That line always bothered me because Roger fought in the Pacific Theatre and was used to seeing his friends die by the squadron-load, more or less. He knows exactly what it’s like to lose people who were important to him.
Von Straugg I think it’s implied she meant a celebrity, someone who abstractly represents your self concept whom you project yourself onto and identify with. It’s not about grieving someone you knew, it’s about grieving what they represented for you. She knows Marilyn in so far as how they experienced life in a similar way, and for Marilyn to die is for her to see the tragedy in her own life, I think
I have lost people I loved. I lost my baby sister and my father. He was murdered. I lost my grandmothers, grandfathers, aunts, cousins, etc. I didn't say I didn't admire or didn't care for Marilyn Monroe. I ONLY said no one around me cried when Marilyn died. I did like her very much. I don't throw the 'LOVE" word around on everyone. REAL love is with people we mingle with. Have real relationships with. We often fall in love with an image. Even myself. But, I LOVE those in my life. Some people need to understand what LOVE really is. It's not an image. When Robin Williams committed suicide, that hurt me deeply. I cared for him as an actor. But, LOVE we throw that word around too much.
Peggy says, "We're lucky Playtex didn't go for that Jackie-Marilyn campaign. We'd have to pull everything indefinitely". That really happened when Natalie Wood died. Miss Wood was the spokeswoman for Covergirl cosmetics and at the time of her death Natalie Wood was in a TV commercial that ends with her saying, "Covergirl....it helps you keep just one step ahead". An eerie foreshadowing when you think of what was just ahead.The whole ad campaign with Natalie Wood had to be stopped.
Marilyn put everything she had into trying to be a great actress, but she could only seem to get somewhere if she used her body. She got caught in a hideous trap that destroyed her. All for greatness. It is sad. She was a sweet woman, just deeply misguided.
Reminds me of when Tupac died. I was working as a 911 operator at the time. I think literally all the youth in the city were calling us that night, crying, telling us that they were “pouring out liquor” in his honor. It was awful. They felt like they had no one or no where else to go to help process their pain. I remember his death announcement scrolling across the TV channel. We knew that these kids shouldn't have been calling us, but he was their hero. We understood.
Must have been a big city. I was a phone operator as well---that didn't happen on my phone line. Of course, I'm from a small town of about 2,000, during the time. No college here, either.
Kids really called 9/11 to help ease pain because a rapper who made his career by rapping about how much of a gangster he is and how much he dislikes police died? ROTFLMAO
The news about Marilyn Monroe's death got out on Sunday. By the time the people were in the office they would have known about Marilyn's death at least the day before. I was just over a year old when Marilyn died so I don't remember it. My mother told me that we were in the car going to church and it came over the radio that Marilyn Monroe had died and apparently it was suicide. My mother told me long afterward, "I felt so sorry for her".---Singer and actress Deborah Harry said she knew men who work black armbands for mourning at the time of Marilyn's death.
@@andrewbrendan1579 I mean it would still be the day right before right? I mean it would make sense for people to get the newspapers of it on Monday morning and everyone to still be talking about the whole thing.
My Mom was devastated when Princess Diana died. She woke me up in the middle of the night crying. I didn't understand it then, but I respected her feelings. Now, I understand. As much as someone who wasn't a woman raising two kids in a difficult marriage could understand.
"We're lucky they didn't go for the Jackie/Marilyn campaign..." Peggy's eye is never far from the game. "Some people hide in plain sight." Neither is Don's.
