I'm among them too, lol. My favorite TM game. It can actually be played in TM2 Stadium now, the only thing I don't like is that tracks are put under a medal wall there, the beauty of ESWC was that all tracks were available from the get-go. ESWC definitely has the best soundtrack of all TM games.
TMNF will always be my home when it comes to Trackmania. The nostalgia, the graphics, the bugs, the fact that any dinky laptop can run it... It's the reason I love it and still build maps and play.
14:00 Wirtual did make some videos on TM² Stadium like "I challenged 70 people to build best map" and some other videos on TM² in general like "Trackmania's most hilariously overpowered bug" but the TM² Valley + Canyon are just more WR videos and the TM² Stadium videos were all before TM2020 was released
Couple of us still around running up TMUF and creating content for the rest of the environments forgotten by time. Hurts my heart hearing how much people hate the snow car in TM2020, but I think without the context of "car = environment" with select blocks you're forced to build with gives the different physics much more of an identity. I encourage anyone who's interested in the older TrackMania(s) to give it a shot!
The reason the SnowCar feels so odd in TM2020 is because it's designed to be used in the snow environment. It's the same reason it feels weird when you try using it in a stadium map in TMUF
Since you asked, the one I played most is probably TM2020, the one I grew up with was TMUF, but the one I genuinely wish they gave more love to is TM Turbo
tm20 mappers don't need blender to make great looking maps. Mappers can also do that and they do regularly do it with only vanilla blocks. Those guys work hard. My main problem with the game is that Nadeo sometimes breaks old maps, it discourages mappers.
To this day I’m crying over why they changed the ice physics. The first physics was fun and fast with a lots of tricks but now it’s just hold left then right and hope you’re fast.
I do like your videos Sybreed, but I do feel like there are some missed points about 2020. Firstly, I'm not a fan of the subscription model either, but Nadeo has plainly stated that without the subscription model 2020 would not have existed. So I get not liking it and the personal preference behind that, but I think it's better than the game not existing at all. Another missed point of the subscription model also is that it is mixed model of subscription/purchase. With the sub for the year, you gain access to all campaign maps/totds ever, but for the year for your purchase period you get to keep the 100 campaign maps + 365 TOTDs and you get to keep those even after your subscription ends. I have a gripe with your focus on community, yes 2020 does have more players. But that does not inherently mean that the community is "more divided" or "isolated". Everyone has their own niche, I've encountered numerous close-knit communities within the game, such as the 2020 LOL server, cohesive communities do exist despite the game's scale. But when you don't play it, its easy to make generalizations. Like you mention TM 2020s lack of focus on tech, there is a tech server just for you with a community just as tight as TM2s Lol server. But the most egrigious is when you compare the blandness of TM2020's vanilla campaign server without club access to a modded TM2 server running pyplanet custom leaderboards. This is just incorrect. Yes, you can natively edit your name to have color in TM2 but there are plenty of servers runnning the exact same pyplanet leaderboards that DO allow nick-editing in exactly the same way on 2020. You shun the game you haven't played because you refuse to give it an honest shot(for some reasons valid ,and others not) and deride it for not having features that servers have custom built/added, but also that they do ACTUALLY have. I love TM2 as well, honestly all TM games. But this video definitely comes across more as "Old man yells at cloud" rather than a real look at why you don't play these games because it's pretty plain to see that you haven't really given either TMNF or TM2020 an honest shot and you fundamentally don't really understand either. But hey, I get it. You log on to TM2 and have fun on the LOL server, I don't expect you understand the differences between the 3 games. But it does feel in bad faith when you just get stuff factually wrong. Just my 2 cents, and I hope you don't take this as aggro or as a troll, I just legitimately care about all TM games. (including 2) PS. Im no Wirtual meat-rider, but he has streamed TM2 a few times before and just like you said earlier in the video "Between the two(TM Games) you probably choose the one you started with first" He started with TMNF so that is his game and he's stated thats why he doesn't play it.
The main point was about the payment model. the rest was just nit-picking little annoying things about it, and airing grievances held by others that don't want to make the move. Not trying to hate on anyone in other games, just explaining why I have a hard time getting into the other games...
and also the club systems. I am not sure how hardcore community met it, but for me (relatively new player) it was a convinient way to get along with different styles, events and so on. for example United Unicorns club organize every week the cup for old cars (which I liked a lot, though they are kinda goofy, not gonna lie). There are also other streamers driven regular events.
the maniaplanet 4 update still has a sour taste in my muzzle to this day from all the things that became worse in tm2 since then :c you can't properly skip run endings anymore, the UI is more cluttered with no option to revert, and the netcode was changed so that a lot of the movement is server-dependent, even for restarting runs. imagine a 230ms delay for each time you want to restart a run for the sole reason being that most servers available are hosted in Europe. this wasn't the case in mp3.
You managed to point out all of my problems with TM2020. Great video! I personally don't really play Stadium, but I would probably put TM2 (Maniaplanet 3) as my favorite (It would have been TMT if not for the bugs).
Some very fair points. I also am not a fan of paid subscriptions games. I'd like to underline the fact that Nadeo has always been making too much content for its own good. That was what led to the acquisition by Ubisoft. Nadeo made so much content available for free, that they had to monetize their racing game concept more or face bankruptcy.
11:53 I'm pretty sure I'm right in saying that most of the UI stuff you mention here is added by PyPlanet, not a feature of the vanilla game. And there are PyPlanet servers on TM2020 too. That aside, most of the criticisms of TM2020 are very valid, even as a TM2020 player.
great video! i agree with pretty much everything you said, especially at 8:53 where you said the smaller amount of people the more you recognize each other, like i went OH when i noticed you were sybreed because i've seen you on a few servers before and i've raced against a few of your solo times on like c08 and d02 if i recall
I have to say I agree with all your opinions. Also I didn't know Trackmania 2 existed I thought it was like 2020 with it's subscription live service model I don't support or TM Nations forever which has landing bugs and shit. If Trackmania 2 is the full package that makes it the definitive experience for me specially because lately 2020 has been incorporating other vehicles into tracks and the feel like ass and you're just supposed to be okay with playing with cars that don't feel at all like the stadium car.
I play(ed) Turbo. What you said about the smaller community and get to recognise names applies there too. Pity TM2020 changes maps (and physics) so often, it's hard to stay motivated. After 3 months, your amazing run will be forgotten about...
New player here: I want to play more tm but just can’t because of the subscription. I don’t have enough time to play to justify paying it. So I just decide to not play at all
@@lkdn get TM2 on a discount, excellent game. I got a bundle offer of 4 games- Stadium, Canyon, Valley and United for just about 20 bucks overall. It was a great offer. If you manage to do so, I highly recommend it.
