Good video. I think what appeals to me with add-on dots is the utility; passive aiming and coarse alignment of a magnified optic. For those purposes the piggy back is the one for me. An offset dot just seems like a waste of a perfectly good optic. :)
Fantasizing about whether or not a top mounted dot is superior to an offset dot in a non home defense situation as a civilian is just larping. If you die because of either one of those, you’ll get to have your entire afterlife to analyze the long list of terrible decisions you made to end up in that situation in the first place, alongside your dot placement choice. Just choose the one you’re more natural at and F off
Hey, let me address them as they come. (for the record he asked me to do this) If you're snapping around the corner as you did, it's not a major difference. I'm talking more from the perspective of crouched or standing, while keeping feet planted behind cover or, while pieing a corner while tilting your torso aggressively, where the muzzle is millimeters from sending a bullet through the wall, not significantly past the corner as you had it. That being said, I probably over spoke how big of a deal it is in the video, the struggles of a adlib video. It's worth mentioning the context here (and you touched on it): this video was for people that wanted to run 2-10x rifles and then use the 1x exclusively for cqb and medium range shooting. Yep you're right piggybacks has lower lows in some scenarios. Yeah I think we're saying the same thing here ( but I sucked at saying it). Offsets can be fast. But (I think) primary positions are consistently faster in a wider range of scenarios. This doesn't matter if you have both. Use whatever works but my video is in the context of a shooter forgoing a primary optic with the assumption that a offset position is the same speed, and intuitiveness off cover, around corners etc. in the exact same way a centerline optic is. NV yeah, agree I think I generally made a low quality video, where I didn't really underline the final conclusion I was making. I'm not saying offset, or piggyback are bad. They're infact quite fast when you put the time into them: see all of the comp circles. I'm saying they're not a wholesale replacement for a center aiming solution (that I did mention several times in the video). As you discovered yourself and stated. You naturally want to sometimes use the center optic in a lot of situations and positions. be it corners, vtacs, etc. The context of my videos discusses a new trend where people think the offset/piggy dot are 100% analogs for centerline optics. Thus allowing for zero performance losses when mounting whatever 4-16 or 2-10x instead of a 1-x lpvo overall it's (yours) is a great video, and over constructive in nature. And I appreciate that. Honestly of higher quality than mine.
Appreciate you sharing your thoughts. I think my video adds a bit of nuance, but I doubt there is a fundamental difference in philosophy. I also realize your video was a bit off the cuff. Love the dialogue.
Nah you hit the nail on the head here, they're absolutely still practical. Any disadvantages are so small that they're negligible in any practical situation. Look at 3gun. For God's sake in USPSA there are great shooters with an offset red dot for their red dot specifically because its better for leaning around cover lol
I think an offset red dot, properly set up so it sits over the bore of the rifle, can be a perfectly fine backup sighting system, and preferable to offset irons. But shooting with both eyes open the tube is still faster for me.
I just got my first offset mount (Arasak) I have a 507c on it. I tried the mount at the 45 and 35-degree setting and the 35 is the best option. It keeps it close to the LPVO and has a minimum range of motion to use.
This video + BrassHops replies make me so proud to be apart of this community. Excellent work my man, you did everything the exact way you should have. Respectfully, not trying to dig at them, and just overall giving your experiences. That is what we need. BrassHops are amazing, but they aren't omnipotent or perfect. Having more voices will always be better!
Just how honest you was in the beginning of the video made me subscribe. I watch brass and hop as well. Any information from other people’s own experiences helps us all out.
Good video. I will say I’m running a scalarworks 1.93 with a NX8 and their offset mount and RMR and I will say I love the setup. I tried to make sure of this before I got it but the offset is seemingly at the same height as the mount so having that at a 1.93 instead of lower 1/3 is fantastic and very comfortable even under a PVS14 so worth a try!
I run an Lpvo 1-6 and plan to add offset Irons for backup and durability in case the optic fails. I don't need two optics because I live in a wet environment and don't need two going down. Everyone has different needs.
