Great competition that was marred by very inconsistent, unfair judging. Sillivas should not have won floor with some of her landings, your silver medalist in bars was a joke and so on and so on.
@@saragrant9749Rubbish. Silivas was the best on floor throughout each competition, from Compulsories, Team Optionals and Finals. Or have you forgotten that back then scores carried over from the Team events?? NONE of the finalists came close to Daniela Silivas in Compulsory Floor Exercise where she received a richly deserved perfect 10.00! She was at least .50 better than any of the other finalists' Compulsory Floors alone!
@@mysticalmargaret6105 no, I haven’t forgotten. Her final floor routine was not even close to a 9.987, not with how she landed on her first tumble. It was a laughable score given only by reputation and nothing more. 9.887 would have been more appropriate.
She really was an amazing gymnast. She was also a wife and a mother. While my heart breaks for the gymnastics world, it breaks even more for her husband and their son who are left behind. 💔🙏🏻
@KristinCortez For years I tried to wrap my brain around it. I blamed terrible quality of Russian health care, thought perhaps Elena had fallen to some habits that compromised her health (not having seen her for 30 years). But then last fall, Mary Lou Retton came very very close to dying of the same thing. The pneumonia hit her out of nowhere, and she was negative for Covid, RSV, everything. A complete wtf. 🤯 So now, seeing a pattern, I'm kind of worried about Tatiana Gutsu.😬
@@KristinCortezI had heard she passed but at first didn’t understand how it could happen to someone that young. When I heard pneumonia… just bizarre and tragic.
@@DianaDeLunaI had bad pneumonia in late May- early June 2024. I was hospitalized two weeks had to have a chest tube. It was staphylococcus. Probably MRSA. All those antibiotics and the bacteria alone kicked me into an autoimmune reaction with high platelets. Don’t know about what Mary Lou’s was or the others but sepsis sets in and you’ve got a problem.
I only wish she’d kept going after 1988, she could definitely have made the 1992 team. Did she choose to retire after these games or did injuries force her to stop?
lol not even close. Queen of an era where eastern bloc origin mattered a great deal is more like it. Here for example… Bars? Awesome. Beam? Near perfection. Floor? A complete asinine joke and vault? Even more of a travesty.
@@pam0626 it wasn’t, but the Soviets carried a huge level of influence on those judges- because they heavily influenced the FIG. Quite often the judge who was from a non eastern bloc area was the one whose scores reflected reality- and were dismissed as a result. You can argue otherwise but history doesn’t lie.
@16:58 "I agree with you Bart, when you see that noticeable hop on the dismount, there's no way..." says the gymnast who scored a 10.00 with multiple hops 4 years before. LOL!
And I bet you have no problem with the countless eastern bloc countries that were awarded exaggerated scores simply because of who they were through history… but of course an American or non Eastern bloc person is an issue. Hypocrisy much?
@@saragrant9749 Actually, I have a problem with most imperfect 10s. They should have all scored lower. Silivas's compulsories are some of the very few exceptions that I think deserved the 10.
@@Ian.D. there have absolutely been some very deserving tens, and I agree with Sillivss’ Compulseries. Her score on floor final was extremely overdone and highly unfair to the other athletes who performed cleaner routines but received lower scores. The performance I think of as a ten as well was her bars- THAT was pure perfection. I just know that over the years a lot of people have pointed out the scores of the Americans in 1984 while completely ignoring a great number of others- from the USSR and East Germany in particular- that were even more blatant. Fair is fair.
@@saragrant9749 Yeah shes a great gymnast but I can't actually think of a more prolific top gymnast who I dislike more as a person. Remember in the aa where she tried to literally psyc out Elena right before the most important vault of her life. Absolute loser behavior, and I'm glad she never got to feel what it's like to be the best gymnast in the world because of it.
@@RuaridhDavidson well, there was also Khorkina celebrating when Presecan stepped out of bounds at Euros one year, Shannon Miller celebrating when Roza Galiyeva fell off balance beam in 1996, and Carly Patterson's "Gee that's too bad " in 2003. Podkopayeva's glacial glare at Mo Huilan (who smirked !)in 1996, Nadia Comaneci blowing cloud of chalk dust in Stella Zakharova's face in 1979 that stand out as worse to me than Silivas' leaning against the boards or giving a half smile. Then again , I never held that against any of them either. This wasn't gymNICEstics _ -these girls were all ruthless competitors.
@@escaflowne9282take2 Those are for sure poor sportsmanship moments, but its very different trying to psyche out your opponents the way silivas did RIGHT BEFORE her performances. Before the most important vault of her life no less. All those you listed happened after/ as a response to a performance of a competitor ( I think with the exception of nadia though correct me if im wrong). If shushu didnt and have and wasnt known for being utterly nerveless that may have been the push needed to deliver a less than 10.0 vault. Unfortunately for silivas, and thankfully for everyone else, shushunova was a competitor that could not be psyched out by such childish actions.
While the level of gymnastic is very high, the judging is just absurd and perverse. At some moments the judges seem to be completely out of mind and out of control, or to put it better, completely under control of some perverse forces from outside.
