KEF 104/2: STILL ANY GOOD? Vintage KEF vs. Tekton Lore
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 พ.ย. 2020
- Interested in any of the gear after I'm done reviewing it? Visit my website.
2channellistening.com/
This week I am reviewing vintage KEF 104/2 speakers on loan to me from Dave Druzisky at Authentic Audio Idaho. He restores vintage audio equipment. He wanted me to play these, see how they sound after he replaced the Ferrofluid in the tweeters and if the crossovers would need touching.
www.authenticaudioid.com/
I pitted the KEF against my Tekton Lore's which as you can see from Hifi Shark, both speakers on the used market are very close in price - so I surmised this a fair battle of real time price points. (Maybe not!)
Full system used in this comparison, with an Apple DB meter app set to 90db max playback, I really kept it at 85 and below to keep all things equal.
Red Dragon Mono Blocks
Classe CP-700 preamp
Maranta ND-8006 dac/streamer
Base entry level Transparent Speaker Cables
Audioquests Columbia XLR's to amps
Hosa RCA's to Dac
Cheapy Amazon USB Cable (I heard no difference with my $230 silver USB)
#KEF, #Tekton, - เพลง
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Terrific details on the 104.2's - Enjoyed every word. Have two sets of these (gen 2 bi-amp model). Is that a parasound A21 amp on the shelf? Just traded mine in for Parasound JC1 mono blocks. The additional power (800 watts @ 4 ohms) is welcomed by these thirsty speakers. Have also upgraded power cables and speaker cables to near TOL audioquest. My source is an esoteric k-03x. Like you I've purchased all on used market. The result is a warm full sound with great sound stage which your description in this video captures so well. BTW - I am also using a parasound halo integrated to help drive the top end of the speakers. When I changed from high quality silver jumpers to a separate power feed from the integrated, the midrange sound quality improved measurably. The JC!'s have an option for two speaker output - a variation that I will also try one day. Also wondering if I should find my way to a tube preamp.
Hello Scott,
thank you for sharing your gear and experience with the Kef 104's. I bet those JC's are everything you say they are, those certainly are on the list for me as well. Yes, that is an A21 in the background, yet, like you said, these speakers do like lots of power and they opened up so much more with my 500 watt Red Dragons. You have some high quality gear on that list, bet it feels all the more satisfying that you acquired them at more realistic prices!
Good luck on the tube preamp hunt. Modwright and ARC have always been good to me. The best thing you can do is try something, right? Keep enjoying those Kef's. Thank you for watching and commenting - Cheers!
@@2ChannelListening Not sure what power cords or speaker cables you are using. Upgrading to the AQ Tornado power cords yielded a big jump in sound quality - likewise for the speaker cables and interconnects. With regard to source, I originally had a much older esoteric matched with one of their external clocks - a budget friendly choice which was a step above an OPPO. BTW - cost of my 104.2's were set #1 $125 (needed re-foam) and set #2 $475 (re-foam already done). Your point that used gear at a reasonable price can be a real discovery could not be more true!
I'm a long ways away from investing more money in the cables currently. I've had less positive experience with jumps in cable price brackets. My power cords are a mish mash of Audience Fe3, Analysis Plus 10 and Transparent entry level stuff. My speakers cables are Audioquest Go4 and Transparent base music level. AQ Tornado, that's some serious investment.
Wow, you struck gold paying those prices for 104's. I see these appreciating in value for nicely refurbished units. Any experience with the 105/3's?
@@2ChannelListening Considered the 105/3 but finally decided I liked the 104/2 better - at least from listening to youtube videos via headphones. As you said - it's how the music sounds with your eyes closed. Are you listening to an orchestra or to speakers presenting an orchestra? I also believe that the 104/2's are better suited to my normal size listening rooms whereas the 105/3's will probably do better in a large room with a vaulted ceiling. I also have a pair of 105/4 (another $125 purchase). They have the big sound of the 104/2's and the advantage of the pivoting upper unit but on the downside is a slightly slower bass. BTW - all of my cables were purchased used and yield an improvement in sound similar to moving from one amp to another. The end result is a full warm soundstage.
Thanks for the info on your experience with the 105/3. You are the second person to say "pass" on that version. I do plan to get my hands on (at some point) a host of vintage 80's and 90's KEF's. Lot's of good stuff out there. The AR-12's I'm evaluating right now are just amazing for a 40 year speaker. Really alters perspective on what modern manufacturers call "cutting edge". Like the F501's.
Thank you again Scott.
I own 3 pair of 104/2s (one bi-wire pair) and have restored all 3 pair from the ground up. Replaced all capacitors with 5% NP Alcaps, replaced ferrofluid in the tweeters, replaced foam on woofers, re-covered grills, etc.. For the money for a used pair, and restoration, they are still well worth the money.
Fully agree, thank you for sharing. 👍
I bought a pair of these in 1986 from the factory in U.K., after hearing them at a trade show in South Australia (where I lived at the time). These are some of the best sounding speakers ever made. I saw the precision work in the factory. No-one makes things that way anymore.
Spare parts and all, you've got yourself a set up for life. Thank you for watching and posting!
