I've loved R4's since back when I had my little BX2350. I still run them but now it's on my B3350HSDC with the 72" belly mower and I must say they are great when I use the backhoe but when I mow, I really have to be careful because in tight turns on damp lawn the slightest wheel slip (which happens often with the heavy cab when I mow over uneven mounds in the yard) they'll dig a hole instantly or at least leave marks like a sand paddle just went over the grass. I make a lot of three point turns when mowing to save the lawn from my R4's during tight turns when it's damp. When it's dry though, there is no problem at all with the R4's on the lawn. Just offering my experiences.
Thanks! I'd be interested to see the results on wet grass and in mud. In both cases I think the R4 will make a bigger difference than this case... even in high range I suspect.
Cool test, however... you let the turf tires break lose before you engaged the dif lock, the started with the dif lock on the R4s, I would say that is unfair to the turf tires unless you move the tractor to a fresh patch of grass, then engage the dif lock and try it again. ;)
I'd agree, but kind of like spinning your tires on snow, once they "polish" the surface, they don't grip as well. I think your ultimate result would still be the same, but probably not as dramatic. I like the test though, and the difference between high and low range is also good info to have. two thumbs up!
Part of my wish list for a B 3350 is a set of R4 tires , ballast box ,and wheel weights. I've always thought the R4 tires were better than turfs , and I have no need for ag tires. Thanks Neil for confirming my thoughts.
As always, I love your videos. However, I agree with the other reviews. By the time you engaged the differential lock with the turf tire test, you already created small ruts by the tires that spun out, so I do not think there would have been as much of a difference in the test if you done both tractors with the defferential lock either engaged or unengaged. Depite your slightly unfair test, there was still very little diffence between the two types of tires. My dad chose the R4 tires option since he has a lot steeper yard to mow. Since I do all of his mowing, I find that my turf tires do not leave the deep cleat marks in softer ground that his R4 tires leave. Moreover, I find when my turf tires spin, his R4 tires spin also. The difference is the turf tires spins up the grass a little. When his R4 tires spin, it takes big hunks out of the ground. When the ground dries, I use my turf tire as a lawn roller to flatten the rut back out. If it is bad, I have to use my buket first to level the rut back out. I do the same thing with dad's tractor, but it leaves those deep cleat marks when finished. I personally just do not see any advntage of the R4 tires (maybe on larger tractors). The R4 tires do not hurt anything on harder ground though. I think it would be interesting to do the same test on softer ground and move the tractors to see the damage done to the turf with both types of tires.
You are funny. All you want to do is change a test where your preference of tire wins. There are pros and cons to all tires and people need to make their own choices for applications. You and your dad have different opinions can't you just accept that? Maybe not. Some people think they have to always be right even when they are not.
Dude, you guys are heaven sent for tractor owners. Where are y’all located? If it’s not too far I’d love to buy a tractor from y’all based on this wonderful library of videos. I’ve learned more about tractors from y’alls videos than anything.
I have R-4's on a BX-25 and turfs on a B3030. In my opinion, the R-4's are more suited if you are doing heavy loader work. I also think, because the BX-25 is a light tractor, it's tougher to ding lawns, even with R-4's.
Good video Neal. What would be really great for us is if you put this test back on your list for winter snow conditions and did it again but with a good snow surface come winter. That would be really helpful come winter. Cheers!
I know there is a big difference but 2vs4 wheel drive. This would help some of the old school people realize a 30hp 4x4 will do more than a 50hp 2 wheel drive. Thanks and good video 👍
Ideas for traction tests: BX vs B vs (the announced) LX vs L vs MX for a traction championship with R1, R3, R14T, R4? I mean, we're talking "Tractor Pr0n" anyway, right? :) Grade tests , vertical not across, with the different tires available? A snow/ice/slush test with the R14T over the coming winter?
I've heard a lot of people mention the compact sized tractors don't have enough weight for many tasks. Like you I think with some added rear weight it would make a huge difference, especially with using them for loader work....and I think that's what many use their compact tractors for? At least around where I live the loader is the most common attachment. 4WD without the diff-lock would provide quite a bit of additional ground traction, and having the diff-lock option just adds to that and may keep you unstuck LOL.
I got my JD 520 buried in the woods. Narrow fronts suck in mud. Dif lock might have helped bad i dont have one so i just ease on a brake. Id like to see ag tires vs r4 vs turf in something other than sod. Dirt maybe mud cause mud turf tires will load up and go slick
@@ciabra I use my B2650 (did have a BX2370) in a heavy clay soil and went with R4 tires for cutting grass and working the soil in a 2,700 sq/ft garden. Turf tires turn to slicks in the clay. The R1 or AG tires do great in dirt or clay cuz the cleats dig into the ground better giving it a better bite or grab when trying to pull a heavy implement thru the ground and get some work done but it tears into and tears up the ground doing it. In the snow however the AG tires are narrower so they cut thru the snow making contact with the ground easier. That can be good or bad. If there is concrete under the snow the tire will cut thru the snow to the concrete and just spin where the R4 is wider giving more surface contact so its better able to transfer its power to the ground. If there is dirt or gravel under the snow however the R1 or AG tire will do better cuz just like in the summer those lugs or cleats on the tire will dig into the ground better giving the tire a better bite. But just like in the summer its also going to tear into and tear up the ground more even if its under snow. So in the end it comes down to you and where you are going to use the tractor, what do you need it to do and how much you value your lawn.
