Ex-Post Office company secretary questioned over Horizon scandal
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ก.ย. 2024
- For years, she's remained silent over what she knew about the wrongful prosecution of subpostmasters.
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But tomorrow, the former head of the Post Office, Paula Vennells, will break that silence when she appears at the Horizon IT inquiry.
Today, it was the turn of the company secretary, Alwen Lyons, who was at every board meeting - and party to many secrets after 34 years in an organisation that caused untold suffering for hundreds of subpostmasters.
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The disgusting thing is that nothing will happen , they are not sorry for what they did , only that they have been caught doing it
If the yesterday's Blood Scandal report was able to damningly accuse so many of covering up the truth, and the government being forced to 'capitulate', then we fully expect the truth to be uncovered in this PO enquiry.
no she isnt sorry at all
Well officialdom won't do anything...
I also feel like this will be the outcome. These upper class rats will work their way out of it like they have always done.
I'm sure a lot of them still think privately that the postmasters DID steal the money.
posh and rich people don't go to prison even when they're obviously guilty. Prison is primarily reserved for poor people who cant afford good lawyers.
Agree 100%
Their Punishment is sitting in front of an inquiry shown on TV ‘ and maybe questioned outside court by some reporters’ but then it’s off to their Country piles to hide from justice.
British justice/ joke. 😂
Yep. ‘A bit of a grilling’ at this inquiry is about all the accountability they’ll face, ever.
Agree 💯.. and a lot of them poor people are innocent people..
Spot on! The CEO received (stole) a 3 million pound bonus.
Lots of rich and posh people in prison, plus a lot of the Post Office staff who were 'behind' the fraud were not rich or posh. Follow the inquiry!!
Prison for the criminal directors and managers!
Unlikely. They are too close to the civil service.
@@vrindersinghrandhawa6343 agreed. The Post Office is full of useful idiots, that have spent their entire life, being promoted up through the organisation. Not because they are any good, but because they toe line.
@@StuartJ Somebody needs to go down, whether its the right people is to be seen but someone is going down for this.
@@PCDelorian if they go for corporate manslaughter, then maybe those at the top might go to jail. Otherwise they will try and make Gareth Jenkins be the fall guy, and maybe one or two others.
The post office knew there was a problem but framed them ........thats the real crime.
And effectively robbed them and their families of everything they had in the process. Yet more amnesia when Venals has to appear tomorrow,I expect.
She should have all her bonuses confiscated under proceeds of crime and locked up
and puala vennals swinson is just as giulty .
Every one of these Post Office people MUST GO TO PRISON!
They won't. They are too close to the civil service.
None of them will go to prison, they will all just deny everything at trial and they will get away with it.
Calm down ffs
@@danielchadwick-hh3cn I think there will be jail sentences but sadly not this woman. She should be forced to give back her OBE and pay pay pack her pension tho
@@TimComley they literally killed people mate its okay to not be calm about this lol.
These people did nothing wrong got jailed now the people involved in this scandal have done wrong so why not them ?????
Ah, but you see, these are TOP PEOPLE who MATTER - like Lord Lucan, who you may remember....... jail is only for innocent plebs like us, who unfortunately worked for the governmen........
And im sure they got jailed very quickly in comparison as well.
have you seen the courts person with thew most money wins .
What I want to know why did these crooks send innocent people to prison.
Because they were onto a good thing. Fat salaries, and bonuses. Once they realised the gravity of the situation, they went into cover-up mode, which snowballed out of control.
I think they really hate ordinary people? Like they saw themselves as better than everyone else? It's still strange tho even allowing for that tbh
££££££££££
I believe that initially they actually thought that all these “working class” people did steal money. However, it soon became apparent within the Post Office Management that it was NOT just one person it was in the hundreds and they covered their butts by telling these individuals that it’s not happened to them nobody else complained about Horizon - An out and out LIE. The Post Office Management went out of their way to get convictions and to hide what they actually knew for years. Anybody in PO Management needs to spend significant amount of time in Jail for this terrible crime where innocent people had their entire life and reputation destroyed, some committing suicide, lost their houses and livelihood. which occurred over decades and is still unresolved. Good people and Good Management don’t spend time covering their butts. They own up to their mistakes as soon as they become aware. They don’t spend years and years trying to prove that they are right and the Sub Post Masters are thief’s!
people commenting here didnt do their homework.
#1.
at that time it wad believed by the court systems, that the computer system cannot be wrong.
If it shows that money are missinb, then it must be the postmasters.
#2.
Fujitsu were also saying, it is impossible to remotely add data to the system.