I'm also a compulsive gun buyer. And I like your balanced pros and cons on this subject. Brass'Opfeil are a go-to for me as well.... So subscribed! Thanks
Very nice and very well done! I run a Vortex Razor HD Gen II-E with an offset Aimpoint T-2, and I find it fast enough and natural enough a set up that I'm not worried about anything.
Great video boss. And a shout out to brasshops as well. I appreciate all of you putting out excellent content, especially for us common folk. What offset mount did you use. Thanks again.
I use offset irons as back up for my 1-6 lpvo. Im just as accurate using the irons as i am with my lpvo set on 1x. I normally leave my lpvo set around 4 to 6x and transition to irons for close "pop up" targets. Its pretty seamless and you really cant miss with a rifle inside 20 yards no matter what sight system you use. Thats why i never really saw the need for an offset dot. The offset irons get the job done way cheaper and its just kinda fun using irons. I guess im a wierdo, lol...
@@compulsivegunbuyer when I use a micro dot as a secondary, I prefer to use a separate mounting option like an arisaka. It eliminates a single point failure.
For threegun, I use my offset as my primary, only using my prism 3x when I need to reach out to distance. I've run the setup for the last two seasons and it's fast and I don't see any of the real downsides that have been discussed.
Excellent video. I think Jeff Gurwitch will agree with you about the viability of the offset dot, considering he ran one for years on his M4 downrange in the sandbox pvp server we call GWOT.
Offset are practical, the piggyback method has the height over bore problems like you said through ports and also your shot placement. Holding the A of the A zone you’ll see the impact at the bottom of the box for cqb distances, a reason I don’t like unity type mounts and it also alters your trajectory. Offset dots can be used with passive but like you said you need to mount them forward and one thing to note is a lot of mounts are low setting like the adm rmr mount but you can get arisaka mounts to sit higher or use a badger j arm for 1.70 or 1.93, also using a t2 or holosun knock off helps because they don’t sit so low like an rmr would
Yes, I think it makes sense to have a piggyback rds if you want a do-all rifle and plan for lots of night shooting, but you are giving up a lot of capability for the nv convenience...and it will take lots of training.
@@compulsivegunbuyer everyone talks about passive aiming but you’re faster with a laser and if you’re in the same room or hallway the jug is up, use your laser. As far as using the dot outside to aim passive you’re going to be limited by the fact you can only see so far under nods and that’s greatly diminished without an IR illuminator. You could use a IR flashlight but then you’re still signaling where you are.
Used ‘em, not impractical at all. Everyone just thinks they are going to go into the boog with nods and a 12 o’clock piggyback red dot. Also, no one switches shoulders when their life is actually at stake.
The piggybacks require you to move your head and to re-acquire the reticle in the dot, losing your cheek weld in the process. Offset is a simple rotation of the rifle (and one that is natural) with the same cheek weld as the primary optic, rotate the rifle, the dot just shows up, I’ve been shooting the offset dots in 3 gun for years (dot mounted behind the scope mount- top adjustment buttons make life much easier- I use a Vortex Razor), the only thing those guys got right is shooting around left corners (if you’re a righty) and maybe the idiotic notion you’d use the dot instead of your IR laser under NV. As far as I’m concerned, the only time to even use the secondary optic is really off rifle placement where eye relief is an issue, around a tight, right corner, and if you have your LVPO dialed up to magnification.
So when your “peeling” around that corner, or any corner of your house/apartment, what’s your plan when the other guy stitches the wall in front of you?
