Faith Alone Debate: Sam Shamoun vs Pastor J.D. Martin
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2024
- Sam is Assyrian Church of the East. J.D. Martin is Protestant
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#ExploringTheology #Theology #Christianity
I got baptised as an adult and I experienced being baptised in the HOLY SPIRIT AS AN ADULT. Super natural experience I would never will forget.
Same with me. I never was taught about being born again and that you can know if you are saved growing up in the Catholic church. I had to find this out outside the church, because they don't teach it and if they don't teach it nor ever read those passages you will never know about it, unless you seek it on your own. When I did ask the church fathers and others, they did not have an answer to my question, if you can know if you are saved. Imagine having the scriptures at your fingertips and keeping that important bit of information a secret, which is a salvation issue.
@@Our_Daily_Bread_With_JB Dear sir, this is the error with modern day Protestantism/Pentecostalism/Charimatism Christian family fellowshipism...There is only ONE Lord (Jesus), One Faith (of Jesus) and ONE BAPTISM (INTO JESUS THE MESSIAH) - Ephesians 4: 5; read also 1 Corinthians 12: 12 - 13 (not neglecting Jesus's Baptism by FULL IMMERSION IN WATER and RECEIVING the Holy Spirit the same time/day and with SONSHIP confirmed by the Father on the same day...no delay! Anything other than that is not part of the Gospel of Jesus (YASHUAH) the Messiah but a pseudo Gospel of man...)🛐🕎📜📖🐑✅️
@@luvpamelanewton I know I will never forget the encounter u had with Him my LORD.
Bullshit.
@@luvpamelanewton John 3:10-12 (JESUS Knows). They May be a Religious Person, They can only teach what they know, and If they don’t The Truth they can’t teach it.
Sam:
according to the scripture, according to the church fathers, according to the saints.
Pastor Martin:
I think
I don’t think
I know. So frustrating! And this pastor couldn't even hear the point being made and revert to that point.
I don’t think he even hears himself speak and understands what his saying
Could this be why the Christian faith is so divided.
He doesn't hear himself and is deceived. So close, yet so far away. Pray that Christ opens his heart to the gospel.
This is a silly point about semantics. Obviously his theology isn’t coming from his imagination. Hes attempting to explain his understanding of scripture.
This statement by Pastor J.D. Martin sums it up: If they (church fathers) agree with me, I am happy. If they don’t agree with me, I’m not happy.” He is the only true source of truth & faith. That’s prideful & dangerous, but I’m afraid he is not alone among the thousands of Protestant pastors. This is the problem of the lack of not having a unified consensus or the magisterium comprised of over 6,000 unified bishops & cardinals vs millions of pastors reading the scriptures based on their own interpretation.
Well said!
@@Godconquersall143 Relying on Many to Support Your beliefs, Is Not necessarily safe. Knowing what JESUS said, and Lead by The HOLY SPIRIT To JESUS Is Safe. We stand Before GOD Individually, To except GOD’s Free Gift, As said by JESUS in JOHN 3:16. Matthew 7:13-14
Pray that he overcomes this.he is fighting.let him get it. And he will.he is softening lol. I pray.😊
This is why the Roman church teaches another gospel than what Paul and Jesus taught. If you feel you earn your way to heaven, you will all fail.
Its the second time I watched this discussion, JD is implying and presuming meanings of words. He forgets the context. Good work by Sam to be chastening him for benifit. Good conversation though it was fruitful.
Amen. You did Soo well here. His definition of Faith....saying it means faithfulness. Even the Google definition is more correct. "That Faith is absolute Trust and confidence in God." Then he says Belief means to abide in His word. It's good that you said "No No, that's not my belief." I loved the part where you said "Even you can't believe that." You have patience that's unreal. It's Soo good to see The fruits of the Spirit in you. You were spot on here....and very polite while he was condescending. God Bless you and your journey is going to be something amazing to see. God is clearly with you ...📜 Reading and studying Titus what it says in Chapter 1:6-9 we see Soo many men "unqualified" and still yet out there. It's very discouraging to see men who are discouraging The Church with gossiping, slandering and using filthy words and ungodly behavior. Soo to see your behavior was extremely encouraging. ✝️💕
THE TRUE GOSPEL DELIVERS FROM BONDAGE , AND THE SECOND DEATH.
11And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life.
13I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life. 14This is the confidence we have in approaching God:
New International Version
Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”
King James Bible
Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
King James Bible
Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
King James Bible
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our. (SINS ) according to the scriptures;
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
King James Bible
And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
New King James Version
Remember that Jesus Christ, of the seed of David, was raised from the dead according to my gospel,
New King James Version
and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised;
King James Bible
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
King James Bible
Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.
New International Version 1 Peter 2:7
Now to you who believe, this stone is PRECIOUS. But to those who do not believe, “The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,”
King James Bible
Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
New International Version
So then, brothers and sisters, stand firm and hold fast to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by ( LETTER.)
JESUS IS LORD= GOD.
GOD IS TRIUNE.
THE FATHER IS GOD.
THE SON IS GOD.
THE HOLYSPIRIT IS GOD.
NOT THREE GODS,
But the one true God.
(HEAR, O ISRAEL; (THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD:)
28And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, WHICH IS THE FIRST COMMANDMENT OF ALL? 29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, '
30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
King James Bible
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
New International Version
Whether, then, it is I or they, this is what we preach, and this is what you believed.
IT'S ALL ABOUT THE GOSPEL MESSAGE .
BELIEVE, AND BE SAVED
New International Version
FOR I AM NOT ASHAMED OF THE GOSPEL, (BECAUSE IT IS THE POWER OF GOD THAT BRINGS SALVATION TO EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES: )FIRST TO THE JEW, THEN TO THE GENTILE.
YOU WILL DO THE WORKS THAT GOD HAS PREPARED FOR YOU BEFORE HAND.
BECAUSE YOU ARE SAVED AND THE SPIRIT LIVES IN YOU.
BELIEVE, AND BE SAVED IS THE MESSAGE.
New International Version john 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
New International Version JOHN 3:19
This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.
HEBREWS 3:19
New International Version
So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.
ONLY 2 CHOICES
DIE IN YOUR SINS, OR BELIEVE AND BE CLEANSED, WASHED IN THE BLOOD OF Christ.
BONUS VERSE
3:11 Micah
New Living Translation
You rulers make decisions based on bribes;
you priests teach God's laws only for a price;
you prophets won't prophesy unless you are
paid. Yet all of you claim to depend on the
LORD. "No harm can come to us," you say,
"for the LORD is here among us.
DO NOT TRUST IN MEN, OR IN WORKS,
BUT BELIEVE IN JESUS THE CHRIST.
I agree! I also admired how the pastor remained composed regardless of "Suge Sam's bullying". Fruits of the Spirit on display. Glory to our Lord Jesus Christ!!
Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.
@@InnocentRuyonga SAM IS AN ARROGANT POMPOUS ASS BULLY AND A HYPOCRITE.
EVEN CHRISTIAN PRINCE SAYS SO!
th-cam.com/video/rJ_H2sMljnk/w-d-xo.html
Aman my brother Sam. In christ jesus ❤❤❤❤ love from south Africa Cape town 😇😇😇😇
I had no idea he was Assyrian Church of the East! That's wonderful to finally know.
Was the good thieve ( next to jesus on the cross) babtised before his salvation?
He was baptized through the words of Christ...
@@rickvermeulen8916He died and rose with Jesus literally. We can do it in baptism, Romans 6,3-14
@@rickvermeulen8916 which baptism? I believe there are three (3) in the New Testament.
What do they believe?what is the foundational beliefs of the Assyrian east church ?
Id say just like Abraham from ur !
Come out of there and follow me , live by faith , be a seed of Abraham . Don’t be deceived,
Mary was no more divine than anyone else. And Mary said, “Behold, the slave of the Lord; may it be done to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her. Luke 1:38
Loving it! So far 54 minutes in JD keeping composure throughout the constant interruptions and side stepping from Romounian attempts.
By your fruits you will know them just a small statement by Christ that tells you works and faith goes hand to hand !!!
Sam’s translation of Gal. 5:6
“For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through faith.”
Or
“For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith which is identical to love working.”
Christ said to get baptized by water, physically, kinda like he did
Galatians 5:6 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.
@jaredrussell9100 where did he say that?
Romans 4:4-5 King James Version (KJV) Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
And that verse cites genesis 15:6 which is after three chapters of Abraham doing good works. Why didn’t it cite genesis 12 instead?
Ok, that's what God says. But what I need to know is what the Pope says.