Where can i find replacement tweeters for t33?
@@bartvanransbeeck1341 Could be difficult but very important to replace with original for the same characteristics. Look on E-bay (they come up once in a while), and if necessary buy the mid/center box
Still have my original set bought the first year out, 3 refurbishing latter they are still fantastic, went on a possible replacement journey last month, Personas, Sonus Fabers, B&W, Focal etc with my half speed mastered 45 of brothers in arms, came home and played Why Worry through my beloved KEFs and thought, Why Bother…..they are still that good:)
Great story George, love it and I believe you.
We owned these since 1985. Loved them. Sold them last year to someone who is going to restore them. The cabinets were perfect, the drivers needed replacing. We had the original boxes and manual.
Wow, you must have made that somebody very happy, original boxes to boot...
So I have to ask Lynn, what did you replace those lovely KEF's with? Thank you for watching and commenting.
Great job on the vid and an even better description of what, we as audiophiles listen for, in a pair of loudspeakers. I'm ALWAYS looking for height within the soundstage that I'm trying to create with my rig. I also love when the soundstage is increased and outside the speakers. Not many speakers have the ability to pull it off....Diggin the channel!!!
Thank you Keeferdog. The engineering that went into KEF's reference line is something really special. How they designed it to project up with distance is just amazing. In a big room with lots of power, these speakers blow me away. Thanks for watching.
If you're looking for "height" - look no further than Ohm Walshs - I have a pair of Ohm Walsh 3's that are phenomenal
I have had a pair of these since I purchased them in about 1982. I used a Tandberg 3006A power amp and a Tandberg 3002A preamp to power them along with a Thorens Td126 turntable. I still use this setup today. Other than a repair to the preamp many years ago, the system has been untouched and still sounds amazingly good to me.
That's very impressive, same system all this time. If its good, its good, why change it, right. Thank you for posting Dan.
Great video, thanks for posting!
I'm glad you liked it, thank you for watching and leaving a nice comment. Cheers!
Going to look a a pair of KEF 104.2 today. Thanks for the info. It helped my buying decisions
Good luck. Check the woofer surrounds. Great speakers when well taken care of.
A very enjoyable commentary thank you, I like how you relate the design to the experience.
In July 21 I set up my 104/2s in the garden for our first record club since covid19.
We listened to Daft Punk's Discovery. I have honestly never heard and felt such a palpable presentation of such music before. The dynamics were extraordinary and the album's extravagant effects and soundstaging so tangible that several of us repeatedly laughed out loud whilst sat listening. Given the nature of that album it felt like an aural firework show.
I had been concerned that the absence outdoors of reflected sound might depress the bass response but it turned out that the bass was exceptionally solid and clear as was the whole audio spectrum. I have to agree with you that these are exceptional speakers. I find that driving them with a relatively humble vintage Exposure amp combo (21/18S) works ok though yes a more powerful amp may bring even more to the party. I guess their only realy weakness is that thet ayyenuate the really deep bass.
Terrific experience and share, thank you.
Indeed, when moved to a larger space and fed much more current, I could not believe what I heard from these 104/2's. Incredibly engineered speakers, an absolute bargain at today's used prices when put up against anything modern under $3K. Thank you for watching and sharing the Daft Punk story, I love comments like yours! Keep em fresh and they will treat you right.
I’m 68yrs old, I still listen to my KEF Model 105 Series1 spkrs daily, which I bought new in ‘79, they’re now 44yrs old😳🔊, mint condition, caps were serviced after 20yrs. I still cherish them, for their ability to absorb the listener into their performance qualities. They use fuses, the Series2 used circuit breakers, which produces a magnetic field near the crossover network😖. I recently added a full set of Audio Magic Liquid Nano fuses, which have sharpened the midrange & tweeters accuracy. And sound better every session needing 125hrs of burn-in. I’ll never sell them, after decades of cherishing them, they’ll be a heirloom passed onto my Godson. I listen to visceral music; rock, jazz, fusion & punk, they never fail to deliver regardless of what is played through them🥰.
Thank you for this lovely post sir! Keep the cherishing going! Blessings.
Great vid. I've been into audio for about ten years, but also surrounded by it growing up. I'm the same age as these Kefs, and had been drawn to them since i found out about them, without having hear a set.
A good friend of mine, and former employer, randomly gifts me speakers the last few years, every spring when we get together to go to our local annual audio show. So far, some Dynaco A35, Axiom M22ti, Triangle Titus ES...stuff he'd had aitting around in closets for a few years. I've known he's had some 104/2 this whole time too. But it's not like I've ever asked...
He told me the other week he'll give them to me next year. Cherry finish maybe, not black though.
I know he replaced the tweeters and did ferrofluid some years ago, but not sure if it's already going to be due. Not sure about the woofers/plug.
I don't actually need these in my space. Bookshelves have always sounded great. But I do want these Kefs! Maybe they hang around a bit and I find someone who can go through them and invest in that internal restoration.
