Skull Bash is far from forgettable, at least to the player, for being in the level up learnset of a starter. I would never use it now but back then i would just pick the coolest sounding moves.
Agreed. Skill Link Pokémon getting a number of multi-hit moves is nothing out of the ordinary, like when Heracross suddenly got Pin Missile, Bullet Seed, and Rock Blast upon gaining its Mega Evolution. Cloyster is one of the most well-known Skill Linkers and while Normal isn't a great attacking type, it is a good choice for coverage.
Cloyster has always been a bit of a favorite of mine, not a top fav when I was younger but 100% grown on me more as times gone on, and anytime I used one I let it keep Spike Cannon. I have never cared about "competitive" pokemon, probably because I skipped from Crystal to Moon since I had stopped playing pokemon after gen 2 for a long time outside of an emulated fire red run and getting a used copy of heart gold about a year before moon came out. So it never felt like a wasted move since against the AI its perfectly serviceable.
@@SovekOnivris Colyster’s hidden ability skill link guarantees that all multi hit moves will always hit five times which means all the ones cloyster gets are between like base 80 and base 120 and some get stab as well, so cloyster losing Spike cannon sucks extra hard
I remember Razor Wind for being annoying in Pokemon Super Mystery Dungeon. Since the attack hits the entire room, enemy Pokemon can snipe you from far away and crit you more often while doing so. The 'charge turn' for most attacks in Mystery Dungeon is just a single step, making the attack quick to use as well. A good few weird niche moves are actually pretty powerful in Mystery Dungeon. Essentially all multi-hit moves are OP, so Spike Cannon and Barrage are actually really good.
@PokemonWoop I recall a Fearow one-shotting my Tyranitar with Fury Attack, but a Togekiss from the same dungeon did like 1/3 of my health with Aura Sphere. I'm pretty sure Sandstorm wasn't even active.
skull bash is a perfectly serviceable move for casual play as one is going through the story imo. I think having quirky moves that might not be great creates intrigue and fun to be had in the early game, even if its worthless in the post-game
Agreed. As far as 2-turn moves that don't make you semi-invulnerable on turn 1 go, Skull Bash is one of the better ones because it at least gives you a stat boost. Certainly a lot better than Razor Wind or Sky Attack.
@@BrianSilva-oc7xg sometimes I think about Jade Cocoon 2 where there are only four "types" but they each have a different specialty. Water focuses on healing and resists the status effects of Wind that work well on Fire which is needed to overpower Earth's defenses or something like that
Smelling salts saved me during my Elite Four run in Pokémon sapphire. I had Makuhita with me since Granite Cave and evolved it into Hariyama. During my final fight with Steven I was down to my final Pokémon in Hariyama. Manectric had already paralyzed metagross and all my pp for earthquake was gone and I couldn’t risk it on focus punch. I used smelling salts and the double power was just enough to knock out metagross
I would've thought a stab brick break or similarly powered fighting move doing neutral damage as opposed to a resisted normal type move would do more damage. Glad you defeated the metagross though
honestly i had a hariyama in my first few runs and i used smelling salts a lot, it was a move that I just thought was neat. it's just one of those moves that i thought was special so it was needed.
I imagine Nightmare might have been intended to counter Gen 2’s very Rest heavy meta-game, as there were a lot of bulky pokemon that couldn’t really heal any other way. Get them on the turn they rested, and you’d do half damage and whatever else you wanted to do.
I find hard to believe that Game Freak, from all developing studios, would have the ability to test the game they were making to the point of developing the meta that ended up developing for real anyway, and consciously add a move to fight that meta. They couldn't even get the game to fit in a cartridge and had to be rescued by Iwata, you're giving them too much credit.
@@xyannail4678 Game freak’s coding has always been famously broken with plenty of unbalanced gameplay, useless types, failed mechanics etc. I love Pokémon and millions still love and play the older gens to this day regardless but let’s not just ignore the faults of the past for nostalgia.
If you have Swallow Return/Aerial Ace on Porygon 1, 2, or Z, have the move in the first slot, and have Texture/Conversion turn the Pokémon into a Flying-type. Pretty cool.
@@LuigiTheMetal64i used psychic on mine due to still giving that fighting resist while actually being a good special move and not a useless physical move
I think if Powder lasted for 5 turns, it would be intereting. Not good per se, but being able to nulify Fire moves for 5 turns may lead to very interesting gimmicks in the style of weakness policy or entrainment
I think five is reasonable but should be play tested if they bring it back. However I think they should also allow it to be nullified as well, so moves like rapid spin or sandstorm can remove it reliably
@@cristhianmontoya6648 I feel 5 turns is reasonable, as long as only vivillion has it. it may be overpowered if other Pokemon had it, but Vivillion is mediocre enough to pull 5 turns without it being OP
I remember running a Darkrai with Dark Void and Nightmare back in gen 6. I just loved the combo of Bad Dreams and Nightmare dealing a ton of damage to sleeping opponents. It was absolutely not viable, but fun to pull off.
I have fond memories of using a Haunter with Hypnosis, Nightmare, and Dream Eater in Diamond, back when I was a kid. It definitely wasn't the most efficient approach, but kid!me got a bit of a power trip out of making those poor NPCs watch their pokemon slowly die while being unable to do anything about it. It probably helped that I typically used Yawn with Uxie before switching into Haunter too lol, Hypnosis never seems to hit! I've tried using Nightmare as an adult but it just doesn't hit the same anymore. :(
I enjoyed using a Shuckle with Bad Dreams, Spore, and Nightmare in a hackmon playthrough I did recently. It wasn't exactly good, but the npcs don't really stand much of a chance.
@@dannybright8708 I...assume Pikachu could learn it as a TM in gen 1. but I haven't checked. regardless, why it is still in his moveset lol. just give it an electrical effect and call it Spark.
The first time I ever tried PVP double battle in Gen 6, someone sent out a Darkrai with that moveset. I forget what the second pokemon was, but it didn't even matter. Darkrai outsped all of my pokemon, hit them with Dark Void, and Nightmared them all to death. I haven't done PVP battles since.
Powder was such a sick move. Had so much doubles potential by stopping fire types from using a fire move and dealing 1/4 HP. Plus it was nice that a bug move had a one up on fire types
My favorite forgotten moves gotta be the strange line of dark status type moves that are really creative but ultimately underwhelming in practice, being Torment, Embargo and finally, Quash. They’re like Taunt’s long lost cousins. Oh and also Heart Stamp. Everybody loves Heart Stamp
has anyone ever actually figured out how to use Snatch - think it was tm 49 in gen 3. i always imagined it working lke mimic or copycat but could never get it to work or understand it even.
if i remember right one of the rental pokemon for its line has it for at least one of the pokemon stadium tournaments and it got me through a few rounds there
Right? I was a Pokemon Yellow kid, but out if the trio the Blastoise line earned big points with having such a cool and rare move. And I feel like if something has to have a 2 turn attack, a bulky defensive tortoise is a good option.
Powder in Gen 8 was for sure an oversight. Kinesis had the exact opposite thing happen, where until the Crown Tundra update, it had the deleted move description, even though Kadabra and Alakazam could learn the move in the Isle of Armor
Conversion was funny to used in gen 7 because as z move it became ... conversion z, matching porygon z name. A good move because it boosted all your stat while allowing you to change type, a bit like tera nowaday
Z-Conversion Omniboost + Type Change + Adaptability was a pretty potent combination for Gen 7 Porygon-Z. Despite the loss of Z-Moves (which made Conversion and its type change not viable), Porygon-Z even used Adaptability to its benefit during Gen 8 as well, packing an extremely-powerful Max Strike (usually from Hyper Beam) while Dynamaxed.
