Organic pools bubble flow. How a natural pool is pumped with one airstone in 1/2 day..
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 พ.ค. 2016
- David Pagan Butler, inventor of the Organic pools bubble flow circulation system, shows how different diameter pipes work as air-lift pumps.
Free pdf: www.organicpools.co.uk/DIY%20DVD.htm
And have a look at the great variety of DIY Organic pools David has inspired: organicpools
You can buy David's classic DIY film "Make a Natural Swimming Pool":
vimeo.com/ondemand/organicpools
Was not aware the water could be "pumped" above the actual level! Very nice, thanks.
I just built a NSP with two airlifts and they work even better than I expected. Here are the details: 3" dia. pipe, 29" of lift, DIY air injector. There are two of these connected to a single loop of 4" drain pipe, 100ft long, buried under the expanded shale. They are both fed from a single 80 lpm septic air pump (ET-80) using ~71 watts. This is seven times less energy than even a high efficient variable speed pool pump for the same flow. I'm getting 52 GPM (combined) as measured with the bucket test. Thanks for the idea!
Dan Walter what if you shorten the pipes?
That was a very British explanation in a video.. love it
Good filming Mr J Pagan!!! Love both yours and Mr D Pagan's work. 🐠
I love watching these videos. I like to imagine he does nothing all day apart from experimenting with his pond and air pumps. That would be a great life.
What a brilliant visual demonstration!
Great video, thanks for uploading them.
Great job David, I am impressed with your videos and the layout system you have come up with. Very beautiful work.
We are planning a natural pool next year when we are done with our excavating. We are following your lead. Not only are you informative, you are fun to watch. So hello from central Pennsylvania in the US!
Starting excavation this week in southeastern PA! How has it beed over the last 3 yrs? I have been nervous about our climate.
Thank you for taking your time to help us all out. Very well done video it really answered a lot of my questions and doubts.
Very informative, great video. Thanks a lot from Italy. Bye
Love it. Keep the videos coming. Im building one here in florida using what ive learned from your videos. Wish me luck!!
John Dunn good luck! I want to build one of these some day. I live in the south east US as well. I think it could work but probably require a bit more attention and some preventative measures to keep snakes out. Post a video when you make it!
How did the building the pond go? I want to build one here in Florida. Let me know how it all turned out. Thanks
Hello John, how did your build turn out? Any lessons learned?
Very interesting, thank you for sharing this vidéo.
Great educational video, thank you so much for your time and effort.
Can you Maby use solar on your 60 watt compresser. That drives your air system just an idea. Great video’s
Hi David, thanks for the video.. I have a couple of questions. What size pump are you using? As I did the same experiment and it didnt work as well. Also does the depth of the pipe make a difference? Thanks, Amy
just out of curiosity, what air compressor do you use? how big should the compressor be for a 10'×20' pool, 7 feet deep for effective circulation?
Hello, David thank you for the great videos, what is that you are sticking down the black ABS Pipes is that a stick with an airstone attached with an air tube and how big or long is the airstone and is that what helps it start the natural flow of the water? Thank you.
pretty cool. Curious, so what is the requirement or forumla for size of pump or flow for given size of pool?
James May doppelgänger
You place these just outside the regeneration zone or do you bury them in it? It appears as though the airlift is taking in water from buried drain-tile in the regeneration zone and lifting it to the surface... Is that right??
Nice demonstration! What is the capacity of the air compressor?
Have you tried using a venturi valve and water pump? Works wonders
Thanks so much for this!! I was able to lift a continuous flow of water (with your enhanced airlift pump principle) from a depth of about 1.30m to 60cm above the water level. I had to use a 32mm pipe and its pumping 5 liters a minute. QUESTION:) the water is moving between two tanks, a mini swimming tank (about 1000 liters) and a regeneration tank (about 500 liters). I am using an 60 min/L airpump. How much should i let it run and at what frequency to keep it all healthy and minimize pump use?? THANKS:)) (ps the two tanks had to be installed on a diffent level hence the extreme lifting of the water)
How much air are you using through the stone?
Is that just a standard bubbler? How much air pressure are you pushing?
really enjoying your videos. with a natural swimming pond do you have problems with leeches and tape worms?
nice, there is no air chamber below?
Great video and a very clever idea. I would love to do a scaled-down version for an indoor aquarium.
Aquariums have been using this archaic method for decades. That is likely where he got the "clever" idea. ;)
Hey David i really like the idea of the natural pool and would like to build one next year all going well, I am located in Darwin, Australia so i am in a tropical location. I am a builder so the construction of the pool is no problem but i am very interested in learning more about the filtration, water movement and water aeration. I have plenty of raw materials ( Large Rocks ) at my disposal so i would like to incorporate a waterfall and upper filter zone. Any tips.
Construct a toad-proof fence. It only needs to be higher than the toads can jump.
LouiseAustralia 🦘
Does the pipe have to be straight down, or can it go at an angle? Great videos, thanks.
Hi. What kind of air pump are you using? How many liters/minut?
Suciu Valentin I think in another video he had 60 liters a minute pump.
Just out of curiosity this organic pool could you have fish it them?
