Man, I remember seeing this when I was like 10 in the IMAX theater at the USAF Museum. Kinda inspired me to be a fighter pilot, but then I did terrible in high school and ended up in the Marine Corps infantry instead lol.
"Another glorious day in the corps! A day in the Marine Corps is like a day on the farm. Every meal’s a banquet! Every paycheck a fortune! Every formation a parade! I love the corps!" -Sgt Apone
Yeah, all the "pub shots" were done back seat of Eagles because they had no way to do IMAX in a Viper. Also, like 90% of this film was done out of Mountain Home with the 366th Wing, which was then still the Composite Wing and so almost every aircraft in the air-to-air are MO birds, including the KC-135s and the B-1Bs. That's also why the ground is so oddly green. They're in Idaho and Northern Utah, not Southern Nevada. Also, you comment about the CG, but it's really funny because the "mountain flying" was done by a camera ship, a Learjet, and they composited an F-15E into the shot. The funniest part is that "nose gear" shot was the Lear 35 camera ship's, not an F-15's.
@@cup_and_cone it was a practicality and cost issue. Why modify 2 airplanes (and F-16D and an F-15D or E) for a very short number of in-cockpit shots just for the aggressors? Putting an IMAX camera in a cockpit isn't a small thing, so you just do 1 camera bird and do all the shots in it.
To make the point clearer - *nothing was changed as far as airframes*. All of the exterior shots and narrative was that the Aggressors were flying Vipers. The only thing that wasn't "correct" was that the in-cockpit shots for the Aggressor Lead were done in the back seat of the F-15 modified to fly an IMAX camera looking back into the rear cockpit.
366th is an all two-seater wing now....389th Thunderbolts lost the Viper to get the Strike Eagle, 390th Wild Boars 🐗 has the near-useless EA-18 Growler and 391 Bold Tigers still has the Strike Eagle
When they were making it the folks writing all this probably thought. They've probably seen top gun so they'll this notice it's the other storied program that gets seared into your brain if you read about the Vietnam era to present. And in Top gun they just send one crew soo we'll just send one guy, the people watching will only be able to handle one person anyway, throw the whole group in and then we actually have to do tactics which will just make a lot of them feel stupid and people don't like to feel stupid.. Of course if they're actually stupid they probably don't have to worry about them thinking.
Colonel Stratton the “main character” in the IMAX film was my wing commander at Lakenheath. I remember going up to him and talking to him because I recognized his name on the side of the jet in the film from when I was a kid. Awesome guy. I heard he just retired. He was a captain (0-3) at the time of the making of the film. I got to launch him out even though he didn’t fly much because of his leadership position.
Major Novotny (the Red Flag Boss) eventually came to Lakenheath the 48 FW/CC, then LtC Stratton arrived, overlapping time as the 493FS Grim Reapers commander. Col Novotny became BG Novotny as the 57 WG/CC and retired a few years ago from there.
I love how the filmmakers clearly were shown the real Red Flag post mission replay system (think slightly updated Atari 2600) and were like “nope, get me the 3D guy right now and let’s movie this up a bit”.
I've heard a story that the Royal navy once sent some buccaneers to red flag and they asked for 250ft, ATC told them they are cleared to descend to 250ft, they responded ascending to 250ft.
@@brianwright9514 Oddly enough...it isn't. I've heard that from multiple sources. Buc crews were known to have come back trailing power lines that they hit while...climbing. There was a story that one of them actually hit the desert floor and bounced--that one probably *is* an embellishment, but weirder things have happened. The Buccaneer crews were trained in Europe during the Cold War, when the hard deck was the ground and the only way they were told they would live longer than three seconds was to go in at ten feet AGL. (Given the initially heavy losses RAF Tornados took in Desert Storm, that might not have been the best tactic.) Incidentally, by that time, the RN had gotten rid of their conventional carriers and gave all their Bucs to the RAF.
@@PolarizedMechs I was at Red Flag #3 in 1976 and the Buc guys were nuts when it came to low level. I thought I was good at LL as I was there in a recce F-4. My limit at the time was 500' later lowered to 100' but like you said the Buc's hard deck was grnd zero. Great time, not as regimented as it is today. We had 10 aircraft in echelon on initial including F-4's, RF-4C's, F-105, F-106...Boss said, "It looked great, don't do it again!"
John talking to his squadron at home: Hey guys you comin to Red Flag? Squad: Yea John, you go ahead of us we'll see you there. John: Cool, see you there. 2 hours later.............. Squad: ......and then he said, see you there lmaoooo..
I was two years out of Pensacola when I saw this in Imax with my ex. When the harriers survived for more than 9 seconds after crossing the line I called bullshit
@@craigcarter9513 Lookdown shootdown is a very real thing. Before airspace is permissive harriers, A-10s and helos really have to have a lot of help from fighters and SEAD platforms to operate in enemy airspace. The contingent of harriers seen in that imagery made my asshole pucker because they were coming in way too close to the front line of fighter support. Obviously we aren't seeing the whole picture or battle plan on this one, but it feels like a planned ejection seat test on the eyeball test
Guys, it's IMO quite disrespectful to make jokes about an accident where so many lost their lives. I'm all about joking and having fun in comments but this got to much for me. Be safe and well. Hopefully this shitty times will end soon.
Colonel John Stratton actually just retired from the Air Force this past fall. So anyone saying there's no way he's a real pilot because he's "overweight", you're wrong.
They also have not seen many pilots either. They come in all shapes and sizes. I was surprised when I got on the line seeing the variety of pilots. Before that I thought they were all tom cruise.
Loved the commentary. Had me smiling all the way through. I was stationed at Nellis in the early 80's for three and a half years with the 433rd FWS/F-15 FWS. I was an environmental systems tech cross trained into crew chief. Got to see lots of air forces such as the Germans, French, Brits, Italians, Thais and even Singapore. Singapore brought six F-5's and a C-130. Which, at the time, was their entire air force. Saw a bunch of different aircraft as well. In addition to the F-15's, F-16's, F-4's and A-10's and F-5's already there we saw Bucs, Jaguars, Mirages and Tornadoes. The Brits brought two Vulcans right after the Falklands war. Got to fly on an E-3 and observe while they were controlling the air space over the range during a Red Flag. There were F-111's, A-7's and A-37's. The Navy brought some A-4's once. Saw a U2 land. Got to crawl around an SR-71 although we couldn't see the cockpit and saw the last active duty F-86. The F-16XL was also there for testing as well as the PA-48 Enforcer. I'm sure I'm forgetting some as well. Nellis was a happening place with much going on all the time. I could go on for hours. Definitely the best assignment of my Air Force career.