@@graybeardsagemy plan, and hear me out, is to grab a pistol (I have one in a small secret trap door 6 inches off the deck at each side at every corner. For example, an apartment where when you walk in there is a full wall the length of the apartment to your right and on the left, a short wall about four 4 feet long that makes up the entrance space, and then a corner on the left wall that opens into a living room with the full wall on the right being one of the four walls that make up the living room space. On that corner on the left, there would be two trap doors with pistols. One trap door accessible if you’re approaching the corner from the entrance and one trap door accessible if you’re already inside the apartment and approaching the corner from living room. You dig what I’m saying? Two trap doors on every corner in the apt and a pistol in each trap door so that a heater will be accessible no matter which side of the corner I’m approaching from. So for this strategy, I’ll be have a gun accessible for any scenario. Now, hopefully you can visualize my trap door location set up. And for this scenario, let’s say it’s about 10:30pm on a Friday night. I’m sitting in my living room recliner watching the most recent episode of Gold Rush on the Discovery channel, and flipping through an old Victoria Secret magazine looking for a chick wearing a sheer bra hoping to see partial nipples, and maybe even an areola. I finally find one and it’s perfect. She looks white/asian mix (probably Korean based on cheek bones, chin shape, and eyes) and definitely meat beater worthy. So I get up to pull the curtain, grab my spank sock from behind the couch, and a set up a tv tray to support the magazine. I pull the string in my sweats and am about to sit down when I hear my door knob rattle. I quickly stash everything in the TV stand cabinet for a quick retrieval and start towards the door. Suddenly I hear the deadbolt click and, door knob turn, and the door pops open. I look in the reflection of picture I have strategically hung on the far wall facing the door, and I an unfamiliar dude peep his head in. He’s wearing a hoodie, a mask over his face, I can make out the barrel of a gun, and I have no idea who he is. So I drop to the floor, belly button to the carpet, and army crawl to within a foot of the corner. I locate my trap door, pull my heater, and suddenly hear very loud POP, POP, POP, POP, POP, POP, POP, , POP, POP, POP! And feel small bits of dry wall rain down on me. The dude just stitched the wall in front of him aiming where the recliner would be on the other side. So I, prepared for this moment, am already laying on the ground in a semi push-up position, head about 8 inches from the corner, feet toward the television inside the interior of the apparent space. Right should up against the wall, gun in my left hand, locked and cocked, and ready to rock the jock that unlocked the lock, creepin with the Glock, pop pop pop no knock like a cop…Tick tock tick tock he’s about to get a shock, brass is flyin like a flock, catchin bodies non stop. Fucked around and found out he picked the wrong spot.
I mean a piggyback seams viable in the sense a scope is mounted so low that a piggyback is essentially like running a 3/4 riser or tower mount for red dots but again thats gonna be if your scope is bumping uglies on your pic rail
My .02 you can do what you want with it. The reason you put a brds is for none other than fast shooting from near to far. In a riot running around cars. In a building shooting outside to quickly inside. In woods from far to defend ambush. All the rest is byproduct. Fluff. Extra. It’s a fast backup sight. Only other legit thing it should be called is a close in sight. Most ppl just call them quick sight, for a reason.
Definitely believe it is a "purpose driven" decision 🤔 For "shorties" I like a 2.26 height RDS primary with a FTC magnifier: no secondary - For "GPR" (13.7~16") I like 1.93 1-6x SFP "RDS bright" LPVO: mRDS secondary not "needed", but definitely not putting one up in a 12 o'clock orbit above an already high mount 😂 If running a secondary, it's definitely going to be offset! - 18~24" SPR/PRS will be running a MPVO or long range primary around 1.5" off the deck. In this instance, a 1x secondary at the 12 o'clock position is ideal.
@davidhartley6232 this is sort of where I've end up as well...only issue is trying to train to adequate proficiency with three different settups (all with multiple optics), but I haven't found a one size fits all that I'm satisfied with.
I have my offset red dot to use when my rifle is set at full magnification. If I’m in my house and using the same rifle, I would have my LPVO at 1x I could use either and not have to lean weird and break my back or whatever.
Brass Facts take on this topic was asinine. ANY red dot position requires you to move your head and/or body slightly off center. That is actually the point of them....isn't it? A 2nd optic on the same rifle to do a different job opposed to your primary optic?!? So he found the one circumstance where an off set red dot would be slightlyyyy less advantageous, just to prove his point. We call this confirmation bias!! Holding a preconceived belief then running tests to help confirm your original outlook/bias. Lastly, why does it always look like Brass Facts is wearing eye liner?? 🧐🧐
Anytime I see arguments favoring one idea over another I come to the conclusion that neither argument is right or wrong. Choose the technique you feel serves your needs. You won’t be wrong no matter what.