What's funny is even though I've never seen Skull Bash used in the games (either by me or NPCs), it's still pretty fresh on my mind as a move that exists because it's been one of Pikachu's (and Pichu's) special moves in Smash since 2001.
Conversion 2 was actually featured in a whole battle CD in XD! There was a Graveler that'd always use explosion on its second turn, and you only had a Hitmonlee and Porygon 2 with no moves that could come close to killing it, so you had to use Hitmonlee's tackle on P2, then have the P2 use conversion 2 to be able to survive the explosion!
I remember Skull Bash being the Squirtle line's signature move in Gen 2. I legitimately didn't know Powder was a move until reading a Fanfiction where a Vivillon used it in battle
Head Smash is nowhere near as terrible as you make it sound. Granted, it’s not amazing, and there are so many better moves than it, but it’s really not a terrible move by any means.
Yeah, it's not horrible, but a 130 power two-turn move is still pretty awful, especially when you have access to far more practical moves. I believe it was also only 100 power in Gen 1
Actually, there is one other Pokémon line that could learn Powder prior to Gen 8, the Cutiefly line via breeding. And since the Cutiefly line did make it into SwSh, that makes the theory that Powder was originally meant to be kept in the game a tiny bit more believable, assuming they were going to bump Powder from just being an egg move for Cutiefly to a level-up move.
Spike cannon and barrage, alongside egg bomb, are a relic of Gen I's original game design. Back then, Normal-type moves were seen as the "standard" moves of an RPG (i.e. hit with a sword, punch...) and non-Normal-type moves were seen as "magic" tricks pulled off by "magical" creatures (ice beams, psychic powers...). Hence, it makes sense to give signature moves to non-Normal-types that are not STAB if these signature moves do not use their "magic". Why I never understood, though, is why Normal-types get a STAB moves on Normal moves. Based on this principle, these moves should be sort of "typeless", this is why they are so widespead. STAB gives Normal-type Pokémon an advantage as they can make use of the most powerful moves everyone gets, but with a bonus
Well the thing is that normal types getting stab isn't as much of a game design concern when you realize most normal types in gen I are terrible. Tauros, Snorlax and Chansey are very much "prestige" pokemon that stand head and shoulders above the others for being much harder to obtain. Just think about how the other members of the Normal type like Lickitung, Pidgeotto, Raticate, Wigglytuff, etc. just kinda...exist and are serviceable in game but aren't good when put in any competitive environment.
For the same reason Normal was made a type at all instead of just making the whole thing typeless. It hits literally nothing for super-effective damage but they really wanted a "Beast-type" to represent Normal animals in their totally not a cockfighting simulator. Fortunately, they seem to have changed it from the NOrmal-type to the Omni-Type representing all types mixed together into a jack of all trades types representing the divine creation power of Arceus, considering its gimmick is to pluck a little from everything such as their wide movepools, some of them changing types, and Eevee evolving into Eeveelutions of many different types.
Yeah, sadly, Pokemon's original battle design philosophies haven't aged well at all. Still, it makes it strange how the game is centered around the type chart
@@autobotstarscream765 It is a weird combination of "typeless", "mammal" and "bird" types. Like, Porygon-Z and Castform are one thing imo, very different from Kangaskhan/Slaking/Purugly, or Noctowl/Chatot/Fearow.
I suppose they could have initially envisioned Normal being "balanced" because it can't hit anything super-effectively, but of course it's better to be able to 2HKO an entire team than OHKO one or two.
Regarding Powder in Gen 8: It's effectively a (very rare) HOME transfer move for Cutiefly and Ribombee, who could get it from breeding with a Vivillon that knew the move in USUM.
Hilariously ironic that I've used all of these moves for a while. The biggest reach is Nightmare because I only used it in Mystery Dungeon when trying to fiddle around with the Puppet status effect (which is it's own little rabbit hole), but other than that I've genuinely used all of these.
Why do I remember all these moves, and this guy doesn't? I mean I used skullbash on my Blastoise for a short while and I understand why people say it's bad because it just increases your Pokemon defense instead of actually protecting them, hell I wish they made it where skull bash actually summons protect on your pokemon instead of raising the Pokemon's defense.
Spike Cannon was actually cool in the Pokemon Adventures manga. Lorelei had her Cloyster use it and have her Dewgong freeze the spikes. I imagine that was the inspiration for Icicle Spear.
Hear me out: the same concept, but for abilities - there's also some great stuff like the Gen 3 ability Cacophany, which was an ability that no Pokemon had and went on to never be used! Awesome vid btw, glad to see an another awesome creator get a start in the Pokémon TH-camr community!🎉
I was waiting throughout the video for you to say "Trump Card." It's more obscure than several of the moves in this video. Trump Card is usable in 4 generations (4-7) before it was removed. Only learnable by 4 Pokemon at a high level: Eevee, Slowking, Minun, and Magearna. Never a TM, TR, or Move Tutor move.
nightmare being a tm in gen2 that you could teach to almost every pokemon was most likely a counter to rest strats. cant beat reds snorlax? just eat its dreams lol. people in competitive spamming rest? just use dream eater. is it a good move? not really. can it work in niche situations? sure
Honestly Spike Cannon always felt like it should be a Steel type move to me. The only multi hit steel type move we have is Gear Grind which is only two attacks and is only available to the Klink line, so it would have filled in a good niche. I think a lot of deleted moves would have been able to fill in a good niche if they just had their types change/were available to more Pokemon. The other one I thought was interesting was Smelling Salts. Imagine how good that would be if it had that effect on *every* status condition in the game. You could pair Hariyama (or any other Pokemon that learned it) with a toxic spikes setter and use it to sweep.
There's a ton of forgettable moves, whether or not they've been removed from the games. Trump Card (which gained power the less PP the move had, and was learned by a rather... eclectic group of Pokémon, including Eevee and Slowking, I believe), Me First (which copies the opponent's impending attack and uses it first with extra power), Soft-Boiled (as a TM in Gen I, it could only be taught to two Pokémon: Chansey and Mew), Spite (which lowered the PP of one of the opponent's moves), Grass Whistle (which put the opponent to sleep), Water Sport and Mud Sport (which reduced damage from Fire and Electric-type moves, respectively), the Pledge moves, Grass, Fire, and Water Pledge (which were made to be used together, to produce different effects on the field). Rototiller is also quite forgetful (it boosted the Attack and Special Attack of Grass-type Pokémon), Egg Bomb has also probably been forgotten (another Gen I TM).
the only one i didn't know about is trump card me first did something funny in a smallant video (pokemon x but every trainer pokémon is level 100), so i cant forget it for that
I'm not going to claim Skull Bash and Razor Wind are great moves, but the way you describe them does make you sound kind of biased. The moves worked just fine in my experience, and didn't ever cause me more trouble than most other 2-turn or low accuracy moves.
My candidate for Most Forgettable Forgotten Move - Reflect Type The only pokemon to learn this move when it was released in Gen 5 were: Latias (at level 70), Mew (at L1 or via Relearner), and... Staryu, at level 46 (40 in BW2). So a mythic, a legendary that wasn't from that gen, and a pokemon who you are almost definitely evolving before it gets to the level you could get this move at. Practically *nobody* saw this move when it came out. After that? The only pokemon to have it added to their movelists also are evolved pokemon who need to use the Relearner to use it... and then only three of them! (Tentacreul, Gengar, and Toedscruel). Just... why?