From WHERE THE GIRLS ARE by Susan J. Douglas: "Poised on the brink of the 1960s, facing the abyss of the teen and preteen years, the girls of America [Baby Boom generation] already had their heads jammed with images and fantasies about how their lives might proceed. We had learned to put ourselves under surveillance, and learned about the importance of female masochism. Then, in August 1962, we heard that the greatest living sex symbol in America, Marilyn Monroe, had died of an overdose of pills. Is this, we wondered, what too much beauty, too much sex appeal, and what appeared at the time like too little brains got you-an early, tawdry death?....But her suicide did represent the death of a certain kind of femininity, and a certain kind of female victimization. When she died, it seemed to me, even back then, that an era had passed, and that the seemingly dumb-blond, busty bombshell would no longer exert the cultural or sexual pull she once did. For while all these twisted lessons about being nice no matter what, never complaining, and being a doormat were well threaded into my psyche, MM, Sleeping Beauty, and all those pathetic women on 'Queen for a Day' made me realize I wanted something else too. I wanted more control than they had. And, one way or another, I was going to get it."
@@kor8267 It makes sense in context of the book and the chapter: niceness can be pretty.,... Not so nice for the nice person if they're not stating their desires and needs. And often the theme of Queen for a Day seem to revolve around a few needy women practically groveling on live TV. I just included that part of the book because obviously it's hard to copy a whole chapter.
Jessica Victoria Carrillo does female masochism the idea of women putting other people’s needs before their own and that it’s their job to serve others?
@@katiebayliss9887 Yeah, especially when you put yourself on the back stove for so long that you get neglected. It's very important that you have something for you and that you save something in your metaphorical bowl or else you're gonna have nothing to give no more.
Kor 82 I’m sure some did, just like there’s some today who do. But it doesn’t help that Valium was called mothers little helper. And yes some people do enjoy helping others, but I think the chapters means like women who are to busy cooking or serving other people they don’t even eat themselves. This idea of that women have to be nice and ladylike and put their wants and needs and opinions below their family members
You mean the "me too" movement? I don't think she was raped; or at least I didn't think she was raped. But, she did have quite a few men in her life. Bombshells like Marilyn never had to worry about getting a man. Holding on to the one was a different thing. Her big love was J. Kennedy. That affair was like a big lie. She knew Kennedy would never be hers. I think is sadden her, too. She died of a broken heart. Of course an overdose, but, a broken heart, as well.
@MrHEC381991 You shouldn't make light of sexual assault like that. And if that wasn't your intention, then you should read more about what #metoo is really about before making clumsy platitudes like that.
@@Unownshipper She was passed around like a fucking peace pipe! How do you not know about this? All her female colleagues knew about it. Here's one that will blow your mind; Natalie Wood was raped by Kirk Doulas. I bet the week he dies, everyone will put their hand up and say "By the way, he raped Natalie Wood."
@@kor8267 "Allegedly" is a funny word that gets thrown around nowadays but before the Age of Information there were "Rumours". When different people from different circumstances start brining up the same names in certain incidents there's a pattern. I bet money on it that people will point the finger at Kirk Douglas after he's dead and maybe Christopher Walken as well.
To everyone who's criticising Marilyn Monroe - why can't you just leave her alone? She was an unhappy woman - but you'd never guess that from watching how she'd shine on the screen. You'd never know she was so nervous that she wanted her acting coach on the set with her, her confidence seemed to just shine through. She created an image that no one has been able to replicate - no one can do the voice or the expressions like her. But 60 years after her death people still have to mock or criticise her. Just leave her alone.
The most disturbing part of this scene is them acknowledging that loneliness leads to depression and suicide and then continuing on to completely ignore the elevator operator because of his race.
I'm somewhat hearing impaired and there are no captions here. Can anyone tell me what Peggy says starting at :41? She says, "My mother....." and after that I can't figure out the rest of what Peggy is saying.
Ofc, my grandpa told me, the world has stopped for a moment, everyone was devastated; even suicide rate grew that week (hardcore fans commited suicide)
Everyone wasn't saddened about Diana either, the news just kept saying it in order to fill up air time. There were a number of writers who commented on the bizarre phenomenon like Christopher Hitchens.
