PART TWO - Models Aren't Worth Their Asking Price!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 พ.ย. 2023
- #Photography #PortraitPhotography #PhotographyForBeginners
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In part two of this five part interview, I talk about the rates that models are setting these days and how they may not be worth their asking price.
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I said it on the previous post. Social media has really inflated people's feelings of worth. I 100% agree, if I'm paying for the session. 1 be on time! 2 know how to pose your body. I will help instruct adjustments when needed, but if you just stand there and want me to direct every inch, that will be the last time we work together. Pretty? Have a cell phone and a skimpy outfit? Boom you too are a model now. Congratulations!
That said, there are real models that are worth high fees, but the problem is they ALL think they need to get those fees off the block. I hate to tell someone they aren't worth their rate as I'm sure there are people that think I'm too high. But If I just picked up a T4i and have no portfolio, you'd be right to say so.
Another side of the coin is there are a lot of "photographers" that are really just a dude with a camera who wants to shoot pretty women. Many of the models that are working today are catering to those types. I work with nude models often and I reached out to one model that listed on her Model Mayhem that she works nude. I asked her nude rate, and she said she only does nude for "private libraries". Any work I shoot will eventually end up on my website, art gallery, coffee table book, etc. I'm not shooting just to have private photos, but as a model you can make a living catering to these types.
I also know photographers that publicly state they will never pay for a model. I think that's misguided as well. You should never have a problem with paying an artist for their service. The problem is not many IG "models" are actually artists.
"dude with a camera", I speak on this in part four dropping on Saturday! But I agree with everything you've said my guy, very well said!
That was the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Reliability is also a major factor...on time every time and ready to work the whole time.
Reliability, I'll be speaking heavily on that in part three dropping tomorrow!
Ha, social media has distorted many into thinking they’re actual experts / pros with no formal training or longevity: Chefs, Hairstylists, Consultants, Detectives, Actors…
You are so doggone right about that! It's literally impossible to go through comments without seeing many of these "experts" lol.
As a former photographer who is now running a business in the world of video, I'm so glad I don't have to deal with this anymore. I find this whole conflict between models and photographers to be one giant race to the bottom. Models think that they can scale a full time income off of hobbyist photographers that are barely affording their camera gear and photographers with inflated egos think that they can nickel and dime broke college girls on instagram.
I cannot argue against anything you said here @SnapsByLuis! BTW, I love your work!
Broke down and hired a model, an international traveling model with a ton of creds. Worth every penny! You want to know the worst thing about the FB model "wannabes" is that they can't even bother to respond to photogs reaching out. It speaks to a larger problem of "the scene", overall, dying. We don't have girls wanting to play Goddess anymore, we have "Goddesses" considering being girls once in a while (and choosing not to). That said, not everyone is worth 150/hr but they saw that was the going rate so that's what they've decided they're worth. Most of these should be looking for 50-75 tops. As a hobbyist I bought the clubs, I realize I might still have to pay for tee-time.
I agree, that $50-75/hr range is definitely where a lot of these models should be, and I would near zero reservation in hiring a model at that rate, even if they weren't experienced or that great at posing. But once you break the $100 mark, there's a certain level of skill you need to be bringing to the table, and many show up to the shoot without it. I tend to look for reels and tagged content of models I want to work with; I want to see how they conduct themselves on a shoot. Seeing the finished product is cool, it at least lets me know they're working with professional photographers, but I'm more interested in what they do while at the shoot.
You hit the nail right on the head Anthony. Great video.
Thank you Brad, much appreciated!
I am a hobbyist photographer who has second shot with my daughter who is a professional photographer. The issue of getting what you pay for transcends photography some people out here want you to pay filet mignon prices and get a damn happy meal
This seems to be the rule nowadays versus the exception. I remember the days where everyone worked hard, they earned their dollar, now it seems no matter what establishment I go in, everyone moves in a lackadaisical manner and no one takes pride in their work anymore. It's sad to see where things are in general, and definitely within the photography space.
