The best advice I was ever given about riding was when I first started riding in the mid 70’s. It has saved me many times and can’t be over- emphasized. ALWAYS leave yourself a way out. Especially at intersections. Before you enter the intersection, scan all around and try to plan a bad scenario just in case it does happen. Plan a way out of it as you approach. It works, especially if you practice thinking things through. Good video, sir- again!!!👍🇺🇸🏍❤️
I see so many riders roll right up behind vehicles with nowhere to go but into the trunk/rear bumper. AND, they put their bike in neutral, both feet on ground, with arms crossed in front of their chest and never look at rearview mirrors. Unbelievable they got their M Endorsement.
@@Elvendertig1130 Well, motorcycles have no frame or sheet metal around them. So it’s a good idea to be extra aware and on your game when you ride. Accidents are not an option. But as in anything else we enjoy doing, you take the risk to enjoy the experience. It’s not a paranoia, it’s a preparedness. If you do start to ride, you’ll understand what I’m saying. Ride on!👍🇺🇸❤️
I always assume every car is out to kill me . Leaving yourself options by lane positioning or slowing down to maximize the reaction time I have .. absolutely has served me well in my nearly 50 years of riding the streets . I'm so sorry to hear of the loss of the officer . Be safe out there
I try to think that every car is trying to get somewhere and may not be concentrating on the road. OK, assume they're trying to kill you might keep you safe but I find this makes me feel the victim when I'd rather feel like a boss for seeing all these things coming and reacting.
@@jamesrindley6215 however you wish to think about as long as you are expecting the unexpected and planning what you would do if and when someone does not see you is a good policy that will keep you safe . I don't want to come off sounding too paranoid lol But after riding 37 different bike's and thousand's of miles under my belt a bit of paranoia is a healthy thing IMHO
@@turbomustang84 I remember how overwhelming it was to try and see everything and to know everything that was going on around me. Intuition has served me well ,but there are unavoidable situations, but then again,,,,, that's true of cars too
@@turbomustang84 profesional drivers think exactly like that. I have been riding and driving that way my entire life. You are not really paranoid untill you quit riding. I just assume everyone is an idiot a drive accordingly.
I say this to everyone I teach/coach. assume everyone on the road is a half-asleep moron. every parked car will open the doors on you. every parked bus is gonna have someone walk out from in front of it. every car in front of you is about to slam on the brakes.
Same same. I trust no vehicle, wear hiviz always, bright helmet, have headlight on always, lane position for best vision and always think where is the danger
Yes but I have a long way to go with those skills. Harleys and other heavy cruisers take a lot of practice to handle slow speeds with confidence. If you can handle the slow speeds proficiently you are less likely to ride too fast for the situation. Also as your skills get better and more automatic you can concentrate more on potential road hazards.
Just got back from riding to Sequoia National Park. I took everything that MC has said and it helped me to control my ride. No matter if the vehicles were behind me, I just rode my ride
They will the more you practice, and every ride is practice. I've been riding for almost 30 yrs, now teaching my son. Don't make the mistake of thinking if you're going slow there's no danger. There's always existential threats, cars, animals, bad road conditions, pedestrians. The more you're slow speed skills improve, the more it becomes muscle memory and you can focus on the threats around you. Be safe and keep your head on a swivel.
I think you just jump off? Purposely jackknifing it and sliding would be some movie stuff. I'm sure there's a situation here and there, where it could be a good idea, but I think at slower speeds, and maybe heading towards a cliff or something.
yes you do 1. Lock up the front brake or both brakes and the bike will slide out from under you or throw you over the handle bars 2. Panic and push the grip on one side so hard the bike turns and leans over past the peg scrape into a frame scrape, and the bike will slide on the frame out from under you - but at least you dont go over the handlebars Laying a bike down is what you have been avoiding for the last 40 years - you know what NOT to do - dont intentionally crash your bike.
I guess you would lock up the rear wheel, or maybe the front, or maybe both. I can't because my BMW R1200GS has anti-lock brakes. Of course I don't want to lay 'er down - better friction with tires than the side of my bike, and I prefer not to trash my bike or slide across the pavement on my butt.
Also when people say they crashed because of gravel, I bet in many cases they actually ran wide in a corner and hit the gravel off the edge of the road.
@@REL602 Once when a van pulled out in front of me, my rear tire ended up just under her rocker panel. Once, I came over a hill real fast and suddenly there was a a stop light and a flatbed and no where to go, I put it down just under the flatbed. You just instinctively react, no practice, no training. I couldn't consciously duplicate my lay downs no matter how hard I might try.
I always thought "I had to lay her down" was just a euphemism/excuse for "I nearly shat my pants when that car pulled out and I grabbed a fist full of brake and lost traction"
Unfortunately, there’s a segment of North American riding culture that created and perpetuates the myth of “layin’ her down” as an accident avoidance maneuver; the same segment that rides to the bar, drinks way too much, then gets back on the road.
@timberwolfdtproductions3890 Along with loud pipes save lives and front brakes are dangerous. I find it useful, sorts out who can be taken seriously in a heartbeat.
Ironically, grabbing a "fist full" i.e. front brake, would probably actually have worked, because of weight transfer, and dual discs up front, 80/20 braking, etc. but there is an entire generation ("ok boomers") who have never learned anything but the foot (i.e. rear, diminishing traction) braking. Look at the incredible size of the typical Harley rear brake foot pedal (on the right side). I've driven *cars* with smaller brake pedals.
Always slow down in areas where a potential path of travel violation may exist. Even if you can see them, don't assume they can still see you. Inattentive blindness exists. If you're wearing all black, its a recipe for disaster, especially when combined with poor road strategy.
@@patrickdecambra2219 While true (Or as I've told the people I've taught to drive and ride: "Just assume everyone's an a_____e out to kill you." you have to be an active invisible driver.
Whenever someone says "I had to lay her down" all I hear is "I ran out of skill" I really think riders should stop thinking of themselves as inexperienced and experienced. The thought that you're an inexperienced rider can lead to panic and when you panic bad things happen. Thinking that you're and experienced rider can lead to ego problems and when your inflated ego is in the drivers seat bad things can happen. Cliché I know but there is always more to learn about riding, new theories, new techniques, new tech, and what not. While not all of it may make sense to you or be for your style of riding take from it that which does and incorporate it into your skill set. Keep building and practicing those old skills and keep adding new ones. Hopefully, when an emergency situation happens your skills will save you and you won't have to tell anyone how you had to "lay her down". Ride safely my friends.
You nailed it. I had a friend of mine who was new to riding asked me how I rated my skills as a rider. I said average maybe a bit above. He looked kinda shocked and asked how that’s possible since I’ve been on bikes for nearly 30 years and teach new riders. I told him it’s because I still have a lot to learn and the moment I think I know it all I will have become a danger to myself. Staying humble with something as dangerous as riding in my opinion is critical to staying safe.
...when you lose control, the outcome is no longer yours to decide. You will do what the vehicle involved tells you to do. Regardless of how much skill you think that you have. You didn't have the good judgement to use enough of it soon enough. And now all of your skill has fled the scene of the impeding accident.
No. When you have "laid it down" you have ALREADY crashed. Just a matter of if you happen to hit anything else afterwards. But you've still crashed it. Hope the gremlin bell helped!
So sad when a fellow rider dies on a bike. This is peak riding season and there are a lot of us just getting warmed up to riding again. Please stay alert and practice as much as possible. Praying you all stay safe and aware this riding season.
And set a good example by making yourself more visible with a white helmet or Hi-Viz vest or jacket, riding sober, getting training especially in counter-steering and proper braking, and choose a bike with ABS.
Kevin, I think you handled the subject very sensitively, with great respect for the fallen rider. This is a subject that I continually harp on, particularly riders of cruisers. One problem is the prevalence of this type of crash on TV, I think because it’s easy for a stunt rider to do. So then people think that in an actual unplanned accident, this is a useful technique.
Good advice as always. None of my three bikes have ABS... but I have made a thirty six year policy of doing a training course about every four to five years to great effect. Last September I put myself in a dangerous position (too fast for conditions) with the predictable consequence and a car nearly squeezed me out of my lane. This particular bike (cafe racer) has a professionally upgraded front brake which is much more powerful but concomitantly less forgiving than the original unit and I managed to 'lock her up'... I was mid crash going down to the right and everything went into very slow motion, I even had time to think 'oh no, not the Triumph' before the training kicked in and I released the front brake with instant return of traction and the bike was able to right itself allowing me to ride out of trouble. Big lesson learnt. The dramatic scuff marks around the right side periphery of the front tyre make ample testimony to how close I came to binning it! I have since made time to practise some hard braking technique on quiet back roads.