Honestly, women standing around crying when Marilyn Monroe passed. No one I was around cried. I think it was a sad thing that she died, due to an overdose. Like when Elvis died. Makes me sick to see Jane cry. The harlot. Telling Jane the guys made her go into Cooper's office. The way she had her blouse unbutton. She loved playing games with the guys and everyone of them played up to her. Especially Ken. Then she told Joan she ran into Roger. She's someone who is really cruel to those who don't meet her expectations by the gold digger she is. She trapped Roger. Glad Roger saw her for what she was. I never felt sorry for Jane. Betty, on the other hand, yes. Jane has looks but that's all she has. Men are like children. they drool and go crazy around a nice looking woman. Following Jane into Cooper's office, how juvenile. Glad Don didn't mix with her. I think Don saw through her.
Marilyn was smart and witty. She had a difficult childhood. She had no one to look after her. She peroxided every last bit of natural hue out of her hair, had some plastic surgery, painted on the face and wore the costumes, but her vulnerability and wit always came through, imho. She had that ability to be herself even in her Marilyn costume. People may judge a person's looks, choices, etc., but it's hard to deny that Marilyn's authentic nature drew people to her, and her death was about so many things that can happen to an empathetic person in a difficult industry. "Management is what's wrong with the business." She was so right about that. Artists are themselves. Management fights that. But it can never change what's true.
@@bojack40 what are you saying? Why is it bloody near impossible for people to write out the actual words when typing a comment these days? Stop abbreviating every thing ! “IKR” is not proper grammar. Nor is FFS. It’s not even proper writing. The English language has become so bastardized that it’s almost barbaric.
It has been 60 years no one replace Marilyn Monroe 💋💯🤍 often imitated but never duplicated she has that great quality, shine and own characteristic like these wonderful women Jean Harlow, Greta Garbo, Bette Davis, Katherine, Judy Garland, Lena Horne, Dorothy Dandridge and Lucy Ball etc Say if you to wanna be an actress and they're casting a Marilyn Monroe type its diffucult to find someone like that.
I never watched this show although I heard a lot of good things about it but the dialogue seems really…not good. I know they’re trying to capture the formality of the 50s but it just sounds like they’re reading off a script. They’re doing their best but…Jesus…
It’s the 60s not the 50s. The reason they talk like that, especially Don, is because he’s the alpha boss guy. He’s just straightforward, private type of guy who was respected in the office
Roger fought in the war...who cares about some harlot who at the top, couldn't control herself. Indeed frivolous, how she disregarded the many lives lost in WW2 that Roger was responsible for.
....And your comments are exactly what Joan meant by "this world destroyed her". Some things makes me more sad then others and some obviously matter more....but can't people be allowed to be emotional about a celebrity that died lmao? It's not stopping them from caring about the war and its victims.
Good job cherry picking. You don't care for someone dying right now, you only care about those you can affect. Roger in this scene didn't care, because she indeed was a stranger. And that's how its always been, or am I to believe that you're crying over every person who dies literally every day? Grow up.
This isn’t about the war. Notice how the only people distraught about MM are the ones who are described by the scene, and by you, as frivolous. These women can only be secretaries, can only hope to use their sexuality to gain a position in life. Yet the one person at that time, who did exactly that, who could have had it all, killed herself. It basically tells us, no matter how many men you have, how rich you can be, you will not be happy until you are not seen as “frivolous” (which MM was famously known for, and Don comments on this). MM is not easily described as a harlot like you or Don said. She is an icon then, and an icon now. When the men downplay / don’t care about MMs’ death, they indirectly insult the women around them who have had it less than MM. Joan took it the hardest because she is her exact replica. This could also be the turning point for Joan when she realizes she doesn’t want to die like her. In her confrontation, she also realizes that men, like Roger, is not the “happy ending” women need, because men at that time lack empathy. This isn’t about some testosterone filled war with no real conclusions, this scene was about women and the importance of women’s rights. Joan’s comment on “one day you’ll lose someone who is important to you” as if she was talking about herself, it could have been wishful thinking because Roger and many other men would only see her as a “harlot”. Like many other mad men scenes, they are put in there for a reason. If you go through the series by only taking in face value (like how people kept saying “MM seemed so happy :( ”) then you’re not doing it right. Tldr; you need to have better analytical skills.
