I have no idea why this video has done so well, but thanks everyone for supporting the channel! I'm very new to this but I'm exciting to create a little community of gba fe lovers :)
Gut feeling tells me at capped stats with promoted classes things would get quite interesting, but then we'd have to take weapon triangle into consideration every time which would be a chore. I respect the effort.
Thanks a lot, I'm gonna have to do it all again for a promoted class follow up video now 😅 yeah it'll be an interesting one, I have no idea how it'll work out
@@rainingrotom There would also be issues around Pierce, Great Shield, and Silencer skewing the results, but you could, I think, remove those using GBABuilder if you wanted it to just be based on stats alone. I don't think the +15% Crit that Swordmasters and Berserkers get would need to be removed, and the only other skill I can think of that might matter is Sure Shot on Snipers, which is probably fine to stay as well, since Snipers have a Skill cap of 30 and a Speed cap of 29.
@@SageOfLegaia Alternatively, while it'd definitely be more time-consuming (and probably more annoying to make), you could do multiple rounds to hopefully reduce skew while still staying true to the intent of the class.
@@BadAtFireEmblemif I were to do this test with promoted classes, I'd give them all capped stats and when testing them I think I'd always give them the weapon triangle advantage where possible, since a player would presumably opt for the weapon triangle advantage in a scenario if given the choice (ie falcon knights can use lance and sword, so when testing against a berserker they would use a sword and testing against a swordmaster they would use a lance). This way it would also factor in the inherit benefits a class has when they arent locked to a single weapon type.
General may do pretty well due to most classes haveing lowish strength growths, pavise having a 20% chance to prock, and mastery of the weapon triangle, though magic units would all most likely destroy them. Also (not meant as an insult) your content is great for starting of bot so long ago.
I'm gonna have to do a follow up with promoted units at some point I think! Thanks a lot crab, that's very kind of you to say ❤️ hopefully I'll see you in the comments in future!
@@BadAtFireEmblem Huh... which GBA standards you are going to follow, then ? If it's the Blazing Sword, Generals do not have access to swords but in Sacred Stones, they do ; same thing for Paladins but in reverse (if i recall.)
@@Tenhys I wasn't even planning on doing promoted units until so many people asked, so I'm not sure. since I'm running the testing on fe8 I'll probably use the classes as they are without changing anything? The results will just have to be taken with a pinch of sal when applying them to fe6 and 7, since they aren't really the same classes when the class skills come into play in fe8
@@Ahappysandwich I don't think stat boosters can be counted upon ; only natural growth stats can be taken into account to give a fairer results. If you start tempering with items you falsify the results because it can drastically change an unit over an entire playthrough. For example, back when i played FE7, i used to select one unit that i decided in advance i would use all of my boosting items upon as to reinforce replayability. In one of said playthrough i selected Florina, the shy pegasus knight, to fill with every boosters available and she became a flying weapon of mass destruction. The same can be done with everyone else. So i assume that stats boosters are out of the question.
definitely a neat little video, only thing I would suggest is perhaps running multiple trials of each matchup to deal with the rng variability a little, but from the sounds of it this already took a while to make and I wouldn't want to do that myself, and it looks like the results are pretty consistent anyway.
I would say that for base classes, your pegesus knight and cavalier are your best in GBA fire emblem. Not due to stats or weapon advantages. But due to 2 things that this video did not test as much: canto/movement. With canto (being able to move after certain actions with the rest of the units movement) and high move, these units can not only contribute to combat, but also preform utility and side objectives with rescue chains, visiting villages, and generally getting to different places on the map faster than other units. This is on top of variable combat and decent stats accross the board.
100% agree. This was purely a combat test, but movement is the best stat in the game, and that paired with canto is stupidly good. Obviously Wyverns still have those benefits alongside the great combat, but I'd definitely rate cav and peg very highly
I don't even remember when the last Fire Emblem video I watched was and this was recommended to me. It was Kratos' Amelia only run though, so I guess maybe his viewers are getting this in their feed? lol
The fact one of Archer Ws is against Wyvern Rider is actually an absolute win for them, because FE8's 3x weapon effectiveness. (if this was FE7 with 2x mt instead of 3x mt, they would be the lowest ranked class)
Curious what this data will be used for, pretty cool regardless. Glad the Monk could prove its worth kinda (or ig the worth of 1-2 range magic but still lol)
1:42 Last Place: Thief 0-14 Record - he’s weak, does little damage 2:10 2nd to Last: The Soldier 2-14 Record Beat the Myrmidon and The Thief 2:35 3rd to last: The Archer🏹 3-13 2:58 Tie-11 Spot: Monk and Pegasus Knight 3:48 #10 The Armor Knight 7-7 Record, sounds respectable - He needs to strike first or he loses 4:08 Pirate and Brigand 9-5 Record High Damage output Beaten by sword 🗡️ units + Beat the mage - Lost to the thief 4:45 Fighter and Myrmidon 10-4 record + Fighter defeats Cavalier 5:13 The Top 5 5. Cavalier 11-3 - Lost to the mage - Lost to the Armor Knight - Lost to the Wyvern 5:35 Mercenary 12-2 Record 5:55 Mage and Shaman 13-1 record 6:39 Wyvern Rider 🥇 15. Thief 14. Soldier 13. Archer 11. Pegasus and Monk 10. Armored Knight 8. Pirate and Brigand 6. Fighter and Myrmidon 5. Cavalier 4. Mercenary 2. Mage and Shaman 1. Wyvern Rider
@@dizzyheads Well, "very tanky flying unit with decent con and lances" is kind of a concept that's hard to go wrong with. They're basically just Pegasus Knights without any of the weaknesses (save for gaining a weakness to dragonslaying weapons, but how often is the player *realistically* running into those?)
now this is content. I have a few questions: 1. What are the stats? I'm assuming its the expected value at level 20 based off the base + level up percentages. 2. Do you think crit chance should have played a role in this trial? 3. Did the Archer lose to the thief?