One of the things here is those were Royal Navy Sea Harrier FA2's shown on the ground. Pretty much dedicated fleet defence fighters with AMRAAM or AIM-9's, very limited ground attack capability on their own (though the CGI "AWACS" shots show Harrier II's) They were retired in 2006, and the Fleet Air Arm transitioned to the RAF's Harrier II's, the GR7's and GR9's which didn't even have a radar, which would be why they started hanging around interdicting at 100ft. When you saw them in 2010, that would have been just months before all the UK Harriers were retired in December that year.
If you look in the background there's a couple of RAF Harrier IIs kicking around on the flightline too. (Example at 6:21 - tell is the smaller nose (no air defence radar) and retractable rather than fixed refuelling probe)
I saw this in the IMAX theater at the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum outside Wash. D.C. shortly after it was released. I found it very entertaining and the parts that "stuck" with me were the ground attack sequences. My God, it was devastating and seemed like there was no chance of survival for anyone or anything on the ground. Death from above - Assured! My Dad was a Navy pilot and he told me a little about their survival training. Part of it was a five day exercise when the pilots were dropped off in separate locations in the desert somewhere with the typical gear they would have after ejecting. The pilots' goal was to evade capture for as long as possible and to move to some designated "rescue" area. The biggest incentive to evade capture was that it was a five day exercise regardless of how long the evasion was successful. After capture (most of them within a day), the pilots went to a mock POW camp to endure more abuse. He told me he spent a lot of time buried in the sand during the day and only moved at night (before widespread use of thermal imaging). Nobody got much sleep whether they were evading or suffering the sleep deprivation "torture" of the POW camp.
There was one time years ago the spanish air force team sent there got their asses handed to them really bad .. i can confirm they totally felt like losing when coming back.
I was so hoping you'd have a commentary on this, Mover. I knew the acting was cheesy, but the rest of the details deserved an honest scrutiny which only a genuine military fighter jockey could provide. Well done, exceeded expectations.
My memory of watching this film for the first time was quite special because I saw it at the Avalon Airshow in Melbourne Australia in 2007. We were given a brief introduction from special guest of honor Gen Chuck Yeager before the showing of the movie. I'd have preferred listening to him talk more rather than watch the movie.
Valid assessment. Having flown Red Flag in 2000, I remember thinking some of the same things when this movie came out. And even then, I thought the CGI was cheesy!
I love the fact that it’s not even a minute in, and you can already point out several issues with the “documentary.” Also… Yesterday, my son (11) and I saw Lemoore NAS Hornets flying two-ship formations I think you called fingertip. I live near SF, but have a project in Visalia, so we drove past LNAS twice and saw the tight formation flying twice. Gorgeous day. I’ll send pics to the mailbag.
Opening unrestricted climb was filmed in Mountain Home AFB, Idaho. In fact quite a few of the airborne scenes were shot within the Mountain Home Range Complex. The F-15´s and F-16´s show MO on the tails. 391FS F-15E, 390FS F-15C and 389FS F-16CM if I remember correctly.
@Mover I feel you are missing a comedic opportunity, Mover. "Mystery Mover Theater 3000" Your cadence and humor are similar to the Mystery Science Theater 3000 format. I could see Gonk, you, and some puppets silhouetted, ripping the shit out of movies! Hahahahaha!!!
I haven't watched this TH-cam video yet, but I just wanted to say I remember buying this years ago and was so disappointed. The best thing about the DVD is there is a long montage of great footage (no special effects) of all these different aircraft flying. No dialog just beautiful video footage. I don't blame any of the service members for this corny film. Thank all of you for your service!
Great commentary Mover; loved it! Aileron roles are great; they distribute the incoming rounds much better around the airframe. Those flares are mostly jettisons, not a decoy program, but to be fair for safety reasons our armourers would prefer you came back with empty dispensers. I used to enjoy looking round the threat systems but I don't remember there being a Nazi 88 in there?
Absolutely loved this video….I assume, as with other flicks, a lot of the footage is filmed the way it is for the viewer to appreciate more excitement in what may be occurring.But I appreciate your incites into what really happens! And your comments were also hilarious….especially from someone who knows what they are talking about! Thank you for a great video and the entertainment as well….you never disappoint 🇺🇸🤘😁
Stratton was supposed to attend my dad's retirement at Maxwell in March 2020. Covid hit and the day before the AF reduced the attendance from 700 to 10 and he got axed so we had family only. Shitty way to see my dad retire after an amazing career flying Vipers. I did meet him briefly at the BBQ though.
There was actually a really good set of videos from years ago that had live fire scenes. As a guy who spent many of my formative years in TACP units, I concentrated on the A-10 parts, but I think the whole thing was actually well done. It had the radio traffic from the pilots, which is always eye-opening for folks who have never flown large exercises. I thought I saved the link, but it may not be on TH-cam any more.
You mentioned Harrier at 100 ft; guy I knew while in USAF flew B-52 & like to tell story of when he was at 200 ft at Red Flag, & an RAF Buccaneer flew under them at about 80 ft.
The base he's leaving is Mountain Home in Idaho in the opening scene. There are various versions of the Eagle but it would appear many of the shots are from the backseat of the F15E and from Seymour-Johnson AFB, NC. I flew as a nose gunner from Seymour. I've participated in 8 RedFlags from 1980-1987 in the F4E and the A7D. I flew Air-to-Air, Conventional Air-to-Ground, Close Air Support and even some Wild Weasel work in the hunter-killer mission. I'm with Mover on most of his comments. For me the most bogus issue is the proximity of the jets in the Air to Air video which was done so that you can get the jets in the same frame. In real air to air engagements you'd never be able to see both jets. We never got as close to each other as we see in the movies.