All that to preface; do you think I can push them at low/mid volume with a vintage 45w Sansui integrated or 65w Toshiba power amp? I could have access to an old Accuphase E-202 as well. Have been also eyeing more modern (5-10y) integrateds like Musical Fidelity, Moon, Bryston, Classé, Atoll in the 800-1200usd range etc. But probably 50-60w models.
If I went new, my budget would be around something like a Yamaha A-S801, maybe NAD, Marantz.
Right now, I'm satisfied and rarely invest anything into upgrades for years at a time. Mostly just enjoying the generosity of my buddy's spare speakers donations and currently have been loving the Triangles for a year. But looking ahead, I'm interested in a new/new-ish amp around 100w. If I can still enjoy the Kefs down the road, with 50w, I'll ride with that. I may even just immediately get them overhauled before making them a permanent fixture while amp shopping. There's always good stuff on marketplace at any one time locally.
Great Review. I have a pair of KEFs bought in 1989. This past Christmas, I put on Handel's Messiah and the right channel was all but dead. Very muffled. I went on the Audio Blogs and were told by many, 'Just buy some new speakers, those KEFs are old', and 'Replace all of the capacitors', etc. Basically, no help whatsoever. I noticed the surrounds on all of the speaker cones were immaculate. I did find the video on replacing the ferro fluid on the two tweeters and figured that was additional work, but easy to do. I finally got inside the speaker and found the tweeter protection circuit had leaky caps. I mean corrosion had eaten the PCB. I bought two sets of the caps for $6 and BINGO! Back in biz.
Back in business and for far less than anything you could replace those 104/2's with. Nice job Warren.
Thanks for doing this fine review of the KEF iconic speaker sound.
Thank you sir 😊
What other genres of music would you listen to in order to properly audition this model KEF speakers?
@@davidstein9129 I listen to a little bit of everything David. Vocal Jazz, Orchestral, Rock, Blues, Film Scores, etc.
Great insight! One thing the TH-cam stereophile community is missing is commentary on 'vintage' equipment. I just purchased a pair of Klipsch KG 1.5 from the late 90s. They are no slouch and I got them for $100. They have a great wood veneer as well. There is some incredible value out there for budget oriented stereophiles to capture. It's just about navigating through the uncertainty. Thanks for your help 2CL!
Thanks for sharing! Enjoy those KG's. There are hundreds of awesome vintage models out there at pennies of the modern speaker prices.
Got mine back in 1986 at the Military audio club RAF Lakenheath UK. They still play and sound great. I just don't crank them like a did when I was 19.
Nice!
Great video. I have the Raymond Cook versions in my vintage setup, you also forgot to add that the midrange drivers do not have a loudspeaker basket. The mdf enclosure is part of the driver assembly, and the cone and voicecoil assembly is directly bonded to the enclosure, with the magnets coupled to the spider directly through the backplane of the midrange enclosure. This completely illuminates 'ringing'. But good video. Also, these speakers tend to perform better with lower damping factor amps, so valve amps and transistor amps from the 70's and 80's with typical damping factors between 0 and 100 enable the speakers to naturally resonate as they were designed to, modern amps with high damping factors seem to take a lot of the warmth away from the speakers as the electronics try to control the resonant frequencies over the natural forces kef designed into the speakers (the force cancelling rod being just on example). Also the 4 ohm load is a purely resistive load, another very unique feature of these speakers that you failed to mention. And lastly speakers are always the weak link in any system, these speakers will work well with 20 watt per channel, or 200 watt per channel and kef were correct that the amps should be the best most powerful one you can afford, as these speakers will reveal the very best from any amplifier.. 😉👍
REL - why thank you so much for your contribution, I did not come across that tid-bit regarding the bonding to the enclosure. Excellent additional information that only reinforces how special and amazing these speakers are for their era. When one looks at today's reference line, it is not hard to see all of the manufacturing "cost-cutting" compromises made when compared to these older versions. When I first demoed these particular KEF's, they were hooked up to some modded, custom Dynaco mono's. I have to blame the room, they were boomy and lifeless in the midrange. My livelier room with the high powered Class D's played well to their strengths with no real downsides I could notice.
I appreciate your comments accentuating the finer details. Thank you for watching.
@@2ChannelListening if you bring the speakers forward, away from the wall by around 6 feet, and increase the distance between them to at least 12 feet, make your listening position around 20 feet away, and really exercise them with some good volume, you will hear and feel a performance you didn't know was possible..
@@Vintaronica Actually I do. When I brought them back, we had a pair of Marantz MA-9's available. We put them in a family room with 24" distance to back wall, 9' apart and I believe at least 12' back; the 104's played larger than I thought possible for their size. They are a special speaker in the annals for sure.
@@2ChannelListening good man..👍
That makes sense, mine are about 6 or 7ft from the back wall, and powered by a McIntosh MC2205 with a damping factor of 16, and sound fantastic.
I sold these new when they first came out. And yes, we had big separate power amplifiers available even back then. Granted, we had to dodge the T-Rexes to get them…but big power *was* available.
Lol, great post. Thank you.
Interesting setup.
Thank you sir. It's all temporary. Once my new place is finished, I will get more serious about set up dimensions, acoustic panels and whatnot. Thanks for watching, cheers.