While I'm not the creator of the video (infact I'm very much watching this video as the 1st time I've heard of this specific creator), but I think I can answer these. 1. We can assume the stats are rounded up to be somewhat close atleast to the average stats they should have at Lv. 20. 2. The crit chance (with the footage displayed) is comically enough only relavant with Monks, due to them being the only ones with a base weapon with a crit rate, that allows them to even think of critting enemies. 3. That was a guranteed L for the Thief, assuming the Archer had a hit rate.
Thank you very much for the glowing review 😅 1. FE Builder has an auto level feature, so every unit was level 20 with the average stats they would have gotten after 19 level ups with the class' inherent growth rates. 2. The monk, Merc and myrmidon were the only classes that really had any crit rate, and the critd they got in the testing only made them win harder, it didn't let them win any battles they would have otherwise lost . 3. The thief did 0 damage to the archer, so he got stomped on
@@khan6690 The Thief class has a base strength of 3 and a 5% growth rate, so in this testing method he only has 4 Strength at level 20; with an Iron Sword, that means he only hits for 9 damage, so any class with 9 or more Defense takes 0 damage from him and he's guaranteed to lose. Doing a quick check through the video, most of the physical classes have 8 defense or more (Archers have 9), and the mages hover around 6 or 7, so he's generally doing 1-2 damage per hit, if he can even deal any damage at all. Shoutout to the Soldier class being the only one with only 5 Defense, graciously letting the Thief deal 4 damage to him before hitting back for 14.
Interesting video. Doesn't really mean much since it doesn't account for weapon options, promoted classes, class acquisition timing, or movement abilities, but still a fun watch :-) I think my top 3 classes that I always play are: 1. Cavalier - Great mobility, controls weapon triangle, always one of your earliest units 2. Thief - Opens doors and steals gear 3. Shaman - amazing spell options
Oh yeah, it's not meant to mean a lot, it's just for fun. And it only really covers raw combat ability. Cavalier is a fantastic class and you always have good options for Cavs even from the start of a campaign. Thieves are pure utility but no other class can do what they do, so they're invaluable. And shaman is the best magic class, with higher might magic, and access to Nosferatu and Luna
I liked the idea behind it but will admit weapons themselves would change things up probably. Myrmidon I feel would kill more if they had a killing edge even if opponent had a killing weapon as well due to them naturally having higher crit then other classes (so should crit more often) but I do like the straight up stats version you posted. keep up the good work.
Very cool! I didn't know I needed this haha (P.S. Your audio is very quiet compared to the majority of videos out there. Pay attention to the audio level during your editing process and raise it to get close to 0db at the peaks of the audio. Other things like a good compression filter can help, easy to search up tips and tricks for better audio. No offense meant.)
I know this is probably a colassal amount of work, but I'd be curious to see it with larger sample size with some sort of standardization for who attacks first. Like, each match up ran 50 times with each side attacking first 25 times or something.
Thanks so much hobo! (feels weird calling someone a hobo), hope to see you in the comments on future vids :) Cav was the only one with multiple ranks and they did have a sword and a lance in their inventory. If I do a sequel with promoted units then most of them would get multiple weapons too
@@BadAtFireEmblemAs far as I’m aware, in vanilla GBA FE yes. I don’t think there are any other unpromoted units who can use multiple weapon types aside from the Cavalier.
Speed is the one thing they aren't amazing at, but they're still busted 😅 and the speed base isn't even that bad, it's still respectable. Friendly wyvern characters can almost always get to a point where they start doubling
For next time, something I’d suggest is making the fights into pairs - one as a green unit and one as a red, then they switch. This is kinda based on chess bot battles, where to test who is actually better they each are given an opening to play once as each color, to account for the difference in going first. In this way, counting them as pairs, you’d have win-loss-draws, which could help significantly by helping to isolate the advantage of going first. I know you said that you did have each of them as red units and green units, but you counted the wins as red units, while this would be counting both, which may do something.
They're a bit outside the norm for classes... but I assume manaketes are just built different from most units. Maybe also some of the other monster classes from FE8, since a lot of them have pretty high stats. Cyclopses, Gorgons, and Dracozombies especially, but I suspect Baels, the centaurs, and gargoyles might do decently as well.
Yeah manaketes are kinda cracked 😅 I think monster classes are different enough to be kept separate from the main classes, but maybe they could a video if their own
This is a really cool concept. Question about the Archer - if Thief has 0 wins, and you said Archer (2:30) beat the Soldier/Peg/Wyvern, shouldn't Archer be at 4 wins since it defeated the Thief as well? From the thief section you showed, Thief can't even damage Archer, so Archer would have to win that encounter.
Why did the wyvern rider not get doubled by the mage as a red unit? Are the stats random each round? I know I'm 4 months late, but still. That really bugs me. Wouldn't setting their stats to be the average (round up or round down, up to you) at lv 20 be much more fair?
As other people have said I think spending some time on what your parameters were would've been great. Slightly changing your starting parameters can change a lot- Like what if everyone had Steel weapons instead? Etc, etc. Did you run every fight once? Because evasion seems pretty interesting as well. Wyvern winning seems obvious to me, I remember playing Fire Emblem By Web back in the day and Wyverns were unfair with their ridiculous bases.
That's fair, I didn't want to have the start of video too bogged down but it could have a little clearer for sure. Yeah I only reach each fight one time to keep things simple, it already took me hours to do this simple testing, but there's scope for a lot of fine tuning with multiple tests, different weapons etc
You should extend this by turning it into an actual tournament format. You say it's too complicated for 1 video, but you could honestly make this into a ten-episode series and people would watch it just because people like tournaments.
I said to myself before this video that Wyvern Riders are the best class in the game due to their good damage + high defense + high mobility, but I didn’t think that they would win in a strictly combat scenario. Nevermind I guess! What is balance anyways?