Sam had so much patience with this young man
Yeah I agree knowing how Sam deals with people who cut him off lol he gave this dude a lot of grace and I was happy they had this discussion but it was sad to see this young pastor tap dance and get into debate mode instead of just letting the Holy Spirit guide the conversation.
This is identical to me trying to argue with my uncle
you all are INSANE!
Lol. If you think that's patience, I don't know what to tell you. I respect Sam for what he is, but patient is not it.
Yeah so much patience that he kept on interrupting
J.D. praise the Lord for the patience that you had with Sam! I really enjoyed listening to yall's dialogue.
It was a fun discussion!
Yeah, J.D. did a great job. Soli Deo Gloria!
I haven’t watched this debate, I just want to add before watching that Sam is wearing a “ be kind” shirt 👕…. And I know Sam is high strung let’s see if he does what his shirt represents 👍 BTW JD I appreciate your patience during debates very calming watching you debate
@milkmeat What are your thoughts after watching this video?
Be kind and rewind!
He said we should all be bereans 💪⛪️📖
Listen to how Paul describes his conversion!
"About noon as I came near Damascus, suddenly a bright light from heaven flashed around me. I fell to the ground and heard a voice say to me, ‘Saul! Saul! Why do you persecute me?’
"'Who are you, Lord?’ I asked.
“ ‘I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting,’ he replied. My companions saw the light, but they did not understand the voice of him who was speaking to me.
“‘What shall I do, Lord?’ I asked.
“ ‘Get up,’ the Lord said, ‘and go into Damascus. There you will be told all that you have been assigned to do.’ My companions led me by the hand into Damascus, because the brilliance of the light had blinded me.
“A man named Ananias came to see me. He was a devout observer of the law and highly respected by all the Jews living there. He stood beside me and said, ‘Brother Saul, receive your sight!’ And at that very moment I was able to see him.
"Then he said: ‘The God of our ancestors has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth.
You will be his witness to all people of what you have seen and heard. And now what are you waiting for?
Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name!"
Acts 22:6-16
Paul is on his way to Damascus to persecute Christians which is persecuting Christ himself.
Paul is sinning and dead in his sins at this point.
Jesus appears to Paul and Paul calls Jesus, "Lord!"
"No one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit."
1 Corinthians 12:3
Paul obeys Jesus and goes to meet with Ananias!
Ananias baptizes Paul and this is when Paul's sins are washed away, and Paul ceases to be dead in his sins and not anytime before his baptism!
When we judge people we are sinning, and so we are dead in sin whenever we sin.
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye."
Matthew 7:1-5
"Whoever is without sin let them cast the first stone!"
John 8:7
Baptism and the Lord's supper are mysteries established for the forgiveness of sins in the visible church established by Jesus Christ.
Matthew 16:18, 28:19
"Jesus said to them, “Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.
For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in them!"
John 6:53-56
What God says is, really is !
"God said "let there be light" and there was light!"
Genesis 1
God bless you for sharing this
Watching stuff like this is not a faith increaser. Its demotivating. It’s way overly technical and proves the church is just an organization. To argue what faith shows us watching, religion is just argumentative to for men to engage in.
And he said: "I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.” I for one have started questioning these values they both espouse and find it empty and lost in the blackness of it all. Perhaps it really is just man made religion
This would tend to increase your faith and perhaps persuade someone to believe there is a God. But better for you that you don't have to have an experience like that to help you believe, Jesus said.
Love the part on baptism and Eucharist
@gigglygiggly309 ai hear you. Its because it is all fleshy carnal dispute. Im sorry ypu feel that way. I truly am. Jesus loves you dided for you. Will save you once for all this instant if you believe Him for it. No religion. No changing. No anything other than taking Him at his word. Im so sorry you feel confused by all this.
Thanks Sam. You are so good! You really show the shallowness of some of these so called Pastors, who, because they went to bible school for four years, think they can deconstruct and reconstruct Christianity. Your points were biblical while his were subjective new age arguments- little from the Bible.
God has gifted you. Keeping using it to teach all.
By Sam's own words, he has changed over time and take on different perspectives. Who is to say his views will not continue to evolve
, yet at a particular moment in time, he stands with and strongly argues for a particular point... which at that point he treats as axioms. The fact that he can debate well and present evidence does not automatically result in him being right.
Doesn't result in him being wrong either. Changing your views doesn't mean anything.
@@syntax575it does mean you are easily persuaded by fallacious arguments and lack true wisdom which is apart from intellect
So, what is the essence of the debate, if not throw light to misconceptions and illogicalities? As in this debate, Sam has stronger points than Pastor Martin. Sam is obviously more enlightened about the faith than the Pastor. And if we are to be logical, the Pastor should leave off some of his beliefs, which are very parochial and if like, informed by bias against the Church Fathers
@Flippiecoester
@@Luiicianoyou are attacking the person, you are being as fallacious as you say he is
I was born in a Roman catholic family, studied the bible under a protestants theologian, now i don't associate with any division. My religion is bring people to Christ.
Christ is the savior. Rest on him alone!
@@exploringtheologychannel1697 yes Jesus is my Lord, my saviour.
Acts 4:12
Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.”
Amen to that. I do think the local church is important though.
@@exploringtheologychannel1697 i do go to rc church because its near by, but i am no very fond of traditions, except for sermon and bible quiz which is good. Regarding protestant churches, i have been many times, their sermon i love but they should also give more emphasis on topics like repentance which they hesitate on preaching. Repentance is one of my favourite topics because i was a drug addict and reading the four gospel changed my life, today i am 13 years away from drugs after know how beautiful our Lord Jesus is in his nature.
I don't go to Churches who believes Jesus is not God. For me Jesus is my Love and my only Love.
@@exploringtheologychannel1697 Yes Church is important, and i love having fellowship who can share the gospel and the love of Christ. But most christian like to speak about wordly affair, politics etc.
ALL of life is a Mystery, embrace the mystery, while endeavoring to live in the flow of Love. Shalom
Act like you are suggesting take another reincarnation through this hell again. Not too bright. Jesus gives us a way off the hamster wheel. Have faith alone and take the step off.
I don't think Sam is right on the faith point. Faithfulness is a result of faith, and we're saved by Grace through faith, not faithfulness (works). Each of the verses in Hebrews 11 says "By" faith, which is to say "because of" faith.
I hope this is helpful, I think a good scripture to demonstrate the Great point that Pastor J D is making is Galatians 5:6. Faith Expresses itself through Love. “ if you Love me, then you will obey my commands.” We have Faith in Christ, we express that by Loving Jesus by Obeying His commands. 😊
Allejuia 🙏🏻💯
Nope, it's NOT JUST FAITH, But ...faith in harmony with work.
According to St. James, FAITH without WORK is DEAD!!!
So faith and works (obedience to Christ) is showing love for JESUS.
And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. - 1 Corinthians 13:2
Paul clearly says that you can have faith that moves all mountains without love, so there's a distinction, but if you don't have love, then you are nothing. So, faith plus nothing (faith alone), according to Paul, is nothing.
@@jacobwoods6153 powerful 🙌🏼
Obedience to the commandment of love: how do we show our obedience? Is it only in mind in the abstract sense or we show obedience through action in reality? So having faith, but not expressed through faith, then faith is dead (James 5:17, 26).
Faith that was once delivered unto the saints & you know them by their works,
THE TRUE GOSPEL DELIVERS FROM BONDAGE , AND THE SECOND DEATH.
11And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life.
13I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life. 14This is the confidence we have in approaching God:
New International Version
Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”
King James Bible
Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
King James Bible
Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
King James Bible
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our. (SINS ) according to the scriptures;
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
King James Bible
And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
New King James Version
Remember that Jesus Christ, of the seed of David, was raised from the dead according to my gospel,
New King James Version
and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised;
King James Bible
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
King James Bible
Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.
New International Version 1 Peter 2:7
Now to you who believe, this stone is PRECIOUS. But to those who do not believe, “The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,”
King James Bible
Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
New International Version
So then, brothers and sisters, stand firm and hold fast to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by ( LETTER.)
JESUS IS LORD= GOD.
GOD IS TRIUNE.
THE FATHER IS GOD.
THE SON IS GOD.
THE HOLYSPIRIT IS GOD.
NOT THREE GODS,
But the one true God.
(HEAR, O ISRAEL; (THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD:)
28And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, WHICH IS THE FIRST COMMANDMENT OF ALL? 29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, '
30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
King James Bible
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
New International Version
Whether, then, it is I or they, this is what we preach, and this is what you believed.
IT'S ALL ABOUT THE GOSPEL MESSAGE .