@Mellissa Boomer of the Night not sure why you used the orphanages part as an example of perverse control. I think that was actually one of the better aspects of it all. These orphanages were very bleak and most of these children dreamed of representing their country via such a sport as gymnastics. It was seen as something to be proud of and cherish, which is a great thing to develop in our youth. To respect, support, and love your country and develop camaraderie with other countries, which sports allow. Training and pursuing a sport was seen as a blessing and tons of young kids were brought to evaluations by their PARENTS to try to win a coveted spot at a training facility. The fact that they also considered kids in orphanages was good for those children, even if their motivation was to win gold medals (the adults, I mean). They usually asked who was actually interested in the sport and those who volunteered were evaluated physically. You made it sound as though they were forced and kidnapped lol Nadia actually had a similar story, only hers was in her school. Coaches came and ASKED them who was interested and she volunteered. She had the right physicality and was accepted. The trainings are always hard, including in the US…Karolyi trained US gymnasts btw for the majority of his career and so did his wife. Non-athletes simply don’t understand as well as millennials and sensitive genz’s. They also weren’t starved; it’s physically impossible to perform at this level with zero food. They were placed on strict diets, there is a difference. The amount of American gymnasts suffering from disordered eating is too high for you to make this a ‘communist thing’. I’m sorry, I’m not trying to come at you or anything, but your comment was a but unfair and very biased and misinformed. You seem to be blaming a lot on communist countries and the Soviet Union in regards to gymnastics when in reality these things were also rampant in American gyms nationwide, nit just the Karolyi ranch, and I think some of your statements were a bit hyperbolic. Hopefully this helped you see a different perspective on the matter 🤗🤗
@Mellissa Boomer of the Night That’s inaccurate, they didn’t starve them. You saw Shoushounava right. That’s your ethnocentrism. I would’ve love a spot at one of these training camps. Also you know Shannon Miller went to the Soviet Union to train when she was going right? She said their hard work and training strategies made her the gymnast she was and that she tried to adapt as much of it as possible. Also, her coach Nunno had weight requirements as well. Strict ones. That was here in the U.S
@@krisuler7734 Right. As an American child I would’ve given anything to have a scholarship to one of these “terrible” Soviet training camps. Would’ve been a dream come true. It’s hard work, but hard work equals medals and excellence.
Miss the perfect 10 system, but this was a little out of control. Think they had it right in 92 where 10s were possible but only for those rare outstanding moments of excellence.
If they were from the Soviet Union (unified team) to be specific. The 1992 games were the last time the world saw such blatant favoritism from the judges.
That bronze on beam by Phoebe Mills was a big deal at the time. The Americans had success in Los Angeles in 84, but this Olympics which was fully attended in a foreign country was a much more difficult task. It's too bad that politics prevented the USA girls from winning the bronze in the team.
The biggest reason it was so much more difficult was because, with the Soviets there the judges were going to only support them- the ones who were paying their salaries. Yes, the Soviets BOUGHT the scores they got throughout the 1970’s and 1980’s unfortunately. It’s actually been documented since then that this was occurring but sadly no consequence were ever paid. Now at least the judges go based on actual performance.
@@saragrant9749 Unfortunately I believe it. I also want to know what the East Germans did to get such generous scores at this event. They should have finished no higher than fifth. Their Beam scores in particular were laughably inflated.
Part of me really wishes that the IOC should right this wrong, As unrealistic as it may be... But I never would have thought they would have gotten it right with 2000 team bronze, So I suppose anything is possible. I'd love to see it someday.
I remember rushing home from school to watch this and how trendy those short haircuts were! For me, this was the golden era of gymnastics - the perfect mix of power and artistry which is sadly missing nowadays.
Shush, Bogy, Strazh, Popa, Dobre, Vodnicharova, Dudeva, Potaeac, Cuiting...such amazing greatness here! If only Omelianchik and Mostepanova had been there, too!
Shushunova proved that you do not have to be graceful to be one of the most artistic performers in the field. She is everything a power gymnast should strive to be. Innovative, daring and explosive yes, but also with an incredible and imposing presence and feeling in her performances, such a shame she couldn't deliver in EF, but she had nothing to prove by the point at least. Top 5 of all time, imo top 3 even.
For those who complain constantly about overscoring in the Olympics gymnastics today-- THIS IS WHAT OVERSCORING LOOKS LIKE!! People can quit the garbage about being overscored, at least it isn’t like this garbage where judges were blatantly biased and in the pockets of certain countries.
Nice memory of NBC's incredibly awful and embarrassing coverage of the 1988 Summer Olympics. This was the worst television coverage in my opinion. Spent way too much time with interviews, athlete profiles, commentary and the camera lingering on non-competition footage when other routines were being contested they could have shown. And of course there were the numerous commercial breaks making it even worse. I was so happy they had that Triplecast for the 1992 Summer Olympics in Barcelona. That was amazing to see hours and hours of competition without commercials and without national bias.
@@sherleybozieux The 1988 Winter Olympics in Calgary were on ABC; The Summer Olympics in Seoul were on NBC. Do your homework because I know I am correct on this.
Mary Lou was an awesome athlete but she sucked as a commentator. She was awkwardly quiet at times which resulted in Bart talking more than he does normally to bail her out... Dick Enberg was a knowledgeable host but unfortunately said some really creepy things that made me cringe... Bart was always an awesome commentator but the dynamic with his two partners did not work...
@kentiemacgymnastics9885 - Hi there, thanks so much for all these classic competition uploads, mine got destroyed years ago and it's wonderful to have them available in such good quality! This is a bit of a long shot, but 1 of my videos that got destroyed, was of the Atlanta 1996 gymnastics gala; there were so many wonderful performances and I've never found a complete upload of it anywhere. Was wondering if by any chance, you had any of it at all in your collection? ☺️
There were several highly inflated scores during those games, costing some very deserving athletes their rightly deserved medals. Unfortunately politics played a crucial role in scoring.