Competitively Reflect Type was actually quite useful. Basically what would normally happen was: -Starmie or Latias would knock out a Pokemon -Tyranitar would come in -Starmie or Latias would either attack ttar, not kill, and get killed by Pursuit (or Crunch if predicted), or they would try to switch out and get killed by Pursuit But with Reflect Type, they could instead turn into Rock/Dark types, which would make them resist Pursuit and switch out pretty freely. Losing a moveslot and not being able to use a scarf or specs sucked, and the move was still pretty niche because of this, but Pursuit was an extremely common way to take those 2 out, and being able to survive and keep your strong, fast special attacker around for longer was a huge deal. Obviously these days with Pursuit gone, this niche is gone, so it wouldn't really get used even if it were still around, but yeah.
Fun fact: razor wind was INCREDIBLY buffed in Blue Kaizo, which I think is the only time where it is legitimately good. It was buffed to be a one turn, hyper beam power level normal move with flinch chance. You can buy the TM from the Celadon Mart and it doesn't even feel broken because you really need all the help you can get.
The more of these moves I remember it makes sense that a lot of Pokemon moves got cut. For Example Like what was the point of play nice? Its just growl and most pokemon that learn play nice also learns growl
I think the purpose of most of these filler moves is just to give the player an edge against the random AI trainers. If the enemy has tackle, growl, leer, and play nice, that means they only have a 25% chance to actually attack you (compared to 33% if Play Nice weren't there), so if you're a 5 year old child playing the game hitting buttons at random, you're relatively likely to get through the trainers. I think this is also why so many early gen movesets suck. TM's and Move Tutors mean the player has access to more moves than enemy trainers, who usually just have their level up learnsets, have access to. That in addition to Stat Experience/EV's means the player's Pokemon are more likely to win, but in a way that kind of hides the fact that the scales are tipped in your favor.
This move isn't particularly bad, but I don't see any Pokemon other than Treecko learning Pound. I think maybe Piplup gets it too but I'm too lazy to check. It's basically the third scratch/tackle, yet it's so uncommon compared to the other two. You'd think a starting move such as this one wouldn't be collecting so much dust.
This video series is more like "Bad Pokémon moves". The only forgotten move for me in this video is Powder. I have 1000s of hours in Pokémon and looked up move sets for various Pokémon so this video is more suited for those that started playing Pokémon gen 5 and above. If you need to impress a lifelong fan like me, you'd need to dig a LOT deeper.
I do not agree with your stance of "I am glad they are removing some moves". You are thinking in purely gameplay sense, but sometimes such things as gameplay and story / wordlbuilding elements exist. More moves mean a little extra for someone to see or learn about some day, making each playthrough unique. There are also moves that represent actions Pokémon can do, but Game Freaks biggest setback was always distribution. It makes no sense that Barrage couldn't be learned by more Pokémon. Chansey, Spheal, Spoink, Mankey, Kangaskhan and so many Pokémon could have learned it. In Japanese it's called Ball Throw, so it could mean certain Pokémon could throw stuff. Other moves such as sharpen could have worked on most steel or rock Pokémon, and conversion could work on Pokémon with high IQ such as Metagross, Alakazam, Gardevoir, Keckleon. You could have made so much.
The first Pokémon game I played was Blue and the most recent was Sun. I'm actually a bit upset that they removed moves in Sword and Shield, wasn't aware of that until I saw this video. Some of these moves you mentioned, like Skull Bash, are actually not obscure to me but very familiar.
I am 100% with time you will be one of the most popular Pokemon youtubers on the platform. Your content honestly far exceeds what I see from other creators of the same demographic. 4k Subscribers, can't wait to see you at 1mil
I will never approve of them removing moves from the games, not when actually useful attacks like Signal Beam and Return were deleted for no reason. If they want moves to not be bad they should just buff them, either increase their power/accuracy or change their type to not Normal
Skull Bash isn't really that Forgettable as it often remembered as Side Special Move for Pikachu/Pichu in Smash Bros Series (also Pichu doesn't legally learns Skull Bash in main series games as far as I remembered)
To understand Gamefreak's obsession with normal moves in early gens think about how 90s JRPGs treated attack typing and functionality. The normal moves were are all basic physical (never special in early gens) attacks that almost all pokemon start with and would learn on level up. Then you have the typed attacks which were more of the cool moves you get to stand out from the normals and other types. You would get just a few of these usually based on your type and character's theme. It wasn't until gen 3 if not fully in gen 4 when this stopped being the case. Edit: replace the word normal with basic and understand that as a concept for early gen pokemon. Normal types had the most and the best physical moves and were widely distributed. This is also why being normal and some other type was super common. It gave you a boost on your basic attacks. The way people and game freak look at and treat the normal type today is as if it is a type just like grass or fire when it really was originally designed to be more of the basic element of the game that most pokemon share. With that being the case some times trading off your normal type to get a new type would now make your basic attacks weaker. Ever wonder why the level 4 Pidgey's tackle can do more damage than your level 5 or 6 Bulbasaur? It is the design of normal type in gen 1 to have those advantages over typed pokemon. For example Tauros and Snorlax are both 2 of the 3 best pokemon in gen 1 OU the upper competitive tier. They both love and lean on body slam and hyper beam the best normal moves in the game over other moves. That is at the tippy top of the top tier and they are using basic moves as basic pokemon to bully everyone. Normal was supposed to be the best type because it was the foundation of the type system. Second edit because i learned this after I posted this: 46.7 percent of moves in gen 1 are normal type. Hope whoever reads this finds this interesting. It explains a lot about the early games, like why Onyx sucks but is actually a genius design for the first boss and why Scyther only learns normal moves. Early gen pokemon isn't as wack as people make it out to be, but I also play gen1 OU so I'm just used to it by now.
I was surprised that there was no Conversion 3 or Conversion Z. I assumed there would be one for each Porygon evolution as it upgrades, it also gets an upgraded Conversion.
It blows my mind what people consider "forgettable." Like anyone with a blastoise knows skull bash, plus its been immortalized in smash. Or seeing every other npc using razor wind, or being confused on why the game wants to put smelling salts on your hariyama, or never having seen Z conversion. These feel forgettable exclusively for those who started in gen 8
This is where Pokémon has developed itself into a bind. Either new moves will be broken and OP or automatically undermined by extant moves. It's the same fundamental issue with Pokémon - it's too fundamental.
Smelling salt actually sounds interesting to give to pokemon.... That's likes to settle, since paralysis can help the pokemon settle and by the point they finish they either death of just powerful enough to defeat the enemy pokemon whit a 140 base power (maybe even higher whit stab) and paralysis don't really matter if the pokemon is out
I dont think the lofi hip hop vhs af sad xxxtentacion bart simpson edit filter really works thematically. It also makes all the gameboy and gameboy color sprites smear and look terrible. It also kinda drains alot of personality from the videos when its what literally everyone is doing spamming vhs filter stock presets
10:06 THANK YOU! This move is absolute garbage. It’s absolutely one of the worst moves in the game imo. Why did it take 2 turns with only 80 base power? Why is it not a flying type move? *Why did this move ever exist?*
You dont seem to talk about what level you get these moves does a lvl 30 cloyster have icicle spear or only spike cannon this is very important, cause otherwise we should remove tackle cuase it sucks
Razor Wind is probably best known by Mystery Dungeon fans because the move is one of the earliest available room wide spread moves. It’s almost like a status move because none of the starters learn it and it’s charge turn is a major detriment, but in the hands of an enemy pokémon it can do serious damage to your team.
