How is it humanly possible for you not to know that true crime/crime scene cleaning was a thing? How do you think these things get cleaned up? Did you think they made the murderer do it lol?
I came across a tiktok of a person "ranking" the most "creative" ways that serial killers hid the bodies of their victims and it genuinely petrified me how desensitizing it was. some of their families will never recover from such tragedies and yet ppl wanna treat this as a quirky little ranking list.
One thing I really hate in the true crime/commentary space is the whole “he didn’t let the police search his vehicle,” “he lawyered up,” thing. You bet your ass I’d ask for a lawyer no matter what. I don’t trust the police. That shouldn’t be some sort of admission of guilt. The speculation is a little dangerous.
a lot of true crime youtubers are very pro cop, which actually makes no sense to me, so many cases go unsolved and so many lives that could have been saved aren't *because* of the police
it's literally copaganda, even if the true crimers don't realize that. like, talking about "lawyering up" or whatever in a negative way plays right in the hands of cops.
yeah, exactly. If something cant be used as an admittion of guilt in court then it shouldnt be presented as such in true crime videos. Getting a lawyer is a good fucking move and your legal right, not an admittion of guilt, refusing a lie detector test (or failing a lie detector test) isnt an admission of guilt (lie detector results arent admissible as evidence in court, at least not in the US. And is used by police mostly to study how the suspect acts or as reason to detain a suspect/to make a suspect stay). I dunno, something about true crime people speculating in real cases is really weird and unsetteling to me
@@ciciamanda. it's also really fucking dangerous to spread this mindset!! like, there will be real people impacted by this. cops are never your friends and if you are in this mindset of "If I get a lawyer others will think I'm guilty" THAT WILL END BADLY FOR YOU!! sorry for yelling but jeez I fucking hate this shit so much.
You're right about most channels in this genre. The past few weeks alone, with the Depp trial, have proven the explosion within the public of armchair detectives, psychologists, doctors, lawyers etc. Oh, and let's not forget body language analysts; there's a real (septic tank) overflow of them.
these past few weeks have been hell for anyone who doesn't see the Depp trial as some sort of reality show, also especially hell for anyone who's been through abuse, horrible, had to unfollow at least 4 creators I thought were sensible people
I used to think most people would find it extremely tasteless to make Epic Meme Compilations about a trial discussing domestic violence and sexual assault TH-cam has once again disappointed me
Like.........whether or not you think Depp is completely innocent, how is this a good idea? Making "Heard TOLD OFF by SAVAGE lawyer" is entertaining to people? HOW? It's like if people made youtube poops out of the casey anthony trial. Read the room man
@@OddMike people are making thirsty tiktoks about graphic descriptions of sexual assault, idc if you think Amber is the devil incarnate, that is honestly so disturbing, Depp won't see those jokes but other people who have been through SA most definitely will, I've hated the internet so much more than usual these days
one true crime youtuber said that it's essentially 'sketchy to not let the cops search your house' when they ask like even if u don't have anything to hide why would u let thrm in lol
also cause if they insist to search your home without any valid reason they can always plant something so they don't have to continue looking?? Which has historically happened a lot with people who've been wrongly accused, searched and arrested
I read in the comments of a Philosophy Tube video "I don't care about privacy 'cause I've got nothing to hide" is like saying "I don't care about free speech 'cause I've got nothing to say".
If I did nothing wrong, I have EVERYTHING to hide. If I've broken no laws, the inside of my house is nobody's business! If you're a cop, get a warrant or fuck off!
Bailey Serian's tweet about being "sad the trial is over :'(" has kind of ruined my opinion of her. Before it was her telling stories, but now I can't really look at it without thinking wow. I don't think there ever was any sincerity if this is how she acts with an ongoing case.
My thoughts exactly. It's easier to think that she puts on a persona for the videos, to give the content a certain 'style'. But in that tweet she reacted as herself, not a constructed persona. Plus, it's astounding to me that a person with sucha big platform and content about most sensitive topics would look at that tweet and be like: "yep, that sounds good, publish". Never had Twitter, but it seems to disconnect people's judgment center.
@@Maialeen To be honest, I didn't think much about them at all. I guess it was a bit of cognitive dissonance. I was more focused on the story and the details of the case rather than the beauty looks, honestly.
Same, the way she acted throughout the trial completely tainted the way I look at her. I had to unsubscribe and made me reevaluate the true crime channels I follow.
I want her to address it so badly. Because I do miss the trial… but I don’t miss the trial itself. I miss the COMMUNITY the situation built. And I’m just hoping that’s what Bailey meant. Her not addressing it though… makes me think it wasn’t.
this year, i wrote a research paper about sensationalism in true crime tiktok and some of the things i saw were sickening. my personal least favourite was one in which the creator basically blamed the murder of a young child on astrology: “and you know 18° and 22° had something to do with it” was the exact quote. i don’t think i’m ever going to forget those words
this is the exact reason why i uninstalled TikTok, that and people making videos like "what's your favorite murder case ❤️ (picture of a crime scene, picture of the victims body)" they really treat it like some fun thing and not a horrible tragedy
Honestly tiktok as a whole treats things as super quirky stuff or doesn't really evaluate facts or become objective and there's more fake or subjective than objective on Tiktok. Thankfully I never installed that app.
@@stayviz first of all, thank you for asking. i’m flattered that anybody would want to read a 30 page research paper. i wrote it when i was like 16 and, i’m gonna be honest, it wasn’t as good as i would want it to be. because of this, i don’t have it out anywhere, but i might revisit the topic sometime in the future
As a family member of a murder victim it is hard to watch how disrespectful some of these channels are to families like mine. Our pain and loss is not just there for you to exploit for entertainment, this is something we have to live with everyday it is not a joke.
I completely agree. I came across a podcast episode about my family member and it was so jarring to hear them read an ad for Hello Fresh before talking about such a grusome and traumatic situation. I’m sorry you went through that and I hope things get easier to deal with
@@awkwardotter13 i was really mad at alex jones and his cultists harrassing the parents of the sandy hook kids being murdered because they didnt "cry enough" as someone whos brother was murdered , i was on the news about it and i did laugh ,when i was speaking on his laugh so i said mentioned that "he had the best laugh" it doesnt mean i wasnt grieving i swear some of these true crime channels watch too many movies of people grieving not every grieves the same way, and life isnt a movie or tv show i also was in a crime victims therapy group and each person grieved differently to a family member being murdered
I'm not sure how to word this, but Stephanie Soo laughing and joking while talking about the horrible misfortune of others after the Nikocado drama is... kinda sickening?
Her crying like a baby over Nikocado while yucking it up over crimes where the victim's families are still alive is pretty sobering. How can anyone stand her, I see her as a total opportunist with no empathy for anyone other than herself.
I remember being hooked upon her content during my edgy teen phase, I find her so unbearable now. Even the titles and descriptions of her true crime podcasts are written as if its from a thriller novel to get more clicks. She makes very insensitive "jokes" while covering the cases and she doesn't get called out for it because she has created a "dumb, quirky girl" persona online over the years.
Yeah its so odd how people defend her like she's Nicki Minaj or something 😭 the objective facts of her continuous insensitivity towards them is clearly there but a lot scrub it off! *I only compared the defending to Nicki because barbz are always really keen to defending her
"this woman got mugged, stabbed, burned in an oven, taken apart, cooked in a casserole and served to her neighbours" *snacks on hot noodle sprinkled with cheeto dust*
Whenever I hear stuff about the depp/heard trial and people treating it like a TV show I wanna physically throw up. These are real people and we need to treat it that way. Ironically meat canyon’s video is pretty accurate, lol.
I saw a sewing/crafting channel made a pro-depp video where she made a godawful Amber Heard rug and I HAD been interested in watching her videos but then I wasn’t anymore. Regardless of the trial, that’s gross
@@morganwentworth2041 So many people have shown how little class they have during this trial. I've lost a lot of faith in humanity cause we have not come far at all.
@Glittery Faery I’d say the blame for that lands squarely at Ms. Heard’s feet. Depp wanted eyes on the trial - he fought for it to be public so that the media could cover it heavily - so that his name could be cleared in the court of public opinion. Given that he’s saying that he had part of a finger cut off, and was repeatedly hit, and he wants people to see the trial, I’d say that respecting the real people involved kind of involves watching the trial.
The ONLY channel I've come across that balances humor and tragedy well is Ask A Mortician, because Caitlin comes from a place of wanting to educate and get people to think differently about death. Most True Crime feels so exploitative.
I feel like she and Cold Hands Hosts would both find the crime scene cleaning videos fascinating from the perspective of working in that field and helping the families of people affected. I can see them being useful to people wanting to go into forensics/pathology work for sure.
I like how Caitlin has respect and only jokes in the most tame way about things she discusses, no recent deaths get made light of and she seems like she GETS how fine the line between mockery and trying to not be too clinical and dry and I can't think of once where she crossed it.
Since Caitlin deals with death and bereavement in her "day job", it's hardly a surprise that she is able to handle contrast of tragedy and comedy so well. I find that people who actually deal with death in their daily lives do the balance best. They know the mundane reality of death, but also understand how others usually react to the topic.
Coffeehouse crime is a channel that covers a lot of cases. I really dislike most 'true crime' content beyond JCS type stuff but coffeehouse to me seems very respectful and well researched, the best part is how he prioritizes focussing on the victims lives over the perpetrators (something that i think is often overlooked, which is such a shame becuase we should be mourning the loss, not prioritizing obsessing over the evil behind it) I have no doubt others will most likely disagree, especially people who just disagree with the practise in general (its understandable, people draw the line in different places with this type of thing). But i think if its respectful and seemingly well intentioned/researched (especially if they're linking charities etc) and raising awareness, some channels who cover true crime seem to be acceptable, others however are definitely not (by anyones standards)
I have had friends murdered, one of them was covered on a channel. I know people will always have a morbid fascination but so many pump out trash because viewers being removed from situations like that take it as stories. So much disrespect to the victims because they seem to know about the murderers more. It will sadly continue just to put out junk because it’s just bedtime background for many they don’t really care.
I enjoy Stephanie Harlowe for the the very reason that she tells the story of the victim, not the perpetrator. She talks about the type of person they were and what they enjoyed doing prior to their death. She is the only true crime I can stomach these days, because it feel gross to treat these topics so trivially (doing makeup or other things while speaking as if the story is gossip).
Curious what channel and what you didn't like about their coverage. Was it just covering it in general (in which case, what do you think about the mainstream news covering murders?) or was the the extra stuff like attempting to add jokes to the story that made it bad?
@@SuperNuclearUnicorn I can’t remember the channel as was sent by another friend last year. I think when channels add gimmicks to their content on such a serious subject it feels disrespectful to me. I do watch true crime but tends to be channels that do the extra work and talk about the victim. I don’t like how gossipy some channels sound like they’re talking about the latest episode of some Netflix series.
Also it was a pretty famous case so it’s been covered by the news, it was my SIL’s cousin and wife that was murdered in Antigua about 10yrs ago. Just hate they were reduced to a top 5 type video. It’s just bizarre when you’ve seen both sides
Idk why I always get attacked when I bring this up, it’s gross and disrespectful to watch someone laugh and put on their makeup, or do asmr (wtffff), while talking so casually about someone who was brutally murdered. Edit: I get people hate asmr, but the genre itself is suppose to be relaxing to the person watching it, not straight up getting “tingles” while hearing about some parent who’s straight up killed their kid
hii omg didn't expect to find you here the worst thing is that because i watch true crime (not asmr) whenever i just search up "asmr" to fall asleep there is always at least one true crime ASMR video, its so disconcerting
When I made a comment about pulling back from true crime videos because my mindset had changed, so many people recommended people like Bailey Sarian who does her makeup while going over the crime. OK I don't know what planet you're from, but someone doing their eyeshadow instead showing a picture of the victim or their family (if released) seems INCREDIBLY disrespectful to me. It's just difficult to balance showing respect to this victim by showing who they were while also doing your youtube thing. I get the struggle but I avoid pretty much all of it at this point for my own comfort
I think asmr and makeup are two separate things when addressing disrespect, but then again I have never found an explanation on why makeup is essentially "disrespectful" to true crime. I understand that asmr is meant to be inherently relaxing so true crime is a stretch, but people with ADHD (me included) find it easier to pay attention to videos when there's something to look at, and I do not understand why it is disrespectful to make true crime more accessible to neurodivergent people. Also, true crime tends to have a majority female audience so the idea of makeup making things "less sensitive" just seems to me an excuse for demonizing feminine behaviours as not being "serious enough" for the subject matter. Especially when you consider how women are categorically ignored for their experiences due to being "more emotional" and not being serious enough, it seems to just make the problem way worse to say that inherently feminine things are disrespectful.