BELIEVE, AND BE SAVED
New International Version
FOR I AM NOT ASHAMED OF THE GOSPEL, (BECAUSE IT IS THE POWER OF GOD THAT BRINGS SALVATION TO EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES: )FIRST TO THE JEW, THEN TO THE GENTILE.
YOU WILL DO THE WORKS THAT GOD HAS PREPARED FOR YOU BEFORE HAND.
BECAUSE YOU ARE SAVED AND THE SPIRIT LIVES IN YOU.
BELIEVE, AND BE SAVED IS THE MESSAGE.
New International Version john 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
New International Version JOHN 3:19
This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.
HEBREWS 3:19
New International Version
So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.
ONLY 2 CHOICES
DIE IN YOUR SINS, OR BELIEVE AND BE CLEANSED, WASHED IN THE BLOOD OF Christ.
BONUS VERSE
3:11 Micah
New Living Translation
You rulers make decisions based on bribes;
you priests teach God's laws only for a price;
you prophets won't prophesy unless you are
paid. Yet all of you claim to depend on the
LORD. "No harm can come to us," you say,
"for the LORD is here among us.
DO NOT TRUST IN MEN, OR IN WORKS,
BUT BELIEVE IN JESUS THE CHRIST.
The JUST shall live by Faith: Romans 1:17 Expanded Bible
17 The ·Good News [Gospel] shows ·how God makes people right with himself [or God’s righteous character; L the righteousness of/from God]-·that it begins and ends with faith [or that advances from one believing person to the next; or that begins with God’s faithfulness and results in people’s faith; L from faith to faith]. As the Scripture says, “But ·those who are right with God will live by faith [or those made righteous through faith will live (eternally); Hab. 2:4].”
@@erfwiseand yet it if you don’t get baptized you can’t enter the Kingdom.
@@Veteransministry That is heresy - show me one scripture - just 1 that says that
@@erfwise John 3:3-5. I will wait for you to come back and say baptism is not what he meant.
Only Sam will make us laugh in a moment of anger! I mean, in a hot debate we just burst out laughing! GOD BLESS YOU BOTH! GREAT DEBATE!
God bless you!
Wow, Sam was being very gracious and patient here. With opponent that keeps circling like this, usually he won't last long with Sam.
you are delusional, Sam is brillient but a prideful, arrogant very disrespectful, ass
I am a Catholic Christian, and I believe that even if one has ALL FAITH, but does not LOVE, it is useless, as Holy Scripture teaches! I also believe that we must cooperate with God's saving grace and repent and bear fruit and forgive others and love one another and persevere to the end to be saved, as Holy Scripture also teaches!
I am very impressed though with the kindness and humility of Pastor JD Martin! I would love to have a Debate with JD on Purgatory if he is open to it! Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink
Please reach out to me on FB messenger. We can talk about it.
Praise God for you brother
@Spartan 300 🤣 Catholics are technically the only true Christian. So you're either Catholic or nonChristian
@Spartan 300 I've been devoting my life to discussing these things lol of course I'd love to discuss them with you
@Spartan 300 the Catholic Church teaches salvation by Grace alone, not faith alone. It's not a works based religion. That's a very common misconceptions by many of the thousands of protestant denominations
Thank you Jesus! thank you Sam!
@exploring theology channel
Brother Martin, I can't believe how rude Sam was being to you at so many points. When you simply asked him if he was a monotheist, he accused you of attacking him. How ironic. Brother, you showed respect, gentleness and patience and this was pleasing to God. God bless!
Thank you so much for your kind comment. May the Lord help us all grow in grace.
Believing takes seconds. Its mental. Baptism is a work. Its physical.
Pastor J.D Martin: I am my own authority.
"And there was also a strife among them, which of them should be accounted the greatest.
And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.
But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.
For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth."- Luke 22 verses 24 to 27.
@@MichaelAChristian1 Amen. What is the relevance of quoting this particular scripture here?
@@iamtheteapot7405 The argument about authority made STRIFE long ago. The lesson to serve. Same now. They want authority to exercise lordship over you. To exercise power over you not to serve you. Or to not be of service and do as they please
But He is among you as one that serves. And as a 2 edged sword. Those who want to be their own authority, can also not be greatest without being as one that serves. Both argue to give authority to themselves to exercise lordship.
None doth seek the things of Christ. Hence scattering of Christians like tower of Babel.
Hence every different name being tossed around. Every debate is same strife over and over. It was settled long ago. If you seek to be greatest then they know what to do and don't.
@@MichaelAChristian1You said a lot of things brother, I’m a little slow, can you explain simply to me your point? Who is they?
@@iamtheteapot7405 People argue about authority still. It's prideful as the greatest is called servant.
A Kingdom divided against itself cannot stand. The Church became divided, books were removed, thousands of people made a God in the image that felt good to them. It is written if they have eyes Lord let them see!
Fascinating discussion on Baptismal Regeneration! A couple of things I'd like to bring to light. First, Sam makes a STRONG move with his truth claim that NO ECF ever rejected Baptismal Regeneration. I LOVE to see that because all JD then has to do is show ONE ECF who did. My question to Sam is whether he would claim Tertullian as an ECF? How about Clement of Rome? And what are the qualifications for one to be an ECF? Then I'd wanna know how the ECF actually defined "Regeneration". The second question I'd ask him is whether he believes Origen was an ECF. The third question I'd ask him is whether he believes everything that Origen taught and believed? And if not then how is it not just a matter of him picking and choosing what he wants to believe? Another question I'd ask is whether the FIRST Council got it all right and whether he holds to the ruling that James gave? If not, why not and if the very FIRST council didn't get it right then why should we think subsequent ones did or why not think that they increasingly got better?
Then there is the issue of Salvation being a different issue than Regeneration. Regarding the Nicene Creed why doesn't Sam believe in the 352 instead of the 381? And why doesn't Sam acknowledge that the addition of "one baptism" in 381 is NOT necessarily a reference to Regeneration nor actually in alignment with the words of Jesus in John. 3:5? Do we have any extant literature that tells us what discussions were held, is meant by "one baptism"? Since we don't even know how many attendees there were how are we to determine how and who finally decided what the final language would be and what was meant by it?
We know for a fact that the DOI and the Constitution of the USA was hotly debated and that some concessions were made in order to get it to fly. Why should we think the same is not true with the Nicene Creed?
what are you referencing when you believe in the 352 instead of the 381?
@@JohnQTaxpayer. - That was a year ago so I'm not positive but I believe I was referring to the two different Nicene Creeds. One in AD 352 & the other 381.
John 3:5
New King James Version
5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
There is not much room for interpretation
Blessings to all brothers and sisters in Christ.
Anyone with decrement knows what’s going on with this debate.
Pastor J.D Marin, respect your patients.
Praying for everyone involved 🙏🏼
All Glory goes to God.
Pastor Martin - got introduced to you through this debate on Sam's channel (I am a fan of his content); I thought you did a really great job in conducting yourself in a calm and clear manner! Very much enjoyed the back and forth, but disappointed on how toxic some of the Live Chat was - hope you weren't discouraged by this! Keep up the good work.
Thank you so much for the encouragement. Online ministry can be so discouraging since people always tear you down. You have no idea how much this comment means to me. Thank you, Chan!
@@exploringtheologychannel1697 i think you did great! Come to see more content! U r very inteligent. God bless you
@exploringtheologychannel1697 He could have been far more brutal, my Baptist brother, quarreling is not pleasing. Perhaps your position is different now. His position has changed as well. Praying for us.
I just watch 5 minutes of the debate Sam already cut this opponent a 100 time he didn't wait for him to answer the questions and he couldn't realize.
Excellent excellent excellent discussion JD. Sadly Sammy just thinks he is always correcting people who differ from him. I listened to the whole discussion which Sam flip flops 🩴 from place to place, cutting you off, and desperately trying to not allow context to be seen. I look forward to talking with you sometime.
Wow. The patience Sam showed JD!! JD basically came unprepared and had nothing to quote as facts other than "I think" " I don't think". And to top it off not listening to the point Sam is making and replying not arresting the point. Basically tap dancing. So frustrating!🤦🏻♀️
Usually when protestants say that Christians can disagree with "non-essential" doctrine, they use this almost completely arbitrary standard of "non-essential" that has no biblical basis at all. The bible does not have an exhaustive list of "essential" and "non-essential" doctrine, so most of the stuff that they say is "non-essential" is just based off of their opinions. No where in the bible does it say amillennialism or premillennialism is "non-essential." The claim that these are non-essential is completely made up by protestants.
Where does it say pre-millennialism or any other view is esssential?
The Gospel is essential. Eschatology is not. This seems obvious.
