I really like the fact that Dc never retconned Injustice to take place in the Dark Multiverse because it kinda shows the Regular Multiverse can be just as bad and in some cases worst
well that and if we put it in the dark multiverse that would 100% confirm that everything goes to shit in the end and the universe dies. In the regular multiverse bad things can happen just like any other universe but in the dark multiverse everything is definitively going to badly and we will all die.
The dark multiverse is such a stupid idea. There are already dark universes in the multiverse. Like the crime syndicates universe, where good is always doomed to lose. The entire idea is dumb af.
@@DastardlyDavid69 honestly the number 1 thing that makes it dark multiverse is just the part where barbatos destroys it. If I remember right that was kinda the whole thing. World Forger made some shitty universes so he just fed them to his totally not evil pet dragon
He was asked to. He said no because somehow he thinks that would make things worse. Let’s ignore the fact that he can just keep correcting things. He has all the time in the world.
@@DastardlyDavid69 but what if by some freak chance, he gets decommissioned in one of the subsequent timelines? or loses his powers like in Flashpoint, but permanently?
Peak moment is when Alfred takes the pill and gives Superman a beating of a lifetime multiple times over while yelling,"You don't get to hurt my family anymore!" Gave me shivers
@@pocketmarcy6990 the cherry on top is Alfred picking Bruce and teleporting away while saying,"There's nothing worth saving here." With a bloodied Clark on the floor
Ah Injustice, what I would consider the "Patient Zero" of the Evil Superman craze. At the time of when I first learned of Injustice I loved the concept. But now, I sometimes wish that people focused more on the Prime Superman that came at the end of the first game.
It’s weird that this came after the original Invincible and the Boys comics, but it was probably the popularity of this evil superman that allowed the Boys and Invincible to get their own incredible tv shows
Snyder cited the Injustice story as an inspiration for his DCEU. That never should’ve been the launching point for the first live action interconnected dc universe. This was a fun and scary story that shows what’s so special about the normal versions of these characters
I'd actually argue in favor of Snyder's approach to Injustice and Dark Knight Returns: take the cool surface elements while removing the more out of character parts. Batman and Superman may be fighting, but Clark's not Reagan's lapdog and Batman is framed as in the wrong; Superman seems evil because Lois died, but it's actually mind control that made him snap rather than being of his free will.
@@Duiker36 I'm arguing Zack managed to implement the cool surface level aspect of these stories while removing the parts fans typically don't like. Though I'm not sure what you mean by suggestions.
comic accurracy doesn't hold anything on it's own. MCU's Tony Stark is more similar to Superior Iron, basically acting like a selfish villain until Infinity War and i think everyone likes him, with no arguments or discussions for more comic accurracy
@Ashu Ebot-Tabi If Snyder uses only surface level, why the hell he would use them at all and isn't it worse, because all original message and weight of the text is undercut?
Oliver’s death always hurts me. As if the Green Arrow getting beaten to death by Superman, the actual hero murdered by the one regarded as the worlds saviour, we get his perspective as his thoughts slow and his vision fades, and the last thing he thinks of is Dinah. Heartbreaking man. Injustice has its issues as a story, mostly the fact that a lot of the comics are simultaneously of a higher quality but also inconsistent with the games, but some of its moments are immensely powerful
Upside though at least the other universe green arrow and the injustice universe black canary get together. I always really like that even though they both lost their version of the other that connected them even more.
Oliver’s death was sad but it made no sense in the context of the comic. Superman would NEVER murder one of his best friends in cold blood like that. And by that point he didn’t have enough justification for going mad.
@@thecollector4332 he watched his dad almost die, even if it only hit the shoulder it could’ve very easily killed him, combine that with losing his wife and son by his own hand and the arrow bouncing off him, it sent him into a blind unfeeling fury, I’m pretty sure he regretted it later
My favorite part about Injustice, is that the big twist is that the original No Kill Superman is actually stronger than a Superman who can kill. Showing that there is power and strength in restraint.
@@bigkirbyhj666 That's basically what normal Superman is. He doesn't have an issue with killing like Batman does, but why would he? He's Superman. He doesn't need to.
My theory is thar MS is stronger than IS is because IS doesn’t need to fight anymore, so he is extremely rusty compared to MS that was fighting Doomsday, Sinestro and Black Adam moments before.
If Lex Luthor decides to actually become a hero, willingly sacrifices his life to call you out on your shit while throwing his massive ego away, then you probably just did something pretty freaking wrong.
Injustice 2 is pretty shallow when it comes to story, but I love the moment when Supes tells Bruce thar he's just "a scared kid trying to stop two bullets." It hurts to read because we're confronted with how much their relationship has fallen apart that Clark would say such a hurtful thing.
Injustice is such a dark, sad, but also hopeful, and heartfelt story. I especially love when the teen titans are freed from the phantom zone in the injustice 2 comics and Conner becomes the new superman.
Tim Drake is so painful when the Titans are freed. Seeing after all this time him finally get out the phantom zone only to be immediately killed by Zod. And Batman’s reaction too. Dude almost breaks his one rule, not for Joker or Superman for but Zod. Tim was a fresh chance at a Robin again after Dick died and Jason and Damian became lost. But he doesn’t get given that chance.
I hate how the Teen titans were handled in Injustice. At any point during the comics, it never occured to Batman to check up on Tim and see that he was missing? Because if he did, why was it never addressed? Everyone just kind of forgot about them. How could the world's greatest detective not realize he and the remaining titans were trapped in the Phantom zone for 5 years? There were so many better ways to handle their story than what they did with them.
@@l.m.a.9861 so if I remember correctly it was assumed that they were dead. They were on their way to Metropolis when joker's nuke went off, killing beast-boy and badly injuring superboy. They then went to the fortress to help him and superboy and the rest of the Titans were trapped in the phantom zone right after. Not a good answer, but I believe that's what the books went with.
@@jamesrosengrant8675 Not really considering a lot of people knew who survived. There's supermans's parents, plus nightwing who visited them and could've filled in batman, but regardless even if Batman didn't known of Tim's fate, why did they never show him trying to find him or mourn him? It just feels lazily written tbh.
What is incredibly sad to me is that dream. That dream required Batman to go against everything he believed in to bring the world into peace. He had to be the one to kill the Joker.
I always loved to about that part is superman just walking through the wall to let Bruce go and he refuses. Batman suffered for the killing of joker so that superman wouldn't.
And probably the most horrible thing batman could do to superman show him everything he could have had proved him right that batman could have stopped the joker if he wished and only for it to be taken away a dream that would never be
For some reason the scene where Clark heat visions Dinah, she's running toward him, he's on the ground like a cornered animal and she's actively on fire and smoking... That scene hurts me. It breaks my heart and I don't know why. Maybe it's that those two aren't often heroes you see in the same place, in power level, they're not in the same league, the only affiliation they really have, or at least their major affiliation, is just them being friends.
It's kind of insane how dark NetherRealm went with this game's lore and narrative considering how held back MK vs. DC Universe was specifically because there were restrictions on how violently they were able to depict the DC characters Now it's kind of at the point where I'm pretty damn fatigued of "evil Superman" or that archetype in general between Injustice, Snyder's whole edgelord Knightmare thing, Homelander and Omni-Man
I always took Omni-Man as less of an "evil Superman" than a "General Zod who starts as a bad guy, realizes how bad he is and eventually changes." in which case his son Mark is the Superman proxy.
@Hellish Hybrid Kirkman claims he's never watched Dragon Ball Z, but Omni-Man is very similar to Vegeta, the Viltrumite strength increase is similar to that of Saiyans, and hell, Viltrumites in general have a lot of similarities with Saiyans
@@mercury2157 I can see the parallels. Both are incredibly powerful, supremely arrogant races of conquerors. The Viltrumites conquer to bring planets into their empire, the Saiyans conquered at first at the command of Frieza's father and later for profit. Both races send only a single warrior to conquer, the Viltrumites sending their greatest warriors, the Saiyans sending their own children. Both races were nearly wiped out, the Saiyans by Frieza, the Viltrumites by a virus engineered by the Coalition of Planets led by one of their own defectors. Both Vegeta and Nolan arrive with the intent to conquer Earth but later change their ways and married human women. If kinda fits.
@@hellishhybrid1839 Those are probably tropes you can find in any sci fi story. Marvel did the whole "alien sent to conquer Earth who eventually grows to love and protect it" thing with Mar-Vell back in the '60s but I doubt Toriyama nor Kirkman were influenced by that particular character
i was at fort benning and we were doing our final ruck march and idr how far it was but it included this infamous steep climb and to keep the morale up and stop ppl from giving up i legit narrated this whole story from the top of my head for the whole or majority of the march, even the platoon sgts paced so as many ppl could listen. we had the least amount of fall outs and heat casualties.. this story is really good, it just sucks the culture took the worst thing from it they could “evil superman is cooler than proper superman”
Cool story. I just wish more people actually read the material they're clearly interested in. I too hate the "evil Superman is cooler than proper Superman" because it simply isn't true.