So like I said, bad writing, that conveniently ignored a man who served under a war, wherein the lives of men will never be forgotten. Its a very cheesy way to try and give the audience a parable to the working female vs MM, it comes off tone death. Roger and many others didn't care because she came and went, and means nothing to their lives, besides being a movie star who fucked every swinging dick. Now if they mean to say, Joanne sees herself as Marilyn and a star, then yes, cleverly written....to an extent, it still tarnishes all the greatness all the men who went to war in the office. Now move on, I don't want this back and forth, you're not gonna change my mind.
@@vandalg282 How was I cherry picking? That is exactly what you said. Now be careful, it seems like a pretty painful fall from that highhorse of yours.
Sterling was right. Marilyn Monroe had everything & everyone loved her. She did in fact throw her own life away, for nothing. However, she was healing. She wasn't even depressed when she was murdered. She was being offered big time career changing opportunities on the eve of her tragic death.
Even if it was proven to be suicide, no one should ever have the right to say she had it all and threw it away because she didn’t have it all. Her “all” was to be a mother and to be a wife to be able to have children and most importantly to have a family, which was something she never had.
I’m with Roger on this. If you can’t find peace at the top.... you fucked up. People with nothing struggle everyday. Killing yourself is a selfish act.
You know it really bothers me that people like you think like this. Money to Marilyn Monroe meant nothing and she said it herself. Because all Marilyn Monroe wanted was to be a wife and to have children, to be a mother and since she didn’t have the top three things that she wanted, which was to be taken serious as an actress, to be a mother, and a wife. I don’t entirely believe she took her own life but it’s no right to say what she did was selfish.
No, the world didn’t destroy her. The world always perceived her as this dumb blonde bombshell. She tried to marketing herself when she opened her production company in New York yet many still didn’t take her serious. Plus the press treated her so terrible so much to where they squeezed out her stitches when she left the hospital in 1961 and the people in the business industry never took her serious.
Being a movie star to Marilyn Monroe, wasn’t everything. All she wanted in life was to be a talented actress and to be a mother and a wife she did not have everything. Money to her meant nothing.
"Some people hide in plain sight" Don gets nervous.
I don't think he gets nervous, Just struck a nerves, is all.
C'mon, a black elevator operator in the 60's. He was talking about himself man.
@@creatinehandshake He was talking about himself, but Don clams up because he applies the word to himself.
@@creatinehandshake dude don clearly related to it and became scared
One day you'll lose someone who's important to you. You'll see. It's very painful.
Idk why she said that, roger fought in the war
That line always bothered me because Roger fought in the Pacific Theatre and was used to seeing his friends die by the squadron-load, more or less. He knows exactly what it’s like to lose people who were important to him.
i do love joan.
Von Straugg I think it’s implied she meant a celebrity, someone who abstractly represents your self concept whom you project yourself onto and identify with. It’s not about grieving someone you knew, it’s about grieving what they represented for you. She knows Marilyn in so far as how they experienced life in a similar way, and for Marilyn to die is for her to see the tragedy in her own life, I think
I have lost people I loved. I lost my baby sister and my father. He was murdered. I lost my grandmothers, grandfathers, aunts, cousins, etc. I didn't say I didn't admire or didn't care for Marilyn Monroe. I ONLY said no one around me cried when Marilyn died. I did like her very much. I don't throw the 'LOVE" word around on everyone. REAL love is with people we mingle with. Have real relationships with. We often fall in love with an image. Even myself. But, I LOVE those in my life. Some people need to understand what LOVE really is. It's not an image. When Robin Williams committed suicide, that hurt me deeply. I cared for him as an actor. But, LOVE we throw that word around too much.