Man the hate towards dragon type was so extreme in six gen, no new dragon moves, the best ones got nerfed, underwhelming new dragon mons, the fairy type, misty terrain dropping dragon moves potency for no apparent reason
Funny enough that I actually remember and use both Skull Bash and Razor Wind during my childhood playing Gen 3 Pokemon Sapphire. The reason? Razor wind animation is cool af for me as a kid. While the Skull Bash is because me and my friend were watching Charizard vs Magmar on the Pokemon Anime and we think it was cool, and yea it was. I don't remember nor I know the other moves haha
You could actually get Ribombee in gen 8, and it could learn powder in gen 7 through breeding. So you had to Island scan a scatterbug on a thursday in Hau'oli city, then level it up to level 55, then breed it with a Cutiefly to get one with powder as an egg move, then transfer it to pokemon box, then to pokemon home, then to pokemon sword and shield, then you can use powder in that game. I'm not sure if you can even get one anymore since they stopped the 3ds store. I don't know if they support the pokemon box app anymore either.
A lot of the Gen 1 Normal-type moves remind me how much more of a normal RPG RGBY felt like. Most moves were normal, and the elemental moves were special techniques. The Special stat isn't even split because it's acting more like a "Magic" stat in other games. Gen 2 things started shifting, but it was still basically an expansion to Gen 1. Then RS almost rebooted the series, this time very clearly as Pokemon games, which by that point had come to define their own category of games in which the elements take center stage.
Razor Wind as a 140 bp high-crit flying type move that phases the opponent on T1 & is shortened to 1 turn in Tailwind could've been good enough to play with casually
talking about powder moves, the hatterene line gets a special signature move called "Magic Powder", it literally just changes the type of the mon it hits into a psychic type, a very weird and useless move they added in a generation where they where removing moves in mass especially useful moves like Hidden Power and Pursuit
I love using these obscure moves when I find them 😅 it’s a hobby of mine to experiment with different strategies in Pokémon. Don’t knock it until you try it
I always figured smelling salt was suited for double battles with a fighting-resist partner. Though there weren’t enough of them in the games to test that theory.
How on earth is Aggron not able to learn Skull Bash? Not like it would be particularly useful on him but Aggron's titanic defenses would at least let him take a punch while the move is being charged so you could surprise your opponent by your Aggron being quirky or something lmao
It's crazy that i was so much into pokemon back in the gen 4-5 days that i knew about every single one of these except Powder (which was introduced in gen 6) Spending hours in the battle tower in Diamond is probably how i learned about most of these considering how weird some of the sets there are
I mentioned this in a comment in the last video, but I feel there’s a kicking move that’s even more obscure then triple kick. Rolling Kick is the only move I was surprised to have discovered exists. It’s 60 bp, incredibly inaccurate, and has a chance to make the target flinch. It was an exclusive move of hitmonlee, but now can be learned by only it, top, and marshadow, though it doesnt matter as there are farr better fighting moves for them to learn. Even in gen 1, it gets outclassed by the jump kicks. Triple Kick has an interesting gimmick where it increases in power with each hit while Rolling Kick has absolutely nothing going for it.
Okay, so recently I was searching through Electrodes's Gen 6 moveset because I wanted to try my hand at fixing some of the ORAS gym leaders, and I came across a move that I legitimately forgot about, Magnetic Flux. It just raises the defensive stats of Plus and Minus Pokemon, so you're not really missing much.
Skull Bash is far from forgettable, at least to the player, for being in the level up learnset of a starter. I would never use it now but back then i would just pick the coolest sounding moves.
It's also used a fair amount in the anime, too
Also it's in Smash Bros. as Pikachu's Side-B.
Also gen 5
I think Spike Cannon being removed is pretty tragic since it gives Cloyster a 100% accurate 100 base power normal move
Agreed. Skill Link Pokémon getting a number of multi-hit moves is nothing out of the ordinary, like when Heracross suddenly got Pin Missile, Bullet Seed, and Rock Blast upon gaining its Mega Evolution. Cloyster is one of the most well-known Skill Linkers and while Normal isn't a great attacking type, it is a good choice for coverage.
Cloyster has always been a bit of a favorite of mine, not a top fav when I was younger but 100% grown on me more as times gone on, and anytime I used one I let it keep Spike Cannon. I have never cared about "competitive" pokemon, probably because I skipped from Crystal to Moon since I had stopped playing pokemon after gen 2 for a long time outside of an emulated fire red run and getting a used copy of heart gold about a year before moon came out. So it never felt like a wasted move since against the AI its perfectly serviceable.
@@SovekOnivris Colyster’s hidden ability skill link guarantees that all multi hit moves will always hit five times which means all the ones cloyster gets are between like base 80 and base 120 and some get stab as well, so cloyster losing Spike cannon sucks extra hard
@@CyberchaoXnews flash: if a pokemon relies on a normal-type move for coverage, that pokemon is not good
Doesn't it already have Icicle Spear?
I remember Razor Wind for being annoying in Pokemon Super Mystery Dungeon. Since the attack hits the entire room, enemy Pokemon can snipe you from far away and crit you more often while doing so. The 'charge turn' for most attacks in Mystery Dungeon is just a single step, making the attack quick to use as well. A good few weird niche moves are actually pretty powerful in Mystery Dungeon. Essentially all multi-hit moves are OP, so Spike Cannon and Barrage are actually really good.
Yeah, Mystery Dungeon had some unique move mechanics. I remember fury attack being a huge problem in those games
@PokemonWoop I recall a Fearow one-shotting my Tyranitar with Fury Attack, but a Togekiss from the same dungeon did like 1/3 of my health with Aura Sphere. I'm pretty sure Sandstorm wasn't even active.
Agility is broken iirc because it allows you to move twice per turn.
@@robertlupa8273 Yes, remember those Aerodactyl in sky tower ? Plus, Agility applied to all allies ( or enemy ) in the room .
skull bash is a perfectly serviceable move for casual play as one is going through the story imo. I think having quirky moves that might not be great creates intrigue and fun to be had in the early game, even if its worthless in the post-game
It's definitely more interesting when moves aren't just X amount of damage in different types
Agreed. As far as 2-turn moves that don't make you semi-invulnerable on turn 1 go, Skull Bash is one of the better ones because it at least gives you a stat boost. Certainly a lot better than Razor Wind or Sky Attack.
@@CyberchaoX yeah razor wind is cool but not that useful
I don't like how most new moves are just different type versions of pre-existing moves or signature moves.
@@BrianSilva-oc7xg sometimes I think about Jade Cocoon 2 where there are only four "types" but they each have a different specialty.
Water focuses on healing and resists the status effects of Wind that work well on Fire which is needed to overpower Earth's defenses or something like that
Smelling salts saved me during my Elite Four run in Pokémon sapphire. I had Makuhita with me since Granite Cave and evolved it into Hariyama. During my final fight with Steven I was down to my final Pokémon in Hariyama. Manectric had already paralyzed metagross and all my pp for earthquake was gone and I couldn’t risk it on focus punch. I used smelling salts and the double power was just enough to knock out metagross
I would've thought a stab brick break or similarly powered fighting move doing neutral damage as opposed to a resisted normal type move would do more damage. Glad you defeated the metagross though
@@Cyntaria I ran out of brick break pp fighting glacia
honestly i had a hariyama in my first few runs and i used smelling salts a lot, it was a move that I just thought was neat. it's just one of those moves that i thought was special so it was needed.