She wasn’t the only one given scores that were questionable in those games- Szabo had errors that were overlooked as well. Just because your precious Romanian princess didn’t win doesn’t detract from the results. And where is Romania now? Oh yes, irrelevant!
@QPHashSS77 Silivas in no way deserved a vault medal. She even admitted it in her recent interview with David Lease. She basically said "the judges and everyone felt sorry for me after barely losing the AA at a major meet again, so I guess they just decided oh her you go, a bit of a gift for you- a vault medal." Johnson or Stoyanova deserved the bronze instead of her. And Dagmer Kersten 6th in vault finals, what the fuck, her vaulting is horrible.
Preliminary scores carried over in those days. Brandy's prelim scores weren't high enough to catch the top girls, unless they all made a mistake. It wasn't just Silivas, the judging was generous for all of the Soviet, Romanian and East German girls. Otherwise, Brandy likely would've been in the top 3 going into the Finals.
@@tylerbam7183 I always wondered how it was that Dagmar Kersten was even in vault finals. The split legs in post flight was atrocious looking. I'm guessing the DDR leotard helped.
Oh the irony, Bart Connor said that Kersten should not have gotten a "10" with her hop on the dismount; however, he received a "10" on the parallel bars in 1984 with an obvious feet slide on his dismount.
Many Eastern Bloc gymnasts were given blatantly overinflated scores throughout history, no one gripes about that. And before you say anything, I’ve seen his routine and it was far more subtle than Kersteb with a VERY VISIBLE HOP! The second an American gets a “gift” it’s a travesty. Talk about selfish bias.
@@maxglendale7614 and how many unrealistic scores were given to eastern bloc countries over the years? Right, too many to count!! People don’t whine about that so it shows their blatant bias and hypocrisy.
The problem for her in the AA was beam- she had some uncharacteristic bobbles that cost her in the end. Also blame the carryover scores- she’d have won in spite of a less than perfect beam without that part factored in.
@@saragrant9749 She was also a weak vaulter. Elena had no weak event, she was the better gymnast and that's consistent Silivas failed to ever place ahead of her in the aa at world/olympic level. Dobre at her peak was better for the same reason.
@@RuaridhDavidson agreed. I was so gutted when Aurelia was too injured to really be competitive at Seoul, being the world AA champion she could definitely have contended sans the knee issue. At least she did leave with the team medal, but what could have been!!
@@RuaridhDavidson Shushunova was a true all around gymnast. Her style wasn't my cup of tea on all events; I loved her vaults, her floor tumbling was very innovative, and her bars had very good difficulty. Beam was jam packed, I wasn't a huge fan of her rhythm/composition for that era, but by today's standards it would be the class of the field. I am not sure I agree about Dobre vs Silivas. Dobre was a better vaulter for sure at her peak than Silivas. Floor was good as Dobre's lines were impeccable, but Silivas had better and more difficult tumbling. Silivas was just flat out better on uneven bars, Dobre's swing left me unimpressed. Dobre had gorgeous beam composition, but tended to have broken connections and fewer flight elements than either Sil or Shush who both had errors in 1987. I'd also add Silivas was a stronger compulsory gymnast (than everyone really). But , she never could do more than a mediocre middle of the road vault at her best . Dobre had a stronger event at the 87 Worlds, but I actually think both Shushunova and Silivas were stronger all around gymnasts at their peaks.
And Shushunova 9.625 with a fall? That literally isn't possible, a fall is a .5 deduction so she couldn't have anything higher than a 9.5. Plus that first tumbling pass is a deduction but they deducted nothing for Silivas landing short on her first pass, so I guess I could overlook with the silly Seoul judging overall, but 9.625 with a fall is impossible.
For all of those complaining about the scoring at these Olympics: 1. There were two 10s awarded in event finals. 2. Why not give Dagmar Kersten a 10 for her stellar bars routine if Phoebe Mills got a 9.95 for her ordinary routine with a step? 3. Personally, I wanted Boriana Stoyanova from Bulgaria to medal on vault, as opposed to Daniela Silivas. However, her coaches had her compete a vault w/a 9.9 start value!?! Those complaining probably applauded Simone Biles winning an AA world championship with 3 falls and Shawn Johnson becoming Olympic champion on beam! Lovely scoring system!
What part of Dagmar taking a hop on landing eludes you? A hop should have resulted in no more than a 9.95, the same as Phoebe. Stellar or not an error is an error! And yes, the judging WAS biased in a big way towards the Eastern European countries- anyone with actual eyeballs could see that. You want to complain about Phoebe on bars? How about Sillivas having multiple landing deductions on floor that were completely ignored! How about Shushunova having multiple checks on beam that were ignored!
Szabo had a fall on her dismount off of the uneven bars in the team optionals, so her carry over score was a lower than she would have liked. She undoubtedly would have taken the gold in the AA if that hadn't been the case. Perhaps she would have taken a bronze in the bars final if she qualified.
Funny how you only complain about Mary Lou but not all the Soviet gymnasts given ridiculously overinflated scores throughout the years. Hypocrisy much?
WOW they were just giving away 10's up in the 80's...... a skip here, a hop there, a slide everywhere and still gave a 10???? These judges clearly had their favorites..... and they the judges obviously cheated on brilliant gymnasts.... Phoebe Mills deserved a silver not a bronze.
im confused with the adjective that the older commentator used, he described potorac as a handsome gymnast with beautiful blue eyes..and yet potorac is a female...why use handsome? can someone please clarify?
Personally, I think Mills deserved silver on beam with Shoushounova being the one to tie for bronze. She often got over-scored by the eastern bloc judges.