Peggy says, "We're lucky Playtex didn't go for that Jackie-Marilyn campaign. We'd have to pull everything indefinitely". That really happened when Natalie Wood died. Miss Wood was the spokeswoman for Covergirl cosmetics and at the time of her death Natalie Wood was in a TV commercial that ends with her saying, "Covergirl....it helps you keep just one step ahead". An eerie foreshadowing when you think of what was just ahead.The whole ad campaign with Natalie Wood had to be stopped.
Is this true?!
@@emilynorris4263 That really happened. I remember it clearly.
I just love Joan so much.
me too.
Me too
Marilyn put everything she had into trying to be a great actress, but she could only seem to get somewhere if she used her body. She got caught in a hideous trap that destroyed her. All for greatness. It is sad. She was a sweet woman, just deeply misguided.
Reminds me of when Tupac died. I was working as a 911 operator at the time. I think literally all the youth in the city were calling us that night, crying, telling us that they were “pouring out liquor” in his honor. It was awful. They felt like they had no one or no where else to go to help process their pain. I remember his death announcement scrolling across the TV channel. We knew that these kids shouldn't have been calling us, but he was their hero. We understood.
Must have been a big city. I was a phone operator as well---that didn't happen on my phone line. Of course, I'm from a small town of about 2,000, during the time. No college here, either.
Kids calling complete strangers to help them process their pain, and help them understand it. That’s heartbreaking!
@@misssmisssymaria sometimes there's no one else to turn to
@lizzie fan irrelevant
Kids really called 9/11 to help ease pain because a rapper who made his career by rapping about how much of a gangster he is and how much he dislikes police died? ROTFLMAO
Joan is THE reaction, such a badass
This is how I felt when Robin Williams killed himself.
This is how I felt when Steve Irwin died.
Same with Gilbert Gottfried
The news about Marilyn Monroe's death got out on Sunday. By the time the people were in the office they would have known about Marilyn's death at least the day before. I was just over a year old when Marilyn died so I don't remember it. My mother told me that we were in the car going to church and it came over the radio that Marilyn Monroe had died and apparently it was suicide. My mother told me long afterward, "I felt so sorry for her".---Singer and actress Deborah Harry said she knew men who work black armbands for mourning at the time of Marilyn's death.
Andrew Brendan you know it’s just tv right?
@@bojack40 Yes but I still expected just a little bit better, a little more historical accuracy, from a show as good this one.
@@andrewbrendan1579 I mean it would still be the day right before right? I mean it would make sense for people to get the newspapers of it on Monday morning and everyone to still be talking about the whole thing.
@@E-Ma Yeah, I don’t really get what they’re complaining about. It’s clearly the morning after people found out about her death.
"This world destroyed her"
Very reminiscent of when Princess Diana died.
diana was a bitch read about her
My Mom was devastated when Princess Diana died. She woke me up in the middle of the night crying. I didn't understand it then, but I respected her feelings.
Now, I understand. As much as someone who wasn't a woman raising two kids in a difficult marriage could understand.
"We're lucky they didn't go for the Jackie/Marilyn campaign..." Peggy's eye is never far from the game. "Some people hide in plain sight." Neither is Don's.
Joan's words come true for Roger later in the series when his mother and shoe shine man dies
I think about that too. It seems to be the only time sterling is really upset
1:55 Betty doesn't give a fuck. Lol
Yeah sadly people around the world didn't care that much about her death
I think she does - that's why she's drinking. Marilyn who seemed to have everything.....and she was still miserable....