I remember you once hinting this roast was coming and it did and it did not disappoint. It's really fun, how even in the midst of roasting you share an immense passion for flying which dammit makes me wanna just hop in a cockpit. Thanks Mover, a great way to end 2021
Some of my best memories were at Red Flag. I was an F-16 (A/B, C/D) crew chief out of Hill AFB from 88-91 and as a lover of all things that fly it was always awesome to see pretty much every type from every branch.
Red Flag was at Nellis AFB, Nevada when I flew for the Air Force in the 1980s. The city skyline in some of the video looks like Las Vegas, which is very close to Nellis AFB. Could the documentary be a mixture of video through the decades? Mover, I love your channel and content. God Bless America.
It's a composite. Some of the footage was filmed at Nellis, hence Vegas being in the background. A lot of the flying was filmed over the Sayler Creek range in Idaho, which is why the aircraft are all out of Mountain Home.
So I saw this at the United States Air Force Museum in Dayton last year and I thought it was amazing and awesome. It was very inspiring having you have served as an army aviator well an army aviation mechanic would be more like it I worked on helicopter engines but anyways to the point seeing someone that actually knows this information go through it and I checked it I got to tell you this is the funniest movie review I’ve ever seen I am dying over here.
Hey, Mover! I was in 94-98, stationed at Tyndall (one of your favorites bases), and they used to host a little thing called "William Tell", where they had fighter groups from all over the Country and some foreign countries shoot down Firebee drones and towed targets. Do you know if they still do this kind of thing anymore? They even live-streamed it over the local Panama City TV station. BTW, the aircraft back then were F-101's, F-102's and F-106's. THe RO in the Voodoo was called a Scope Wizard.
I was at Tyndall 1992-2000, in the 2nd FS. I really had a great time there. Spring break on PC Beach was crazy. Saw many Airmen have to do the walk of shame into the shirt's and commanders office for getting busted on the beach by police raising hell.
Rob Novotny, the guy who is leading the briefs and apparently, the Air Boss on the AWACS did indeed go on to become a BG about 15 years later. I believe he commands the 57th Wing at Nellis today.
Good comments Mover. The Red Flags I flew in the 80s were like what you described. My first time there in a 111 I ended up with a 111 and an F4 and a 105 on my wing. It was barely VFR at Nellis and I had never flown in there before. I finally saw the airfield at about runway mid point and we all pitched out and landed ok. I did not want to be the guy going straight through initial with 3 guys on my wing.
my last Red Flag was in 2001, then shipped to Osan and then out. But from the maintenance side, F16 crew chief. I do remember a lot of formation flights tho, and most missions were at night indeed. Always wanted to hear from the pilot's perspective about this.
The IMAX movie didn’t cover the tanker crew that was non-A downtown (natural for tankers) who ended up in some roach hotel on E Flamingo Rd that had a murder occur down the hall…
Thanks for picking this apart, Mover...I think I saw that when it first came out and felt then that it was a 'made for TV' flick instead of a true to scale documentary...cool to see the flight footage nonetheless!...Happy New Year!
Ah, man...I thought this was "Red Flag: The Ultimate Game." I was hoping to see Mover's thoughts on the F-4 outside loop scene, and the F-5 diving into the ground trying to follow him. A friend of my dad's, who was a F-4G pilot, was in that movie, and the director told him "You need to act natural! You're a fighter pilot!" So he looked extremely bored. Oh well...this will still be fun.
Hey Mover… ya know I got to thinking about your description of your mental state … and I’m going to mix this comment with your Single Engine landing. I have stated several times that I was a USAF Crew Chief…. On EVERY LAUNCH… I felt that way until my jet was wheels up … no matter if I was on it or not. I was damn good at what I did ( PreFlt eval 100% no defects) from crew chief to recovery team leader in 3 years. I went to recovery because I had to bail out of the CC spot… the anxiety was causing sleep issues. I was fixing jets in my sleep. The stresses are so intense for both air and ground crew to perform and for us… the boots on the ground, the name on the canopy… WE Silently SCREAM that we never lose a bird. I hand you the 781’s with my signature and my Chiefs Signature… he is backing me on my word that the jet is GTG. I want you to know how deeply the crew chief feels about the pilot and the jet. Just like your dogs are to you… that jet/pilot/crew ( I’m a old Tanker guy) is the same to us. Here’s to a better year in 22’
The opening scene of the unrestricted climb to FL250 view from the cockpit looking behind is my all time favorite! The view paired with the music gives me chills every time! ❤
I’ve been following your channel for a few years and am not sure how I missed this video. I honestly didn’t believe you could ruin my favorite scene but when you said he’s in the back seat my heart sank 😂 It’s still a phenomenal shot 😎
RE "Parachuting Survivor": I never saw this occur. Of my 3 visits to Red Flag with Air Force Rescue, a "pilot" (quotes included cuz it did not need to be a rated pilot...any warm body would do as a survivor) & SERE instructor were dropped off by HH-60, and a scenario was built based on his or her location. Very "Hollywood" here!
🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩 AF Top Gun..NOICE! For this guy in the Strike Eagle. In the forever immortal words of, Nick "Goose" Bradshaw, "the alternative plaque is down in the ladies room". Ahahaha "I crack myself up" (of course referring to 1st place at Miramar.) Mover? You don't ruin movies, you make movies better.. thanks
Got the DVD of this, and pissed off my family watching it, think you nailed pretty much all of it. "We own the night," is getting worn out, but calling out the backseat driving got me a lot of grief! Def not Eglin, no Gulf in the background!
Enjoy the "mover ruins" series, lol. It does seem like this was more of "a movie loosely based off of a Red Flag exercise". Than a real documentary. Can't get any worse than that 80s movie "Red Flag: The Ultimate Game". That movie was just a crime.
That line about bringing the best pilots and maintainers is BS. I've been to three red flags as a maintainer and we take everyone to include skaters and newbies. The same can be said of the pilots.