@@andradasa I never did. Comaneci was given some of her 10’s in 1976- on routines that didn’t have a stuck dismount! That is the definition of NOT a perfect 10.
Silivas's bars had excellent form, perfect handstands and a solid landing... but her amplitude on the releases was so lacklustre compared to Thuemmler's. Given Thuemmler's knee form break and the tiny landing fault, I think a 9.95 would be suitable for both of them. I know people often go on about how Kersten's 10 was undeserved compared to Silivas, but I really think Silivas was overscored too in this instance. Only a year later we'd get Fan Di's incredible performance at Stuttgart, and look at those releases against Silivas'
The choreographer for Pheobes floor is horrible. You can tell that she used similar baby moves for other gymnasts, all the way up to the 96 Olympics. Always Karolyi girls. Moceanu in 96, Kim Zemeskal, on and on. Hated those routines.
The scoring was absurd and stupid. Shushonova fell on her butt on floor and I expected at least 2 judges to throw out a 10 at that point. The 10’s awarded to some of these routines was absolute insanity
One of the best gymnastics finals ever. Silivas was just amazing.
Great competition that was marred by very inconsistent, unfair judging. Sillivas should not have won floor with some of her landings, your silver medalist in bars was a joke and so on and so on.
@@saragrant9749Rubbish. Silivas was the best on floor throughout each competition, from Compulsories, Team Optionals and Finals. Or have you forgotten that back then scores carried over from the Team events?? NONE of the finalists came close to Daniela Silivas in Compulsory Floor Exercise where she received a richly deserved perfect 10.00! She was at least .50 better than any of the other finalists' Compulsory Floors alone!
@@mysticalmargaret6105 no, I haven’t forgotten. Her final floor routine was not even close to a 9.987, not with how she landed on her first tumble. It was a laughable score given only by reputation and nothing more. 9.887 would have been more appropriate.
Agree! Daniela deserves gold for being the only gymnast that could make the “robot move” cool
I loved loved both Yelena and Daniella. I could never form a favorite. 1988 women’s gymnastics was so amazing.
RIP Elena. She recently passed away so young. What an amazing gymnast
She really was an amazing gymnast. She was also a wife and a mother. While my heart breaks for the gymnastics world, it breaks even more for her husband and their son who are left behind. 💔🙏🏻
@KristinCortez For years I tried to wrap my brain around it. I blamed terrible quality of Russian health care, thought perhaps Elena had fallen to some habits that compromised her health (not having seen her for 30 years).
But then last fall, Mary Lou Retton came very very close to dying of the same thing. The pneumonia hit her out of nowhere, and she was negative for Covid, RSV, everything. A complete wtf. 🤯 So now, seeing a pattern, I'm kind of worried about Tatiana Gutsu.😬
@@KristinCortezI had heard she passed but at first didn’t understand how it could happen to someone that young. When I heard pneumonia… just bizarre and tragic.
@@DianaDeLunaagree so young. My teammate from college passed only at 42 from pneumonia and was always the beacon of health. 😢
@@DianaDeLunaI had bad pneumonia in late May- early June 2024. I was hospitalized two weeks had to have a chest tube. It was staphylococcus. Probably MRSA. All those antibiotics and the bacteria alone kicked me into an autoimmune reaction with high platelets. Don’t know about what Mary Lou’s was or the others but sepsis sets in and you’ve got a problem.
Daniela Silivaș ..the best!!!
Silivas is one of my favorites ever. Gymnastics was so much better in those days! ❤
RIP Shoushounova - for me, she really had it all as a gymnast.
I only wish she’d kept going after 1988, she could definitely have made the 1992 team. Did she choose to retire after these games or did injuries force her to stop?
Queen 👸 of gymnastics 😎👸Silivas
Maybe then but not now
@@Allison-ti5vv you know who is tho
lol not even close. Queen of an era where eastern bloc origin mattered a great deal is more like it. Here for example… Bars? Awesome. Beam? Near perfection. Floor? A complete asinine joke and vault? Even more of a travesty.
👍👍👍
@@saragrant9749
Daniela, is something, you never by..😂😂😂...The hate from your words tels evrything, about you 👎👎..a big lack of common sense..
Phoebe Mills had a gorgeous beam routine.
Agreed!!
She really did, and helped to open the door for the American gymnasts during the era of Soviet controlled judging.
@@saragrant9749 I had no idea it was a majority Soviet panel. TY!
@@pam0626 it wasn’t, but the Soviets carried a huge level of influence on those judges- because they heavily influenced the FIG. Quite often the judge who was from a non eastern bloc area was the one whose scores reflected reality- and were dismissed as a result. You can argue otherwise but history doesn’t lie.
@@saragrant9749 🤣
Now these were the true GOATs for me! Silivas and Elena! Best ever!
With some very generous scores.
great copy, daniela really proven herself and the world that she a true champion in these finals
@16:58 "I agree with you Bart, when you see that noticeable hop on the dismount, there's no way..."
says the gymnast who scored a 10.00 with multiple hops 4 years before. LOL!
Hahaha :)
she can't control that she got a 10 with a hop
And I bet you have no problem with the countless eastern bloc countries that were awarded exaggerated scores simply because of who they were through history… but of course an American or non Eastern bloc person is an issue. Hypocrisy much?
@@saragrant9749 Actually, I have a problem with most imperfect 10s. They should have all scored lower. Silivas's compulsories are some of the very few exceptions that I think deserved the 10.