Your content is pure life saving gold. I've been riding since 2013 and it's easy to get comfortable and cocky after a while. Your advice keeps me humbled and motivated to stay safe.
I am always looking in both mirrors as I am riding and I say out loud instructions to myself like slow down, don’t change lanes now, people don’t see you, don’t follow too closely, honk the horn. I never get cocky when I am driving.
I've never understood the "I had to lay the bike down" thing and don't see it as a strategy that should ever even come up. Why would you not keep it up on two wheels and take advantage of the massive braking potential that motorcycles have, and maintain control to the last possible instant? Also, the way I see it, motorcycles inherently want to stay upright and go straight. So the only way to lay one down on purpose is to purposely throw it into an out of control skid to force it down (which makes me wonder how many of these "I had to lay the bike down" incidents were really intentional, and how many of them are just the rider panicking, which could happen to anyone). Why not put those precious split seconds to better and more efficient use?
I think the 'I had to lay it down" is just a way of sugar coating that they crashed. It's downplaying the situation, and in most cases the rider didn't handle the situation well, so they "Had to"
I agree - motorcycles are self balancing, you cannot force it to fall over unless you lock up both brakes and stop the wheels from spinning, at which point the bike will fall over as if it was standing still I had to lay it down! Translation: I did not know how to stop fast or swerve and gravity took over...
@@kenwittlief255 I couldn't agree more. What does "laying the bike down" even mean? How is this done? Can one practice the skill of "laying the bike down"? I've never believed it. They grabbed too much front brake, and crashed. Simple as that.
It makes no sense, so long as we're still on the bike there's still a chance to avoid the crash. Even if you end up hitting something, it'll be made less severe by losing as much speed as possible using the brakes and tyres. Crashes are often dynamic with the other vehicle also moving which means there might be a chance of an escape path opening up. Tyres are designed to grip tarmac as well as possible, which is not true of riding gear, skin, and other parts of the motorcycle.
I’ve been riding on and off fo 40 years. Most motorcyclists I see on the road don’t ride with fear they will die, so they ride nonchalantly. If you ride with a little fear, maybe they will distance themselves from other vehicles and provide enough time to avoid the possibility’s. I’m not saying don’t enjoy the ride. I’m saying live in reality, if you can distance yourself, great. If not you step up the fear level and be more cautious. Works for me
@@deb-kenjohnson9497 ...agree...it is all about 'situational awareness' and this will always help you to be half a second ahead of the rest and possibly more able to implement defensive strategy if/when needed. What I have learnt from going through my learner's process here in Australia last year and now with my full license, I have found I have changed my approach to driving (43 years) to become more aware and often thinking like I am riding while behind the wheel! I see so much more of what others are doing as a result!
Sure, top level climbers say fear is a good thing. It needs to be fear channelled into concentration and focus, not fear that makes you paranoid and likely to freeze up.
yep a lot of people ride with the attitude that people will watch-out for them and give them extra space because they are riding a bike :) some people will actually do that, and some other people will run them right off the road
Glad for this real-world analysis. In 2013, I totaled a Triumph Sprint after low siding it when a car pulled out in front of us at distance too short to maneuver. No ABS so I lost the front and low-sided it. Dumb luck proved it was the right thing to do. Neither of us were hurt. There's no way on God's green earth I had the presence of mind to "lay her down." I think people who say this are delusional.
Exactly my point. So glad to read your description of the events. Lesser-trained and less intelligent riders would describe that as you “laid the bike down” as if that were a real choice.
First of all, I am not a believer in ABS. I believe riders should learn how to brake properly. It sounds like you accidentally low sided while trying to brake. Better braking skills may or may not have prevented the low side. As far as having "the presence of mind to "lay her down", I am also a dirt rider, and started riding off road at age 8. I rode dirt bikes for 8 years before getting my license at age 16, and getting a street bike. I'm too old now to do some of the things I used to do on dirt bikes, including jumps and slides. I used to lean the bike way over to the left in a sharp left turn, attempting to slide around the turn. That didn't always work, and I sometimes wound up laying on the ground with the bike on top of me. Things work very differently on dirt than they do on pavement, where you have way more traction. But having done it on dirt so many times, if I found myself in one of those one in a million situations (like heading straight for a semi trailer, no room to get around it, and realizing my brakes were not going to stop me in time) I believe I would be able to intentionally lay the bike down, hoping to slide under the trailer rather than having my head taken off by it. It might or might not work. But I seriously doubt I will ever find myself in such a situation to begin with. How could anyone miss a semi pulling in front of them? Just watch some videos of crotch rocket riders (who really have no business being on public roads) going way too fast and leaning over way too far in corners, trying to get their knee and elbow on the asphalt. Many of them wind up low siding, and some of the unluckier ones wind up regaining traction somehow and high siding.
@@geraldscott4302 Nonsense. ABS is way better. Grab all the brake you can and lower the velocity as much as possible and hope for the best. Period. If you fishtail without ABS, you have to release brakes and re-grab them to get back on track, losing ground right toward the target at higher speed than if you grabbed all the ABS that you can.
@@geraldscott4302 A rider's bike can both have ABS and the rider also know how to brake properly. One of my motorcycles (a older dual sport) does not have ABS, and I have practiced minimum distance stops with deliberation on both dirt and hard paved surfaces. Many riders have older bikes without ABS along with modern bikes with it, and it should go without saying that knowing one's equipment is always prudent. That said, modern ABS is, as is said in the video, a life saver. The notion that even a very well practiced human can surpass the efficacy of ABS in a minimum distance stop emergency braking and maneuver is false, and becomes downright dangerous when it generates criticism against it. Given how long statistical evidence of the additional safety provided by ABS has been around, there should be nothing controversial about it.
@@geraldscott4302 I used to thing that way, plus ABS adds significant weight to a bike, so track rider me disapproved. Plus, a good rider can outbrake ABS. Thing is, on the track, you are focused. Nearly everything that happens on track is predictable, and your concentration is absolute. Hell, that is why we are there, isn't it? On the street, everyone loses focus from time to time. On the commute to or from work, running errands, maybe thinking about tonight's date. ABS doesn't lose focus and not notice the oil patch while panic braking. So yeah, I am partially with you. ABS ain't perfect, but it can help in those times that perfect focus is lost. In fact, an ABS moment on the VFR I once owned sold me on it. I still don't want it on my track bikes, though.
I recently had a similar encounter. My daughter and I was riding when an elderly man pulled directly in front of us from a secondary road. We was in a right turn going through an underpass/tunnel. I was in lane position 1. The posted speed for that turn was 30mph, I believe I was running 35. I’m one who watches your videos frequently and I’ve been riding for around 10 years now. Your videos always help me remember what I was taught many years ago and with that saved us from hitting that car. I applied emergency braking just hard enough to keep the wheels from locking and kept my eyes on the driver. Right at the time I was just going to set the bike up straight the driver seen me and gassed on it. Just narrowly missing him. Also, in this, my daughter who’s 24, never moved an inch! Which I praised her afterwards. It’s very crucial that not only the rider gets trained, but the passenger as well. I’ve done my best to teach my wife and daughter on proper techniques as a passenger. Had she not been trained as well and made the wrong move, it surely would’ve ended badly. Thanks for all you do Kevin! You my friend do make a difference in people’s road skills and strategies. 😎
@@jodybogdanovich4333 lol I could lie and say i was that good, but truth is i finished my coffee chillin on the patio at starbucks. the weather was too nice to not be out enjoying it.
@@FlySwann I love my cup holder and a long straw. Can sip while riding if need be. I was picturing that scenario with your emergency braking. I once hit a rough patch of road and my tank and I wore my latte that day. 🤦♀️
Kevin we appreciate your wisdom and training. So sorry for the family of the fallen officer. Great advice continue to practice what you learn to be prepared. God bless you
I just made this mistake yesterday in Muskegon MI, I was traveling behind one of those MI dump trucks could not see over it. We were at a light and I was trailing it too close. They ran a red light and I had use emergency braking and stopped about 1/3 way into intersection. No harm but drove lane position home to me, thx McRider
In my city they have programmed the lights so that when one turns red there is approximately a one second hold before the next in line turns green. Just for those well I'll hold my tongue on that but people that like to time lights and once it's turns green they can go through at full speed. So with a pause with all red lights they have to put on their brakes or at least look because all lights are red good engineering by our city I'm sure lies have been saved by this. My mechanic gave me this advice he said every intersection and every time he sees a car turning onto his road he hits his rights flasher on his Harley cluster. I have one also and just starting to use it. Car drivers definitely do see it especially at night because a single headlight 30 to 40 yards away can appear to the driver like it's another street light but when that light flashes they don't pull out in front of you. I also have a strobe brake light too many people getting too close to the rear my bike.