They based Joan’s character on Marilyn Thats why her character had to be affected by marilyns death
This is the best TV show ever made
From WHERE THE GIRLS ARE by Susan J. Douglas:
"Poised on the brink of the 1960s, facing the abyss of the teen and preteen years, the girls of America [Baby Boom generation] already had their heads jammed with images and fantasies about how their lives might proceed. We had learned to put ourselves under surveillance, and learned about the importance of female masochism. Then, in August 1962, we heard that the greatest living sex symbol in America, Marilyn Monroe, had died of an overdose of pills. Is this, we wondered, what too much beauty, too much sex appeal, and what appeared at the time like too little brains got you-an early, tawdry death?....But her suicide did represent the death of a certain kind of femininity, and a certain kind of female victimization. When she died, it seemed to me, even back then, that an era had passed, and that the seemingly dumb-blond, busty bombshell would no longer exert the cultural or sexual pull she once did. For while all these twisted lessons about being nice no matter what, never complaining, and being a doormat were well threaded into my psyche, MM, Sleeping Beauty, and all those pathetic women on 'Queen for a Day' made me realize I wanted something else too. I wanted more control than they had. And, one way or another, I was going to get it."
@@kor8267 It makes sense in context of the book and the chapter: niceness can be pretty.,... Not so nice for the nice person if they're not stating their desires and needs. And often the theme of Queen for a Day seem to revolve around a few needy women practically groveling on live TV. I just included that part of the book because obviously it's hard to copy a whole chapter.
Jessica Victoria Carrillo does female masochism the idea of women putting other people’s needs before their own and that it’s their job to serve others?
@@katiebayliss9887 Yeah, especially when you put yourself on the back stove for so long that you get neglected. It's very important that you have something for you and that you save something in your metaphorical bowl or else you're gonna have nothing to give no more.
Kor 82 I’m sure some did, just like there’s some today who do. But it doesn’t help that Valium was called mothers little helper. And yes some people do enjoy helping others, but I think the chapters means like women who are to busy cooking or serving other people they don’t even eat themselves. This idea of that women have to be nice and ladylike and put their wants and needs and opinions below their family members
@@katiebayliss9887 Thanks Katie, that's where me and the author were getting at.
Last line was perfect to say to a shallow person.
Marilyn Monroe was surreptitiously the first high profile #metoo
You mean the "me too" movement? I don't think she was raped; or at least I didn't think she was raped. But, she did have quite a few men in her life. Bombshells like Marilyn never had to worry about getting a man. Holding on to the one was a different thing. Her big love was J. Kennedy. That affair was like a big lie. She knew Kennedy would never be hers. I think is sadden her, too. She died of a broken heart. Of course an overdose, but, a broken heart, as well.
@MrHEC381991 You shouldn't make light of sexual assault like that. And if that wasn't your intention, then you should read more about what #metoo is really about before making clumsy platitudes like that.
@@Unownshipper She was passed around like a fucking peace pipe! How do you not know about this? All her female colleagues knew about it. Here's one that will blow your mind; Natalie Wood was raped by Kirk Doulas. I bet the week he dies, everyone will put their hand up and say "By the way, he raped Natalie Wood."
@@kor8267 "Allegedly" is a funny word that gets thrown around nowadays but before the Age of Information there were "Rumours". When different people from different circumstances start brining up the same names in certain incidents there's a pattern. I bet money on it that people will point the finger at Kirk Douglas after he's dead and maybe Christopher Walken as well.
@@MrHEC381991 natalie wood was murdered because she walked in on kirk douglas and (another actor whose name i can't remember_) having sex
To everyone who's criticising Marilyn Monroe - why can't you just leave her alone?
She was an unhappy woman - but you'd never guess that from watching how she'd shine on the screen. You'd never know she was so nervous that she wanted her acting coach on the set with her, her confidence seemed to just shine through.
She created an image that no one has been able to replicate - no one can do the voice or the expressions like her.
But 60 years after her death people still have to mock or criticise her.
Just leave her alone.
The most disturbing part of this scene is them acknowledging that loneliness leads to depression and suicide and then continuing on to completely ignore the elevator operator because of his race.
Because he is black or because he is an elevator operator?
Don referred to him by name. You’re looking too deep into that. He pushed buttons for crying out loud.
He wasn't ignoring him at all, he even called him by his first name-
Dude your whole comment is laugh worthy.
SJW
The days my parents got married.