I Think the main reason it is a subscription model (other than to gain copious amounts of money) is like I Racing where if you want to be competitive and play tournaments u gotta pay. The thing is tho is that Ubisoft had locked 75% of the games content behind a paywall and the content that is free is repetitive and I like to think of it as a river there are many rivers (campaign, cotd, community maps, etc) but they all lead to an ocean which is the subscription. This is just my take on TM2020
I respect the stance against subscription models, I also didnt bother engaging with TM2020 because of it. But the alternative to a live-service subscription would just be a new game every 2 years that further divides the community, costs more for less, has different physics that require relearning, has no leaderboard continuity, would probably remove some features every game (such as surface types), etc. Live-service fixes all of this. The downside is that when they do adjust the physics (extremely rare, and only for specific surfaces from what I remember), it does ruin some of the leaderboards, but I think the pros outweigh this. When I think about it like that, I think Trackmania is PERFECTLY suited for a subscription model, I can't think of a more fitting pairing tbh.
@@0sac when did Nadeo ever release TM games yearly? TM2 for example was a collection of environments under the single and convenient Mania Planet. It's not like they released a new game with new interface every year or even 2. And United included all previous environments and even Stadium.
1 year of tm20 is also a collection of environments bundled together in a convienient launcher (Yearly release is an example of an alternative to what the new model could have been in the modern day), I think what we have now is pretty similar to what we used to have, but improved.
Even though I play TM2020 every day, I do agree with you about a lot of these points. 100% TM2 looks better than TM2020 imo, and I do absolutely feel that I should be playing this game as often as possible to get my money's worth. However there are some corrections to be made like at 11:53 you talk about all the leaderboard UI and new records in chat etc. That stuff does exist in 2020 but only on the other dedicated servers like the Evo server. And iirc this is the same case in TM2, where that UI and leaderboard tracking and chat times are only present because of the custom server they are running on. So it's not a matter of TM2020 being worse in that regard but TM2 doesn't have this either and has to be patched in by the community in both games. Plugins and action keys both have their points. On one hand it's great that they exist for accessibility purposes, but on the other hand there's no reason a lot of the plugin functionality should exist in the base game by default, and action keys feel like they're just a hackfix on top of bad game design. If I do go back to TM2 I do feel like the game feels more empty without a track of the day system. It's a nice way for the game to give me a high-quality map for me to play without having to put in effort to actively search for community maps. And despite how I think ice physics are badly designed, ice is genuinely a lot of fun to play that I would sorely miss it if I had to go back to TM2.
TMNF was like a big city where you had an overwhelming lot of people everywhere. But you had your main playgrounds. TM2020 is like a big city, where you flip a coin to decide which playground you can go to. The game lacks a proper browser system and favourites list so badly. If it had that I would probably play TM2020, but I stick to TMNF simply for the community and democratic approach on which maps we as a community are gonna play now.
3:07 I hate why this happens, this is why I love Tm2 now and it just feels easier to play 9:06 This is so true, I hop on a RPG server in TMNF and there’s only one person online but it’s easier to tell who was who, I ended up being able to be Steam friends with him
Biggest issue of TM2 Statdium was that it was paid remake of a free TMNF. Noone switched, so people who started on TMNF never did a switch and players of United kinda skipped it due to that reason too and just went into TM Canyon / Lagoon / Valley. I still remember community reaction from launch, really negative and looked like awful cashgrab.
not 100% sure but arent the features you mentioned in tm2 servers actually plugins? i get that its already being done for you in tm2 without any hassle but these things arent impossible in tm20. i agree that tm2 just looks the best. everytime i play with the homies we say the same thing. tm20 is butt-ugly fallguys level eye candy while tm2 (and older) look like an actual racing environment. also tmnf has Poland RPG so theres a reason to return every once in a while lol.
You should be sure, because that is indeed the case. This guy is a TM2S player for more than 2000 hours and haven't noticed that PyPlanet is not by Nadeo. So yes, as others have said as well PyPlanet also exists in TM2020, he just couldn't visit those servers and he didn't even pay for a game and the parts of the game he is forming an opinion about.
Helloooooo I'm here to represent the few TmTurbo enjoyers. Our servers are inexistants, we all grinded this game to its bits. And I love the artstyle of TmTurbo
I play almost exclusively TM 20 and the main reason is flying respawns. It's such a small thing I know but it's just nice being able to test a certain checkpoint multiple times while not having to drive there every time. You can also install open planet to have the number of checkpoints on screen. You also get some other nice stuff like comparing the current speed vs pb speed at each checkpoint and much more. It's a free software with community developed plugins.
Having to install openplanet for that is crazy and has the same problem has tmnf. 1. I dont want to install mods to have fun 2. For 20 USD a year I should get that for free 3. Its difficult/impossible to install on non-windows devices
@@Bee3D1 That's fair I guess. Bottom line is everyone should play the game they like the most. From time to time I go back to the older games and find myself not having fun because of the missing flying respawn.
A lot of other games use the subscription model like fifa or nba 2k. The difference with trackmania is that it’s the same game so you get to keep stuff, while in sports game you lose all of your progress every year
Really good video! I started playing tm in 2022 picking up tmnf and i really love it. I only have a couple hours in tm2020 (under 10), agreeing with the reasons you mentioned. I think ill love tm2 so im thinking of getting it
you can map, i made 5 or so maps in TM2020 (don't ask abaut 100+ in TMNF) just open the game in offline once and you can start making maps (no commiunity made blocks)
7:21 Why do you compare a campaign map with a random community made tech map? What is this comparison tying to achieve here? You really think Tech has been the only style previous campaigns represent? Or if you aren't comparing campaign map styles, then why don't you compare community maps? If you did this you would've realized both games have all of its styles represented in their community maps.
I think it's a problem that the only fun I ever really had in TM2020 was making maps because that's literally everything you can do beside the tutorial and less than half the campaign.
Even tho I prefer TM2 because of gameplay and editor features, I've always loved 2016 Trackmania Turbo. Those graphics are just an eyecandy and I love it. What is your opinion about it?
The steam vers of United Forever was busted until I pointed out to Ubisoft support that Steam used an older vers of the game instead of the non steam vers. The the mod thankfully actually notified someone of the problem. But my guess for TM nations is that it's free to play so they don't care.
the fact that wirtual never talked about trackmania² but still plays nations forever is really something that pisses me of too. good to know i'm not the only one.
TM2020 *used* to let you see leaderboards, playin cup of the day, join clubs, upload car skins, upload custom tracks, and play multiplayer for free before. Then they just changed it and put all of it behind a paywall when they got rid of Standard access.
