Andromeda Changed: Millennia of Whitewashing
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- A return to the old... and I don't just mean for the themes of the channel.
Sources:
There's a lot, here.
The works of Ovid
The fragmentary remains of Andromeda by Euripides
The works of Petrarch and Vellutello's commentaries on the works of Petrarch, particularly Triumphus Cupidinis
The Black Andromeda by Elizabeth McGrath: www.yumpu.com/...
These articles, which I read mostly after I was finished writing but convey much of the same information in ways better than I:
www.theroot.co...
artuk.org/disc...
www.bbc.com/cu...
Andromede by Corneille
www.theatre-cla...
Andromeda by Charles Kingsley
The Histories by Herodotus
Interpretations of the myth of Andromeda at Iope by Ted Kaizer
journals.opene...
Geography by Strabo
Vases by the Niobid Painter and other artists
The Library by Apollodorus
I told you it was a lot. This was not an easy video to make. Let me know what you think, please. And again, thank you.
I think Greece has amazing history and I have always loved its mythology.
in todays society, You would be labeled "woke". Receiving all sorts of backlash.
Though, you are very correct. And well researched. I commend you for your good work.
This is so well-researched, it really deserves more eyes on it
Liska Thank you so much! I really appreciate it.
@@MothsAudioandVideos There's no real way to bend the algorithm to my will, but I hope any little bit helps!
It's mostly thankless for now, but it's easy to tell that you're having fun with the work you're putting into your analysis/research deep dives. Thanks for sharing them! They're neat and I'm glad I stumbled across your channel.
I saw the title and shouted YES THANK YOU!!!
Oh my goodness, thank you!
Perseus: So if you’re from Africa…WHY ARE YOU WHITE?
Andromeda: Oh my gosh Perseus you can’t just ask people why they’re White.
✌✌✌✌✌ u r seriously confused poor ting
I love mean girls hahaha
Lol
I first learned that Andromeda was black by her mother Cassiopea's side when reading Thomas Bulfinch's Age of Fable
I feel genuinely betrayed that I never knew this when growing up. I was that one kid in class who was super into Greek Mythology and not once was Andromeda, in ANY of the school books or resources I could find, described or depicted as black
Thank you for informing me of the truth
Seni Pain It is my honor.
Neither was memnon . But the fact the information is there means that modern educators was hiding stuff not the Greeks themselves.
This is Roman/Greek culture period not Sub-Saharan African at all
@@armanigorgio-ly3yjdid you watch the video? it may have been told by Greeks, but they mentioned she was from a land of people who were dark and describe herself as dark
She was VERYYYYY AFRICAN❤
@@AgainTheTruth Show me differently, because of aliens exist, Jesus is white and pigs fly, you mayyyy have a point. If not we will just continue to disagree getting us nowhere...... But if you can prove that she was not infact African. I'll stand corrected 🤔🙏🤭
I've been reading Greek mythology lately, and seemed to notice that the Greeks had loving kind relationship with africans. That was pretty dope. Racism didn't really exist back then. Im not sure where that phenomenon arised from.
Facts
Before the Renaissance, Andromeda was depicted as a black Ethiopian princess, after the Renaissance she was depicted as a white European, it seems artist of the Renaissance didn't care at all for historical accuracy only the promotion of white supremacy.
There was no white supremacy back then. Quite frankly they cared far more about your religion than your skin tone.
And if you think these post medieval artists cared about or were able to produce historically accurate stuff at all then you know nothing about the period
@user-ep2yj6pd8h she was an Ethiopian princess stop being stupid
I actually have read about Andromena being black before but I didn’t know about the comments made by poets and play writes. That’s sad but not surprising. Another great video of yours
Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. We always seem to be erased from history.
thank you mate - I have been interested in the Andromeda legend for years and have recently been meaning to research this angle... You have done all the heavy lifting - cheers - i'm sure there's a lot more to find out on this score - your production is first rate in so many ways - i really dig your objectivity too. More power to your elbow!
I would really like to hear your opinions on what Disney is doing to tachalla and the image of black male heros in general. The only ones we have now (since they are killing off tachalla) are 2 government agents with hand me down hero status ( war machine and falcon captain America).
Terms used when referring to early Africans include Ethiopians, Memphites, Cushites, Thebans, Nubians etc. Note that ancient Greek historians such as Herodotus and Diodorus Siculus used the word Aethiopia (Αἰθιοπία) in reference to the peoples who live immediately to the south of ancient Egypt, specifically, the area which is now known as the ancient Kingdom of Kush, now a part of modern-day Nubia in Egypt and Sudan, and generally, all of Sub-Saharan Africa. The name Aethiopia comes from the ancient Greek word "Aethiops" (Burnt faces] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Ethiopia
Nice vid, thanks for making and sharing
cat k. I appreciate it!
TBF the most active thing Andromeda does is tell Perseus how she ended up where she is.