Anthony, thank you for your video, you are the best among all youtube's photo blogs. I really like and dig your opinion and your point of view - it is very smart and wisdomly/ Sorry for my eng
Thank you so much @NekroExtravaganza I very much appreciate the kind words!!
honest conversation ,peace
I appreciate it fam!
Awesome video. You rock!
Thank you so much Agnetha!
At one point id only pay models through agencies but lately i have paid "solopenuers." Unpaid gigs seem to require too much personality are start feeling a bit "datey." Biggest issue is sometimes i want to pay for elaborate sets or wardrobe that both of us would get value from even if they just create bts with their phone. And also too your point, so often they cant pose or follow directions, they just want to stand there and look cute. I get that everyone is allowed to set the price that their willing to leave their house for but lets be realistic, we can look at the profile and tell if a model is really booking 200/hr gigs.
And I'm trending towards the opposite, thinking I want to start leaning on agencies (am definitely curious to know why you transitioned away from it.) Out of curiosity, when you create those elaborate sets, what are you intending to get out of it? What are you hoping to get in return? And I agree, everyone absolutely is free to set their own price, but don't expect people to pay just because it's what YOU feel you're worth. For the amount of effort I put into every client shoot, I should be making a grand for a portrait session, but very few people would be willing to pay that so I'm not going to stubbornly price it at that anyway and get, maybe, a handful of clients a year.
@AnthonyToglife I swayed from agencies when I moved to a different city and lost the connections plus It started feeling like a job (low paying) when I became the "house photographer." I didn't really want to put in the effort of coordinating for them at the rate they where paying so I decided to go straight to the source and find some "model hopefuls." I mostly just shoot for fun and learning, and don't have time to market so my goal is to shoot stunning images that might attract the right clients (for now). Also I don't actually create the sets I find them on peerspace which can be pricey to end up with a flake or a novice. To be fair I'm still learning also, but my coffee table is full of books and I spend hours on TH-cam studying the craft, I feel that its ok to expect the same from the model
@@droe90 gotcha, that makes sense about the agency. As to the stunning images, definitely shoot the type of stuff you want to attract. There's nothing worse than devoting your time to the craft but it be things that aren't what you actually want to get hired for. It's cool to photograph whatever you want, but post what you want to attract.
I love this Netflix docudrama look you have gong on
Very contrasty 😎
My models are my 4 and 8yr olds.. I can take about 4-5 photos with each in an attempt to capture my concept before I've lost their attention and they run off 😅
Hahaha, that made me laugh. There’s no better practice than trying to work with children. When they say “you’ve got 15 seconds to get the shot” that’s exactly what they mean, lol.
I appreciate the comment on the look. The whole thing was intentional, and I’m gonna drop a video on the whole setup on Monday next week. I have three more parts to drop first.
@@AnthonyToglifeyou really hit it out of the park with the design of this series. Plus, your insight is eye opening.
Every photographer should watch this video. Many girls believe they are models because they have a huge amount of followers, but they don't know how to pose. I thinkk it's ok if you charge for publicity, a mention or somenthing like that, but charging for modeling and don't be able to strike a pose... I don't know. Thanks for the video. Greetings from Colombia.
@leomartinezcol for the record, I agree with you 100%! Their following is often irrelevant for a plethora of reasons: 1) their followers usually aren’t in line with yours 2) followers are often inflated/fake (backed by the fact they’ll have hundreds of thousands of followers yet their post has sub-100 likes/very little engagement and 3) followers don’t guarantee money or future business. Apparently these days you’re paying models for their following, not actual skill. 🤷🏾♂️ Sad world we’re living in.
So true
I am on model mayhem and I get random messages from models wirj their rates
I will respond with my rates
They run for the door.
I hear you on the on experience models with the high rates.
On a separate note
What to you think about that 24-105 2.8
Man, I didn't know Model Mayhem was still around, lol. I was on there a LONG time ago, but never put much effort into it. Do you feel there's still value over there?