Funny how you expect documentaries to be 100% accuracy considering their intended audience. I saw a documentary on the Forrestal fire and it showed Super Hornets. Never knew we flew those in Vietnam 😏
I was so excited to see this around 2006 at the Udvar-Hazy A&S Museum's iMax (was also my first visit there) and then I noticed all the CGI stuff and obvious "stock" and "scenic" footage. I was a bit disappointed, but, was still pretty compelling, I think. Yes, acting. and before GoPro.
you know what gets me about this documentary...my dad retired out of Nellis and I lived close by for 20 years and for the life of me I never remember the range being that green. ever.
On the PJ mission you and I said "why didn't they just land?" At the same time. I guess on all those air assault missions in Afghanistan we were doing it wrong.
@@CWLemoine not like there was a battle with in the last few years were slow moving blackhawks were shot down in a Low Intensity Threat Environment. Let alone the peer level Integrated Air Defense these big training rotations are supposed to be simulating. But now we are just doing Mystery Science Theater: Mover edition.
The IMAX cameras are too big for the front cockpit. So that's the only way it can be shot. It was awesome when you said you can gun all 4 strike eagles...love it :)
The first time I saw this back several years ago I noticed, almost first thing, that the footage of him flying featured two different models of the F-15, the C model and the Strike Eagle. I guess to the average person they'd never pick up on it but to anyone familiar with military aircraft they'd have noticed it right away. Cool to hear an actual military pilot critique this "documentary"
Nice to see the RF Facility again. There's a ceiling tile with my unit's EX Patch for 2016 there still I hope. I had to paint the GD thing in a Vegas hotel room with no opening windows. LMAO
I supported many of Red Flag exercises - as well as other "colored" Flags during my time stationed at Nellis back in the 80's - as well as supporting the Tactical Fighter Weapons Center. I loved the ramp at Nellis; there always action going on!
I watched this growing up all the time and it made me want to become a fighter pilot for a long time. I’d love to see you get John or Tractor on the channel sometime
I'm not a fighter pilot, but in a dogfight 2v1, while 1 try to get out of the aggressor's 12, the other has to engage the aggressor's 6. You never keep flying in formation side by side.
Was at Red Flag mid 70s ,with 417 sqn CF-104s as ground crew J79 tech. had a blast . Every thing we did was day light, unfortunately we lost one aircraft on a low level sortie.
Man, I remember seeing this when I was like 10 in the IMAX theater at the USAF Museum. Kinda inspired me to be a fighter pilot, but then I did terrible in high school and ended up in the Marine Corps infantry instead lol.
Rah
the beach needs fertilizer also. lol
"Another glorious day in the corps! A day in the Marine Corps is like a day on the farm. Every meal’s a banquet! Every paycheck a fortune! Every formation a parade! I love the corps!"
-Sgt Apone
Thank you for your service…..appreciate your commitment and sacrifice 🇺🇸🤘
Yut yut, kill! Eat those crayons, lick those windows! Semper Feetus!
Narrator: Red Flag is not a competition. There are no winners or losers.
Me: Exactly what a loser would say.
For real
Sucks to suck 😉
Yup
Yeah, all the "pub shots" were done back seat of Eagles because they had no way to do IMAX in a Viper. Also, like 90% of this film was done out of Mountain Home with the 366th Wing, which was then still the Composite Wing and so almost every aircraft in the air-to-air are MO birds, including the KC-135s and the B-1Bs. That's also why the ground is so oddly green. They're in Idaho and Northern Utah, not Southern Nevada. Also, you comment about the CG, but it's really funny because the "mountain flying" was done by a camera ship, a Learjet, and they composited an F-15E into the shot. The funniest part is that "nose gear" shot was the Lear 35 camera ship's, not an F-15's.
Probably had more to do with the fact the film was mainly financially backed by Boeing and swapping the Viper for Eagle was heavily influenced...
@@cup_and_cone it was a practicality and cost issue. Why modify 2 airplanes (and F-16D and an F-15D or E) for a very short number of in-cockpit shots just for the aggressors? Putting an IMAX camera in a cockpit isn't a small thing, so you just do 1 camera bird and do all the shots in it.
To make the point clearer - *nothing was changed as far as airframes*. All of the exterior shots and narrative was that the Aggressors were flying Vipers. The only thing that wasn't "correct" was that the in-cockpit shots for the Aggressor Lead were done in the back seat of the F-15 modified to fly an IMAX camera looking back into the rear cockpit.
366th is an all two-seater wing now....389th Thunderbolts lost the Viper to get the Strike Eagle, 390th Wild Boars 🐗 has the near-useless EA-18 Growler and 391 Bold Tigers still has the Strike Eagle
@@CAPFlyer an* not and
"Usually you send a whole squadron to Red Flag, not just one ass hole." I burst out laughing. No truer words were ever spoken.
When they were making it the folks writing all this probably thought. They've probably seen top gun so they'll this notice it's the other storied program that gets seared into your brain if you read about the Vietnam era to present. And in Top gun they just send one crew soo we'll just send one guy, the people watching will only be able to handle one person anyway, throw the whole group in and then we actually have to do tactics which will just make a lot of them feel stupid and people don't like to feel stupid.. Of course if they're actually stupid they probably don't have to worry about them thinking.
I want to like you comment, but man I just can’t make it 70
@@nike42593 only reply to that is... Nice!
In Russia if you **** up you go down. That’s a code, don’t come back home. (We don’t want to kill you that’s why)
You kinda know yourself
Colonel Stratton the “main character” in the IMAX film was my wing commander at Lakenheath. I remember going up to him and talking to him because I recognized his name on the side of the jet in the film from when I was a kid. Awesome guy. I heard he just retired. He was a captain (0-3) at the time of the making of the film. I got to launch him out even though he didn’t fly much because of his leadership position.
Major Novotny (the Red Flag Boss) eventually came to Lakenheath the 48 FW/CC, then LtC Stratton arrived, overlapping time as the 493FS Grim Reapers commander. Col Novotny became BG Novotny as the 57 WG/CC and retired a few years ago from there.
I thought a Captain was an O-6? 🤔
@@eknight101 For the Navy. The USAF follows the Army with Captain being an O-3. The O-6 for the Air Force is the Colonel.