Buying a tractor (L3301) from an Oregon Dealer this afternoon. Your videos were very informative and helped me decide Kubota was the right brand for us. I subscribed!
This was very well done 👍. Could I ask for a comparison of the same setup with addition of an R2 tire and put all three setups in some mud? This is where the difference in the Turf, Industrial, and AG tire really shine.
I have never had the R4 tires. I run ag tires on my L2501. My dealer told me that for my use that I wouldn't like the R4's. I have seen on You Tub e where guys have spied the R4's and they claim that it made a huge difference.
Wow...thanks for another great video! So many great posts...I bought a bx23s with R4 tires - live in area that is hilly and gets lots of snow in winter...glad I made the right call.
awesome test, exactly what i was looking for. however this exact test in snow would be even better; thats when most people start to have issues with traction. thanks !
That would be interesting to know as well. I think around 1,000lbs is what they say on them? I'd assume that is somewhat limited to the weight of the tractor and could change if you added rear weights? Or does the loader lift capacity always remain the same regardless of added counter weight and largely based on the tractor's overall weight & size?
Test the tractor light instead of heavy. Meaning without backhoe and maybe even without loader. In my opinion a tractor that can't break traction at the lowest available gear ratio is much heavier than it needs to be.
I’d also like to see a FEL test, but from typical load points like hooks on top of the bucket or Clevis hitch inside the bucket. All the manufacturers load test from the pivot point, but who lifts from that point honestly? Love your videos, and they are so informative.
Interesting test with expected results. What you should test is how the grass handles the different tires while driving, turning, and towing. I use my tractor in our yard and notice that the R4 tires tend to put indents in the ground if I am turning or the tractor has any resistance to moving such as pulling. Do the turf tires "rip up" the grass less under normal circumstances. Obviously, the answer is yes but to what extent is the question.
I would love to see this done on a less ideal surface. Some mud or even snow. Also please include r1 tires. It would also be interesting to show the three options on a zero turn. As well as show how bad they tear up the grass.
I have turf tires on a 4wd 24hp John Deere and it can pull much much better than our 80hp backhoe with only 2wd. A lot of times I exceed the 800 pound limit on the loader as it has so much grip to push.
I have owned several tractor with R4s and several with turfs. R4s are terrible in snow. I have turfs on the tractor I use for snow removal, they work much better.
I'm right near the Canadian boarder have always preferred turf tires on snow. I've always thought it was a matter of surface area on the slick ground, but I don't really know.
"Take the parking brake off". That's the only complaint I have with my b7500. I wish there was a light to indicate when I have the parking brake on. I can clearly hear it's on except when I'm wearing hearing protection then not so much.😞. A light for when the engine temp gets high would be a nice addition too.
You can use a pulley on the tractor to reduce force on the load cell by 1/2 extending its useful load to 6k. Cable from load cell, through pulley on tractor, back to static mount near load cell......
How does the ride compare between the Turf and R4s? I have a B3350 with R4s that has a very rough ride. Air pressures at minimum, liquid in the rears. It is a mowing tractor. I live in the sand-hills and need the extra traction. I run a Land Pride FDR 1672 and RCR 1260 with it.
First off, IMHO, R4's are like a jack of a trades, certainly master of none. They are terrible in snow, a turf works exactly like a modern day snow tire. They are terrible in mud and soft soil as they don't self clean, or bite nearly as well as an R1, and they still tear up your lawn. That being said, I would like to see this test redone using the locker right off the bat with the turfs, once you spun the tires, you loaded them up with grass, and disturbed the soil under them. I would love to see a comparision between brands and between models. I.E. Bx23 vs B2301. Bx vs GC vs Emax, etc. My B6100 has WAY more power than traction, even at 14hp.. It will spin the tires in 2nd gear high range at half throttle..
Jon V - Turfs are not just like a snow tire. They have no siping. If the tread fills up with snow, they no longer provide traction. I’ve used both R4 and turfs in snow, my experience is that turfs are worse. R4s are indeed a compromise tire, but a decent one. Better in dirt and mud than a turf, but not as hard on the ground as R1 tires. And as for the locker, they really don’t engage until a tire spins anyway.