I overall enjoy the Injustice comics, it has up and downs like every other piece of media. However, i can't thank enough one piece of media that came out of it: Injustice Year 4 Anual. It's one of the coolest displays of Plastic Man as a serious threat and hero. I don't get enough stories with him, so seeing him in that was amazing.
My favorite Injustice related thing is the final conversation between IJ Batman and Superman in Injustice 2. It’s subtle, honest, and heartbreaking. The look Bruce gives Clark as he tries to find the right words to say, and then Clark just rushing him in a “I don’t want to hear anymore” gesture. It’s actually amazing.
I feel Injustice gets a lot of flak for kickstarting the modern "Evil Superman" trend but the comics like you said can at times be brilliantly written and can do really interesting things because they're not as concerned with staying in line with the main continuity
The comic is just as bad as the games lmao. Dick’s death is still hilariously stupid and Superman’s descent into madness is still horribly written (moreso when you have read more Superman comics and storylines like kingdom come and ending battle) and don’t get me started on how horribly Taylor writes Wonder Woman for absolutely no reason (that backstory they invented for her was a cheap copout to justify bad writing)
@@thecollector4332 I honestly feel bad for Wonder Woman fans whenever she's made to go along with the Evil Superman plotline. The animated Injustice film did a lot of things wrong, but they didn't make Diana a 1D villain after Clarks dick, and I can appreciate that.
I love injustice and similar stories about the heroes being evil. You can't appreciate how great our heroes are until you see the evil they are capable of.
Turns out heroes are better villains than the actual villains. Every time one of them becomes evil they take over they actually accomplish the villains goals
@@kingol4801 Have to disagree on that one, Kingdom Come is a masterpiece and the Justice Lords storyline in the animated show was pure genius, Injustice is Netherrealm bad writing at its finest
@@kingol4801 this man been smoking Crack. Or meth. But whatever it is it got him seriously effed up if he believes injustice is better than the Gloy that is Kingdom Come.
@Legoben98 Productions what do you mean? She doesn't go to jail or face any negative repercussions for her act of terrorism. She tries to atone for what she did but the writers make it seem like her love for the Joker completely clouded her judgment which isn't justifiable. I would like to hear your argument for how she does face consequences for her actions.
@@legoben98productions ok let's look at what she did. She assisted Joker in a huge act of terrorism that killed millions of people. Millions of people and destroyed a city. And what did she get? The Joker died. Harley got away with it. Harley Quinn is a glaring flaw in the story. Because A: are we just assuming that her being abused by the Joker allows her to get away with nuking millions and destroying a city. B: no one treats her in any differently even though she's half of the reason Superman went down his path. C:She makes batman look like a complete monster to superman and any normal person. .As brought up before Harley helped nuke metropolis. She assisted in something that caused alot of death. Yet she's given more sympathy from batman and his group then superman ever received at all. If this story had actual decent writing Harley would've been in jail forever. We wouldn't get in Harlry Quinn moments at all. But you know what let's look at your story. Let's talk about how the one who assisted in mass murder feels and responses to her pasted actions. Let's look at Superman vs the teen titans and Damian Wayne's turn to evil compared to how Harley got away easily. E. The teen titans automatically gain up on Superman at his emotional lowest. They yell at him and call him a monster for killing the Joker who FUCKING KILLED MILLIONS. Batman never forgives an accident that Damien makes in the heat of the moment. He never forgives the depressed teenager, but he's able to just let go of the mass murdering woman who never got called out anyways. F.Stop treating Harley like she's a fucking baby who can't take accountability for her actions. But the worst part is her response to all these actions. Her response for being complicit in the deaths of millions. Is "It wasn't suppose to work he was suppose to save the day and I wanted him to save it". This right her isn't good writing this is her having a pity party for what nothing. She helped nuke a city out of existence and you expect people to forget that. Her arc wasn't good her arc was her generic Joker is a monster who abuses me. Which couldn't work considering the context of this situation. Context matters in writing characters. The fact that Harley had it easier than fucking everyone else's for being a monster leaves a huge hole in the story.
@@mrboerger1620 Injustice was made precisely for that, it's a fucked up situation, Superman then tries to destroy Metropolis and Gotham and if he wasn't prevented he would have killed more than the Joker, the reality is that the whole situation turned into a War, and in the end Harley Quinn, regardless of the past from her she is a soldier, the Green Lantern and the Flash were on the side of the Regime, but then they go to the side of Batman without any punishment, this happens all the time in wars in the real world, countries do horrible things but change sides and become important to contain another threat. Harley Quinn will never be punished because she is an important fighter, she helped stop Superman when he tried to kill more people than the Joker killed in his entire life, she made herself useful, that's the reality, in the end there is no justice, just Injustice. The same goes for Flash and Green Lantern, they should be in prison for being part of the Regime, but since they decided to change sides, they become more useful in helping to protect people on Batman's side as a form of redemption for their crimes than they would be arrested.
Her steve was a nazi and thus shattering her perception of the common man, she loves superman and deep down feels a little guilt to leading him astray. There backstory down .
@jack butt idk about that exactly she actively made things worse and boosted his ego. She took advantage of his loss of lois and his daughter and she used that to gain a position of power. She led him astray on purpose for her own ego.
I really appreciate this video. Sure, Injustice really made the whole evil version fad that didn’t make too many bangers but the series itself is great. From the very underrated comic to the very good video games, it’s a very fun story. Not enough people talk about how much the comics popped off in certain moments, and the games having some voice actors from the DCAU made it all the better. Can’t wait for you to talk about injustice 2.
I simply have to say; As a DC fan, I love your videos. The tone, the music, the research... Everything is awesome. Thank you for this great content of our favourite heroes
The main thing that always annoys me about Evil Superman stories is what they always do with Wonder Woman. Every time he goes evil they throw her character under the bus by having her basically have always been waiting to do it too. Probably because the writer knows that she’s the one that could take him if he actually went too far.
It's like whenever the story sets Superman and Batman to collide, Wonder Woman is either on Supes side then ignored in the main conflict or just a non factor so Bruce and Clark can keep doing the same thing.
Back when the first Injustice was new and a Xbox friend and I would play it all the time, he had a fan theory that the modified Scarecrow fear toxin was still messing with Superman's mind because Scarecrow's toxin is geared to work on human physiology not Kryptonian and Joker laced it with experimental kryptonite. We had a bunch of fun fan theories, but that one has always stuck with me. What if that were true and it was able to be removed from Superman's body? What would he do after being returned mentally to normal with the knowledge of everything he'd done? Seems too dark an outcome to me.
I remember watching an hour long video that showed all the cutscenes to injustice and it hooked me. The story kept my interest and it actually got me to learn more about the comics. I loved all the themes and I loved your perspective on it. Also Mercy Graves????!!
While I appreciate this analysis of the Injustice story as to be something more than just a bloody warscape for superheroes, Part of me still finds it hard to forgive Injustice (and later Man of Steel) for being such a huge catalyst towards the "Superman is a Menace" campaign that somehow got instilled into people's mind during that time I know it's an unfair judgement, but it's hard for me to see any dark interpretation of Superman more than just an honest experimentation of his character Once again, amazing analysis Happy New Year
injustice has runed superman, as much how good injustice series was. this was a mistake by tom taylor. like how game of thrones writing influenced so much deconstruction tv/movies
The major thing I never liked about Injustice was how gleeful Superman was in this incarnation about everything he’d done. I love the idea of Superman having everything taken from him and, slowly but surely, abandoning his principles to become the monster he always feared he’d turn into, as an elseworlds story. But here’s the thing - he did have those fears, and he did want to be better than this. Even if Superman indulged his worst impulses to force the world to bend to his will, he would still be plagued by insecurity and doubt as he wondered whether he’d done the right thing. Moments like “You weren’t the gun!” in the first game came close but when Prime Superman confronts him, Regime Superman should not have been as sure or confident in himself as he was. Prime’s pleas should have struck a chord with him and while he would still ultimately conclude that the Regime was needed, it would be with a heavy heart. He needed to be a lot more conflicted about who he was now, but always find an excuse to push onwards. But the Superman as depicted in Injustice was simply too cocky about what he did, so unabashedly sure that he was the good guy doing the right thing when any version of Superman would know it was wrong. So I love the idea, not so much how they handled it.
They handled it well. Injustice Superman suffered the same fate as any hero-turned-villain. He crossed too many lines and has lost his sanity or sense of purpose - just fighting for himself in the very end.
It's like the reason batman doesn't start killing. If he kills once what's to stop him from crossing the line again and again and again. Everytime you cross the line it gets farther and farther away and at a certain point there is no going back.
@@habijjj he's not Batman though. Batman's no kill rule only works with Batman because of how much of a fanatic and insane he is with his crusade. The same shouldn't be applied to other heroes, especially Superman.