#3.
Bosses of the Post Office were always suspicious of Postmasters.
THEY DID NOT TRUST THEM.
YET THEY DID CHOOSE THEM!!!
Also they had racist believe that because they were Indians, they were more likely to steal.
And when the computer system show money missing, it was clear cut case!!!!
#4.
Post Office had unlimited budget for private prosecution thanks to the Governemnt NOT asking questions, why suddenly you need so much money to prosecute people,
...the same people YOU IDIOTS CHOOSE AND DID BACKGROUND CHECK ON THEM.
#5.
Postmasters were in position of trust.
And the Post Office was NATIONAL TREASURE, beloved company.
That is why the prison sentence for theft.
I still can't get over how somone like paula vennels gets to such a high position?
It certainly wasn't through looks
😂😂😂
@@canalboatingI’d suggest it was, but not her physical looks…
…her ilk all look the same, to me, just as anyone with ‘good’ looks fills her ilk with revulsion.
Funny thing about predators, is that they evolve to identify their prey, and this lot are a pack of hunter-gatherers…
…e pluribus unum
Additionally, not one of those ‘players’ cross-examined have a conscience, but some are easier to rattle than others; and behind closed doors or not, whether they even respect each other or not, they are a natural team.
No manual, just a natural ability to identify what the pack desires and to individually play their ‘gatekeeping’ position of power - at whatever level - in satisfying those specific desires.
Gatekeeping positions that are awarded because their ability to act in favour of the pack’s interest, has been recognised.
Generally, it’s about gathering resources at the expense of those they hunt - sub-postmasters, taxpayers, decent human beings who have the power to improve The World, as well as actual criminals to help maintain the deception: but not all criminal enterprises - that’s why The World is the way it is…
…evil knows evil, and everyone is expendable towards evil achieving what ‘it’ desires.
That’s why Beauty is in the eye of The Beast: can’t destroy what can’t be seen.
That’s also why you see some of them infiltrate & occupy seemingly good looking positions: camouflage.
This ‘perversity’ amuses them.
They have the will to endanger others (even when their employment is contingent on public ‘Health & Safety’), but at the same time they’ll protect themselves & each other to extremes: with little or no hesitation.
They’re rarely if ever held accountable for this perversity.
One only has to look at Loughinisland to understand this, and more.
Nothing has changed, The World is still being run by ‘ugly’ people who won’t stop until it’s all attractive to them.
When you have no moral compass, you can lie, cheat your way to the top. I bet she thought she got out in time to avoid prosecution. I can’t wait to see her squirm tomorrow.
It’s an elite club. One recommends the other. Friends in high places. You can see this happening over and over when the inquiry explores their backgrounds and career relationships.
Very, very poor effort from this witness. To say she didn’t know about prosecutions is ridiculous. Broke the world record for saying “ So “.
Her and that witch angela (a misnomer if there ever was one). The ‘so’ amnesiacs.
So…..you always know know you are about to hear less that the actuality
Decent, lawful people deserve proper restitution-with interest over time. In the US the damages for each case would be in the tens of millions.
I want vennels in jail.
Proper prison as well like all the victims had to go to. Not some suite away from all the other inmates... Holloway, Parkhurst, and her in the mix of it all.
Complicit with Governments
@markrichards636 No doubt she'll be in the house of Lords, she's facing a major public scandal... that's the next step isn't it?
The Post Office investigators need to be arrested as they have clearly Perverted The Course Of Justice and failed to disclose legal material to the Defence that would have assisted the clients they were defending.
Well done to that reporter. Make that woman feel totally ashamed. Thank you, Channel 4 for this coverage!
They (PO) thought they could get away with ruining people’s lives. Justice must be done.
tory backed criminal actions for proffit again.
Good on that reporter for pressing for answers, should she give her OBE back...YES.....should she go to jail.....YES.
I liked the way the umbrella was close-hauled down like a hatch and then how the reporter was repeatedly lifting up the hatch to ask questions.
I liked the way the umbrella was closed down like a hatch and then how the reporter was repeatedly lifting up the hatch to ask questions.
She was happy to sit back and watch innocent people go to jail - now it is her turn behind bars. Her reputation (if she ever had one) is dashed to the ground and she will go to her grave knowing she was part of the worst crime in British history.
The whole board need to go to prison, if anyone else çaused this much suffering and lied, causing such a massive fraud, they would be in prison. Why are they still walking free? I'm disgusted by our government, who have always known but chose to do nothing.
I think so, too. Not enough focus on the board - it wouldn't be because of all their political connections?
