Enterprise Refit VS Enterprise A NCC 1701 - Both Ways Star Trek Starship Battles
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 ธ.ค. 2023
- #startrek #starships
Today we compare the Enterprise Refit to the Enterprise A.
Cosmetically speaking there are differences, but are there any differences with Weapons/Shields and Propulsion?
Let’s find out!
Played in Star Trek Bridge Commander Remastered.
Thanks for watching!
Official Good Old Games (GOG) links to buy the games:
Star Trek Bridge Commander: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
If you would like to support the channel, please consider subscribing this will help it grow and you will be notified of future video releases!
If you would like to go even further you could have your name proudly displayed on the ending credits screen by donating a super thanks or through paypal.
All names will be displayed for 12 months:
Ensigns: £2.49
Liuetenants: £3.49
Commanders: £4.99
Captains: £6.49
Admirals: £14.99 - (Also you will have a personalised battle of your choice made for you, please contact me with your request on the about page of the channel).
Paypal Link: paypal.me/retrobadgergaming
Star Trek Voyager Elite Force: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Voyager Elite Force 2: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Armada: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Armada 2: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Starfleet Command 3: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Hidden Evil: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Starfleet Command Gold Edition: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Starfleet Command: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Judgment Rites: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek 25th Anniversary: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Star Trek Away Team: track.adtraction.com/t/t?a=15...
Please note the channel receives a small commission from each purchase using the above links.
Check out our playlists for the following walkthroughs:
Star Trek Resurgence
Star Trek Voyager Elite Force
Elite Force 2
Star Trek Armada
Star Trek Armada 2
Star Trek Shattered Universe (PS2)
Star Trek Invasion (PS1)
Star Trek Away Team
Star Trek Prodigy
So the deal with the E-A is that there seems to be no authoritative answer on whether it was just another Connie Refit rechristened after the events of the Whale Probe, or if it was a new build Connie 2. However, in either case, the E-A is much more advanced because it is 12 years newer than the Connie Refit completed in TMP; for example it has a far more powerful warp core. In Star Trek V the dialogue strongly suggests that the ship is a new build. There is the theory that Yorktown was one of the last Connies to be refit, hence the dialogue with Scotty in that the ship was so new it hadn't done a proper shakedown. However, this suggests then, that the Yorktown was launched before it was ready by Starfleet to intercept the Whale Probe and it completely failed. In Star Trek IV we actually see the Yorktown, it is played on screen and its captain is played by Indian tennis legend Vijay Amritraj. So, in either case, new build or super late refit, the E-A is considerably more advanced than the original Connie Refit because it is 12 years newer! From the time that Enterprise is launched in TMP (Stardate 7410.2, or 2273) to Star Trek II (Stardate 8130.3 or 2285) is 12 years. Lots of advances in that time, and it spells out that the Connie Refit was meant to last some time and would justify a new build Connie 2 as well because the USS Excelsior was still not in production as a class.
I didn't realize that there was a 12-13 year difference between Star Trek TMP and Star Treks 2-5. Does that mean Kirk took the Enterprise for another 5-Year Mission after TMP?
Thanks for the extra info. Really helps plug some gaps in my own knowledge 🖖
@@chadwickst.clair-smythe4217 I think so, the last dialogue seems to imply Kirk took a sabbatical from the admiralty and took the Enterprise on an extended mission. Also, it now makes sense when Admiral Morrow says the Enterprise is over 20 years old.
@@RetroBadgerGaming Most welcome!
@@chadwickst.clair-smythe4217 Actually the 1701 was exactly 40 years old when destroyed.
Great battle! The A took many torpedoes in the Undiscovered Country, it makes sense the shield output is better in the 2290s ship than the 2270s refit. Do more videos with the A!
3:58 The Ent. A turning toward you just looks so cool here! Reminds me a bit of the scene from Picard S3 where the ship "looks up" after the shuttle hits the nacelle.