Agreed the execution especially at the beginning could be better especially considering who Superman is. One good example for me would be showing more grief and self doubt and the heroes at least the main ones (Flash, Wonder Woman) heavily disagreeing with Superman to the point where maybe Superman gets a new posee with lesser know but more ruthless heroes.
The injustice series is very interesting story however I am burned out with the whole evil Superman stuff and personally in my opinion part of me actually wishes that injustice Superman does redeem himself and maybe if he meets the other Superman and his son Jonathan Samuel Kent Superboy as his little 10 year old self maybe he will be a good guy again at least that’s what I wanted for injustice 3 but I have a sneaking suspicion that’s not going to happen anytime soon at least In my opinion.
I mean he almost immediately when back to doing the same shit like right away. When brainiac was defeated it should have been done except Clark wanted to go on another killing spree.
@@habijjj agreed he did had one shot of redemption after the defeat of braniac but no instead of doing the right thing he decided to do the exact and opposite and go back to killing again which is just sad because injustice superman was a good guy once.
I never really liked the Idea of a Evil Superman, because the very definition of the Man of Tomorrow is just that. A kid born from Kansas trying to do the right thing, a man in suit, a symbol knowing that tomorrow, today is gonna be a good day. A man like you and me but a man greater than all of us, not because of power but because of compassion, humility, love and most importantly, empathy, that's super. The Omni Man take is probably my only favorite in a narrative stand point because his complete 180 remembering just that, love humility, and family. God damn it, you really have to get me tearing up with the Stay with me Smallville.
God man, I just wanna say all your videos are a trip. The amount of effort and love for these mini films are so good. That intro gets me going every time, and I love everything I’ve watched from you, especially the Batman ones. Thank you.
Agreed. I get the point of the "no kill rule" (in and out of universe), but refusing to kill someone like the Joker rubs me the wrong way. Doesn't help that I have a... weird morality.
I at least like that Superman doesn't completely lose himself. I actually found that more satisfying than dragging it out in a nonsense struggle that keeps getting so big, we forget what this was all about in the first place.
Injustice was an awesome story. That's why I was so disappointed at the Cliffs Notes animated version we got last year. Hopefully it'll eventually get a proper do over one day(as The Death Of Superman did)as an ongoing 5 season series covering each year or at least 5 movies doing the same.
That shit wasn't even the cliff notes version they got essentially every single thing wrong. I mean they killed off the flash and no one said shit about it the rest of the movie.
I find it interesting that DC recently made injustice earth-49 of the multiverse. It's explained that Barry Allen used comic books from earth-33 to see the multiverse.
What I most hated about Injustice is Wonder Woman. I felt like she was there just to take advantage of Louis's death, Clark's grieve, only to take her place as his love interest, doing whatever it takes to be Sups lover, telling him what he wanted to hear instead of what he NEEDED to hear. Now, I'm not a comic reader (I've only read a few), but as far is I know (correct me if I'm wrong) WW never was this stupid. Sure, she's always being portrayed as someone who is not afraid of using violence, but Injustice WW is just brainrot, punching first and asking questions later IF the person she just knocked out still breathes. I droped Injustice pretty soon because of this, I don't know if she changed (I hope so), but fr, I always hated (and always will) Injustice WW.
I feel that Wonder Woman dumped a ton of fuel on a raging fire and made things worse. Then she has the nerve to later act shocked when he murders a bunch of kids. She acted like the devil on the shoulder while Batman was the little angel.
WW in injustice was a true villain. She was supposed to be the friend that guide superman back to the light but in her greed and lust, he empowered superman as a "yes" woman and manipulated him.
oliver queen's death in injustice is still the most gut wrenching thing I have ever read in a comic. I could not stop thinking about it for days afterwards. I have to go read it again
I forgot how good Part 2 is. Gotta reread that shit because the Green Lantern deaths, Gordon’s death, and Black Canary’s surprisingly happy ending hit me like a freight train when I read it for the first time.
Injustice single handedly ruined Superman and has created this annoying trend for people who never even read Superman to just default to this version because he's "more interesting." Injustice Superman completely goes against what Superman would do if he were in that situation or a similar one, but that's why the idea worked initially. I also hate how nobody ever mentions how good Superman had to save the day in that story (the animated movie is a goddamn joke). I genuinely hope we never see an evil Superman arc on film or television ever again now that Gunn is in charge.
i absolutely adore your videos, i started listening to something that was changing ur mind and everytime i listen to it i get happy because i think of ur videos
Injustice is both a great, but also a sad story. Many heroes die or end up becoming misguided/evil and most of them don't really have a home to go back to anymore. As a example in Year 5: The Flash after a argument with Superman decides to go back to Central City only for him to realise that people there don't really trust him anymore or just strayed up fear him.
Beautiful done. It's an amazing comic series and one of my all time favorites and I think it gets hate for silly reasons and people who haven't read it.
the moment when superman went too far was when he had alfred killed. killing green arrow is one thing, (you can blame it on the heat of the moment) but he planned and had alfred killed not just to hurt bruce but because his ego couldn't take that an old british butler got the better of him. that's the moment i knew that there was no going back for this version of clark.
There’s a part of me believes that the Joker got what he deserved. Batman not killing the Joker is Batman’s biggest mistake. Every time Batman locks the Joker back up in Arkham, he escapes and plans his next scheme, which gets people either killed or hurt in the crossfire. The Joker tricking Superman into killing Lois is, to me, the final straw.
I can appreciate the genuine stakes that stories like Injustice or DCeased can lend to superhero stories, which (imo) tend to be terribly lacking in that regard. That said, I really, REALLY prefer my superheroes to not be so bleak and dystopian. The further down this path you go the more it tends to resemble our own reality (in tone at least), and that’s not what I come to superhero stories for. I come to them for a hopeful escape from my own (often) bleak reality.
@@habijjj it’s disingenuous to act like the Injustice universe isn’t dystopian compared to the main DC continuity. To say nothing of the stupid “shock value” deaths, like what happened to Nightwing. That’s not what I want from superhero stories, and I already said as much in my initial post.
I honestly appreciate when the superhero seems bleak but still managed to be optimistic and strive to help the people who have made the heroes lives difficult that I can say if they were able to put up the bs they deal with then so can I.
@@legoben98productions I think the issue for me with Injustice specifically is that Superman is one of my favorite characters, so I’m not all aboard the evil Superman train.
@@nickjanecke6688 I’m the same here, most of them feels poorly written like since UTRH became a thing and changed the background of Batman’s one rule it really damaged his character to how he was more on redemption and rehabilitation for his foes rather than himself becoming a addicted to murder. WW is pretty self explanatory right?
Love this part: the descent 0:02 I like there is death while Superman is becoming more and more terrifyingly a monster of earth the music is so good on showing it
Me, I always saw superman's fall as a tragedy, because if Batman had stopped being such a pissy baby about superman killing the joker and actually had been there for Clark? None of this would have happened. Bruce could have talked superman back from the ledge.
injustice year 1 and 2 really adapts why superman struggles with the easiest of choices to morally hard question, i.e., have batman kill the joker then go back doing the police procedure. or better yet, have Gotham grow a non-rotten brain and death sentence half the super villain due to the many attempts of world genocide. we have WW1 and the Sino Russian economic invasion as IMPORTANT history lessons! in the end though, it's literally superman's genes as a Kryptonian messing with his head and Diana going opportunist concubine on Clark.
Theses comics also have the suicide squad playing wing man to Croc getting hitched to Orca and then a bunch of monkeys marry the two. Not what i was expecting in the middle of a tone of murder
While I don't hate Injustice, I feel it suffers from 2 aspects: the first is the need for Batman to always be unequivocally right and badass, while anyone against him is a loser idiot. Another is an unwillingness to explore these moral dilemmas with nuance: the story acts like the only choices for the characters are either putting villains in revolving cardboard prisons or killing anyone who looks at them funny, as opposed to anything else.
Putting Bruce on a pedestal and being the “goodest good” kind of bugs me too. I sort of feel like if this wasn’t a shitty game fanfic he’d feel very differently about the Joker and Harley murdering Metropolis and Lois and the baby and turning his best friend, a man of good morals who he looked up to as an ideal, into a bitter and lost person. He wouldn’t be smug and he’d channel his and his friend’s pain to be on the same page and try to make sense of it. In the comic he just has an attitude that, to me, read as him feeling resentful that Clark reacted by killing the Joker and losing his way and immediately turned on him because he didn’t live up to his standards. I personally disliked the Injustice Batman as much for that as I did a lot of the Injusticeverse characters.
@@Nightman221k Yeah, I just found Batman to be really dehumanizing towards Clark in the story. He never seems to consider the sheer grief and trauma of what happened.