Jail sentence
Death sentence!
I do commend channel four for keeping on producing pieces on this - and this particular journalist who clearly, rightly feels angry like everyone else. They have broken new aspects of the story during the enquiry rather than just being lazy and reporting the enquiry albeit this piece doesn’t bring anything new to the table, other than give everyone the heads up to pay attention re vennels testimony tomorrow. Well done channel 4.
None of this would have come to light without the persistence of Private Eye.
Thank you channel 4 for your continuing coverage of this terrible scandal 👍
Oh please go away.
@@coppershark1973 isn't pretending nothing is happening and shutting people down part of the problem. 🙄🙄......
@@tazzie2shoosyeah but a certain demographic tend to vote for the party he also likes so we must let them do whatever they want... 😉
channel 4 are crooks too.
Where is the ex top lawyer, hiding overseas, drag her back, use the diplomatic tools in the box, the public is proper mad.
Sir wyn will advise on why she isnt attending the inquiry today friday 24th May 2024 i believe, itll be interesting to find out. Part of me is beginning to wonder has she been bribed......she would be a key witness in all of this but amazingly is THE one witness not attending not even remotely!
Malignant managerialism is everywhere.
Our system rewards it. The turds float right to the top.
Oh, well put. I'm stealing that.
If people spent less time presenting results to senior management in increasingly elaborate PowerPoint presentations, and more time actually doing what they should be doing, then we would all be better off. And of course, when times get tough, the consultants come in and they aren't going to bite the hand that feeds are they, so the workers are the first to get the chop. Christ on a bike, it's farcked out there.
Paula will be suffering amnesia just like the rest 🤔
Listened to quite a bit of this, collective amnesia seems to be rife among them.
@@monteceitomoocher She will have a serious case of CRAFT disease. Can't remember a f**king thing!
Same as Johnson when he couldn’t recall any parties. They are all briefed to deny knowledge of anything.
Collective, and selective amnesia, seems to be prevalent in the top people within Fujitsu and the PO
And so it was - she did - the next day and the day after.
All the directors and lawyers involved all have to be sent to prison for greater than the minimum sentence that was given to all the innnocent PO staff.
But the postmasters were wrongly accused so the sentences should be longer by far than the longest sentence received by any podtmaster.
Her life was ruined at 19. How much compensation should she receive? £10m
That was the first figure I thought of. Only millions of pounds would be adequate compensation to make up for the bankruptcy, lost jobs, lost career opportunities due to having a criminal record, trauma, mental and emotional damage. And some prison sentences for those responsible.
@@LoupedelouNo matter how much money they receive it will never compensate the damage it has done to their lives and they need the cash now to replace their savings which they should be using to enjoy themselves. They lost livelihood houses and some a large number of family and friends so those GUILTY should NOT have any freedom or comfortable life whatsoever
No !!! They need that money for PO bonuses ..
@@DotBell-m6t that's how compensation is calculated though
"I don't recall" The epitaph for the post office senior management
Haha spot on
4:32 Well done on pushing those 2 pricks out the way to question her. You're right, you are doing your job, and doing it well 👏
Who are they?
Ditto 👍
Probably the only time in her life the cow hasn't got her own way!
Big man reporter, bullying people in the street
@@Ground53 asking an evil being questions and holding ‘it’ & its ilk to account, is not bullying; and to suggest it is bullying, is nothing short of perverse & evil in itself.
On my computer screen next to this video is an advert for a Post Office credit card. I don't think I will apply.
Sign up. And when you've paid the first month off it will show successful. Then you're start getting messages from the post office that it needs to be paid. When you say you have and show proof, they'll claim its not what they see their end and that you're the only one with the issue.
A joke but they've even been doing it recently with their stupid barcoded stamps. Charging people extra for "using fake stamps" then finding their scanning system is inaccurate so they've had to suspend the program. How many of those people charged have been paid back.
report it for false advertising .youtube been backing the wrong side all the way and it seem they did this for advert payments .they been blocking comments warning people for our actions .trying to scare people into silence all for a little bit of cash and now we have the proof why and motive never forget what youtube puts 1 st .
Deserved to go to prison for perjury.
Vennells must go to prison for this
Whats more disgusting is this was known years ago and nothing was done about it until they made a tv series about it.
Well done finally someone asked the question everyone wants to ask. Are they ready for prison.
God bless this poor lady. She deserves at least a million in compensation and Vennells should be sentenced to the worse jail punishment available.
For the post office management the timing could not be worse, the public are sick to death of sloppy/greedy/lying politicians & executives!