This is an absurd statement that you are making as a false straw man attack against Protestants. Obviously it is not arbitrary. The Scripture gives example regarding non essentials and speaks to Christian liberty The two groups of Christians were arguing and passing judgment on one another, and Paul told them to stop “quarreling over disputable matters” (Romans 14:1).
After quoting the Scipture will you continue to claim that Protestants are being arbitrary with no biblical basis regarding "non essentials"?
Roman's 14:22 So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves.
Hi Sam I truly appreciate your journey. The best way to explain. The Catholic Church is, it is like an umbrella and underneath the umbrella are the Roman Catholic Church, the Eastern Assyrian Catholic Church, Coptic Catholic Church etc.. they are all part of the One Catholic Church. All hold all of the beliefs of the One Catholic Church this is why we can call Her One.
Baptism don't save you it's showing obedience to God
It's doesn't not Don't
And yeah if you have a problem solve it with Peter not us
1 Peter 3:20
New International Version
20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,
1 Peter 3:21
New International Version
21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also-not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God.[a] It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
John 3:5 “Jesus answered, ‘I tell you the truth, unless a man is born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.’
Acts 22:16 “And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on his name.”
Salvation is by faith
@@kiroshakir7935using the niv just shows your not very knowledgeable my brother or sister in Christ
@@Bornagain5.56 I know it's not the most popular in scholarly discourse
and has some questionable translation choices
but I quoted it because it's the easiest and most accessible
Besides the translation of the verses in question is virtually the same compared to the "better translations" like the ESV and NRSV
@@kiroshakir7935 yall are both right they go together.
Imagine how great Sam would be if he had a smidgin of humility and was a humble teacher. He has a lot of potential I hope he realizes it.
get out of here with your fake piety.
@@Catholic_convert81 I forgive you and pray for you sir.
We are saved by the doing and dying of Jesus Christ put to our account by grace through faith, not by any of our works. Period. Anything else is a false gospel.
AMEN.
That’s arrogance.
@@rjyahin05 Beleiving that I bring anything to my salvation other than the sin that made it necessary is arrogance? I agree.
Faith is the “substance”…. So you receive a word or promise from God …. Then since you heard the word or promise you now take steps “action” toward what you heard. That is the result of faith…. And since you took action on what you heard then you get the reward of what you were promised.
The biggest contrast in the discussion was the contrast between JD's humility and Sam's lack of humility. JD, great job with a difficult personality. Every-time Sam tried to throw his weight around (e.g. "well, you just don't understand my point," or "I used to be where you are and you are just on a journey"), I couldn't help but think about that lesson my law professor taught me. If he can't articulate his counter-point to you clearly, you have no reason just to accept his rejection of your point. Great job not backing down but being very gracious in your response.
I disagree. I saw two honest and humble men have a discussion. Sissified Christians like you have no spine and this anyone who is firm is "arrogant" and not humble. Get off your high horse
@@Thedisciplemike looks like you need to get off your high horse, Mike.
@@Davian_James great comeback
@@Thedisciplemike Yours too!
@@Thedisciplemike - It had nothing to do with firmness. It had everything to do with the pretense that Sam was “educating” JD and every time there was a difference in view it was because JD “just didn’t understand”. We understand Sam just fine.. and think he are wrong. Sam did not show humility.
Sam keeps showing JD scripture to prove his point and JD answers "I don't believe that" . Omgoodnes
J.D Sam kept interrupting when you were trying to lay out its very annoying, but it shows insecurity, however he Conveniently was able to control himself unlike on his streams...like he Conveniently controls himself when on other people's channels but not his own
His channel, his rules.
I don't know why that would seem crazy to you.
@@elpibe1924
It's called respect
Sam has always been interrupting his whole life on debates.
I am praying for you sam and will always do.
This guy is trying to hold firm because his church members are gonna hear this.
And leave his congregation.
I kind of agree, his knowledge is very shallow and hopefully he isnt running a church, but in mentorship.
Hopefully he will become seasoned and more well versed
It is distressing to see how many who once defended the Gospel are now its enemies. Yet Jesus said many would fall away and so it is.
I’m a Baptist Protestant as of now. But I admit that I cannot defend my position on the points Sam made if I’m being consistent to the Church History and to myself as well.
Good points!
I’ll be exploring more on church history and now I’m studying Orthodox Christianity.
"And there was also a strife among them, which of them should be accounted the greatest.
And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.
But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.
For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth."- Luke 22 verses 24 to 27.
First study and meditate on the word that you may not be deceived by men writings and men's church history. Indeed it is good to know the history. But you should know the word predates all that history.
It's like if you want to become a doctor; you studied a doctor's book. So if we want to be a true believer of Jesus; we must know the word. So studying the Bible for it is the one that takes you right back to Jesus and Apostles timeline. Church history will lead you only to men creating things but not truly to Jesus.
When it comes to church history I would highly encourage you to listen to Gavin Ortlund at Truth Unites. He does an amazing job and provides much needed historical context
Amen brother keep searching and asking the Holy Spirit to guide you in truth and not your own understanding. ❤️❤️🙏
@@rishanborrymbai1104deceived? Have you read the church fathers? I would invite you to truly study the early church and their beliefs and the roots of Protestantism. The disciples protected the true faith and passed it on to the early church as they defended the faith. If we seek truth and truly humble ourselves before God we will find truth in these understandings, not of our own. God bless you brother / sister ❤️🙏
The only reason why this didn't turn into an argument is that JD knew how to deal with him. Well done, JD.
it's because Sam was patient.
@@user-nu3sd7zb2j are you one of those people who begs Sam not to block them and then praises him to feed his ego when he spares you?
Sam, patient? Lol
@@p4pdestined8 calm down. Your narcissism is showing.
@@user-nu3sd7zb2j sounds like Sam too. Also, I don't think you know what a narcissist is; if you did, you wouldn't have made that comment.
@@p4pdestined8 I do. It's very telling.
Sam, have you yet considered using a portable microphone? I think it would make a big difference in hearing your voice clearly 🙏🙏❤️
Basically we can read the bible and believe what we want, what Jesus ordained we can question everything, twisting everything, no wonder the world is a mess.
Faith is obedience.
Sam needs to understand that a disagreement on an issue doesn’t mean the other person is begging the question against them. That was one frustrating part of the discussion.
Sam doesn’t care about all of that. You have to prove it scripturally. That’s what matters
@@bewitchedprophetofislam9048 And Sam didn’t. His faith = faithfulness is outright false.
@@coolmuso6108 Faith Alone = Faithfulness, is CORRECT actually. Faith without works is dead faith. So he’s actually correct. Faith alone is not dead faith.
@@bewitchedprophetofislam9048 No, it’s the faith (assenting to the truth of the promise of the Gospel) that saves you. Faithfulness is a fruit of the Spirit and the Spirit is received by faith - not works.
@@coolmuso6108even your "faith/belief" is the product of your "freewill" which clearly you yourself is FREELY ACTING ON/DOING.
So, St. JAMES is always right, faith without works is DEAD., thus, ANNIHALATING protestant heresy of "FAITH ALONE"!!!
😏😏
The simplicity of the gospel is believing Jesus Christ alone for salvation, nothing added to the finished work of the cross, who are you trusting for salvation? Yourself and your works or the one who died on the cross to reconcile sinners back to the Father, believing Jesus Christ alone for salvation is the one and only way. God bless you.
I don't believe that without faith you would want to get baptized, you need faith to take that step. When I was baptized, I went to church believing that Jesus is the one and only God and I had faith that the things I heard about him were true. I also heard that being baptized was my way of showing Jesus that I truly believe. I'm just a regular guy, a child of the Almighty God who is trying to learn. God bless you both and thank you for teaching people what a disagreement should look like.
Well, yeah..sure, how about those people with psychological disabilities from birth (Ex. Autism)?
If faith is "religiously" required to enter the kingdom, how do people with psychological disabilities since birth get baptized?
Baptism is one thing. Baptism in the catholic sense is Christ giving authority to be PART of the kingdom, and personal FAITH is not YET a requirement, thus, the baptism of infants.
After baptism, we in the Catholic church have "CONFIRMATION", that's the time when your "faith" is required so, then you can enjoy His body, in the Eucharist.
And your task doesn't end there, your faith needs to persevere until the end.
Christ, by His sacrifice already redeemed ALL MEN past, present and future--- but for the present, Christ's sacrifice is our TICKET, now we need to go to the BALL.
How do we get to the ball (heaven) miles and miles away from our house?