@@davolbc what?! when you flash your headlights at a turning car in an intersection you are telling them to turn across your path and you will wait its called blinking them thru you are going to get yourself killed
@MCrider - Motorcycle Training MSF Obstacle Avoidance Maneuver saved my life the other day. Car turning left, stopped on busy highway with turn signal on but car behind me never slowed down on 55 mph highway AT ALL. The thought of becoming a Car Sandwich made me use said MSF Maneuver to get out of the way, pulling right - braking in the grass (ditch) with no ABS but was able to down shift and brake in concert to stop w/o dropping bike. Got out of the way as car behind me hit the car in front of me dead on. So glad I didn't lay my bike down on the road that day which was certainly a possibility. Had mere seconds to react but very grateful to have learned in MSF class to have a path out and away from potential trouble. Thank you so much for your spot on videos. Always learning....
I am never going to put the motorcycle down to avoid an accident. Brake, swerve anything but laying it down. Situational awareness is your best defense against a motorcycle crash. Lane position it key to avoiding accidents if you can't see them they can't see you........................ You'll never convince me that Hi-Visibility gear is not the way to go. You have to be seen to avoid being pulled in front of. Ride safe and be seen. I have a bright yellow bike and Hi-Vis gear.
@@wormfood83 yup. Dayglow suit and yellow helmet (never mind the headlight) didn’t stop the lady from pulling broadside in front of me. The responding cop couldn’t believe it either. That said, I still wear the suit and have an even more obnoxious helmet now. BTW, I got it down to about 5 mph (from about 35) before impact and got lucky that I hit right between tire and fender, so more energy bled off. Not only did I not “lay ‘er down,” but the bike stayed upright once I got off it - no sidestand required! Maybe I should have considered jumping off at the last second and spider-man-landing on her hood. :D
The interesting thing I've noticed as I have acquired and driven a whole range of vehicles over 45 years, is that while the "I didn't see him" has become the normal excuse for causing a motorcycle accident, I have just as many incidents of people not seeing me, when I'm driving a car, my full size pickup, or even my large 2 ton truck. The thing is if people aren't looking and/or concentrating, they are not going to see you regardless of what you drive, a review of semi truck dash cam video of accidents will show how many cannot even see them coming. The "I didn't see him" becomes more prolific with motorcycles because what would be some bent metal work in a pickup ends up in death, or serious injury with a motorcycle and therefore gets more publicity. I certainly agree with making attempts to be visible on a motorcycle, but either way I've found I have to adopt all the same defensive riding/driving skills what ever I'm driving to avoid accidents that would occur with frightening regularity as cases of distracted and inept driving seem to increase exponentially on our roads.
Thank You for the great reminder of practicing good technique. A motorcycle will always stop faster and maneuver better on its wheels, rather than sliding on its side. I would be honored to participate in any event to memorialize this man. He did the best he could in the time he had. We can’t fault him for that, but we can honor his life by respectfully telling his story.
I agree on your assessment of ABS. My VFR800 has it, and while it doesn't replace good technique it is absolutely critical in improving your odds of not "laying her down" in a panic brake situation.
I've been riding for 49 years and appreciate your help/advise very much! Your tips on stopping a heavy bike were especially helpful.. Keep up the great work!! You're awesome!!!
A sad loss for the family and friends off the rider in question. On behalf of myself and many others who will benefit from watching this video, thank you for posting.
Thank you for sharing. I am a new rider and after 6 weeks and 2000 miles on my bike, I have been practicing my breaking and evasive maneuvers because of watching your videos.
I always though that laying the bike down was a bad idea. Metal/plastic on asphalt can't possibly stop faster than rubber. If it did, we would all be riding with metal wheels
Thing is tires are made of this sticky rubbery stuff where as the pegs and bars and fairing on the side of a motorcycle are made of hard stuff like plastics and metal, guess which grips best and slows you best in a straight line obstacle avoidance scenario :/
@@250txc there may be times when laying the bike down is the only option but I can’t think of many. Sure if someone runs wide of a curve goes off the road towards a branch at chest height with boulders on each side preventing a turn then MAYBE laying it down in a low speed slide MIGHT work. If I laid the bike down everytime I’ve needed to use max braking I would have slide into the car/person each of those times.
One of your finest videos yet. In twenty-five seconds, specifically from 2:40 to 3:05, you summarized perfectly the situation a motorcyclist faces every time they ride, and how best to deal with it. Thank you for saying it so well.
Kevin, I always get something I can use from watching the videos. You are so right on improvements in all aspects of motorcycle riding. The brakes, lights, tires, helmets and protective gear are light years ahead of what I had when I started riding in 1965. Some so -called "hard core or purists" look down on those of us that use "all the gear, all the time". One even told me that if I was that scared, I should quit riding! Been married 48 years, and Wife riding with me for 49 years. Our riding habits and safety gear and bike all convey that we want to live to ride again! Our current ride is a Airbag ABS Gold Wing. And, I just bought her a Helite air vest to add to her gear. Thanks for letting me ramble on!
Kevin, I've only recently viewed a few of your videos. As a 10 year MSF rider coach, long distance rider who can no longer put in the ultra miles, and a person who values good advice, I appreciate your thoughtful information. I appreciate your sincere demeanor and presentation of choices while riding. The riding landscape is ever changing and presents many opportunities for decisions. There is rarely one right choice. Each of us has to select the best choice based on our knowledge, experience, motorcycle, and decision in the moment. Training and experience help us make better decisions in the moment. Thanks for your work. Billy
Recently I had a chance to apply your suggestions. I have ridden for 60 years. Had the closest call last week. Traveling 45mph. I was following a car in a legal distance. Rain dampened road and a car coming towards me in opposite lane. All the sudden a van darted from a street on the left and shot right in front of me to the other side of the street. I didn’t panic and knew I was headed into the side of the van. I applied both brakes till the abs brakes were chattering but I just veered gently left and went right between the van and the car approaching it the opposite direction. Glad I didn’t lay it down. Your videos are part of the reason I can still type this message. Thanks
People in cars don’t see riders. This thought I’ve imprinted in my mind and I rarely get angry with drivers for ‘my’ sake. No hitting the rev limiter in a poor attempt to discipline drivers. It’s just another distraction. I think as riders, we need adapt a mature, common sense approach our life depends on it. Even so, sad events such as this still happen.
"Inattentional blindness" is the condition of not seeing what you don't expect to see. Study after study show this is real and additional studies show that cagers, especially in the early riding season, simply do not expect to see us (and don't). I didn't see the video he mentioned, but I have to assume he discusses placing your bike in a position where it would be seen as if it were the headlight of an oncomming car. In his example it would be lane position #1.
Your final comments about Honoring the Deceased by using this as a Learning opportunity Could Not have Been More Graceful. You are a Class Act! Best Wishes from Montana M.H
Motorcycles do not stop very good when sliding on metal and plastic parts. They stop way better when braking on rubber parts! The idea that laying the bike down is a god idea is just pure ignorance!
Thank you McRider! Too many people talk about laying the bike down. UGH!!!! So wrong!!! It's nice to hear other people talking sense. Don't ever give up control of the bike. Don't ever practice laying down the bike. Giving space to make a better decision is a smarter choice. Slow down, Give space, Don't give up control of the bike and intentionally crash. Sometimes it may be avoidable (and sometimes accidents happen). Do what you can and change your habits so you don't end up in this situation.
This is great commentary and excellent education. The one thing I have always done in over 40 years of riding motorcycles is always assume that nobody sees you....
Great and sombre video, thoughts and prayers with his family. Totally agree with all you say. As an ex police officer I would much rather use the equipment on the bike that is designed to scrub off speed rather than lay down on my lower friction riding gear, which allows me to travel further down the road to spread the force of impacts. Dynema and leather are certainly slipper than rubber compound. Also, if you hit something whilst on the bike, you have a chance of going over the hood/top of the car and rolling off some of that energy. You drop and slide, you're on an uncontrollable course to a solid bodily impact with something that isn't going to move. And these days, I don't even entertain a bike unless it has ABS. Another great video and I recently signed up for one of our rider awareness courses run by the police in the UK. Because even with my history, I must keep my training in good order. God bless sir! Dale
"... going over the hood/top of the car and rolling off some of that energy..." Five decades ago I watched a rider do just that. A few weeks later he showed up on crutches to pick up my sworn affidavit of what I had seen. His lawyer was very happy for that affidavit. The rider made the instantaneous correct choice; lowering his CG would not have helped him, and "losing control" would have cost him his case.