@@Ian.D. there have absolutely been some very deserving tens, and I agree with Sillivss’ Compulseries. Her score on floor final was extremely overdone and highly unfair to the other athletes who performed cleaner routines but received lower scores. The performance I think of as a ten as well was her bars- THAT was pure perfection. I just know that over the years a lot of people have pointed out the scores of the Americans in 1984 while completely ignoring a great number of others- from the USSR and East Germany in particular- that were even more blatant. Fair is fair.
SILIVAS THE QUEEN
And the only one that could make a perm and robot move cool! She’s my fave ever!
Bars looks so cool this olympics. I know it is harder now, but lots of things look similar. Here there was much more variation. :)
I love Silivas's smile after Elena's floor exercise
Hahahahahha sim , pq no Allaround ela chorou . Agora ela riu
Definitely showed the level of sportsmanship and respect she had… 🙄
@@saragrant9749 Yeah shes a great gymnast but I can't actually think of a more prolific top gymnast who I dislike more as a person. Remember in the aa where she tried to literally psyc out Elena right before the most important vault of her life. Absolute loser behavior, and I'm glad she never got to feel what it's like to be the best gymnast in the world because of it.
@@RuaridhDavidson well, there was also Khorkina celebrating when Presecan stepped out of bounds at Euros one year, Shannon Miller celebrating when Roza Galiyeva fell off balance beam in 1996, and Carly Patterson's "Gee that's too bad " in 2003. Podkopayeva's glacial glare at Mo Huilan (who smirked !)in 1996, Nadia Comaneci blowing cloud of chalk dust in Stella Zakharova's face in 1979 that stand out as worse to me than Silivas' leaning against the boards or giving a half smile. Then again , I never held that against any of them either. This wasn't gymNICEstics _
-these girls were all ruthless competitors.
@@escaflowne9282take2 Those are for sure poor sportsmanship moments, but its very different trying to psyche out your opponents the way silivas did RIGHT BEFORE her performances. Before the most important vault of her life no less. All those you listed happened after/ as a response to a performance of a competitor ( I think with the exception of nadia though correct me if im wrong).
If shushu didnt and have and wasnt known for being utterly nerveless that may have been the push needed to deliver a less than 10.0 vault. Unfortunately for silivas, and thankfully for everyone else, shushunova was a competitor that could not be psyched out by such childish actions.
Queen Daniela!
Daniela Silivas is.the best
Looking at this I’m very pleased they changed scoring system
10 after landing with your chest practically touching your knees is nasty work
While the level of gymnastic is very high, the judging is just absurd and perverse. At some moments the judges seem to be completely out of mind and out of control, or to put it better, completely under control of some perverse forces from outside.
Elle Burger, the head judge who happens to be from East Germany.
@Mellissa Boomer of the Night not sure why you used the orphanages part as an example of perverse control. I think that was actually one of the better aspects of it all. These orphanages were very bleak and most of these children dreamed of representing their country via such a sport as gymnastics. It was seen as something to be proud of and cherish, which is a great thing to develop in our youth. To respect, support, and love your country and develop camaraderie with other countries, which sports allow. Training and pursuing a sport was seen as a blessing and tons of young kids were brought to evaluations by their PARENTS to try to win a coveted spot at a training facility. The fact that they also considered kids in orphanages was good for those children, even if their motivation was to win gold medals (the adults, I mean). They usually asked who was actually interested in the sport and those who volunteered were evaluated physically. You made it sound as though they were forced and kidnapped lol Nadia actually had a similar story, only hers was in her school. Coaches came and ASKED them who was interested and she volunteered. She had the right physicality and was accepted. The trainings are always hard, including in the US…Karolyi trained US gymnasts btw for the majority of his career and so did his wife. Non-athletes simply don’t understand as well as millennials and sensitive genz’s. They also weren’t starved; it’s physically impossible to perform at this level with zero food. They were placed on strict diets, there is a difference. The amount of American gymnasts suffering from disordered eating is too high for you to make this a ‘communist thing’. I’m sorry, I’m not trying to come at you or anything, but your comment was a but unfair and very biased and misinformed. You seem to be blaming a lot on communist countries and the Soviet Union in regards to gymnastics when in reality these things were also rampant in American gyms nationwide, nit just the Karolyi ranch, and I think some of your statements were a bit hyperbolic. Hopefully this helped you see a different perspective on the matter 🤗🤗
@Mellissa Boomer of the Night That’s inaccurate, they didn’t starve them. You saw Shoushounava right. That’s your ethnocentrism. I would’ve love a spot at one of these training camps. Also you know Shannon Miller went to the Soviet Union to train when she was going right? She said their hard work and training strategies made her the gymnast she was and that she tried to adapt as much of it as possible. Also, her coach Nunno had weight requirements as well. Strict ones. That was here in the U.S
@@krisuler7734 Right. As an American child I would’ve given anything to have a scholarship to one of these “terrible” Soviet training camps. Would’ve been a dream come true. It’s hard work, but hard work equals medals and excellence.
Yep, the Soviet Union. It’s been well known for years that they were in the pockets of those cheaters.
Miss the perfect 10 system, but this was a little out of control. Think they had it right in 92 where 10s were possible but only for those rare outstanding moments of excellence.
If they were from the Soviet Union (unified team) to be specific. The 1992 games were the last time the world saw such blatant favoritism from the judges.
Right... @@saragrant9749
That bronze on beam by Phoebe Mills was a big deal at the time. The Americans had success in Los Angeles in 84, but this Olympics which was fully attended in a foreign country was a much more difficult task. It's too bad that politics prevented the USA girls from winning the bronze in the team.