@@Nightman221k I don't know how you see that. The comics certainly don't put Batman on any pedestal. His inability to sympathize with Clark as much as he should is not treated in a good light, nor is his complete dismissal of Damian following Dick's accidental murder. His inflexible ideals are called into questions many times, he miscalculates a lot of things. He pretty much fails throughout the comics. So he's certainly not portrayed as perfect at all. That being said, I don't agree that he turns against Superman immediately. He disliked what Superman was doing, while admitting that in the same situation, he might be doing the very same thing. He just sincerely believed that Superman, the literal symbol of hope, should not be leading with that sort of example. He always saw Superman as better than he was, and to see him resort to threats and fear was probably quite heartbreaking. In short, Batman put Superman on a very high pedestal, and when he fell from it, Batman was very disappointed. And Batman has never been good with reactions to disappointment.
@@Ares99999 while there is some nuance there in the end of the day superman is the guy that kills kids and becomes a facist dictator and batman is the guy against that ,both the comic and the games frame batman as the "good guy" that was proven right" equal" conflict this is not
Injustice, especially in the comics, was a story I thought I would love seeing; Superman abandon his principles to become a ruthless dictator while Batman leads a group of freedom fighters to oppose him. But the actual handling of it was… sloppy, at best. I think this could have been on par with Gods and Monsters as one of the best elseworlds stories ever told and been a really strong example of why Superman is such a great character and what it would take to drive him to be the opposite of what he always strived for but the actual story was mediocre, the suffering seemed needlessly over the top and the themes it should have hit on just weren’t as strong as they should have been. I wanted to love it, I just sadly couldn’t. At least we got a great DC fighting game out of it tho. 😅
Gods and monsters is incredible and probably the only Superhero story that executes the "bad superman" concept well. Ends on a good and uplifting note.
I only read years 1-3 and they were some of the best comics I'd ever read. Especially since I hadn't actually known of the game until after reading year one. So seeing Superman actually watching the Justice League turn on each other before the other universes interfere was actually terrifying.
Despite evil superman and forever moody and always right batman having etched it's way into the mainstream, I'll always love Injustice and the Justice Lords two parter of the DCAU for showing us why we love Superman. He isn't a tyrant and doesn't let power go to his head even in the worst situations. He helps people wherever he goes even if it's a different universe, to the point where Batman actually smiles. He can be naive but not stupid. He knows he's not always right but doesn't pretend like he is. So when a proper version of himself, the prime one, sees his darker self standing in front of him as a dictator and a murderer, he's rightfully disgusted. And it's so satisfying seeing him beat the snot out of him
I love the comics but I hate how in the end they were beholden to the game. The comic did an amazing job making an understandable Superman who chooses to rule by force but in the game he's maniacally evil so they have to make that turn at the end. The comic sets up Captain Marvel for a long time to the point that'd you'd expect a big climatic fight where he stands up to Superman and is the last real hope to beat him but Superman kills him like a bug in the game so we were never going to get that. I think my favorite moment in the comic is after Sinestro joins the Regime. He's torturing someone for info on where Batman is and Superman stops him. Sinestro takes him to the side and explains that this in necessary in war but it's understandable that he doesn't like it so it's best Superman just leaves and lets him do it in private. Just look the other way. Superman actually listens and leaves but looks sad and bothered as he leaves that man to be tortured .
supes being able to kill Luthor while not making anything gory happen during the strangulation is funny to me w how horribly he murders joker and shazam in this same game, definitely think they were able to do this story's mean cruel concept more justice in the animated movie version with how much more blood and gore was in it
I get the feeling of being tired of "evil Superman," and im right there, but some of them are just good stories, and Injustice is one of them. I don't think the game itself fully justifies Clark's turn, but the comics manage to pull off a very out of character story arc for Superman in a manner that actually makes a lot of sense. I get why Superman dies what he does and why he's the one who does it. I also really got invested in the conflict between Clark and Bruce. I have no idea what happened to Tom Taylor, because his work on Injustice is fantastic, and so much of his other stuff is, well, very much not...(I blame his addiction to Twitter and his obsessive, neurotic preoccupation with and general ignorance of American politics, or at least the ignorant caricature of it as seen through the lense of Twitter)
When i played the game and we bring the Superman of the "normal" world... I felt what i supposed yo feel with this character. HOPE. But of course, contrary to the fim (what is trash) it needed all the bsckstory to feel that way. All the lose, the death of many héroes and even villains, The desperation... Injustice 1 its a pretty well crafted story, even with many narrative problems... But it tolds you how horrible is when the greatest superhero loses everything...
imagine if the games weren't fighting games though and instead similar to the arkham games but instead of fighting batmans rogues you're up against superman
They have a short spin off in the batman beyond comics, so it's part of the DCAU comic universe (multiverse, I suppose) I'm honestly disappointed by the little summary I could find, the idea of a universe where a superhuman team occupies earth for years, horrifyingly dispatches all opposition, then suddenly gets depowered is the very definition of power vacuum, where the traditional hero/villain divide has been destroyed. There's a lot you could do with all that, but they basically seem to be from what I can see mostly "that evil superman is back to his old tricks again"
Only played the game (On Wii U, believe it or not) and I liked the idea of it as well as how the mainline Superman put Injustice Superman in his place. I sort of wonder what would happen if instead of Superman going crazy it was Batman?
![[MV] A leap of faith...ความเชื่อใจครั้งสุดท้าย (From "Petrichor the series")](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/U1piZH2CNXA/mqdefault.jpg)
I really like the fact that Dc never retconned Injustice to take place in the Dark Multiverse because it kinda shows the Regular Multiverse can be just as bad and in some cases worst
I gotta be honest that's why i don't like the Dark Multiverse, or things like Marvel's axis.
well that and if we put it in the dark multiverse that would 100% confirm that everything goes to shit in the end and the universe dies. In the regular multiverse bad things can happen just like any other universe but in the dark multiverse everything is definitively going to badly and we will all die.
The dark multiverse is such a stupid idea. There are already dark universes in the multiverse. Like the crime syndicates universe, where good is always doomed to lose. The entire idea is dumb af.
Dark multiverse was stupid
@@DastardlyDavid69 honestly the number 1 thing that makes it dark multiverse is just the part where barbatos destroys it. If I remember right that was kinda the whole thing. World Forger made some shitty universes so he just fed them to his totally not evil pet dragon
The one time where Flash going back in time would have been useful.
Yes
Yep.
He was asked to. He said no because somehow he thinks that would make things worse. Let’s ignore the fact that he can just keep correcting things. He has all the time in the world.
@@DastardlyDavid69 but what if by some freak chance, he gets decommissioned in one of the subsequent timelines? or loses his powers like in Flashpoint, but permanently?
@@DastardlyDavid69 Do a really need to link the video about Jay Garrick (The CW) explaining that timeline cannot be fix without leaving a mark
Peak moment is when Alfred takes the pill and gives Superman a beating of a lifetime multiple times over while yelling,"You don't get to hurt my family anymore!" Gave me shivers
Best part of the whole comic run
“Alfred knocked your freakin ass out!” ~Harley Quinn
@@pocketmarcy6990 the cherry on top is Alfred picking Bruce and teleporting away while saying,"There's nothing worth saving here." With a bloodied Clark on the floor
Ah, the good ol’ “Butlering”
You don't tug on Superman's Cape ...
_....unless you're Alfred freakin Pennyworth...._
@@pocketmarcy6990 That Harley was ever allowed to have such a large part in the story still bothers me
Ah Injustice, what I would consider the "Patient Zero" of the Evil Superman craze. At the time of when I first learned of Injustice I loved the concept. But now, I sometimes wish that people focused more on the Prime Superman that came at the end of the first game.
It’s weird that this came after the original Invincible and the Boys comics, but it was probably the popularity of this evil superman that allowed the Boys and Invincible to get their own incredible tv shows
All of them, the Injustice Superman included, just seem like lazy knockoffs of Superboy Prime.
@@LordNifty superboy prime is on par or below the evil Superman trope. He was an awful character in a qualitative sense lol.
@@noxXxnocti superboy prime is just a silver age fanboy
There was also Justice Lords Superman and he wasn't NEARLY as unhinged as Injustice Supes, different circumstances though.
Snyder cited the Injustice story as an inspiration for his DCEU. That never should’ve been the launching point for the first live action interconnected dc universe. This was a fun and scary story that shows what’s so special about the normal versions of these characters
I'd actually argue in favor of Snyder's approach to Injustice and Dark Knight Returns: take the cool surface elements while removing the more out of character parts. Batman and Superman may be fighting, but Clark's not Reagan's lapdog and Batman is framed as in the wrong; Superman seems evil because Lois died, but it's actually mind control that made him snap rather than being of his free will.
@@ashuebot-tabi4449 So what's your argument? You've made a few suggestions, but I don't see any reasoning.
@@Duiker36 I'm arguing Zack managed to implement the cool surface level aspect of these stories while removing the parts fans typically don't like. Though I'm not sure what you mean by suggestions.
comic accurracy doesn't hold anything on it's own. MCU's Tony Stark is more similar to Superior Iron, basically acting like a selfish villain until Infinity War and i think everyone likes him, with no arguments or discussions for more comic accurracy
@Ashu Ebot-Tabi If Snyder uses only surface level, why the hell he would use them at all and isn't it worse, because all original message and weight of the text is undercut?