We need to save money, take a bath, go to the airport/terminal/pier, journey to the destination with food and water, also, the outfit for the ball is required, extra money for some miscellaneous and just make sure to be in time before the ball starts. And let me remind you that the "TICKET" for the ball is so expensive that all ur effort to go to the ball would mean "NOTHING". But, u need to get to the ball of ur own doing (FREEWILL = FAITH+WORKS)
All those efforts u did for making it in time for the ball are parallel to BAPTISM, CONFIRMATION, EUCHARIST, ALL THE SEVEN SACRAMENTS, THE ROSARY, GUIDANCE OF THE CHURCH..., and ur able to do those things because God through the Holy Spirit provided everthing you need for the journey (GRACE), all u need to do is use those things on the journey.
We have a different view on baptism. Imagine your son walking across the street on his own at 2 years old? Do you let him cross the street on his own or do you hold his hand? Same
Thing with Christianity for the Eastern Orthodox faith. We love our children so much that we baptize them to wash away their sin. At that point they are saved… but then in life God has allowed the devil to roam the earth. The devil works very hard to tempt us to screw up and fall off track. By falling into sin, we become aware of our sin, repent and reach to the Bible and church to grow closer to God. I was saved, I am being saved, I will be saved. We say that we will be saved because at the end god is the most merciful. We get to choose whether we want to go with him or not. If we choose not then we will face eternal hell.
The end where we have a choice is the second coming the final judgment
What bible does Sam profess to believe in. Paul spells it out in Romans 4 that one is justified by faith without works, so there is no room for boasting. Christians do good works because they have been saved. One is placed into Christ, regenerated, justified by faith, beeing faithful to one’s position comes after!
You dont understand the position of catholic and orthodox, is not that you are saved by works that is a strawman, is that you have to persevere and stay close to Christ until the end, you are justified by faith without works, when you stop persevering your faith dies, what James describes as work is not just good deeds, but also the closeness to Christ
So faith means faithfulness. I’m saved by my faithfulness. That’s to say that I’m saved by my works. I can boast because of my faithfulness, but I cannot boast because of my faith.
I gotta call it like it is… the pastor not only did his thing but WON in this great discussion. I love Sam but the pastor not only kept him on his toes but made him constantly push the goal post back when he had no DIRECT answer. Respect to both but HUGE CREDIT FOR THE PASTOR on this one
@@TheJackjack um no.
100%
As Christians we are all called to learn and obey the truth from the bible alone. Denominational beliefs should not be an obstacle in our walk. God's ways are not our ways. Discussions unites, debates divides.
Sam, I find it incomprehensible how such a smart "believer" is dismissive of the power the Holy Spirit over the apostles, apostolic fathers, Doctors of the Church so as to keep His Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church's deposit of faith intact, generation after generation; when Jesus himself asked Peter, the leader of the Church, if he loved him more than the other apostles and to care for his flock. Jesus made it a point that He would not leave His Church without visual representation and acephalic. That's something only Satan would have desired.
So, amongst all the apostles Peter loved Him the most, and Jesus knew it and made it a point to highlight this fact thrice. Finally, Jesus said that He was to pray for Peter's stewardship of His flock, not that of the heretical 64,000 Christian sects in existence today. And, that in the Holy Spirit and through the Holy Spirit that Jesus left us, the gates of hades will never prevail over it.
The young pastor, unaware, lives in discontinuity with the Primitive Church, its history, and the Deposit of Faith, and resists the Holy Spirit in some areas with man-made protestant exegesis a la James White, who seems to hold the keys, "not Peter", of knowledge/exegesis to True Church Belief 2000 years later. He really does not believe in the power of the Holy Spirit, let alone the literal meaning of the Bible, but on his power of persuasion, exegesis and endless ranting disputation.
Again, so much knowledge and articulation, yet the young pastor, as most hard core protestants, don't heed the literal meaning of Jesus' words in the Bible. Instead, their spirit is one of disputation, protestation and hatred for the True Church; the same spirit that divided Christians in 1054 and 1521.
I hope the pastor is a truth seeker and is lead by the Holy Spirit, and matures in his understanding of where the Bible he holds in his hands and where any orthodox deposit of faith he believes in comes from.
Blessings and excellent debate!!!
Nowhere does it mention that Peter loved Jesus more than the other apostles. Jesus asked Peter if he loved Him 3x times, very likely to restore him after he denied Him 3x. Just because Jesus gave Peter primacy, it does not mean that was based on him loving him more than the other apostles. There can be other reasons for entrusting a person or persons with something other than their love for you. Even in the OT, God chose Israel out of all the nations, but that does not mean it was because they loved him more. In fact, it's made clear that they were chosen based on nothing they had done. Jacob and Esau is another example of God choosing one over another for his own purposes, since He made that choice before they were born. Let's not try to refute Protestantism by falling into their own errors of reading our own thoughts and speculations into the Holy Scriptures.
Bless his heart....it's fine to have the confidence of your convictions, young man. At some point, however, you just really need to concede to the wisdom of someone who's studied these things longer.
Faith ALONE is a man made tradition, for even if one has ALL FAITH, but does not LOVE, IT IS USELESS, as we must cooperate with God's saving grace and repent and bear fruit and forgive others and love one another and persevere to the end to be saved! Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink
No, faith alone is a biblical doctrine. Faith plus works is a man made doctrine.
Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] *NOT OF WORKS* , lest any man should boast.
Romans 4:4-8 KJV
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. [5] But to him that *WORKETH NOT* , but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. [6] Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, [7] Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. [8] Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
Romans 3:20-24 KJV
Therefore *BY THE DEEDS OF THE LAW THERE SHALL BE NO FLESH JUSTIFIED* in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. [21] But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; [22] Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: [23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; [24] Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Galatians 2:16 KJV
Knowing that a man *IS NOT JUSTIFIED BY THE WORKS OF THE LAW* , but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and *NOT BY THE WORKS OF THE LAW* : for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Romans 3:28 KJV
Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith *WITHOUT THE DEEDS OF THE LAW.*
Hebrews 6:1 KJV
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of *repentance from dead works* , and of faith toward God,
Romans 10:3-4 KJV
For they being *ignorant of God's righteousness,* and going about to establish their own righteousness, *have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God* . [4] For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
Over and over the Bible makes it clear that a person is saved by faith without works. Yet many people deny this and claim that passages such as James 2.24 teach that a person is saved by faith and works. This is false, the Bible does not contradict itself.
James 2:24 KJV
Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
Is James 2.24 teaching that a person is saved by faith and works? No. It is not even talking about salvation. Both Paul and James use the word dikaioo which is translated as justified. This word has a range of meanings depending on the context. Dikaioo had primarily a forensic (legal) use meaning that one is declared righteous, acquitted, this is the way Paul uses it and is talking about in the sight of God. James however does not use dikaioo in this way, instead he uses it in the same way that 1 Timothy 3.16 and Luke 7.35 uses it which is talking about vindication, something being proven to be true. Justification in these passages is simply referring to that. It would be absurd to say that dikaioo (justified) in relation to Christ is talking about him being saved. Because people fail to recognise how dikaioo is used they end up misunderstanding the Bible.
1 Timothy 3:16 KJV
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, *justified* in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Luke 7:35 KJV
But wisdom is *justified* of all her children.
James agrees with Paul. That is why they both quote Genesis 15.6. James quotes this in verse 23, just prior to the passage many claim teaches that you are saved by faith. Yet Abraham was 75 when he got saved. (Joshua 24, Genesis 12). About 100 years old he get circumcised. Years later he finally offered up Isaac. To say that Abraham's work of offering up Isaac saved him denies that he was saved prior which us evidently false.
James 2:23-24 KJV
And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. [24] Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
Genesis 15:6 KJV
And he believed in the Lord ; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
Abraham was not saved by being circumcised.
Romans 4:9-12 KJV
Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. [10] How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? *Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.* [11] And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also: [12] And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, *which he had being yet uncircumcised.*
Neither was he saved by offering up Isaac. Abraham was saved before he offered up Isaac, he was saved before circumcision, he was saved by calling on the Lord, his faith saved him. When James says Abraham was justified by offering up Isaac he is talking about being justified in the sight of men. Not God.
Romans 4:2 KJV
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but *NOT BEFORE GOD.*
Abraham proven his faith by his works. This is the point James was making. That is why James 2:18 says, "Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works." Man cannot see someones heart to know if they are saved. Man looks at works. In the sight of man, Abraham was justified by his works, in other words, his faith was proven to be true.
Paul and James are not talking about the same thing. Paul is speaking against self-righteous Judaism while James is talking about dead orthodoxy. When Paul speaks about justification he is talking about the declaration of innocence before God. When James speaks about justification it is talking about the sanctification of believers in the sight of men. Paul is speaking about Genesis 15.6, yet the emphasis of James is on Genesis 22.