Marilyn had borderline personality disorder. So do i. The fear of abandonment, being alone, a failure...its hard.
Don't give up. Life is worth fighting for.
Alex eh
@@Alex00789 eh
Checking in to make sure you’re ok.
Don't give up here for u everything will be alright
I'm somewhat hearing impaired and there are no captions here. Can anyone tell me what Peggy says starting at :41? She says, "My mother....." and after that I can't figure out the rest of what Peggy is saying.
"My mother and sister keep calling"
@@bdis4306 Thank you!
They let people go home if they were crying back inthe 1960s
When people knew Kobe Bryant death.
Was everyone saddened by Marilyn dying as they were about Princess Diana?
Ofc, my grandpa told me, the world has stopped for a moment, everyone was devastated; even suicide rate grew that week (hardcore fans commited suicide)
Everyone wasn't saddened about Diana either, the news just kept saying it in order to fill up air time. There were a number of writers who commented on the bizarre phenomenon like Christopher Hitchens.
Honestly, women standing around crying when Marilyn Monroe passed. No one I was around cried. I think it was a sad thing that she died, due to an overdose. Like when Elvis died. Makes me sick to see Jane cry. The harlot. Telling Jane the guys made her go into Cooper's office. The way she had her blouse unbutton. She loved playing games with the guys and everyone of them played up to her. Especially Ken. Then she told Joan she ran into Roger. She's someone who is really cruel to those who don't meet her expectations by the gold digger she is. She trapped Roger. Glad Roger saw her for what she was. I never felt sorry for Jane. Betty, on the other hand, yes. Jane has looks but that's all she has. Men are like children. they drool and go crazy around a nice looking woman. Following Jane into Cooper's office, how juvenile. Glad Don didn't mix with her. I think Don saw through her.
Marilyn was smart and witty. She had a difficult childhood. She had no one to look after her. She peroxided every last bit of natural hue out of her hair, had some plastic surgery, painted on the face and wore the costumes, but her vulnerability and wit always came through, imho. She had that ability to be herself even in her Marilyn costume. People may judge a person's looks, choices, etc., but it's hard to deny that Marilyn's authentic nature drew people to her, and her death was about so many things that can happen to an empathetic person in a difficult industry. "Management is what's wrong with the business." She was so right about that. Artists are themselves. Management fights that. But it can never change what's true.
@@bellablow4287 You sound really annoying. Shut up
jt FFS it’s Joan, NOT Jane 😳
@@bojack40 what are you saying? Why is it bloody near impossible for people to write out the actual words when typing a comment these days? Stop abbreviating every thing ! “IKR” is not proper grammar. Nor is FFS. It’s not even proper writing. The English language has become so bastardized that it’s almost barbaric.
@@Luvie1980 Luvie?!
2020
Joan can easily replace her, more mentally stable, head strong 💪 and hot 🔥.
It has been 60 years no one replace Marilyn Monroe 💋💯🤍 often imitated but never duplicated she has that great quality, shine and own characteristic like these wonderful women Jean Harlow, Greta Garbo, Bette Davis, Katherine, Judy Garland, Lena Horne, Dorothy Dandridge and Lucy Ball etc Say if you to wanna be an actress and they're casting a Marilyn Monroe type its diffucult to find someone like that.
I never watched this show although I heard a lot of good things about it but the dialogue seems really…not good. I know they’re trying to capture the formality of the 50s but it just sounds like they’re reading off a script. They’re doing their best but…Jesus…
It’s the 60s not the 50s. The reason they talk like that, especially Don, is because he’s the alpha boss guy. He’s just straightforward, private type of guy who was respected in the office
Roger fought in the war...who cares about some harlot who at the top, couldn't control herself.
Indeed frivolous, how she disregarded the many lives lost in WW2 that Roger was responsible for.
....And your comments are exactly what Joan meant by "this world destroyed her".
Some things makes me more sad then others and some obviously matter more....but can't people be allowed to be emotional about a celebrity that died lmao? It's not stopping them from caring about the war and its victims.