@@mitosisjones If you actually watched Bailey Sarian she absolutely shows the picture of the victim (mostly at the beginning, even in the thumbnail) and centres her videos on the victims, but she also shows herself. The reason she chose to do her makeup in her videos is that she’s a PROFESSIONAL MAKEUP ARTIST and she wanted something to do with her hands while she was recording so makeup was the best option because she knew what she was doing and could focus on telling the victim’s story. Why does your "personal comfort" matter more than the millions of people who were able to hear the story of the victim because of people like Bailey who are able to reach a wide audience? If she made the story about her, I would agree with you, but it is nothing different than the art commentary videos that have taken over the platform, the momentum of which has allowed her to appeal more to TH-cam's algorithm and share stories with more people. If you see more of a problem with makeup than other types of art maybe its time to think about why you see makeup as less "sensitive" than other art forms.
Those "tiny little mouth sounds" are such auditory sensory triggers for me. I cannot imagine listening to those and hearing her discuss actual murders.
I remember watching a Slo4n (he has numbers somewhere in his name I just don't remember) video about one of his high school classmates who had been murdered in an unsolved case. I'm a neighbor of that classmate who passed away. I just hope that my neighbor's family never see that video because it's full of speculation about family members (Like, if they're responsible or what their part may have been), how the suspect may have gotten away, and repeatedly Sloan said that 'although I wasn't a friend of (victim) I still feel close to him' or something along those lines. It feels disingenuous at best and disgusting at worse. The case has also been talked about by internet armchair detectives who clearly aren't getting anywhere with their 'investigation'. It just feels exploitative of my neighbor's son and his death.
Yes I hate the way people act like they somehow had a connection to people who have died. In high school this kid died in his sleep because he had asthma and everyone assumed he killed himself and everyone acted like they were friends with him and used his death for attention, it was so annoying. Same thing happened to my brother after he killed himself, it’s funny how people only act like they care about someone once they die.
sloan is very scummy, spreads misinformation and doesn't really give a shit. his research is as deep as a puddle, i hate how people praise him for exposing people? nothing he says is new, literally first page googls and yes, he speculates a lot. the naya rivera video where he p much alleged her ex and her sister "have something going on"??? shut up
As someone who constantly consumes true crime material, ever since I watched your previous video on the topic I haven't been able to avidly enjoy true crime as much because I now realize how these youtubers capitalize and make light of real-life deaths. You've enlightened me Orr!
The person I think takes it seriously and donates to the cause often is Kendall Rae. She doesn’t laugh or make light of these serious tragedies. It’s sad that there aren’t many who respect the stories and live of these people :/
same, I stopped watching a lot of the true crime channels. I remember a vid where the person was trying to censor as much as possible so they can maximize the revenue off their vid.
@@spacexsimp6790 Kendall Rae takes her time, contacts families for permission...does it right. She’s the only true crime TH-camr that I can stand. I’ve unsubscribed to everyone else. No, thank you..
I know some of the most famous True Crime youtubers do other things while they tell stories, and I do listen to some of them when they're talking about conspiracy theories (do your makeup and talk about Bigfoot, fine), but I absolutely cannot handle it when it's related to a real tragedy. I'm not against true crime in general if it can help other people, whether that be keeping a perpetrator in jail or knowing what they look like if they're paroled. Or even just adjusting one's behavior, but not for shock value and not while creating a "fire look" or stuffing one's face.
@@extndo64-26 I saw a true crime channel like that. I was like what's the point of even making the video if you're gonna censor what happened so you can get more ad revenue.
One true crime TH-camr that I would like to recommend is coffeehouse crime. He does a legitimately good job of providing information and focuses more so on the victims than he does the killers. He doesn’t use dramatic stock music or footage. He also does a really good job of not diagnosing people or make snarky comments.
dude, I love his channel. I discovered his vids recently, and I love 'em. and as you said, he makes sure to give respect to the victims, and his dry humor is great too. he also dresses very nicely as a bonus.
He's the best. Never dehumanizes or disrespects victims, never sensationalizes or plays up the trauma of the situation. Always makes sure to center the narrative around the people who were hurt and the tragedy of the situation. He's the perfect model of what these channels should be.
@@explodingegg123 Absolutely, I think the only time I’ve seen him kind of speak “out of line“ about someone that he was covering was the case about the 10 year old girl was abducted by the 17 year old guy who was planning to harm a young woman, but considering the context of the crime and how monstrous the kid was I felt it was appropriate. Edit: Austin Sigg is the guy
2nd coffeehouse crime as a true crime channel that's takes the stories seriously. Another great channel is Kendall Rae, she not only goes in depth with the stories but also is very respectful of the victims families and has done interviews/promoted GoFundMes at their request.
True Crime is a very touchy subject, you're basically talking about events that happened in real life that have also affected people, usually containing death/s. You can talk about True Crime however the hell you want, with a deep voice, or with a light-hearted tone, or in a mukhbang, etc. But the fact remains that these are still real, real crimes that has permanently done damage to people.
I think it's kind of in the vein of how people claim they can't say what they want because of PC-ness. Like you can say whatever you want. But other people have the right to tell you how wrong you are. Yeah, you can joke about true crime cases but you should be prepared to be slammed for it. The problem with most of these people is entitlement in the end. They think they should do/say whatever they want but nobody can criticize it in return. It's disgusting
@@ohh771 Yes and also the issue is that they should be more serious as they're playing up with other people's lives, I wouldn't mind a reaction video if the people's reactions were discussions of unsolved cases and what they think has happened or in closed inconsistent cases (inconsistencies and loopholes). Maybe even give condolences to the victims even also why do the reactions people give in the reactions videos shock they signed up to see gory things. The Vtuber wouldn't be a problem but I don't think they should be streaming a video game while talking about it or if they do maybe a calming game (like Animal Crossing) or a favorite game of the victim if they play games at all or maybe don't play games at all and maybe just maybe get a more serious avatar outfit and personality detective. Asmr and true crime would make sense but I agree with Orr there shouldn't be mic sounds probably just whispering is enough. The cleaning should be fine but don't make your cleaning related to the case you're doing as it gives serious disrespect and for cooking maybe make a victim's favorite food or comfort food or even their last meal (then just voice record yourself and record the cooking video seperately (I guess that's just a way to pay tribute and be serious at least.)
Recently I came across an animated video about tragedy that happened to my family member and it was the most uncomfortable experience in my life. Creators should be more careful to be respectful when they discuss such sensitive topics
I think videos like this one and the other one Pinely made are a great idea because it is waking people up to that understanding. Shanspeare did a couple too and I'm sure there are more.
orr i've been absolutely loving the direction you've been going with your videos (as much as i always adore and rewatch your older content as well) and it's been so awesome to see you keep doing stuff you're interested in and also able to shift the way you want. loved the last vid and excited about this one too! thanks so much for making my day :)
Thank you so much!!!! I don't know if you can tell but I'm enjoying this style of videos a lot more, I think this is more natural and the time I used to spend on drawing all the frames now goes into writing better scripts and editing the videos in a more interesting way (for me at least) all around
@@Pinely you are just an absolute natural at this, gotta say. keep it up. the casual dismissal, that's what it is. you've got a level of casual dismissal lmao. like "look at this shit, can you believe it? yeah neither can I. it's ridiculous. here's why. let's move on and do better. ya morons."
I actually pretty much stopped watching/listening to true crime, unless it's fairly historical, after your last video. I've also seen some information about how too much true crime can lead to paranoia and whatnot, and just don't need more anxiety in my life, thankee. So down for this sequel.
jesus christ finally someone talks about how uncomfortable asmr is i have autism and whenever i listen to asmr it is a sensory nightmare with all of the mouth noises and it being weirdly loud but also quiet, its a mess and i hate it so much
im a fan of true crime content adn your last video really made me reconsider the creators that i watch and even now i still take the time to consider if i feel like their content is ethical and if i am okay watching it
I'd been watching a makeup youtuber talk about crime, after I watched your first video I couldn't continue watching her without thinking how disrespectful she was being. Thanks for helping me see another view.
After hearing a sex trafficking survivor on TT talk about how triggering and dangerously inaccurate True Crime can be, I can't watch anymore. It feels too exploitative
Couple of days ago I got curious and searched "true crime is immoral" or something to that extent and found a video by some lady who had apparently met some criticism for a video she'd done where she used true crime as Halloween themed. That lady absolutely did not like being challenged whatsoever and her privilege was fucking astounding and unreflected.
@@brunamota8865 I don't believe its her, she does ghost stories for Halloween and true crime all year round and contacts the family for approval and if she can't get approval she will take videos down if a family member contacts her.
Seeing one true crime youtuber saying they didn't want the Depp trial to end on twitter like it was a TV show or something shocked me a little, this particular youtuber had been recommended to me a few times by friends as a very serious content creator I had to come here to check it out and makeup and gruesome crimes is not for me thank you. My biggest problem with this genre as a law student, aside from the disrespect to victims, is the amount of misinformation about legal procedures they spread, like getting a lawyer means you're guilty for example: people please get lawyers this is your right, thinking this will make you look guilty can end very badly for you.
I’m really like this video so far, I always like hearing your takes on the morality of certain TH-cam genres. I don’t know if this is just me, but the only issue I really had with this video is the ASMR section. I had to skip through most of it because the auditory examples made me so uncomfortable. That may just be me though since I’m not at all a fan of ASMR in the first place. I’m looking forward to more videos like this in the future :)
That ASMR whispering gives me the most uncomfortable sickening feeling running up my spine. Reminds me of when I had vasovagal response after a blood test.
I came to the comments during that section because it made me feel sooo uncomfortable. If you do watch it (completely understand why you wouldn't) Pinely actually shares our feelings about asmr in general, like I needed another reason to love him :D
It's what's wrong w/ our modern social media filled culture. We've all decided that anyone can talk about anything, not caring about best-practices when discussing sensitive subject matter or even a 2nd thought of the victim or their families, some whom are still healing & don't want their loved ones being used for clicks, views, & money by some TH-camr.
Coffeehouse crime is a great TH-cam channel for true crime. The host is incredibly respectful and treats these horrific events as the horrific events they are and not just as a story. He also focusses on the victims and tells the viewer about their life and who they were as a person and doesn't do the same for the criminal (usually this is the other way around so it is very refreshing).
pinely!! i first discovered your channel like a year ago and it didn't quite get me but i wanted to say i think ur writing has improved A LOT and these style of videos (all the ones from lately!!!) really help show off your comedic styling - just comedic enough but doesn't diminish the gravity
The Casual Criminalist is a great true crime channel. The host is very adamant about how he doesnt want the videos to be "murder porn" but rather informational. He sometimes skips sections in the script if he thinks they get a bit too in to it all and is really a nice change from the majority of other true crime channels
i really recommend the channel dreading. it’s the best true crime channel i’ve ever seen to be honest. he doesn’t dramaticize anything and it’s very factual, respectful, and detailed. some of his videos are pretty hard to watch though because of the details of what the offenders have done.
The channels without the creators face in them are always better. It seems vain to get ready and put makeup on and get ready for your limelight face shot while talking about victims who are forgotten
one of my fav channels in this vein is shrouded hand. I used to watch a lot of true crime stuff or just put it on in the background while I drew, but it started to really effect my mental health, so I stopped. what I like about shrouded's channel is always covers really unique topics that scratch that itch for a spooky, morbid story without being true crime. he also does true crime, but I like his videos on folklore, legends, ghosts, and aliens much better. plus his channel graphics are always top notch and he has a great sense of humour
Obligatory rant about Mr. Beast since Pinely mentionned liking him: homeboy pretends to care about the environment, but is invested in cryptocurrency, which produces more CO2 than entire countries. If a content creator supports NFTs or crypto in general, I instantly lose all respect for them.
I personally really enjoy Ask a Mortician, and Sneegsnag when it comes to commentary on true crime. While Sneegsnag doesn't cover the cases, and instead reacts, he's able to really easily point out when a true crime channel is being shitty, and give a perspective of someone who actually did study criminal justice.
Doubling down on the first video after the fans of said YTers tried to blindly defend them while missing the point of said video entirely? Honestly king shit, I love it. Awesome.
I have a strong appreciation for true crime stories. TH-camrs like Disturban who give detailed tellings of these stories in a very respectful but none sugar coated way. You don't feel happy or comfortable watching these videos. And you're not suppose to. But, it is very fascinating hearing about how evil the human being can be. And how some people can do things most of us have never thought of. As well as how society affects crime.