I have two sets of 104.2s and played them through different power ensembles, Krell FPB200 + KRC Pre, HK 730 and HK 430, HK Citation Separates...from the 430 to the Krell I was never disappointed! The speaker are original condition and very likely never serviced...I would imaging some day with servicing they may become even better?
Yes, the fluid in the tweeters need to be serviced when they dry out. You will know, left to right balance comes out of focus and they will start to sound off, hard. Plus check your woofer surrounds from time to time, the internal woofer surrounds were susceptible to deterioration.
I bet they do sound marvelous with that Krell power! 👍
I used to have a pair of 104/2s. I miss them very much.
The 104/2 is still a great value, several of refreshed pairs out there. Check Hifi Shark.
Nice review. Seems like you could use a few sound panels to help absorb reflections in your room tho.
Thanks Ben,
the apartment is temporary. I did add a very large heavy curtain behind everything after this video was taken. Thank you for watching and your suggestion. Cheers.
Love my kef 104.2's. I am finally happy not to upgrade again. Big natural sound, wonderful bass and midrange and treble good enough. Listening feels like I'm in my own space ship sometimes, traveling to different lands
Great to hear it Jo Jo. Keep on traveling the galaxies!
@@2ChannelListening thank you my friend. The treble is sublime really 🙉
Loved your video. May you also visit galaxies, wonderful planets, nebula and the wonders of the universe, relationships, deep emotions and the wonder of it all
Like your content thanks for sharing. Great speaker that stands the test of time really well. Did your friend change out the caps as I remember there are quite a few in the big crossover board. Typically British sound but with a techie twist. Try some Linn Isobarik or Some Response 3.8 from Proac. Superb and IMHO, better than many so called esotoric monsters on sale for $1000's more.
Dave did not change any caps yet, the sound was so clean still. I absolutely have Proac on my short list, thank you for the recommendations. Thank you for the compliments, cheers.
Yes to bucket head and yes to the Kef , best preamp I had was the Aesthetix Calypso with vintage tubes. Had to sell my system due to co/ 19 work loss.
Thanks for sharing! Super sorry you had to lose some gear because of C19! I hope you can get it back soon.
It's peculiar. HiFi reviewers from the era were never 100% in favour of Kef 104/2 speakers, especially when coupled with the Kef Kube. And indeed, they do sound better overall without the Kube, but I was never in doubt as to their quality of sound. I have a pair that I bought new in 1989, and they sounded superb when they were demonstrated to me after extensive listening against other comparable units. Their one requirement was an amplifier that was capable of their rather odd challenging load. I've connected amps to mine and the speakers sound dull. But my own amps are Naim NAC42/NAP140, and they cruise the presented load and make these speakers sing. So the secret is that nothing average will do. There is amazing quality locked inside them.
EDIT: As to sound stage, I have found that the 104/2 sound staging is pinpoint. And it is big. It spreads outside of the pair and higher than their height. Back in the day, when I first bought these, the final thing that helped me decide was seeing Sade [with my eyes closed while listening] standing there singing "Is It A Crime", from her album that I took along. It was incredibly real. Even the guy, who was used to demonstrating high-end equipment every day, turned to me and said, "Wow."
Yes, with the right amps, a good sized room with space, these speakers will really perform mind tricks. Very impressive, well balanced speakers. Thanks for watching and posting Andy.
Scott, firstly thanks for the review. I am now far more confident about going for vintage over new in my budget range. Secondly, can you share your test playlist? I heard you mention a couple of things in the middle such as a Buckethead track, but there were others. I tried the link to your site and get an error. I have my own speaker/headphone test list, but I am always on the lookout for things that make them work. Thanks again for the review.
Here are the most played test tracks currently - I should also include Aaron Copland - Billy the Kid. Thank you for watching.
Club For 5 - Brothers In Arms
music.amazon.com/albums/B073JNTNLS?trackAsin=B073T1GD7M&ref=dm_sh_c06d-d17d-ee35-3fda-dce23
Damian Rice - 9 Crimes
music.amazon.com/albums/B0012C27JC?trackAsin=B0012C24CM&ref=dm_sh_c9e7-428e-663b-03ee-35e6b
Tool - Invincible
music.amazon.com/albums/B07W3NP8N5?trackAsin=B07W8HZ9K3&ref=dm_sh_4e8a-df75-c451-f22f-c1b00
Buckethead - Electric Sea - Point Doom
music.amazon.com/albums/B007AHRC2K?trackAsin=B007AHRCO8&ref=dm_sh_e1c1-2db3-ed50-f689-13796
Hanz Zimmer - Time (Inception)
music.amazon.com/albums/B003U9TDII?trackAsin=B003U9OE64&ref=dm_sh_4dee-725d-e2fa-6405-16649
Michael Hedges - The 2nd Law
music.amazon.com/albums/B001VGFEFI?trackAsin=B001VG5OL2&ref=dm_sh_89d6-dd1d-588e-7b25-02ab8
Patrick O’Hearn - Panning the Sands
music.amazon.com/albums/B001QSEFXS?trackAsin=B001QSGJH8&ref=dm_sh_f0c7-14f4-cca8-0078-ec3c9
Incubus - Aqueous Transmission
music.amazon.com/albums/B0013DCC72?trackAsin=B0013D6NN6&ref=dm_sh_fe40-cc63-d5a0-b0a5-773e3
Regina Spektor - Cover of My Guitar Gently Weeps (Movie Soundtrack Kubo)
music.amazon.com/albums/B01HHQSIDA?trackAsin=B01HHQSCDQ&ref=dm_sh_6758-dcd0-f8bf-a2f2-78c6d
Endless Fields Album; Alive in the Wilderness
music.amazon.com/artists/B0713T2TKG?ref=dm_sh_8b5b-6a50-8e2e-659a-6fdc4
Bozzio, Levin, Stevens - Track; Duende
music.amazon.com/albums/B000TPVTPG?trackAsin=B000TPMNE2&ref=dm_sh_ffed-e03b-d771-c9a1-0ae06
Melody Gardot - Live in Europe - Wayfaring Stranger (Bonus Tracks)
music.amazon.com/albums/B0824GH6VY?trackAsin=B0824HDS9Y&ref=dm_sh_19ab-ef64-95b9-fca7-56260
Man, you got me stoked. In the 70s we would say your are 'boss'. WOW, nicely done. The KEF beat the Tektons.