Oliver’s death always hurts me. As if the Green Arrow getting beaten to death by Superman, the actual hero murdered by the one regarded as the worlds saviour, we get his perspective as his thoughts slow and his vision fades, and the last thing he thinks of is Dinah. Heartbreaking man. Injustice has its issues as a story, mostly the fact that a lot of the comics are simultaneously of a higher quality but also inconsistent with the games, but some of its moments are immensely powerful
Upside though at least the other universe green arrow and the injustice universe black canary get together. I always really like that even though they both lost their version of the other that connected them even more.
Oliver’s death was sad but it made no sense in the context of the comic. Superman would NEVER murder one of his best friends in cold blood like that. And by that point he didn’t have enough justification for going mad.
@@thecollector4332 He flipped because one of his arrows almost hit his parents. He had PTSD after Metropolis.
@@thecollector4332 he watched his dad almost die, even if it only hit the shoulder it could’ve very easily killed him, combine that with losing his wife and son by his own hand and the arrow bouncing off him, it sent him into a blind unfeeling fury, I’m pretty sure he regretted it later
@@spacejesus6581 he did they stopped fighting and held a funeral later where he did showup saying he didn't mean to kill him
My favorite part about Injustice, is that the big twist is that the original No Kill Superman is actually stronger than a Superman who can kill. Showing that there is power and strength in restraint.
Honestly I like a superman willing to kill but finds it really distasteful and a last resort.
@@bigkirbyhj666 That's basically what normal Superman is. He doesn't have an issue with killing like Batman does, but why would he? He's Superman. He doesn't need to.
My theory is thar MS is stronger than IS is because IS doesn’t need to fight anymore, so he is extremely rusty compared to MS that was fighting Doomsday, Sinestro and Black Adam moments before.
@@haengeltheknight1212 ngl at first I was confused who MS and IS were.
MS = Main Superman
IS = Injustice Superman
If Lex Luthor decides to actually become a hero, willingly sacrifices his life to call you out on your shit while throwing his massive ego away, then you probably just did something pretty freaking wrong.
In the injustice universe, lex luthor was never a criminal. He was an old friend of super man and the justice league
@@mindblower8774he was a criminal
@@mindblower8774he was a criminal
@@Mayan_88694 not in the injustice universe
@@mindblower8774 show me the comic then
Injustice 2 is pretty shallow when it comes to story, but I love the moment when Supes tells Bruce thar he's just "a scared kid trying to stop two bullets." It hurts to read because we're confronted with how much their relationship has fallen apart that Clark would say such a hurtful thing.
Injustice is such a dark, sad, but also hopeful, and heartfelt story. I especially love when the teen titans are freed from the phantom zone in the injustice 2 comics and Conner becomes the new superman.
Tim Drake is so painful when the Titans are freed. Seeing after all this time him finally get out the phantom zone only to be immediately killed by Zod. And Batman’s reaction too. Dude almost breaks his one rule, not for Joker or Superman for but Zod. Tim was a fresh chance at a Robin again after Dick died and Jason and Damian became lost. But he doesn’t get given that chance.
@@spiralyt309 the writing for Injustice 2 was awful
I hate how the Teen titans were handled in Injustice. At any point during the comics, it never occured to Batman to check up on Tim and see that he was missing? Because if he did, why was it never addressed? Everyone just kind of forgot about them. How could the world's greatest detective not realize he and the remaining titans were trapped in the Phantom zone for 5 years? There were so many better ways to handle their story than what they did with them.
@@l.m.a.9861 so if I remember correctly it was assumed that they were dead. They were on their way to Metropolis when joker's nuke went off, killing beast-boy and badly injuring superboy. They then went to the fortress to help him and superboy and the rest of the Titans were trapped in the phantom zone right after. Not a good answer, but I believe that's what the books went with.
@@jamesrosengrant8675 Not really considering a lot of people knew who survived. There's supermans's parents, plus nightwing who visited them and could've filled in batman, but regardless even if Batman didn't known of Tim's fate, why did they never show him trying to find him or mourn him? It just feels lazily written tbh.
What is incredibly sad to me is that dream. That dream required Batman to go against everything he believed in to bring the world into peace. He had to be the one to kill the Joker.
I always loved to about that part is superman just walking through the wall to let Bruce go and he refuses. Batman suffered for the killing of joker so that superman wouldn't.
The whole dream sequence is probably my favorite part of the whole Injustice comics, it was so damn bittersweet to read
And probably the most horrible thing batman could do to superman show him everything he could have had proved him right that batman could have stopped the joker if he wished and only for it to be taken away a dream that would never be
@@habijjj Honestly I could 100% see normal Superman doing something like that for Batman. They are basically soulmates.
Batman is partially responsible for thousands of deaths, by not killing the Joker.
For some reason the scene where Clark heat visions Dinah, she's running toward him, he's on the ground like a cornered animal and she's actively on fire and smoking...
That scene hurts me. It breaks my heart and I don't know why. Maybe it's that those two aren't often heroes you see in the same place, in power level, they're not in the same league, the only affiliation they really have, or at least their major affiliation, is just them being friends.
"I've done a lot of things I thought I'd never do these last two years... One more won't hurt."
- Superman
Let’s never forget, Diana was the enabler for injustice. Joker was the fuel, but Diana did nothing to put out the flames, she just fed fire.
It's kind of insane how dark NetherRealm went with this game's lore and narrative considering how held back MK vs. DC Universe was specifically because there were restrictions on how violently they were able to depict the DC characters
Now it's kind of at the point where I'm pretty damn fatigued of "evil Superman" or that archetype in general between Injustice, Snyder's whole edgelord Knightmare thing, Homelander and Omni-Man
I always took Omni-Man as less of an "evil Superman" than a "General Zod who starts as a bad guy, realizes how bad he is and eventually changes." in which case his son Mark is the Superman proxy.
@Hellish Hybrid Kirkman claims he's never watched Dragon Ball Z, but Omni-Man is very similar to Vegeta, the Viltrumite strength increase is similar to that of Saiyans, and hell, Viltrumites in general have a lot of similarities with Saiyans
@@mercury2157 Kirkman is straight up capping.
@@mercury2157
I can see the parallels. Both are incredibly powerful, supremely arrogant races of conquerors. The Viltrumites conquer to bring planets into their empire, the Saiyans conquered at first at the command of Frieza's father and later for profit. Both races send only a single warrior to conquer, the Viltrumites sending their greatest warriors, the Saiyans sending their own children. Both races were nearly wiped out, the Saiyans by Frieza, the Viltrumites by a virus engineered by the Coalition of Planets led by one of their own defectors. Both Vegeta and Nolan arrive with the intent to conquer Earth but later change their ways and married human women.
If kinda fits.
@@hellishhybrid1839 Those are probably tropes you can find in any sci fi story.
Marvel did the whole "alien sent to conquer Earth who eventually grows to love and protect it" thing with Mar-Vell back in the '60s but I doubt Toriyama nor Kirkman were influenced by that particular character
Jor el apologizing to the kents for sending Kal el to Earth was some deep shit
i was at fort benning and we were doing our final ruck march and idr how far it was but it included this infamous steep climb and to keep the morale up and stop ppl from giving up i legit narrated this whole story from the top of my head for the whole or majority of the march, even the platoon sgts paced so as many ppl could listen. we had the least amount of fall outs and heat casualties.. this story is really good, it just sucks the culture took the worst thing from it they could “evil superman is cooler than proper superman”
Cool story. I just wish more people actually read the material they're clearly interested in. I too hate the "evil Superman is cooler than proper Superman" because it simply isn't true.
Im afraid people are deeply paranoid about what general audiences actually think about the "evil Superman" thingy.
It’ll always be Fort Benning
Ye old stairway to heaven. Can't believe it's been 10 years since I was at sand Hill
I overall enjoy the Injustice comics, it has up and downs like every other piece of media. However, i can't thank enough one piece of media that came out of it: Injustice Year 4 Anual. It's one of the coolest displays of Plastic Man as a serious threat and hero. I don't get enough stories with him, so seeing him in that was amazing.
Where would you start reading plastic man anyway?
@@DC.edit347 I'd love to know that too, hopefully james gunn gives a him a series or something
My favorite Injustice related thing is the final conversation between IJ Batman and Superman in Injustice 2. It’s subtle, honest, and heartbreaking. The look Bruce gives Clark as he tries to find the right words to say, and then Clark just rushing him in a “I don’t want to hear anymore” gesture. It’s actually amazing.
Your point about the transmedia experience of Injustice is absolutely a great one.
I remember you could buy the comics on Xbox live as DLC when Microsoft points were a thing back then.