I think it's kinda ironic, how people would (rightfully) complain about reaction yotubers like jinx a way back and make whole callout videos about, but now every big youtuber has a reaction channel where they barely say anything noteworthy about the stuff they watch
@@tripadvizer4879 you realize the qualms everyone has w reaction channels aren't the fact that they're reaction channels, but that they don't actually react to anything right?
I personally loved true crime for a while, mainly coming from my mother (who’s OBSESSED with the content) and I didn’t see anything wrong with what I was watching. Eventually, I realized I got so attached to the cases/victim’s stories that I would get emotional during random moments of the day. Or I’d get angry while thinking about it and get in a bad mood. That’s mostly just me, but I also question how someone can make this content and be so calm and nonchalant about it. I don’t watch it anymore mainly due to how upsetting it was for me.
It's the amount of exposure. After hearing about so many incidents, you have to compartmentalize everything you hear to make it more bearable and to keep yourself sane. For some people, it's unintentional and a trauma response. After hearing so many stories and watching so many news cycles, you kind of become numb to it, and it just becomes another form of entertainment. Suddenly, a real-life crime is no different than some psycho in a horror movie. It's also incredibly hard for some people to truly realize how awful these things are when you don't experience it yourself. And some people never do because "That could never happen to me". Anyway, I think most people just kind of distance themselves from this sort of thing and think of it more so as a movie or urban legend rather than living, breathing people with lives that affected others'. And whether or not it's intentional is something they may never know.
I use to watch a lot of true crime too. My mom also got me into ture crime, she collected true crime books and detective magazines. Every week we watched American justice and unsolved mysteries fast forward to the mid 90s and Bill Kurtis was always on. I love true crime but I realized I consumed more when I was depressed and that can't be good at all. Balance is a good thing, taking care of our own mental well-being and emotional state is a necessity. Good on you for recognizing the damage consuming true crime was doing to you.
My personal favorite true crime channel is Explore With Us. They look at actual interrogation footage and give analysis on it. It's focused on the facts of the cases and doesn't try to be gimmicky or add inappropriate jokes. I also enjoy Eleanor Neale and Hannah the Horrible's true crime videos. I feel like they're very respectful, and Hannah has called out the true crime community for being insensitive.
I enjoy EWU, but the speculation and amateur diagnosis in their recent video on Chandler Halderson's ex-girlfriend was outrageous. They do a lot of behavioural analysis which is a lot of pseudoscience. I really couldn't make it through that video and preferred how dreading handled it.
Youre video was fantastic. Unfortunately the insanity of true crime fandoms, especially the weird ones like ASMR and mukbang true crime, cannot be understood unless you've had to face it. These people are relentless about getting their entertainment and ignore any harm that may come from it. They don't care about people, all the care about is getting their fix. And they do NOT understand the delicate ethics involved in this genre. They don't care. They think as long as the content creator speaks generally positive about victims then they're fully ethical. They don't care about the families or the living people poorly run or side show esq true crime channels effect. They care about themselves and making sure they get their content. An example of this: A popular True Crime podcast named Morbid released an episode which upset the murder victims family member. Because Morbid is primarily a comedy podcast, the victims family member did not like the jokes that were made surrounding their father's murder. This person spoke out about it on Morbid's Instagram post about the episode. Insane fans of the podcast harassed this person, yes the person who was upset that their father's death was made into comedy entertainment, a completely normal and understandable reaction. They sent the family member disgusting messages saying he was 1. Too sensitive 2. Just trying to get attention 3. Shouldn't be listening to an episode that hit so close to home 4. The jokes were fine because they liked them, the people who have no connection to that case in anyway. This went on for days. Let's summarize. A large true crime podcast upset a victims family member by making jokes about their father's death and the effected party spoke out only to have the fans harass, belittle, and invalidate the feelings of someone whose father was taken away from them too soon at the hands of another person for no reason. They said he was too sensitive and that episode wasn't for him. And the podcast, Morbid, finally deleted the post where all this was happening and then never addressed their harmful fan base about the situation. That horrible behavior was never addressed nor corrected and it will likely happen again to another victim. These are those kind of true crime fans. They don't care about people. They care about themselves and that they have access to the entertainment they want.
Disgusting ass mfs and I hate people who make money off of these tragic ass stories with no regards to the friends and families of the victims. I don’t like cancel culture but this type of shit needs to be out especially the podcaster
I've seen this in the everyday too, I had coworkers that during that case where a woman went missing while on a trip with her boyfriend and he came back, they were all playing detective and saying he was totally guilty because he "lawyered up" and "wouldn't talk to the police" Even recently I had a coworker talk about how during her studies in college for her legal degree, she got /addicted/ (her own words) to going to trials (which she originally had to do for her studies but she mostly did out of /fun/) because she found them so interesting. She even told me how she'd wished she could have brought in popcorn. I enjoy true crime, but I have too high of morals to let myself enjoy something that is actively hurting people and poisoning others' minds
@@sugarrusheb these same channels criticized alex jones for "profiting" off of victims death i told one of them (bailey siren) "isnt that what your doing but even worse because youre smiling and cracking lame jokes throughout?" i got my comment removed
@@sugarrusheb Did they ever figure out what happened? I remember seeing the reports about that, and I really felt for her family who just wanted to know if she was alright, if they went separate ways, when he last saw her. His refusal to talk raised red flags for me. That said, people shouldn't jump on other people for lawyering up. And if his lawyer advised him not to talk, that's that. It's not great for people to speculate, but I think it's still better to do it aloud in a closed setting than spouting off about it on the internet for all to see/hear.
I used to put on Bailey Sarian's true crime makeup series as bg noise, until one day I realized how messed up that is. A great replacement is Robert Welsh makeup and ghost stories 👻 💄
Yeah, it's also great that Robert has direct permission to tell those stories, as they are sent directly to them. So you can enjoy it without really having to consider the ethics or lack thereof.
I'm so glad that there are people like Kendal Rae who work directly with families and actively work to raise money for victims families or organizations that try to prevent violence in the first place or that help DV victims. Princess Weekes just did a great video on this topic too. Thanks for talking about this again Orr! It's such an important topic, especially with the depp/heard nightmare that has ignited the internet into a frenzy.
That Chapter is a true crime TH-camr who knows how to talk about crime respectfully while still adding humor. He seems like a pretty genuine soul as well
True Crime ASMR is really jarring. I personally don’t like ASMR content, but from what I understand other people find it relaxing. What exactly is relaxing about murder and abuse? Who is watching this? It makes no sense.
I used to watch Stephanie Soo for a long time and have seen over the past few years how talking about true crime and horrible things that have happened to others has completely lost it's s meaning to her, at some point along the way she became so desensitized from tragedy and death that she feels comfortable joking and making sex jokes when the case involves SA, R,... I just couldn't keep watching, even though she is very entertaining and I don't think we shouldn't be allowed to joke about tragedy, but making money off and not treating in with the respect it deserves has turned me away from channels like these.
This 👆👆👆 Like i find her disgusting by the way She does those videos and idc abt her podcast and that she is "respectful there" She still continues making those insensitive videos , like for me IT makes her disingenious and fake by how the podcast are (have never watched her podcast but everyone gives that as an example that she cares and is emathetic to the victims ) and how She does her videos laughing , eating making insensitive jokes like dam its weird impov
the moment she started doing true crime and eating, i completely checked out. i think its so weird to combine a mukbang with discussions of murder and death. its in SUCH bad taste.
In my opinion, the best and most respectful true crime youtuber is Kendall Rae. Her videos are done well and usually include either family members of the victim or a fundraising campaign of some sort. I follow true crime a lot because it is closely connected to my career path but I am disguisted by some of those videos. People tend to forget they are talking about a human being who suffered not a fictional character.
Also her husband has a podcast that is true crime/ ghost stories/ criptids called the lights out podcast. I think him and his wife ( she isn’t on the podcast) are pretty good at keeping it respectful and if josh ever makes a joke it’s usually to bash the murderer. I can’t stomach any that do stuff while telling the stories. I believe these stories kinda demand you’re full attention otherwise it’s disrespectful.
Kendall Rae, Stephanie Harlowe and Brooke Makenna are the only true crime youtubers I watch after realizing how some of them (other true crime youtubers) glorify and/or justify the killers' actions. They put the focus on the victim and the impact the crime had on people, at the same time, trying to help others prevent the crime because they care about the people affected.
I love LordanArts because he actually went out of his way to make connections at NAMUS and will help with making sure a victim’s name is added to NAMUS.
Honestly, I think the ASMR ones sums up the desensitization issue a lot of people have with True Crime creators and their communities... I think there's an issue with horrific murder cases being retold in a format that's meant to calm people and/or elicit positive reactions; these real life deaths shouldn't be used as a way to calm someone or unwind.
Some say that it helps them concentrate, because they got hit with the 'tard shovel in the womb. But as someone who got hit with the 'tard shovel too... this is a load of crap. ASMR and the True Crime combination doesn't work and will always look at best uncomfortable as hell and at worst absolutely disrespectful and fucked up. These same wankers always talk about the neurotypical world which should respect their boundaries and what problems they have as a neurodivergent. But they can't respect the boundaries and sense of discomfort of (many, many many) others???? Because it helps THEM to better concentrate and therefore to easier consume their "hobby"? No way. That's no excuse and unacceptable. Edit: With "these wankers" I mean a group of neurodivergent, mentally and/or physically disabled people on the internet who uses their disability/disorder for everything as a getaway card. It sucks and doesn't help.
Paige Christie did a similar video a while back and Stephanie Soo’s stans were in the comments defending why her videos “aren’t disrespectful”. Look at this comment section, I’m glad people understand how inappropriate it is to giggle while talking about people being kidnapped/tortured/murdered.
*rule of thumb that i just made up:* if you wouldn't do it during a funeral, maybe don't do it in a video talking about true death and murder that happened
I think the true crime chapter I watched the most was That Chapter. He went into depth about the victims, circumstances leading up to the crime, the investigation and its clearly thoroughly researched. Jokes he makes are fairly minimal and either directed at himself or at the expense of the criminal. He is pretty respectful throughout all his vids.
So out of curiosity i searched up truecrime cleaning, well it turns out there is a video of a person cleaning while narrating a crime story. what is the limit lmao
As a ghetto dweller with an arm in crime, watching the explosion of "true crime" on here has been hilarious. Ted Bundy video? Sure, I get it. Interesting fella. But now we're down to talking about B&E, describing rando junkies as "monsters of pure evil". Make me laugh
@@morganwentworth2041 yea man, and I'm cool with that. But it's only a matter of time before they get down to the level of reporting people's mistakes for the entire internet to see. Not cool.
My name is Jesse and for some reason at 21:49 I forgot about breaking bad entirely and thought that Pinely was threatening me personally and for a split second I was astral projected into the worst fear and confusion I've ever felt
So glad someone finally talks about it. Even among true crime channels, there are so few that over cases with dignity and respect. And true crime became a commercially streamlined product at this point
I am someone who does consume a good amount of true crime. I mainly just find it interesting to learn about cases that I can then look into myself. I enjoy learning about the psychology behind the cases especially. I really only watch Elenor Neale and Coffeehouse Crime, since I find them to be very respectful and straightforward about their cases. I used to watch a few makeup youtubers but stopped since I started to feel uncomfortable with it
I really appreciate the urgency you treat to survivors and living loved ones of those who were cruelly stolen from their lives. I have consumed true crime media, not most but some, I am autistic and adhd so I am both highly perceptive and still oblivious to many things. I have much to still process and understand, but I know this is the right direction for EVERYONE to develop true compassion inward and outward, it MUST be on the forefront people's well being and basic human respect and deceny I agree! We also need this energy for us disabled and neurodivergent people!!! Please remember that disabled people like me are still suffering due to ablelism from everything, we need this energy to help disabled people in every way! I hope to heal so I can help my people, I heal by laying on acupressure mats for years!
I am a big podcast person, and now there’s a big podcast boom and a TON of new true crime podcasts. They’re being advertised in the commercial breaks of the podcasts I actually like, and they are formulaic as heck
the asmr and stephanie one were definitely the most disrespectful ones. laughing while talking about smth serious such as death is just so damn baffling to me and its CLEARLY not those I'm uncomfortable laughs.
the true crime channels i like are ones that analyse the interrogation. Ive found generally they treat the victims with a lot of respect and kinda rip into the suspect especially if they were found guilty. Although my favourite one was when they set up all the evidence and made you think one person did it and then they showed you what actually happened- which is interesting to see how you can manipulate interrogations that way
Tiny nitpick - that particular vtuber is using a 2D model. There are 3D vtubers though! And a "cleaning podcast" type of video where someone cleans while talking about the subject of the day would be interesting, why ISN'T that a thing.
idk about cleaning but there are 'metal detector' guys who walk around forests etc looking for stuff, talking about history of the places, wars all that
lmao I watched that memeulous video and the brigading from stephanie soo's fans were insane. the comment section made my blood boil honestly. the amount of mental gymnastics were unbelievable.