BrassFacts is just another guy with an opinion, although he believes his opinions are worth more than they are (probly because he wears plaid shirts in his video). Hes no more special than the next guy. Nobody should be taking what he says as gold. Same with Hop. Do whatever the fuck you want to do, nuff said.
It's their job to state their opinions. Met both at SHOT show by the way--they are great guys. Just look at their replies to this video in the comment section and you can see that they don't take their opinions as gospel either.
I see an offset red dot as a backup optic first and foremost. Piggybacks are relying on the same mounting system as your primary optic. Doesn’t make sense to me.
I bought an LPVO for the 1x and am well aware of the drawbacks. Adding more stuff to a rifle is a marketer's dream. The gun community is obsessed with consumerism. Is it hard to shoot in non conventional positions with an LPVO? Maybe. But that is a training issue. Basically train more.
I have ran both on top of a few optics and on the side on 33 or 45 degree. For me it is clearly much better to have it on the side hands down. And that other guy aggressively coming up with silly not so correct points on why an offset is so bad is in my opinion not very factual and more just overly opinionated. Don’t like those dudes channels much for many of those reasons
@@compulsivegunbuyeryou are welcome, I am sure they are good people. But I just listen to what they say and how they say it. I have used rifles in bad situations and got paid for it and still do sometimes when it is that time of year. My point is there is some misinformation from them and they don’t really understand a few things but it’s whatever
@dylanmills1476 I get ya. I think we all have our little bit to add to the conversation. It's when we speak beyond that bit that we can start to sound silly, as you say.
Brass facts is wrong about offset red dots! Offset red dots are better then 12 o'clock position, because if you run a plate , the turning of the stock will sit perfectly in your shoulder, but good luch doing that with a 12oclock red dot, not as comfortable
This is why you are wrong. Offset red dots require you to can’t your rifle. Canting a rifle while running CQB will land you smashing your rifle magazine into a threshold or corner. This is the one and only reason why I no longer run an offset red dot.
Good video. I think what appeals to me with add-on dots is the utility; passive aiming and coarse alignment of a magnified optic. For those purposes the piggy back is the one for me. An offset dot just seems like a waste of a perfectly good optic. :)
@Hop Thank you for being willing to engage in discussion with the small guys! You’re a positive force in building the community!
I get it. The redundancy does bother me in an OCD way.
@@PeekEngineering I should change my channel name to "the small guys"
Thanks brasshops
Fantasizing about whether or not a top mounted dot is superior to an offset dot in a non home defense situation as a civilian is just larping. If you die because of either one of those, you’ll get to have your entire afterlife to analyze the long list of terrible decisions you made to end up in that situation in the first place, alongside your dot placement choice. Just choose the one you’re more natural at and F off
Hey, let me address them as they come.
(for the record he asked me to do this)
If you're snapping around the corner as you did, it's not a major difference. I'm talking more from the perspective of crouched or standing, while keeping feet planted behind cover or, while pieing a corner while tilting your torso aggressively, where the muzzle is millimeters from sending a bullet through the wall, not significantly past the corner as you had it. That being said, I probably over spoke how big of a deal it is in the video, the struggles of a adlib video. It's worth mentioning the context here (and you touched on it): this video was for people that wanted to run 2-10x rifles and then use the 1x exclusively for cqb and medium range shooting.
Yep you're right piggybacks has lower lows in some scenarios.
Yeah I think we're saying the same thing here ( but I sucked at saying it). Offsets can be fast.
But (I think) primary positions are consistently faster in a wider range of scenarios.
This doesn't matter if you have both. Use whatever works but my video is in the context of a shooter forgoing a primary optic with the assumption that a offset position is the same speed, and intuitiveness off cover, around corners etc. in the exact same way a centerline optic is.
NV yeah, agree
I think I generally made a low quality video, where I didn't really underline the final conclusion I was making. I'm not saying offset, or piggyback are bad. They're infact quite fast when you put the time into them: see all of the comp circles.