You have your opinion, I have mine. I realize they have no siping, my point is that they have many more biting edges than an r1 or r4, which is my comparison to a snow tire. I've plowed with tractors since I was tall enough to reach the pedals, I'll stick with my turfs. If you you engage the locker before you need it and roll the tractor some, they do engage before a tire a spins. May be a small difference but I would still like to see the results.
I bought my BX23S with the R4 tires, but with continuously hauling heavy loads in the bucket, the front tires developed sidewall damage and blew out, even though they were always kept at recommended pressure. So, I went with 10ply skid steer tires of the same size. Have you heard of this causing issues with the front axle or knuckle?
Excellent video, how about the same comparison on different surfaces like gravel and dirt. Thanks you for the education you provide in your videos. I recently bought a bx23s with R4’s and have had some traction problems on wet clay
Now that we have snow on the ground, can we see the same test with snow covered ground? I've gotten a lot of opinions but facts would be great. Plus when I buy my new B model, I'll know what I want. Thanks.
What does NOT get good traction on flat and dry ground? Thanks for the test, but someone on the fence about which tire to choose is obviously going to be doing more than using their machine as a lawn mower on only the driest of days. They are going to be using it to get some tilling/plowing/digging/grading done in loose soil...., but can they get the work done with turf tires, or not?
So I have a older b6200 with turf tires I was looking to find some agricultural tires so I can get better traction so my question is are their still tires available for my tractor and will the newer tractor rims with tires fit on my older tractor?
It was never going to be good starting in high range. Restarting the turf test in the same spot meant starting on a slipperier spot. B for effort, though.
Just picked up a new MX5800 w/ FEL and 3 sets of Kubota wheel weights. 1300lb rotary cutter on the back...will she lift a pallet with 2,000lbs out of the back of a pickup truck?
metallica2000sm: Probably not. The loader is rated for about 2200lbs at the pins, but only about 1600 at the bucket mid-point. If you’re using forks, most are heavier than the bucket further decreasing your capacity.
Sort of what I'd expect. My forks are only 330lbs or so. My bucket is heavy duty and is around 450. I'd be using the pallet forks to try and lift a pallet of wood pellets in the winter. I would be curious if you try to lift something that won't move - do you risk blowing a hose / seal or is there safety bypass to just let the hydro fluid circulate and avoid damage?
Turf tires in 4wd mowing have plenty of traction. If you’re slipping you shouldn’t be mowing. Turf tires tear up less turf. R4 tires are bell on a yard if in 4wd. You gotta slow down on turns more. Good test. I have R4 on mine because I do work besides mowing and if I tear up some yard so be it.
I am looking to buy a tractor but my primary purpose is to cut the 5 acres i live on. U want to shorten my work load and am not sure what will work best.....tractor/zero turn. Can you do a grass cutting test based on speed and cut quality?
You lost traction before locking the dif on the turf tires leaving slick ground under the tires. But did not do the same on the r4 tires. The result may be the same who knows. But the buyer for turf tires probably is not using for heavy-duty work. I have turf tires on my BX2670 I use it to cut grass and with a box blade maintain a 1000ft gravel driveway. I do plan on getting a front end loader attachment and when I do I'll be ordering new tires and wheels r4 of course. :-) p.s. my turf tires never slip even on gravel I just go slow.
Same test but instead of grass, do it in the winter time with a blower instead of a backhoe. My Kubota dealer tell me turf tire are better during winter months that R4
Do the same test but with a BX2680 with some ballast since it doesn't have the backhoe. I've found I run out of traction long before I run out of capability with my BX2680...not enough weight, it'll spin all 4's in many cases before I really reach its limits....although better to spin the tires in some cases than possibly break things I guess LOL.
At first I was thinking that as well, but I think he essentially 'did' do the test the same. Keep in mind that unless he locked them on the approach to that spot, they don't lock until one spins and aligns with the locking pin. Also, in a high load-up scenario like that, spin the tires very slowly when trying to lock the diff until it slips in. Spin them fast loaded up and you'll snap that locking pin.
My last tractor had ag tires but my new Kubota B2650 has the R4s. I was worried that they may not be aggressive enough for working around the place but they haven't failed me yet.
Neil, love the videos... Looking to configure a BX23S I've owned quite a few BXs starting from the 2200 have recycled them every five years to help 3 of my nephews get started with Kubota’s. Instead of Trading in sold to them @ a very reasonable price. My question, which tire selection R 4 or 14s, 90% of what I do is mow. 2 1/2 acres some bucket work BX23S plan is at least three stump removals and one 30 foot ditch. so your personal opinion, on which tires to outfit the BX23S with?
Would have liked to see a test of a couple of machines with each tire. There’s enough variation in builds even on an assembly line the tranny pressures on new machines may not be the same just because of lack of wear-in or any number of variants. But over all nice test.