These hit different on podcasts. On Spotify I rarely see this stuff on true crime even from the same creators because you can't see them eating and grinning and putting on makeup while talking about a rapist and murderer in a podcast I never knew Stephanie was like this though.
As someone who has ASMR triggers AND misophonia. ASMR videos also make my skin crawl cuz all the mouth sounds 😣 which makes finding ones with things I do enjoy difficult
there was an unaliving in my small suburban hometown in 2019 that became a nationally publicized affair to some extent, there was tons of news coverage, a lifetime movie, and a documentary. the woman who was unalived/"disappeared" was on the PTA with my mom, she had five kids and one was in my little brother's grade. i was venting to a friend of mine during the trial about how nauseatingly immoral the defense was for the man who definitely unalived her and the response i got was "i just want you to know you're providing amazing entertainment for a room of very intoxicated people right now." as soon as i made it clear that i was really upset and not just recounting a sensationalized case, my friend apologized profusely and it ended up being fine. but i think it says something about what the prominence of true crime has done to the way people, myself included sometimes, respond to hearing about an unaliving case. my friend's first assumption was that i had the same kind of detachment that they did, the same ability to see the case as almost a fiction rather than something that happened to my mom's friend. we often think about the sensationalized, hyper-reality aspects of the case first and the real pain involved second. part of that is just about how difficult it is for the human brain to comprehend something so terrible, but i think part of it has to do with the way some of us encourage our brains to follow that path of separation from the real emotions by consuming content that capitalizes on removing us from the tragedy. true crime content tells us we're different from the people this happened to. we're safe, even if they're not. i understand what can be comforting about it. lots of true crime creators pretend they can give you tips on how to stay safe. the slogan "stay sexy and don't get murdered" embodies this to me, like it's something we can control. like the odds of being unalived by a stranger in a parking lot aren't so slim they may as well be irrelevant, and the odds of being hurt by someone you trusted and could never have anticipated hurting you aren't much higher. like the people who are hurt by true crime cases could have easily avoided their unaliving if they'd just KNOWN to be less polite, or not to wear a ponytail when walking alone at night. if they'd been as smart as you, the listener. it feels so insidious the way so many content creators seem to be reassuring you through the parasocial bond that you're smarter than all those victims, you're better, you can keep yourself safe. i know it's comforting, and that there are plenty of other reasons people consume true crime, but it's not true. you are no different from anybody who falls victim to these crimes and no matter how much you think you "prepare yourself" you never will be. it's not worth it to be constantly suspicious of the people around you and live in fear under the guise of "being prepared." i don't know. sorry for writing an essay here, this stuff just kind of gets me down sometimes and it's tough to talk about this with people irl since true crime content has become so ubiquitous. this is a good video, i really appreciate the balls it takes to criticize the TCC, no matter how reasonable your critique is you still usually get hate for it.
Great vid once again, I've had the subject matter on my mind recently and it's always so cool to be able to watch someone talk about it in details. Kinda scrathes that itch and puts my thoughts to rest. I was rethinking about my true crime phase, and why I stopped specifically. I used to watch only one channel that specialized in true crime, and noticed that she often did sponsors, which started to bother me after a while. "Hi everyone, today we're going to talk about the horrible tragedy that took the lives of 15 pregnant people, 45 puppies and 10 old folks, but first ! How would you like to have the same glasses that I do ? Aren't they stylish ? Well you're in luck because today's episode is brought to you by Soulless Copr Inc.!" My breaking point was when I clicked on the case of Shanann Watts. Not being american I had no idea what it entailed specifically, sat through an ad and had to go puke when she started talking in detail about the body being recovered and in what state. Never clicked on another true crime video after that. Anyhoot, nice essay. Liked it
Thank you for mentioning Kendall Rae!!! Every time people criticize the true crime community I think of her bc I think she and her husband do a great job of being informative and respectful. This sounds like an ad for her but naw I just legit love her vids 😭😭
I too, am deeply disturbed by ASMR, it puts me into a fight or flight panic and so I had to put my fingers in my ears for that part, although I don't judge people who enjoy it, my daughter loves the genre. I have been a fan of true crime since I was in High School (1990), I still think the best crime shows are ones from a scientific point of view, they are just factual and educational (eg. Forensic Files). I'm such s stan for TH-cam, but it falls short when it comes to true crime. One out of five stars from me. Also, Happy Birthday! I'm really appreciating the more vulnerable, real Pinely.
To me the worst part is that more and more people genuinely seem to fancy themselves detectives and freely speculate about both ongoing and unsolved cases, or just straight up harass people after picking up "clues". Just play a Nancy Drew game.
You’ll be happy to know there are channels who mix cleaning with true crime. Came across a tiktok account a while ago who plays a voiceover over her cleaning her toilet :)
I am an avid listener of ASMR. Not only does it help me sleep but it helps with my anxiety and/or manic episodes. I also love true crime. That being said, true crime does not belong in the ASMR community. I always wonder if maybe a family member or friend of the victim that uses ASMR the way I do for anxiety/bipolar were to stumble on the video how would it make them feel? Like a coping mechanism being used to talk about a horrible time in someone's life. Just awful.
@@Peaches2456 i already said I use it for anxiety and bipolar. I listen to it during the day when I'm anxious and over stimulated. I never said I was against that in particular. My point was that family and friends of victims could be using it the same way we do to cope. How would you feel if you came across the brutal murder of someone you love when you were trying to relax? That was my only point. It feels like you only chose to reply to one part of my comment completely ignoring the other. My opinion in a TH-cam video comment section isn't going to change anything. To come here and comment what you did, not knowing who I am or that I use asmr for the same reasons you do (even though I said it in my original comment) was pointless. We are on two sides of the same coin. Accept it.
@@Peaches2456 you are COMPLETELY missing my point. I feel like I'm talking to a wall. This conversation is over. Idk if you're doing this on purpose or you're really not getting it. I'm over it.
the number one true crime creator i will always respect is Cayleigh Elise. it's such a shame she left the platform but i don't fault her for it at all.
I also want to point out that the only true crime person I watch(and also listen to because he has a podcast) is MrBallen. He videos LOOK click baity and gimicky which is why I never watched him on TH-cam(found him first through TikTok) but then I started listening to his podcast and realized he actually has a shit ton of respect for the victims. He actually talks about their backstories before he even gets to the murder part. It isn't just "oh this person is dead, here's the brutal way they were murdered" but "hey, here's what this person's life was like and here's who they were prior to their murder". Good vibes. I like his storytelling format. He's REALLY good at it.
I'm not trying to argue with you as I agree with your point. The majority of reaction channels are very lazy!! I'm autistic and love experiencing my favourite shows and movies for the first time again through the eyes of others! However I have no friends or family that are interested in the same things I like and so refuse to watch things I like. So watching reaction channels is extremely satisfying to me, seeing the difference in opinions between easy going movie watchers and film critics about my favourite movies is really stimulating! :))))))))
14:07 Oh hey that's me! That vtuber you showed was actually the one I saw that led me to make that comment. Their character isn't too bad, my concern is more with them possibly starting a genre of other vtubers doing the same thing but with less.. tasteful avatars. Of the jiggly kind. The only gimmick merging I've seen that's passable (still weird and has problems) is true crime and art, because at least in most of those they're not drawing while talking about the crime, the art is just a background visual. Still has it's issues and feels a bit wrong to me though.
I'm sorry he couldn't even say your username.. you're just a "someone" 🙄. If you watch his previous video on this topic (true crime) he bashed a couple other creators for not pronouncing foreign names correctly, and even for shortening them. Yet he can't even say the names of 2 of his FANS who literally helped him have more content (= more $$). Feels hypocritical asf
Danielle Hallen, Elenor Neale and Kendal are the only true crime channel I actually watch because they actually understand the weight of what these crimes are and the effects their videos cause.
the only "true crime" channel I watch now is Ask a Mortician. I think since she actually deals with death daily in her job, she knows not to cross any line and she's never disrespectful, she's also funny and her content is very educational
I truly do not understand how the asmr lady is making so many wet mouth noises while whispering, like it takes EFFORT to whisper with so much moisture in there ma'am please stop.
Happy birthday Orr!! Hope you had a great day :) thanks for bring out so much content at the moment, it's really great to see it all but make sure not to overexert yourself!
Grab Atlas VPN for just $1.99/mo before the deal expires 💥:
get.atlasvpn.com/Pinely
thanks dad
cool
I don't know if somebody ever told you this but you look nice in purple👍😃
How is it humanly possible for you not to know that true crime/crime scene cleaning was a thing? How do you think these things get cleaned up? Did you think they made the murderer do it lol?
I came across a tiktok of a person "ranking" the most "creative" ways that serial killers hid the bodies of their victims and it genuinely petrified me how desensitizing it was. some of their families will never recover from such tragedies and yet ppl wanna treat this as a quirky little ranking list.
One thing I really hate in the true crime/commentary space is the whole “he didn’t let the police search his vehicle,” “he lawyered up,” thing. You bet your ass I’d ask for a lawyer no matter what. I don’t trust the police. That shouldn’t be some sort of admission of guilt. The speculation is a little dangerous.
and "they refused to take the lie detector test!" hell yeah i would refuse too, it's pseudo-science
a lot of true crime youtubers are very pro cop, which actually makes no sense to me, so many cases go unsolved and so many lives that could have been saved aren't *because* of the police
it's literally copaganda, even if the true crimers don't realize that. like, talking about "lawyering up" or whatever in a negative way plays right in the hands of cops.
yeah, exactly. If something cant be used as an admittion of guilt in court then it shouldnt be presented as such in true crime videos. Getting a lawyer is a good fucking move and your legal right, not an admittion of guilt, refusing a lie detector test (or failing a lie detector test) isnt an admission of guilt (lie detector results arent admissible as evidence in court, at least not in the US. And is used by police mostly to study how the suspect acts or as reason to detain a suspect/to make a suspect stay). I dunno, something about true crime people speculating in real cases is really weird and unsetteling to me
@@ciciamanda. it's also really fucking dangerous to spread this mindset!! like, there will be real people impacted by this. cops are never your friends and if you are in this mindset of "If I get a lawyer others will think I'm guilty" THAT WILL END BADLY FOR YOU!! sorry for yelling but jeez I fucking hate this shit so much.
You're right about most channels in this genre. The past few weeks alone, with the Depp trial, have proven the explosion within the public of armchair detectives, psychologists, doctors, lawyers etc. Oh, and let's not forget body language analysts; there's a real (septic tank) overflow of them.
these past few weeks have been hell for anyone who doesn't see the Depp trial as some sort of reality show, also especially hell for anyone who's been through abuse, horrible, had to unfollow at least 4 creators I thought were sensible people
I used to think most people would find it extremely tasteless to make Epic Meme Compilations about a trial discussing domestic violence and sexual assault
TH-cam has once again disappointed me
Like.........whether or not you think Depp is completely innocent, how is this a good idea? Making "Heard TOLD OFF by SAVAGE lawyer" is entertaining to people? HOW?
It's like if people made youtube poops out of the casey anthony trial. Read the room man
@@glitteryfaery I relate to literally every part of your comment. Sending love 💜
@@OddMike people are making thirsty tiktoks about graphic descriptions of sexual assault, idc if you think Amber is the devil incarnate, that is honestly so disturbing, Depp won't see those jokes but other people who have been through SA most definitely will, I've hated the internet so much more than usual these days
i've seen people explaining the lore of five nights at Freddy's talk about murder in a more appropriate way lol
The fact that thats true.
one true crime youtuber said that it's essentially 'sketchy to not let the cops search your house' when they ask like even if u don't have anything to hide why would u let thrm in lol
that is insane, how can someone whos so into true crime be so trusting of the police 😭 like you should know better lmao
also cause if they insist to search your home without any valid reason they can always plant something so they don't have to continue looking?? Which has historically happened a lot with people who've been wrongly accused, searched and arrested
Like bro I have dirty laundry out id be embarassed
I read in the comments of a Philosophy Tube video "I don't care about privacy 'cause I've got nothing to hide" is like saying "I don't care about free speech 'cause I've got nothing to say".