I'm saying they're not a wholesale replacement for a center aiming solution (that I did mention several times in the video).
As you discovered yourself and stated.
You naturally want to sometimes use the center optic in a lot of situations and positions. be it corners, vtacs, etc.
The context of my videos discusses a new trend where people think the offset/piggy dot are 100% analogs for centerline optics. Thus allowing for zero performance losses when mounting whatever 4-16 or 2-10x instead of a 1-x lpvo
overall it's (yours) is a great video, and over constructive in nature. And I appreciate that. Honestly of higher quality than mine.
Appreciate you sharing your thoughts. I think my video adds a bit of nuance, but I doubt there is a fundamental difference in philosophy. I also realize your video was a bit off the cuff. Love the dialogue.
The king 👑
Such a well formulated and articulate response. Too bad it was too long and I didn’t read a single word of it.
@@burritoman2727😂😂😂😂
I got to the part about adlib video and quit reading, because I'm pretty sure you really were thinking about a dildo video.
I really love seeing thoughtful pushback to BrassHop; they’re collectively my favorite part of TH-cam. Excellent video.
I'm a big fan as well. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for watching! Do you believe offset red dots were a fad or are still a practical secondary optic?
Nah you hit the nail on the head here, they're absolutely still practical. Any disadvantages are so small that they're negligible in any practical situation. Look at 3gun. For God's sake in USPSA there are great shooters with an offset red dot for their red dot specifically because its better for leaning around cover lol
@@clearly_2967 i conxur
I think an offset red dot, properly set up so it sits over the bore of the rifle, can be a perfectly fine backup sighting system, and preferable to offset irons. But shooting with both eyes open the tube is still faster for me.
“A. Fuck you, you’re not trex arms.” 😂
Iraq Combat Veteran Armorer here. Piggyback red dots are not as effective as offset. PERIOD! 120 missions says so! Great video
I just got my first offset mount (Arasak) I have a 507c on it. I tried the mount at the 45 and 35-degree setting and the 35 is the best option. It keeps it close to the LPVO and has a minimum range of motion to use.
This video + BrassHops replies make me so proud to be apart of this community.
Excellent work my man, you did everything the exact way you should have. Respectfully, not trying to dig at them, and just overall giving your experiences. That is what we need. BrassHops are amazing, but they aren't omnipotent or perfect. Having more voices will always be better!
Thanks for the kind comment. These guys are great and I was just happy to add something valuable to the conversation.
Just how honest you was in the beginning of the video made me subscribe. I watch brass and hop as well. Any information from other people’s own experiences helps us all out.
Love to hear that. Thank you!
Good video. I will say I’m running a scalarworks 1.93 with a NX8 and their offset mount and RMR and I will say I love the setup. I tried to make sure of this before I got it but the offset is seemingly at the same height as the mount so having that at a 1.93 instead of lower 1/3 is fantastic and very comfortable even under a PVS14 so worth a try!
This is the setup I will probably be going with, except with a t2 instead of rmr, and a 1.57 instead of 1.93, as I don’t have nods.
I run an Lpvo 1-6 and plan to add offset Irons for backup and durability in case the optic fails. I don't need two optics because I live in a wet environment and don't need two going down. Everyone has different needs.
I'm also a compulsive gun buyer. And I like your balanced pros and cons on this subject. Brass'Opfeil are a go-to for me as well.... So subscribed! Thanks
Appreciate that, boss
Very nice and very well done! I run a Vortex Razor HD Gen II-E with an offset Aimpoint T-2, and I find it fast enough and natural enough a set up that I'm not worried about anything.
Great video boss. And a shout out to brasshops as well. I appreciate all of you putting out excellent content, especially for us common folk.
What offset mount did you use. Thanks again.
Trex arms offset in all these clips I believe. I own an arisaka but the trex seems a little tougher to me.
@0:45 What mount is that for your lpvo?