The biggest reason it was so much more difficult was because, with the Soviets there the judges were going to only support them- the ones who were paying their salaries. Yes, the Soviets BOUGHT the scores they got throughout the 1970’s and 1980’s unfortunately. It’s actually been documented since then that this was occurring but sadly no consequence were ever paid. Now at least the judges go based on actual performance.
@@saragrant9749 Unfortunately I believe it. I also want to know what the East Germans did to get such generous scores at this event. They should have finished no higher than fifth. Their Beam scores in particular were laughably inflated.
@@mikeg8375 And vaults also
@@mikeg8375that is absolutely true. Eastern bloc countries had a great deal of influence on scoring.
Part of me really wishes that the IOC should right this wrong, As unrealistic as it may be... But I never would have thought they would have gotten it right with 2000 team bronze, So I suppose anything is possible. I'd love to see it someday.
I remember rushing home from school to watch this and how trendy those short haircuts were! For me, this was the golden era of gymnastics - the perfect mix of power and artistry which is sadly missing nowadays.
And I rushed home from work!!
Superb weren’t they , there is no one in the last 15 years that comes close to these gymnasts, I love watching these videos thankyou so much ❤
The golden era of blatantly biased judging and unfair scoring is more like it.
The US has some very talented and good gymnasts.
Not sure about the hair cut comment! These are very unbecoming styles!
Shush, Bogy, Strazh, Popa, Dobre, Vodnicharova, Dudeva, Potaeac, Cuiting...such amazing greatness here! If only Omelianchik and Mostepanova had been there, too!
Shushunova proved that you do not have to be graceful to be one of the most artistic performers in the field. She is everything a power gymnast should strive to be. Innovative, daring and explosive yes, but also with an incredible and imposing presence and feeling in her performances, such a shame she couldn't deliver in EF, but she had nothing to prove by the point at least. Top 5 of all time, imo top 3 even.
omg those vault scores. How times have changed
Both Bulgarian girls deserved to be on the fx podium
She sure did. Unfortunately politics played a crucial role in scoring.
Love the double tumbling passes.
80s, 90s and 00s were the GOAT for gymnastics.
Graceful Silivas!
Silivas was just perfect
On bars and beam in the individual finals, absolutely- but definitely not floor. In the AA finals, without carryover scores she’d have won.
Back in those days when the top floor exercise gymnasts were actual dancers rather than parkour people...I’m talking about the great Silivas.
Back when country of origin also determined scores.
Yep. Current gymnasts are glorified tumblers. Can’t do much else on the floor at all. Lack grace and elegance.
Now they are robots seeing who jumps higher
For those who complain constantly about overscoring in the Olympics gymnastics today-- THIS IS WHAT OVERSCORING LOOKS LIKE!! People can quit the garbage about being overscored, at least it isn’t like this garbage where judges were blatantly biased and in the pockets of certain countries.
Nice memory of NBC's incredibly awful and embarrassing coverage of the 1988 Summer Olympics. This was the worst television coverage in my opinion. Spent way too much time with interviews, athlete profiles, commentary and the camera lingering on non-competition footage when other routines were being contested they could have shown. And of course there were the numerous commercial breaks making it even worse. I was so happy they had that Triplecast for the 1992 Summer Olympics in Barcelona. That was amazing to see hours and hours of competition without commercials and without national bias.
Actually 1988 Olympics was cast on ABC not NBC
@@sherleybozieux The 1988 Winter Olympics in Calgary were on ABC; The Summer Olympics in Seoul were on NBC. Do your homework because I know I am correct on this.
Mary Lou was an awesome athlete but she sucked as a commentator. She was awkwardly quiet at times which resulted in Bart talking more than he does normally to bail her out... Dick Enberg was a knowledgeable host but unfortunately said some really creepy things that made me cringe... Bart was always an awesome commentator but the dynamic with his two partners did not work...
el duelo de duelos inolvidable
@kentiemacgymnastics9885 - Hi there, thanks so much for all these classic competition uploads, mine got destroyed years ago and it's wonderful to have them available in such good quality! This is a bit of a long shot, but 1 of my videos that got destroyed, was of the Atlanta 1996 gymnastics gala; there were so many wonderful performances and I've never found a complete upload of it anywhere. Was wondering if by any chance, you had any of it at all in your collection? ☺️
Bar routines were so cool looking these times..as were all the apparatuses
Fenomen❤ Silivas❤Felicitari!❤
Boginskaya was my favorite on the bars
All the romanian gymnasts are queens. And Nadia is the best of the best.
Teodora Ungureanu sadly underrated & underscored.
SILIVAS 3 GOLD EVENT ❤
Repeat for Romania...Szabo lost AA and won 3 golds in 1984 and Silivas repeats it 4 years later! both were deserving of their AA golds
Daniela would have won barring carryover scores. Szabo would have won if she hadn’t FALLEN IN OPTIONAL BARS!!
Legends.
Silivas took a Medal in Every Event, 6 in total. WOW
Antrenorii😮Octavian belu😮Mariana bitang😮superbi oameni😮minunati😮
Shushunova didn’t deserve 10 on bars.. sorry
Dont worry... Its true
@QPHashSS77 Totally agree with you. That Silivas compulsory floor routine is one of the most perfect pieces of gymnastics EVER.
She didn’t deserve the All around Gold.. it was Silivas
There were several highly inflated scores during those games, costing some very deserving athletes their rightly deserved medals. Unfortunately politics played a crucial role in scoring.
@@billywaynecoakleySoviets always robbed us..a small country but with a big heart 😅❤
Grande❤ Silivas❤Felicitari !❤
Judges handing out 10's like it's the Oprah Winfrey show haha
Bougunskaya!!! My all time fave! 😍
Russian swan.