How did you do growth rates for stats? Because I have a lvl 15 colm in the playthrough I'm doing right now that has 11 str. I'm not sure how far outside of the norm that is, but 4 seems incredibly low
It's the growth rates attached to the class which enemies use for calculating stats, not the person growth rates that a character like Colm had which override his class growths. It's all built into the game
@@BadAtFireEmblem Oh, gotcha, that makes sense. I didn't realize there were growth rates attached to classes rather than characters. I'm a pretty casual player, tbh. Thanks for the answer!
I knew mages would be top 5. Every single game theyre one of my best performing units just due to them usually having high damage and how they usually double most units. A tie for second place is more than i had anticipated though, which is nice.
It's interesting information But I feel like the data pool is far too small when considering RNG, eatch matchup should be at least the best of 7, to help with ensuring a win doesn't end up being fully decided by extreme RNG rolls Otherwise this could be used as a "target priority" guide to kind of give you a rough idea of which units are the biggest threat in any given chapter without taking any time to inspect their stats
@@lsrrr3857 This is true for the Thief vs some of the Axefighters, but the Archer did beat the Thief (since the thief can't even do damage). So yeah, it would be 4 wins for the Archer.
Im sorry to ask this here because it´s irrelevant to the video, but i couldn´t find it in any other place. Do you know how to change a character class when it appears in the middle of a chapter? I tried to change their classes with FE Builder but i couldn´t. I don´t know how to explain it, but in FE8 in chapter 2 join Moulder and Vanessa, and i want to change their classes but i have no idea where is the "script" that spawns them in your party, because they don´t appear in the middle (or at the start) of a chapter they aren´t on the chapter 2 events. Thanks a lot in advance!
Hey ninja, I'm not very good with Fe builder beyond the basics but I've asked people that same question before and had it explained to me so I do know how to fix the issue. What happens is moulder and Vanessa actually join your party in between chapters, so changing their class in ch2 won't override what's already been coded for their joining event. If you scroll down the chapter list on the left side of febuilder until you get '38 Castle Frelia', it's just a blank map, but that's where the joining event is stored. So if you click on unit placer for chapter 38 then you'll be able to change their class and stuff 😊
you're welcome, if you haven't already then you should join the FEUniverse discord server, you can just ask any febuilder questions you have there and people are super helpful :)@@ninjaexperto7217
Placing my bets on hero Or I suppose if we are including archsage, then that. Okay, well that was quick, I did not think this was going to just be unpromoted classes.
I think I'm going to have to do a follow up video for promoted classes now, which should be interesting, I feel a lot less confident in my ability to accurately predict the results for that one :P
@@BadAtFireEmblemwhy do they get even a decent speed base in addition to ridiculous defense strength and hp to pair with great move and flying Like dang even in game a bunch of those guys around means you are playing very carefully
@@Chunkosaurus I think when they made fe6 they wanted Wyverns to be a hella scary enemy class and didn't care if they were balanced 😅 they just wanted Bern to be strong, and who cares if they're OP
Get bodied, kid. But yeah, kind of expected that. Wyvern riders are just some of the best classes in the game. If you ever do a promoted unit version of this I’m sure wyvern lord will also perform admirably.
Kid deserved it :P Yeah I'll definitely do a preomoted sequel video, and I'm sure they'll do well in that too, but I feel like they might get the top spot taken from them?
My prediction before watching: Mercenary. Edit: shit i forgot Wyvern Riders exist Not surprised that the thief ended up the lowest. Thief is more of a utility class and whenever there are enemy thieves, they're just there to steal stuff from the chests and will avoid combat when they can. Not surprised that the Pirate and the Brigand tied. They are so similar, and they even serve the same general purpose in the game, simply being a bandit class that destroys villages. The only different is that the Brigand can cross mountains, and the pirate can cross water.
The best class is cavalier because the most important Stat is movement, moving again after doing non attack actions is huge as well. The arena doesn't really indicate the best class for the majority of the game. I just dump every non mounted unit that I can replace with a mounted unit at this point. Just paladins, flyers, troubadour, magic guys if needed or useful and lords. Balanced teams are for suckers
I assume you intentionally skipped the nomad class? You said you wanted to test the vanilla base classes in all the GBA games, but the nomad wasn't there.
I remembered nomad after the videos. They're not present in fe8 at all so I could have imprted their class into the game but didn't. Would have been interesting to see if they were much better than the archer
How has the archer 3 wins? Pegasus, Wyvern and Soldier were mentioned, but the thief has 0 wins and did 0 dmg, so surely the archer has to have 4 wins?
2 speed and 5 defence at level 20, 6 constitution, and no promotion. You can see why rom hackers (like myself) treat soldier classes with such love. They deserve it after what they’ve been through.
why not give the peg a slim lance? i'd think you'd outfit each unit with the best weapon for that uni as long as it's in rank. very cool breakdown nonetheless!
I would give it to cavalier and paladin classes being the strongest their kind of op classes and over ruling in the world GBA fire emblem. Cavaliers and Paladins have great speed, balance stats and mobility on their side. Even cavaliers base stats without any boost is pretty decent. But I do know cavaliers and paladins are not unbeatable. The perfect counter classes for the cavaliers and paladins. Probably would be knights and generals due to their high physical def stat and decent attack stat maybe their skill stats. But the major problems with knights and generals would be their lack of speed and mobility and a lot of other problems etc. Also not being properly developed a perfect counter for the cavaliers and paladins.🙂
@@alexandersutherland798 yeah definitely. Wyverns are better but the games normally limit how many you get and only give you access later in the game, but Cavs are given out like candy in the early game and theyre better than practically every other option you have. I would say in the late game they're way less op, units like loeen and Franz do fall off eventually, but early game they're a bit too good
Feels weird to rate "power" of a class as just combat potential. Troubadours obviously have the worst combat, but are probably among the strongest t1 classes in terms of how much they improve your ability to clear a map. Cool evaluation, though.