I'm glad to see alot of the problems i have with tm20 put into words, i main tmnf as it is the game i grew up with and know people on but i do think tm2 is objectively the better game and i think some tmnf players would agree with that. The only problem i can really think of with tm2 is that i dont like the nadeo campaign nearly as much. I will dissagree with your opinion of the tm20 stad car drives better i feel like it is by far the worst feeling stad car.
i kinda hate the campaigns in every trackmania game but i think the tm² one is better than the tmnf one. the tmnf campaign after the white series plays like little jimmy's first tracks. maybe this is bias from having played the tm² one way more than the tmnf one but i just find tm² has a better built campaign. not that the bar is high
did i just play with you on Lolmaps server on tm2 and fell on your channel completely randomly just after ? yeah totally 👍and i'm happy to have found this channel 😄
TMNF account creation requires TLS 1.0 to make an accout (netowork adapter setting) dont forget to turn it off afterwards to prevent protocol exploits TM2 physiks got change in the maniaplanet 4 update and broke all records and maps (backwards accel on the Valley and Canyon car) TM 2020 Map editor is free (advanced and simple) with an option to edit blocks within the editor istself no need for blender but doing in blender is easier Having a 1 time payment makes the game to have set budget that cause after some time to implement microtransactions or to re release the game multipile times TMNF is the reason why Nadeo was bought by Ubisoft since they would be not there anymore after that release in 2008 since noone bought the permium version of the game TMUF
I had the same issues with creating an account on TMNF, if you look it up you just have to revert your security settings to outdated version, create an account, then revert it to the correct security settings.
I actually remember I wanted to play TM2 but I had too weak of a PC to play it, so I completely skipped that game and eventually forgot about it. So the only trackmanias I played was the original Trackmania+Power Up, TMNF, TMUF and a little bit of free TM2020.
i don't love TM2020's subscription model by any means, but hosting servers costs money, and honestly, i'd rather just pay $20/yr over having to pay for skins and DLC and things of that nature. i don't play any modern games other than TM2020, as i do agree that, in general, modern games are worse than the games i grew up with. but TM2020 is a great game, and i think its subscription model is actually a fair deal given that it's likely necessary to keep the game running. maybe it could be cheaper or maybe we could all have "credits" or something that we have to spend in order to play online so that we don't feel forced to play while our subscription is active, but regardless, i'm not entirely sure a one-time payment for the game is a reasonable ask
TM2 is amazing, though I haven't played almost at all since MP4 update. Honestly TM2020 should have made standard a 1 time payment, called the free tier a trial instead of pretending it's free to play, and had the subscription give access to extra bonus stuff. Clubs should be in standard. Still not paying Ubisoft for anything though.
Interesting points. I agree with most I think. Personally, the biggest gripe i have with TM2020 is its UI and the lack of... categorization? classification? Its just a clusterfuck of everything together, you never know what you sing up for when booing up a map/server/campaign. Like TMUF existed with multiple environments just fine, but they were separated. Its cool to be able to combine them, but i think the default should be separated, and combination for special occasions or events. Or maybe a way to see in a map browser "oh this map is stadium only" or "ah this has all cars involved". Personally i play TMNF most of the time, basically just because of nostalgia and.. i honestly don't even know why. I just have all my settings and maps there and am used to the interface. HOWEVER i totally agree that TM² is superior in basically any way. I really enjoy the graphics, the Replay Editor and rendering stuff is way more polished. You have more gamemodes and custom blocks. I also enjoy Canyon a lot, super satisfying. I wish TM² would be more popular. I also loved the concept they had at the start, where you could play for free for 1 hour every day. Probably a bad thing financially for the company, but idk make it 20-30 minutes and i think you'd get a lot of people to buy it to play longer.
Welp, I'm relatively new to trackmania games, but i got your point and I think you just got another player fro TM2 :)). I've tried the new track mania and I feel the same : the subscription should not be part of the game, the other cars feel really weird, etc
I am not even a TM20 player. But I have to say, that's a bit hilarious that most Trackmania gamers are utterly forgetting the one important thing about the previous games, and that they were fun. Soon I feel like if another Trackmania game comes out it'll be paying YOU to play the game. lol
I'm with you. I play TM since 2005 (TMN ESWC) and was actually enjoying TM 2020 until the snow car was released. On that day I went back to TM 2. I was already struggling learning all the surfaces and physics with the stadium car, now I would have to learn everything again with a new car!? No thanks!
Yep agreed on everything you've put out, though there is a (public) TAS tool for TMNF/UF that I am just so addicted to. I think there is a tas tool for tm2, but it's private so that's sad. You interested in tasses as well?
Linux has never officially been supported. Either you try to find a workaround, or install Windows to play the game on there without this issue (I know, this practice is heresy for Linux users!)
@@coder436if you run the game in fullscreen mode (not windowed borderless), you need to promptly switch from and back to fullscreen for the car (and other textures) to appear
Back then, Nadeo started to split up the huge community with FreeZone and then destroy it. Anyone who hadn't spent 30€ on United had to live with the consequences. TM2 was an improved version with a much better engine. TM Turbo was the first attempt to go on newer consoles, but in my opinion it didn't work. TM2020 was now the attempt to remake TM United Forever, but Ubi$oft just wants to see money. What the community wanted and loved didn't matter at all. I miss the time between 2006 and 2010, when TM NF/UF was really great. My servers in TM NF/UF and TM2 are still online :)
I was constantly thinking about getting TM² cuz of how it looks n all I'm a very active TMU / TMNF player I tried TM2020 just to be slapped with a yearly paywall.. This video makes me wanna get TM² 100% I want to get all environments for the fun of it! I'll wait for the next steam sale. Thank you for this great video
8:42 What you said under the 99% $$$ screen is so incorrect it's incredible. I get it, it's edgy to say _back in my day everything was free and better,_ but come on, you should know that basically more than half of games you showed there aren't officially supported anymore. But you are saying 99% still are. Yeah right, sure...
I have spent over 300 hours in TM20 and 40 hours in TMNF. I got all the author medals in TMNF and I like the online rooms, but I don't like the style. I like the positive friendly vibe of TM20. I don't like the overwhelming, old-looking TMNF and TM2 interface. I don't think the payment model is a bad thing. It's personal taste.
i play tmuf and for the past 2-3 years ive been playing mostly RPGs on stadium, something that kept me away from tm2 was the way nadeo released it back whenever that happened. with tmuf you could just go to the store and buy the game. with tm2 you had to set up an account and buy the game online but it wasnt every tm2 environment, but then they had some release where you could get all the environments... it was just too confusing for me to get into tm2. tm2020 on the other hand they immediately removed me from the target audience by making it a paid s*bscription model. i tried playing the regular campaign, but it was just a rehash of older meps. also i completely agree with the paid model, people say 'ooh its good that its paid cause they improve the game constantly!' but all they really do is just break the game and make it more complicated for the complexity sake. i like the separation of environments tmuf gives, if i wanna play coast i can play coast etc, i dont have to learn everything just to beat a wr because for some reason theres a 5 second snow car section in a given mep. another part is the mapping - a lot of people seem to enjoy how 'beautiful' the tm2020 meps can get with all the imported scenery, but i find it boring and kind of unoriginal. tmnf builders built so many much more unique and beautiful meps with just that restricted amount of blocks it puts gamedevs to shame for their laziness with making stock blocks.
For the Wirtual thing, I believe he grew up on TMNF and is only really involved in TM20 and TMNF communities so he can't really weigh in on TM2 because it is just something he has never been involved in.