People are saved by faith, not works. Over and over the Bible repeats itself on this point. Paul strongly rebukes the Galatians calling them foolish for later adding an element of the law to the Gospel, thinking they would be justified by it.
Galatians 3:3-13 KJV
Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? [4] Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain. [5] He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? [6] Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. [7] Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. [8] And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. [9] So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. [10] For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. [11] But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. [12] And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. [13] Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
People were preaching false gospels of salvation, one of which included the work of circumcision. The type of work added to the Gospel for salvation is irrelevant, any work added makes it a false gospel (which the Bible warns of). As Paul makes known in Galatians 5.4, that Christ became no effect to the Galatians, since they were seeking to be justified by the works they included. Therefore whoever believes in a Gospel of works is not believing in Christ for salvation. A person can claim they trust in Christ, yet whoever believes works are a part of salvation clearly do not as the Bible reveals.
Galatians 5:3-5 KJV
For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. [4] Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. [5] For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Galatians 2:21 KJV
I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
Titus 3:4-5 KJV
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, [5] Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
In conclusion, the Bible teaches that a person is saved by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone, not of works. The Bible teaches that those who add work (whatever work that might be) to the Gospel are preaching a false gospel, one that frustrates the grace of God and renders Christ of no effect to those who receive it. In short, a person cannot be saved by believing such a gospel.
FALSE GOSPEL
Christ + faith + works = salvation
TRUE GOSPEL
Christ + faith =salvation
Salvation is a free gift of God, given by his grace and mercy. It is not earned. It is a gift.
@@jesusisgod2953 sorry to say but faith alone as defined by the protestant in not biblical, its a man made tradition created on 16th century later.
@@christianspear6322
Salvation is a gift. It is free. You don't work for it, you don't earn it neither can you add to what Christ did. Christ is sufficient. Not our filthy rags.
@@christianspear6322 i think you do not even know what "Faith alone" means
Ok then.. how much good works have you done to add to to His grace....who has bewitch you?
Couple areas where Sam is ignorant. He says one Baptism? (Matthew 3:11)
“I baptize you with water for repentance, but he who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
That's two separate baptisms.
He uses the thief on the cross as going to heaven and not being baptized.
(Luke 23:43)
And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
And I quote; "on this day" remember this..
(John 20:17)
Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”
This is "three" days later. Was the thief already in heaven as same stated? Or in a place of paradise? There is a huge contradiction here if the thief went to heaven without Jesus. Remember He said; on this day! And with me! In paradise.
Sam do some more studying brother.
There are two places when people die as you also stated in another video. In torment and a chasm between the others as you started when speaking of Lazarus a far off and the rich man in torment.
The only time the phrase "Faith Alone" is found in scripture is in James 2:24 "a man is justified by works, and not by faith alone."
What a terrible argument lol
@cool muso that's the classic catholic argument. Reminds me of a weaker version of calvinism....just a doctrine in search of a proof text.
@@coolmuso6108 "what a terrible argument lol" says a dude who then proceeds not to make any rebuttal whatsoever. Either you're too lazy or you actually don't know how
@@coryalbright9798 and you're answer to it is...?
@@Thedisciplemike Define for me how James is using the words “justified” and “faith.”
Salvation is to ‘believe’ and through faith. Rom 10:9-10, and Eph 2:8-9. Belief is a verb (John 3:16), faith is a noun (Heb 11)
Sam's behavior seems rude, presumptuous, incorrigible, uncharitable to fellow believers, and a poor witness of Christlikeness as far as I'm concerned.
Hahaha Sam was fighting the urge no to annihilate him. He was actually being very charitable the whole discussion. Thank God he didn’t challenge Sam to a debate.
You simply dont know Sam, his judgment belongs to the lord alone, not us. We are all in a spiritual battle with the enemy, and Sam admits his falts, he admits hes impatience, he struggles with anger ect. But that doesn't meen hes wrong about his theology. Sams not perfect like all of us are not perfect, but i watch Sam daily pray to the holy spirit live on video asking god to give him patience and to calm his anger. So Sam is humble, but Sam also has a amazing gift from God to memorize the scriptures almost perfectly. So because of that hes extremely confident in his theology, because in doing so he can look at the big picture and help layman understand. Sams not here to tickle people's ears and boost their own ego. Thats not why Sam does this, Sam could care less what any man thinks of him. What matters is truth, no matter who it may offend. But i watch Sam pray 🙏 daily for god to give him patience and humility because Sam himself recognizes his own falts. And isnt trying to hide them from anyone, you have to admire a man like him honestly.
@@davekendall1139 I agree that Sam is a gifted man when it comes to the Scriptures, but it seems Sam and you have agreed with me - he has "issues" that are unChristlike and they may be a distraction and deterrent to effectively sharing the Gospel.
I also agree that we all have our struggles, but none of them justify inappropriate attitudes, speech, or behavior.
Not "ticking people's ears" or "caring what others think of you" is not a license to habitually demean or mistreat other image bearers of God no matter how wrong or deceived they are.
So I applaud you for praying for Sam and encourage you to continue praying for him. Yet, the truth still remains, he and you both admit that he does have problems that need to be repented of and addressed. I'm also praying for Sam, but if Truth is important to us all and it is, then we must be truthful with one another and not try to cover up, excuse, sweep under the rug, or downplay that which is wrong and must be corrected and changed.
This is not a personal attack but an admonishing between brothers in Christ.
His back handed insult to catholics’s belief in the magisterium did not go unnoticed by me
Sam has gonna off the rockers the last 2 years …once you start digging 😳.
Sam is much more educated (knowledge wise), he truly has a gift, he just needs guidance because all his claims are very simple to brush off with the right understanding.
He has all the raw materials but needs guidance in order to process them correctly, I really hope in God that He will find this guidance someday
Gotta jump in here again because it's actually Sam that is not listening. I hear what he's saying and I think JD does too. The EVIDENCE that Sam is not listening is his continuing to interrupt JD which means JD isn't getting a chance to finish his point which means Sam can NOT be listening. I don't know who setup this "debate" or structured it but it was poorly structured. This is a GREAT example of why there needs to be Opening Statements followed by rebuttals followed by cross-examinations followed by Closing Statements.
That said I want to point to one specific EVIDENCE that proves something Sam just said is false. Sam would have a good and strong point IF what he said about the Nicene Counsel/Creed is true in that JD would be projecting his 21st century understanding onto the Council/Creed. Sam asks the question where was the Holy Spirit to guide and direct them? How about in the 600 or more invited attendees that did NOT show up?
Now to falsify his claim. He states "This is what they believed. It was universal. It wasn't something that was secondary. This was the universal belief. Even the heretics believed in baptismal regeneration.", etc. I believe that's a false statement. Where is the evidence for such a claim?? I believe I have read that Tertullian believed in Baptism being required for Salvation but wrote against Baptismal Regeneration. From what I recall seeing the subject is NEVER even addressed by Clement of Rome.
Given that we KNOW some of these councils got VERY heated and we have NUMEROUS writings from various ECF that pretty much confirms that NONE of them agreed on much of anything WHY should we believe there is Universal Agreement on Baptismal Regeneration?? WHERE is the EVIDENCE for such?? Sam says "No one in the 4th Century that represented the Church disagreed with the statements of Nicaea." We KNOW that is NOT true! EVIDENCE: The council itself in the Creed pronounces anathema upon those who disagreed with them on the substance/essence of Christ. Which just 56yrs later as removed from the Creed!!
And lastly, given that we have some, like Polycarp, who CLEARLY wrote that one is saved by Faith Alone, and never mentions baptismal regeneration, WHY should we believe there was Universal Agreement on it?
No you are wrong Sam is right like seriously check out the Bible verse Sam is quoting from baptism is important in Christianity
@@Cool.905 LOL No, you are wrong. Your OPINION is duly noted and summarily dismissed because, well, it's just that and MORE IMPORTANTLY God says otherwise.
“Even a fool who keeps silent is considered wise; when he closes his lips, he is deemed intelligent.” (Pro. 17:28)
"A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind." (Pro. 18:2)
I'm not only familiar with that verse but EVERY verse regarding Baptism and Salvation. Neither JD nor myself are saying that Baptism isn't important. We're saying it's NOT essential and NOT part of the Gospel. Nor does it regenerate anyone,
@@HeavyDutyJack315 - You probably didn't notice where I gave EVIDENCE that Sam wasn't listening.