If I did nothing wrong, I have EVERYTHING to hide. If I've broken no laws, the inside of my house is nobody's business! If you're a cop, get a warrant or fuck off!
Bailey Serian's tweet about being "sad the trial is over :'(" has kind of ruined my opinion of her. Before it was her telling stories, but now I can't really look at it without thinking wow. I don't think there ever was any sincerity if this is how she acts with an ongoing case.
My thoughts exactly. It's easier to think that she puts on a persona for the videos, to give the content a certain 'style'. But in that tweet she reacted as herself, not a constructed persona. Plus, it's astounding to me that a person with sucha big platform and content about most sensitive topics would look at that tweet and be like: "yep, that sounds good, publish". Never had Twitter, but it seems to disconnect people's judgment center.
And before you thought her thumbnails where she's making faces over stories of ruined lives were normal?
@@Maialeen To be honest, I didn't think much about them at all. I guess it was a bit of cognitive dissonance. I was more focused on the story and the details of the case rather than the beauty looks, honestly.
Same, the way she acted throughout the trial completely tainted the way I look at her. I had to unsubscribe and made me reevaluate the true crime channels I follow.
I want her to address it so badly. Because I do miss the trial… but I don’t miss the trial itself. I miss the COMMUNITY the situation built. And I’m just hoping that’s what Bailey meant.
Her not addressing it though… makes me think it wasn’t.
this year, i wrote a research paper about sensationalism in true crime tiktok and some of the things i saw were sickening. my personal least favourite was one in which the creator basically blamed the murder of a young child on astrology: “and you know 18° and 22° had something to do with it” was the exact quote. i don’t think i’m ever going to forget those words
this is the exact reason why i uninstalled TikTok, that and people making videos like "what's your favorite murder case ❤️ (picture of a crime scene, picture of the victims body)" they really treat it like some fun thing and not a horrible tragedy
Honestly tiktok as a whole treats things as super quirky stuff or doesn't really evaluate facts or become objective and there's more fake or subjective than objective on Tiktok. Thankfully I never installed that app.
I wanna read this but also 🤢
Is your paper available anywhere?
@@stayviz first of all, thank you for asking. i’m flattered that anybody would want to read a 30 page research paper. i wrote it when i was like 16 and, i’m gonna be honest, it wasn’t as good as i would want it to be. because of this, i don’t have it out anywhere, but i might revisit the topic sometime in the future
As a family member of a murder victim it is hard to watch how disrespectful some of these channels are to families like mine. Our pain and loss is not just there for you to exploit for entertainment, this is something we have to live with everyday it is not a joke.
I can't even imagine how it must feel seeing shit like this. I'm sorry for your loss.
I completely agree. I came across a podcast episode about my family member and it was so jarring to hear them read an ad for Hello Fresh before talking about such a grusome and traumatic situation. I’m sorry you went through that and I hope things get easier to deal with
@@awkwardotter13 i was really mad at alex jones and his cultists harrassing the parents of the sandy hook kids being murdered because they didnt "cry enough" as someone whos brother was murdered , i was on the news about it and i did laugh ,when i was speaking on his laugh so i said mentioned that "he had the best laugh"
it doesnt mean i wasnt grieving i swear some of these true crime channels watch too many movies of people grieving not every grieves the same way, and life isnt a movie or tv show i also was in a crime victims therapy group and each person grieved differently to a family member being murdered
I'm not sure how to word this, but Stephanie Soo laughing and joking while talking about the horrible misfortune of others after the Nikocado drama is... kinda sickening?
Her crying like a baby over Nikocado while yucking it up over crimes where the victim's families are still alive is pretty sobering. How can anyone stand her, I see her as a total opportunist with no empathy for anyone other than herself.
@@Nightman221k I don't understand how she, as a victim herself, can be so disrespectful towards other victims and their families
I remember being hooked upon her content during my edgy teen phase, I find her so unbearable now. Even the titles and descriptions of her true crime podcasts are written as if its from a thriller novel to get more clicks. She makes very insensitive "jokes" while covering the cases and she doesn't get called out for it because she has created a "dumb, quirky girl" persona online over the years.
Yeah its so odd how people defend her like she's Nicki Minaj or something 😭 the objective facts of her continuous insensitivity towards them is clearly there but a lot scrub it off!
*I only compared the defending to Nicki because barbz are always really keen to defending her
She lied about shit in the nikocado drama too
"this woman got mugged, stabbed, burned in an oven, taken apart, cooked in a casserole and served to her neighbours" *snacks on hot noodle sprinkled with cheeto dust*
Casserole mukbang
@@amarabertelson9106 "casserole mukbang (w\ my neighbours)"
Whenever I hear stuff about the depp/heard trial and people treating it like a TV show I wanna physically throw up. These are real people and we need to treat it that way. Ironically meat canyon’s video is pretty accurate, lol.
I saw a sewing/crafting channel made a pro-depp video where she made a godawful Amber Heard rug and I HAD been interested in watching her videos but then I wasn’t anymore. Regardless of the trial, that’s gross
@@morganwentworth2041 what channel was it?
@@morganwentworth2041 So many people have shown how little class they have during this trial. I've lost a lot of faith in humanity cause we have not come far at all.
@@Nightman221k there are people doubting Marilyn Manson's victims now because of this trial, it's actually insane
@Glittery Faery I’d say the blame for that lands squarely at Ms. Heard’s feet. Depp wanted eyes on the trial - he fought for it to be public so that the media could cover it heavily - so that his name could be cleared in the court of public opinion. Given that he’s saying that he had part of a finger cut off, and was repeatedly hit, and he wants people to see the trial, I’d say that respecting the real people involved kind of involves watching the trial.
The ONLY channel I've come across that balances humor and tragedy well is Ask A Mortician, because Caitlin comes from a place of wanting to educate and get people to think differently about death. Most True Crime feels so exploitative.
I feel like she and Cold Hands Hosts would both find the crime scene cleaning videos fascinating from the perspective of working in that field and helping the families of people affected. I can see them being useful to people wanting to go into forensics/pathology work for sure.
I like how Caitlin has respect and only jokes in the most tame way about things she discusses, no recent deaths get made light of and she seems like she GETS how fine the line between mockery and trying to not be too clinical and dry and I can't think of once where she crossed it.
Since Caitlin deals with death and bereavement in her "day job", it's hardly a surprise that she is able to handle contrast of tragedy and comedy so well. I find that people who actually deal with death in their daily lives do the balance best. They know the mundane reality of death, but also understand how others usually react to the topic.
Stephanie Harlow is also pretty good. She puts a ton of research into her videos, including the victims
Coffeehouse crime is a channel that covers a lot of cases. I really dislike most 'true crime' content beyond JCS type stuff but coffeehouse to me seems very respectful and well researched, the best part is how he prioritizes focussing on the victims lives over the perpetrators (something that i think is often overlooked, which is such a shame becuase we should be mourning the loss, not prioritizing obsessing over the evil behind it)
I have no doubt others will most likely disagree, especially people who just disagree with the practise in general (its understandable, people draw the line in different places with this type of thing). But i think if its respectful and seemingly well intentioned/researched (especially if they're linking charities etc) and raising awareness, some channels who cover true crime seem to be acceptable, others however are definitely not (by anyones standards)
I have had friends murdered, one of them was covered on a channel. I know people will always have a morbid fascination but so many pump out trash because viewers being removed from situations like that take it as stories. So much disrespect to the victims because they seem to know about the murderers more. It will sadly continue just to put out junk because it’s just bedtime background for many they don’t really care.
I'm so sorry 💖💖💖
I enjoy Stephanie Harlowe for the the very reason that she tells the story of the victim, not the perpetrator. She talks about the type of person they were and what they enjoyed doing prior to their death. She is the only true crime I can stomach these days, because it feel gross to treat these topics so trivially (doing makeup or other things while speaking as if the story is gossip).
Curious what channel and what you didn't like about their coverage. Was it just covering it in general (in which case, what do you think about the mainstream news covering murders?) or was the the extra stuff like attempting to add jokes to the story that made it bad?
@@SuperNuclearUnicorn I can’t remember the channel as was sent by another friend last year. I think when channels add gimmicks to their content on such a serious subject it feels disrespectful to me. I do watch true crime but tends to be channels that do the extra work and talk about the victim. I don’t like how gossipy some channels sound like they’re talking about the latest episode of some Netflix series.
Also it was a pretty famous case so it’s been covered by the news, it was my SIL’s cousin and wife that was murdered in Antigua about 10yrs ago. Just hate they were reduced to a top 5 type video. It’s just bizarre when you’ve seen both sides
Idk why I always get attacked when I bring this up, it’s gross and disrespectful to watch someone laugh and put on their makeup, or do asmr (wtffff), while talking so casually about someone who was brutally murdered.
Edit: I get people hate asmr, but the genre itself is suppose to be relaxing to the person watching it, not straight up getting “tingles” while hearing about some parent who’s straight up killed their kid
hii omg didn't expect to find you here
the worst thing is that because i watch true crime (not asmr) whenever i just search up "asmr" to fall asleep there is always at least one true crime ASMR video, its so disconcerting
When I made a comment about pulling back from true crime videos because my mindset had changed, so many people recommended people like Bailey Sarian who does her makeup while going over the crime. OK I don't know what planet you're from, but someone doing their eyeshadow instead showing a picture of the victim or their family (if released) seems INCREDIBLY disrespectful to me. It's just difficult to balance showing respect to this victim by showing who they were while also doing your youtube thing. I get the struggle but I avoid pretty much all of it at this point for my own comfort
I think asmr and makeup are two separate things when addressing disrespect, but then again I have never found an explanation on why makeup is essentially "disrespectful" to true crime. I understand that asmr is meant to be inherently relaxing so true crime is a stretch, but people with ADHD (me included) find it easier to pay attention to videos when there's something to look at, and I do not understand why it is disrespectful to make true crime more accessible to neurodivergent people. Also, true crime tends to have a majority female audience so the idea of makeup making things "less sensitive" just seems to me an excuse for demonizing feminine behaviours as not being "serious enough" for the subject matter. Especially when you consider how women are categorically ignored for their experiences due to being "more emotional" and not being serious enough, it seems to just make the problem way worse to say that inherently feminine things are disrespectful.
@@mitosisjones If you actually watched Bailey Sarian she absolutely shows the picture of the victim (mostly at the beginning, even in the thumbnail) and centres her videos on the victims, but she also shows herself. The reason she chose to do her makeup in her videos is that she’s a PROFESSIONAL MAKEUP ARTIST and she wanted something to do with her hands while she was recording so makeup was the best option because she knew what she was doing and could focus on telling the victim’s story. Why does your "personal comfort" matter more than the millions of people who were able to hear the story of the victim because of people like Bailey who are able to reach a wide audience? If she made the story about her, I would agree with you, but it is nothing different than the art commentary videos that have taken over the platform, the momentum of which has allowed her to appeal more to TH-cam's algorithm and share stories with more people. If you see more of a problem with makeup than other types of art maybe its time to think about why you see makeup as less "sensitive" than other art forms.
im a huge asmr enthusiast and i used to watch baliey sarian a lot. someone in this thread mentioned ask a mortician and i highly vouch for her!
Those "tiny little mouth sounds" are such auditory sensory triggers for me. I cannot imagine listening to those and hearing her discuss actual murders.
The smackies 🤢
Heavy misophonia moment, definitely.
Yess, I think I went insane
misophonia gang
I have finally found my people.
I remember watching a Slo4n (he has numbers somewhere in his name I just don't remember) video about one of his high school classmates who had been murdered in an unsolved case. I'm a neighbor of that classmate who passed away. I just hope that my neighbor's family never see that video because it's full of speculation about family members (Like, if they're responsible or what their part may have been), how the suspect may have gotten away, and repeatedly Sloan said that 'although I wasn't a friend of (victim) I still feel close to him' or something along those lines. It feels disingenuous at best and disgusting at worse. The case has also been talked about by internet armchair detectives who clearly aren't getting anywhere with their 'investigation'. It just feels exploitative of my neighbor's son and his death.
Yes I hate the way people act like they somehow had a connection to people who have died. In high school this kid died in his sleep because he had asthma and everyone assumed he killed himself and everyone acted like they were friends with him and used his death for attention, it was so annoying. Same thing happened to my brother after he killed himself, it’s funny how people only act like they care about someone once they die.
sloan is very scummy, spreads misinformation and doesn't really give a shit. his research is as deep as a puddle, i hate how people praise him for exposing people? nothing he says is new, literally first page googls and yes, he speculates a lot. the naya rivera video where he p much alleged her ex and her sister "have something going on"??? shut up
You spelled his name right
He uses a 0 too, Sl04n
:)
Yeah, I don't get these kinds of people with the detective mindset, just tell the story, don't assume who's done it if your not a actual detective
As someone who constantly consumes true crime material, ever since I watched your previous video on the topic I haven't been able to avidly enjoy true crime as much because I now realize how these youtubers capitalize and make light of real-life deaths. You've enlightened me Orr!