@@eknight101 That's Navy. In all other services (save coastguard) captain is 0-3)
@@eknight101Navy?
I love how the filmmakers clearly were shown the real Red Flag post mission replay system (think slightly updated Atari 2600) and were like “nope, get me the 3D guy right now and let’s movie this up a bit”.
That's precisely what they did.
The even more insulting part is they made the audience think the AWACS has that picture - freaking hilarious
I remember the Atari 2600!
Great machine.
Untill we got a Commodore 64 a few years later.
I've heard a story that the Royal navy once sent some buccaneers to red flag and they asked for 250ft, ATC told them they are cleared to descend to 250ft, they responded ascending to 250ft.
Gotta be embellished. No way that altitude blocks are that finely controlled.
@@brianwright9514 Oddly enough...it isn't. I've heard that from multiple sources. Buc crews were known to have come back trailing power lines that they hit while...climbing. There was a story that one of them actually hit the desert floor and bounced--that one probably *is* an embellishment, but weirder things have happened. The Buccaneer crews were trained in Europe during the Cold War, when the hard deck was the ground and the only way they were told they would live longer than three seconds was to go in at ten feet AGL. (Given the initially heavy losses RAF Tornados took in Desert Storm, that might not have been the best tactic.)
Incidentally, by that time, the RN had gotten rid of their conventional carriers and gave all their Bucs to the RAF.
@@PolarizedMechs I was at Red Flag #3 in 1976 and the Buc guys were nuts when it came to low level. I thought I was good at LL as I was there in a recce F-4. My limit at the time was 500' later lowered to 100' but like you said the Buc's hard deck was grnd zero. Great time, not as regimented as it is today. We had 10 aircraft in echelon on initial including F-4's, RF-4C's, F-105, F-106...Boss said, "It looked great, don't do it again!"
In the south africa border war there was a similar saying. You first see the dust cloud, then you hear it, then you see it. Something like that
4:19 not only does he have tanks, but somewhere between the mountain shot and Nellis his plane transformed from a Strike Eagle back into a Charlie.
Decepticons confirmed.
John talking to his squadron at home: Hey guys you comin to Red Flag?
Squad: Yea John, you go ahead of us we'll see you there.
John: Cool, see you there.
2 hours later..............
Squad: ......and then he said, see you there lmaoooo..
😂
I was two years out of Pensacola when I saw this in Imax with my ex. When the harriers survived for more than 9 seconds after crossing the line I called bullshit
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Low heat signature and flying 100ft from the deck must have made the Harrier hard to hit, no?
@@craigcarter9513 Lookdown shootdown is a very real thing. Before airspace is permissive harriers, A-10s and helos really have to have a lot of help from fighters and SEAD platforms to operate in enemy airspace. The contingent of harriers seen in that imagery made my asshole pucker because they were coming in way too close to the front line of fighter support. Obviously we aren't seeing the whole picture or battle plan on this one, but it feels like a planned ejection seat test on the eyeball test
"Already rolling when he was cleared for takeoff..." So he's got a promising career at KLM ahead of him.
Oo
Nicely done, Sir!
Amazing reference to Tenerife
Cold as ice. Hahahaha
Guys, it's IMO quite disrespectful to make jokes about an accident where so many lost their lives. I'm all about joking and having fun in comments but this got to much for me.
Be safe and well. Hopefully this shitty times will end soon.
Oooof. A bit harsh since people died.
Colonel John Stratton actually just retired from the Air Force this past fall. So anyone saying there's no way he's a real pilot because he's "overweight", you're wrong.
I heard he is a really good dude too.
They also have not seen many pilots either. They come in all shapes and sizes. I was surprised when I got on the line seeing the variety of pilots. Before that I thought they were all tom cruise.
Just like Jek Porkins in the X-wing.
@@CWLemoine you should try to get him on for an interview!
He's got a Wikipedia page even
Nicely done! I met the main Eagle dude at a Red Flag when he was a squadron commander, good dude 🇺🇸. This one ruins itself in a lot of ways…
" you send an entire squadron to red flag not one asshole" 😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
Loved the commentary. Had me smiling all the way through. I was stationed at Nellis in the early 80's for three and a half years with the 433rd FWS/F-15 FWS. I was an environmental systems tech cross trained into crew chief. Got to see lots of air forces such as the Germans, French, Brits, Italians, Thais and even Singapore. Singapore brought six F-5's and a C-130. Which, at the time, was their entire air force. Saw a bunch of different aircraft as well. In addition to the F-15's, F-16's, F-4's and A-10's and F-5's already there we saw Bucs, Jaguars, Mirages and Tornadoes. The Brits brought two Vulcans right after the Falklands war. Got to fly on an E-3 and observe while they were controlling the air space over the range during a Red Flag. There were F-111's, A-7's and A-37's. The Navy brought some A-4's once. Saw a U2 land. Got to crawl around an SR-71 although we couldn't see the cockpit and saw the last active duty F-86. The F-16XL was also there for testing as well as the PA-48 Enforcer. I'm sure I'm forgetting some as well. Nellis was a happening place with much going on all the time. I could go on for hours. Definitely the best assignment of my Air Force career.
One of the things here is those were Royal Navy Sea Harrier FA2's shown on the ground. Pretty much dedicated fleet defence fighters with AMRAAM or AIM-9's, very limited ground attack capability on their own (though the CGI "AWACS" shots show Harrier II's)
They were retired in 2006, and the Fleet Air Arm transitioned to the RAF's Harrier II's, the GR7's and GR9's which didn't even have a radar, which would be why they started hanging around interdicting at 100ft. When you saw them in 2010, that would have been just months before all the UK Harriers were retired in December that year.
Good thing they’ve got F35Bs now
If you look in the background there's a couple of RAF Harrier IIs kicking around on the flightline too. (Example at 6:21 - tell is the smaller nose (no air defence radar) and retractable rather than fixed refuelling probe)
As soon as they showed the aileron rolls I said "oh another movie the USAF wasn't particularly interested in helping film"
I saw this in the IMAX theater at the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum outside Wash. D.C. shortly after it was released. I found it very entertaining and the parts that "stuck" with me were the ground attack sequences. My God, it was devastating and seemed like there was no chance of survival for anyone or anything on the ground. Death from above - Assured!