-SNP malfeasance
-Water companies polluting rivers and seas
-Batley teacher still in hiding no support from head teacher, police or union
-Cannot protect our borders
-Woke BBC
List goes on and on
Proper journalism👏👏👏
Perhaps we should include the judges in these investigations.
If the postmasters stole 10’s of thousands of pounds, where were the flash cars, the expensive holidays, the bloated bank accounts?
Why didn’t anyone ask where the money went?
If judges are complicit then that must of come from the top of Westminster, to preserve the brand that was ear marked for privatisation. So it’s share price would remain high.
Horizon program in use 1999
Post master convictions 1999-2015
Postal services act 2011
Royal Mail group split in 2012
Royal Mail privatised 2013-2015
Vincent Cable knighted 2015
Alwen Lyon’s OBE 2018
Vennels CBE 2019
I think you are onto something there. The Tory M.O at work again.....
i agree by the 900 persn going to courts this year after itv shows they was happy to carry on as normal in the courts .they was even chassing innacent people for compo the po was chassing up on threatoning more jail time if they did not pay what the never owed in the 1 st place .how could the judges not realise or did they just not care a normal day at court .po even claimed tax back on compo they claimed knowing it should never been demanded in the 1 st place .they was still taking people to court this year .bissiness as usual for the courts .
Nothing is being learnt from inquiry if no one is actually accountable and going to jail. Laughable and an insult. Years of inquiries but ended up just another paper published
What a horrible, conniving and dishonest person. No prison sentence is sufficient to pay for her lack of morals or ethics and vindictiveness toward honest and hard working people.
What I do not understand is how is it possible that the management of the post office could believe that so many post office branches were stealing money. Sure, I can understand a small number, one percent of them, if that, but surely alarm bells should have gone off when so many were being found. Are we still thinking that a machine, a computer, is infalable - or was the drive for profit so high that everything else is eclipsed by that need?
"I hadn't seen any evidence up till this point." That's what happens when you close your eyes to the evidence before you, and you don't ask for additional evidence to look at.
they did every thing to make sure truth was never heard but did not see any thing to give them that reason. makes perfect sence to a tory .
As well as the P.O. I hope the judge has apologised to this lady.
Those judges read out despicable things when sentencing these people, they also played their part, but that will be swiftly swept under the carpet, there is no regulator for the judiciary.
Apologies are no longer enough. Prison is the poison
@@barbs574 i like to see a judge go jail about time they was made to do a propper job with questions asked .even bringing up the subject in a court is siucide .thats not fair is it.
Would love to hear a psychologist 's views on body language and avoidance/denial going on in these people's heads.
I have asked 'the behaviour panel', hoping they do it.
They need to be attached to a lie detector
@@barbs574 it would brake the machine and the pen would run out of ink.
Apologies at this late stage are an insult and may lead people to believe that an apology now is merely spurious. What is even more vexing is that this is still dragging on. It's a further slap in the face for those wrongly accused and who had to suffer the indignities of job loss, bankruptcy, public ridicule, jail time and even loss of life. Shame on all of those who acted so horribly in this scandal.
Amazing that all the directors and lawyers involved all suffer from selective amnesia only when evidence is found against them. They are either lying or its not an act.
Legally briefed........
must be havana syndrome
Honourable people took their lives over Vennells, if she had and remorse left inside of her she would follow suit!
"Excuse me, excuse me". What are you excusing? Unbelievable. Disgusting. No conscience to these evil people and their enablers.
So sorry for the terrible pain this has caused. The Post Office has done a massive coverup with corruption, greed and dishonesty
This poor woman was young, ill represented and very inexperienced. She's been through a terrible ordeal. I hope after all this she can rebuild her life and prosper. The post office management could do with a dose of their own medicine.
We know why. Greed. Pure and simple GREED. Sociopaths fleecing as much as they can milk with no regard for the people wrongly charged.
These people should be in jail!
They ALL knew something at one point. They ALL had an opportunity to do the right thing, the just thing, but they ALL decided to ignore and cover it up.
Salaries must be clawed back.
Horrendous what happened to these innocent people. Will those responsible be held to account?
This woman should be receiving millions of pounds in compensation. It should be millions of pounds after any costs or anything of that nature.
those judges and prosecutors who acted on "evidence" provided by a criminal organization without further scrutiny, should also face consequences.
Don't be stupid.. the judge had no idea what these criminals were doing.. he or she works with what evidence is put before them
The the Executive team and Board in prison. They can share cells with the politicians responsible also.