I have been riding motorcycles for about 55 years and have never had a collision with a car. I always ride with the mindset that all of these people driving cars are out to kill me. I find the most dangerous situations are at intersections. When I approach one, I am always looking at the cars and the driver and slow up just a bit and have an extended following distance. When I deem the intersection is clear I will ad a little throttle to get out of the intersection quickly. I agree with you Kevin. I have had a couple very close calls, WAY to close for comfort but I did not lay the bike down but took evasive measures to keep from getting hit. Keep up the good instructional videos Kevin! They are great!!
"Laying down" the bike makes no sense to me at all! I always thought that the mission was to do all you can to stay up and if a bike went down, it was a consequence of evasive action that failed. Laying your bike down doesn't evade an accident it commits to it; if you go down, you've crashed!
Been riding 30yrs. Recently went to a BIG bike. Slow speed is alot different on a 600lb. bike compared to 900lb. especially when I weigh 150lbs. Your low speed vids has given me critical information to make me safer and a more confident rider. Thank you Kevin.
I read just yesterday someone boasting about “having to lay it down”. Adding to that, this person had only a helmet and no gear whatsoever. Such a shame, all the road rash could have been avoided by having a different mindset.
People have mocked me for wearing protective gear in the 100+ degree temps we have here, but I tell them it's because of allergies. Allergies?? Yeah, I'm allergic to road rash! 😂
Whether I’m riding my motorcycle, driving my car, walking along the road, or on my bicycle, I have never been disappointed by expecting everyone else on the road to do the unexpected. I enjoy life and want to do activities (like riding) that increase my enjoyment. I understand there are risks, but, as you say, Kevin, I have control over a lot of those risks through constant situational awareness and skill based riding. It is sad to hear of stories like this, and you’re correct that we don’t know all the details of this tragic event. They can serve as reminders to take responsibility for ourselves each time we throw a leg over and go for a ride. Keep up the great work, Kevin!
The greatest safety feature of a motorcycle is the riders Knowledge. The knowledge that the street is not a racetrack or stunt park and even when you are riding sedately the street will sometimes try to kill you Also the knowledge that everyone else on the road is out to kill you (even your friend riding with you) but it is only occasionally that they see you as an actual target for murder Often they just don't care or think even that far.
I survived my motorcycle crash in 1977 --- helmet on --- yamaha 650 going to work --- 4 lane street w/ side streets. Box van truck in the right lane signals right turn so I go left lane to cruise by --- driver on the side street wanting to turn left never sees me --- I never saw her. She pulls out into my path --- sees me and hits the brakes. My instincts saved me --- go for daylight --- don't let your body hit anything --- I was going 45 mph but swerved enough to hit her car at the trunk instead of the roofline. Would have been cut in half. Spent 6 days in the hospital because my legs were paralyzed from the shock. I still walk and ride. Take care and keep up these great videos.
Extactly! I imediately thought about "road strategy", sight, tires, brakes, developed skills. We have an entire arsenal to keep our selves safe. But sometimes Murphy's Law wins, no matter what. RiP that good man. 🙏😔
Great video Kevin. when people say " I know how to ride, I don't need a class" That doesn't automatically mean a person has skill. 1. Firm progressive squeeze - if you don't know what that means please take a class. 2. LP1, LP2, LP3 - if you don't know what that means please take a class. 3. Space cushion - if you don't know what that means please take a class.
Frankly, I never got the whole "'lay 'er down" thing…and I think the crash I had last week confirms this: I had just finished filling up at the Costco gas station in a local mall, and pulled onto the ring road from the station exit. As I approached an intersection some 150 feet away, I noticed a rather tired-long Dodge Intrepid approaching a stop sign to my left. I had right-of-way, but as always, I shot the driver a quick look as I approached, noted they appeared to be slowing down, then accelerated through the intersection…which I've done countless times, with many other drivers around who did the right thing, but *this* driver chose to accelerate into the intersection the same time I did. We were going just fast enough for me to realize the only thing I could do was slam on he brakes and prepare for impact. I hit the car hard enough to get knocked off the bike, but slow enough to let myself do the rag-doll thing and and just drop for the sake of minimizing injury. (Note: other than regular jeans, I had All The Gear on: helmet, gloves armored mesh jacket, riding-specific high-tops.) Driver was cool: got out to check if I was okay, admitted fault, suggested heading into the parking lot to get insurance business settled. I escaped totally without injury; my Vespa GTS 300, not so much - only a mall scratch on the body/frame (it's a monocoque design, so messing that up would've been a problem), but the front end got tweaked enough for me to bring to the dealer for a proper once-over. The upshot here for me is that there are times when trying to *avoid* crashing could leave you in worse shape than just taking the hit and rolling with it the best you can. And, make certain you're *properly* insured: if you shelled out for a cool ride but balk about paying for anything above minimum coverage, you might want to reexamine your priorities. Excellent piece again, Kevin, and my condolences to officer Belcastro's family.
I had a very similar scenario happen to me. I had a curb on one side and a truck changing lanes towards me in the other. I had no where to go. I applied maximum braking and stayed with the bike until the impact. While the bike was totaled, and I was thrown off with a long slide, the combination of protective gear and slowing the bike down prevented me from having anything beyond a sore wrist. Tires brake much better than metal. One of the best techniques you can practice is front brake control, especially if you have a bike without ABS.
I believe everything you said is true. And you got almost everything right. I wasn't watching your video from my couch actually I'm sitting on my bed other than that spot on and a great tribute video. It was a reminder for me after not riding much at all during covid-19 it's like I'm starting all over at least I'm going to take it that way. Time to go back to the parking lot and practice. 🙁
Kevin, thank you for the video. This is an important one, and you did it respectfully, tactfully, and without condescension. It is this attitude that, in addition to the fantastic content, keeps me coming back to your channel. Thanks again for your life-saving advice.
I am 62, disabled vet. Got a bike last year after 30+ year lay off. Finally have it at shop and finished to riding condition. Was there settling bill things and was told i could test ride it. Got new tires without a mile on them, and it was raining. I passed on my first ride of bike. Bike is at a shop 40 plus miles away, in a town i dont know very well. Am fully ready to put my gear on and head for home with someone along in case. But not on new tires in rain on a 800 pound bike. If new riders use the precious cargo the helmet protects, they might understand there are stupid ways to enjoy this sport. In this case im like you and wasnt there. So cannot give full ways to avoid, i think i would of made sure i saw that lane and that lane saw me before this could happen. Just be smart and safe on your two wheeled journeys. I promise i will be in the wind soon. Lol
im a new rider and this stuff really scares me. im doing a tonne of hazard perception training and going over and over different techniques but still. youve got to wonder if someday youll be faced with a situation that you dont have time to react in.
I just took the advanced riders course last Sunday. I have been riding for around 46 years. But I still take training classes. I'm a founder for a FB group of lady riders called The Litas. We make sure the gals wear gear and continually work on their riding skills. I recommend your channel all the time. Thanks 😊.
I pretty much assume when I'm riding that I'm invisible so I never assume Anything...I always try to look motorists in the eye when possable and hope I "register" in in the other drivers mind.. maintaing good lane position and always looking for an escape route these are good defensive riding technics but.. practicing emergency braking is in my humble opinion the most important thing any rider can do to save your own life .
Practice blip downshifting, and braking at the same time. With the engine breaking, I can slow down extremely fast. But also be careful doing that as well.
looking at the other motorists you are setting yourself up because you are assuming they are coherent or that there is someone even IN the vehicle if a parked car rolls out into the street, blowing your horn or revving your loud pipes wont stop it... Look at every vehicle as a moving object, or stationary object... If one starts rolling out across your path, dont assume anything, brake or swerve to avoid it. BTW the first human has already been hit by a self driving car and killed, 2 years ago in Arizona its only going to get worse.
I 100% agree, do NOT intentionally lay a bike down. My 1st mtc crash was in 1993 - im on a str8 line, old woman sitting at a stop sign waits until im almost at the intersection, pulls out placing the driver's side directly in my path. No time to swerve, no good escape line, dug into both brakes, reduced imapact speed (in the split second i had). NOW, with that said - if you are going into a turn too hot, you're drifting offline and going to cross into oncoming traffic (or leave the roadway, if it is a left sweeper), keep Fn LEANING further. Most bikes can lean farther than you think (ive scraped a peg on my Dyna) and laying it down is MUCH better than a head on or driving into the trees (but let the BIKE decide when to "lay down"). Thank you, good video 👍 Qr need to squash some dangerous misconceptions. Stay safe!