My Dad was a Navy pilot and he told me a little about their survival training. Part of it was a five day exercise when the pilots were dropped off in separate locations in the desert somewhere with the typical gear they would have after ejecting. The pilots' goal was to evade capture for as long as possible and to move to some designated "rescue" area. The biggest incentive to evade capture was that it was a five day exercise regardless of how long the evasion was successful. After capture (most of them within a day), the pilots went to a mock POW camp to endure more abuse. He told me he spent a lot of time buried in the sand during the day and only moved at night (before widespread use of thermal imaging). Nobody got much sleep whether they were evading or suffering the sleep deprivation "torture" of the POW camp.
I'm sick at home ....... I'm laughing my ass off, thanks mover for just being mover.
Feel better!
@@CWLemoine thankyou
Narrator:"There are no winners or losers."
Every guy who's ever been to a military training: "Are there though?"
There was one time years ago the spanish air force team sent there got their asses handed to them really bad .. i can confirm they totally felt like losing when coming back.
I was so hoping you'd have a commentary on this, Mover. I knew the acting was cheesy, but the rest of the details deserved an honest scrutiny which only a genuine military fighter jockey could provide. Well done, exceeded expectations.
I was stationed at Nellis when they made this abortion. Needless to say it was quickly forgotten about after it was released.
LMAO When they made this abortion? Tell me you're mx without telling me you're mx.
Lol gotta love autocorrect
That first take off looked to be out of Mountain Home Idaho, same as his tail MO - they just botched the audio
Don't forget the documentary about Doug Masters' heroic flight to rescue his father!
Dammit, Chappy, I'm doing it my way!
*Doug Masters
Oops!
I guess the aggressors forgot to turn on the tape players.
Lol iron eagle lol loved that film when i was a kid 🤣
My memory of watching this film for the first time was quite special because I saw it at the Avalon Airshow in Melbourne Australia in 2007. We were given a brief introduction from special guest of honor Gen Chuck Yeager before the showing of the movie. I'd have preferred listening to him talk more rather than watch the movie.
Valid assessment. Having flown Red Flag in 2000, I remember thinking some of the same things when this movie came out. And even then, I thought the CGI was cheesy!
The opening scene takeoff is Mountain Home AFB.
I love the fact that it’s not even a minute in, and you can already point out several issues with the “documentary.” Also… Yesterday, my son (11) and I saw Lemoore NAS Hornets flying two-ship formations I think you called fingertip. I live near SF, but have a project in Visalia, so we drove past LNAS twice and saw the tight formation flying twice. Gorgeous day. I’ll send pics to the mailbag.
I played a survivor at MCCRES. I was dropped off with a jerry can of water and a radio.
Did they make you parachute out of a helo?
@@CWLemoine Nope just dropped off by one to be found by another from my squadron. After a few hours I was worried I'd have to walk home. It was hot.
Opening unrestricted climb was filmed in Mountain Home AFB, Idaho. In fact quite a few of the airborne scenes were shot within the Mountain Home Range Complex. The F-15´s and F-16´s show MO on the tails. 391FS F-15E, 390FS F-15C and 389FS F-16CM if I remember correctly.
Best movie review ever! Thanks for the intel shout-out... started my days in 96 doing ELINT for the Skunk-Bugs.
@Mover
I feel you are missing a comedic opportunity, Mover.
"Mystery Mover Theater 3000"
Your cadence and humor are similar to the Mystery Science Theater 3000 format. I could see Gonk, you, and some puppets silhouetted, ripping the shit out of movies! Hahahahaha!!!
"Usually you send a whole squadron to Red Flag, not just one asshole."
I haven't watched this TH-cam video yet, but I just wanted to say I remember buying this years ago and was so disappointed. The best thing about the DVD is there is a long montage of great footage (no special effects) of all these different aircraft flying. No dialog just beautiful video footage.
I don't blame any of the service members for this corny film. Thank all of you for your service!
Great commentary Mover; loved it!
Aileron roles are great; they distribute the incoming rounds much better around the airframe.
Those flares are mostly jettisons, not a decoy program, but to be fair for safety reasons our armourers would prefer you came back with empty dispensers.
I used to enjoy looking round the threat systems but I don't remember there being a Nazi 88 in there?
Absolutely loved this video….I assume, as with other flicks, a lot of the footage is filmed the way it is for the viewer to appreciate more excitement in what may be occurring.But I appreciate your incites into what really happens! And your comments were also hilarious….especially from someone who knows what they are talking about! Thank you for a great video and the entertainment as well….you never disappoint 🇺🇸🤘😁
Stratton was supposed to attend my dad's retirement at Maxwell in March 2020. Covid hit and the day before the AF reduced the attendance from 700 to 10 and he got axed so we had family only. Shitty way to see my dad retire after an amazing career flying Vipers. I did meet him briefly at the BBQ though.
There was actually a really good set of videos from years ago that had live fire scenes. As a guy who spent many of my formative years in TACP units, I concentrated on the A-10 parts, but I think the whole thing was actually well done.
It had the radio traffic from the pilots, which is always eye-opening for folks who have never flown large exercises.
I thought I saved the link, but it may not be on TH-cam any more.
I found it: th-cam.com/video/WoDik2hgles/w-d-xo.html
These are by far my favorite type of videos. Some of the best reaction/analysis videos on TH-cam.
A great episode. Roasting a documentary is cool.
By the way, is there a visitor airforce that played "Red Force" or is it always US Agressor Fleet ?
MiG-1 is always professional red air. Sometimes other squadrons will augment the red forces however.
Nellis now has contractor aggressors as well; A-4's etc
@@slappymcgillicuddy7532 yeah that is also a reality now; contractors! So far Aussie F-18 leagacy hornets, Israeli F-16's sold for such companies.
This might be your masterpiece on Mover Ruins Movies. You were destined to do this particular "documentary" review. Bravo sir.