I have no idea why this video has done so well, but thanks everyone for supporting the channel!
I'm very new to this but I'm exciting to create a little community of gba fe lovers :)
The thumbnail
I would definitely click on that
It took about 2 hours so I'm glad it was worth the extra effort 😅 cheers Zabami
@@Ismael_Espinola well I'm happy it reached you :)
Yeah, TH-cam does put some videos from smaller creators with low views into recommendations, which is an great way to discover the smaller creators
I would love to see the same but with promoted classes
a few people have said the same so I guess I'll have to do it at some point! :P
@@BadAtFireEmblem Yesss please
@@mockinghyena960 stay tuned I guess 😅
Swordmaster/Berserker sweep
@@iLegaultnah man assassin just gonna hit every silencer (trust)
Next let’s see which class can most effectively dispatch villager children
Now THIS is a video idea 🤣
the answer is a giant poisonous spider
@@raymoo8504 fe8 chapter 6 wants its gameplay mechanics back
That'll be amazing
@@raymoo8504that chapter is the worst thing that ever happened to me
Gut feeling tells me at capped stats with promoted classes things would get quite interesting, but then we'd have to take weapon triangle into consideration every time which would be a chore. I respect the effort.
Thanks a lot, I'm gonna have to do it all again for a promoted class follow up video now 😅 yeah it'll be an interesting one, I have no idea how it'll work out
giving all of the units capped stats messes up the results pretty bad since everyone gets so much def res and speed
@@rainingrotom There would also be issues around Pierce, Great Shield, and Silencer skewing the results, but you could, I think, remove those using GBABuilder if you wanted it to just be based on stats alone.
I don't think the +15% Crit that Swordmasters and Berserkers get would need to be removed, and the only other skill I can think of that might matter is Sure Shot on Snipers, which is probably fine to stay as well, since Snipers have a Skill cap of 30 and a Speed cap of 29.
@@SageOfLegaia Alternatively, while it'd definitely be more time-consuming (and probably more annoying to make), you could do multiple rounds to hopefully reduce skew while still staying true to the intent of the class.
@@BadAtFireEmblemif I were to do this test with promoted classes, I'd give them all capped stats and when testing them I think I'd always give them the weapon triangle advantage where possible, since a player would presumably opt for the weapon triangle advantage in a scenario if given the choice (ie falcon knights can use lance and sword, so when testing against a berserker they would use a sword and testing against a swordmaster they would use a lance). This way it would also factor in the inherit benefits a class has when they arent locked to a single weapon type.
General may do pretty well due to most classes haveing lowish strength growths, pavise having a 20% chance to prock, and mastery of the weapon triangle, though magic units would all most likely destroy them.
Also (not meant as an insult) your content is great for starting of bot so long ago.
I'm gonna have to do a follow up with promoted units at some point I think!
Thanks a lot crab, that's very kind of you to say ❤️ hopefully I'll see you in the comments in future!
@@BadAtFireEmblem
Huh... which GBA standards you are going to follow, then ? If it's the Blazing Sword, Generals do not have access to swords but in Sacred Stones, they do ; same thing for Paladins but in reverse (if i recall.)
@@Tenhys I wasn't even planning on doing promoted units until so many people asked, so I'm not sure. since I'm running the testing on fe8 I'll probably use the classes as they are without changing anything? The results will just have to be taken with a pinch of sal when applying them to fe6 and 7, since they aren't really the same classes when the class skills come into play in fe8
Can't you drink some item that significantly raises resistance?
That's what I did in FE7 gave my general the shoes for +2 movement and the res potion.
@@Ahappysandwich I don't think stat boosters can be counted upon ; only natural growth stats can be taken into account to give a fairer results. If you start tempering with items you falsify the results because it can drastically change an unit over an entire playthrough.
For example, back when i played FE7, i used to select one unit that i decided in advance i would use all of my boosting items upon as to reinforce replayability. In one of said playthrough i selected Florina, the shy pegasus knight, to fill with every boosters available and she became a flying weapon of mass destruction. The same can be done with everyone else. So i assume that stats boosters are out of the question.
definitely a neat little video, only thing I would suggest is perhaps running multiple trials of each matchup to deal with the rng variability a little, but from the sounds of it this already took a while to make and I wouldn't want to do that myself, and it looks like the results are pretty consistent anyway.
Thanks man, appreciate that. Yeah it took ages even without repeats
Interesting fire emblem videos always find their way into my recommendations.
Looking forward to more interesting stuff 🎉
GBA fire emblem is the gift that keeps on giving 😅
Thanks man, hopefully I'll see you in the comments again
Axes performed much better than I was expecting
Axes have been OP in most Fire Emblem games, and the advantage of higher Mt helps carry the weaker stats of the classes who use axes.
Damn, that merc was so close to beating the armor knight...
He tried so hard and got so far, but in the end it didn't even matter ...
@@BadAtFireEmblem nice linkin park reference right there
Great to have a gba food chain now
Never though to text out all the units! It's great to watch
Glad you enjoyed it man :)
Yooo lmao I love that you offered up a child as a sacrificial reward to him
You get a sub for that
Thanks, I appreciate the validation, child had it coming 😅
I would say that for base classes, your pegesus knight and cavalier are your best in GBA fire emblem. Not due to stats or weapon advantages. But due to 2 things that this video did not test as much: canto/movement.
With canto (being able to move after certain actions with the rest of the units movement) and high move, these units can not only contribute to combat, but also preform utility and side objectives with rescue chains, visiting villages, and generally getting to different places on the map faster than other units. This is on top of variable combat and decent stats accross the board.