4:08 This new AI has quite an obsession with ramming, doesn't it?
5:07 "Engaging saucer separation!"
According to the book "mr scotts guide to the enterprise" i believe its called, the Enterprise A was actually first christened as the U.S.S. TI HO she wasnt a refit connie like the Enterprise or the Yorktown she was built keel up as the updated constitution class. She had been scheduled to have shakedown cruises bit due to the events in ST4 that never happened and as a gift to the Enterprise crew the TI HO was renamed Enterprise and the Enterprise crew assigned to it. Thats why in ST5 Scotty rambles about her build quality and all that. Because she wasnt exactly completed when they took over. I also heard the Yorktown version as well and had accepted that as canon for most of my life until i read that book. Its definitely a good read
I remember Scotty saying something about the monkeys that put that ship together.
I have the same book. It has spread a lot of wrong information over the decades. Most of the information is not canon and is considered apocrypha.
I like Venom Geek. He puts a lot of thought in his videos. His collaboration with Drachnifel is a must watch for those who are fans of naval design between 1860-1945. Venom does good work though we disagree on a couple things, like the Keldon Class as a carrier or heavy cruiser (it is actually both as there are variants).
In Star Trek 5, didn’t Scotty say it was a new ship ? It also had a completely different warp core and shuttle bay. If it was new, it would have been 10 to 15 years more advanced. We know they had Constitution class ships around, so the design was still around 80 years later in some form or another.
Yes however after such an extensive retrofit the ship would essentially be new. Same was said of the Enterprise refit in The Motion Picture.
According to the Enterprise illustrated handbook, the Enterprise A had two aft launchers and also had better shielding.
tbf, the neck region was a critical weakness on the connie design, it was addressed in the later Excelsior class vessels
it got worse with the refit design, since the old connie had a horizontal reactor design, the refit switched to a vertical chamber, it was more efficient and had much greater output, but i'd imagine they had to weaken the structure even more to make room to fit in through the neck down to the bottom of the secondary hull
Enterprise A had an aft torpedo launcher and more powerful shields. Look at the beating it took during ST6. 1701 refit got an aft launcher before WOK.
1701A at its decommission was armed with the same weapons as Excelsior at the same time. The Excelsior was more sturdy, bigger, a little faster, with better shields.
I like to believe the Enterprise-A was the last of the production run of the Constitution class and it had some early Excelsior class tech , like shields phasers torpedoes and a next gen warp core .
It makes sense that Enterprise A is stronger than Enterprise Refit. If you're rechristening the ship, might as well take the opportunity to give it the latest updates you have available before sending it once more unto the undiscovered country, dear friend. 😉
I love your channel Badger! But I gotta let you know the venom channel you recommend is only a authority at making stuff up.
Of course @venomgeekmedia9886 is making stuff up. And it's lots of fun. The writers on DS9 were also just "making stuff up". I think Venom's authority comes from the sheer quality of his content, his absolute passion for golden-era trek, and his incredible attention to detail.
That was really cool
One thing from Venom geek media that stuck with me is during his collab with Drachinifel and the whole "wandering Galaxies"
Good video, but I gotta talk about VenomGeek. He does a good job explaining his logic, the problem is his logic feels like he pulled it from the seat of his pants. He gives his headcanon precedence over regular canon, he cites himself as a source, and he's got this strange notion that most ships can't be multirole.
A lot of times he'll create a niche in his headcanon and then try to mold a ship to fit said niche. The guy is king of "I reject your reality and chose to replace it with my own."