12:14 - "Break left!" Stick goes left.
Aircraft rolls right. Yeah, okay, that tracks.
Code 2 flight controls
You mentioned Harrier at 100 ft; guy I knew while in USAF flew B-52 & like to tell story of when he was at 200 ft at Red Flag, & an RAF Buccaneer flew under them at about 80 ft.
The base he's leaving is Mountain Home in Idaho in the opening scene. There are various versions of the Eagle but it would appear many of the shots are from the backseat of the F15E and from Seymour-Johnson AFB, NC. I flew as a nose gunner from Seymour. I've participated in 8 RedFlags from 1980-1987 in the F4E and the A7D. I flew Air-to-Air, Conventional Air-to-Ground, Close Air Support and even some Wild Weasel work in the hunter-killer mission. I'm with Mover on most of his comments. For me the most bogus issue is the proximity of the jets in the Air to Air video which was done so that you can get the jets in the same frame. In real air to air engagements you'd never be able to see both jets. We never got as close to each other as we see in the movies.
My father designed the original ACMI system for Cubic Corp back in the early 1970's.. Very cool stuff and makes a BIG difference in training pilots.
The initial takeoff scene is Mountain Home AFB in Idaho
Ah... Thank you. Deuce actually said most of it was filmed at Mountain Home (after I had filmed this).
@@CWLemoine I wondered, because I don't remember Nellis having that much green out in the range spaces . . . .
Was part of a few Maple Flags back in the day during my time in Cold Lake AB! Always a great experience! Thx for the post! Cheers!
I remember you once hinting this roast was coming and it did and it did not disappoint. It's really fun, how even in the midst of roasting you share an immense passion for flying which dammit makes me wanna just hop in a cockpit. Thanks Mover, a great way to end 2021
Some of my best memories were at Red Flag. I was an F-16 (A/B, C/D) crew chief out of Hill AFB from 88-91 and as a lover of all things that fly it was always awesome to see pretty much every type from every branch.
Yes ! Thanks for doing this one.. they actually had this playing at the museum of the air force at Wright Patterson
Red Flag was at Nellis AFB, Nevada when I flew for the Air Force in the 1980s. The city skyline in some of the video looks like Las Vegas, which is very close to Nellis AFB. Could the documentary be a mixture of video through the decades?
Mover, I love your channel and content. God Bless America.
It's a composite. Some of the footage was filmed at Nellis, hence Vegas being in the background. A lot of the flying was filmed over the Sayler Creek range in Idaho, which is why the aircraft are all out of Mountain Home.
So I saw this at the United States Air Force Museum in Dayton last year and I thought it was amazing and awesome. It was very inspiring having you have served as an army aviator well an army aviation mechanic would be more like it I worked on helicopter engines but anyways to the point seeing someone that actually knows this information go through it and I checked it I got to tell you this is the funniest movie review I’ve ever seen I am dying over here.
Hey, Mover! I was in 94-98, stationed at Tyndall (one of your favorites bases), and they used to host a little thing called "William Tell", where they had fighter groups from all over the Country and some foreign countries shoot down Firebee drones and towed targets. Do you know if they still do this kind of thing anymore? They even live-streamed it over the local Panama City TV station. BTW, the aircraft back then were F-101's, F-102's and F-106's. THe RO in the Voodoo was called a Scope Wizard.
The last William Tell happened in 2004. They still conduct Combat Archer(WSEP) & Fullscale (QF-16)/subscale (BQM-167) drones ops from Tyndall.
I was at Tyndall 1992-2000, in the 2nd FS. I really had a great time there. Spring break on PC Beach was crazy. Saw many Airmen have to do the walk of shame into the shirt's and commanders office for getting busted on the beach by police raising hell.
Your cynicism and sarcasm give me a warm glow inside 😆
Rob Novotny, the guy who is leading the briefs and apparently, the Air Boss on the AWACS did indeed go on to become a BG about 15 years later. I believe he commands the 57th Wing at Nellis today.
Good comments Mover. The Red Flags I flew in the 80s were like what you described. My first time there in a 111 I ended up with a 111 and an F4 and a 105 on my wing. It was barely VFR at Nellis and I had never flown in there before. I finally saw the airfield at about runway mid point and we all pitched out and landed ok. I did not want to be the guy going straight through initial with 3 guys on my wing.
BTW, the base in the opening scene masquerading as Eglin is Mountain Home AFB in Idaho.
my last Red Flag was in 2001, then shipped to Osan and then out. But from the maintenance side, F16 crew chief. I do remember a lot of formation flights tho, and most missions were at night indeed. Always wanted to hear from the pilot's perspective about this.
This needs more views... you are hilarious and informative.
The “not Eglin” shot was actually filmed at Mountain Home AFB, Idaho (366th FW).
The IMAX movie didn’t cover the tanker crew that was non-A downtown (natural for tankers) who ended up in some roach hotel on E Flamingo Rd that had a murder occur down the hall…
Thanks for picking this apart, Mover...I think I saw that when it first came out and felt then that it was a 'made for TV' flick instead of a true to scale documentary...cool to see the flight footage nonetheless!...Happy New Year!
Ah, man...I thought this was "Red Flag: The Ultimate Game." I was hoping to see Mover's thoughts on the F-4 outside loop scene, and the F-5 diving into the ground trying to follow him. A friend of my dad's, who was a F-4G pilot, was in that movie, and the director told him "You need to act natural! You're a fighter pilot!" So he looked extremely bored.
Oh well...this will still be fun.
Hey Mover… ya know I got to thinking about your description of your mental state … and I’m going to mix this comment with your Single Engine landing.
I have stated several times that I was a USAF Crew Chief…. On EVERY LAUNCH… I felt that way until my jet was wheels up … no matter if I was on it or not.
I was damn good at what I did ( PreFlt eval 100% no defects) from crew chief to recovery team leader in 3 years. I went to recovery because I had to bail out of the CC spot… the anxiety was causing sleep issues. I was fixing jets in my sleep.
The stresses are so intense for both air and ground crew to perform and for us… the boots on the ground, the name on the canopy… WE Silently SCREAM that we never lose a bird.