I feel Injustice gets a lot of flak for kickstarting the modern "Evil Superman" trend but the comics like you said can at times be brilliantly written and can do really interesting things because they're not as concerned with staying in line with the main continuity
The comic is just as bad as the games lmao. Dick’s death is still hilariously stupid and Superman’s descent into madness is still horribly written (moreso when you have read more Superman comics and storylines like kingdom come and ending battle) and don’t get me started on how horribly Taylor writes Wonder Woman for absolutely no reason (that backstory they invented for her was a cheap copout to justify bad writing)
@@thecollector4332 I honestly feel bad for Wonder Woman fans whenever she's made to go along with the Evil Superman plotline. The animated Injustice film did a lot of things wrong, but they didn't make Diana a 1D villain after Clarks dick, and I can appreciate that.
You usually do well with the intros but man this one hit different, well done!
I love injustice and similar stories about the heroes being evil. You can't appreciate how great our heroes are until you see the evil they are capable of.
Turns out heroes are better villains than the actual villains. Every time one of them becomes evil they take over they actually accomplish the villains goals
I see Injustice as the combination of Kingdom Come and the Justice Lords timeline, making this a crazy universe. Endless suffering on both sides
It is better than Kingdom come. Everything about it is better.
@@kingol4801 lol that's a first
@@kingol4801 Have to disagree on that one, Kingdom Come is a masterpiece and the Justice Lords storyline in the animated show was pure genius, Injustice is Netherrealm bad writing at its finest
@@kingol4801 this man been smoking Crack. Or meth. But whatever it is it got him seriously effed up if he believes injustice is better than the Gloy that is Kingdom Come.
@@kingol4801 what on earth are you on
Harley Quinn walking free after what she did still angers me to this day.
Exactly
I guess you overlooked her story in injustice huh.
@Legoben98 Productions what do you mean? She doesn't go to jail or face any negative repercussions for her act of terrorism. She tries to atone for what she did but the writers make it seem like her love for the Joker completely clouded her judgment which isn't justifiable.
I would like to hear your argument for how she does face consequences for her actions.
@@legoben98productions ok let's look at what she did.
She assisted Joker in a huge act of terrorism that killed millions of people.
Millions of people and destroyed a city. And what did she get? The Joker died.
Harley got away with it. Harley Quinn is a glaring flaw in the story. Because A: are we just assuming that her being abused by the Joker allows her to get away with nuking millions and destroying a city.
B: no one treats her in any differently even though she's half of the reason Superman went down his path.
C:She makes batman look like a complete monster to superman and any normal person.
.As brought up before Harley helped nuke metropolis. She assisted in something that caused alot of death.
Yet she's given more sympathy from batman and his group then superman ever received at all.
If this story had actual decent writing Harley would've been in jail forever. We wouldn't get in Harlry Quinn moments at all.
But you know what let's look at your story. Let's talk about how the one who assisted in mass murder feels and responses to her pasted actions.
Let's look at Superman vs the teen titans and Damian Wayne's turn to evil compared to how Harley got away easily.
E. The teen titans automatically gain up on Superman at his emotional lowest. They yell at him and call him a monster for killing the Joker who FUCKING KILLED MILLIONS.
Batman never forgives an accident that Damien makes in the heat of the moment. He never forgives the depressed teenager, but he's able to just let go of the mass murdering woman who never got called out anyways.
F.Stop treating Harley like she's a fucking baby who can't take accountability for her actions.
But the worst part is her response to all these actions. Her response for being complicit in the deaths of millions. Is "It wasn't suppose to work he was suppose to save the day and I wanted him to save it".
This right her isn't good writing this is her having a pity party for what nothing. She helped nuke a city out of existence and you expect people to forget that.
Her arc wasn't good her arc was her generic Joker is a monster who abuses me. Which couldn't work considering the context of this situation.
Context matters in writing characters. The fact that Harley had it easier than fucking everyone else's for being a monster leaves a huge hole in the story.
@@mrboerger1620 Injustice was made precisely for that, it's a fucked up situation, Superman then tries to destroy Metropolis and Gotham and if he wasn't prevented he would have killed more than the Joker, the reality is that the whole situation turned into a War, and in the end Harley Quinn, regardless of the past from her she is a soldier, the Green Lantern and the Flash were on the side of the Regime, but then they go to the side of Batman without any punishment, this happens all the time in wars in the real world, countries do horrible things but change sides and become important to contain another threat.
Harley Quinn will never be punished because she is an important fighter, she helped stop Superman when he tried to kill more people than the Joker killed in his entire life, she made herself useful, that's the reality, in the end there is no justice, just Injustice. The same goes for Flash and Green Lantern, they should be in prison for being part of the Regime, but since they decided to change sides, they become more useful in helping to protect people on Batman's side as a form of redemption for their crimes than they would be arrested.
A breakdown of Wonder Woman's backstory from Injustice would be amazing video.
Her steve was a nazi and thus shattering her perception of the common man, she loves superman and deep down feels a little guilt to leading him astray. There backstory down .
@jack butt idk about that exactly she actively made things worse and boosted his ego. She took advantage of his loss of lois and his daughter and she used that to gain a position of power. She led him astray on purpose for her own ego.
@@habijjj ok and where do you disagree?
@@habijjj just be reminded that that was injustice WW and not our WW because some people deadass dislike her for a none Canon story
@@Potato_Sama Just as they do with all the involved, sups, bats, shazam, ollie... No one left unharmed.
I really appreciate this video. Sure, Injustice really made the whole evil version fad that didn’t make too many bangers but the series itself is great. From the very underrated comic to the very good video games, it’s a very fun story. Not enough people talk about how much the comics popped off in certain moments, and the games having some voice actors from the DCAU made it all the better. Can’t wait for you to talk about injustice 2.
I simply have to say; As a DC fan, I love your videos. The tone, the music, the research... Everything is awesome. Thank you for this great content of our favourite heroes
The main thing that always annoys me about Evil Superman stories is what they always do with Wonder Woman. Every time he goes evil they throw her character under the bus by having her basically have always been waiting to do it too.
Probably because the writer knows that she’s the one that could take him if he actually went too far.
It's like whenever the story sets Superman and Batman to collide, Wonder Woman is either on Supes side then ignored in the main conflict or just a non factor so Bruce and Clark can keep doing the same thing.
or that they know nothing about wonder woman and jsut think she's "girl superman"
Same with flash to be honest yeah he has some good moments but he can take out Supes if he wanted too. But they always nerf him
not-so-subtle misogyny
Back when the first Injustice was new and a Xbox friend and I would play it all the time, he had a fan theory that the modified Scarecrow fear toxin was still messing with Superman's mind because Scarecrow's toxin is geared to work on human physiology not Kryptonian and Joker laced it with experimental kryptonite.
We had a bunch of fun fan theories, but that one has always stuck with me. What if that were true and it was able to be removed from Superman's body? What would he do after being returned mentally to normal with the knowledge of everything he'd done? Seems too dark an outcome to me.
I need your entire shows play list for every episode good lord 90% of my music has been coming from these
I remember watching an hour long video that showed all the cutscenes to injustice and it hooked me. The story kept my interest and it actually got me to learn more about the comics. I loved all the themes and I loved your perspective on it. Also Mercy Graves????!!
What about it?
While I appreciate this analysis of the Injustice story as to be something more than just a bloody warscape for superheroes,
Part of me still finds it hard to forgive Injustice (and later Man of Steel) for being such a huge catalyst towards the "Superman is a Menace" campaign that somehow got instilled into people's mind during that time
I know it's an unfair judgement, but it's hard for me to see any dark interpretation of Superman more than just an honest experimentation of his character
Once again, amazing analysis
Happy New Year
injustice has runed superman, as much how good injustice series was. this was a mistake by tom taylor. like how game of thrones writing influenced so much deconstruction tv/movies
You would love Kingdom Come. It's a Batman vs Superman story where both people are right and addresses the issue of killing the joker in an adult way.
The major thing I never liked about Injustice was how gleeful Superman was in this incarnation about everything he’d done.
I love the idea of Superman having everything taken from him and, slowly but surely, abandoning his principles to become the monster he always feared he’d turn into, as an elseworlds story.
But here’s the thing - he did have those fears, and he did want to be better than this. Even if Superman indulged his worst impulses to force the world to bend to his will, he would still be plagued by insecurity and doubt as he wondered whether he’d done the right thing. Moments like “You weren’t the gun!” in the first game came close but when Prime Superman confronts him, Regime Superman should not have been as sure or confident in himself as he was. Prime’s pleas should have struck a chord with him and while he would still ultimately conclude that the Regime was needed, it would be with a heavy heart.
He needed to be a lot more conflicted about who he was now, but always find an excuse to push onwards. But the Superman as depicted in Injustice was simply too cocky about what he did, so unabashedly sure that he was the good guy doing the right thing when any version of Superman would know it was wrong.
So I love the idea, not so much how they handled it.
They handled it well.
Injustice Superman suffered the same fate as any hero-turned-villain.
He crossed too many lines and has lost his sanity or sense of purpose - just fighting for himself in the very end.
It's like the reason batman doesn't start killing. If he kills once what's to stop him from crossing the line again and again and again. Everytime you cross the line it gets farther and farther away and at a certain point there is no going back.