Yes, VenomGeek runs an awewome channel ^^
I have said this on a couple different pages discussing the origins of the 1701A according to the superb ship recognition book Ships of the Starfleet Vol1 2290-91 (103rd year of issue!!) printed in 1991. The 1701-A was inserted into the production run of the Enterprise (II) class Heavy cruiser (which was to be originally the Levant class after the first ship of the new updated class) the class also included the surviving members of the Enterprise (I) class Farragut NCC1702, Lexington NCC1703, Excalibur NCC1705, Exeter NCC1706, El Dorado NCC1722, and Krieger NCC1726 which got refits as they returned from missions. Interestingly the TMP refit of 1701 was supposed to be USS Lexington NCC1703 except she was delayed in completing her mission and Capt Kirk returned from the five year mission with 1701 first....and 1701 became the lead ship of the new class. At the front of the book is a Fleet readiness table which lists for 2290: 93 Heavy cruisers, 35 Strike cruisers, 23 Heavy frigates (Avenger/Miranda class) 75 FR (standard frigates) 29 FF Fast frigates, 5 DH heavy destroyers 89 DD standard destroyers, plus assorted scouts, science vessels and 2 Excelsior class..
Its a great book and fun to read through it has some nice little tidbits describing ship missions (both successes and losses) with brilliant line drawings, ship spec's and a nice fold out drawings of the Belknap class Strike cruiser in the back.
Always fun watching these battle. I was wondering about the warp core. Does it make a difference in your battles whether it is horizontal like the Enterprise VS other Enterprises or Federation ships? I know they switched to vertical sometime ago.
I'd assume the 1701-A was better, though perhaps not in TFF given all the bugs they still had to work out, no doubt due to being rushed into service out of refit. Of course if it is the Yorktown and they rechristened it mid refit, that means it started the refit process much later than the original Enterprise, so no doubt some technological improvements were implemented that weren't available for the original.
As to whether any Constitution class ships were built from scratch to the refit standard, I suppose it's possible. The refit was basically a new design, but personally I don't think there were new refit Connies built, at least not many. The way I see it, the Miranda was always the more economical explorer. A lot of interchangeable parts with the constitution, basically the same saucer and nacelles, arguably better tactical capabilities with the aft torpedoes, and probably for every 7 constitutions they could build, they could have 10 mirandas instead. Now, the constitution was still bigger, had a larger crew, no doubt had a larger warp core and therefore more power, and with amenities like the arboretum it's better equipped for those long 5 year missions whereas the miranda is better suited to shorter assignments, but for 95% of missions either ship will do.
Now you still would want a ship with added capabilities for those other 5% of missions where a light cruiser just doesn't cut it, but by the time the 1701-A entered service, that role was being filled by the superior Excelsior class.
Given all the messed-up systems on the thing, I've always favored the idea that it was a ship used for training engineers. They put her into service when they needed to give Kirk a new ship as a show of force against the Klingons following the Genesis scandal.
So, technically a new ship, but the kids have been in there tampering with everything and causing a mess for years.
There isn't anything in canon to support the idea that it's the Yorktown.
Being the first ship to receive the refit technology, the original Enterprise was also probably doomed to early obsolescence once all the bugs were worked out. Plus there's probably a limit to how much an old design can be refit before it's better to just simply build a completely new ship.
Well done Captain.. I could see some deference's , I like the Ent A a bit more.. hard to say, from the books and what we see actually in the movies .. so hard to say but the A is more advance and also, again, the Refit had the bay doors open again. hmmm🤔 whom is playing with the buttons lol. love the video Captain..!!😊🖖
Would make sense if A (regardless of the name she started with) was built from the ground up as an updated connie, that she would be stronger. As there would have been limits on what they could do with the original Enterprise as she was one of the orignal connies having served for 30 years (with one suspect refit before Kirk took command) before this overhaul. I would imagine at least some of the systems would have had to remain orignal or at least have a reduced ablility to be updated. if not it could also be that the A went through additional updates prior to her launch as the A. Would also explain what scotty said about her being so new she hadn't even done a proper shake down.
I agree that the Enterprise-A is a more power house than the original Refit Enterprise. I said, "Holy cow!" when I saw the Refit Enterprise get destroyed like it did. I didn't expect it to be taken out so fast.