100% agree. This was purely a combat test, but movement is the best stat in the game, and that paired with canto is stupidly good. Obviously Wyverns still have those benefits alongside the great combat, but I'd definitely rate cav and peg very highly
I don't even remember when the last Fire Emblem video I watched was and this was recommended to me. It was Kratos' Amelia only run though, so I guess maybe his viewers are getting this in their feed? lol
Well I'm happy it reached you :)
I do enjoy Kratos videos, I only found him relatively recently but he's very good
The fact one of Archer Ws is against Wyvern Rider is actually an absolute win for them, because FE8's 3x weapon effectiveness. (if this was FE7 with 2x mt instead of 3x mt, they would be the lowest ranked class)
Absolutely, big win for the shootyboi. Though he might have still beat the peg with double effectiveness, he won't that fight quite convincingly
My love for the Mercs and Mages sprites really paying off
7:27 a delicious snack for the wyvern
Didn't expect this channel to be so new after watching
Yah I'm a newb 😅
It's great to see so much support on the channel though!
Curious what this data will be used for, pretty cool regardless. Glad the Monk could prove its worth kinda (or ig the worth of 1-2 range magic but still lol)
Watch this space haha
The main worth is still promoting for C rank staves, but they're not 100% useless in combat 😅
Now i wonder how the promoted classes stack up
I'd like to think sniper does better than archer did against it's peers
@@jonathann.5754 I'm gonna have to do a follow up video 😅 I hope they would do better, love my archer bros!
Bro spent genuine effort. Respected and subbed
Appreciate it breadman 😊
This is a treat video for us fans, thank youuu❤
Plenty more to come! 😊
amazing! u should do this again, but with Everyone! including all of the promoted and special classes.
1:42
Last Place:
Thief
0-14 Record
- he’s weak, does little damage
2:10 2nd to Last:
The Soldier
2-14 Record
Beat the Myrmidon and The Thief
2:35 3rd to last: The Archer🏹 3-13
2:58 Tie-11 Spot: Monk and Pegasus Knight
3:48
#10 The Armor Knight
7-7 Record, sounds respectable
- He needs to strike first or he loses
4:08 Pirate and Brigand
9-5 Record
High Damage output
Beaten by sword 🗡️ units
+ Beat the mage
- Lost to the thief
4:45 Fighter and Myrmidon
10-4 record
+ Fighter defeats Cavalier
5:13 The Top 5
5. Cavalier
11-3
- Lost to the mage
- Lost to the Armor Knight
- Lost to the Wyvern
5:35 Mercenary
12-2 Record
5:55 Mage and Shaman
13-1 record
6:39 Wyvern Rider 🥇
15. Thief
14. Soldier
13. Archer
11. Pegasus and Monk
10. Armored Knight
8. Pirate and Brigand
6. Fighter and Myrmidon
5. Cavalier
4. Mercenary
2. Mage and Shaman
1. Wyvern Rider
Wow Wyvern knights always seem to be consistently great in FE games
@@dizzyheads Well, "very tanky flying unit with decent con and lances" is kind of a concept that's hard to go wrong with. They're basically just Pegasus Knights without any of the weaknesses (save for gaining a weakness to dragonslaying weapons, but how often is the player *realistically* running into those?)
"Friendship and adventure" playing... Kickass Hector sprite... You there are a true man of culture
All hail Marquess Ostia!!
Thank you, Hector is ma boi!
"culture" indeed
now this is content. I have a few questions:
1. What are the stats? I'm assuming its the expected value at level 20 based off the base + level up percentages.
2. Do you think crit chance should have played a role in this trial?
3. Did the Archer lose to the thief?
While I'm not the creator of the video (infact I'm very much watching this video as the 1st time I've heard of this specific creator), but I think I can answer these.
1. We can assume the stats are rounded up to be somewhat close atleast to the average stats they should have at Lv. 20.
2. The crit chance (with the footage displayed) is comically enough only relavant with Monks, due to them being the only ones with a base weapon with a crit rate, that allows them to even think of critting enemies.
3. That was a guranteed L for the Thief, assuming the Archer had a hit rate.
Thank you very much for the glowing review 😅
1. FE Builder has an auto level feature, so every unit was level 20 with the average stats they would have gotten after 19 level ups with the class' inherent growth rates.
2. The monk, Merc and myrmidon were the only classes that really had any crit rate, and the critd they got in the testing only made them win harder, it didn't let them win any battles they would have otherwise lost .
3. The thief did 0 damage to the archer, so he got stomped on
3. Updated: sorry, I just realised why you asked. Yeah I think I messed up, it should be 4 wins. That's my bad 😅
@@BadAtFireEmblem I'm surprised the thief does that little damage
@@khan6690 The Thief class has a base strength of 3 and a 5% growth rate, so in this testing method he only has 4 Strength at level 20; with an Iron Sword, that means he only hits for 9 damage, so any class with 9 or more Defense takes 0 damage from him and he's guaranteed to lose. Doing a quick check through the video, most of the physical classes have 8 defense or more (Archers have 9), and the mages hover around 6 or 7, so he's generally doing 1-2 damage per hit, if he can even deal any damage at all.
Shoutout to the Soldier class being the only one with only 5 Defense, graciously letting the Thief deal 4 damage to him before hitting back for 14.
I want you to know I subscribed purely because the joke at the very end was too good. You monster! 🤣👍
hopefully you enjoy your time here on the channel! :)
Interesting video. Doesn't really mean much since it doesn't account for weapon options, promoted classes, class acquisition timing, or movement abilities, but still a fun watch :-) I think my top 3 classes that I always play are:
1. Cavalier - Great mobility, controls weapon triangle, always one of your earliest units
2. Thief - Opens doors and steals gear
3. Shaman - amazing spell options
Oh yeah, it's not meant to mean a lot, it's just for fun. And it only really covers raw combat ability. Cavalier is a fantastic class and you always have good options for Cavs even from the start of a campaign. Thieves are pure utility but no other class can do what they do, so they're invaluable. And shaman is the best magic class, with higher might magic, and access to Nosferatu and Luna
This is interesting, you should do more consistent content like this one on GBA games, like weapons, characters exploit that.