@@habijjj he's not Batman though. Batman's no kill rule only works with Batman because of how much of a fanatic and insane he is with his crusade. The same shouldn't be applied to other heroes, especially Superman.
Agreed the execution especially at the beginning could be better especially considering who Superman is. One good example for me would be showing more grief and self doubt and the heroes at least the main ones (Flash, Wonder Woman) heavily disagreeing with Superman to the point where maybe Superman gets a new posee with lesser know but more ruthless heroes.
The injustice series is very interesting story however I am burned out with the whole evil Superman stuff and personally in my opinion part of me actually wishes that injustice Superman does redeem himself and maybe if he meets the other Superman and his son Jonathan Samuel Kent Superboy as his little 10 year old self maybe he will be a good guy again at least that’s what I wanted for injustice 3 but I have a sneaking suspicion that’s not going to happen anytime soon at least In my opinion.
nahh injustice superman is far beyond remption
I mean he almost immediately when back to doing the same shit like right away. When brainiac was defeated it should have been done except Clark wanted to go on another killing spree.
@@habijjj agreed he did had one shot of redemption after the defeat of braniac but no instead of doing the right thing he decided to do the exact and opposite and go back to killing again which is just sad because injustice superman was a good guy once.
Very rarely do I ever hope for a character to die as much as I do with Injustice Wonder Woman
literally finished injustice 2 last night this is great
I never really liked the Idea of a Evil Superman, because the very definition of the Man of Tomorrow is just that. A kid born from Kansas trying to do the right thing, a man in suit, a symbol knowing that tomorrow, today is gonna be a good day. A man like you and me but a man greater than all of us, not because of power but because of compassion, humility, love and most importantly, empathy, that's super. The Omni Man take is probably my only favorite in a narrative stand point because his complete 180 remembering just that, love humility, and family.
God damn it, you really have to get me tearing up with the Stay with me Smallville.
One thing that is story does great is that when it kills a character it doesn’t just forget them we see proper reactions to these characters deaths
Congratulations you’re the lucky winner of the ongoing giveaway text me on telegram to claim your package......🎁
I always wondered why the Injustice Batman didn’t have some version of the Agamemnon Contingency plans.
Every Universe where The Joker turns a hero into a villain is a universe where The Joker wins, even if he's dead.
God man, I just wanna say all your videos are a trip. The amount of effort and love for these mini films are so good. That intro gets me going every time, and I love everything I’ve watched from you, especially the Batman ones. Thank you.
I always really liked the house of magic storyline and how Constantine manipulated everyone.
To the Joker, Injustice is just a normal storyline.
My favorite part of the injustice comics is when Damian makes fun of cyborg and flash when he calls them a-holes. It’s so funny
My favorite thing about injustice 2 was the He-Man comic crossover that came out of it.
He-Man becoming Shazam is incredible!
Seeing the Joker FINALLY rightfully and justify killed by Batman 5:56. For some reason makes my heart explode with butterflies and satisfaction.
Agreed. I get the point of the "no kill rule" (in and out of universe), but refusing to kill someone like the Joker rubs me the wrong way.
Doesn't help that I have a... weird morality.
@@juliagoodwin9510 Honestly I agree with Jason Todd when he said that too. Like the Joker is the ONLY one that would be the best way to save everyone
@@juliagoodwin9510 Batmans no kill rule would make sense if gotham wasn't so corrupt. Then Joker would be given the death penalty.
@@trkg4584 True. Not sure why the mob would want the Joker around. Other than being scared of him, that is.
I'm still mad at WB for the animated movie adaptation. It should have been a full series or 5 movies.
I at least like that Superman doesn't completely lose himself. I actually found that more satisfying than dragging it out in a nonsense struggle that keeps getting so big, we forget what this was all about in the first place.
Injustice was an awesome story. That's why I was so disappointed at the Cliffs Notes animated version we got last year. Hopefully it'll eventually get a proper do over one day(as The Death Of Superman did)as an ongoing 5 season series covering each year or at least 5 movies doing the same.
That shit wasn't even the cliff notes version they got essentially every single thing wrong. I mean they killed off the flash and no one said shit about it the rest of the movie.
There’s a scene before the Superman boss fight in the Batman ending where the dialogue hit hard. I like to call it “men written like actual men”
I find it interesting that DC recently made injustice earth-49 of the multiverse. It's explained that Barry Allen used comic books from earth-33 to see the multiverse.
That's incredibly amazing mate. Having Faith when losing sight of who you are is the best takeaway ever. Thank you so much for that.
What I most hated about Injustice is Wonder Woman. I felt like she was there just to take advantage of Louis's death, Clark's grieve, only to take her place as his love interest, doing whatever it takes to be Sups lover, telling him what he wanted to hear instead of what he NEEDED to hear.
Now, I'm not a comic reader (I've only read a few), but as far is I know (correct me if I'm wrong) WW never was this stupid. Sure, she's always being portrayed as someone who is not afraid of using violence, but Injustice WW is just brainrot, punching first and asking questions later IF the person she just knocked out still breathes.
I droped Injustice pretty soon because of this, I don't know if she changed (I hope so), but fr, I always hated (and always will) Injustice WW.
I live for these uploads
I feel that Wonder Woman dumped a ton of fuel on a raging fire and made things worse. Then she has the nerve to later act shocked when he murders a bunch of kids. She acted like the devil on the shoulder while Batman was the little angel.
deathstroke is so badass in this universe he the goat and the star light in this for me in my opinion.
WW in injustice was a true villain. She was supposed to be the friend that guide superman back to the light but in her greed and lust, he empowered superman as a "yes" woman and manipulated him.
I've been binging your content since the second I got a video of yours recommended to me, love your stuff man keep up the amazing work!
oliver queen's death in injustice is still the most gut wrenching thing I have ever read in a comic. I could not stop thinking about it for days afterwards. I have to go read it again
I forgot how good Part 2 is. Gotta reread that shit because the Green Lantern deaths, Gordon’s death, and Black Canary’s surprisingly happy ending hit me like a freight train when I read it for the first time.
Injustice single handedly ruined Superman and has created this annoying trend for people who never even read Superman to just default to this version because he's "more interesting." Injustice Superman completely goes against what Superman would do if he were in that situation or a similar one, but that's why the idea worked initially. I also hate how nobody ever mentions how good Superman had to save the day in that story (the animated movie is a goddamn joke). I genuinely hope we never see an evil Superman arc on film or television ever again now that Gunn is in charge.
Compromise is an essential element of life. The question is what you’re willing to compromise and when. It’s about what you’re holding onto.
i absolutely adore your videos, i started listening to something that was changing ur mind and everytime i listen to it i get happy because i think of ur videos
Injustice is both a great, but also a sad story. Many heroes die or end up becoming misguided/evil and most of them don't really have a home to go back to anymore.
As a example in Year 5: The Flash after a argument with Superman decides to go back to Central City only for him to realise that people there don't really trust him anymore or just strayed up fear him.
The Injustice Universe, also known as the we can do whatever the hell we want here universe.
Beautiful done. It's an amazing comic series and one of my all time favorites and I think it gets hate for silly reasons and people who haven't read it.
the moment when superman went too far was when he had alfred killed. killing green arrow is one thing, (you can blame it on the heat of the moment) but he planned and had alfred killed not just to hurt bruce but because his ego couldn't take that an old british butler got the better of him.
that's the moment i knew that there was no going back for this version of clark.
Honestly the injustice books are one of my favorite DC storylines it’s so well written to me and truly is the darkest timeline in all of DC to me
There’s a part of me believes that the Joker got what he deserved. Batman not killing the Joker is Batman’s biggest mistake. Every time Batman locks the Joker back up in Arkham, he escapes and plans his next scheme, which gets people either killed or hurt in the crossfire. The Joker tricking Superman into killing Lois is, to me, the final straw.
I can appreciate the genuine stakes that stories like Injustice or DCeased can lend to superhero stories, which (imo) tend to be terribly lacking in that regard.
That said, I really, REALLY prefer my superheroes to not be so bleak and dystopian. The further down this path you go the more it tends to resemble our own reality (in tone at least), and that’s not what I come to superhero stories for. I come to them for a hopeful escape from my own (often) bleak reality.
I mean the injustice universe has never fully gone to shit. And I'm pretty sure the next game we'll get something really interesting.
@@habijjj it’s disingenuous to act like the Injustice universe isn’t dystopian compared to the main DC continuity. To say nothing of the stupid “shock value” deaths, like what happened to Nightwing. That’s not what I want from superhero stories, and I already said as much in my initial post.
I honestly appreciate when the superhero seems bleak but still managed to be optimistic and strive to help the people who have made the heroes lives difficult that I can say if they were able to put up the bs they deal with then so can I.
@@legoben98productions I think the issue for me with Injustice specifically is that Superman is one of my favorite characters, so I’m not all aboard the evil Superman train.