@@HeavyDutyJack315 “Answer a fool according to his foolishness, so that he may not be wise in his own eyes.” (Pro 26:5)
“Like a dog that returns to its vomit is a fool who repeats his folly.” (Pro. 26:11)
“Do you see a man wise in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.” (Pro. 26:12)
You definitely didn't notice that you just proved all those Proverbs true. Nor the difference between FACTS and OPINION. FACTS are backed up with EVIDENCE. OPINIONS are NOT.
God did not create demons, God created Angels whom chose to demonize themselves through their own actions and false thinking. Now banished from heaven, demons try their best to disrupt the Holy Church Of God.
Desire of Baptism? What scripture verse is that?
Why must we demonstrate it from scripture? The bible doesn't teach sola scriptura.
Where in scripture does it say baptism isn’t necessary for salvation? Clear statement, not an interpretation.
What happens to someone who isn't baptized. Will he see the kingdom of God. Or was Jesus lying in John 3:3-5?
@JChrisTruth146 water refers to water baptism. Which is what Noah's flood represents. 8 people were saved by water. While Jesus was on the cross the Roman stabbed his side and water came pouring out. Represents the world being baptized.
1 Peter 3:20-21 which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, 👉🏻 *eight souls were saved by water* 👈🏻
21 👉🏻 *The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us* 👈🏻 (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
@JChrisTruth146 yes and Ezekiel 36 is referring to mikvah which is where baptism came from. If you notice Nicodemus asks Jesus how can a full grown man enter the womb a second time. Which is how we know that John 3:5 certainly refers to baptism. Because we see in John 3:4 that this is referring to being born again of both water and spirit. The water in baptism is what that represents. Entering the physical rebirth without entering the womb as an adult a 2nd time.
Sam, I was curious. I couldn't understand you when you said something about 3what the Assyrisns believe vs. the Catholics on Purgatory. Can you elaborate?
I watched it earlier live. I thought it was pretty much disappointing. The core issue was never really even touched, u both side tracked each other constantly and spend too much time just talking about everything but the issue at hand.
I hope your next talks will be better. You both have so much potential for great debates and discussions
I am looking forward to the next talk!
I agree, there was way too much talking past each other and distraction, going down rabbit trails. Having a moderator to keep the dialogue on track would have been beneficial.
Can you show me 1 verse in the entire Bible that says we are saved by faith alone. I'll wait.
@@KyrieEleisonMaranatha you’re starting to sounds like a Muslim. “Can you show me where Jesus says I am God”
Or a Jehovah witness says “show me one verses with the word trinity”
We both know that doctrines aren’t established that way.
Romans 5:1
Therefore, since we have been 👉🏻justified👈🏻 by 👉🏻faith👈🏻, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
Romans 4:5
And to the one who does not work but 👉🏻believes 👈🏻in 👉🏻him👈🏻 who 👉🏻justifies👈🏻 the ungodly, his 👉🏻faith👈🏻 is counted as 👉🏻righteousness👈🏻,
Romans 4:3
For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham 👉🏻believed👈🏻 God, and it was 👉🏻counted👈🏻 to him as. 👉🏻righteousness👈🏻
Ephesians 2:8-9
For by 👉🏻 GRACE👈🏻you have been saved through 👉🏻faith👈🏻. And this is not your own 👉🏻doing👈🏻; it is the 👉🏻gift👈🏻 of God, not a result of 👉🏻WORKS👈🏻, so that no one may boast.
@@jamesb6818 I didn't ask you to show me the exact words faith alone. Because even if you did that there is only 1 verse that actually says faith alone. That's James 2:24.
Also I never said we are saved by the works of the law of Moses. Not really sure why you posted a bunch of verses about works of the law of Moses. We don't teach that anyways. So that is straw man argument to post all those verses.
I asked you to show me where the Bible says/teaches we are saved by faith alone. None of those verses say faith is alone in the process of sanctification. You aren't going to find a single verse that teaches faith is alone. Faith and works of the law of Christ go together. You can't have one apart from the other.
Sam, I have a question for you? Does faithfulness to parents determine whether or not they are the children of the same parents? Think about what you are saying Sam.
This video should have updates.
Since this was first aired, Sam has converted to Catholicism ✝️
Praise God!
He's no longer Orthodox?
I think faith is something when you first believe an faithful is something that continually
It'd be nice if Sam let jd talk
@shamounian Hi Sam love your work . What i think pastor J.D.Martin wants to say is that faith is the moment you believe and faithfulness is remaining in that belief. For example: the thief on the cross had faith in Jesus and remained faithfull till he died. Faith do not require an action other then believing and faithfulness is remaining in the belief that you had first (includes acting conform the belief that you have). God bless ye!!!
My God, Sam is such a lion of the faith. May God lead hin towards the one true, and apostolic, Catholic church
Sam’s position is weak and he tries to cover this by maintaining the other’s position does not consider the context. He will not allow the other person to finish. One becomes a child of God by faith, because one is then a child of God one can be faithful to the Father.
You dont let other people answer something you didnt said, its a waste of time, you need to correct people before they do that
If that's so, why don't you refute him on his channel?
Why? I’m not a debater. I still have a right to disagree with him. I like to write my responses, Sam likes to speak his.
JD I think your points would have been MORE effective if Sam would have stuck to the issue/topics at hand. He would ask you one question, then you would start to address the question, then he would stop you before you could explain answer and then ask you a different question. Like spider veins spreading all over the place. I think a moderator would be better next time or at least give you 1 minute to layout your answers . @Exploring Theology Channel
I do think a moderator may be helpful for future debates I have on the channel. Someone else recently said that as well.
Information is in the details, Sam is breaking it up as he talks to prove where he is wrong. When we make a decision that something is wrong, we have many reasons to support our belief and sometimes it is because we reject something in the earlier days which could be the mistake of ignorance or rebellion.
Faithfulness fullness of faith...it's the whole life
Faith ALONE means by the Grace of God, FAITH is absolutely FREE (no fee) without any Work/Deed from the Law of Moses... In order to have God's Grace of Free FAITH in Christ Jesus, a person must first BELIEVE, then ACCEPTANCE and CONFESSION/REPENTANCE (100% necessarily/necessity/requirements without exception) for SALVATION... while BAPTISM and GOOD WORKS/DEEDS (Charity of Love for their neighbors/foes) are also needed, but NOT ALWAYS necessarily required in some circumstances (exemption to the rule)... like those People who are non-believers dying from their bed, hospital, accident, war, battle, and imminent death... Example... The thief dying on the Cross with Christ Jesus... No Baptism and No Good Works/Deed (Charity of Love for their Neighbors/foes) but still Christ Jesus promised salvation to the thief... Facts and Truth, biblically speaking...
Christ Be with you
No faith alone means no works (James 2:14-26)
and that means not love (john 14:21-24)
Without love and obedience to Christ we cannot abide in Him.
The thief on the cross showed love for Christ defending him while going to his own death, that is work (luke 23:29-43)
God bless you
How can claim to love God and believe in him and not abide in every one of his commandments? The rich man who professed Jesus as "good" (meaning he is God) but did not do as Jesus instructed him showed the kind of faith that is dead. Professing and believing is not faith. Professing, believing and doing all his commandments is faith.
@@adedamolaayo-onita8603 Many will say, Lord, Lord in your Name, we Prophesied, in your Name, we healed the sick and driven out demons, but Christ will turn around and say to them, I never knew you, away from me you EVILDOERS." (ref. Matt. 7:23)... The FIRST will be the last, and the LAST will be the first to enter the Kingdom of God... (Ref. Matt. 20:16)... Anyone who DOES the WILL of my Father (God), is my Brother, Sister, and Mother,... and will enter the Kingdom of Heaven." (Ref. Matt. 12:50 / Mat. 7:21-22)
Is the type of faith written by God in Col 2:12 required?
JD showed a lot of patience and grace with Sam. Sam has developed some strange notions and the more he gives into catholic fathers he will degenerate further. The whole argument about someone near faith dying was a waste of time. JD was correct, you either believe or you don’t and Sam even quoted the verse in Hebrews that judgement comes at death by appointment of God. Genesis 3 says that God’s Spirit will not always strive with man and if the guy dies before faith he is still under cndemnation. And Sam kept going down rabbit holes. He is contentious for no reason other than to argue. He dominated the time with constant ramblings that led to nowhere. I should have known he was going to do that when he continually kept repeating that he was unlearned about Assyrian Orthodoxy, yet had converted to it. Who does that?
You will be called names like "son of the devil", because of your JW pic. LOL
Debate him then if you're so confident you know more than Sam.
I had a Baptist say to me recently, "Once you are saved by Jesus, you are saved forever", in other words, Once saved always saved. This is indeed a grand statement, so could someone give me the biblical passage where this grand statement is made? I have looked and looked, and "Once saved always saved" is not mentioned anywhere. Can anyone help?
don’t listen to that baptist. He’s preaching a false gospel.
