendre.
"Hetero life partners"
Didn't Patroclus give Achilles a handy on at least 2 seperate occasions?
Well historians must have thought Achilles was just really desperate
Daphne Lexine Rosenfeld Realica never trust historians…
@@Mmmmmmmmmmmac Historians could literally assume that a man and a woman were married because they were sat beside each other in a mural but two men being really close and literally wanting their ashes to be mixed to be together forever even after death means they were just really close friends to them.
@@fictionlover2064 I mean, you gotta be very close to want to do that, like close enough to sort of merge together
@@fictionlover2064 TBF, considering how Aristotle viewed friendship, it won't surprise me if some greek dudes actually wanted to do that.
New titles for the Iliad trilogy:
Troy Story 1: The Woman War
Troy Story 2: Poseidon's Vendetta
Troy Story 3: The Plagerized Italian
Black Coffee Productions hehehe. ☺
The Aeneid is a masterpiece on its own though, considering Vergil ended up making a critical piece on the person who instructed him to make a propaganda piece
Also...
Troy story 5: for some reason they all ended up in hell
Tom Sistermans i guess your right. And also they deserve glory on Olympus! Way to go Dante Allegari, you put the coolest people in Greco-Roman history in the one place they shouldn't be! Dante's Revengo: Virgil follows him around on the fall of rome and his banishment from Florence.
Jackie Dorn we could make a case for Troy Story 6: opposite day in Dublin
Tom Sistermans what does dublin have to so with this, wrong country dude.
Am i the only one that chibi athena is adorable.
chibi everyone is adorable
Even Achilles being a Necrophile
Athena: One Troll to Rule Them All
Da Dom WE MUST HAVE CHIBI CHARACTERS OF EVERY GREEK PERSONS!!!
Da Dom I
This is even funnier paired with Epic: the musical. 🤣
Especially since Jorge may write an Iliad musical too! (Though that would be years down the line lol)
@@nixthelapin9869 I hope he does
It would be so funny if all the gods would just mess around, like they (almost) all are like toddlers with powers not toddler should have.
2:00 see, this is the answer to everything:
Sad: burrito
Angry: burrito
Not wanting to fight because your general is a jackass: burrito
Duvet/blanket/cover-of-somekind fix everything
Hotel? Trivago
Sadly it doesn't bring your dead friend back to life
“Friend”
best quote ever "all the best heroes have ADD"
Shall now forever refer to the Iliad as Troy Story.
You are a greek WARRIOR
Discount Pixar's: Toy Story 6
*You Got A Friend In Me playing in the distance*
I just finished watching "The Song of Achilles" the audiobook. And this video was directly underneath in the recommended.😅
Of course I've watched this video already years ago. I'm just watching it again because I love Red's voice and how she tells her condensed version of the story.😌🥰👍