@@arthurfidas7254the dark days before infinite leppa berries 😢
I imagine Nightmare might have been intended to counter Gen 2’s very Rest heavy meta-game, as there were a lot of bulky pokemon that couldn’t really heal any other way. Get them on the turn they rested, and you’d do half damage and whatever else you wanted to do.
Yeah, that's part of why Jynx is really great in gen 2
I find hard to believe that Game Freak, from all developing studios, would have the ability to test the game they were making to the point of developing the meta that ended up developing for real anyway, and consciously add a move to fight that meta. They couldn't even get the game to fit in a cartridge and had to be rescued by Iwata, you're giving them too much credit.
@@NickCapricorn Even a broken Game Freak can be right twice a gen? Tbf it didn’t work and their attempt to Fireproof a gen or two clearly went nowhere
@@Airlord3670They did the first five or six gens right; don't discredit what they did right.
@@xyannail4678 Game freak’s coding has always been famously broken with plenty of unbalanced gameplay, useless types, failed mechanics etc. I love Pokémon and millions still love and play the older gens to this day regardless but let’s not just ignore the faults of the past for nostalgia.
Conversion was actually really good in Gen 7 thanks to its Z move giving you an omni-boost
If you have Swallow Return/Aerial Ace on Porygon 1, 2, or Z, have the move in the first slot, and have Texture/Conversion turn the Pokémon into a Flying-type. Pretty cool.
Conversion on Porygon-Z makes Porygon-Z OP due to its Adaptability ability........
@@LuigiTheMetal64i used psychic on mine due to still giving that fighting resist while actually being a good special move and not a useless physical move
@@DracoX-hz3tudid that with shadow ball so I became immune to fighting.
Diet tera at home
Wait really wow
I think if Powder lasted for 5 turns, it would be intereting. Not good per se, but being able to nulify Fire moves for 5 turns may lead to very interesting gimmicks in the style of weakness policy or entrainment
5 turns a bit too much. 3 turns is more reasonable
I think five turns is good there aren’t that many cases where you’re going to be going up against a fire type
I think five is reasonable but should be play tested if they bring it back. However I think they should also allow it to be nullified as well, so moves like rapid spin or sandstorm can remove it reliably
@@cristhianmontoya6648 I feel 5 turns is reasonable, as long as only vivillion has it. it may be overpowered if other Pokemon had it, but Vivillion is mediocre enough to pull 5 turns without it being OP
@@MustacheDLuffyyeah cause stealth rock already is nerfing them why would they need another move nerfing the type for 5 turns it’s definitely too much
I remember running a Darkrai with Dark Void and Nightmare back in gen 6. I just loved the combo of Bad Dreams and Nightmare dealing a ton of damage to sleeping opponents.
It was absolutely not viable, but fun to pull off.
And then Smeargle came along and nerfed dark void into the ground lol.
I have fond memories of using a Haunter with Hypnosis, Nightmare, and Dream Eater in Diamond, back when I was a kid. It definitely wasn't the most efficient approach, but kid!me got a bit of a power trip out of making those poor NPCs watch their pokemon slowly die while being unable to do anything about it. It probably helped that I typically used Yawn with Uxie before switching into Haunter too lol, Hypnosis never seems to hit!
I've tried using Nightmare as an adult but it just doesn't hit the same anymore. :(
I enjoyed using a Shuckle with Bad Dreams, Spore, and Nightmare in a hackmon playthrough I did recently. It wasn't exactly good, but the npcs don't really stand much of a chance.
@@KreceirAll they had to do was make the move only work if Darkrai used it. But no, they had to destroy the move entirely
I remember my first online battle in Pokemon Battle Revolution was getting swept by a Darkrai with Dark Void and Nightmare in a double battle lmao
Skull Bash and Nightmare are among my favourite moves.
Also, IIRC, Pikachu's Side Smash in Super Smash Bros. is supposed to be Skull Bash
Side special
@@oz0006 Right, Side Special. I got confused, thanks for pointing it out
Which is very weird, since Pikachu can’t even learn Skull Bash in the games.
If anything it should’ve been Squirtle’s side special.
@@dannybright8708 I...assume Pikachu could learn it as a TM in gen 1. but I haven't checked. regardless, why it is still in his moveset lol. just give it an electrical effect and call it Spark.
I used Nightmare on my Darkrai in Platinum.
Dark Void + Nightmare + Bad Dreams was a cheesy but fun strat.
The first time I ever tried PVP double battle in Gen 6, someone sent out a Darkrai with that moveset. I forget what the second pokemon was, but it didn't even matter. Darkrai outsped all of my pokemon, hit them with Dark Void, and Nightmared them all to death. I haven't done PVP battles since.
You mean Dream Eater right?
Powder was such a sick move. Had so much doubles potential by stopping fire types from using a fire move and dealing 1/4 HP. Plus it was nice that a bug move had a one up on fire types
My favorite forgotten moves gotta be the strange line of dark status type moves that are really creative but ultimately underwhelming in practice, being Torment, Embargo and finally, Quash. They’re like Taunt’s long lost cousins.
Oh and also Heart Stamp. Everybody loves Heart Stamp
has anyone ever actually figured out how to use Snatch - think it was tm 49 in gen 3. i always imagined it working lke mimic or copycat but could never get it to work or understand it even.
@@liammallen95 it only works if the opponent is using a status move on the same turn
Quash is actually pretty good on prankster sableye lol
Quash is a beast in doubles
I actually used a Skull Bash Blastoise before and he actually did fairly good lol
if i remember right one of the rental pokemon for its line has it for at least one of the pokemon stadium tournaments and it got me through a few rounds there
Right? I was a Pokemon Yellow kid, but out if the trio the Blastoise line earned big points with having such a cool and rare move. And I feel like if something has to have a 2 turn attack, a bulky defensive tortoise is a good option.
Powder in Gen 8 was for sure an oversight. Kinesis had the exact opposite thing happen, where until the Crown Tundra update, it had the deleted move description, even though Kadabra and Alakazam could learn the move in the Isle of Armor
Conversion was funny to used in gen 7 because as z move it became ... conversion z, matching porygon z name. A good move because it boosted all your stat while allowing you to change type, a bit like tera nowaday
God tera is broken.
Z-Conversion Omniboost + Type Change + Adaptability was a pretty potent combination for Gen 7 Porygon-Z. Despite the loss of Z-Moves (which made Conversion and its type change not viable), Porygon-Z even used Adaptability to its benefit during Gen 8 as well, packing an extremely-powerful Max Strike (usually from Hyper Beam) while Dynamaxed.
@@sbclaridge gen 7 1v1s Z-Conversion was a MENACE, that thing was so strong
What's funny is even though I've never seen Skull Bash used in the games (either by me or NPCs), it's still pretty fresh on my mind as a move that exists because it's been one of Pikachu's (and Pichu's) special moves in Smash since 2001.
And Pikachu only learned it in ONE Gen too!
Conversion 2 was actually featured in a whole battle CD in XD! There was a Graveler that'd always use explosion on its second turn, and you only had a Hitmonlee and Porygon 2 with no moves that could come close to killing it, so you had to use Hitmonlee's tackle on P2, then have the P2 use conversion 2 to be able to survive the explosion!
I remember Skull Bash being the Squirtle line's signature move in Gen 2. I legitimately didn't know Powder was a move until reading a Fanfiction where a Vivillon used it in battle
Head Smash is nowhere near as terrible as you make it sound. Granted, it’s not amazing, and there are so many better moves than it, but it’s really not a terrible move by any means.