@@saragrant9749 I love her here too- she was up and coming, and still did so well!!
The scoring in bars other than silivas' routine was just messed up
Welcome to eastern bloc scoring.
Gimnastele din romania❤😮😮aveau performanta😮în lume😮super staruri😮😮😮
Não tinha para ninguém! O duelo era só entre a romena e a russa.
What happens when politics determines scores.
Very strong shushunova.. iron girl from Soviet union
You never won the AA Mary Lou, it was a joke and you know it
You know she'll never see this, right? Know what she CAN see? That gold AA medal.
She wasn’t the only one given scores that were questionable in those games- Szabo had errors that were overlooked as well. Just because your precious Romanian princess didn’t win doesn’t detract from the results. And where is Romania now? Oh yes, irrelevant!
😂😂😂
At one time, someone had posted the entire event finals without commentary. Anyone know if it is still posted somewhere?
Brandy Johnson vault was in the rafters. The height was crazy 🤗🤗🤗. She totally should have outscored Silivas on this event.
@QPHashSS77 Silivas in no way deserved a vault medal. She even admitted it in her recent interview with David Lease. She basically said "the judges and everyone felt sorry for me after barely losing the AA at a major meet again, so I guess they just decided oh her you go, a bit of a gift for you- a vault medal." Johnson or Stoyanova deserved the bronze instead of her. And Dagmer Kersten 6th in vault finals, what the fuck, her vaulting is horrible.
Preliminary scores carried over in those days. Brandy's prelim scores weren't high enough to catch the top girls, unless they all made a mistake. It wasn't just Silivas, the judging was generous for all of the Soviet, Romanian and East German girls. Otherwise, Brandy likely would've been in the top 3 going into the Finals.
@@tylerbam7183 I always wondered how it was that Dagmar Kersten was even in vault finals. The split legs in post flight was atrocious looking. I'm guessing the DDR leotard helped.
silivas was absolutely the best.elena was just supported by judges
Sillivas also got some generous scores- especially on floor. That routine was not 9.987 worthy.
Oh the irony, Bart Connor said that Kersten should not have gotten a "10" with her hop on the dismount; however, he received a "10" on the parallel bars in 1984 with an obvious feet slide on his dismount.
He's american, he can 😜
Many Eastern Bloc gymnasts were given blatantly overinflated scores throughout history, no one gripes about that. And before you say anything, I’ve seen his routine and it was far more subtle than Kersteb with a VERY VISIBLE HOP! The second an American gets a “gift” it’s a travesty. Talk about selfish bias.
@@maxglendale7614 and how many unrealistic scores were given to eastern bloc countries over the years? Right, too many to count!! People don’t whine about that so it shows their blatant bias and hypocrisy.
Wonder if downgrading the FTY to a 9.9 would have made the next quad more interesting and changed a lot of results.
全体を通して、女子体操の床の演技は大好きなんだけど
何回も見たくなるのは
この年のシリバスさんの演技なんだよな
Svetlana The Best voult
I'm dying at the beginning of this vid 😂.
Great answer from Silivas after the questionable All-Around result- wow!
The problem for her in the AA was beam- she had some uncharacteristic bobbles that cost her in the end. Also blame the carryover scores- she’d have won in spite of a less than perfect beam without that part factored in.
@@saragrant9749 She was also a weak vaulter. Elena had no weak event, she was the better gymnast and that's consistent Silivas failed to ever place ahead of her in the aa at world/olympic level. Dobre at her peak was better for the same reason.
@@RuaridhDavidson agreed. I was so gutted when Aurelia was too injured to really be competitive at Seoul, being the world AA champion she could definitely have contended sans the knee issue. At least she did leave with the team medal, but what could have been!!
@@RuaridhDavidson Shushunova was a true all around gymnast. Her style wasn't my cup of tea on all events; I loved her vaults, her floor tumbling was very innovative, and her bars had very good difficulty. Beam was jam packed, I wasn't a huge fan of her rhythm/composition for that era, but by today's standards it would be the class of the field. I am not sure I agree about Dobre vs Silivas. Dobre was a better vaulter for sure at her peak than Silivas. Floor was good as Dobre's lines were impeccable, but Silivas had better and more difficult tumbling. Silivas was just flat out better on uneven bars, Dobre's swing left me unimpressed. Dobre had gorgeous beam composition, but tended to have broken connections and fewer flight elements than either Sil or Shush who both had errors in 1987. I'd also add Silivas was a stronger compulsory gymnast (than everyone really). But , she never could do more than a mediocre middle of the road vault at her best . Dobre had a stronger event at the 87 Worlds, but I actually think both Shushunova and Silivas were stronger all around gymnasts at their peaks.
The handsome young Romanian. Look at those blue eyes.
Silivas so overscored on vault. She even admitted in a recent interview her getting a vault medal was kind of a joke. I feel bad for whoever was 4th.
That would be Borjana Stojanova. I thought both her and Brandy Johnson should've finished ahead of Silivas on that event.
And floor. Her landings on a couple of passes should have been deducted.
Cea mai buna Daniela the Queen
Guuuurl that hair !!! 😂
And Shushunova 9.625 with a fall? That literally isn't possible, a fall is a .5 deduction so she couldn't have anything higher than a 9.5. Plus that first tumbling pass is a deduction but they deducted nothing for Silivas landing short on her first pass, so I guess I could overlook with the silly Seoul judging overall, but 9.625 with a fall is impossible.
the scores were way too high at this time
For certain countries, absolutely.