I liked the idea behind it but will admit weapons themselves would change things up probably. Myrmidon I feel would kill more if they had a killing edge even if opponent had a killing weapon as well due to them naturally having higher crit then other classes (so should crit more often) but I do like the straight up stats version you posted. keep up the good work.
Very cool! I didn't know I needed this haha
(P.S. Your audio is very quiet compared to the majority of videos out there. Pay attention to the audio level during your editing process and raise it to get close to 0db at the peaks of the audio. Other things like a good compression filter can help, easy to search up tips and tricks for better audio. No offense meant.)
7:20-7:30 "won't somebody think of the children?!" 😂
I thought of the children. I thought to involve them in the tournament 😅
@@BadAtFireEmblem 😂😥
You know, child sacrifice wasnt the first thing that came to mind when i first thought about strongest class in fire emblem GBA
Gotta think outside the box 🧠
Your video made me feel like playing fe sacred swords again
Dew it
I know this is probably a colassal amount of work, but I'd be curious to see it with larger sample size with some sort of standardization for who attacks first. Like, each match up ran 50 times with each side attacking first 25 times or something.
Yeah that'd be more comprehensive, but I'll leave it for someone else to do that, it took a silly amount of time just to do it once 😅
Fun idea, subbed to see what you do in the future. Do classes with multiple weapons get both weapon types?
Thanks so much hobo! (feels weird calling someone a hobo), hope to see you in the comments on future vids :)
Cav was the only one with multiple ranks and they did have a sword and a lance in their inventory. If I do a sequel with promoted units then most of them would get multiple weapons too
@@BadAtFireEmblem wait the cavalier is the only unpromoted class with several weapon types?
@@hajoeijgenraam295 unless I'm being dumb?
@@BadAtFireEmblemAs far as I’m aware, in vanilla GBA FE yes. I don’t think there are any other unpromoted units who can use multiple weapon types aside from the Cavalier.
@@JC_Stone cavalier just has it all I guess
I never liked Wyvern Riders because I always saw them as very slow units, but my opinion changed in the last years
Speed is the one thing they aren't amazing at, but they're still busted 😅 and the speed base isn't even that bad, it's still respectable. Friendly wyvern characters can almost always get to a point where they start doubling
The answer to "what is the best unit" is always a wyvern. But its nice to have a ladder.
You're not wrong :P
Idk if this is possible but I would love to see it: All final bosses in the series going at it
I may or may not have plans to do just this 👀
@@BadAtFireEmblem you've peaked my interest enough to subscribe
Cool video; it would be interesting to do this same thing with FE7 (FE6 & FE8) main characters with their 20/20 average stats
A tournament to prove who's the strongest* (*After 500 turns of grinding) in each game does sound pretty neat ngl
I may or may not have planned to this is the future 👀
This should be best of 5 for every MU
This just emphasizes the importance of positioning and movement options. The best defense is a good offense in these games.
Completely agree. In the actual game, movement is the best stat, and 1-2 range weapons is the best thing you can have for combat
For next time, something I’d suggest is making the fights into pairs - one as a green unit and one as a red, then they switch. This is kinda based on chess bot battles, where to test who is actually better they each are given an opening to play once as each color, to account for the difference in going first.
In this way, counting them as pairs, you’d have win-loss-draws, which could help significantly by helping to isolate the advantage of going first.
I know you said that you did have each of them as red units and green units, but you counted the wins as red units, while this would be counting both, which may do something.
That's a pretty solid suggestion. It might makes things more complicated but I'll see if I can take that on board, cheers :)
They're a bit outside the norm for classes... but I assume manaketes are just built different from most units.
Maybe also some of the other monster classes from FE8, since a lot of them have pretty high stats. Cyclopses, Gorgons, and Dracozombies especially, but I suspect Baels, the centaurs, and gargoyles might do decently as well.
Yeah manaketes are kinda cracked 😅 I think monster classes are different enough to be kept separate from the main classes, but maybe they could a video if their own
Just from a damage standpoint, Assassin. Rng provides, you kill everything in one hit, regardless of what damage you'd normally do.
ooh that's actually a really cool element, I hadn't thought of lethality. The sequel video with prepromotes is gonna be an interesting one
That villager sacrifice at the end was so out of pocket. 😂
You gotta give him a nice reward!
The child might be getting their revenge in future though 👀
Thieves may have come up short but honorable mention to chad in fe6 with his fatty growths and advantage against axe users
If assassin was a promotion in that game it'd be joever for bern
@@Designated_loser it always upset me that thieves don't promote in that game
Reminded me why I hated Hector hard mode - infinite spawning red Wyverns at you.
This is a really cool concept. Question about the Archer - if Thief has 0 wins, and you said Archer (2:30) beat the Soldier/Peg/Wyvern, shouldn't Archer be at 4 wins since it defeated the Thief as well? From the thief section you showed, Thief can't even damage Archer, so Archer would have to win that encounter.
Thanks :) yes I made a mistake, archer had 4 wins not 3!
Yeah, though the standings didn't get changed anyway, to be frank
This was pretty cool. Maybe do the promoted classes or fe8 next time
A lot of people seem to want the promoted classes testing so I guess I'm making a follow up video :P
Why did the wyvern rider not get doubled by the mage as a red unit? Are the stats random each round? I know I'm 4 months late, but still. That really bugs me. Wouldn't setting their stats to be the average (round up or round down, up to you) at lv 20 be much more fair?
Where would nomads place?
As other people have said I think spending some time on what your parameters were would've been great. Slightly changing your starting parameters can change a lot- Like what if everyone had Steel weapons instead? Etc, etc. Did you run every fight once? Because evasion seems pretty interesting as well.
Wyvern winning seems obvious to me, I remember playing Fire Emblem By Web back in the day and Wyverns were unfair with their ridiculous bases.
That's fair, I didn't want to have the start of video too bogged down but it could have a little clearer for sure.