Hi Kevin, man, I think you are hitting each piece. Yes, for this comparison, with the right room set up, the KEF are really something special. I've heard them in larger rooms with even more power, and they blew my mind with their capability and scale. The one limiting factor that kept me from buying them was they just did not perform to my liking with low level listening. That's where my ZU's excel. Thank you for all the watching and feedback Kevin! Cheers mate.
Hell,you can STILL say he's BOSS! We know what ya talking about!
Would have been interesting to see how you liked the KEFs with, and without, the proper KEF Kube in the circuit. I prefer them without the Kube. Great speakers if you can do the work to refresh them and bring them back to life. They do like the big clean power.
No access to the Kube, I certainly would if I could. There will be more vintage KEF's on this channel, I can guarantee that! Thanks for watching and subscribing Blue DC.
I spot a Parasound JC 5? Great amp! I have the A23+ for my little desktop set up under my computer monitor connected to 2 ATC SCM 12 Pro's and my Rel TZero Sub and I am using a Passlabs HPA-1 headphone amp...Trying out a new Gustard x16 dac but i might upgrade to the more powerful Gustard X26 eventually. I got my Parasound used for 899 instead of 1595...my ATC were a dealer demo 1660 instead of 2190..Pas Labs HPA-1 I got used too for 1/3 off.
Hi Penn, its an A21. Nice warm, detailed amp, so much better than the previous generations of Parasound. Alas, it went to a good home locally. The Gustard, what is the difference from the X22 to the X26? Sounds like you have a great set up, especially for desktop use! Let me know how you like your dac, I'm interested in switching out my mainstream Marantz for something a little more off the reservation. Thank you.
@@2ChannelListening X26 pro is newer and had better ESS 9038Pro chips than the X22's cheaper AK4499's. BUT the biggest difference is Gustard's own in hose built clocks just for themselves instead of the ACCUSILICON femtosecond. It will have more bass slam and better soundstage and more detail top end. It can go up against $5000-20,000 dacs now at a fraction of the price for like $1300ish.. Check hifigo.
I got a pair. With Kinergetics Research kba 75 platinun, CEC cd , Mit cables , Rega planar 3 . For around 20 years. And if you put them on wood stand 8 inches so the tweeter is 36 or 37 inches from the floor. Its more than magic. Do the trial. And between 8 or 9 foot. My romm is 14 ft wide and 20 ft long. Its fire 🔥
That's an interesting way to set them up. The crossovers were designed to deal with where the tweeter resides, projecting the sound field up. In a nearfield and mid-field configuration, I'm sure your way works well too. They sounded best to me in a large room, 12ft away with big mono block power, magic indeed!
How does the Tekton Lore do with lower quality amps regarding noise floor? Since it's pretty efficient. I know you did a video comparing amps on it, but that was more about resolution.
Thanks!
The ZU DW and Lore are pretty equal in revealing noise floor of amps. I have not had a noisy tube amp yet to compare, but I did have a cheap class D unit that produced audible noise at my listening position. I have to give extra kudos to the Peachtree Nova150 (v.2), its very quiet on the ZU DW.
The bass section of th e 104/2 doesn't look like an isobaric arrangement. It looks like a tri-chamber 4th order bandpass arrangement, with the drivers loaded by separate sealed chambers and a common vented chamber. KEF referred to the arrangement as a "coupled-cavity" arrangement
Hi Brian,
not sure where I got Isobaric from when I said it. It is a coupled cavity, must have been the two woofer loaded up firing that tripped me. Thanks for pointing that out.
Using a pair of Corellis on stands; SP1051. Fine small room speaker.
Nice! rare birds
The internal drivers in the KEF's have foam surrounds, so I wonder if he replaced those. Really difficult to get to.
Hello MK, one has to come at them by removing the bottom mdf plate. Dave is going to replace them pretty soon.