It was a big surprise! 🖖
Admiral Horton has a cool design for a SNW Connie Refit design
Nice Showcase!😅
In one of the earliest drafts of Star Trek II, the ship Kahn acquired was another Constitution Refit, though for assorted reasons this was changed to the Miranda Class (including both audience confusion of the same ship and story reasons).
Nice showcase of the SFRD Connie Refits, would you be able to do the same with WileyCoyote's Ent Refit and Ent-A?😅
I loved watching this video. I thought it would be an even match, but the E-A did short work of the refit. Watching this one, I have a request: could you do the Excelsior vs the Enterprise B?
Thanks! Totally. That's a great idea 🖖
Technically, the A is the refit refit.
In non canon lore the A was either an all new starship built from the keel up and was the USS Ti-Ho (NCC-1798 IIRC) or was another one of the original Constitutions that was also refit, the USS Yorktown (NCC-1704) - unless you go by beta canon in which it was NCC-1717 but also the one referenced in ST IV. There’s nothing I could find as to whether either of Yorktown registries indicated anything other than it was similar in age to the original Constitution class Enterprise, which would explain why the Enterprise A was decommissioned only 7 years after it was renamed at the end of ST IV. Clearly, based on the set changes from ST IV to ST VI there is an implication that it was a refit refit- particularly since they used the same engine room set in ST VI as the Enterprise D in TNG.
Picard son talks about the Enterprise A he states she was state of the art at the time of her retirement. Star fleet pulled her to make her a museum ship.
@@haroldchase4120 She was trashed in ST VI and went on to be immediately decommissioned.
Enterprise A was a new build from the Refit. Hence why Scotty was having so many issues with it in Star Trek 5.
Also, the A was even longer than the Refit.
Just like the Excelsior class, it was upgraded, and upgraded again 😎
The Yorktown was a Miranda Class in Star Trek 4.
Great video! Would you consider doing a video with the Connie Refit Refit and the Phase II Enterprise?
Thanks! That's a great idea, i'll add it to the list! 🖖
I prefer the idea of Kirk getting a new ship of the refit design. After what Kirk and crew went through to get Spock back.
Increase power to your sensor array. I've noticed you neglect it but it's key to torpedo accuracy as it locks on quicker and longer.
Love the Constitution Class, she’s a timeless beauty for sure, great replay Retro
Thanks! Totally agree about the Connie refit. It never seems to age! 🖖
The A should put up a decent fight against the prototype Exclesior, NX2000, from ST III. The A is slightly newer.
It's obvious the A was an already-built Constitution II Class starship that was rechristened, but I doubt it was the Yorktown. Close-ups of the displays on the A Bridge seem to indicate she was brand new with transwarp drive and Scotty's remark ".........they don't make them like they used to" backs that up. Then again, why would she be retired after only 7 years of service if she had been relatively new?
1:06 If they made a new ship based on an old design it's probably because Kirk asked them to.
"New" might be a relative term, kind of like how the Titan-A was "new" while using mish-mashed parts from other ships, including parts from the original Titan and nacelles that were over 25 years old.
Perhaps they had a bunch of Constitution parts laying around. For example, a half-finished saucer for a refit they no longer needed to do, and some junkyard nacelles and warp core from a severely battered ship. It would be fast and cheap to just make a new engineering hull, slap on the old parts, and viola' it's a "new" ship. Kinda anyway.
The Enterprise Refit was equipped with a Swirl Type Warp Reactor like USS Voyagers, whilst the later Enterprise A had a more traditional Warp core like the Enterprise D's
It not far fetched to me. When 8 was play Star Trek their were 3 Enterprise s. I'd like to think this is Kirk 1701A Vs Spock 1701. And yes the A had better shields. The model actually has more physical markings. And the A is supposed to have Transwarp Drive. It also had mark VII torpedos vs 1701s Mark VI
Boom I thing so , try refit vs Yamato
what is this version of bc remastered ?