Yeah I only reach each fight one time to keep things simple, it already took me hours to do this simple testing, but there's scope for a lot of fine tuning with multiple tests, different weapons etc
Maybe you should have tallied both going first and second together, and then have a win-draw-loss tally instead of just win
Interesting idea. It's really hard to work out the best set up but that's a fair idea
wait how did the archer have 3 wins (Soldier, Pegasus, Wyvern)? What happened to thief?
....
Er...
Ah, yeah. I think I effed up 🤣
Thief out here literally stealing wins
Thief's gotta do what a thief's gotta do!@@catman9222
Would the Thief at least potentially get a win against a Priest?
Sounds like a fairly even fight 😅
Wyvern riders are infamously hard to kill in FE 6 the Binding Blade
Just ask mangs
Fe6 Wyverns are indeed cracked.
They slightly less dominant in 7 and 8 but they're still mad good
@@BadAtFireEmblem while in the city level you are flanked by lots of wyvern riders mangs called it the "chapter from hell"
Promoted next, great video.
You should extend this by turning it into an actual tournament format. You say it's too complicated for 1 video, but you could honestly make this into a ten-episode series and people would watch it just because people like tournaments.
Everyone loves a tournament arc
Yeah it's something I might end up doing in the future :)
like and subcribe for more content like this, i need to see this tipe of tournament with every class single class!
Actually, it would be really fun to simulate this in @RISK or a similar simulation tool.
Oh dear god, that's an insane idea! 🤣
....... maybe it's something I could do at some point 👀
Wait could you do this but with Every GBA character
I said to myself before this video that Wyvern Riders are the best class in the game due to their good damage + high defense + high mobility, but I didn’t think that they would win in a strictly combat scenario. Nevermind I guess! What is balance anyways?
Balance is a lie, it never existed and it never will 😅
How did you do growth rates for stats? Because I have a lvl 15 colm in the playthrough I'm doing right now that has 11 str. I'm not sure how far outside of the norm that is, but 4 seems incredibly low
It's the growth rates attached to the class which enemies use for calculating stats, not the person growth rates that a character like Colm had which override his class growths. It's all built into the game
@@BadAtFireEmblem Oh, gotcha, that makes sense. I didn't realize there were growth rates attached to classes rather than characters. I'm a pretty casual player, tbh. Thanks for the answer!
I knew mages would be top 5. Every single game theyre one of my best performing units just due to them usually having high damage and how they usually double most units. A tie for second place is more than i had anticipated though, which is nice.
They're very strong for combat, and the fact they can get staves on promotion just makes them even more used
It's interesting information But I feel like the data pool is far too small when considering RNG, eatch matchup should be at least the best of 7, to help with ensuring a win doesn't end up being fully decided by extreme RNG rolls
Otherwise this could be used as a "target priority" guide to kind of give you a rough idea of which units are the biggest threat in any given chapter without taking any time to inspect their stats
Changing lances and swords on the cavalier but not giving the pegasus a slim lance to double, smh unfair
Fair comment honestly, I did them dirty 😅 would be interesting to see how much of a difference the slim lance would make
Shouldn't Archer have 4 wins, not 3?
Thief, Soldier, Pegasus, Wyvern?
the wins only tallies the particular class going first.
Thief lost everything going first, but manage lucky wins going second sometimes
@@lsrrr3857 This is true for the Thief vs some of the Axefighters, but the Archer did beat the Thief (since the thief can't even do damage). So yeah, it would be 4 wins for the Archer.
I did miscount for the archer, he did beat the thief as well so he should have 4 wins
Would someone please think of the children 😢
Im sorry to ask this here because it´s irrelevant to the video, but i couldn´t find it in any other place. Do you know how to change a character class when it appears in the middle of a chapter? I tried to change their classes with FE Builder but i couldn´t. I don´t know how to explain it, but in FE8 in chapter 2 join Moulder and Vanessa, and i want to change their classes but i have no idea where is the "script" that spawns them in your party, because they don´t appear in the middle (or at the start) of a chapter they aren´t on the chapter 2 events. Thanks a lot in advance!
Hey ninja, I'm not very good with Fe builder beyond the basics but I've asked people that same question before and had it explained to me so I do know how to fix the issue.
What happens is moulder and Vanessa actually join your party in between chapters, so changing their class in ch2 won't override what's already been coded for their joining event. If you scroll down the chapter list on the left side of febuilder until you get '38 Castle Frelia', it's just a blank map, but that's where the joining event is stored. So if you click on unit placer for chapter 38 then you'll be able to change their class and stuff 😊
@@BadAtFireEmblem OMG thank you so much!
you're welcome, if you haven't already then you should join the FEUniverse discord server, you can just ask any febuilder questions you have there and people are super helpful :)@@ninjaexperto7217
2:34 Wouldn't archer have 4 wins? You said he beat both fliers, and the soldier, but he also bea tthe thief because the thief had 0 wins.
Yes I made a mistake, it should be 4 wins
Placing my bets on hero
Or I suppose if we are including archsage, then that.
Okay, well that was quick, I did not think this was going to just be unpromoted classes.
I think I'm going to have to do a follow up video for promoted classes now, which should be interesting, I feel a lot less confident in my ability to accurately predict the results for that one :P
Could definitely see Hero being a solid contender in the promoted tournament.The FE6 ones at least can be rough.
@@min-min3160 they're definitely a powerful class, but I feel like they might make the top 5 but not any higher? It's so hard to predict 😅
Heh, I guessed it was Sage. I was close enough :;) But yeah, I forget how tanky Wyverns can be.
Wyverns are hella scary, they're terrifying 😅
@@BadAtFireEmblemwhy do they get even a decent speed base in addition to ridiculous defense strength and hp to pair with great move and flying Like dang even in game a bunch of those guys around means you are playing very carefully
@@Chunkosaurus I think when they made fe6 they wanted Wyverns to be a hella scary enemy class and didn't care if they were balanced 😅 they just wanted Bern to be strong, and who cares if they're OP
Ephiram, because he takes castles and gives them back just for fun
If Pegasus Knight beat Monk then shouldn't that count as a tiebreaker for 11th?