I play 2020 and TMNF. I map in both (more on TMNF, with unlimiter, such a great tool). I’m mad they deleted standard access, I wanted to play without paying so much.
I play TMUF because it has more general content and isn't a fucking subscription. I love all the different cars and enviroments that all feel really uniqe and fun. Multiplayers works, somehow (always get stuck at entering a 'key' to make an account tho).
Thank you for this! A very good rundown of TM2020's "problems". I would like to add that the feel of the stadium car in 2020 is (almost) objectively worse than both TM2 and TMNF. It's steering feels both wonkier and slower/delayed compared to the earlier games. Speedsliding is also something that has become way worse, because the response when sliding feels like adding 200ms of input delay, which results in microadjustments become overadjustments because of the extra time the car uses to react to the input. But sure - you could forcibly learn this change in the car's mechanic, but I cant justify the distress you would have to put yourself through because of the other negatives that you stated in this video. Why bother re-learning an inferior version of the car-mechanic that was already perfected 10 years ago? I've been called a crybaby many times when I've complained about these topics to people. The fact is that I've tried so hard to adapt and accept the problems with the new game because I really wanted it to be good. 2020 does deliver a lot of cool concepts and features that I really wish that the older games had, but it also brings too many issues to the table which ruins the game completely for me. It feels like a tragedy. - A hardcore TM2 fullspeed-player
a note on the action keys: keyboard players are at a disadvantage even with action keys. it's just the nature of a digital input device in an analog input setting. on a theoretical level, any analog steering device is better than a normal keyboard. on a practical level, though, the difference comes down to the skill and preference of any given player. some people just find it more comfortable to play using keyboard, and the action keys are there to help even the playing field for these people.
i only play tmnf, ive bought tm2 but tbh i have a whole buddy list on tmnf (amazing system btw, dont know if tm2 has that or not) plus i always forget that i have it. and the tire screeching
The most popular Trackmania Stadium game: Trackmania 2020 The most polished Trackmania Stadium Game: Trackmania² Stadium The most beloved Trackmania Stadium Game: Trackmania Nations Forever
You make some great arguments for TM2, but how the hell are we going to preserve TM2020? When the servers go down, we will never play TM2020 again. We can't rely on an offline patch because this is Ubisoft were talking about. They're the same company who said gamers need to get comfortable with not owning their games. We're going to lose a ton of TM history all because of a subscription service. TMT2016 is the best TM. Absolutely love the vibe of that game.
TM20 is very fun to watch due to all the different surfaces and special blocks, but it is a pain in the ass to play. My friends got me into TMNF (also my gf's dad plays TMNF) so i just stay there because i know my TMshort-tech server and my RPG servers which are basically the only ones that i log into whenever i play the game. so yeah i just dont play TM20 even though i installed it, sometimes i get on when there's a free COTD however the timing in shite as it sits at the exact time i have my meals, except for cup of the night but i aint playing at 4AM
The server browser comment you made is 100% true to many games. I've been complaining for years about how they removed the server browser from CoD games and completely destroyed all the server-based communities in the games. This is one of the shittiest trends in the online gaming industry. Literally some of my best real life friends are people I met in server communities, servers were epic.
My biggest problem with tm2020 is the point you made about the surfaces and different cars. I really only care about the campaign in different racing games because it is fun to me to grind out my best times and compare on the leaderboards. Something about it being an official map sparks my competitive interest. But in tm2020 i find the new cars to be jokes, and all the gimmicky surfaces to be annoying. Cool that they are in the game but I wish they would leave them out of campaign tracks and leave it for custom maps.
Trackmania 2 is also my primary title. Hilariously, Stadium is my least favorite TM2 environment. Even with fewer bugs compared to TMN/TMNF, the StadiumCar is just so hard to control compared to nearly the rest. Still, I believe the hardest car to control in the entire franchise is easily the CoastCar. The SnowCar was my favorite at one point, and still remains my #2 car of choice even after Lagoon became available.
I'm one of the 3 TMN ESWC online players alive
😢 i also play but veery rarely
are the servers still up?? might have to hit that up again
@@TigerDriver91 They are, 5-6 of them are up iirc.
Based
I'm among them too, lol. My favorite TM game. It can actually be played in TM2 Stadium now, the only thing I don't like is that tracks are put under a medal wall there, the beauty of ESWC was that all tracks were available from the get-go.
ESWC definitely has the best soundtrack of all TM games.
Why do i need openplanet for a cam3 speedometer
Why do i need openplanet for a cam3 speedometer
Why do i need openplanet for a cam3 speedometer
lol hey ogre
??? All the cars in TM2020 have a speedo on the dash in cam3
@@syfp4769 and if you disable the cockpit?
@@syfp4769 no one plays with the massive blocking cockpit
TMNF will always be my home when it comes to Trackmania. The nostalgia, the graphics, the bugs, the fact that any dinky laptop can run it... It's the reason I love it and still build maps and play.
14:00 Wirtual did make some videos on TM² Stadium like "I challenged 70 people to build best map" and some other videos on TM² in general like "Trackmania's most hilariously overpowered bug" but the TM² Valley + Canyon are just more WR videos and the TM² Stadium videos were all before TM2020 was released
In 2022 participated in event on TM2 rpg map: Laputa castle in the sky
basicallly its cause hes a content creator and is making content for the largest audience which is not TM2
Couple of us still around running up TMUF and creating content for the rest of the environments forgotten by time. Hurts my heart hearing how much people hate the snow car in TM2020, but I think without the context of "car = environment" with select blocks you're forced to build with gives the different physics much more of an identity. I encourage anyone who's interested in the older TrackMania(s) to give it a shot!
The reason the SnowCar feels so odd in TM2020 is because it's designed to be used in the snow environment. It's the same reason it feels weird when you try using it in a stadium map in TMUF
TMUF gang!!! The game isn't complete for me without the other environments. Stadium is nice, but it's not everything.
I honestly wish trackmania 2020 get a reputation as good as the other players
I feel sorry for all the players on trackmania turbo (2010)
Yes as a kid I was really fed up that nadeo used that name again. TM Turbo 2010 doesn't deserve that!
good old turbo ds :)
My first Trackmania 🖤
well, i played both, 2010 and 2016n, my favorite is the 2016 one.
But yeah, TmTurbo 2010, what a joy was it.
Since you asked, the one I played most is probably TM2020, the one I grew up with was TMUF, but the one I genuinely wish they gave more love to is TM Turbo
tm20 mappers don't need blender to make great looking maps. Mappers can also do that and they do regularly do it with only vanilla blocks. Those guys work hard.
My main problem with the game is that Nadeo sometimes breaks old maps, it discourages mappers.
To this day I’m crying over why they changed the ice physics. The first physics was fun and fast with a lots of tricks but now it’s just hold left then right and hope you’re fast.