I'm curious to see where the pressure relief valve spring is set from one tractor to the next. If both tests were done exact same tractor, you might get different results, thanks for the video
How about the ground compression between the 2 types of tires?can you do a satisfactory job cutting a finish lawn with the r4 tire? thanks for the great videos !
Turf tire diff lock test invalid after wheel spin, need fresh grass. After spinning tires you are ripping grass apart and releasing the fluids in the grass. I called the diff lock not giving a higher reading as soon as I saw you didn't move the tractor.
i noticed that when you had the turf tires and spun them the first time, when you did the test with the diff lock on and turf tires they spun right away. i think due to the spinning the first time on the grass and getting those 2 tires in the dirt skewed the results a little. i think you'd have gotten a little different result, maybe not that much but still different. also, i noticed in one of your videos talking about hydro transmissions (you were talking about using a loader) and the slower speed on the pedal was like putting a manual in 1st gear and that you shouldn't press to higher speed because it reduces torque (while scooping into a pile). i noticed you were going all the way (fast, forward) with this test. is there an advantage going all the way forward?
Just curious as to what damage a test like this would do to the Hydrostatic Transmission. On a Manual shift that clutch would be screaming if it didnt stall the engine beforehand.
In the high range test, if neither set of tires broke loose, the turf tires should have had a slight advantage as (I believe) their diameter is less, yet that didn't happen. I think tractor #2 has better power.
Test ride quality on bx 2380 with valve kit and 60" mower between turf tires and industrial lug tires. I have 1 with turf tires and it is a bouncy ride. Will r4 tires make a difference in ride quality? Lot different between b 2601 ride with turf tires and bx 2380.
Good video, but I felt this test was abusive to the tractor. Lugging the engine to the point of black smoke due to overfueling and straining the hydros like that is not operating with “mechanical sympathy.” Granted it was brief.
This notthing yet! In the factory they do a endtest! To check it to the max if you see the smoke over there coming from the exhaust then youre scarred! I would recommend to do this when the engine is warm and not at coldstart! I would buy this bx23s if i needed it cause it performed like a boss! That,s the Kubota quality!
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I've loved R4's since back when I had my little BX2350. I still run them but now it's on my B3350HSDC with the 72" belly mower and I must say they are great when I use the backhoe but when I mow, I really have to be careful because in tight turns on damp lawn the slightest wheel slip (which happens often with the heavy cab when I mow over uneven mounds in the yard) they'll dig a hole instantly or at least leave marks like a sand paddle just went over the grass. I make a lot of three point turns when mowing to save the lawn from my R4's during tight turns when it's damp. When it's dry though, there is no problem at all with the R4's on the lawn. Just offering my experiences.
Thanks! I'd be interested to see the results on wet grass and in mud. In both cases I think the R4 will make a bigger difference than this case... even in high range I suspect.
Cool test, however... you let the turf tires break lose before you engaged the dif lock, the started with the dif lock on the R4s, I would say that is unfair to the turf tires unless you move the tractor to a fresh patch of grass, then engage the dif lock and try it again. ;)
I did do diff lock with turfs. It did not give me a better result though.
But you locked it after spinning your tires, that patch of grass is now shot. Move tractor to new spot, lock diff and retest.
I'd agree, but kind of like spinning your tires on snow, once they "polish" the surface, they don't grip as well. I think your ultimate result would still be the same, but probably not as dramatic. I like the test though, and the difference between high and low range is also good info to have. two thumbs up!
I was thinking that too.
I have the same tractor with a 60" mower and I mow my yard without any issues or damage to grass. I highly recommend r4 tires
Part of my wish list for a B 3350 is a set of R4 tires , ballast box ,and wheel weights. I've always thought the R4 tires were better than turfs , and I have no need for ag tires. Thanks Neil for confirming my thoughts.
As always, I love your videos. However, I agree with the other reviews. By the time you engaged the differential lock with the turf tire test, you already created small ruts by the tires that spun out, so I do not think there would have been as much of a difference in the test if you done both tractors with the defferential lock either engaged or unengaged. Depite your slightly unfair test, there was still very little diffence between the two types of tires. My dad chose the R4 tires option since he has a lot steeper yard to mow. Since I do all of his mowing, I find that my turf tires do not leave the deep cleat marks in softer ground that his R4 tires leave. Moreover, I find when my turf tires spin, his R4 tires spin also. The difference is the turf tires spins up the grass a little. When his R4 tires spin, it takes big hunks out of the ground. When the ground dries, I use my turf tire as a lawn roller to flatten the rut back out. If it is bad, I have to use my buket first to level the rut back out. I do the same thing with dad's tractor, but it leaves those deep cleat marks when finished. I personally just do not see any advntage of the R4 tires (maybe on larger tractors). The R4 tires do not hurt anything on harder ground though. I think it would be interesting to do the same test on softer ground and move the tractors to see the damage done to the turf with both types of tires.