Hi David, I want to make a streamer into my pool while using this airlift method. I plan to have more terraces where each terrace has a long 2-3m down-pipe, from where the air pushes up the water to the next 20-30 cm higher terrace. So then the water from the higher terrace circulates back as a streamer effect back to the lower terrace. As long as the throughput of the first terrace is slightly bigger than the one of the next higher terraces, then the water circulates over the whole streamer. But for safety, I will add few more small pipes to the highest terrace which will add water from the pool to the highest point.So the question is:
Do you have a good planning guide for airlift planningt? I want to maximize for throughput, while taking water up to 1-1,5 meter with maximum 2-3m downpipes.
My friend, have a look at the work of Glenn Martinez/ Natalie cash of Olomana gardens, he does some great stuff with airlift pumps
Great hint, thank you!
A haphazard demonstration, but I get the idea. Well done David.
whats the ratio of dept to height above waterline ?
Question could this be used to create a waterfall to a pond?
is a saltwater natural pool possible with marine plants and animals? like mangroves and seagrass?
What size air pump are you using for this experiment
Nice little demonstration and experiment.. I wonder what the results would be when you have a tube that starts wide (200 bottom to 100mm in the middle and ends narrow (lets say 40mm)?
I am actually doing this tomorrow, I am connection my venturi in-line to see if it changes anything ;)
@@nolan5320 please tell me your findings
@@avitbt at 1.8.m the 110mm works optimimly, the 50mm starts bubbling and skimning on top outlet. Venturi good for deep water, clean bottom or to circulate water sub surface
@@nolan5320 thanx bud
please post the link you made a video of your setup
would a natural pool pond work in a texas climate
Hi! I have lost track of how many times I've watched your videos. I'm currently in the middle of my swimming pond construction, and I was wondering if I could use this system with the pipe close at the bottom end, and connected in the middle to the drainage pipe that comes out horizontally to the swimming zone from under the gravel in the planting zone. Like your regular bubble system but with the air stone fixed to the cap at the extended bottom end, and the top end with another T pipe above the water level. This way I could probably force the water coming thru the gravel in the regeneration zone circulate much faster without having to make the "upgraded bubble pump system" you showed us in another video. Anyhow, I will give it a shot and let you know about the results in your facebook page. Greetings, David!! all the way down from Chile!!
Tilt thre rig sidways so the bottom of the pipe is only about a foot in to the water youll need less air pressure to get the same flow
I measured your video for filling the 10 liter bucket with your 1,5meter deep air lift pump:
5cm head: 70mm pipe :9sec (2:14-2:23), 40mm pipe:17sec (2:56-3:13), 110mm pipe:18sec (3:54-4:12)
20cm head: 70mm pipe :27sec (4:55-5:22), 40mm pipe: 21sec (5:50-6:11), 110mm pipe: no flow
So the best result (70mm pipe with 5cm head) is around 300 liter/h with say 35W airpump.
I have got 150m3 pool in planing, so with this flowrate I would need ca.20 airlift-pumps of this type (150000/300/24=20,8) and maybe 700W electicity.
What would you recommend to optimise this for such a big swimming pond?
I guess you already finished your pool but 10l in 10 sec are 60l per minute, 3600l an hour. I don´t know if I am missing something. How did you design your system?
@@81kerouac81 You are right. My above calculations were wrong. I recalculated in the mean time, and the plan has changed to 3 enhanced airlift pumps, and 2 sediment rising air lift pump, and 2 surface circulating bubble pump. There will be a streamer too.
Do you have to run the filter constantly?
Yes. water has to be flowing all the time, so there is oxigenated water continuously runing to the filter. Whatever your filter is. If it is barrel full of foam or as in this case gravel around swimming area. It is crucial, because beneficial bacteria which live in filter needs oxigen. If there is no water flowing throug, they use all oxygen close enoug and then just die. So no filtration anymore. It usually takes up to 3 weeks to fully re-ocuppy the filter with bacteria, so you really do not want to loose them.
What do you use as the source of air?
He uses 60L/min air pump
What fills the pond ,Potable water? Earthships recycle after rain water collection so I’m wondering if a community might send some of their effluent to such a pond as a community water feature? Ever try that?
Sewage pond. Probably better off as a name for a heavy metal band.
What happened to the red bucket? Cliffhanger.
yup yup ! I said yup yup ! Word to your mother !
David. Could an air bubble pump provide sufficient water flow to drive a RAM pump, which would then raise a smaller volume of water to a much higher elevation? If so, then the water could potentially be run through a suitably designed solar-driven pond heater. Here is an excellent video showing a RAM pump operated simply from an elevated bucket th-cam.com/video/A9W0zx2D7aU/w-d-xo.html. There are lots more TH-cam videos showing RAM pumps running from the power provided by small flowing streams. Also, here is a video of what could be a potentially suitable solar pool/pond heater th-cam.com/video/AcSO5uaQxeE/w-d-xo.html.
Now that we know how the pumps work, it would also by good to know what they are actually good for. Why would you run the pool water through the plastic pipes? I mean this is supposed to be a DIY system but some of these videos just don't make much sense. I wish there was a real, comprehensible explanation.