I do like your videos Sybreed, but I do feel like there are some missed points about 2020. Firstly, I'm not a fan of the subscription model either, but Nadeo has plainly stated that without the subscription model 2020 would not have existed. So I get not liking it and the personal preference behind that, but I think it's better than the game not existing at all. Another missed point of the subscription model also is that it is mixed model of subscription/purchase. With the sub for the year, you gain access to all campaign maps/totds ever, but for the year for your purchase period you get to keep the 100 campaign maps + 365 TOTDs and you get to keep those even after your subscription ends.
I have a gripe with your focus on community, yes 2020 does have more players. But that does not inherently mean that the community is "more divided" or "isolated". Everyone has their own niche, I've encountered numerous close-knit communities within the game, such as the 2020 LOL server, cohesive communities do exist despite the game's scale. But when you don't play it, its easy to make generalizations. Like you mention TM 2020s lack of focus on tech, there is a tech server just for you with a community just as tight as TM2s Lol server.
But the most egrigious is when you compare the blandness of TM2020's vanilla campaign server without club access to a modded TM2 server running pyplanet custom leaderboards. This is just incorrect. Yes, you can natively edit your name to have color in TM2 but there are plenty of servers runnning the exact same pyplanet leaderboards that DO allow nick-editing in exactly the same way on 2020. You shun the game you haven't played because you refuse to give it an honest shot(for some reasons valid ,and others not) and deride it for not having features that servers have custom built/added, but also that they do ACTUALLY have. I love TM2 as well, honestly all TM games. But this video definitely comes across more as "Old man yells at cloud" rather than a real look at why you don't play these games because it's pretty plain to see that you haven't really given either TMNF or TM2020 an honest shot and you fundamentally don't really understand either.
But hey, I get it. You log on to TM2 and have fun on the LOL server, I don't expect you understand the differences between the 3 games. But it does feel in bad faith when you just get stuff factually wrong. Just my 2 cents, and I hope you don't take this as aggro or as a troll, I just legitimately care about all TM games. (including 2)
PS. Im no Wirtual meat-rider, but he has streamed TM2 a few times before and just like you said earlier in the video "Between the two(TM Games) you probably choose the one you started with first" He started with TMNF so that is his game and he's stated thats why he doesn't play it.
came here to say something like this, well said!
The main point was about the payment model. the rest was just nit-picking little annoying things about it, and airing grievances held by others that don't want to make the move.
Not trying to hate on anyone in other games, just explaining why I have a hard time getting into the other games...
and also the club systems. I am not sure how hardcore community met it, but for me (relatively new player) it was a convinient way to get along with different styles, events and so on. for example United Unicorns club organize every week the cup for old cars (which I liked a lot, though they are kinda goofy, not gonna lie). There are also other streamers driven regular events.
Actually united unicorns is helping keeping all games alive, I love it
You get to keep 365 TOTD? That the community made? Crazy generous gift of someone elses work.
the maniaplanet 4 update still has a sour taste in my muzzle to this day from all the things that became worse in tm2 since then :c
you can't properly skip run endings anymore, the UI is more cluttered with no option to revert, and the netcode was changed so that a lot of the movement is server-dependent, even for restarting runs. imagine a 230ms delay for each time you want to restart a run for the sole reason being that most servers available are hosted in Europe. this wasn't the case in mp3.
You managed to point out all of my problems with TM2020. Great video!
I personally don't really play Stadium, but I would probably put TM2 (Maniaplanet 3) as my favorite (It would have been TMT if not for the bugs).
The reason why you couldnt make an account in tmnf is because you didnt enable tcp 1.0
Even with tcp 1.0 enabled the error still appears on Windows 11, it's been like this for almost 2 years now.
@@מעייןלבי Works fine on windows 11 for me
they just need to update the certificate, isnt even hard, but they probably want people playing TM2020
the game works perfectly fine for me
@@Azur1200I believe after Ubisoft bought them they legally can't update it because it's free and Ubisoft doesn't like that
Some very fair points.
I also am not a fan of paid subscriptions games.
I'd like to underline the fact that Nadeo has always been making too much content for its own good.
That was what led to the acquisition by Ubisoft.
Nadeo made so much content available for free, that they had to monetize their racing game concept more or face bankruptcy.
11:53 I'm pretty sure I'm right in saying that most of the UI stuff you mention here is added by PyPlanet, not a feature of the vanilla game. And there are PyPlanet servers on TM2020 too.
That aside, most of the criticisms of TM2020 are very valid, even as a TM2020 player.
TM2020 player here. But I can understand and agree with most points you mention in this video.
P.S. Watching someone playing ice in cam 2 is pain :)
it really is a pain watching someone play ice in cam 2
great video! i agree with pretty much everything you said, especially at 8:53 where you said the smaller amount of people the more you recognize each other, like i went OH when i noticed you were sybreed because i've seen you on a few servers before and i've raced against a few of your solo times on like c08 and d02 if i recall
just so you know, you CAN map for free in tm20
I have to say I agree with all your opinions.
Also I didn't know Trackmania 2 existed I thought it was like 2020 with it's subscription live service model I don't support or TM Nations forever which has landing bugs and shit.
If Trackmania 2 is the full package that makes it the definitive experience for me specially because lately 2020 has been incorporating other vehicles into tracks and the feel like ass and you're just supposed to be okay with playing with cars that don't feel at all like the stadium car.
I play(ed) Turbo. What you said about the smaller community and get to recognise names applies there too.
Pity TM2020 changes maps (and physics) so often, it's hard to stay motivated. After 3 months, your amazing run will be forgotten about...
TM2 is the best TM! Nice one Sybreed
New player here: I want to play more tm but just can’t because of the subscription. I don’t have enough time to play to justify paying it.
So I just decide to not play at all
Maybe I should just get tm2
@@lkdntmnf is free so try that, but tm2 is my favorite game out of all 3. In fact I quit 2020 with 250 hours because of wood and snowcar
@@lkdn get TM2 on a discount, excellent game. I got a bundle offer of 4 games- Stadium, Canyon, Valley and United for just about 20 bucks overall. It was a great offer. If you manage to do so, I highly recommend it.
I just got into TM2 (from your channel)
I Think the main reason it is a subscription model (other than to gain copious amounts of money) is like I Racing where if you want to be competitive and play tournaments u gotta pay. The thing is tho is that Ubisoft had locked 75% of the games content behind a paywall and the content that is free is repetitive and I like to think of it as a river there are many rivers (campaign, cotd, community maps, etc) but they all lead to an ocean which is the subscription. This is just my take on TM2020
FINALLY TM2 HAS BEEN MENTIONED
I respect the stance against subscription models, I also didnt bother engaging with TM2020 because of it.
But the alternative to a live-service subscription would just be a new game every 2 years that further divides the community, costs more for less, has different physics that require relearning, has no leaderboard continuity, would probably remove some features every game (such as surface types), etc. Live-service fixes all of this.
The downside is that when they do adjust the physics (extremely rare, and only for specific surfaces from what I remember), it does ruin some of the leaderboards, but I think the pros outweigh this.