The person I think takes it seriously and donates to the cause often is Kendall Rae. She doesn’t laugh or make light of these serious tragedies. It’s sad that there aren’t many who respect the stories and live of these people :/
same, I stopped watching a lot of the true crime channels. I remember a vid where the person was trying to censor as much as possible so they can maximize the revenue off their vid.
@@spacexsimp6790 Kendall Rae takes her time, contacts families for permission...does it right. She’s the only true crime TH-camr that I can stand. I’ve unsubscribed to everyone else. No, thank you..
I know some of the most famous True Crime youtubers do other things while they tell stories, and I do listen to some of them when they're talking about conspiracy theories (do your makeup and talk about Bigfoot, fine), but I absolutely cannot handle it when it's related to a real tragedy. I'm not against true crime in general if it can help other people, whether that be keeping a perpetrator in jail or knowing what they look like if they're paroled. Or even just adjusting one's behavior, but not for shock value and not while creating a "fire look" or stuffing one's face.
@@extndo64-26 I saw a true crime channel like that. I was like what's the point of even making the video if you're gonna censor what happened so you can get more ad revenue.
One true crime TH-camr that I would like to recommend is coffeehouse crime. He does a legitimately good job of providing information and focuses more so on the victims than he does the killers.
He doesn’t use dramatic stock music or footage. He also does a really good job of not diagnosing people or make snarky comments.
dude, I love his channel. I discovered his vids recently, and I love 'em. and as you said, he makes sure to give respect to the victims, and his dry humor is great too. he also dresses very nicely as a bonus.
He's the best. Never dehumanizes or disrespects victims, never sensationalizes or plays up the trauma of the situation. Always makes sure to center the narrative around the people who were hurt and the tragedy of the situation. He's the perfect model of what these channels should be.
@@explodingegg123 Absolutely, I think the only time I’ve seen him kind of speak “out of line“ about someone that he was covering was the case about the 10 year old girl was abducted by the 17 year old guy who was planning to harm a young woman, but considering the context of the crime and how monstrous the kid was I felt it was appropriate.
Edit: Austin Sigg is the guy
That Chapter is a really good and to the point channel as well!
2nd coffeehouse crime as a true crime channel that's takes the stories seriously. Another great channel is Kendall Rae, she not only goes in depth with the stories but also is very respectful of the victims families and has done interviews/promoted GoFundMes at their request.
True Crime is a very touchy subject, you're basically talking about events that happened in real life that have also affected people, usually containing death/s. You can talk about True Crime however the hell you want, with a deep voice, or with a light-hearted tone, or in a mukhbang, etc. But the fact remains that these are still real, real crimes that has permanently done damage to people.
I think it's kind of in the vein of how people claim they can't say what they want because of PC-ness. Like you can say whatever you want. But other people have the right to tell you how wrong you are. Yeah, you can joke about true crime cases but you should be prepared to be slammed for it. The problem with most of these people is entitlement in the end. They think they should do/say whatever they want but nobody can criticize it in return. It's disgusting
@@ohh771 Yes and also the issue is that they should be more serious as they're playing up with other people's lives, I wouldn't mind a reaction video if the people's reactions were discussions of unsolved cases and what they think has happened or in closed inconsistent cases (inconsistencies and loopholes). Maybe even give condolences to the victims even also why do the reactions people give in the reactions videos shock they signed up to see gory things. The Vtuber wouldn't be a problem but I don't think they should be streaming a video game while talking about it or if they do maybe a calming game (like Animal Crossing) or a favorite game of the victim if they play games at all or maybe don't play games at all and maybe just maybe get a more serious avatar outfit and personality detective. Asmr and true crime would make sense but I agree with Orr there shouldn't be mic sounds probably just whispering is enough. The cleaning should be fine but don't make your cleaning related to the case you're doing as it gives serious disrespect and for cooking maybe make a victim's favorite food or comfort food or even their last meal (then just voice record yourself and record the cooking video seperately (I guess that's just a way to pay tribute and be serious at least.)
Recently I came across an animated video about tragedy that happened to my family member and it was the most uncomfortable experience in my life. Creators should be more careful to be respectful when they discuss such sensitive topics
I think videos like this one and the other one Pinely made are a great idea because it is waking people up to that understanding. Shanspeare did a couple too and I'm sure there are more.
orr i've been absolutely loving the direction you've been going with your videos (as much as i always adore and rewatch your older content as well) and it's been so awesome to see you keep doing stuff you're interested in and also able to shift the way you want. loved the last vid and excited about this one too! thanks so much for making my day :)
that reminded me to Patreon like I said I was gonna last time lol thanks
bc I agreeeeee
Thank you so much!!!! I don't know if you can tell but I'm enjoying this style of videos a lot more, I think this is more natural and the time I used to spend on drawing all the frames now goes into writing better scripts and editing the videos in a more interesting way (for me at least) all around
@@Pinely you are just an absolute natural at this, gotta say. keep it up.
the casual dismissal, that's what it is. you've got a level of casual dismissal lmao. like "look at this shit, can you believe it? yeah neither can I. it's ridiculous. here's why. let's move on and do better. ya morons."
@@Pinely it definitely looks like you’re enjoying it more, so it makes us enjoy it more! thank you so much for your hard work 🤍
Coffee house crime is a genuinely respectful, well researched and interesting true crime channel
Yes! And Dreading
Yes and I love how he always pays respects to all the family and victims involved 🙏
@@tonybalony1811 I love dreading they are so respectful
Yeah no his thumbnails are all sorts of weird and often demeaning to the victims
@@alinamunteanu4250 how?
I actually pretty much stopped watching/listening to true crime, unless it's fairly historical, after your last video. I've also seen some information about how too much true crime can lead to paranoia and whatnot, and just don't need more anxiety in my life, thankee. So down for this sequel.
jesus christ finally someone talks about how uncomfortable asmr is
i have autism and whenever i listen to asmr it is a sensory nightmare with all of the mouth noises and it being weirdly loud but also quiet, its a mess and i hate it so much
Anytime I listen to asmr I feel a strong impulse to put my head in a oven lmao
It makes me want to hurt myself, I actually get the urge to punch my legs or scrape my skin. I don’t know why it upsets me so much.
@@adeer87 you might have misophonia.
@@adeer87 Sounds a lot like misophonia tbh
I like the ones where its more scenic and they aren't smacking their lips together personally
im a fan of true crime content adn your last video really made me reconsider the creators that i watch and even now i still take the time to consider if i feel like their content is ethical and if i am okay watching it
I'd been watching a makeup youtuber talk about crime, after I watched your first video I couldn't continue watching her without thinking how disrespectful she was being. Thanks for helping me see another view.
After hearing a sex trafficking survivor on TT talk about how triggering and dangerously inaccurate True Crime can be, I can't watch anymore. It feels too exploitative
I have stopped watching a few makeup channels because they started making true crime videos
Was it hailey elizabeth because if it was, she actually stopped doing the makeup
@@_Mic_helle_ definitely her, some smaller ones too
Bailey sarien? I used to watch her but she’s become increasingly more disrespectful.
Coffee House Crime, Dave's Lemonade and JCS (whenever he actually posts) are the only true crime channels worth watching
I watch those and "fear files"!
yes a fellow daves lemonade fan!
@@babyvia6712 fear files used to be very ghoulish, but they shaped up a lot in the past year.
Couple of days ago I got curious and searched "true crime is immoral" or something to that extent and found a video by some lady who had apparently met some criticism for a video she'd done where she used true crime as Halloween themed.
That lady absolutely did not like being challenged whatsoever and her privilege was fucking astounding and unreflected.
Stephanie Harlowe?
Who?
Was it Stephanie Harlowe?
@@brunamota8865 I don't believe its her, she does ghost stories for Halloween and true crime all year round and contacts the family for approval and if she can't get approval she will take videos down if a family member contacts her.
@@bryannamohan9964 she used missy bevers and elisabeth olten for harloween
Seeing one true crime youtuber saying they didn't want the Depp trial to end on twitter like it was a TV show or something shocked me a little, this particular youtuber had been recommended to me a few times by friends as a very serious content creator I had to come here to check it out and makeup and gruesome crimes is not for me thank you. My biggest problem with this genre as a law student, aside from the disrespect to victims, is the amount of misinformation about legal procedures they spread, like getting a lawyer means you're guilty for example: people please get lawyers this is your right, thinking this will make you look guilty can end very badly for you.
I’m really like this video so far, I always like hearing your takes on the morality of certain TH-cam genres. I don’t know if this is just me, but the only issue I really had with this video is the ASMR section. I had to skip through most of it because the auditory examples made me so uncomfortable. That may just be me though since I’m not at all a fan of ASMR in the first place. I’m looking forward to more videos like this in the future :)
That ASMR whispering gives me the most uncomfortable sickening feeling running up my spine. Reminds me of when I had vasovagal response after a blood test.
I came to the comments during that section because it made me feel sooo uncomfortable. If you do watch it (completely understand why you wouldn't) Pinely actually shares our feelings about asmr in general, like I needed another reason to love him :D
It's what's wrong w/ our modern social media filled culture. We've all decided that anyone can talk about anything, not caring about best-practices when discussing sensitive subject matter or even a 2nd thought of the victim or their families, some whom are still healing & don't want their loved ones being used for clicks, views, & money by some TH-camr.
I don’t understand how any one likes to watch Stephanie Soo in any type of context. She is so over the top and dramatised.
Coffeehouse crime is a great TH-cam channel for true crime. The host is incredibly respectful and treats these horrific events as the horrific events they are and not just as a story. He also focusses on the victims and tells the viewer about their life and who they were as a person and doesn't do the same for the criminal (usually this is the other way around so it is very refreshing).
pinely!! i first discovered your channel like a year ago and it didn't quite get me but i wanted to say i think ur writing has improved A LOT and these style of videos (all the ones from lately!!!) really help show off your comedic styling - just comedic enough but doesn't diminish the gravity
also thank god you're also discomforted by ASMR stuff i cannot STAND ppl whispering for too long 😭 well edited to avoid that
The Casual Criminalist is a great true crime channel. The host is very adamant about how he doesnt want the videos to be "murder porn" but rather informational. He sometimes skips sections in the script if he thinks they get a bit too in to it all and is really a nice change from the majority of other true crime channels
i really recommend the channel dreading. it’s the best true crime channel i’ve ever seen to be honest. he doesn’t dramaticize anything and it’s very factual, respectful, and detailed. some of his videos are pretty hard to watch though because of the details of what the offenders have done.
Seconded
The channels without the creators face in them are always better. It seems vain to get ready and put makeup on and get ready for your limelight face shot while talking about victims who are forgotten
@@larsland Exactly!! It really allows for the focus to actually be on the case.
dreading has seriously made me re evaluate the channels i've been watching for 1.5 years after watching his content for a week
Dreading is probably one of the best 'JCS alike channels out there.
one of my fav channels in this vein is shrouded hand. I used to watch a lot of true crime stuff or just put it on in the background while I drew, but it started to really effect my mental health, so I stopped. what I like about shrouded's channel is always covers really unique topics that scratch that itch for a spooky, morbid story without being true crime. he also does true crime, but I like his videos on folklore, legends, ghosts, and aliens much better. plus his channel graphics are always top notch and he has a great sense of humour
Obligatory rant about Mr. Beast since Pinely mentionned liking him: homeboy pretends to care about the environment, but is invested in cryptocurrency, which produces more CO2 than entire countries. If a content creator supports NFTs or crypto in general, I instantly lose all respect for them.
wait, mr beast did crypto? i thought he was supposed to be good with money
This aged well
Fr
I personally really enjoy Ask a Mortician, and Sneegsnag when it comes to commentary on true crime. While Sneegsnag doesn't cover the cases, and instead reacts, he's able to really easily point out when a true crime channel is being shitty, and give a perspective of someone who actually did study criminal justice.
Doubling down on the first video after the fans of said YTers tried to blindly defend them while missing the point of said video entirely? Honestly king shit, I love it. Awesome.