A other easier steal is the kef P60 K300 ,bbc monitor, a compact 2way, with eton polypro 8" bass and T33 tweeter and simple crossover for phase alignment and 'kube' integrated in K300 'quad pro' amplifier....easy to renew passif components in filter , amazing sound ,even with 113db peaks , best image i heard in 50years audio....if you see a pair , don't hesitate , you need the kef km1 to better it
Cant say I've ever come across a pair of those - thank you for the information.
One small correction. The 104/2s were not top pof the line. The KEF Ref 107s were the top. A similar in concept but bigger speaker with equalization to extend bass and higher power requirements.
Hmmn, thought I mentioned the 107. Thanks.
What kind of receiver is needed for the KEF 104/2? Please help
Bucket is a force of nature.
He is
Is this KEF the speaker that elicited the advice;
Minimum Power 200wpc
Maximum Power 201wpc
?
LOL, I have not heard that one before. Certainly the 104/2 respond better to big power and sound better the harder you push them, until they don't :-)
Hi nice vid, I like what I hear , but are they able to procude verry deep basses ?? Thanks to you ;-)
Thank you. If you were able to find a pair with the Kube Equalizer, it does help push a few extra hz deeper. I would not characterize these KEF's as bass makers, the design errs on the side of flat and as true to a signal as it can produce. You would want the 107's with Kube Equalizer to get in the deeper 20hz range.
I'm super curious about your stereo system's; Are you a buyer who only chases new equipment, or do you take a conservative approach to Hifi, only buying heavily depreciated TOTL speakers from years back? Do you like to mix it up, or like many, you own the same components for over a decade?
I have owned a pair of Kef 104/2 for 10 years, love them!,I agree with you, I’d rather spend $1K than $5k if I'm getting the same sound. Just curious, do you think it's worth me getting my pair serviced and refoamed given I've had them for 10 years?
@@GadgetGuyU.K. Greetings. I would want to know more about your pair before suggesting any changes. The two most common service points are the ferrofluid and the woofer foam donut dust caps. The woofers are very easy to inspect with a flashlight, are the foam dust caps discolored and showing any signs of cracking or separation? Yes replace them for sure. Much harder to determine is the ferrofluid. Just by age and use alone, its a lubricant that will harden and get crusty, so its a good idea to have the tweeters serviced if you want to enjoy another 15 years of bliss with your KEF 104/2's.
Like the pair I reviewed, I could not hear any anomalies with crossover points or loss of extension. Upgrading the crossover components with modern materials is purely a "want to" versus any need. I've been lucky to have lots of speakers through my hands and I think the KEF 104/2's are really special for what they do. Currently I have a new British speaker I am comparing them to right now and for me, yet again, the KEF's are what I would prefer to spend money on.
Thank you for watching and sharing your experience. Keep your KEF's healthy and they will treat your music right :-) Cheers!
Thanks so much for taking the time to write your very detailed and brilliant advice, it is much appreciated! I’ll check the things you mentioned. Best wishes and keep up the good work with your great TH-cam channel!
I got a pair of vandersteen model 1c's (got them for 150 the pair) and although i know my room is not ideal, i dont really like them too much, theres not enough clarity to me and they sound kind of meh in my opinion. Recently i found some vintage mirage m3si's on offerup for $400 for the pair and i think i might get those, theres amazing reviews for them
Hi Alan, first, thank you for watching and commenting. I think the best thing you can do is keep an open mind with older speakers. As you said, finding a pair that will work in your room, with your space and furniture is just as important as what kind of amp you use. It takes patience and willingness to make several adjustments, some big, some little, such as toe in or raking them forward or backward based on your sitting position.
If you buy speakers right, you don't lose money while you are trying them out, so go give those Mirage a try! I wish you luck, remember to have fun with the experience, don't get frustrated, once you find the sound you like, it will all be worth it.
I am thinking on buying a pair of 104.2 fisrt heard them in the 80's a good friend on mine add those driven by a mission amp,i just bought a Classé amp the CA-100 with the Classé 30 pre amp i was wondering would that be a good fit ? Basically is my amp powerfull enough for those speakers ...?
Hello De Luca, very nice choices. About how large is your listening space and how close or far do you plan on sitting to the KEF's? If you are 10' and under, your set up would be wonderful, if you are pushing 12' or more and like moderate volume, I would go for a CA-150 or better.
@@2ChannelListening Thank you for the fast reply and yup mid size room and 10 feet more or less will be the distance and depending on my mood the sound can go from moderate to live concert decibels, my only concern is even if these kef are in beautiful condition and 1 owner only and come with the kube they are still stock i am wondering what will need to be done on them, its basically the only thing stopping me
Really thorough review! How do I know if the ferrofluid in my Kef C80s needs replacement? I didnt realize this was a problem until recently.
Hi Richard, here is some advice from the KEF forums: "As the ferrofluid dries up, the speaker’s high end becomes dull and loses some sparkle. It may not be evident unless one compares it to a speaker with fresh ferrofluid. Typically ferrofluid lasts about 15 to 20 years with normal use. KEF recommends replacing ferrofluid after 15 years. If you go too long with dried up ferrofluid, the tweeter may be permanently damaged. You would start to hear distortion."