Laying a bike down might have made some sense back in the days of drum brakes. It may have been that you could slow down quicker from the drag of the bike sliding than you could with the brakes. But now with dual discs on the front and often ABS, you are much better off braking until the end. Other than that "laying it down" makes no sense.
What if the situation is your fault and the difference between crashing and hitting another vehicle is points on your record and more expensive insurance .
Unfortunately so many of us old guys started riding long before TH-cam videos, current high level training courses, and high level riding instructors. All we had to go by was what older, more experienced riders said most of which was at best simply wrong. Counter steering, trail braking, slow speed training, track tracking were simply unheard of. To be frank, it is amazing how much we didn’t know. “I had to lay her down” is one of those sayings that falls into that simply wrong category. Thanks Kevin for addressing this misnomer. Hopefully, this discussion will save lives.
Very glad for the professional trainers frequently repeating the mantra of practice, practice, practice….AND train, train, train. Emergency responders train and practice all the time, allowing each to enhance the other. As you point out, during emergency response, we depend on our practiced training to save ourselves as well as others. Thanks for the reminders!
Thank you! I've been saying this for 40 years and my mates have been telling me I'm nuts. I've never laid a bike down. I've always figured that if you've time to lay it down, you've time to do something better.
No.1 Rule I was taught - Never assume your right of way. No.2 Rule If you ride a motorcycle and you are involved in a collision you have done something wrong regardless of who is technically at fault.
Thanks for that, very well put. In 50 years of riding, I have had 9 accidents. 5 ice/diesel/oil is one of those things, but 4 impacts with cars pulling in front of me. I was told very young, don't swerve or you will create the opportunity for a hit and run. My 4 impacts, braked the best I could, hit them just in front of the wind shield and took the flight. Cuts and bruises but limped away. None of the cars I hit were drivable after. My Gold Wing bent an Opel Manta's chassis. (Germany). I am not recommending this to anyone, but in these 4 cases it gave me the best outcome. Keeps up the good work and be careful in this world full of selfish lunatics.
How about a video on riding with a passenger, I don’t know if you have one out but I’ve been watching you for a lot of years and you made me a better rider, and thank you so much Kevin I have practiced all the maneuvers and everything in your videos much appreciated man and God bless
My main crash avoidance strategy is to try to swerve into a vector that takes me out of danger, or at least minimizes the collision as much as possible. I also get on the brakes as hard as I can (I have ABS on my Yamaha FJR 1300). If I definitely can't avoid a crash, I will stay on the brakes right up to the point of collision to scrub off as much speed as possible. When I started riding about 20 years ago, I took the Motorcycle Safety Foundation Basic Rider Course. I remember my instructor telling me to never lay down the bike because once you do - you have no steering or braking at all. If you can't avoid a crash - don't give up. Keep riding your bike and doing everything you can to lessen the impact. That being said, I was involved in a crash a few years ago when a car turned left in front of me. I followed my strategy and braked while trying to steer out of danger, but the brakes locked up (I was on an old non-ABS Harley) and the bike went into a slide. I avoided the car, but I ended up with a broken collarbone and heavily damaged motorcycle. I was glad I was wearing a helmet, boots, jacket, and gloves - otherwise my injuries would have been a lot worse. Last year a buddy of mine crashed his Harley in a high-side slide and went under a truck. He ended up with a broken femur and was laid up for two months. Stay safe!
Well said Sir! I can remember a former instructor making the point that you're more likely to stop or avoid an accident with rubber on the road than you are with metal.
My friend and I signed up for BRC 2 scheduled to take place tomorrow, Sunday, May 30. I even bought a trailer to transport our bikes & spent over $2k to get my truck roadworthy for the trip, only to have the class canceled due to lack of signups. Minimum number is 5; there were only 3 - my friend, me, and another person through the school. We are in the Asheville/western North Carolina area. This is so frustrating. We want to take classes but there’s not enough interest or felt need. Somehow awareness of need for training must be addressed.
Thank you for posting these videos. In the past, i felt like i was an experienced rider but I've learned that some of my technique needs to be corrected to become a better and safer rider. Now i need to go out next Saturday and practice for a couple hundred miles.
When I go out for a ride on my way home there’s a large parking lot a block from my house and is empty on weekends, which is when I usually go riding. After every ride I go into the lot, relaxed settled in the bike and I spend just 10 minutes or so practicing panic stops from different speeds, swerving at different speeds, u turns from lock to lock and see how tight I can make them, and if I feel like it weaves using the parking spaces as cones. This has been extremely helpful to me in the real world of riding. I am Developing muscle memory and it’s simple. When the time comes you’ll surprise yourself how well it works. Try it.
Cars and trucks, don’t see motorcycles no matter what. In a perfect world, Red Green Yellow, means Stop, Go, Caution, prepare to stop. This isn’t a perfect world…watch it!
Thank you Kevin, for saying the comment may be "speculation". I doubt any highly trained motorcycle officer would choose to "lay it down", but only the deceased officer and God knows. Bless his heart and may he rest in peace, and prayers for comfort for his loved ones left behind.
The best advice I was ever given about riding was when I first started riding in the mid 70’s. It has saved me many times and can’t be over- emphasized. ALWAYS leave yourself a way out. Especially at intersections. Before you enter the intersection, scan all around and try to plan a bad scenario just in case it does happen. Plan a way out of it as you approach. It works, especially if you practice thinking things through. Good video, sir- again!!!👍🇺🇸🏍❤️
I see so many riders roll right up behind vehicles with nowhere to go but into the trunk/rear bumper. AND, they put their bike in neutral, both feet on ground, with arms crossed in front of their chest and never look at rearview mirrors. Unbelievable they got their M Endorsement.
I'm no rider yet but this makes me wonder. If you always have to prep for worst-case scenario's then how much can you actually enjoy the ride?
@@Elvendertig1130 Well, motorcycles have no frame or sheet metal around them. So it’s a good idea to be extra aware and on your game when you ride. Accidents are not an option. But as in anything else we enjoy doing, you take the risk to enjoy the experience. It’s not a paranoia, it’s a preparedness. If you do start to ride, you’ll understand what I’m saying. Ride on!👍🇺🇸❤️
@@davemoyer505 Makes perfect sense, thanks for the encouragement! Have a good one!
@@Elvendertig1130 Enjoy, my friend.👍🇺🇸❤️
I always assume every car is out to kill me .
Leaving yourself options by lane positioning or slowing down to maximize the reaction time I have ..
absolutely has served me well in my nearly 50 years of riding the streets .
I'm so sorry to hear of the loss of the officer .
Be safe out there
I try to think that every car is trying to get somewhere and may not be concentrating on the road. OK, assume they're trying to kill you might keep you safe but I find this makes me feel the victim when I'd rather feel like a boss for seeing all these things coming and reacting.
@@jamesrindley6215 however you wish to think about as long as you are expecting the unexpected and planning what you would do if and when someone does not see you is a good policy that will keep you safe .
I don't want to come off sounding too paranoid lol
But after riding 37 different bike's and thousand's of miles under my belt a bit of paranoia is a healthy thing IMHO
@@turbomustang84 I remember how overwhelming it was to try and see everything and to know everything that was going on around me. Intuition has served me well ,but there are unavoidable situations, but then again,,,,, that's true of cars too
@@turbomustang84 profesional drivers think exactly like that. I have been riding and driving that way my entire life. You are not really paranoid untill you quit riding. I just assume everyone is an idiot a drive accordingly.
I say this to everyone I teach/coach. assume everyone on the road is a half-asleep moron. every parked car will open the doors on you. every parked bus is gonna have someone walk out from in front of it. every car in front of you is about to slam on the brakes.
I ride with the mindset that I am invisible to everybody else.
Same same. I trust no vehicle, wear hiviz always, bright helmet, have headlight on always, lane position for best vision and always think where is the danger
But they’re still out to get me.
And like they are actively trying to kill us.
That’s been my position for 50 years. With the addition of, those can see me are intent upon killing me!
Exactly
I'm finding the better my low speed skills become, the better my overall street riding becomes. Anyone else feeling that?
Yes, slow speed skills force you to practice techniques that translate to road speed skills. Good to you for working on your skills!!!
Yes but I have a long way to go with those skills. Harleys and other heavy cruisers take a lot of practice to handle slow speeds with confidence.
If you can handle the slow speeds proficiently you are less likely to ride too fast for the situation. Also as your skills get better and more automatic you can concentrate more on potential road hazards.