I have a strong appreciation for true crime stories. TH-camrs like Disturban who give detailed tellings of these stories in a very respectful but none sugar coated way. You don't feel happy or comfortable watching these videos. And you're not suppose to. But, it is very fascinating hearing about how evil the human being can be. And how some people can do things most of us have never thought of. As well as how society affects crime.
You're the only other person I saw mention him. Glad for it.
I think it's kinda ironic, how people would (rightfully) complain about reaction yotubers like jinx a way back and make whole callout videos about, but now every big youtuber has a reaction channel where they barely say anything noteworthy about the stuff they watch
And how hes reacting to them reacting to true crime videos lmfao. Life imitates art or whatever
@@tripadvizer4879 uhh? he’s not just reacting he’s actually commentating and critiquing
@@tripadvizer4879 you realize the qualms everyone has w reaction channels aren't the fact that they're reaction channels, but that they don't actually react to anything right?
@@tripadvizer4879
He is actually discussing it, not blandly reacting to it.
Coming in a year later: True crime stories while cleaning your house is indeed a thing
I do that too.
theres a channel that does that and she lets you watch her lol
I personally loved true crime for a while, mainly coming from my mother (who’s OBSESSED with the content) and I didn’t see anything wrong with what I was watching. Eventually, I realized I got so attached to the cases/victim’s stories that I would get emotional during random moments of the day. Or I’d get angry while thinking about it and get in a bad mood. That’s mostly just me, but I also question how someone can make this content and be so calm and nonchalant about it. I don’t watch it anymore mainly due to how upsetting it was for me.
It's the amount of exposure. After hearing about so many incidents, you have to compartmentalize everything you hear to make it more bearable and to keep yourself sane. For some people, it's unintentional and a trauma response. After hearing so many stories and watching so many news cycles, you kind of become numb to it, and it just becomes another form of entertainment. Suddenly, a real-life crime is no different than some psycho in a horror movie. It's also incredibly hard for some people to truly realize how awful these things are when you don't experience it yourself. And some people never do because "That could never happen to me". Anyway, I think most people just kind of distance themselves from this sort of thing and think of it more so as a movie or urban legend rather than living, breathing people with lives that affected others'. And whether or not it's intentional is something they may never know.
@@makennarudolph good explanation. Also, if it were to happen to the watcher, I'm sure they wouldn't be able to watch that kinda stuff anymore.
I use to watch a lot of true crime too. My mom also got me into ture crime, she collected true crime books and detective magazines. Every week we watched American justice and unsolved mysteries fast forward to the mid 90s and Bill Kurtis was always on. I love true crime but I realized I consumed more when I was depressed and that can't be good at all. Balance is a good thing, taking care of our own mental well-being and emotional state is a necessity. Good on you for recognizing the damage consuming true crime was doing to you.
My personal favorite true crime channel is Explore With Us. They look at actual interrogation footage and give analysis on it. It's focused on the facts of the cases and doesn't try to be gimmicky or add inappropriate jokes.
I also enjoy Eleanor Neale and Hannah the Horrible's true crime videos. I feel like they're very respectful, and Hannah has called out the true crime community for being insensitive.
I enjoy EWU, but the speculation and amateur diagnosis in their recent video on Chandler Halderson's ex-girlfriend was outrageous. They do a lot of behavioural analysis which is a lot of pseudoscience. I really couldn't make it through that video and preferred how dreading handled it.
Youre video was fantastic. Unfortunately the insanity of true crime fandoms, especially the weird ones like ASMR and mukbang true crime, cannot be understood unless you've had to face it.
These people are relentless about getting their entertainment and ignore any harm that may come from it. They don't care about people, all the care about is getting their fix. And they do NOT understand the delicate ethics involved in this genre. They don't care. They think as long as the content creator speaks generally positive about victims then they're fully ethical. They don't care about the families or the living people poorly run or side show esq true crime channels effect. They care about themselves and making sure they get their content.
An example of this:
A popular True Crime podcast named Morbid released an episode which upset the murder victims family member. Because Morbid is primarily a comedy podcast, the victims family member did not like the jokes that were made surrounding their father's murder. This person spoke out about it on Morbid's Instagram post about the episode.
Insane fans of the podcast harassed this person, yes the person who was upset that their father's death was made into comedy entertainment, a completely normal and understandable reaction. They sent the family member disgusting messages saying he was 1. Too sensitive 2. Just trying to get attention 3. Shouldn't be listening to an episode that hit so close to home 4. The jokes were fine because they liked them, the people who have no connection to that case in anyway. This went on for days.
Let's summarize. A large true crime podcast upset a victims family member by making jokes about their father's death and the effected party spoke out only to have the fans harass, belittle, and invalidate the feelings of someone whose father was taken away from them too soon at the hands of another person for no reason. They said he was too sensitive and that episode wasn't for him.
And the podcast, Morbid, finally deleted the post where all this was happening and then never addressed their harmful fan base about the situation.
That horrible behavior was never addressed nor corrected and it will likely happen again to another victim. These are those kind of true crime fans. They don't care about people. They care about themselves and that they have access to the entertainment they want.
I’m curious, when did this all go down?
Disgusting ass mfs and I hate people who make money off of these tragic ass stories with no regards to the friends and families of the victims. I don’t like cancel culture but this type of shit needs to be out especially the podcaster
I've seen this in the everyday too, I had coworkers that during that case where a woman went missing while on a trip with her boyfriend and he came back, they were all playing detective and saying he was totally guilty because he "lawyered up" and "wouldn't talk to the police"
Even recently I had a coworker talk about how during her studies in college for her legal degree, she got /addicted/ (her own words) to going to trials (which she originally had to do for her studies but she mostly did out of /fun/) because she found them so interesting. She even told me how she'd wished she could have brought in popcorn.
I enjoy true crime, but I have too high of morals to let myself enjoy something that is actively hurting people and poisoning others' minds
@@sugarrusheb these same channels criticized alex jones for "profiting" off of victims death i told one of them (bailey siren) "isnt that what your doing but even worse because youre smiling and cracking lame jokes throughout?" i got my comment removed
@@sugarrusheb Did they ever figure out what happened? I remember seeing the reports about that, and I really felt for her family who just wanted to know if she was alright, if they went separate ways, when he last saw her. His refusal to talk raised red flags for me.
That said, people shouldn't jump on other people for lawyering up. And if his lawyer advised him not to talk, that's that. It's not great for people to speculate, but I think it's still better to do it aloud in a closed setting than spouting off about it on the internet for all to see/hear.
I used to put on Bailey Sarian's true crime makeup series as bg noise, until one day I realized how messed up that is. A great replacement is Robert Welsh makeup and ghost stories 👻 💄
Eleanor neale is pretty good. She’s respectful and she goes through the entire case from both sides of able
Yeah, it's also great that Robert has direct permission to tell those stories, as they are sent directly to them. So you can enjoy it without really having to consider the ethics or lack thereof.
I'm so glad that there are people like Kendal Rae who work directly with families and actively work to raise money for victims families or organizations that try to prevent violence in the first place or that help DV victims. Princess Weekes just did a great video on this topic too. Thanks for talking about this again Orr! It's such an important topic, especially with the depp/heard nightmare that has ignited the internet into a frenzy.
That Chapter is a true crime TH-camr who knows how to talk about crime respectfully while still adding humor. He seems like a pretty genuine soul as well
True Crime ASMR is really jarring.
I personally don’t like ASMR content, but from what I understand other people find it relaxing.
What exactly is relaxing about murder and abuse? Who is watching this?
It makes no sense.
I used to watch Stephanie Soo for a long time and have seen over the past few years how talking about true crime and horrible things that have happened to others has completely lost it's s meaning to her, at some point along the way she became so desensitized from tragedy and death that she feels comfortable joking and making sex jokes when the case involves SA, R,... I just couldn't keep watching, even though she is very entertaining and I don't think we shouldn't be allowed to joke about tragedy, but making money off and not treating in with the respect it deserves has turned me away from channels like these.
This 👆👆👆
Like i find her disgusting by the way She does those videos and idc abt her podcast and that she is "respectful there" She still continues making those insensitive videos , like for me IT makes her disingenious and fake by how the podcast are (have never watched her podcast but everyone gives that as an example that she cares and is emathetic to the victims ) and how She does her videos laughing , eating making insensitive jokes like dam its weird impov
the moment she started doing true crime and eating, i completely checked out. i think its so weird to combine a mukbang with discussions of murder and death. its in SUCH bad taste.
In my opinion, the best and most respectful true crime youtuber is Kendall Rae. Her videos are done well and usually include either family members of the victim or a fundraising campaign of some sort. I follow true crime a lot because it is closely connected to my career path but I am disguisted by some of those videos. People tend to forget they are talking about a human being who suffered not a fictional character.
Also her husband has a podcast that is true crime/ ghost stories/ criptids called the lights out podcast. I think him and his wife ( she isn’t on the podcast) are pretty good at keeping it respectful and if josh ever makes a joke it’s usually to bash the murderer. I can’t stomach any that do stuff while telling the stories. I believe these stories kinda demand you’re full attention otherwise it’s disrespectful.
Danelle Hallen is on par with Kendall, both very respectful and put in their research
absolutely, her and stephanie harlowe are so well researched and genuinely care about the victims
Kendall Rae, Stephanie Harlowe and Brooke Makenna are the only true crime youtubers I watch after realizing how some of them (other true crime youtubers) glorify and/or justify the killers' actions. They put the focus on the victim and the impact the crime had on people, at the same time, trying to help others prevent the crime because they care about the people affected.
I love LordanArts because he actually went out of his way to make connections at NAMUS and will help with making sure a victim’s name is added to NAMUS.
"Mixing fun with like death and trauma and all that." Yeah, that's how I've made it into my 30's. Also, you *do* look good in purple.
Honestly, I think the ASMR ones sums up the desensitization issue a lot of people have with True Crime creators and their communities... I think there's an issue with horrific murder cases being retold in a format that's meant to calm people and/or elicit positive reactions; these real life deaths shouldn't be used as a way to calm someone or unwind.
Some say that it helps them concentrate, because they got hit with the 'tard shovel in the womb. But as someone who got hit with the 'tard shovel too... this is a load of crap. ASMR and the True Crime combination doesn't work and will always look at best uncomfortable as hell and at worst absolutely disrespectful and fucked up.
These same wankers always talk about the neurotypical world which should respect their boundaries and what problems they have as a neurodivergent. But they can't respect the boundaries and sense of discomfort of (many, many many) others???? Because it helps THEM to better concentrate and therefore to easier consume their "hobby"? No way. That's no excuse and unacceptable.
Edit: With "these wankers" I mean a group of neurodivergent, mentally and/or physically disabled people on the internet who uses their disability/disorder for everything as a getaway card. It sucks and doesn't help.
Paige Christie did a similar video a while back and Stephanie Soo’s stans were in the comments defending why her videos “aren’t disrespectful”. Look at this comment section, I’m glad people understand how inappropriate it is to giggle while talking about people being kidnapped/tortured/murdered.
*rule of thumb that i just made up:*
if you wouldn't do it during a funeral, maybe don't do it in a video talking about true death and murder that happened
This exactly
I think the true crime chapter I watched the most was That Chapter. He went into depth about the victims, circumstances leading up to the crime, the investigation and its clearly thoroughly researched. Jokes he makes are fairly minimal and either directed at himself or at the expense of the criminal. He is pretty respectful throughout all his vids.
That chapter is a great true crime channel that respects the victims, does the research and still fits in comedy. Love that guy
I like the guy but sometimes his jokes literally make me cringe.
I like him starting the video with “hey son”. No clue why but it makes me happy.
So out of curiosity i searched up truecrime cleaning, well it turns out there is a video of a person cleaning while narrating a crime story.
what is the limit lmao
As a ghetto dweller with an arm in crime, watching the explosion of "true crime" on here has been hilarious. Ted Bundy video? Sure, I get it. Interesting fella. But now we're down to talking about B&E, describing rando junkies as "monsters of pure evil". Make me laugh
People are scraping for anything to stand out from what feels like a saturated market
@@morganwentworth2041 yea man, and I'm cool with that. But it's only a matter of time before they get down to the level of reporting people's mistakes for the entire internet to see. Not cool.