Scalarworks 30mm
I use offset irons as back up for my 1-6 lpvo. Im just as accurate using the irons as i am with my lpvo set on 1x. I normally leave my lpvo set around 4 to 6x and transition to irons for close "pop up" targets. Its pretty seamless and you really cant miss with a rifle inside 20 yards no matter what sight system you use. Thats why i never really saw the need for an offset dot. The offset irons get the job done way cheaper and its just kinda fun using irons. I guess im a wierdo, lol...
I look at top mounted reddots a supplementary equipment. I look at offset dots a secondary sighting system.
I think this is right.
@@compulsivegunbuyer when I use a micro dot as a secondary, I prefer to use a separate mounting option like an arisaka. It eliminates a single point failure.
For threegun, I use my offset as my primary, only using my prism 3x when I need to reach out to distance.
I've run the setup for the last two seasons and it's fast and I don't see any of the real downsides that have been discussed.
Meanwhile in PCC... I'll take an offset red dot to go with my main red dot please.
cheek weld is important, cant get that piggy backed.
Excellent video. I think Jeff Gurwitch will agree with you about the viability of the offset dot, considering he ran one for years on his M4 downrange in the sandbox pvp server we call GWOT.
Offset are practical, the piggyback method has the height over bore problems like you said through ports and also your shot placement. Holding the A of the A zone you’ll see the impact at the bottom of the box for cqb distances, a reason I don’t like unity type mounts and it also alters your trajectory. Offset dots can be used with passive but like you said you need to mount them forward and one thing to note is a lot of mounts are low setting like the adm rmr mount but you can get arisaka mounts to sit higher or use a badger j arm for 1.70 or 1.93, also using a t2 or holosun knock off helps because they don’t sit so low like an rmr would
Yes, I think it makes sense to have a piggyback rds if you want a do-all rifle and plan for lots of night shooting, but you are giving up a lot of capability for the nv convenience...and it will take lots of training.
@@compulsivegunbuyer everyone talks about passive aiming but you’re faster with a laser and if you’re in the same room or hallway the jug is up, use your laser. As far as using the dot outside to aim passive you’re going to be limited by the fact you can only see so far under nods and that’s greatly diminished without an IR illuminator. You could use a IR flashlight but then you’re still signaling where you are.
@@ExplorinInTheWoods my take as well
Loved the video bro
What color is the paint on your AR in the stills?
painting your rifle #camo
Used ‘em, not impractical at all. Everyone just thinks they are going to go into the boog with nods and a 12 o’clock piggyback red dot. Also, no one switches shoulders when their life is actually at stake.
The piggybacks require you to move your head and to re-acquire the reticle in the dot, losing your cheek weld in the process. Offset is a simple rotation of the rifle (and one that is natural) with the same cheek weld as the primary optic, rotate the rifle, the dot just shows up, I’ve been shooting the offset dots in 3 gun for years (dot mounted behind the scope mount- top adjustment buttons make life much easier- I use a Vortex Razor), the only thing those guys got right is shooting around left corners (if you’re a righty) and maybe the idiotic notion you’d use the dot instead of your IR laser under NV. As far as I’m concerned, the only time to even use the secondary optic is really off rifle placement where eye relief is an issue, around a tight, right corner, and if you have your LVPO dialed up to magnification.
Totally agree man. Great video.
Thanks for watching!
So when your “peeling” around that corner, or any corner of your house/apartment, what’s your plan when the other guy stitches the wall in front of you?
Sorry, what? Stitches the wall?
@@compulsivegunbuyer dumps 20 rounds in/across the wall in front of you.
My plan would be to not sh!t my pants and die with dignity 😂
@@graybeardsagemy plan, and hear me out, is to grab a pistol (I have one in a small secret trap door 6 inches off the deck at each side at every corner. For example, an apartment where when you walk in there is a full wall the length of the apartment to your right and on the left, a short wall about four 4 feet long that makes up the entrance space, and then a corner on the left wall that opens into a living room with the full wall on the right being one of the four walls that make up the living room space. On that corner on the left, there would be two trap doors with pistols. One trap door accessible if you’re approaching the corner from the entrance and one trap door accessible if you’re already inside the apartment and approaching the corner from living room. You dig what I’m saying? Two trap doors on every corner in the apt and a pistol in each trap door so that a heater will be accessible no matter which side of the corner I’m approaching from. So for this strategy, I’ll be have a gun accessible for any scenario.