Just got back from riding to Sequoia National Park. I took everything that MC has said and it helped me to control my ride. No matter if the vehicles were behind me, I just rode my ride
They will the more you practice, and every ride is practice. I've been riding for almost 30 yrs, now teaching my son. Don't make the mistake of thinking if you're going slow there's no danger. There's always existential threats, cars, animals, bad road conditions, pedestrians. The more you're slow speed skills improve, the more it becomes muscle memory and you can focus on the threats around you. Be safe and keep your head on a swivel.
YESSS that precision skills practice!!
I have been riding 40 years and don't know how to lay a bike down.
I think you just jump off? Purposely jackknifing it and sliding would be some movie stuff. I'm sure there's a situation here and there, where it could be a good idea, but I think at slower speeds, and maybe heading towards a cliff or something.
yes you do
1. Lock up the front brake or both brakes and the bike will slide out from under you or throw you over the handle bars
2. Panic and push the grip on one side so hard the bike turns and leans over past the peg scrape into a frame scrape, and the bike will slide on the frame out from under you - but at least you dont go over the handlebars
Laying a bike down is what you have been avoiding for the last 40 years - you know what NOT to do - dont intentionally crash your bike.
I guess you would lock up the rear wheel, or maybe the front, or maybe both. I can't because my BMW R1200GS has anti-lock brakes. Of course I don't want to lay 'er down - better friction with tires than the side of my bike, and I prefer not to trash my bike or slide across the pavement on my butt.
Just lock up the brakes, the bike will do the rest
wait.... got it!
Put the kick stand down
and turn left!
I had to lay her down! Biggest lie in motorcycling! That's a crash.
usually means rider locked up the brakes and tried to swerve at the same time.
@@kenwittlief255 exactly 💯 +
Also when people say they crashed because of gravel, I bet in many cases they actually ran wide in a corner and hit the gravel off the edge of the road.
You sure are an "expert". Go get back on your Vespa.
@@REL602 Once when a van pulled out in front of me, my rear tire ended up just under her rocker panel. Once, I came over a hill real fast and suddenly there was a a stop light and a flatbed and no where to go, I put it down just under the flatbed. You just instinctively react, no practice, no training. I couldn't consciously duplicate my lay downs no matter how hard I might try.
I always thought "I had to lay her down" was just a euphemism/excuse for "I nearly shat my pants when that car pulled out and I grabbed a fist full of brake and lost traction"
Unfortunately, there’s a segment of North American riding culture that created and perpetuates the myth of “layin’ her down” as an accident avoidance maneuver; the same segment that rides to the bar, drinks way too much, then gets back on the road.
@timberwolfdtproductions3890
Along with loud pipes save lives and front brakes are dangerous.
I find it useful, sorts out who can be taken seriously in a heartbeat.
You are exactly right.
It is.
Ironically, grabbing a "fist full" i.e. front brake, would probably actually have worked, because of weight transfer, and dual discs up front, 80/20 braking, etc. but there is an entire generation ("ok boomers") who have never learned anything but the foot (i.e. rear, diminishing traction) braking. Look at the incredible size of the typical Harley rear brake foot pedal (on the right side). I've driven *cars* with smaller brake pedals.
I always say to myself when im riding. If I can’t see them they sure as hell don’t see me!! Great video Kevin. Thank You
Always slow down in areas where a potential path of travel violation may exist.
Even if you can see them, don't assume they can still see you. Inattentive blindness exists. If you're wearing all black, its a recipe for disaster, especially when combined with poor road strategy.
Amen!
When you're riding just assume you are invisible and nobody sees you because that's the way it is
@@patrickdecambra2219 While true (Or as I've told the people I've taught to drive and ride: "Just assume everyone's an a_____e out to kill you." you have to be an active invisible driver.
As far as I'm concerned, nobody sees you, even other motorcyclists, at times.
Whenever someone says "I had to lay her down" all I hear is "I ran out of skill" I really think riders should stop thinking of themselves as inexperienced and experienced. The thought that you're an inexperienced rider can lead to panic and when you panic bad things happen. Thinking that you're and experienced rider can lead to ego problems and when your inflated ego is in the drivers seat bad things can happen. Cliché I know but there is always more to learn about riding, new theories, new techniques, new tech, and what not. While not all of it may make sense to you or be for your style of riding take from it that which does and incorporate it into your skill set. Keep building and practicing those old skills and keep adding new ones. Hopefully, when an emergency situation happens your skills will save you and you won't have to tell anyone how you had to "lay her down". Ride safely my friends.
Spot on, they panic & their mind freezes, so they choose to lowside the bike
You nailed it. I had a friend of mine who was new to riding asked me how I rated my skills as a rider.
I said average maybe a bit above. He looked kinda shocked and asked how that’s possible since I’ve been on bikes for nearly 30 years and teach new riders. I told him it’s because I still have a lot to learn and the moment I think I know it all I will have become a danger to myself. Staying humble with something as dangerous as riding in my opinion is critical to staying safe.
And the reason they ran out of skill is because they don't practice those skills.
...when you lose control, the outcome is no longer yours to decide. You will do what the vehicle involved tells you to do. Regardless of how much skill you think that you have.
You didn't have the good judgement to use enough of it soon enough.
And now all of your skill has fled the scene of the impeding accident.
Thank you! I have waited literally 50 years to hear some one agree with me: laying down the motorcycle is giving up and guarantees you will crash.
No. When you have "laid it down" you have ALREADY crashed. Just a matter of if you happen to hit anything else afterwards.
But you've still crashed it.
Hope the gremlin bell helped!
So sad when a fellow rider dies on a bike. This is peak riding season and there are a lot of us just getting warmed up to riding again. Please stay alert and practice as much as possible. Praying you all stay safe and aware this riding season.
That's why you ride through winter too. Not bad with the right gear, and I'm in st louis
Amen!
And set a good example by making yourself more visible with a white helmet or Hi-Viz vest or jacket, riding sober, getting training especially in counter-steering and proper braking, and choose a bike with ABS.
@@ThatMagaLife hahahaha! I wish! We’re below zero too often and get too much snow for winter riding.
Kevin, I think you handled the subject very sensitively, with great respect for the fallen rider. This is a subject that I continually harp on, particularly riders of cruisers. One problem is the prevalence of this type of crash on TV, I think because it’s easy for a stunt rider to do. So then people think that in an actual unplanned accident, this is a useful technique.
Good advice as always. None of my three bikes have ABS... but I have made a thirty six year policy of doing a training course about every four to five years to great effect. Last September I put myself in a dangerous position (too fast for conditions) with the predictable consequence and a car nearly squeezed me out of my lane. This particular bike (cafe racer) has a professionally upgraded front brake which is much more powerful but concomitantly less forgiving than the original unit and I managed to 'lock her up'... I was mid crash going down to the right and everything went into very slow motion, I even had time to think 'oh no, not the Triumph' before the training kicked in and I released the front brake with instant return of traction and the bike was able to right itself allowing me to ride out of trouble. Big lesson learnt. The dramatic scuff marks around the right side periphery of the front tyre make ample testimony to how close I came to binning it! I have since made time to practise some hard braking technique on quiet back roads.
Your content is pure life saving gold. I've been riding since 2013 and it's easy to get comfortable and cocky after a while. Your advice keeps me humbled and motivated to stay safe.
I am always looking in both mirrors as I am riding and I say out loud instructions to myself like slow down, don’t change lanes now, people don’t see you, don’t follow too closely, honk the horn. I never get cocky when I am driving.
Agreed - keep your eyes moving so you know what is going on all around you, 360 degrees, no surprises.
I've never understood the "I had to lay the bike down" thing and don't see it as a strategy that should ever even come up. Why would you not keep it up on two wheels and take advantage of the massive braking potential that motorcycles have, and maintain control to the last possible instant? Also, the way I see it, motorcycles inherently want to stay upright and go straight. So the only way to lay one down on purpose is to purposely throw it into an out of control skid to force it down (which makes me wonder how many of these "I had to lay the bike down" incidents were really intentional, and how many of them are just the rider panicking, which could happen to anyone). Why not put those precious split seconds to better and more efficient use?
I think the 'I had to lay it down" is just a way of sugar coating that they crashed. It's downplaying the situation, and in most cases the rider didn't handle the situation well, so they "Had to"
I agree - motorcycles are self balancing, you cannot force it to fall over
unless you lock up both brakes and stop the wheels from spinning, at which point the bike will fall over as if it was standing still
I had to lay it down! Translation: I did not know how to stop fast or swerve and gravity took over...
@@kenwittlief255 I couldn't agree more. What does "laying the bike down" even mean? How is this done? Can one practice the skill of "laying the bike down"? I've never believed it. They grabbed too much front brake, and crashed. Simple as that.