@@jonfitzpatrick9942 oh, I wasn't defending them. More cynical tone to my comment
My name is Jesse and for some reason at 21:49 I forgot about breaking bad entirely and thought that Pinely was threatening me personally and for a split second I was astral projected into the worst fear and confusion I've ever felt
So glad someone finally talks about it. Even among true crime channels, there are so few that over cases with dignity and respect. And true crime became a commercially streamlined product at this point
I am someone who does consume a good amount of true crime. I mainly just find it interesting to learn about cases that I can then look into myself. I enjoy learning about the psychology behind the cases especially. I really only watch Elenor Neale and Coffeehouse Crime, since I find them to be very respectful and straightforward about their cases. I used to watch a few makeup youtubers but stopped since I started to feel uncomfortable with it
I really appreciate the urgency you treat to survivors and living loved ones of those who were cruelly stolen from their lives. I have consumed true crime media, not most but some, I am autistic and adhd so I am both highly perceptive and still oblivious to many things. I have much to still process and understand, but I know this is the right direction for EVERYONE to develop true compassion inward and outward, it MUST be on the forefront people's well being and basic human respect and deceny I agree! We also need this energy for us disabled and neurodivergent people!!! Please remember that disabled people like me are still suffering due to ablelism from everything, we need this energy to help disabled people in every way! I hope to heal so I can help my people, I heal by laying on acupressure mats for years!
loved the first video cant wait to watch this one!
I am a big podcast person, and now there’s a big podcast boom and a TON of new true crime podcasts. They’re being advertised in the commercial breaks of the podcasts I actually like, and they are formulaic as heck
the asmr and stephanie one were definitely the most disrespectful ones. laughing while talking about smth serious such as death is just so damn baffling to me and its CLEARLY not those I'm uncomfortable laughs.
I really like mr ballen's true crime videos. He's respectful and his storytelling is great
I was looking for a comment like this
the one word i have for these true crime yters is TACKY. these people have no concept of boundaries.
the true crime channels i like are ones that analyse the interrogation. Ive found generally they treat the victims with a lot of respect and kinda rip into the suspect especially if they were found guilty. Although my favourite one was when they set up all the evidence and made you think one person did it and then they showed you what actually happened- which is interesting to see how you can manipulate interrogations that way
You would think that he repeating the "Russian" clip would be boring. But why it gets funnier each time? Lol
Tiny nitpick - that particular vtuber is using a 2D model. There are 3D vtubers though!
And a "cleaning podcast" type of video where someone cleans while talking about the subject of the day would be interesting, why ISN'T that a thing.
Because it’s hard to clean in one space and talk about stuff especially if you need to follow a script ?
idk about cleaning but there are 'metal detector' guys who walk around forests etc looking for stuff, talking about history of the places, wars all that
Check out body doubling cleaning videos - some include casual friendly chats recorded over live footage of cleaning 🧼
lmao I watched that memeulous video and the brigading from stephanie soo's fans were insane. the comment section made my blood boil honestly. the amount of mental gymnastics were unbelievable.
I appreciate you keeping the asmr section brief. Makes my skin crawl listening to them and not because of the murder
These hit different on podcasts. On Spotify I rarely see this stuff on true crime even from the same creators because you can't see them eating and grinning and putting on makeup while talking about a rapist and murderer in a podcast I never knew Stephanie was like this though.
it was in the past, i think she noticed and she improved by separating the topics into different channels. she takes true crime seriously now.
As someone who has ASMR triggers AND misophonia. ASMR videos also make my skin crawl cuz all the mouth sounds 😣 which makes finding ones with things I do enjoy difficult
Joshua Miles 100% is a really respectful person
I was scrolling through the comments looking for mention of his name. Underrated TH-camr
I know we all love Kendall Rae but we need to remember the time she put brutal crime scene photos behind a paywall.
there was an unaliving in my small suburban hometown in 2019 that became a nationally publicized affair to some extent, there was tons of news coverage, a lifetime movie, and a documentary. the woman who was unalived/"disappeared" was on the PTA with my mom, she had five kids and one was in my little brother's grade. i was venting to a friend of mine during the trial about how nauseatingly immoral the defense was for the man who definitely unalived her and the response i got was "i just want you to know you're providing amazing entertainment for a room of very intoxicated people right now."
as soon as i made it clear that i was really upset and not just recounting a sensationalized case, my friend apologized profusely and it ended up being fine. but i think it says something about what the prominence of true crime has done to the way people, myself included sometimes, respond to hearing about an unaliving case. my friend's first assumption was that i had the same kind of detachment that they did, the same ability to see the case as almost a fiction rather than something that happened to my mom's friend. we often think about the sensationalized, hyper-reality aspects of the case first and the real pain involved second. part of that is just about how difficult it is for the human brain to comprehend something so terrible, but i think part of it has to do with the way some of us encourage our brains to follow that path of separation from the real emotions by consuming content that capitalizes on removing us from the tragedy. true crime content tells us we're different from the people this happened to. we're safe, even if they're not. i understand what can be comforting about it. lots of true crime creators pretend they can give you tips on how to stay safe. the slogan "stay sexy and don't get murdered" embodies this to me, like it's something we can control. like the odds of being unalived by a stranger in a parking lot aren't so slim they may as well be irrelevant, and the odds of being hurt by someone you trusted and could never have anticipated hurting you aren't much higher. like the people who are hurt by true crime cases could have easily avoided their unaliving if they'd just KNOWN to be less polite, or not to wear a ponytail when walking alone at night. if they'd been as smart as you, the listener. it feels so insidious the way so many content creators seem to be reassuring you through the parasocial bond that you're smarter than all those victims, you're better, you can keep yourself safe. i know it's comforting, and that there are plenty of other reasons people consume true crime, but it's not true. you are no different from anybody who falls victim to these crimes and no matter how much you think you "prepare yourself" you never will be. it's not worth it to be constantly suspicious of the people around you and live in fear under the guise of "being prepared."
i don't know. sorry for writing an essay here, this stuff just kind of gets me down sometimes and it's tough to talk about this with people irl since true crime content has become so ubiquitous. this is a good video, i really appreciate the balls it takes to criticize the TCC, no matter how reasonable your critique is you still usually get hate for it.
I really appreciate your point on the whole “stay sexy stay alive thing”. I’ve always found it disturbing when creators would say that
God Stephanie sue is so annoying, she really went from "her body was found on a suitcase" to "mmm onion rings"
Great vid once again, I've had the subject matter on my mind recently and it's always so cool to be able to watch someone talk about it in details. Kinda scrathes that itch and puts my thoughts to rest.
I was rethinking about my true crime phase, and why I stopped specifically. I used to watch only one channel that specialized in true crime, and noticed that she often did sponsors, which started to bother me after a while.
"Hi everyone, today we're going to talk about the horrible tragedy that took the lives of 15 pregnant people, 45 puppies and 10 old folks, but first ! How would you like to have the same glasses that I do ? Aren't they stylish ? Well you're in luck because today's episode is brought to you by Soulless Copr Inc.!"
My breaking point was when I clicked on the case of Shanann Watts. Not being american I had no idea what it entailed specifically, sat through an ad and had to go puke when she started talking in detail about the body being recovered and in what state.
Never clicked on another true crime video after that.
Anyhoot, nice essay.
Liked it
Thank you for mentioning Kendall Rae!!! Every time people criticize the true crime community I think of her bc I think she and her husband do a great job of being informative and respectful. This sounds like an ad for her but naw I just legit love her vids 😭😭
I too, am deeply disturbed by ASMR, it puts me into a fight or flight panic and so I had to put my fingers in my ears for that part, although I don't judge people who enjoy it, my daughter loves the genre. I have been a fan of true crime since I was in High School (1990), I still think the best crime shows are ones from a scientific point of view, they are just factual and educational (eg. Forensic Files). I'm such s stan for TH-cam, but it falls short when it comes to true crime. One out of five stars from me. Also, Happy Birthday! I'm really appreciating the more vulnerable, real Pinely.
"I don't know who made this and who thought it's a FINE thing to do, tonally" I see what you did there Pinely
To me the worst part is that more and more people genuinely seem to fancy themselves detectives and freely speculate about both ongoing and unsolved cases, or just straight up harass people after picking up "clues". Just play a Nancy Drew game.
You’ll be happy to know there are channels who mix cleaning with true crime. Came across a tiktok account a while ago who plays a voiceover over her cleaning her toilet :)
I am an avid listener of ASMR. Not only does it help me sleep but it helps with my anxiety and/or manic episodes. I also love true crime. That being said, true crime does not belong in the ASMR community. I always wonder if maybe a family member or friend of the victim that uses ASMR the way I do for anxiety/bipolar were to stumble on the video how would it make them feel? Like a coping mechanism being used to talk about a horrible time in someone's life. Just awful.
i dont understand how people like it, i hate it some much, i want to punch the person talking to shut them up, make me unreasonably angry
@Lorna M like I said, I enjoy true crime. I just don't believe it belongs in the ASMR community.
@@Peaches2456 i already said I use it for anxiety and bipolar. I listen to it during the day when I'm anxious and over stimulated. I never said I was against that in particular. My point was that family and friends of victims could be using it the same way we do to cope. How would you feel if you came across the brutal murder of someone you love when you were trying to relax? That was my only point. It feels like you only chose to reply to one part of my comment completely ignoring the other. My opinion in a TH-cam video comment section isn't going to change anything. To come here and comment what you did, not knowing who I am or that I use asmr for the same reasons you do (even though I said it in my original comment) was pointless. We are on two sides of the same coin. Accept it.
@@Peaches2456 you are COMPLETELY missing my point. I feel like I'm talking to a wall. This conversation is over. Idk if you're doing this on purpose or you're really not getting it. I'm over it.
the number one true crime creator i will always respect is Cayleigh Elise. it's such a shame she left the platform but i don't fault her for it at all.
brooo true crime is so interesting to me, but i hate when people dont respect the victims/ the situation itself
I also want to point out that the only true crime person I watch(and also listen to because he has a podcast) is MrBallen. He videos LOOK click baity and gimicky which is why I never watched him on TH-cam(found him first through TikTok) but then I started listening to his podcast and realized he actually has a shit ton of respect for the victims. He actually talks about their backstories before he even gets to the murder part. It isn't just "oh this person is dead, here's the brutal way they were murdered" but "hey, here's what this person's life was like and here's who they were prior to their murder". Good vibes. I like his storytelling format. He's REALLY good at it.
I agree with you on this!! He’s the only person I’ve ever watched before that actually made me feel connected to the victims themselves.
Same here. I avoided Mr Ballen until about 5 months ago based on the thumbnails being cheesy lol, but he’s such a thorough and engaging speaker.
I like his videos too, and he also runs fundraisers that helps the families of murder victims which makes it even better.
I'm not trying to argue with you as I agree with your point. The majority of reaction channels are very lazy!! I'm autistic and love experiencing my favourite shows and movies for the first time again through the eyes of others! However I have no friends or family that are interested in the same things I like and so refuse to watch things I like. So watching reaction channels is extremely satisfying to me, seeing the difference in opinions between easy going movie watchers and film critics about my favourite movies is really stimulating! :))))))))
14:07 Oh hey that's me!
That vtuber you showed was actually the one I saw that led me to make that comment. Their character isn't too bad, my concern is more with them possibly starting a genre of other vtubers doing the same thing but with less.. tasteful avatars.
Of the jiggly kind.
The only gimmick merging I've seen that's passable (still weird and has problems) is true crime and art, because at least in most of those they're not drawing while talking about the crime, the art is just a background visual.
Still has it's issues and feels a bit wrong to me though.
I'm sorry he couldn't even say your username.. you're just a "someone" 🙄. If you watch his previous video on this topic (true crime) he bashed a couple other creators for not pronouncing foreign names correctly, and even for shortening them. Yet he can't even say the names of 2 of his FANS who literally helped him have more content (= more $$).
Feels hypocritical asf
@@A_Ducky My name is literally in the screenshot
Danielle Hallen, Elenor Neale and Kendal are the only true crime channel I actually watch because they actually understand the weight of what these crimes are and the effects their videos cause.
the only "true crime" channel I watch now is Ask a Mortician. I think since she actually deals with death daily in her job, she knows not to cross any line and she's never disrespectful, she's also funny and her content is very educational
I truly do not understand how the asmr lady is making so many wet mouth noises while whispering, like it takes EFFORT to whisper with so much moisture in there ma'am please stop.
it bugs me that stephanie soo has changed up and is suddenly more professional only because people pointed out that she was being disrespectful.
I know. Her delivery is a lot more compassionate and she doesn't mukbang but she didn't learn anything all she did was rebrand.
Yeah same. I unsubbed. It felt very disingenuous. She just did it so she wouldn’t be cancelled.
But her true crime mukbang videos are still up and she's making money off of them. She's disgusting and greedy
Happy birthday Orr!! Hope you had a great day :) thanks for bring out so much content at the moment, it's really great to see it all but make sure not to overexert yourself!
That ASMR true crime person's mouth sounds are setting off my misophonia