You are funny. All you want to do is change a test where your preference of tire wins. There are pros and cons to all tires and people need to make their own choices for applications. You and your dad have different opinions can't you just accept that? Maybe not. Some people think they have to always be right even when they are not.
Dude, you guys are heaven sent for tractor owners. Where are y’all located? If it’s not too far I’d love to buy a tractor from y’all based on this wonderful library of videos. I’ve learned more about tractors from y’alls videos than anything.
Pennsylvania. See messicks.com
I have R-4's on a BX-25 and turfs on a B3030. In my opinion, the R-4's are more suited if you are doing heavy loader work. I also think, because the BX-25 is a light tractor, it's tougher to ding lawns, even with R-4's.
Good video Neal. What would be really great for us is if you put this test back on your list for winter snow conditions and did it again but with a good snow surface come winter. That would be really helpful come winter. Cheers!
I know there is a big difference but 2vs4 wheel drive. This would help some of the old school people realize a 30hp 4x4 will do more than a 50hp 2 wheel drive. Thanks and good video 👍
Ideas for traction tests:
BX vs B vs (the announced) LX vs L vs MX for a traction championship with R1, R3, R14T, R4?
I mean, we're talking "Tractor Pr0n" anyway, right? :)
Grade tests , vertical not across, with the different tires available?
A snow/ice/slush test with the R14T over the coming winter?
I've heard a lot of people mention the compact sized tractors don't have enough weight for many tasks. Like you I think with some added rear weight it would make a huge difference, especially with using them for loader work....and I think that's what many use their compact tractors for? At least around where I live the loader is the most common attachment. 4WD without the diff-lock would provide quite a bit of additional ground traction, and having the diff-lock option just adds to that and may keep you unstuck LOL.
I got my JD 520 buried in the woods. Narrow fronts suck in mud. Dif lock might have helped bad i dont have one so i just ease on a brake.
Id like to see ag tires vs r4 vs turf in something other than sod. Dirt maybe mud cause mud turf tires will load up and go slick
Great Job Neil , I work for kubota in Ontario, Canada I find all your videos very useful keep doing what you do brother .
Love to see the same test (with a higher capacity load cell) of the b2650, and including ag tires.
Thanks for all the great videos. Professionally done and very informative. I'm binge watching a ton of them.
I switched from ag tires to R4's on my BX23s and it made a huge difference. Thanks for the official test!
Tom McHugh a huge difference in which way? Are ag tires better or not on dirt vs r4. How about muddy, wet condition? Thx
@@ciabra I use my B2650 (did have a BX2370) in a heavy clay soil and went with R4 tires for cutting grass and working the soil in a 2,700 sq/ft garden. Turf tires turn to slicks in the clay. The R1 or AG tires do great in dirt or clay cuz the cleats dig into the ground better giving it a better bite or grab when trying to pull a heavy implement thru the ground and get some work done but it tears into and tears up the ground doing it. In the snow however the AG tires are narrower so they cut thru the snow making contact with the ground easier. That can be good or bad. If there is concrete under the snow the tire will cut thru the snow to the concrete and just spin where the R4 is wider giving more surface contact so its better able to transfer its power to the ground. If there is dirt or gravel under the snow however the R1 or AG tire will do better cuz just like in the summer those lugs or cleats on the tire will dig into the ground better giving the tire a better bite. But just like in the summer its also going to tear into and tear up the ground more even if its under snow. So in the end it comes down to you and where you are going to use the tractor, what do you need it to do and how much you value your lawn.
@@andysworld2188 Thanks for the detailed answer. I'll go with R4.
I used to garden tractor pull and had better luck with turf tires than lug tires, on hard pack track of course. Thanks Neil!
Buying a tractor (L3301) from an Oregon Dealer this afternoon. Your videos were very informative and helped me decide Kubota was the right brand for us. I subscribed!
This was very well done 👍. Could I ask for a comparison of the same setup with addition of an R2 tire and put all three setups in some mud? This is where the difference in the Turf, Industrial, and AG tire really shine.
This is the best tractor Channel.
I would also like to see R4 tires tested against R1 tires. You need a bigger measuring stick 😁
I have never had the R4 tires. I run ag tires on my L2501. My dealer told me that for my use that I wouldn't like the R4's. I have seen on You Tub e where guys have spied the R4's and they claim that it made a huge difference.
Wow...thanks for another great video! So many great posts...I bought a bx23s with R4 tires - live in area that is hilly and gets lots of snow in winter...glad I made the right call.
awesome test, exactly what i was looking for. however this exact test in snow would be even better; thats when most people start to have issues with traction. thanks !
Do a loader lift with the Load cell and see if the specs match up with that
I strongly concur. I would love to see the lift capacity of some of these machines, especially the L and Grand L series machines.