The scriptures tell us once we are saved Always saved. Even if we lose faith and cease to believe.
This is because salvation is dependant upon what Christ did for us on the cross, not our own works. Christ is still going to remain faithful to his promise to save you when you first believed and he cannot deny you because you are part of his body, you are one with him spiritually and bone of his bone flesh of his flesh ( 1 Corinthians 6:17, Ephesians 5:30-33). To deny you would be denying himself because as just I said both you and the Christ are one.
2 Timothy 2:13
if we are faithless, he remains faithful, for he cannot disown himself
All our sins are forgiven past present and future when we place our faith in the gospel.
Colossians 2:13
And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you ALL trespasses;
Salvation is a free gift Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
It also says that the gifts of god are without repentance, which means that once God gives a gift he will NEVER take it back.
Romans 11:29
For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
All our sins are forgiven past present and future when we place our faith in the gospel.
Colossians 2:13
And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you ALL trespasses;
Salvation is a free gift Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
It also says that the gifts of god are without repentance, which means that once God gives a gift he will NEVER take it back.
Romans 11:29
For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
It is a true statement because the scriptures teach that you are sealed unto the day of redemption and many fall away and you may have heard them say, I use to believe but I don't any longer. John 8:31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, John 15:6 If anyone does not abide in me he is thrown away like a branch and withers; and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire, and burned. What say you?
@@amos3three941 if u can fall off then u ain’t always saved. U have a responsibility to stay in grace by being Christlike.
Once Baptized always Baptized. Eternal life that NEVER ENDS. IMMUTABLE PROMISE OF GOD. GOD will NEVER leave you nor forsake you. You shall NOT COME INTO CONDEMNATION. Full ASSURANCE OF HOPE.
Hope you havent seen yet as Romans 9 says. Full ASSURANCE OF FAITH.
Does that help? That's Eternal security. Or as you label it once Saved always saved. More powerful Matthew 1:21. Jesus means HE SHALL SAVE HIS PEOPLE FROM THEIR SINS! His name can't be broken. Do you believe ON HIS NAME!
35:30 I'd have to disagree with Sam that faith is a work. The context is on the heels of the feeding of the 5000. Jesus tells them that they are only there because they were fed a meal but that they should labor for the food which does not perish, in other words Jesus is the true bread of life and to look to him for eternal life. Then they ask what works they should do, Jesus answers that the work that God requires is faith in him. It's a play on words because to the Jewish ear, they would have equated works with things that they need to do to please God. Jesus was taking their idea of works and turning it on its head by saying God wants you to believe in me. Faith comes empty handed, offering nothing because our "works" are as filthy rags. Faith is trust, not a thing that is done. Faith leads to good works but it is not a work.
Faith-Faithfulness to the true church founded by Jesus Christ thru the apostles, If you are outside the church you don't have faithfulness
I'm sorry if I am attacking you brother JD but on Sam channel you said this was not a debate but just a discussion but here you are writing that it is a debate. Why would you lie? your title should be a discussion not a debate. As a minister of the Gospel be true to yourself.
Where did I mention it was not a debate? I said a lot of things in this discussion, so I don't remember everything.
@@exploringtheologychannel1697 i will check the time line and send to you brother. just give me some time.
Opening prayer you multiple times call it a conversation.
1:42:44 in concluding remarks its against referred to as a conversation.
I don’t view a debate as a bad thing. A debate is a discussion where people disagree. Thus, in my view every debate is a discussion, but every discussion is a debate since if you agree it can’t be called a debate.
Faith as A Way of Life
Sam gets rattled WAY too easily.....he doesn't know how to have a calm, rational discussion
All the law and the prophets hang on us understanding our identity in Christ. If you dont understand who you are, then you dont understand what faith is. The relationship we have with ourselves is a faith-based relationship.
"Faith is a work, John 6:29." - Sam Shamoun
I was really have a hard time listening to this since Sam was behaving in such bad faith, but once he said that, I'm out. That's an egregious exegetical error. That's most certainly not what that verse is saying and Romans 4 makes it clear that faith is not a work. In fact, the entire New Testament contrasts faith and works, so how you could believe that faith is a work is mind boggling to me.
I appreciated your patience JD. It exceeded mine and I was just listening to it.
Faith absolutely in itself is a work. Faith is an action word. Faith requires you to move your lips Romans 10:9. Moving your lips is a work.
Christ be with you
Rom 4 speaks of works of the Law, not good works.
It speaks of the circumcision of Abraham, and King David's forgiveness without animal sacrifice.
St Paul talks of the promise to Abraham that came by it faith.
This promise was full we are told by God was fulfilled because he Obeyed God (Gen 26:4-5)
God bless you
@@MrKev1664 yep, that's because we are now saved by faith alone. However we are also not by the works of the law Moses either. But rather the works of the law of Christ. We certainly must keep the law of Christ or we are not saved.
@@KyrieEleisonMaranatha
Christ be with you
No we are saved by Gods Grace, his forgiveness of our sin
there is no such thing as Faith alone especially if we must keep the Law of Christ.
do you now what the Law of Christ is?
Can you define what faith in Jesus Christ is?
God bless you
@@MrKev1664 absolutely the law of Christ is Jesus's commandments he gave while on earth with us. Baptism, euachrist, charity etc.
Faith is the belief in and obedience to Jesus. But it also includes Baptism and confession. Faith in itself is an action word, a work.
Is it with in the character of God to leave his sheep unsure of their salvation? That sounds like it would encourage fear, anxiousness and depression rather than assuredness, comfort and rest ... I know nothing and am still learning but thats where im at so far
They can have moral certitude, but we are sinners - we tend to be attracted to sin. If Jesus had said Once Saved Always Saved, for example, we’d likely take that as a free pass to sin. Luckily, he preached the opposite: Sin is very serious. It offends God. Nothing sinful can enter Heaven. Jesus died so we could live eternally, so don’t neglect this gift. Don’t take his grace for granted. ❤️
It does. I grew up with that uncertainty and constant fear. I was raised Catholic. When I asked if you can know if you are saved, no one could answer my question.
I had to find out outside the church. I felt betrayed. It's a serious salvation issue of my soul.
Telling me I am going to wind up in Purgatory from unconfessed sin, to have the sin be beat out of me, is not something to look forward to. Not knowing the connection of why Jesus Christ died and resurrected and that you still need to depend on church fathers and their mediation for your salvation isn't good enough.
You become completely dependent on them for your salvation and hope you can be good enough to make it.
The scriptures showed me Jesus Christ is the mediator, because He is the one who died for me. The scriptures taught me that if I confessed Jesus Christ the Son of God is Lord, I can inherit the gift of salvation by what He did, dying and atoning for my sins on the cross. This I never learned in the church. I found out when it was shown to me in the scriptures outside the church. Why? If they follow the apostles and their teachings, why not teach this? Why keep it a secret?
Always on a journey and never arriving. You've supposedly been a Christian for years Mr Shamoun, even got to the extent of being a public debater and yet no firm convictions on the basic matter of faith and salvation? All the while you believed you were saved by faith alone, does that mean that you weren't really saved then? Did you just get saved recently on learning that salvation isn't by faith alone?
Well, not to be unnecessarily unkind, but way back in the days when I got introduced to your debates Mr Shamoun, I always cringed at the how easily you insulted and threw jabs at your opponents...how you easily got personal and rancorous. I couldn't fathom that a genuine Christian could be doing that, even to atheists and Satanists. I'm kinda not too surprised at your drift. I pray you drop anchor as soon as possible, so that your journey doesn't arrive you at athesim
Great comment. God bless NGN!
One thought on Baptism:
What makes anyone think they were talking about water baptism? What did John the Baptist say: I baptize you with water, but he who comes after me will baptize you with fire and/even the Holy Spirit.
We know even the early church fathers got this wrong because of Acts 19 - John's water baptism did not save them.
Water baptism is important for Identification, we Identify with Christ just as Christ identified with us through baptism. It is an important step of obedience. But if there is only One baptism that matters for salvation, its got to be the fiery baptism of the Holy Spirit. Even Jesus taught Nikodemus that he was born of water and must also be born of the Spirit.
Not looking to argue.
It wouldn't surprise me if Sam Shamoun became a Muslim.
😂
I doubt he will ever become a Muslim...however, one requires discernment when listening to his anti-Protestant talks.
@@ephesians6124 sham shamoun is a Muslim destroyer
Sam adds to the scripture. Where does he pull these things? Water Baptism is a work then aren't we saved by faith in Christ works alone.