Yeah, it's not horrible, but a 130 power two-turn move is still pretty awful, especially when you have access to far more practical moves. I believe it was also only 100 power in Gen 1
You mean Skull Bash. Head Smash is a MUCH better move on the right Pokémon.
Actually, there is one other Pokémon line that could learn Powder prior to Gen 8, the Cutiefly line via breeding. And since the Cutiefly line did make it into SwSh, that makes the theory that Powder was originally meant to be kept in the game a tiny bit more believable, assuming they were going to bump Powder from just being an egg move for Cutiefly to a level-up move.
I remember using powder in my mono bug run in pokemon Y actually. I dont remember how much use i got out of it, but it was super fun anyway
Nightmare was actually pretty useful in gen 2 competitive play by punishing the many Pokemon that relied on using Rest as recovery
Spike cannon and barrage, alongside egg bomb, are a relic of Gen I's original game design. Back then, Normal-type moves were seen as the "standard" moves of an RPG (i.e. hit with a sword, punch...) and non-Normal-type moves were seen as "magic" tricks pulled off by "magical" creatures (ice beams, psychic powers...). Hence, it makes sense to give signature moves to non-Normal-types that are not STAB if these signature moves do not use their "magic".
Why I never understood, though, is why Normal-types get a STAB moves on Normal moves. Based on this principle, these moves should be sort of "typeless", this is why they are so widespead. STAB gives Normal-type Pokémon an advantage as they can make use of the most powerful moves everyone gets, but with a bonus
Well the thing is that normal types getting stab isn't as much of a game design concern when you realize most normal types in gen I are terrible. Tauros, Snorlax and Chansey are very much "prestige" pokemon that stand head and shoulders above the others for being much harder to obtain. Just think about how the other members of the Normal type like Lickitung, Pidgeotto, Raticate, Wigglytuff, etc. just kinda...exist and are serviceable in game but aren't good when put in any competitive environment.
For the same reason Normal was made a type at all instead of just making the whole thing typeless. It hits literally nothing for super-effective damage but they really wanted a "Beast-type" to represent Normal animals in their totally not a cockfighting simulator. Fortunately, they seem to have changed it from the NOrmal-type to the Omni-Type representing all types mixed together into a jack of all trades types representing the divine creation power of Arceus, considering its gimmick is to pluck a little from everything such as their wide movepools, some of them changing types, and Eevee evolving into Eeveelutions of many different types.
Yeah, sadly, Pokemon's original battle design philosophies haven't aged well at all. Still, it makes it strange how the game is centered around the type chart
@@autobotstarscream765 It is a weird combination of "typeless", "mammal" and "bird" types. Like, Porygon-Z and Castform are one thing imo, very different from Kangaskhan/Slaking/Purugly, or Noctowl/Chatot/Fearow.
I suppose they could have initially envisioned Normal being "balanced" because it can't hit anything super-effectively, but of course it's better to be able to 2HKO an entire team than OHKO one or two.
Regarding Powder in Gen 8: It's effectively a (very rare) HOME transfer move for Cutiefly and Ribombee, who could get it from breeding with a Vivillon that knew the move in USUM.
Hilariously ironic that I've used all of these moves for a while. The biggest reach is Nightmare because I only used it in Mystery Dungeon when trying to fiddle around with the Puppet status effect (which is it's own little rabbit hole), but other than that I've genuinely used all of these.
Why do I remember all these moves, and this guy doesn't? I mean I used skullbash on my Blastoise for a short while and I understand why people say it's bad because it just increases your Pokemon defense instead of actually protecting them, hell I wish they made it where skull bash actually summons protect on your pokemon instead of raising the Pokemon's defense.
I love Skull Bash, I wish more Pokémon learned it.
Spike Cannon was actually cool in the Pokemon Adventures manga. Lorelei had her Cloyster use it and have her Dewgong freeze the spikes. I imagine that was the inspiration for Icicle Spear.
Hear me out: the same concept, but for abilities - there's also some great stuff like the Gen 3 ability Cacophany, which was an ability that no Pokemon had and went on to never be used!
Awesome vid btw, glad to see an another awesome creator get a start in the Pokémon TH-camr community!🎉
Sounds interesting! I was also thinking of talking about Pokemon's oldest, obscure items
“making its own death bed never knowing it was already dead in the first place” is such a hard line
Hearing about some of these moves makes me feel *ancient* for having used them
I was waiting throughout the video for you to say "Trump Card." It's more obscure than several of the moves in this video. Trump Card is usable in 4 generations (4-7) before it was removed. Only learnable by 4 Pokemon at a high level: Eevee, Slowking, Minun, and Magearna. Never a TM, TR, or Move Tutor move.
nightmare being a tm in gen2 that you could teach to almost every pokemon was most likely a counter to rest strats. cant beat reds snorlax? just eat its dreams lol. people in competitive spamming rest? just use dream eater. is it a good move? not really. can it work in niche situations? sure
Honestly Spike Cannon always felt like it should be a Steel type move to me. The only multi hit steel type move we have is Gear Grind which is only two attacks and is only available to the Klink line, so it would have filled in a good niche.
I think a lot of deleted moves would have been able to fill in a good niche if they just had their types change/were available to more Pokemon.
The other one I thought was interesting was Smelling Salts. Imagine how good that would be if it had that effect on *every* status condition in the game. You could pair Hariyama (or any other Pokemon that learned it) with a toxic spikes setter and use it to sweep.
I love how ridiculously dramatic these videos are for such a light topic like obscure Pokémon moves lmao
There's a ton of forgettable moves, whether or not they've been removed from the games.
Trump Card (which gained power the less PP the move had, and was learned by a rather... eclectic group of Pokémon, including Eevee and Slowking, I believe), Me First (which copies the opponent's impending attack and uses it first with extra power), Soft-Boiled (as a TM in Gen I, it could only be taught to two Pokémon: Chansey and Mew), Spite (which lowered the PP of one of the opponent's moves), Grass Whistle (which put the opponent to sleep), Water Sport and Mud Sport (which reduced damage from Fire and Electric-type moves, respectively), the Pledge moves, Grass, Fire, and Water Pledge (which were made to be used together, to produce different effects on the field). Rototiller is also quite forgetful (it boosted the Attack and Special Attack of Grass-type Pokémon), Egg Bomb has also probably been forgotten (another Gen I TM).
soft boiled is commonly ran on chansey/blissey so I wouldn't call it forgotten.
the only one i didn't know about is trump card
me first did something funny in a smallant video (pokemon x but every trainer pokémon is level 100), so i cant forget it for that
Just seeing the move name “Trump Card” brought back so many memories for me.
the pledge moves literally have a niche in doubles
Gen 1 had so many strange TMs. I remember there was one for Water Gun in Mt. Moon
they keep wanting to make new pokemon, and gimmicks, when all they have to do is let pokemon have 5 mores or 3 types or 7 pokemon rosters.
Yeah, imagine being able to purchase extra move slots throughout the game
I'm not going to claim Skull Bash and Razor Wind are great moves, but the way you describe them does make you sound kind of biased. The moves worked just fine in my experience, and didn't ever cause me more trouble than most other 2-turn or low accuracy moves.
Skull Bash still sees some use in Pokémon Go. While it does still take a while to charge up, it's also still a 130 attack that increases your defense.
My candidate for Most Forgettable Forgotten Move - Reflect Type
The only pokemon to learn this move when it was released in Gen 5 were: Latias (at level 70), Mew (at L1 or via Relearner), and... Staryu, at level 46 (40 in BW2).