When I think about it like that, I think Trackmania is PERFECTLY suited for a subscription model, I can't think of a more fitting pairing tbh.
But TM 2020 has already divided the community...
As much as a yearly release would? Absolutely not.
@@0sac when did Nadeo ever release TM games yearly?
TM2 for example was a collection of environments under the single and convenient Mania Planet. It's not like they released a new game with new interface every year or even 2. And United included all previous environments and even Stadium.
1 year of tm20 is also a collection of environments bundled together in a convienient launcher
(Yearly release is an example of an alternative to what the new model could have been in the modern day), I think what we have now is pretty similar to what we used to have, but improved.
@@0sac There is only one environment... occasional changing to other cars for a few seconds doesn't count.
Even though I play TM2020 every day, I do agree with you about a lot of these points. 100% TM2 looks better than TM2020 imo, and I do absolutely feel that I should be playing this game as often as possible to get my money's worth.
However there are some corrections to be made like at 11:53 you talk about all the leaderboard UI and new records in chat etc. That stuff does exist in 2020 but only on the other dedicated servers like the Evo server. And iirc this is the same case in TM2, where that UI and leaderboard tracking and chat times are only present because of the custom server they are running on. So it's not a matter of TM2020 being worse in that regard but TM2 doesn't have this either and has to be patched in by the community in both games.
Plugins and action keys both have their points. On one hand it's great that they exist for accessibility purposes, but on the other hand there's no reason a lot of the plugin functionality should exist in the base game by default, and action keys feel like they're just a hackfix on top of bad game design.
If I do go back to TM2 I do feel like the game feels more empty without a track of the day system. It's a nice way for the game to give me a high-quality map for me to play without having to put in effort to actively search for community maps. And despite how I think ice physics are badly designed, ice is genuinely a lot of fun to play that I would sorely miss it if I had to go back to TM2.
TMNF was like a big city where you had an overwhelming lot of people everywhere. But you had your main playgrounds.
TM2020 is like a big city, where you flip a coin to decide which playground you can go to.
The game lacks a proper browser system and favourites list so badly. If it had that I would probably play TM2020, but I stick to TMNF simply for the community and democratic approach on which maps we as a community are gonna play now.
3:07 I hate why this happens, this is why I love Tm2 now and it just feels easier to play
9:06 This is so true, I hop on a RPG server in TMNF and there’s only one person online but it’s easier to tell who was who, I ended up being able to be Steam friends with him
I will always stay to tm2. It simply has much more stuff to do.
Biggest issue of TM2 Statdium was that it was paid remake of a free TMNF. Noone switched, so people who started on TMNF never did a switch and players of United kinda skipped it due to that reason too and just went into TM Canyon / Lagoon / Valley. I still remember community reaction from launch, really negative and looked like awful cashgrab.
not 100% sure but arent the features you mentioned in tm2 servers actually plugins? i get that its already being done for you in tm2 without any hassle but these things arent impossible in tm20.
i agree that tm2 just looks the best. everytime i play with the homies we say the same thing. tm20 is butt-ugly fallguys level eye candy while tm2 (and older) look like an actual racing environment.
also tmnf has Poland RPG so theres a reason to return every once in a while lol.
You should be sure, because that is indeed the case. This guy is a TM2S player for more than 2000 hours and haven't noticed that PyPlanet is not by Nadeo. So yes, as others have said as well PyPlanet also exists in TM2020, he just couldn't visit those servers and he didn't even pay for a game and the parts of the game he is forming an opinion about.
Helloooooo
I'm here to represent the few TmTurbo enjoyers.
Our servers are inexistants, we all grinded this game to its bits.
And I love the artstyle of TmTurbo
7:23 white maps are very easy and are meant for the new player, red maps usually have drifts and in some campaigns has 1 tech map
I play almost exclusively TM 20 and the main reason is flying respawns. It's such a small thing I know but it's just nice being able to test a certain checkpoint multiple times while not having to drive there every time. You can also install open planet to have the number of checkpoints on screen. You also get some other nice stuff like comparing the current speed vs pb speed at each checkpoint and much more. It's a free software with community developed plugins.
Having to install openplanet for that is crazy and has the same problem has tmnf.
1. I dont want to install mods to have fun
2. For 20 USD a year I should get that for free
3. Its difficult/impossible to install on non-windows devices
@@Bee3D1 That's fair I guess. Bottom line is everyone should play the game they like the most. From time to time I go back to the older games and find myself not having fun because of the missing flying respawn.
@@tallowisp8868 yeah flying respawn is the one of the best features, along with the dirt not being bumpy
@@Bee3D1 dirt NOT being bumpy was the biggest complaint i heard from some players when tm2020 came out lmao
@@mt180extras dirt being bumpy is so annoying lol. Why would anyone like it
A lot of other games use the subscription model like fifa or nba 2k. The difference with trackmania is that it’s the same game so you get to keep stuff, while in sports game you lose all of your progress every year
Really good video! I started playing tm in 2022 picking up tmnf and i really love it. I only have a couple hours in tm2020 (under 10), agreeing with the reasons you mentioned. I think ill love tm2 so im thinking of getting it
Go for it, we need more ppl !
100% agree with tm2020, absolute joke of a business model, optimization and UI. Even the physics in old games feel better. Classic Ubisoft
Bc the tm20 car does have a smaller turning radius than the tmnf/2 car
you can map, i made 5 or so maps in TM2020 (don't ask abaut 100+ in TMNF) just open the game in offline once and you can start making maps (no commiunity made blocks)
7:21 Why do you compare a campaign map with a random community made tech map? What is this comparison tying to achieve here? You really think Tech has been the only style previous campaigns represent?
Or if you aren't comparing campaign map styles, then why don't you compare community maps? If you did this you would've realized both games have all of its styles represented in their community maps.
you can't play community maps in free mode. thats why
@@ImagineTheAI Is it really the game's fault then?
@@ImagineTheAI you can play even less if you don't pay for tm2
Most of the reasons you listed are why I don't play tm2020.
You don't need the paid version of 2020 to make maps.
Non paid map editor is bad and has no decorations so if you want to make good maps you need to have payed version
@@opera_tm
The whole editor is free since the console releases in May 2023
I think it's a problem that the only fun I ever really had in TM2020 was making maps because that's literally everything you can do beside the tutorial and less than half the campaign.
some of your tm20 takes are weird or just incorrect
Shut up
btw Wirtual used to make TM2 Stadium content before TM2020 came out
Even tho I prefer TM2 because of gameplay and editor features, I've always loved 2016 Trackmania Turbo. Those graphics are just an eyecandy and I love it. What is your opinion about it?
You convinced me to play TM².
The steam vers of United Forever was busted until I pointed out to Ubisoft support that Steam used an older vers of the game instead of the non steam vers. The the mod thankfully actually notified someone of the problem. But my guess for TM nations is that it's free to play so they don't care.