Another Moth Banger!
nicely done. thank you
Great video. Seems that iconoclasm has been a thing throughout "Greek" history. I'm sincerely starting to wonder whether Hercules of Thebes/Mycenae was also "Black"...
My birthchart, astrology, says that the story of Andromeda is my life story. Persseus left me this lifetime. Maybe for my highest good?
Great Video, Would love more around this time.
Wasn't her father a foreign Phoenician ruler though? Also if it's solely a 16th-century racist agenda why so do so many classical artists also portray her that way?
tyler patti Later Greek and Roman sources connected him with Agenor and Phoenix, but that is in direct contradiction of both Herodotus and Apollodorus, who came much earlier, that list him as a son of Belus, an African king.
Also I didn’t say it was “solely a 16th-century racist agenda.”
@@MothsAudioandVideos
All I could find on Belus himself was that he was an Egyptian king, son of Libya, brother of Agenor, and that he might be a syncretic figure with Baal-Hadad chief deity of Canaan; the former still linking him with North Africa and the latter to Canaan. Even if the former is a latter embellishment the latter, if true would still give him links to the Levant. Though that doesn't necessarily mean Andromeda, is since Belus could also be a later embellishment.
My other question was meant to distinguish the renaissance trend which has more clear roots in modern racial bias and why classical artists, who would not have the same prejudices as more modern artists. I should have been clearer.
@@tylerpatti9038 Thank you for the clarification. As for why several classical artists (though again, not all) portray Andromeda as white or light-skinned, I’d have to address on a case by case basis. Definitely, as briefly mentioned in the video, the traditions linking her to Joppa, though later syncretizations, are still part of cultural storytelling.
This was a very good video. However, I disagree. There is plenty of evidence in Ancient Greece that Andromeda was white. Euripides describes Perseus mistaking her for a marble statue, bowls depicting her as white while having black servants, and more. You also need to note that Aethiopia was presented in a good light costantly in Greek Mythology. The first time we hear of her being black is from Ovid, who was a Roman poet. I think there's a point where it isn't "whitewashing" but the original and established depiction. Also, I'm black myself, so don't call me racist. Great video, though, man. Have a nice day:)
@SirLofHearthaven I did not say that Aethiopia was presented in a negative light in Greek myths. I brought up the bowl that you mention, though I did not mention the marble statue quote, not because I was unaware of its existence, but because for one, not all marble statues made in Greece were made using white marble. Several marbles were shades of pink, yellow, and even black. But for two, these statues that were made on white marble are thought of as white today, but at the time were regularly painted with multiple colors, so I didn't see it as a point against or for either argument.
Ovid may have been the first artist to talk at length about her darker skin color, and I bring him up to illustrate how this was perceived by other cultures that syncretized with Greek culture, but my point is more to say that the term Aethiopian itself references an individual having darker skin. The Ancient Greeks would know what the term Aethiops meant dark skin, and the princess of Aethiopia would only logically be Aethiopian herself.
But I haven't called anybody racist here for disagreeing with me. I see the pottery depicting her with lighter skin than her servants as explained by colorism common across the Mediterranean to depict the royals, who did not work in the sun, as lighter than the working class, but I do not expect everybody to agree with me, and that is what I would consider the best counterargument to the claim that Andromeda has been whitewashed. I respect your comment and don't mind some pushback. Thanks for watching.
@@MothsAudioandVideos You know, that's fair enough. I respect your points even if I disagree with them. Also, I didn't think you'd call me racist, but that someone else might. I think it'd be best to agree to disagree. Have a nice day :)
If I remember correctly, It was her dressed that was described as white. Her skin was described as Dark. She was trapped in Ethiopia. Her parents are both Black Africans.
@@truth9415 There were vases and pots that depicted her as white, and the only one who stated she was black if I remember was Ovid.
@@SirLofHearthaven That doesn't mean anything. Alot of artwork has been whitewashed over the years. What matters more is the historical writings.
She's African. She's Black.
I believe that Andromeda was meant to be a Leucaethiops (black/white biracial). Hence why she is depicted as lighter than the other Aethiopes but still has textured hair.
Agent of Chaos She may have been intended to be biracial, though Leukaethiopes as a concept was Roman, and the vase in question was Greek.
When they did pigment check on the greek statues they found that they were painted blond and blue eyed in ancient times.
It was after that all the depictions of black greeks and greek statues started showing up in popular media.
Trencher1375 Some of those statues had blond hair and blue eyes, but certainly not all of them. At any rate, Andromeda and other characters like Memnon, Cepheus, and Cassiopeia are Black characters in Greek stories, not Black Greeks.
Bravo! 👌
Fake news 📰
What part?
@@AgainTheTruth Alright, clearly you didn’t watch the video.
@@AgainTheTruth Now you’re just lying as I said no such thing about Homer and Herodotus being in agreement. You’re just making stuff up because history offends you.