Are you still confused?
@@francus7227 No-one has replied to my question. Mr. Pagan obviously doesn't care.
@@branislavboba1699
Oh-key-doe-key.....
First ..... David seems like a nice guy. But he's also a businessman. Most TH-cam guys make money from likes and subs. David never asks for either. He just wants to sell his videos and share ideas. So I think.... He doesn't tent to the comments as closely as most but he has kindly answered me in the past.
Here my best explanation and I hope it helps.
He runs black flexible pipes in circles lying on the ground floor around the swim zone. This is under the rocks and plants. These pipes have hundreds of small holes perforated to allow water to flow.. These circles are about 2-3 meters diameter and connect at a point with a 1 meter vertical pipe. Then those flexible pipes lying are covered with 2-3 cm rocks. Then those rocks are covered with a layer of fabric. Then a mixture of sand and 1cm rocks are put on top of the fabric to make a 2nd layer. Depending on the size of the pond..... With his 4 meter X 8 meter swim size has 6 of these circular systems. Then he runs a clear fish tank hose with and air stone on the end of that hose. He drops one into the bottom of each vertical pipe that has a 60 watt air pump. Dave says 60 watts is strong enough to push air down to a depth of 1 meter for all six pipes. The purpose of the air stone???... It makes a 1000x more bubbles than if it was just an open ended hose. Those bubbles float up. As they do.... they pull water vertically with them. That vertical rising water is replaced by the water that is coming from the circular flexible tubes that have hundreds of holes in them. That water is the water under all the rocks. As that water goes into the black flexible pipes. ... it pulls surface water down through the sand/rocks and then through the bigger rocks to complete a slow downward flow of water through the rock and finally UP and out of each pipe. That pulling of water through the rocks acts as a rock filter. David also says.... good bacteria and microorganisms will naturally grow on the rocks and eat bad bacteria.
Your two enemies in a pool are bad bacteria (make you sick) and algae (makes the water cloudy and its string-ie like Angel hair)....
To fight algae.... keep the nutrients in the water so low that algae cannot live. To do this... Keep lots of plants that can live with minimal nutrients and lots of light.
No fish because fish poop. Poop is nutrients and algae food. So is bird poop. So is people PEE.
Keep the nutrients low ! ! ! The water circulation downward vertically though the rock and you pond will also keep it mosquitoe free because mosquitoes like still water... . All of this will keep the water clear as London Gin and clean and a fresh spring.
Lastly....
Plenty of people are using natural ponds. But many are using a water pump (like a traditional pool pump) and a separate filter.....Which works TOO. But, those pumps EAT electricity...
Like..... instead 5 bucks a month. It's a hundred.
Pushing air is cheaper that pushing water.
In this clip he show that just one system can circulate his whole pond twice a day. 6 of them means.... all water goes by the plants and through the rock filter 12 times a day. That's a lot of filtration for 5 bucks a month and MORE than enough to do the job.
There's some evidence that you really don't even need the filter part if you have enough plants.
I'm in Thailand. I can fill my (in the near future) pond with so many floating plants that will NEVER die because it's ALWAYS summer. I am gonna put the filtration system in. But, I do have small plastic ponds with so many plants... the water is never cloudy and zero algae......even though they have minnows. The minnows eat the mosquitoes eggs before they can hatch. If you're north of latitude 25°..... tropical plants will die in the winter. But Davis said these ponds work in Canada. It freezes..... No big deal. In the spring, it starts working again.
If you're serious. ....watch 20 of David's clips. It will come together.
Good luck.
@@francus7227 Thanks for the answer! However - everything you have written I had already known. And there's more. I have actually read his whole PDF book that his sells but the fact remains it is very confused. As much as Mr. Pagan himself. He's also showed me his other face (the one obviously have not seen) and I can tell you it's pretty ugly.
@@branislavboba1699
Your welcome. As I was writing it.... I was thinking in a slightly condescending way (sorry), "You could just watch the videos. That's how I learned it"..... Turns out, you already did what I did and MORE because I didn't buy the clip or pdf. But I have read some reviews about the clip that "explains everything" and some of the reviews are very in line with your report.
I plan to build this Jan because that's the "dry season" and will be good for building. Right now??? This rice village is SWAMPED. I think I have enough of "the jist" to get the job. The good thing? I have an endless supply of READY and CHEAP labor. Bad thing??? Finding a good liner 10 meters X 15 meters (preferably RPE) might prove to be the biggest challenge. And the ultimate fall back???? If I fail, 30 minutes and a tractor can push everything into the hole and bury the whole idea and go back to growing vegetables on it....
Good luck.
Has anyone seen the comedian Carrot Top lately??? ...... A traditional bottom aerator will move much more water for the same nickle. Better designers use them.
I thought this video was of an elephant drinking out of a puddle lol
What about air volume and bubble dispersion? Too many variables...
wouldn't a pond pump be more efficient at moving water
Andrew Olgado airlift pump can not get clogged.
Yes and if you put your pump in a 55 gal barrel or something like that it will not get clogged .and set it up on solar