Interesting🤔
the A should win as if we us the last time they were featured
the A was refitted to 2293 specs while the 1701 actually was only updated to 2276 or 2278 (depends on whether kirks 2nd 5 year mission starts in 2271 or 2273) specs.
now you would ask why TWOK took place in 2285. true
the thing here is after kirks second 5 year mission the 1701 got transferred over to be an academy ship so no further refits would be given to it as students would only be practicing on older equipment.
Thanks for the info 🖖
You might also enjoy the channel We Travel by Night. He does a lot of interesting analysis on the minutia of the ST ships.
In some sources , there's talk of a rear torpedo tube
I would think that any Connie refits would be updated along with the Ent A. Maybe the Refit used here was before the Ent A and hadn’t been updated yet
So it turns out that the Enterprise A / Yorktown was built from the ground up unlike the refit. So it was able to get better systems than the refit.
The A wasn’t the Yorktown, it wasn’t the Ti-ho either, well kind of. Look back at Star Trek 5 where Scotty said “let’s see what she’s got, said the Captain and we did. I think this ship was put together by monkeys.” Reason I bring that up is a ship doesn’t have those issues if it was an older ship, as those theory’s say. Generally the an older ship has all its kinks worked out where those said kinks are all there in new builds. The next thing is that it’s a naval taboo to rename a ship that’s already been in christened and in service. After that the idea that just because a newer and better design is available the production of a ship line isn’t just ended, they may not have ordered any more to be built but they sure would finish building the ones already being built and The excelsior class was still being tested by the movie ST 5 so My theory that keeps those theories alive, sort of, while also preserving naval tradition is that the A was almost done being built under a different name but wasn’t launched or christened yet so when the original Enterprise was destroyed and the whale probe incident happened Starfleet and the federation council decided to honor the loss of the great ship and the crew that saved everyone by christening the next Connie class that was coming off the line the Enterprise-A. There’s precedent for this in WW2 when the USA lost a carrier the navy would rename one of new ones being built to that name. This not only honored the ship and crew that was lost but also screwed with the Japanese who thought they sunk that one. Basically my explanation doesn’t shit on the legacy or crew of the old ship but also explains how a new one was built so quickly. The Big E-A was a brand new ship but as the design was at the end of its time she only served for a little while compared to previous ones. You could also say Starfleet saw damage report after the battle of kitimer and decided that instead of spending resources to rebuild a trashed ship of a line that was being phased out they’d instead decommission her and build a new Excelsior class ship to carry on the name. Again in the real world we saw this with many ship that’s were built in WW2 that were decommissioned and mothballed after only a few years of service, like Iowa class battleships. So it’s possible the Big E-A was mothballed in the reserve mothball fleet with the possibility of being recommissioned if the need arose.
How about the Enterprise-A vs Enterprise-B.
It was uss yorktown like the kelvin timeline starbase yorktown builds the uss enterprise A from the ground up! lol
You can look at main Engineering on the A and see she has a much more powerful worpcore than the refit . I’m certain If the old ship received the refit Scotty wanted to give her after the wrath of knah . She would have been equal to any ship of her time . Sadly turd fleet wanted her out of the way
The Enterprise A was also bigger.
I’m showing my age
But what game is this? simulator?
No surprise that the Enterprise A made very short work of the Enterprise Refit. 😂 It’s newer with more advanced technology including more powerful shields, phasers and photon torpedoes and it’s faster. 😉
ha! this match up is a meme
It makes sense. While they really are difficult to tell apart, it does make sense the Enterprise A would have a bit more might to it that the refit. The refit was (tragically) built from a cannibalized original Connie, while the Enterprise A was a freshly built ship with a different name. Though the Enterprise A did have a number of issues prior to this as we saw. Thankfully those did get ironed out.
Also I love how at the end the Enterprise A just started careening towards a sun. XD
The A has better performance because she has more decks: Indisputable logic!
in a real fight the enterpise - A would win as it's weapons and shields are like 10 years newer and more powerful then the refit's