Now, hopefully you can visualize my trap door location set up. And for this scenario, let’s say it’s about 10:30pm on a Friday night. I’m sitting in my living room recliner watching the most recent episode of Gold Rush on the Discovery channel, and flipping through an old Victoria Secret magazine looking for a chick wearing a sheer bra hoping to see partial nipples, and maybe even an areola. I finally find one and it’s perfect. She looks white/asian mix (probably Korean based on cheek bones, chin shape, and eyes) and definitely meat beater worthy. So I get up to pull the curtain, grab my spank sock from behind the couch, and a set up a tv tray to support the magazine. I pull the string in my sweats and am about to sit down when I hear my door knob rattle. I quickly stash everything in the TV stand cabinet for a quick retrieval and start towards the door. Suddenly I hear the deadbolt click and, door knob turn, and the door pops open. I look in the reflection of picture I have strategically hung on the far wall facing the door, and I an unfamiliar dude peep his head in. He’s wearing a hoodie, a mask over his face, I can make out the barrel of a gun, and I have no idea who he is. So I drop to the floor, belly button to the carpet, and army crawl to within a foot of the corner. I locate my trap door, pull my heater, and suddenly hear very loud POP, POP, POP, POP, POP, POP, POP, , POP, POP, POP! And feel small bits of dry wall rain down on me. The dude just stitched the wall in front of him aiming where the recliner would be on the other side. So I, prepared for this moment, am already laying on the ground in a semi push-up position, head about 8 inches from the corner, feet toward the television inside the interior of the apparent space. Right should up against the wall, gun in my left hand, locked and cocked, and ready to rock the jock that unlocked the lock, creepin with the Glock, pop pop pop no knock like a cop…Tick tock tick tock he’s about to get a shock, brass is flyin like a flock, catchin bodies non stop. Fucked around and found out he picked the wrong spot.
I mean a piggyback seams viable in the sense a scope is mounted so low that a piggyback is essentially like running a 3/4 riser or tower mount for red dots but again thats gonna be if your scope is bumping uglies on your pic rail
Do Brass or Hop have any experience besides TH-cam theoreticals and paper targets?
My .02 you can do what you want with it. The reason you put a brds is for none other than fast shooting from near to far. In a riot running around cars. In a building shooting outside to quickly inside. In woods from far to defend ambush. All the rest is byproduct. Fluff. Extra. It’s a fast backup sight. Only other legit thing it should be called is a close in sight. Most ppl just call them quick sight, for a reason.
Definitely believe it is a "purpose driven" decision 🤔
For "shorties" I like a 2.26 height RDS primary with a FTC magnifier: no secondary
-
For "GPR" (13.7~16") I like 1.93 1-6x SFP "RDS bright" LPVO: mRDS secondary not "needed", but definitely not putting one up in a 12 o'clock orbit above an already high mount 😂 If running a secondary, it's definitely going to be offset!
-
18~24" SPR/PRS will be running a MPVO or long range primary around 1.5" off the deck. In this instance, a 1x secondary at the 12 o'clock position is ideal.
@davidhartley6232 this is sort of where I've end up as well...only issue is trying to train to adequate proficiency with three different settups (all with multiple optics), but I haven't found a one size fits all that I'm satisfied with.
Just have both and forego BUIS
Call me old-fashioned but I can't seem to ditch BUIS.
@@compulsivegunbuyer I hear ya. Irons are fun to shoot in my opinion.
@@compulsivegunbuyerBUIS nation after the EMP hits lmao 😂
They use passive aiming with nod and no laser so... I'm piggyback fan also
I like piggybacks too
I have my offset red dot to use when my rifle is set at full magnification. If I’m in my house and using the same rifle, I would have my LPVO at 1x I could use either and not have to lean weird and break my back or whatever.
Great video. Thanks
THIS IS MURICA!!!!
We are masters of excess, RUN BOTH!!!