I hand you the 781’s with my signature and my Chiefs Signature… he is backing me on my word that the jet is GTG.
I want you to know how deeply the crew chief feels about the pilot and the jet. Just like your dogs are to you… that jet/pilot/crew ( I’m a old Tanker guy) is the same to us.
Here’s to a better year in 22’
I wish the civilian a&p’s took their job that seriously. The number of squawks after my last annual was pathetic
The opening scene of the unrestricted climb to FL250 view from the cockpit looking behind is my all time favorite! The view paired with the music gives me chills every time! ❤
I’ve been following your channel for a few years and am not sure how I missed this video. I honestly didn’t believe you could ruin my favorite scene but when you said he’s in the back seat my heart sank 😂 It’s still a phenomenal shot 😎
RE "Parachuting Survivor": I never saw this occur. Of my 3 visits to Red Flag with Air Force Rescue, a "pilot" (quotes included cuz it did not need to be a rated pilot...any warm body would do as a survivor) & SERE instructor were dropped off by HH-60, and a scenario was built based on his or her location. Very "Hollywood" here!
🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
AF Top Gun..NOICE!
For this guy in the Strike Eagle. In the forever immortal words of, Nick "Goose" Bradshaw, "the alternative plaque is down in the ladies room". Ahahaha "I crack myself up" (of course referring to 1st place at Miramar.)
Mover? You don't ruin movies, you make movies better.. thanks
Got the DVD of this, and pissed off my family watching it, think you nailed pretty much all of it. "We own the night," is getting worn out, but calling out the backseat driving got me a lot of grief! Def not Eglin, no Gulf in the background!
Enjoy the "mover ruins" series, lol.
It does seem like this was more of "a movie loosely based off of a Red Flag exercise". Than a real documentary. Can't get any worse than that 80s movie "Red Flag: The Ultimate Game". That movie was just a crime.
That line about bringing the best pilots and maintainers is BS. I've been to three red flags as a maintainer and we take everyone to include skaters and newbies. The same can be said of the pilots.
Wow the tanker isn’t in the weather and shark finning it
Ooohh.. Valid. Definitely a work of fiction here!
TOMCATS! Looking good Lemoine; I wish you a good 2022 with lots of airtime!
The Airbase that is not Egland, was a SAC base you can see the Alert pads during the take off.
Funny how you expect documentaries to be 100% accuracy considering their intended audience. I saw a documentary on the Forrestal fire and it showed Super Hornets. Never knew we flew those in Vietnam 😏
Those crazy British flying at 100ft in their harriers...
Looks up and laughs from a Buccaneer 😂
I was so excited to see this around 2006 at the Udvar-Hazy A&S Museum's iMax (was also my first visit there) and then I noticed all the CGI stuff and obvious "stock" and "scenic" footage. I was a bit disappointed, but, was still pretty compelling, I think. Yes, acting. and before GoPro.
you know what gets me about this documentary...my dad retired out of Nellis and I lived close by for 20 years and for the life of me I never remember the range being that green. ever.
On the PJ mission you and I said "why didn't they just land?" At the same time.
I guess on all those air assault missions in Afghanistan we were doing it wrong.
And then they landed anyway 🤷♂️😂
@@CWLemoine all that wasted gas and loiter time. They could have been doing top cover.
Why be tactical when you can do a 6 ship OGE hover right over the survivor? 😂
@@CWLemoine not like there was a battle with in the last few years were slow moving blackhawks were shot down in a Low Intensity Threat Environment. Let alone the peer level Integrated Air Defense these big training rotations are supposed to be simulating.
But now we are just doing Mystery Science Theater: Mover edition.
I was hoping you were going to do this one
The IMAX cameras are too big for the front cockpit. So that's the only way it can be shot. It was awesome when you said you can gun all 4 strike eagles...love it :)
Probably true for back in 2004. topgun maverick is filmed in Imax.
@@scottkelley1558 yes It is ..and still in the back seat of a super hornet
The first time I saw this back several years ago I noticed, almost first thing, that the footage of him flying featured two different models of the F-15, the C model and the Strike Eagle. I guess to the average person they'd never pick up on it but to anyone familiar with military aircraft they'd have noticed it right away. Cool to hear an actual military pilot critique this "documentary"
Man this was the best entertainment for the year. Thank you Mover, once again ;)
Nice to see the RF Facility again. There's a ceiling tile with my unit's EX Patch for 2016 there still I hope. I had to paint the GD thing in a Vegas hotel room with no opening windows. LMAO
Please do Flight of the Intruder!
I supported many of Red Flag exercises - as well as other "colored" Flags during my time stationed at Nellis back in the 80's - as well as supporting the Tactical Fighter Weapons Center. I loved the ramp at Nellis; there always action going on!
Your sarcasm makes me chuckle every time.
Thank you for making this one!!! I commented on your video of the final countdown with gonky asking if you would do one for red flag! Keep it up!
Even I not being in the military noticed a lot of this as a somewhat knowledgeable person. However, I still love it!
you have no idea how long i have been waiting for you to do this film
My guess is that’s Mountain Home, and considering his F-15E backseat it fits
I enjoyed it… you did a great job hosting 👍 love the commentary
I watched this growing up all the time and it made me want to become a fighter pilot for a long time. I’d love to see you get John or Tractor on the channel sometime
I'm so glad you did this movie! They really liked to pop off flares in this one.
Yes Finally!!! Love your channel, long time fan.
I remember the rescue scene. Saw pictures and videos from the ground done by the 66th RQS bubbas...hokey.
I'm not a fighter pilot, but in a dogfight 2v1, while 1 try to get out of the aggressor's 12, the other has to engage the aggressor's 6. You never keep flying in formation side by side.
Why not? It's actually pretty cool when no one is trying to kill you.
Tractor came and talked to my Airman Leadership School class at Tyndall LOL
Was at Red Flag mid 70s ,with 417 sqn CF-104s as ground crew J79 tech. had a blast . Every thing we did was day light, unfortunately we lost one aircraft on a low level sortie.
I was actually surprised to see the AMMO representation in the Red Flag video and showing some love