You can think about it that way if you want to split hairs, yeah :)
Subbed. Merlinus clears
Thanks heiss 😊
Haha hell yes, merlinus best unit ❤️
Get bodied, kid. But yeah, kind of expected that. Wyvern riders are just some of the best classes in the game. If you ever do a promoted unit version of this I’m sure wyvern lord will also perform admirably.
Kid deserved it :P
Yeah I'll definitely do a preomoted sequel video, and I'm sure they'll do well in that too, but I feel like they might get the top spot taken from them?
My prediction before watching: Mercenary.
Edit: shit i forgot Wyvern Riders exist
Not surprised that the thief ended up the lowest. Thief is more of a utility class and whenever there are enemy thieves, they're just there to steal stuff from the chests and will avoid combat when they can.
Not surprised that the Pirate and the Brigand tied. They are so similar, and they even serve the same general purpose in the game, simply being a bandit class that destroys villages. The only different is that the Brigand can cross mountains, and the pirate can cross water.
Yeah I feel like the rankings for the unprompted classes were fairly predictable
Bro your comment appeared in the comment bar and spoiled the winner for me 😭
@@cardboardgaming101 oh no, I ruined the top class and literally none of the others. I’m sure there was no point in watching the video after that.
The best class is cavalier because the most important Stat is movement, moving again after doing non attack actions is huge as well. The arena doesn't really indicate the best class for the majority of the game. I just dump every non mounted unit that I can replace with a mounted unit at this point. Just paladins, flyers, troubadour, magic guys if needed or useful and lords. Balanced teams are for suckers
Is this proof that Sofia is viable??
I assume you intentionally skipped the nomad class? You said you wanted to test the vanilla base classes in all the GBA games, but the nomad wasn't there.
I remembered nomad after the videos. They're not present in fe8 at all so I could have imprted their class into the game but didn't. Would have been interesting to see if they were much better than the archer
How has the archer 3 wins? Pegasus, Wyvern and Soldier were mentioned, but the thief has 0 wins and did 0 dmg, so surely the archer has to have 4 wins?
Yeah it's 4 wins, I misrecorded the result
Thief mains represent 🫱🏼🫲🏽🙌🏻
7:10 Oh no! run child!
They can't outrun a flying unit with 7 move 😈
2 speed and 5 defence at level 20, 6 constitution, and no promotion.
You can see why rom hackers (like myself) treat soldier classes with such love. They deserve it after what they’ve been through.
Yeah one of the first jobs for any hacker is to buff soldier bases and give them halberdier promotion
hey you forgot the celric and athe dances i wood have like them to shou up but it dosent mater vbeocse thay cant atank
With iron zword some of them are usless but nmr 4 deserves the win the fire emblem version back i remmember that raven was awsome
why not give the peg a slim lance? i'd think you'd outfit each unit with the best weapon for that uni as long as it's in rank. very cool breakdown nonetheless!
Cheers man, yeah I thought keeping everyone to iron weapons would be most fair, but it did screw over the peg a bit
So now youre gonna do the promoted classes and add monsters to milk out content right?
Right???
I may have a couple ideas along those lines 👀
Erm, subscribed???
the ending lol
Wait, then why did you use the monk class? Its not in fe6
Well I learned something today! I haven't played much fe6 compared to 7 and 8, and I never realised they aren't in fe6 😅
@@BadAtFireEmblem yea, I was surprised to, light magic Is so underused in that game
@@Battagang light magic in general has a tough time, it just doesn't do much damage and monk class bases suck
@@BadAtFireEmblem thank God for slayer and fe8 Luna being garbage
Thus we see why you sadly only get 1 wyvren rider :(
Yeahhh, they're too op to let you have 4 of them :P
promoted units when?
I've got a couple videos in the works but I'll probably make it within the next month :)
Now make the Lords fight
yea promoted units would go way differently. heros with axes and swords would wreck
We'll see how the sequel video turns out :P
If you included advanced classes, assassins rock as long as they crit lol
Upcoming sequel video
Perhaps you could review all the fire emblem gba rom hacks.
That's definitely something I'd like to do in the future, but probably not anytime soon
I would give it to cavalier and paladin classes being the strongest their kind of op classes and over ruling in the world GBA fire emblem. Cavaliers and Paladins have great speed, balance stats and mobility on their side. Even cavaliers base stats without any boost is pretty decent. But I do know cavaliers and paladins are not unbeatable. The perfect counter classes for the cavaliers and paladins. Probably would be knights and generals due to their high physical def stat and decent attack stat maybe their skill stats. But the major problems with knights and generals would be their lack of speed and mobility and a lot of other problems etc. Also not being properly developed a perfect counter for the cavaliers and paladins.🙂
Cavs are fantastic units, their movement and canto utility are super useful, and their weapon triangle usage gives them great combat utility as well
@@BadAtFireEmblem Thx u! Do you think cavaliers and paladins are kind of op and over ruling in fire emblem GBA?
@@alexandersutherland798 yeah definitely. Wyverns are better but the games normally limit how many you get and only give you access later in the game, but Cavs are given out like candy in the early game and theyre better than practically every other option you have. I would say in the late game they're way less op, units like loeen and Franz do fall off eventually, but early game they're a bit too good
Didn't the wyvern rider lose to the archer? So wouldn't that mean that the Shaman, Mage and Wyvern Rider all tie for 1st place at 13 wins?
He's only counting the win/loss when they're the red unit. Red archer beat green wyvern, but red wyvern beat everything.
yeah exactly:)
Feels weird to rate "power" of a class as just combat potential. Troubadours obviously have the worst combat, but are probably among the strongest t1 classes in terms of how much they improve your ability to clear a map. Cool evaluation, though.
It's just a bit of fun really, but yeah there's lots of other things more important. Canto, flying, movement, staff utility, thief utility etc
Promoted class!!