It makes no sense, so long as we're still on the bike there's still a chance to avoid the crash. Even if you end up hitting something, it'll be made less severe by losing as much speed as possible using the brakes and tyres. Crashes are often dynamic with the other vehicle also moving which means there might be a chance of an escape path opening up. Tyres are designed to grip tarmac as well as possible, which is not true of riding gear, skin, and other parts of the motorcycle.
@@jamesrindley6215 Not to mention if you stay on the bike when you hit the car you've got a chance of not being under the car where the wheels are.
I’ve been riding on and off fo 40 years. Most motorcyclists I see on the road don’t ride with fear they will die, so they ride nonchalantly.
If you ride with a little fear, maybe they will distance themselves from other vehicles and provide enough time to avoid the possibility’s.
I’m not saying don’t enjoy the ride. I’m saying live in reality, if you can distance yourself, great. If not you step up the fear level and be more cautious.
Works for me
If you don't have some fear while riding, you won't manage the risks properly.
Situational awareness, lane position and moving farthest from danger are smart not fearful. Anticipate the worst and it most likely won't happen.
@@deb-kenjohnson9497 ...agree...it is all about 'situational awareness' and this will always help you to be half a second ahead of the rest and possibly more able to implement defensive strategy if/when needed. What I have learnt from going through my learner's process here in Australia last year and now with my full license, I have found I have changed my approach to driving (43 years) to become more aware and often thinking like I am riding while behind the wheel! I see so much more of what others are doing as a result!
Sure, top level climbers say fear is a good thing. It needs to be fear channelled into concentration and focus, not fear that makes you paranoid and likely to freeze up.
yep a lot of people ride with the attitude that people will watch-out for them and give them extra space because they are riding a bike :)
some people will actually do that, and some other people will run them right off the road
Glad for this real-world analysis. In 2013, I totaled a Triumph Sprint after low siding it when a car pulled out in front of us at distance too short to maneuver. No ABS so I lost the front and low-sided it. Dumb luck proved it was the right thing to do. Neither of us were hurt. There's no way on God's green earth I had the presence of mind to "lay her down." I think people who say this are delusional.
Exactly my point. So glad to read your description of the events. Lesser-trained and less intelligent riders would describe that as you “laid the bike down” as if that were a real choice.
First of all, I am not a believer in ABS. I believe riders should learn how to brake properly. It sounds like you accidentally low sided while trying to brake. Better braking skills may or may not have prevented the low side. As far as having "the presence of mind to "lay her down", I am also a dirt rider, and started riding off road at age 8. I rode dirt bikes for 8 years before getting my license at age 16, and getting a street bike. I'm too old now to do some of the things I used to do on dirt bikes, including jumps and slides. I used to lean the bike way over to the left in a sharp left turn, attempting to slide around the turn. That didn't always work, and I sometimes wound up laying on the ground with the bike on top of me. Things work very differently on dirt than they do on pavement, where you have way more traction. But having done it on dirt so many times, if I found myself in one of those one in a million situations (like heading straight for a semi trailer, no room to get around it, and realizing my brakes were not going to stop me in time) I believe I would be able to intentionally lay the bike down, hoping to slide under the trailer rather than having my head taken off by it. It might or might not work. But I seriously doubt I will ever find myself in such a situation to begin with. How could anyone miss a semi pulling in front of them?
Just watch some videos of crotch rocket riders (who really have no business being on public roads) going way too fast and leaning over way too far in corners, trying to get their knee and elbow on the asphalt. Many of them wind up low siding, and some of the unluckier ones wind up regaining traction somehow and high siding.
@@geraldscott4302
Nonsense. ABS is way better. Grab all the brake you can and lower the velocity as much as possible and hope for the best. Period.
If you fishtail without ABS, you have to release brakes and re-grab them to get back on track, losing ground right toward the target at higher speed than if you grabbed all the ABS that you can.
@@geraldscott4302 A rider's bike can both have ABS and the rider also know how to brake properly. One of my motorcycles (a older dual sport) does not have ABS, and I have practiced minimum distance stops with deliberation on both dirt and hard paved surfaces. Many riders have older bikes without ABS along with modern bikes with it, and it should go without saying that knowing one's equipment is always prudent.
That said, modern ABS is, as is said in the video, a life saver. The notion that even a very well practiced human can surpass the efficacy of ABS in a minimum distance stop emergency braking and maneuver is false, and becomes downright dangerous when it generates criticism against it.
Given how long statistical evidence of the additional safety provided by ABS has been around, there should be nothing controversial about it.
@@geraldscott4302 I used to thing that way, plus ABS adds significant weight to a bike, so track rider me disapproved. Plus, a good rider can outbrake ABS.
Thing is, on the track, you are focused. Nearly everything that happens on track is predictable, and your concentration is absolute. Hell, that is why we are there, isn't it?
On the street, everyone loses focus from time to time. On the commute to or from work, running errands, maybe thinking about tonight's date. ABS doesn't lose focus and not notice the oil patch while panic braking.
So yeah, I am partially with you. ABS ain't perfect, but it can help in those times that perfect focus is lost. In fact, an ABS moment on the VFR I once owned sold me on it. I still don't want it on my track bikes, though.
Thanks!
I recently had a similar encounter. My daughter and I was riding when an elderly man pulled directly in front of us from a secondary road. We was in a right turn going through an underpass/tunnel. I was in lane position 1. The posted speed for that turn was 30mph, I believe I was running 35. I’m one who watches your videos frequently and I’ve been riding for around 10 years now. Your videos always help me remember what I was taught many years ago and with that saved us from hitting that car. I applied emergency braking just hard enough to keep the wheels from locking and kept my eyes on the driver. Right at the time I was just going to set the bike up straight the driver seen me and gassed on it. Just narrowly missing him. Also, in this, my daughter who’s 24, never moved an inch! Which I praised her afterwards. It’s very crucial that not only the rider gets trained, but the passenger as well. I’ve done my best to teach my wife and daughter on proper techniques as a passenger. Had she not been trained as well and made the wrong move, it surely would’ve ended badly. Thanks for all you do Kevin! You my friend do make a difference in people’s road skills and strategies. 😎
So conscientious, so thoughtful, so important,
thanks Kevin.
S
I literally went out this morning for Starbucks and on my way home I stopped in an empty lot and practiced my emergency braking.
Hope you didn't spill your drink 😄☕
@@jodybogdanovich4333 lol I could lie and say i was that good, but truth is i finished my coffee chillin on the patio at starbucks. the weather was too nice to not be out enjoying it.
@@FlySwann I love my cup holder and a long straw. Can sip while riding if need be. I was picturing that scenario with your emergency braking. I once hit a rough patch of road and my tank and I wore my latte that day. 🤦♀️
@@gohjohan empty parking lots are awesome for practicing a lot of maneuvers. 👍
Must ride a BMW Adventure GS. I heard it's contractually obligated to linger at St☆rbucks.
Kevin we appreciate your wisdom and training. So sorry for the family of the fallen officer. Great advice continue to practice what you learn to be prepared. God bless you
I just made this mistake yesterday in Muskegon MI, I was traveling behind one of those MI dump trucks could not see over it. We were at a light and I was trailing it too close. They ran a red light and I had use emergency braking and stopped about 1/3 way into intersection.
No harm but drove lane position home to me, thx McRider
Make sure you can always see past the person in front of you. Use lane positioning. This way, if they have to emergency brake, you will see it coming.
😳 so glad they didn't get you!
if you cant see past the truck or bus in front of you, then you need to be 5 seconds behind it
In my city they have programmed the lights so that when one turns red there is approximately a one second hold before the next in line turns green. Just for those well I'll hold my tongue on that but people that like to time lights and once it's turns green they can go through at full speed. So with a pause with all red lights they have to put on their brakes or at least look because all lights are red good engineering by our city I'm sure lies have been saved by this.
My mechanic gave me this advice he said every intersection and every time he sees a car turning onto his road he hits his rights flasher on his Harley cluster. I have one also and just starting to use it.
Car drivers definitely do see it especially at night because a single headlight 30 to 40 yards away can appear to the driver like it's another street light but when that light flashes they don't pull out in front of you. I also have a strobe brake light too many people getting too close to the rear my bike.
@@davolbc what?!
when you flash your headlights at a turning car in an intersection you are telling them to turn across your path and you will wait
its called blinking them thru
you are going to get yourself killed
@MCrider - Motorcycle Training MSF Obstacle Avoidance Maneuver saved my life the other day. Car turning left, stopped on busy highway with turn signal on but car behind me never slowed down on 55 mph highway AT ALL. The thought of becoming a Car Sandwich made me use said MSF Maneuver to get out of the way, pulling right - braking in the grass (ditch) with no ABS but was able to down shift and brake in concert to stop w/o dropping bike. Got out of the way as car behind me hit the car in front of me dead on. So glad I didn't lay my bike down on the road that day which was certainly a possibility. Had mere seconds to react but very grateful to have learned in MSF class to have a path out and away from potential trouble. Thank you so much for your spot on videos. Always learning....