Hope this helps! Thank you.
Are they good with tube amps like the wilsenton r8?
That's a tough question. They can work in a mid-field environment with reasonable SPL expectations. However, I found the 104/2's worked best with big wattage.
mine still going strong...since 1984
Terrific! What are you pushing them with?
Thanks for watching.
@@2ChannelListening best setting i had was with a Marantz pm84 mkII but today its in a 5.1 setting with Onkyo TX-RZ730
Are the ferrofluid in tweeters not dried up?
Stated that this particular pair already had the fluid replaced. Sound fantastic and smooth.
do the door stops help?
Being on the 3rd floor with lots of building vibration, they certainly do not hurt. Cheap insurance is what I call them. Thanks for watching & noticing ;-)
Re-capping the KEF with 5% metal poly brings them in to the modern era. More open and cleaner. Don't forget the kube.
Those Kubes, pretty rare these days. Thank you for your thoughts.
I love the kef 104.2's
Total happiness
Music joy
Everything
Glad you enjoy them, keep on enjoying the music. Thanks for watching
@2 Channel Listening line your TH-cam
Here is my record deck, sound's amazing, and because I did the upgrades very satisfying
th-cam.com/video/MIDpEilmfYc/w-d-xo.html
Nice review and glad you leaned toward the KEFs. I have owned a pair for 3 years ($550 off Craigslist). Replaced one tweeter and changed the ferrofluid on both. Several years ago I threw my Luxman M120a amp (8 ohm rated/120 watts) into speaker protection mode (clipping) having pushed the limits. Bought a 200 watt Luxman M-117 (1990 year) that handles the KEFs. I will go to a more powerful 4-ohm amp in the near future.
You might want to try Tidal ($10/month or $20/month with MQA). I use HiFishark, so thanks for the tip on saving searches.
Here is a recent 2-minute vid of my KEF 104/2s with Tidal via my iPhone and a Mytek Brooklyn DAC+
th-cam.com/video/GgPAQ2hQDqE/w-d-xo.html
Hi Virgil, thank you so much for the compliment. This past week I've had a chance to spend more time with them at their owners home, whom hooked up a set of Marantz MA9 S1's. Wow, really brought the dynamics of these speakers to life. They really don't mind being punished - such a great speaker, now I'm on the hunt for some nice 105/3's. Good luck in your hunt for "that" special amp. Thanks again for watching.
@@2ChannelListening - I have a friend who unloaded his 105/3s and kept his 104/2s because he thought they sounded better. Happy hunting! I signed up on HiFishark thanks to you 👍👍
Beautiful, please what song is that?
Artist is Buckethead, album Electric Sea - track "Point Doom".
Do you recommend the tekton lore reference?
If you have a very small room or need to listen mid-field, then yes. If you have the extra room, I would step up to the larger Lore.
You can't judge how speaker's respond by using one instrument as a demo.
Agreed.
Nice to see you're still about my friend. My friend refurbished these speakers and posted a few videos of them in action using different amplifiers and Turntables ( Rega RP6 fitted with an Audio Note one ii tonearm, and Rega Rp8) ,on my wee channel.😉
I love my restored pair, but I do love my KEF 107’s better
Nice 👍
Great speakers but a nightmare to service. Unless you are very skilled and experienced you won't be able to refoam / redonut the internal woofers, yes re donut... the internal foam piece. Try to find them. Just taking the bottom plate off is a nightmare since it's glued on so solidly that it can't be removed without breaking it. Good luck replacing the ferrofluid in the tweeter. The work is enormous and the cost is tres expensive.
My buddy Dave at Authentic Audio Idaho did the ferrofluid, said it wasn't that bad. I have seen some folks struggle to get the base plate off for sure. I've seen over half a dozen pairs in the last few months in the States that were refoamed and under $750. It does pay to know a guy...
@@2ChannelListening Some pf the earlier T33s were glued on tightly. Peeling the dome off risks breaking it. Four donuts plus four surrounds is a hell of a lot of work that takes hours and hours. Some 104s had rubber surrounds making it less timely. It's something for the prospective buyer to consider before purchase. Plus you'll need to fabricate two base plates for the chip board ones that are broken to bits when removed. It all happened to me some years ago.
Sorry to hear that. What's your speaker of choice today?
@@2ChannelListening I listen mainly to vintage British designs. I've sold or given to friends many of them like the 104/2s after the retrofit. I now regret ever parting with them. Such a musical speaker.
Speakers I kept and still listen to are Monitor Audio MA3s, Radfords, B&W DM4s, Tangent RS4s and Mission 770s. I know, they're all old but they still sound great to my ear. My favourite being the MA3s which I like as much or more than the 104/2s. Cheers and thanks for keeping the hobby alive.
@@socksumi Whoa, those MA3...never seen those and look nothing like what MA has put out in over twenty years (maybe 30). Those are intriguing. Thanks for watching and I appreciate the kind words. I love this hobby!