Good job cherry picking. You don't care for someone dying right now, you only care about those you can affect.
Roger in this scene didn't care, because she indeed was a stranger. And that's how its always been, or am I to believe that you're crying over every person who dies literally every day?
Grow up.
This isn’t about the war. Notice how the only people distraught about MM are the ones who are described by the scene, and by you, as frivolous. These women can only be secretaries, can only hope to use their sexuality to gain a position in life. Yet the one person at that time, who did exactly that, who could have had it all, killed herself. It basically tells us, no matter how many men you have, how rich you can be, you will not be happy until you are not seen as “frivolous” (which MM was famously known for, and Don comments on this). MM is not easily described as a harlot like you or Don said. She is an icon then, and an icon now. When the men downplay / don’t care about MMs’ death, they indirectly insult the women around them who have had it less than MM. Joan took it the hardest because she is her exact replica. This could also be the turning point for Joan when she realizes she doesn’t want to die like her. In her confrontation, she also realizes that men, like Roger, is not the “happy ending” women need, because men at that time lack empathy. This isn’t about some testosterone filled war with no real conclusions, this scene was about women and the importance of women’s rights. Joan’s comment on “one day you’ll lose someone who is important to you” as if she was talking about herself, it could have been wishful thinking because Roger and many other men would only see her as a “harlot”. Like many other mad men scenes, they are put in there for a reason. If you go through the series by only taking in face value (like how people kept saying “MM seemed so happy :( ”) then you’re not doing it right. Tldr; you need to have better analytical skills.
So like I said, bad writing, that conveniently ignored a man who served under a war, wherein the lives of men will never be forgotten.
Its a very cheesy way to try and give the audience a parable to the working female vs MM, it comes off tone death. Roger and many others didn't care because she came and went, and means nothing to their lives, besides being a movie star who fucked every swinging dick.
Now if they mean to say, Joanne sees herself as Marilyn and a star, then yes, cleverly written....to an extent, it still tarnishes all the greatness all the men who went to war in the office.
Now move on, I don't want this back and forth, you're not gonna change my mind.
@@vandalg282 How was I cherry picking? That is exactly what you said. Now be careful, it seems like a pretty painful fall from that highhorse of yours.
Sterling was right. Marilyn Monroe had everything & everyone loved her. She did in fact throw her own life away, for nothing. However, she was healing. She wasn't even depressed when she was murdered. She was being offered big time career changing opportunities on the eve of her tragic death.
Even if it was proven to be suicide, no one should ever have the right to say she had it all and threw it away because she didn’t have it all. Her “all” was to be a mother and to be a wife to be able to have children and most importantly to have a family, which was something she never had.
Imagine crying over a movie personality manufactured by Hollywood
Because within that Hollywood image was an incredible woman who was cruelly exploited throughout her life.
I’m with Roger on this.
If you can’t find peace at the top.... you fucked up.
People with nothing struggle everyday. Killing yourself is a selfish act.
You know it really bothers me that people like you think like this. Money to Marilyn Monroe meant nothing and she said it herself. Because all Marilyn Monroe wanted was to be a wife and to have children, to be a mother and since she didn’t have the top three things that she wanted, which was to be taken serious as an actress, to be a mother, and a wife. I don’t entirely believe she took her own life but it’s no right to say what she did was selfish.
marilyn destroyed herself - not the 'world'
No, the world didn’t destroy her. The world always perceived her as this dumb blonde bombshell. She tried to marketing herself when she opened her production company in New York yet many still didn’t take her serious. Plus the press treated her so terrible so much to where they squeezed out her stitches when she left the hospital in 1961 and the people in the business industry never took her serious.
"Really? She was a moviestar who had everything and everybody and she threw it away."
Being a movie star to Marilyn Monroe, wasn’t everything. All she wanted in life was to be a talented actress and to be a mother and a wife she did not have everything. Money to her meant nothing.