That would be interesting to know as well. I think around 1,000lbs is what they say on them? I'd assume that is somewhat limited to the weight of the tractor and could change if you added rear weights? Or does the loader lift capacity always remain the same regardless of added counter weight and largely based on the tractor's overall weight & size?
Yes please. Loader lift.
Yep lift it and see how much down force it can do also.
Also interested in loader lift capacity
Love the tutorials. Played a large part in our selection of tractor for our farm. Thank you. Keep up the amazing work. We purchased the L 2051 4wd
Hey Neil,
Thanks for another great video. I always look forward to seeing them. 🤠
Can we get an AG tire test?
That would fill out the options. I'd guess at this point we'd max the load cell just like we did with R4's.
Messick Farm Equipment I went with AG on my MX 4800. Got 95 acres, figured I’d need a good set of digs.
Test the tractor light instead of heavy. Meaning without backhoe and maybe even without loader. In my opinion a tractor that can't break traction at the lowest available gear ratio is much heavier than it needs to be.
I’d also like to see a FEL test, but from typical load points like hooks on top of the bucket or Clevis hitch inside the bucket. All the manufacturers load test from the pivot point, but who lifts from that point honestly? Love your videos, and they are so informative.
You certainly know how to show/sell...i would buy...
I hope kubota pays you for these great videos, you are responsible for at least 5 kubota sales that I know of..
sean peterson 6.....
he is trying to sell tractors,, he gets paid when people buy one... but they are still interesting videos
Interesting test with expected results. What you should test is how the grass handles the different tires while driving, turning, and towing. I use my tractor in our yard and notice that the R4 tires tend to put indents in the ground if I am turning or the tractor has any resistance to moving such as pulling. Do the turf tires "rip up" the grass less under normal circumstances. Obviously, the answer is yes but to what extent is the question.
Kind of hard to quantify.
I would love to see this done on a less ideal surface. Some mud or even snow. Also please include r1 tires. It would also be interesting to show the three options on a zero turn. As well as show how bad they tear up the grass.
Maybe do the same test next time it snows. Some people claim turf tires are better in snow then the R4's. I only have R4's, so i don't really know.
I have turf tires on a 4wd 24hp John Deere and it can pull much much better than our 80hp backhoe with only 2wd. A lot of times I exceed the 800 pound limit on the loader as it has so much grip to push.
Danny Hancock i have been told that as well
I have owned several tractor with R4s and several with turfs. R4s are terrible in snow. I have turfs on the tractor I use for snow removal, they work much better.
Turf is a softer tire, not as much rubber and can contact the ground better when frozen.
I'm right near the Canadian boarder have always preferred turf tires on snow. I've always thought it was a matter of surface area on the slick ground, but I don't really know.
Thanks for what you do Neil.
"Take the parking brake off". That's the only complaint I have with my b7500. I wish there was a light to indicate when I have the parking brake on. I can clearly hear it's on except when I'm wearing hearing protection then not so much.😞. A light for when the engine temp gets high would be a nice addition too.
What about tire durability? Is the R4 more resistant to rock damage?
You can use a pulley on the tractor to reduce force on the load cell by 1/2 extending its useful load to 6k. Cable from load cell, through pulley on tractor, back to static mount near load cell......
Would like to see this type test with Ag Tires vs R4's in something like an MX or M5660. Even an L4701 or grand L would be interesting.
How does the ride compare between the Turf and R4s? I have a B3350 with R4s that has a very rough ride. Air pressures at minimum, liquid in the rears. It is a mowing tractor. I live in the sand-hills and need the extra traction. I run a Land Pride FDR 1672 and RCR 1260 with it.
Have you ever done a backhoe lift test.
I am looking for a small tractor to build a retaining wall if the how can pick them up an place them/.
Another great video. I have learned SO much from you guys.
First off, IMHO, R4's are like a jack of a trades, certainly master of none. They are terrible in snow, a turf works exactly like a modern day snow tire. They are terrible in mud and soft soil as they don't self clean, or bite nearly as well as an R1, and they still tear up your lawn.
That being said, I would like to see this test redone using the locker right off the bat with the turfs, once you spun the tires, you loaded them up with grass, and disturbed the soil under them. I would love to see a comparision between brands and between models. I.E. Bx23 vs B2301. Bx vs GC vs Emax, etc.
My B6100 has WAY more power than traction, even at 14hp.. It will spin the tires in 2nd gear high range at half throttle..
Jon V - Turfs are not just like a snow tire. They have no siping. If the tread fills up with snow, they no longer provide traction. I’ve used both R4 and turfs in snow, my experience is that turfs are worse. R4s are indeed a compromise tire, but a decent one. Better in dirt and mud than a turf, but not as hard on the ground as R1 tires. And as for the locker, they really don’t engage until a tire spins anyway.