I bought my biwire version from Steve Rochlin of enjoy the music fame,they were his faves till he jokingly had to bury them in his yard
Absolute keepers you have
I wonder how many people in the world have gone from listening to Susan Boyle one minute to buckethead the next that I never knew about!🤪🤪🤪🤪😜😉🤗😇
We probably could count the folks on our combined fingers and toes...ha ha.
@@2ChannelListening
You want good frigen music go listen to Gamazda! Mind blowing and not bad to look at!🤪😉😇
@@bigjay1970 Ha ha, I certainly see what you mean...thanks for the recommendation.
@@2ChannelListening
That young lady is incredible and the sound quality is also fantastic! Lucky for me my wife that I've been with for 18 years is no slouch but man I wish she could play like that. Watch her on TH-cam when you get a chance! You seem like a perfect match because she plays a lot of Rock classics!🤗😉😇
kube ?
What's the question? I could not locate one at a reasonable price to use with them, and they were on loan.
Buckethead rules
SPEAKERS SOUND GOOD TRY ISAAC HAYES SHAFT LETS HEAR THAT
Thank you John. I gave the speakers back to Dave (unfortunately). I'll keep Isaac Hayes in mind for future audio playback demos.
is it me or this rooms souns really hollow (zero acoustic treatment) ? and i bet you can put 100k hardware it'll still sound hollow...
Thanks for the contribution Boris
Your room is too LIVE I can hear a lot of reflections and reverb. You need room conditioning. With the tektons they are a Eminence driver. A company that made car speakers, a Kef is a very well made and designed system. You are describing a Jaguar against a Chevy .
Very aware of the room situation despite all the curtains and other treatments I have done you guys cannot see. Only three more months of this room. Ha ha, are you sure you want to call a KEF analogous to a Jaguar - I think the KEF would be rather upset by that...I think the KEF can go years without a maintenance issue! I know first hand a Jag cannot.
@@2ChannelListening
Oh yes!! Both Brit's you have to change the fluid in the Kef tweets
Like you have to change the oil in a jag. I have a pair of AR 9's that is around the same year that the kef's came to market and Never had a fluid change for the tweeters. Now for the Tektons take my ADVICE purchase a second pair of drivers, because when Eminence stop producing that driver and you have a issue with that drive, you will have a back up to replace it. Because his first run of speakers. The drivers was replaced. Paul Klipsch had the same issue with Electrovoice woofers. You will thank me later.
Why do some audiophiles have such crappy taste in music?
LOL, Ryan, you are putting me in a bad spot...
Let me say it this way; our own sound systems allow us to hear so much more inner detail and previously shrouded information that we gain new appreciation for wider varieties of music.
Plus I would just say our tastes change as we get older. For me, I only add more to my plate. I still love hard rock, blasting Buckethead, some Judas Priest, but I can equally appreciate Nora Jones and Aaron Copland. That was not the case 10 years ago.
Thanks for asking!
@@2ChannelListening I've been an Audio Engineer and audiophile for almost 30 years. I listen to a wide variety of music,all of which have more than just one or two instruments. I'm not about pretending. To me a piece of equipment need not require selling a kidney to own it. The art of listening is where it's at, equipment doesn't make you an audiophile, nor does obscure, boring music. I happen to be a jazz lover and I find that more often than not contemporary jazz recordings where real,truly talented musicians , play real instruments are often great reference material.Rather than a lone guitar with lots of reverb being passed off as a high-res reference material, just try a good, rhythmic well recorded jazz piece.If you can pick out the instruments, vocals,etc and hear them individually and as part of a sound stage,that will not only be enjoyable but will show what your system is truly capable of is what I'm alluding to.
@@addonisryan8851 Dave Brubeck and Buddy Rich recordings fit the bill you are alluding to just fine for me. Otherwise, Jazz remains low on my rotation. As to some other points, those who do invest in a good sound system inevitably do spend more time with music and that is a good thing in my book, even if some do it for superficial reasons. Whenever someone's education is used to point out why they have better credentials...well, that's why this hobby statistically remains 99.5% male dominated. Exponentially add to that "good O'l boys club" mentality when music genres and preferences become a litmus test for writing folks off. Sorry, one is only an audiophile if you play Jazz doesn't get me into the club, I'm perfectly fine with remaining the heretic while I crank up the dial on Alice In Chains.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and opinion, it's valuable as a learning tool for sure.
I used to think the same, the reason is the complexity and detail of the music. With Hip Hop or Pop you don't get that level of detail and it doesn't test your equipment like you want to!
@@2ChannelListening I agree, Those recordings are well done and show more of what a system can do.I use the Yellowjackets "Raising our voice album, specifically the 1st track-man facing North.
Bla,Bla
Ha ha...
these old junks.................i used to sell them at a store..............other speakers at much lower prices were far better.............
Old junk...and what pray tell would be those far better speakers at lower prices you allude to? Please share...
Hahaha I love how some people post comments...it's definitely everyone else worstalentscout..with hundreds of reviews and commenters praising the 104/2...but noooo you've got the inside track with the truth...too funny..maybe take your fingers out of your ears
You talk to much in my opinion. Get to what you think about how they freaking sound, please.
Its a process, thank you Ben.