You need to enable tls 1.0 to create a tmnf account (and you can use bumpers instead of triggers)
the fact that wirtual never talked about trackmania² but still plays nations forever is really something that pisses me of too. good to know i'm not the only one.
every tm game has charm they are all good games
TM2020 *used* to let you see leaderboards, playin cup of the day, join clubs, upload car skins, upload custom tracks, and play multiplayer for free before. Then they just changed it and put all of it behind a paywall when they got rid of Standard access.
I'm glad to see alot of the problems i have with tm20 put into words, i main tmnf as it is the game i grew up with and know people on but i do think tm2 is objectively the better game and i think some tmnf players would agree with that. The only problem i can really think of with tm2 is that i dont like the nadeo campaign nearly as much. I will dissagree with your opinion of the tm20 stad car drives better i feel like it is by far the worst feeling stad car.
same
true
i kinda hate the campaigns in every trackmania game but i think the tm² one is better than the tmnf one. the tmnf campaign after the white series plays like little jimmy's first tracks. maybe this is bias from having played the tm² one way more than the tmnf one but i just find tm² has a better built campaign. not that the bar is high
did i just play with you on Lolmaps server on tm2 and fell on your channel completely randomly just after ? yeah totally 👍and i'm happy to have found this channel 😄
TMNF account creation requires TLS 1.0 to make an accout (netowork adapter setting) dont forget to turn it off afterwards to prevent protocol exploits
TM2 physiks got change in the maniaplanet 4 update and broke all records and maps (backwards accel on the Valley and Canyon car)
TM 2020 Map editor is free (advanced and simple) with an option to edit blocks within the editor istself no need for blender but doing in blender is easier
Having a 1 time payment makes the game to have set budget that cause after some time to implement microtransactions or to re release the game multipile times
TMNF is the reason why Nadeo was bought by Ubisoft since they would be not there anymore after that release in 2008 since noone bought the permium version of the game TMUF
I bought united forever
I had the same issues with creating an account on TMNF, if you look it up you just have to revert your security settings to outdated version, create an account, then revert it to the correct security settings.
I actually remember I wanted to play TM2 but I had too weak of a PC to play it, so I completely skipped that game and eventually forgot about it. So the only trackmanias I played was the original Trackmania+Power Up, TMNF, TMUF and a little bit of free TM2020.
i don't love TM2020's subscription model by any means, but hosting servers costs money, and honestly, i'd rather just pay $20/yr over having to pay for skins and DLC and things of that nature. i don't play any modern games other than TM2020, as i do agree that, in general, modern games are worse than the games i grew up with. but TM2020 is a great game, and i think its subscription model is actually a fair deal given that it's likely necessary to keep the game running. maybe it could be cheaper or maybe we could all have "credits" or something that we have to spend in order to play online so that we don't feel forced to play while our subscription is active, but regardless, i'm not entirely sure a one-time payment for the game is a reasonable ask
i love how the free trial for turbo on steam is the full game
btw, for tmnf there are ways to get controller working (mainly through steams controller settings)
TM2 is amazing, though I haven't played almost at all since MP4 update. Honestly TM2020 should have made standard a 1 time payment, called the free tier a trial instead of pretending it's free to play, and had the subscription give access to extra bonus stuff. Clubs should be in standard.
Still not paying Ubisoft for anything though.
Very nice video, though at the end i felt like you said that Wirtual part for no reason.
Interesting points. I agree with most I think. Personally, the biggest gripe i have with TM2020 is its UI and the lack of... categorization? classification? Its just a clusterfuck of everything together, you never know what you sing up for when booing up a map/server/campaign. Like TMUF existed with multiple environments just fine, but they were separated. Its cool to be able to combine them, but i think the default should be separated, and combination for special occasions or events. Or maybe a way to see in a map browser "oh this map is stadium only" or "ah this has all cars involved".
Personally i play TMNF most of the time, basically just because of nostalgia and.. i honestly don't even know why. I just have all my settings and maps there and am used to the interface.
HOWEVER i totally agree that TM² is superior in basically any way. I really enjoy the graphics, the Replay Editor and rendering stuff is way more polished. You have more gamemodes and custom blocks. I also enjoy Canyon a lot, super satisfying. I wish TM² would be more popular.
I also loved the concept they had at the start, where you could play for free for 1 hour every day. Probably a bad thing financially for the company, but idk make it 20-30 minutes and i think you'd get a lot of people to buy it to play longer.
for online, windows disabled the web protocol tmnf uses, so you have to re-enable it from windows features
You prevented me from buying club access, thx!
Ubisoft need to double the price of the subscription and make it a one time payment, so we might fix the greed issue of trackmania 2020
Welp, I'm relatively new to trackmania games, but i got your point and I think you just got another player fro TM2 :)). I've tried the new track mania and I feel the same : the subscription should not be part of the game, the other cars feel really weird, etc
I am not even a TM20 player.
But I have to say, that's a bit hilarious that most Trackmania gamers are utterly forgetting the one important thing about the previous games, and that they were fun. Soon I feel like if another Trackmania game comes out it'll be paying YOU to play the game. lol
TO create an account on TMNF, you need to enable TLS 1.0 in security
Thank you for making this video bro i instantly bought and installed it after seeing this
btw in TM20 you can turn off ads on billboards
have the same thoughhts and i played all 3 games. biggest issues is the invisible speedometer on curves xd greetings guga
I'm with you. I play TM since 2005 (TMN ESWC) and was actually enjoying TM 2020 until the snow car was released. On that day I went back to TM 2. I was already struggling learning all the surfaces and physics with the stadium car, now I would have to learn everything again with a new car!? No thanks!
I love the original Snow, Rally and Desert cars, but if I want to play them, I launch TMUF 🤪 switching cars mid-race is a mish-mash.
TM sunrise enjoyer
Yep agreed on everything you've put out, though there is a (public) TAS tool for TMNF/UF that I am just so addicted to. I think there is a tas tool for tm2, but it's private so that's sad. You interested in tasses as well?
TM Turbo What's my first ever track Mania game.
I still play it to this day
Yaaaaay, the 2016 ? me too.
I just got the 129 auth time, today.
My fav thing about tm 2020 is the snowcar, did you not know its is a part of TMUF?
No because he doesn't play _inferior_ cars. For him and players like him, the Stadium supremacy is all that matters.
@@Mandarin9900 that sounds like racism lol
@@meteorname Tell me, where is the racism in a game with pretty much only cars?
The controller bug never happened to me in TM Nations Forever. So Not sure it's even a viable complaint just because yours didn't work.
The tryharding aspect of the community is real for sure
Also, what device are you running TMNF on? I also have a problem where the car doesn't render on Linux (on TM²)
Linux has never officially been supported. Either you try to find a workaround, or install Windows to play the game on there without this issue (I know, this practice is heresy for Linux users!)
Yeah using Windows is a crime (unless absolutely necessary)
@@coder436if you run the game in fullscreen mode (not windowed borderless), you need to promptly switch from and back to fullscreen for the car (and other textures) to appear
Back then, Nadeo started to split up the huge community with FreeZone and then destroy it.