You have your opinion, I have mine. I realize they have no siping, my point is that they have many more biting edges than an r1 or r4, which is my comparison to a snow tire. I've plowed with tractors since I was tall enough to reach the pedals, I'll stick with my turfs. If you you engage the locker before you need it and roll the tractor some, they do engage before a tire a spins. May be a small difference but I would still like to see the results.
I bought my BX23S with the R4 tires, but with continuously hauling heavy loads in the bucket, the front tires developed sidewall damage and blew out, even though they were always kept at recommended pressure. So, I went with 10ply skid steer tires of the same size. Have you heard of this causing issues with the front axle or knuckle?
As long as the tires and the same size, and the rolling radius did not change, you won't have a problem
My turf tires do well in the snow. I expected the tread to pack, but it does not.
Excellent video, how about the same comparison on different surfaces like gravel and dirt. Thanks you for the education you provide in your videos. I recently bought a bx23s with R4’s and have had some traction problems on wet clay
Now that we have snow on the ground, can we see the same test with snow covered ground? I've gotten a lot of opinions but facts would be great. Plus when I buy my new B model, I'll know what I want. Thanks.
what about the Farm tires--are they a better fit if I only have dirt and no grass??? I'm leaning to R4 but have some slopes to go up
What does NOT get good traction on flat and dry ground? Thanks for the test, but someone on the fence about which tire to choose is obviously going to be doing more than using their machine as a lawn mower on only the driest of days. They are going to be using it to get some tilling/plowing/digging/grading done in loose soil...., but can they get the work done with turf tires, or not?
So I have a older b6200 with turf tires I was looking to find some agricultural tires so I can get better traction so my question is are their still tires available for my tractor and will the newer tractor rims with tires fit on my older tractor?
It was never going to be good starting in high range.
Restarting the turf test in the same spot meant starting on a slipperier spot.
B for effort, though.
Just picked up a new MX5800 w/ FEL and 3 sets of Kubota wheel weights. 1300lb rotary cutter on the back...will she lift a pallet with 2,000lbs out of the back of a pickup truck?
metallica2000sm:
Probably not. The loader is rated for about 2200lbs at the pins, but only about 1600 at the bucket mid-point. If you’re using forks, most are heavier than the bucket further decreasing your capacity.
Sort of what I'd expect. My forks are only 330lbs or so. My bucket is heavy duty and is around 450. I'd be using the pallet forks to try and lift a pallet of wood pellets in the winter. I would be curious if you try to lift something that won't move - do you risk blowing a hose / seal or is there safety bypass to just let the hydro fluid circulate and avoid damage?
Turf tires in 4wd mowing have plenty of traction. If you’re slipping you shouldn’t be mowing. Turf tires tear up less turf. R4 tires are bell on a yard if in 4wd. You gotta slow down on turns more. Good test. I have R4 on mine because I do work besides mowing and if I tear up some yard so be it.
I would like to see how the AG tires do in this test, or some feedback on your thoughts on AG tires.
I am looking to buy a tractor but my primary purpose is to cut the 5 acres i live on. U want to shorten my work load and am not sure what will work best.....tractor/zero turn. Can you do a grass cutting test based on speed and cut quality?
Pretty much, a quality zero turn will out preform any tractor... But all it does is mow.
You lost traction before locking the dif on the turf tires leaving slick ground under the tires. But did not do the same on the r4 tires. The result may be the same who knows. But the buyer for turf tires probably is not using for heavy-duty work. I have turf tires on my BX2670 I use it to cut grass and with a box blade maintain a 1000ft gravel driveway. I do plan on getting a front end loader attachment and when I do I'll be ordering new tires and wheels r4 of course. :-) p.s. my turf tires never slip even on gravel I just go slow.
Same test but instead of grass, do it in the winter time with a blower instead of a backhoe.
My Kubota dealer tell me turf tire are better during winter months that R4
Sorry I just saw that you did this test already, Great job Neal.
how do they compare on ice or packed snow ?
Do the same test but with a BX2680 with some ballast since it doesn't have the backhoe. I've found I run out of traction long before I run out of capability with my BX2680...not enough weight, it'll spin all 4's in many cases before I really reach its limits....although better to spin the tires in some cases than possibly break things I guess LOL.
No diff lock turf tires spun creating a slick area with plant juice.
Should have done the same thing with the other tractor.
At first I was thinking that as well, but I think he essentially 'did' do the test the same. Keep in mind that unless he locked them on the approach to that spot, they don't lock until one spins and aligns with the locking pin. Also, in a high load-up scenario like that, spin the tires very slowly when trying to lock the diff until it slips in. Spin them fast loaded up and you'll snap that locking pin.
My last tractor had ag tires but my new Kubota B2650 has the R4s. I was worried that they may not be aggressive enough for working around the place but they haven't failed me yet.