@@nickjanecke6688 I’m the same here, most of them feels poorly written like since UTRH became a thing and changed the background of Batman’s one rule it really damaged his character to how he was more on redemption and rehabilitation for his foes rather than himself becoming a addicted to murder. WW is pretty self explanatory right?
In my view, Kingdom Come will always be Injustice but better in almost every way.
Great video! Looking forward to part 2. I have only played the first game, not the second.
Love this part: the descent 0:02
I like there is death while Superman is becoming more and more terrifyingly a monster of earth the music is so good on showing it
Me, I always saw superman's fall as a tragedy, because if Batman had stopped being such a pissy baby about superman killing the joker and actually had been there for Clark? None of this would have happened. Bruce could have talked superman back from the ledge.
Especially if injustice was made long before UTRH
@@legoben98productions UTRH? what story is that
@@keit99 Under The Red Hood
@@keit99 Under The Red Hood
this is one of the best DC games, story alone.
injustice year 1 and 2 really adapts why superman struggles with the easiest of choices to morally hard question, i.e., have batman kill the joker then go back doing the police procedure. or better yet, have Gotham grow a non-rotten brain and death sentence half the super villain due to the many attempts of world genocide. we have WW1 and the Sino Russian economic invasion as IMPORTANT history lessons! in the end though, it's literally superman's genes as a Kryptonian messing with his head and Diana going opportunist concubine on Clark.
Theses comics also have the suicide squad playing wing man to Croc getting hitched to Orca and then a bunch of monkeys marry the two. Not what i was expecting in the middle of a tone of murder
Would welcome more coverage of Injustice, especially on the comics but the games as well.
While I don't hate Injustice, I feel it suffers from 2 aspects: the first is the need for Batman to always be unequivocally right and badass, while anyone against him is a loser idiot. Another is an unwillingness to explore these moral dilemmas with nuance: the story acts like the only choices for the characters are either putting villains in revolving cardboard prisons or killing anyone who looks at them funny, as opposed to anything else.
Putting Bruce on a pedestal and being the “goodest good” kind of bugs me too. I sort of feel like if this wasn’t a shitty game fanfic he’d feel very differently about the Joker and Harley murdering Metropolis and Lois and the baby and turning his best friend, a man of good morals who he looked up to as an ideal, into a bitter and lost person. He wouldn’t be smug and he’d channel his and his friend’s pain to be on the same page and try to make sense of it. In the comic he just has an attitude that, to me, read as him feeling resentful that Clark reacted by killing the Joker and losing his way and immediately turned on him because he didn’t live up to his standards. I personally disliked the Injustice Batman as much for that as I did a lot of the Injusticeverse characters.
@@Nightman221k Yeah, I just found Batman to be really dehumanizing towards Clark in the story. He never seems to consider the sheer grief and trauma of what happened.
@@Nightman221k I don't know how you see that. The comics certainly don't put Batman on any pedestal. His inability to sympathize with Clark as much as he should is not treated in a good light, nor is his complete dismissal of Damian following Dick's accidental murder. His inflexible ideals are called into questions many times, he miscalculates a lot of things. He pretty much fails throughout the comics. So he's certainly not portrayed as perfect at all.
That being said, I don't agree that he turns against Superman immediately. He disliked what Superman was doing, while admitting that in the same situation, he might be doing the very same thing. He just sincerely believed that Superman, the literal symbol of hope, should not be leading with that sort of example. He always saw Superman as better than he was, and to see him resort to threats and fear was probably quite heartbreaking.
In short, Batman put Superman on a very high pedestal, and when he fell from it, Batman was very disappointed. And Batman has never been good with reactions to disappointment.
@@Ares99999 while there is some nuance there in the end of the day superman is the guy that kills kids and becomes a facist dictator and batman is the guy against that ,both the comic and the games frame batman as the "good guy" that was proven right" equal" conflict this is not
Injustice, especially in the comics, was a story I thought I would love seeing; Superman abandon his principles to become a ruthless dictator while Batman leads a group of freedom fighters to oppose him. But the actual handling of it was… sloppy, at best.
I think this could have been on par with Gods and Monsters as one of the best elseworlds stories ever told and been a really strong example of why Superman is such a great character and what it would take to drive him to be the opposite of what he always strived for but the actual story was mediocre, the suffering seemed needlessly over the top and the themes it should have hit on just weren’t as strong as they should have been.
I wanted to love it, I just sadly couldn’t.
At least we got a great DC fighting game out of it tho. 😅
I thought I was the only one who liked Gods and Monsters.
Gods and monsters is incredible and probably the only Superhero story that executes the "bad superman" concept well. Ends on a good and uplifting note.
@@GeneralBolas Everyone who saw it loved it.
It’s just not many people saw it. 😭
I only read years 1-3 and they were some of the best comics I'd ever read. Especially since I hadn't actually known of the game until after reading year one. So seeing Superman actually watching the Justice League turn on each other before the other universes interfere was actually terrifying.
injustice is literally the one if the worse case scenarios for DC
along with DCeasd and The Metal series
the characterization of diana set us back YEARS
Hal's Redemption in Injustice is goosebumps material
The only nightmore fuel of Injustice is the fact that it got so popular despite being edgy garbage.
The story of Injustice really took me back the the old Elseworlds comics series. Overall, a well done story arc worth the time.
Despite evil superman and forever moody and always right batman having etched it's way into the mainstream, I'll always love Injustice and the Justice Lords two parter of the DCAU for showing us why we love Superman. He isn't a tyrant and doesn't let power go to his head even in the worst situations. He helps people wherever he goes even if it's a different universe, to the point where Batman actually smiles. He can be naive but not stupid. He knows he's not always right but doesn't pretend like he is. So when a proper version of himself, the prime one, sees his darker self standing in front of him as a dictator and a murderer, he's rightfully disgusted. And it's so satisfying seeing him beat the snot out of him
I love the comics but I hate how in the end they were beholden to the game. The comic did an amazing job making an understandable Superman who chooses to rule by force but in the game he's maniacally evil so they have to make that turn at the end. The comic sets up Captain Marvel for a long time to the point that'd you'd expect a big climatic fight where he stands up to Superman and is the last real hope to beat him but Superman kills him like a bug in the game so we were never going to get that.
I think my favorite moment in the comic is after Sinestro joins the Regime. He's torturing someone for info on where Batman is and Superman stops him. Sinestro takes him to the side and explains that this in necessary in war but it's understandable that he doesn't like it so it's best Superman just leaves and lets him do it in private. Just look the other way. Superman actually listens and leaves but looks sad and bothered as he leaves that man to be tortured .
supes being able to kill Luthor while not making anything gory happen during the strangulation is funny to me w how horribly he murders joker and shazam in this same game, definitely think they were able to do this story's mean cruel concept more justice in the animated movie version with how much more blood and gore was in it
“All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day.”
I get the feeling of being tired of "evil Superman," and im right there, but some of them are just good stories, and Injustice is one of them. I don't think the game itself fully justifies Clark's turn, but the comics manage to pull off a very out of character story arc for Superman in a manner that actually makes a lot of sense. I get why Superman dies what he does and why he's the one who does it. I also really got invested in the conflict between Clark and Bruce. I have no idea what happened to Tom Taylor, because his work on Injustice is fantastic, and so much of his other stuff is, well, very much not...(I blame his addiction to Twitter and his obsessive, neurotic preoccupation with and general ignorance of American politics, or at least the ignorant caricature of it as seen through the lense of Twitter)
When i played the game and we bring the Superman of the "normal" world... I felt what i supposed yo feel with this character.
HOPE.
But of course, contrary to the fim (what is trash) it needed all the bsckstory to feel that way.
All the lose, the death of many héroes and even villains, The desperation...
Injustice 1 its a pretty well crafted story, even with many narrative problems...
But it tolds you how horrible is when the greatest superhero loses everything...
The animated movies should've been adapted ver batem, with each movie being an entire year. What a goddamn letdown for one of DCs best comic arcs.
The comic was incredible
My favourite scene from the whole story was Superman and Flash's chess game, brilliant stuff.
imagine if the games weren't fighting games though and instead similar to the arkham games but instead of fighting batmans rogues you're up against superman
This was always the R-rated version of the DCAU's Justice Lords storyline. Which also has its own canonical parallel Earth in the comics, apparently.
They have a short spin off in the batman beyond comics, so it's part of the DCAU comic universe (multiverse, I suppose)
I'm honestly disappointed by the little summary I could find, the idea of a universe where a superhuman team occupies earth for years, horrifyingly dispatches all opposition, then suddenly gets depowered is the very definition of power vacuum, where the traditional hero/villain divide has been destroyed. There's a lot you could do with all that, but they basically seem to be from what I can see mostly "that evil superman is back to his old tricks again"
Say it with me kids.
The👏idea👏of👏a👏evil👏Superman👏is👏terrifying.
Only played the game (On Wii U, believe it or not) and I liked the idea of it as well as how the mainline Superman put Injustice Superman in his place.
I sort of wonder what would happen if instead of Superman going crazy it was Batman?