19. She was still a kid. Scarred for life. No amount of money will heal those wounds.
Aren't they evil. Prison terms for them all please.
The truth here is the whole management team should be in jail, all complacent and no one spoke out when they could of.
A joint enterprise of criminals...
Send them down!
The combined total number of years that every postmaster was sentenced to, should be evenly divided against the Executive committee members and they should serve that time.
There seems to be an outbreak of collective amnesia amongst these people.
The Post Office execs perverted the course of justice at the very least and committed perjury. They need to go to jail.
Using comic sans - straight to jail!
I noticed that. Isn't that a Primary school font lol
It is!
It suggests getting your message over in a fun and light-hearted way 😂😂😂
I don’t say this often - Hero journalist 👏👏👏
These royal medals are a disgrace and should be scrapped
Great work and fantastic reporting
Another one with a bad memory, liars the lot of them.
'I don't recall' I wonder how many times we are going to hear that?
Fauci when questioned in the USA congress over the covid cover up .. said “ I don’t recall “ 72 times ! How’s that for a record .. Seems to be their playbook !
It's devastating that lady had to go to prison at 19, being falsely accused. I thinks she is showing remarkable strength by what she said, she's an inspiration to all people who have been unjustly wronged.
Awesome reporter! Well done and keep up your good work. The cat has got these bullies and liars tongues. Cowards now hiding behind umbrellas when it’s not raining and face disguises.
Never trust business management graduate degrees.
The establishment don't jail themselves - they never have done.
All these bosses should be in crown court and sent to prison for a long time
Post Office gangsters will string this out just like the Grenfell Tower gangsters have done.
Exactly
so , so , so , so , so , so, i do not recall , i do not remember , so so so so so , so ..... i can not remember .... she should be striped of her OBE not give it back ...... she is a coward .......
Send them down, take their money off them
No one at the post office at this time should have any honour - the OBE should be returned
This is a serious mess
The government call a general election, and takes Vennells off the news. What does the government want to cover up???
Exactly this.
Them folks who caused this terrible behaviour of putting a 19yr old in prison need sending down for law. Everyone involved Government down to the rats should be brought out of hiding. One disgraceful story after another. Can't believe folks or devils would act like this. This is the 20th Century not the 15th. Unbelievably disgraceful
Every single one of those dreadful senior executives - if found guilty - should give back every single penny of their bonuses. That would do for a start.
He shouldn't have lifted up her umbrella. That's too aggressive.
My love to you and everyone else who has had to deal with all the lies. The establishment will never allow you to get to the truth. What a sad world we live in but we must keep going just to fight the injustice.
Can see evidence in jail
Prison!!!
Laws in the UK need to be brought in to protect the public against these criminals and fraudsters acting in the UK corporate world! Accountability laws are what is needed to make the wrongdoers do the right thing in the future! Seize the passports & assets of all post office employees to prevent them from fleeing the country as some have already jumped the uk to France !
I hope they ask Vennells if she is prepared for prison!!
Everyone of the corrupt post office bosses and civil servants should be looking at 10 years prison each
Everyone who has falsely been accused by the Post Office should know that those in charge of accusing the many innocent did so and with intent , and were using a known defective product.
It’s soo apparent the powers knew of the horizon blip yet continued to persecute the employees .what is going to happen to them surely the must get prison sentences . They’ve knowingly wrecked lives .
It's not cross-examination, it's an enquiry. Only one side questioning.
That reporter following her 🤣🤣 legend
I hope justice prevails.... finally
Prison time looms!
Sooo Sorry to this Lady. God Bless her! 😢🎉
I've just finished listening to Alice Perkins. At first I thought just another disingenuous, faux apologetic, arrogant and dismissive lying old bat, chucking others under the bus with every reply! Now I think I can sum her up in one word. Insidious! See, the memory is a peculiar human trait. It can recall details from incidents that happened many decades ago, whilst not being able to recall details from last week. But one thing the memory cannot forget, and that is the Truth. It's always with us whether we want it to be or not, and we will ALL have to face the Truth in time. And that's the Truth! Many Blessings and Justice to all those wronged by the evil acts of others! 🙏⚖️🙏
We need justice now
She sought to thrust herself into a position of importance and ended up putting herself into a situation where she could go to jail.
Send her
Throw the key away.
Every one of the people who contributed to this conspiracy should be prosecuted and jailed. The Board should be under scrutiny for the pressures they themselves exerted
Compensation of "ONE MILLION DOLLARS" per post pffice victims needs to be made ..all 900 and not with tax payers money ..