Anyone who hadn't spent 30€ on United had to live with the consequences.
TM2 was an improved version with a much better engine.
TM Turbo was the first attempt to go on newer consoles, but in my opinion it didn't work.
TM2020 was now the attempt to remake TM United Forever, but Ubi$oft just wants to see money.
What the community wanted and loved didn't matter at all.
I miss the time between 2006 and 2010, when TM NF/UF was really great.
My servers in TM NF/UF and TM2 are still online :)
I was constantly thinking about getting TM² cuz of how it looks n all I'm a very active TMU / TMNF player I tried TM2020 just to be slapped with a yearly paywall.. This video makes me wanna get TM² 100% I want to get all environments for the fun of it! I'll wait for the next steam sale. Thank you for this great video
8:42 What you said under the 99% $$$ screen is so incorrect it's incredible. I get it, it's edgy to say _back in my day everything was free and better,_ but come on, you should know that basically more than half of games you showed there aren't officially supported anymore. But you are saying 99% still are. Yeah right, sure...
I have spent over 300 hours in TM20 and 40 hours in TMNF. I got all the author medals in TMNF and I like the online rooms, but I don't like the style.
I like the positive friendly vibe of TM20. I don't like the overwhelming, old-looking TMNF and TM2 interface.
I don't think the payment model is a bad thing.
It's personal taste.
i play tmuf and for the past 2-3 years ive been playing mostly RPGs on stadium, something that kept me away from tm2 was the way nadeo released it back whenever that happened. with tmuf you could just go to the store and buy the game. with tm2 you had to set up an account and buy the game online but it wasnt every tm2 environment, but then they had some release where you could get all the environments... it was just too confusing for me to get into tm2. tm2020 on the other hand they immediately removed me from the target audience by making it a paid s*bscription model. i tried playing the regular campaign, but it was just a rehash of older meps.
also i completely agree with the paid model, people say 'ooh its good that its paid cause they improve the game constantly!' but all they really do is just break the game and make it more complicated for the complexity sake. i like the separation of environments tmuf gives, if i wanna play coast i can play coast etc, i dont have to learn everything just to beat a wr because for some reason theres a 5 second snow car section in a given mep.
another part is the mapping - a lot of people seem to enjoy how 'beautiful' the tm2020 meps can get with all the imported scenery, but i find it boring and kind of unoriginal. tmnf builders built so many much more unique and beautiful meps with just that restricted amount of blocks it puts gamedevs to shame for their laziness with making stock blocks.
I played from TM Sunrise to TMNF. Wanted to check out the new TM, but the subscription model is the only thing holding me back.
Top tier content. Just as always.
For the Wirtual thing, I believe he grew up on TMNF and is only really involved in TM20 and TMNF communities so he can't really weigh in on TM2 because it is just something he has never been involved in.
I play 2020 and TMNF. I map in both (more on TMNF, with unlimiter, such a great tool). I’m mad they deleted standard access, I wanted to play without paying so much.
Why can't i make an account anymore someone plz help
I play TMUF because it has more general content and isn't a fucking subscription. I love all the different cars and enviroments that all feel really uniqe and fun.
Multiplayers works, somehow (always get stuck at entering a 'key' to make an account tho).
I never had any issues like you with TMNF & TMUF o.O except landing bugs ofc
Thank you for this! A very good rundown of TM2020's "problems".
I would like to add that the feel of the stadium car in 2020 is (almost) objectively worse than both TM2 and TMNF. It's steering feels both wonkier and slower/delayed compared to the earlier games. Speedsliding is also something that has become way worse, because the response when sliding feels like adding 200ms of input delay, which results in microadjustments become overadjustments because of the extra time the car uses to react to the input.
But sure - you could forcibly learn this change in the car's mechanic, but I cant justify the distress you would have to put yourself through because of the other negatives that you stated in this video. Why bother re-learning an inferior version of the car-mechanic that was already perfected 10 years ago?
I've been called a crybaby many times when I've complained about these topics to people. The fact is that I've tried so hard to adapt and accept the problems with the new game because I really wanted it to be good. 2020 does deliver a lot of cool concepts and features that I really wish that the older games had, but it also brings too many issues to the table which ruins the game completely for me. It feels like a tragedy.
- A hardcore TM2 fullspeed-player
a note on the action keys: keyboard players are at a disadvantage even with action keys. it's just the nature of a digital input device in an analog input setting. on a theoretical level, any analog steering device is better than a normal keyboard.
on a practical level, though, the difference comes down to the skill and preference of any given player. some people just find it more comfortable to play using keyboard, and the action keys are there to help even the playing field for these people.
i only play tmnf, ive bought tm2 but tbh i have a whole buddy list on tmnf (amazing system btw, dont know if tm2 has that or not) plus i always forget that i have it. and the tire screeching
The most popular Trackmania Stadium game: Trackmania 2020
The most polished Trackmania Stadium Game: Trackmania² Stadium
The most beloved Trackmania Stadium Game: Trackmania Nations Forever
You make some great arguments for TM2, but how the hell are we going to preserve TM2020? When the servers go down, we will never play TM2020 again. We can't rely on an offline patch because this is Ubisoft were talking about. They're the same company who said gamers need to get comfortable with not owning their games. We're going to lose a ton of TM history all because of a subscription service.
TMT2016 is the best TM. Absolutely love the vibe of that game.
TM20 is very fun to watch due to all the different surfaces and special blocks, but it is a pain in the ass to play. My friends got me into TMNF (also my gf's dad plays TMNF) so i just stay there because i know my TMshort-tech server and my RPG servers which are basically the only ones that i log into whenever i play the game. so yeah i just dont play TM20 even though i installed it, sometimes i get on when there's a free COTD however the timing in shite as it sits at the exact time i have my meals, except for cup of the night but i aint playing at 4AM
True, lets play together. If you are intersted to hunt more of the campaign tracks :)
The server browser comment you made is 100% true to many games. I've been complaining for years about how they removed the server browser from CoD games and completely destroyed all the server-based communities in the games. This is one of the shittiest trends in the online gaming industry.
Literally some of my best real life friends are people I met in server communities, servers were epic.
My biggest problem with tm2020 is the point you made about the surfaces and different cars. I really only care about the campaign in different racing games because it is fun to me to grind out my best times and compare on the leaderboards. Something about it being an official map sparks my competitive interest. But in tm2020 i find the new cars to be jokes, and all the gimmicky surfaces to be annoying. Cool that they are in the game but I wish they would leave them out of campaign tracks and leave it for custom maps.
Trackmania 2 is also my primary title. Hilariously, Stadium is my least favorite TM2 environment. Even with fewer bugs compared to TMN/TMNF, the StadiumCar is just so hard to control compared to nearly the rest. Still, I believe the hardest car to control in the entire franchise is easily the CoastCar.
The SnowCar was my favorite at one point, and still remains my #2 car of choice even after Lagoon became available.