Just an idea. Why not if your going left corner switch hands. Then you wouldnt be as exposed.
Fair enough but you'd still have to use your primary optic instead of the offset (i.e. offsets are not ambidextrous).
Brass Facts take on this topic was asinine.
ANY red dot position requires you to move your head and/or body slightly off center. That is actually the point of them....isn't it? A 2nd optic on the same rifle to do a different job opposed to your primary optic?!?
So he found the one circumstance where an off set red dot would be slightlyyyy less advantageous, just to prove his point.
We call this confirmation bias!! Holding a preconceived belief then running tests to help confirm your original outlook/bias.
Lastly, why does it always look like Brass Facts is wearing eye liner?? 🧐🧐
Anytime I see arguments favoring one idea over another I come to the conclusion that neither argument is right or wrong. Choose the technique you feel serves your needs. You won’t be wrong no matter what.
Pretty much. Training trumps gear and you can make many things work for you.
BrassFacts is just another guy with an opinion, although he believes his opinions are worth more than they are (probly because he wears plaid shirts in his video). Hes no more special than the next guy. Nobody should be taking what he says as gold. Same with Hop. Do whatever the fuck you want to do, nuff said.
It's their job to state their opinions. Met both at SHOT show by the way--they are great guys. Just look at their replies to this video in the comment section and you can see that they don't take their opinions as gospel either.
I see an offset red dot as a backup optic first and foremost. Piggybacks are relying on the same mounting system as your primary optic. Doesn’t make sense to me.
@@itsEzvn That's an interesting thought. Do you still run irons?
Off set irons ftw
I don’t have night vision so offset is 👑 . 😂
I bought an LPVO for the 1x and am well aware of the drawbacks. Adding more stuff to a rifle is a marketer's dream. The gun community is obsessed with consumerism. Is it hard to shoot in non conventional positions with an LPVO? Maybe. But that is a training issue. Basically train more.
Good video
Thanks!
I’d say what is comfy for YOU. Like for me??? I am faster with a Red Dot and the 45 degree offset just works better for me.
I totally agree
Why don’t you spend a few more bucks and get the eotech system and call it a day?
What's this in reference to? Do you mean an eotech + magnifier?
? ? ?
I have ran both on top of a few optics and on the side on 33 or 45 degree. For me it is clearly much better to have it on the side hands down. And that other guy aggressively coming up with silly not so correct points on why an offset is so bad is in my opinion not very factual and more just overly opinionated. Don’t like those dudes channels much for many of those reasons
I like them, but thanks for the comment.
@@compulsivegunbuyeryou are welcome, I am sure they are good people. But I just listen to what they say and how they say it. I have used rifles in bad situations and got paid for it and still do sometimes when it is that time of year. My point is there is some misinformation from them and they don’t really understand a few things but it’s whatever
@dylanmills1476 I get ya. I think we all have our little bit to add to the conversation. It's when we speak beyond that bit that we can start to sound silly, as you say.
Brass facts is wrong about offset red dots!
Offset red dots are better then 12 o'clock position, because if you run a plate , the turning of the stock will sit perfectly in your shoulder, but good luch doing that with a 12oclock red dot, not as comfortable
It might depend on the specific stock shape but yes, I tend to agree.
This is why you are wrong. Offset red dots require you to can’t your rifle. Canting a rifle while running CQB will land you smashing your rifle magazine into a threshold or corner. This is the one and only reason why I no longer run an offset red dot.
Interesting
My CQB rig is a P90, so I can't relate.
This is extremely true, but for me is mitigated by the fact I usually run a 20rd mag in the rifle that uses an offset red dot
Ironsite Gang, who's with me!
The true men among us.
Primary red dot offset prism 🦧
This man is operating on a different level
@@compulsivegunbuyer My other idea was double offset red dot, like having a mount that holds 2 red dots at opposite 45 degree angles
@PrussianPushma how about an mpvo with an offset lpvo?
@@compulsivegunbuyer hahaha triple flashlights up front
What a wanna b operator with all that tac gear. You people kill me
Nice