So a mythic, a legendary that wasn't from that gen, and a pokemon who you are almost definitely evolving before it gets to the level you could get this move at. Practically *nobody* saw this move when it came out.
After that? The only pokemon to have it added to their movelists also are evolved pokemon who need to use the Relearner to use it... and then only three of them! (Tentacreul, Gengar, and Toedscruel). Just... why?
Yeah, that one is really weird
Competitively Reflect Type was actually quite useful. Basically what would normally happen was:
-Starmie or Latias would knock out a Pokemon
-Tyranitar would come in
-Starmie or Latias would either attack ttar, not kill, and get killed by Pursuit (or Crunch if predicted), or they would try to switch out and get killed by Pursuit
But with Reflect Type, they could instead turn into Rock/Dark types, which would make them resist Pursuit and switch out pretty freely. Losing a moveslot and not being able to use a scarf or specs sucked, and the move was still pretty niche because of this, but Pursuit was an extremely common way to take those 2 out, and being able to survive and keep your strong, fast special attacker around for longer was a huge deal.
Obviously these days with Pursuit gone, this niche is gone, so it wouldn't really get used even if it were still around, but yeah.
Fun fact: razor wind was INCREDIBLY buffed in Blue Kaizo, which I think is the only time where it is legitimately good. It was buffed to be a one turn, hyper beam power level normal move with flinch chance. You can buy the TM from the Celadon Mart and it doesn't even feel broken because you really need all the help you can get.
The more of these moves I remember it makes sense that a lot of Pokemon moves got cut. For Example Like what was the point of play nice? Its just growl and most pokemon that learn play nice also learns growl
Yeah, it feels like Game Freak is realizing how many filler moves there were in the old gens
I think the purpose of most of these filler moves is just to give the player an edge against the random AI trainers. If the enemy has tackle, growl, leer, and play nice, that means they only have a 25% chance to actually attack you (compared to 33% if Play Nice weren't there), so if you're a 5 year old child playing the game hitting buttons at random, you're relatively likely to get through the trainers.
I think this is also why so many early gen movesets suck. TM's and Move Tutors mean the player has access to more moves than enemy trainers, who usually just have their level up learnsets, have access to. That in addition to Stat Experience/EV's means the player's Pokemon are more likely to win, but in a way that kind of hides the fact that the scales are tipped in your favor.
I Completely Forgot about Razor Wind!
Yeah, that move not being a Flying Type is such a disgrace!
Exactly. It's already terrible, so why not at least make it flying?
This move isn't particularly bad, but I don't see any Pokemon other than Treecko learning Pound. I think maybe Piplup gets it too but I'm too lazy to check. It's basically the third scratch/tackle, yet it's so uncommon compared to the other two. You'd think a starting move such as this one wouldn't be collecting so much dust.
This video series is more like "Bad Pokémon moves". The only forgotten move for me in this video is Powder. I have 1000s of hours in Pokémon and looked up move sets for various Pokémon so this video is more suited for those that started playing Pokémon gen 5 and above.
If you need to impress a lifelong fan like me, you'd need to dig a LOT deeper.
Exactly. skull bash and razor wind are not at all forgotten, they’re just underwhelming.
6:46 the lets go eevee moves should have been distributed to eeveelutions as their signautre moves
Skull Bash suppose not to be in the list, since Super Smash Bros. Pikachu exists
I do not agree with your stance of "I am glad they are removing some moves". You are thinking in purely gameplay sense, but sometimes such things as gameplay and story / wordlbuilding elements exist. More moves mean a little extra for someone to see or learn about some day, making each playthrough unique. There are also moves that represent actions Pokémon can do, but Game Freaks biggest setback was always distribution. It makes no sense that Barrage couldn't be learned by more Pokémon. Chansey, Spheal, Spoink, Mankey, Kangaskhan and so many Pokémon could have learned it. In Japanese it's called Ball Throw, so it could mean certain Pokémon could throw stuff. Other moves such as sharpen could have worked on most steel or rock Pokémon, and conversion could work on Pokémon with high IQ such as Metagross, Alakazam, Gardevoir, Keckleon. You could have made so much.
The first Pokémon game I played was Blue and the most recent was Sun. I'm actually a bit upset that they removed moves in Sword and Shield, wasn't aware of that until I saw this video. Some of these moves you mentioned, like Skull Bash, are actually not obscure to me but very familiar.
I am 100% with time you will be one of the most popular Pokemon youtubers on the platform. Your content honestly far exceeds what I see from other creators of the same demographic. 4k Subscribers, can't wait to see you at 1mil
I was with him since he had 11 subs
Absolutely agree, he Is so underrated
Thanks! I think 1 mil is a bit too far of a reach currently but the goal is 10K!
@@PokemonWoop nah ppl wont stop til 10 mil
I will never approve of them removing moves from the games, not when actually useful attacks like Signal Beam and Return were deleted for no reason. If they want moves to not be bad they should just buff them, either increase their power/accuracy or change their type to not Normal
Return and Frustration got deleted because Gen 8 changed how friendship works.
@@shatteredsentient5321 they shouldn't have messed with the friendship system then
Skull Bash isn't really that Forgettable as it often remembered as Side Special Move for Pikachu/Pichu in Smash Bros Series (also Pichu doesn't legally learns Skull Bash in main series games as far as I remembered)
youre so underrated wth
To understand Gamefreak's obsession with normal moves in early gens think about how 90s JRPGs treated attack typing and functionality. The normal moves were are all basic physical (never special in early gens) attacks that almost all pokemon start with and would learn on level up. Then you have the typed attacks which were more of the cool moves you get to stand out from the normals and other types. You would get just a few of these usually based on your type and character's theme. It wasn't until gen 3 if not fully in gen 4 when this stopped being the case.
Edit: replace the word normal with basic and understand that as a concept for early gen pokemon. Normal types had the most and the best physical moves and were widely distributed. This is also why being normal and some other type was super common. It gave you a boost on your basic attacks. The way people and game freak look at and treat the normal type today is as if it is a type just like grass or fire when it really was originally designed to be more of the basic element of the game that most pokemon share. With that being the case some times trading off your normal type to get a new type would now make your basic attacks weaker. Ever wonder why the level 4 Pidgey's tackle can do more damage than your level 5 or 6 Bulbasaur? It is the design of normal type in gen 1 to have those advantages over typed pokemon. For example Tauros and Snorlax are both 2 of the 3 best pokemon in gen 1 OU the upper competitive tier. They both love and lean on body slam and hyper beam the best normal moves in the game over other moves. That is at the tippy top of the top tier and they are using basic moves as basic pokemon to bully everyone. Normal was supposed to be the best type because it was the foundation of the type system.
Second edit because i learned this after I posted this: 46.7 percent of moves in gen 1 are normal type. Hope whoever reads this finds this interesting. It explains a lot about the early games, like why Onyx sucks but is actually a genius design for the first boss and why Scyther only learns normal moves. Early gen pokemon isn't as wack as people make it out to be, but I also play gen1 OU so I'm just used to it by now.
Add another edit and learn how to write Tauros or I will haunt you in your dreams.
Yeah, that's pretty interesting. I think I also read somewhere that Gen 1 was based around having not 100% accurate moves
I was surprised that there was no Conversion 3 or Conversion Z. I assumed there would be one for each Porygon evolution as it upgrades, it also gets an upgraded Conversion.
It blows my mind what people consider "forgettable." Like anyone with a blastoise knows skull bash, plus its been immortalized in smash.