If you use a pully your loadcell vam meseur up to 6000 ponds, than you can get a proper number for the r4's
Neil, love the videos... Looking to configure a BX23S I've owned quite a few BXs starting from the 2200 have recycled them every five years to help 3 of my nephews get started with Kubota’s. Instead of Trading in sold to them @ a very reasonable price. My question, which tire selection R 4 or 14s, 90% of what I do is mow. 2 1/2 acres some bucket work BX23S plan is at least three stump removals and one 30 foot ditch. so your personal opinion, on which tires to outfit the BX23S with?
Turf? R4 probably.
Would have liked to see a test of a couple of machines with each tire. There’s enough variation in builds even on an assembly line the tranny pressures on new machines may not be the same just because of lack of wear-in or any number of variants. But over all nice test.
How about a tug o war 🙃
This was interesting. My R4's aren't very good on snow and ice. And chains cost a lot.
You need to test r1 vs r4s. Great videos.
I'm curious to see where the pressure relief valve spring is set from one tractor to the next. If both tests were done exact same tractor, you might get different results, thanks for the video
Do the same test on different surfaces such as asphalt, snow with no ice ,glare ice and hard-packed dirt or gravel
How about the ground compression between the 2 types of tires?can you do a satisfactory job cutting a finish lawn with the r4 tire? thanks for the great videos !
Not an issue for the load cell but is there a way to drop the three point without dropping the mower deck on a bx23s
Turf tire diff lock test invalid after wheel spin, need fresh grass. After spinning tires you are ripping grass apart and releasing the fluids in the grass. I called the diff lock not giving a higher reading as soon as I saw you didn't move the tractor.
GREAT test Neil!
Can you do some snow tests? I ordered an 1880 with a front blower and the kick ass tires.
You should do this test without all the ballast. That would be interesting!
I got a jd4200 with loader and turf tires and I like them only thing that I don’t like is the service from my John Deere dealership AHW
I would love to see this test with the b2401
I'd like to see this same test done on snow. Like to see which tires have more traction on it.
i noticed that when you had the turf tires and spun them the first time, when you did the test with the diff lock on and turf tires they spun right away. i think due to the spinning the first time on the grass and getting those 2 tires in the dirt skewed the results a little. i think you'd have gotten a little different result, maybe not that much but still different. also, i noticed in one of your videos talking about hydro transmissions (you were talking about using a loader) and the slower speed on the pedal was like putting a manual in 1st gear and that you shouldn't press to higher speed because it reduces torque (while scooping into a pile). i noticed you were going all the way (fast, forward) with this test. is there an advantage going all the way forward?
The intent with a pedal was to push over the transmissions relief point.
Repeat test on tractor only or with just a mower
Great test Neil!
Would it be possible to do the same test under a variety of conditions. Ideally compare 3 types of tyres.
Great job once again Neil!
Just curious as to what damage a test like this would do to the Hydrostatic Transmission. On a Manual shift that clutch would be screaming if it didnt stall the engine beforehand.
Relief valve goes over. Happens every time you bury the tractor in a pile of dirt. No harm.
@@MessicksEquip Thank you for the Super quick Reply
If your doing any digging, turf tires are worthless if the ground is wet and muddy. They turn into slicks real fast.
For snow removal (I did it professionally for mor than 3 decades in New England) turf tires are way better than R4's.
In the high range test, if neither set of tires broke loose, the turf tires should have had a slight advantage as (I believe) their diameter is less, yet that didn't happen. I think tractor #2 has better power.
How much the loader can actually lift at different rpms.
I like my turf tries on my jd 420 HST tractor with the loader
Thank you!
maybe You can compare other tractor Brands that way . Nice Videos.
Bigger load cell! Ag vs r4! Yay engineering!
Loader lift test with the chain at different legths to see what the lifting power is with the arms all the way up vs all the way down
Test ride quality on bx 2380 with valve kit and 60" mower between turf tires and industrial lug tires. I have 1 with turf tires and it is a bouncy ride. Will r4 tires make a difference in ride quality? Lot different between b 2601 ride with turf tires and bx 2380.
small tires on a BX won't ride like a bigger tractor does. You could try dropping the PSI.
Messick Farm Equipment that was my 1st option b4 tire change.
Great job Neal!
Good video, but I felt this test was abusive to the tractor. Lugging the engine to the point of black smoke due to overfueling and straining the hydros like that is not operating with “mechanical sympathy.” Granted it was brief.
Yea I wouldn't be happy to buy either of those tractors and then find out that was done to them.
This notthing yet! In the factory they do a endtest! To check it to the max if you see the smoke over there coming from the exhaust then youre scarred! I would recommend to do this when the engine is warm and not at coldstart! I would buy this bx23s if i needed it cause it performed like a boss! That,s the Kubota quality!
next time can you test it in the snow?
been waiting for the right day to do that
can you do a video on breaking a rusted clutch loose.
I’d like to borrow your load cell to weigh my old lady but I saw where it maxed out.
Can a mx5200 be turned up to mx5800