For all of those complaining about the scoring at these Olympics:
1. There were two 10s awarded in event finals.
2. Why not give Dagmar Kersten a 10 for her stellar bars routine if Phoebe Mills got a 9.95 for her ordinary routine with a step?
3. Personally, I wanted Boriana Stoyanova from Bulgaria to medal on vault, as opposed to Daniela Silivas. However, her coaches had her compete a vault w/a 9.9 start value!?!
Those complaining probably applauded Simone Biles winning an AA world championship with 3 falls and Shawn Johnson becoming Olympic champion on beam! Lovely scoring system!
What part of Dagmar taking a hop on landing eludes you? A hop should have resulted in no more than a 9.95, the same as Phoebe. Stellar or not an error is an error! And yes, the judging WAS biased in a big way towards the Eastern European countries- anyone with actual eyeballs could see that. You want to complain about Phoebe on bars? How about Sillivas having multiple landing deductions on floor that were completely ignored! How about Shushunova having multiple checks on beam that were ignored!
This scoring is ridiculous.
❤❤❤
Interesting to think the wall was still up.
22:00 Daniela Silivas. I have never seen a better routine ever on the beam, unless someone can tell me differently. Maybe Nadia Comaneci in 1976?
Phiebe was the only gymnast,male or female, to bring home a medal for the USA
How did Elena practically land on her head and still get 19.7???
Funny how Mary Lou talks about taking steps when she took a lot of them and still won lol.. Zsabo should had won the all around.
Szabo had a fall on her dismount off of the uneven bars in the team optionals, so her carry over score was a lower than she would have liked. She undoubtedly would have taken the gold in the AA if that hadn't been the case. Perhaps she would have taken a bronze in the bars final if she qualified.
Funny how you only complain about Mary Lou but not all the Soviet gymnasts given ridiculously overinflated scores throughout the years. Hypocrisy much?
Și gimnastele😮s, u, a😮foarte mari staruri😮😮la gimnastica😮performanta foarte mare❤😮❤😮
Daniela silivas😮un mare star😮lidera gimnastica în lume😮😮😮😮
What’s wrong with them ? Such a bad editing of not showing Boginskaya Silver performance .😂
Ooh, 1988 👍🏽 😆
WOW they were just giving away 10's up in the 80's...... a skip here, a hop there, a slide everywhere and still gave a 10???? These judges clearly had their favorites..... and they the judges obviously cheated on brilliant gymnasts.... Phoebe Mills deserved a silver not a bronze.
Yes i m wondering the same question. It was easy to have 10 in 1984 1988
Some of the gymnasts who peformed are not here
I same judging . Giving out 10’s like they’re going out of fashion. Scoring system much better now.
*insane
im confused with the adjective that the older commentator used, he described potorac as a handsome gymnast with beautiful blue eyes..and yet potorac is a female...why use handsome? can someone please clarify?
Very dated use but it means healthy or strong (I think), it was used a lot in Jane Austen times too 😃😅
Why does the vaulting springboard logo look like a behind?
Lol. It was a marker for the gymnast to place thier feet.
The Silivas consolation prize EFs.
I'm sorry, Dorte should've won a medal instead of Dagmar
Personally, I think Mills deserved silver on beam with Shoushounova being the one to tie for bronze. She often got over-scored by the eastern bloc judges.
Yup. Welcome to the Soviet and eastern bloc era of scoring.
The real winner in 1984 was Ecaterina Szabo, that s for sure!
She FELL on optional bars. That doesn’t win you an AA gold, get over it.
@@saragrant9749 so don't say that Comaneci deserves the gold over Davydova 😅
@@andradasa I never did. Comaneci was given some of her 10’s in 1976- on routines that didn’t have a stuck dismount! That is the definition of NOT a perfect 10.
Silivas's bars had excellent form, perfect handstands and a solid landing... but her amplitude on the releases was so lacklustre compared to Thuemmler's. Given Thuemmler's knee form break and the tiny landing fault, I think a 9.95 would be suitable for both of them. I know people often go on about how Kersten's 10 was undeserved compared to Silivas, but I really think Silivas was overscored too in this instance. Only a year later we'd get Fan Di's incredible performance at Stuttgart, and look at those releases against Silivas'
👍👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
14:55
この頃にリンチを実施していたのでしょうか？
凄いですね！
SILIVAS e Schoushounova Duas Rainhas dessa edição .
Boginskaya 👎 ficar em segundo , com esse solo grotesco , tirando as Bulgaras foi um erro !!
Sillivas winning floor was also not correct. She had a couple of noticeable errors too that were not accounted for.
The choreographer for Pheobes floor is horrible. You can tell that she used similar baby moves for other gymnasts, all the way up to the 96 Olympics. Always Karolyi girls. Moceanu in 96, Kim Zemeskal, on and on. Hated those routines.
Nadia Comaneci’s wack acid trip routine from 1978 is worse than all of those
The scoring was absurd and stupid. Shushonova fell on her butt on floor and I expected at least 2 judges to throw out a 10 at that point. The 10’s awarded to some of these routines was absolute insanity
Weird scoring. Don't stick the landing... 10 0? Weird
Welcome to eastern bloc scoring.
this is stick ur landing and u get a medal😭😭
Judging was so bad here...
Silivas , a fost foarte bună cu 7note de zece. A fost nedreptate, pentru ca a fost romanca.
9.625 ...???? It doesn't funny anymore
Elena Couchounova .. Floor .. hmm ... i think 9.000 Is better
The commentators voices are so irritating. I had to take the sound off 🔕