Or seeing every other npc using razor wind, or being confused on why the game wants to put smelling salts on your hariyama, or never having seen Z conversion. These feel forgettable exclusively for those who started in gen 8
Nightmare Noctowl helped me cheese Red. Level 47 vs. 70s. It was so funny.
This is where Pokémon has developed itself into a bind. Either new moves will be broken and OP or automatically undermined by extant moves. It's the same fundamental issue with Pokémon - it's too fundamental.
Smelling salt actually sounds interesting to give to pokemon.... That's likes to settle, since paralysis can help the pokemon settle and by the point they finish they either death of just powerful enough to defeat the enemy pokemon whit a 140 base power (maybe even higher whit stab) and paralysis don't really matter if the pokemon is out
Considering the Hariyama on Victory Road, I saw Smelling Salt often while grinding for levels.
I also knew about powder because of another video.
Has he talked about comet punch? It sounds so cool, but it's a normal attack that has pitiful uses
I dont think the lofi hip hop vhs af sad xxxtentacion bart simpson edit filter really works thematically.
It also makes all the gameboy and gameboy color sprites smear and look terrible.
It also kinda drains alot of personality from the videos when its what literally everyone is doing spamming vhs filter stock presets
10:06 THANK YOU! This move is absolute garbage. It’s absolutely one of the worst moves in the game imo. Why did it take 2 turns with only 80 base power? Why is it not a flying type move? *Why did this move ever exist?*
you mean Razor Wind?
I like the lowkey and eerie music you use over this. Gives a nice mysterious feeling.
I've watched the two videos of this series and I've recognized every single Pokémon move on this list... I don't know how to feel about it...
You dont seem to talk about what level you get these moves does a lvl 30 cloyster have icicle spear or only spike cannon this is very important, cause otherwise we should remove tackle cuase it sucks
I wanna see a nightmare only pokemon run now
That sounds like a nightmare... literally
Razor Wind is probably best known by Mystery Dungeon fans because the move is one of the earliest available room wide spread moves. It’s almost like a status move because none of the starters learn it and it’s charge turn is a major detriment, but in the hands of an enemy pokémon it can do serious damage to your team.
I find it more insulting that Razor Wind isn’t a Flying-type move, rather than it just being a mediocre move.
Man the hate towards dragon type was so extreme in six gen, no new dragon moves, the best ones got nerfed, underwhelming new dragon mons, the fairy type, misty terrain dropping dragon moves potency for no apparent reason
Funny enough that I actually remember and use both Skull Bash and Razor Wind during my childhood playing Gen 3 Pokemon Sapphire. The reason? Razor wind animation is cool af for me as a kid. While the Skull Bash is because me and my friend were watching Charizard vs Magmar on the Pokemon Anime and we think it was cool, and yea it was.
I don't remember nor I know the other moves haha
You could actually get Ribombee in gen 8, and it could learn powder in gen 7 through breeding. So you had to Island scan a scatterbug on a thursday in Hau'oli city, then level it up to level 55, then breed it with a Cutiefly to get one with powder as an egg move, then transfer it to pokemon box, then to pokemon home, then to pokemon sword and shield, then you can use powder in that game.
I'm not sure if you can even get one anymore since they stopped the 3ds store. I don't know if they support the pokemon box app anymore either.
Pokemon Bank is still supported if you already have it, but if you didn't get it before the 3DS shop closed, you're indeed out of luck.
This was such boring information and yet you put this mysterious music over the top of it. It makes it even more boring.
Me who knows each one of these moves. I feel old lol and well you'd know all these if you played the games a decent amount of time
Gen6 really hated dragon types"
Personally? Give more mons forgettable quirky moves for kids to mess around with
It’s a shame that moves get hit. Not everything needs to be viable. It’s all about having a wide variety.
i saw my friend use powder to sweep mala in pokemon X it was hillarious
3rd viewer plus first comment!
Wait woop foreshadowed this vid omg-
A lot of the Gen 1 Normal-type moves remind me how much more of a normal RPG RGBY felt like. Most moves were normal, and the elemental moves were special techniques. The Special stat isn't even split because it's acting more like a "Magic" stat in other games. Gen 2 things started shifting, but it was still basically an expansion to Gen 1. Then RS almost rebooted the series, this time very clearly as Pokemon games, which by that point had come to define their own category of games in which the elements take center stage.
That was kind of the theme of Gen 1. Voltorb, Koffing, Grimer, Vileplume... These all seem like Final Fantasy inspired
Razor Wind as a 140 bp high-crit flying type move that phases the opponent on T1 & is shortened to 1 turn in Tailwind could've been good enough to play with casually
That's pretty cool. Would it be too broken if it could set up Tailwind during it's charging turn?
Great video, thoroughly enjoyed, but why is it edited with horror ambiance?
i completely forgot razor wind existed until a random absol in my emerald used it
talking about powder moves, the hatterene line gets a special signature move called "Magic Powder", it literally just changes the type of the mon it hits into a psychic type, a very weird and useless move they added in a generation where they where removing moves in mass especially useful moves like Hidden Power and Pursuit
Starmine will sometimes use nightmare in gen 2 to counter snorlax
I love using these obscure moves when I find them 😅 it’s a hobby of mine to experiment with different strategies in Pokémon. Don’t knock it until you try it
You know, I actually have been doing a similar thing, but instead using lesser used Pokemon in playthroughs
i wish they'd actually tried tweaking some of these to be actually better, 900 moves but basically every mon of a given type just used the same ones
Yeah, Game Freak should tweak more moves instead of removing them
I always figured smelling salt was suited for double battles with a fighting-resist partner. Though there weren’t enough of them in the games to test that theory.
Nightmare saw play in gen 2 due to the prominence of rest and sleeptalk
Two episodes in and nothing about Doom Desire?
How on earth is Aggron not able to learn Skull Bash? Not like it would be particularly useful on him but Aggron's titanic defenses would at least let him take a punch while the move is being charged so you could surprise your opponent by your Aggron being quirky or something lmao
probably because Aggron is already high in Defense stat.......
Steel (or rock) type Skull Bash would be pretty crazy
@@PokemonWoop what do you mean by "would be pretty crazy"?
I like your videos but why are these directed like a creepypasta video
Smash keeps Skull Bash alive as it’s pretty well known there.
It's crazy that i was so much into pokemon back in the gen 4-5 days that i knew about every single one of these except Powder (which was introduced in gen 6)
Spending hours in the battle tower in Diamond is probably how i learned about most of these considering how weird some of the sets there are
I mentioned this in a comment in the last video, but I feel there’s a kicking move that’s even more obscure then triple kick. Rolling Kick is the only move I was surprised to have discovered exists. It’s 60 bp, incredibly inaccurate, and has a chance to make the target flinch. It was an exclusive move of hitmonlee, but now can be learned by only it, top, and marshadow, though it doesnt matter as there are farr better fighting moves for them to learn. Even in gen 1, it gets outclassed by the jump kicks. Triple Kick has an interesting gimmick where it increases in power with each hit while Rolling Kick has absolutely nothing going for it.
Yeah, that move is pretty terrible. Hitmonlee has no need to run it
Hey Woop, Game Freak also deleted Signal Beam and Sky Uppercut in gen 8 as well
Yeah, a surprising amount of moves were deleted. Some of them were pretty cool
Great video but why is it edited like a creepypasta vid 😭
Okay, so recently I was searching through Electrodes's Gen 6 moveset because I wanted to try my hand at fixing some of the ORAS gym leaders, and I came across a move that I legitimately forgot about, Magnetic Flux. It just raises the defensive stats of Plus and Minus Pokemon, so you're not really missing much.
I know all these moves lol