I am never going to put the motorcycle down to avoid an accident. Brake, swerve anything but laying it down. Situational awareness is your best defense against a motorcycle crash. Lane position it key to avoiding accidents if you can't see them they can't see you........................ You'll never convince me that Hi-Visibility gear is not the way to go. You have to be seen to avoid being pulled in front of. Ride safe and be seen. I have a bright yellow bike and Hi-Vis gear.
Not a bad plan, just don't assume because you have H-Vis gear everyone automatically can see you. It just helps some.
@@wormfood83 yup. Dayglow suit and yellow helmet (never mind the headlight) didn’t stop the lady from pulling broadside in front of me. The responding cop couldn’t believe it either. That said, I still wear the suit and have an even more obnoxious helmet now. BTW, I got it down to about 5 mph (from about 35) before impact and got lucky that I hit right between tire and fender, so more energy bled off. Not only did I not “lay ‘er down,” but the bike stayed upright once I got off it - no sidestand required! Maybe I should have considered jumping off at the last second and spider-man-landing on her hood. :D
The interesting thing I've noticed as I have acquired and driven a whole range of vehicles over 45 years, is that while the "I didn't see him" has become the normal excuse for causing a motorcycle accident, I have just as many incidents of people not seeing me, when I'm driving a car, my full size pickup, or even my large 2 ton truck. The thing is if people aren't looking and/or concentrating, they are not going to see you regardless of what you drive, a review of semi truck dash cam video of accidents will show how many cannot even see them coming. The "I didn't see him" becomes more prolific with motorcycles because what would be some bent metal work in a pickup ends up in death, or serious injury with a motorcycle and therefore gets more publicity. I certainly agree with making attempts to be visible on a motorcycle, but either way I've found I have to adopt all the same defensive riding/driving skills what ever I'm driving to avoid accidents that would occur with frightening regularity as cases of distracted and inept driving seem to increase exponentially on our roads.
You are a fool
Thx for all ur help in making me more confident and becoming a better rider and also enjoying riding more in the process!
Thank You for the great reminder of practicing good technique. A motorcycle will always stop faster and maneuver better on its wheels, rather than sliding on its side. I would be honored to participate in any event to memorialize this man. He did the best he could in the time he had. We can’t fault him for that, but we can honor his life by respectfully telling his story.
Thanks Kevin for all the hard work you do to help us to stay safe on the road and to practice all the exercises you give us 👍🏼
Watching these videos helps to raise my level of awareness on the road and I thank you for your efforts, sir!
I agree on your assessment of ABS. My VFR800 has it, and while it doesn't replace good technique it is absolutely critical in improving your odds of not "laying her down" in a panic brake situation.
My VFR800 is an early 03 model, on ABS, it was optional. I'm a newish rider(2 years/12,000m) in the UK, not needed ABS yet.
The good thing is “I had to lay ‘er down” is now a meme among younger motorcycle riders and a view we make fun of.
I've been riding for 49 years and appreciate your help/advise very much! Your tips on stopping a heavy bike were especially helpful.. Keep up the great work!! You're awesome!!!
This is your most important video to date, hands down. Well done, sir.
A sad loss for the family and friends off the rider in question. On behalf of myself and many others who will benefit from watching this video, thank you for posting.
Right on Kevin. This is a wonderful video reinforcing what we all should be thinking about.
Thank you for sharing. I am a new rider and after 6 weeks and 2000 miles on my bike, I have been practicing my breaking and evasive maneuvers because of watching your videos.
Thanks Kevin. Yeah, a common practice but a wrong practice.
I always though that laying the bike down was a bad idea. Metal/plastic on asphalt can't possibly stop faster than rubber. If it did, we would all be riding with metal wheels
@@joemann7971 "I had to lay her down", normally the last resort of the untrained.
Saying "I had to lay the bike down" is like a car driver with an oncoming accident saying "I just took my hands off the wheel and hoped for the best"
I still wonder whether people actually put the bike down or just crash inadvertendly and try to explain it away.
"Jesus take the wheel." I always thought that song was stupid.
"I had to lay 'er down" is just another way of saying "I panicked and crashed."
@@rob2650 yep, they grabbed the front brake too hard and washed out the front tire.
Thing is tires are made of this sticky rubbery stuff where as the pegs and bars and fairing on the side of a motorcycle are made of hard stuff like plastics and metal, guess which grips best and slows you best in a straight line obstacle avoidance scenario :/
I'm sorry to hear about that accident, but after watching your video, I'm definitely going to take a class and practice improving my skills.
@@250txc there may be times when laying the bike down is the only option but I can’t think of many.
Sure if someone runs wide of a curve goes off the road towards a branch at chest height with boulders on each side preventing a turn then MAYBE laying it down in a low speed slide MIGHT work.
If I laid the bike down everytime I’ve needed to use max braking I would have slide into the car/person each of those times.
One of your finest videos yet. In twenty-five seconds, specifically from 2:40 to 3:05, you summarized perfectly the situation a motorcyclist faces every time they ride, and how best to deal with it. Thank you for saying it so well.
Kevin, I always get something I can use from watching the videos. You are so right on improvements in all aspects of motorcycle riding. The brakes, lights, tires, helmets and protective gear are light years ahead of what I had when I started riding in 1965. Some so -called "hard core or purists" look down on those of us that use "all the gear, all the time". One even told me that if I was that scared, I should quit riding! Been married 48 years, and Wife riding with me for 49 years. Our riding habits and safety gear and bike all convey that we want to live to ride again! Our current ride is a Airbag ABS Gold Wing. And, I just bought her a Helite air vest to add to her gear. Thanks for letting me ramble on!
Kevin, I've only recently viewed a few of your videos. As a 10 year MSF rider coach, long distance rider who can no longer put in the ultra miles, and a person who values good advice, I appreciate your thoughtful information. I appreciate your sincere demeanor and presentation of choices while riding. The riding landscape is ever changing and presents many opportunities for decisions. There is rarely one right choice. Each of us has to select the best choice based on our knowledge, experience, motorcycle, and decision in the moment. Training and experience help us make better decisions in the moment. Thanks for your work. Billy
I've almost been in several accidents and laying the bike down has never once entered my mind.
Recently I had a chance to apply your suggestions. I have ridden for 60 years. Had the closest call last week. Traveling 45mph. I was following a car in a legal distance. Rain dampened road and a car coming towards me in opposite lane. All the sudden a van darted from a street on the left and shot right in front of me to the other side of the street. I didn’t panic and knew I was headed into the side of the van. I applied both brakes till the abs brakes were chattering but I just veered gently left and went right between the van and the car approaching it the opposite direction. Glad I didn’t lay it down. Your videos are part of the reason I can still type this message. Thanks
People in cars don’t see riders.
This thought I’ve imprinted in my mind and I rarely get angry with drivers for ‘my’ sake. No hitting the rev limiter in a poor attempt to discipline drivers. It’s just another distraction.
I think as riders, we need adapt a mature, common sense approach our life depends on it.
Even so, sad events such as this still happen.
"Inattentional blindness" is the condition of not seeing what you don't expect to see. Study after study show this is real and additional studies show that cagers, especially in the early riding season, simply do not expect to see us (and don't). I didn't see the video he mentioned, but I have to assume he discusses placing your bike in a position where it would be seen as if it were the headlight of an oncomming car. In his example it would be lane position #1.
Your final comments about Honoring the Deceased by using this as a Learning opportunity Could Not have Been More Graceful.
You are a Class Act!
Best Wishes from Montana M.H
Motorcycles do not stop very good when sliding on metal and plastic parts. They stop way better when braking on rubber parts! The idea that laying the bike down is a god idea is just pure ignorance!
Thank you McRider! Too many people talk about laying the bike down. UGH!!!! So wrong!!! It's nice to hear other people talking sense. Don't ever give up control of the bike. Don't ever practice laying down the bike. Giving space to make a better decision is a smarter choice. Slow down, Give space, Don't give up control of the bike and intentionally crash. Sometimes it may be avoidable (and sometimes accidents happen). Do what you can and change your habits so you don't end up in this situation.
When I started riding, my uncle told me if you lay the bike down to avoid a crash, you crashed.
This is great commentary and excellent education. The one thing I have always done in over 40 years of riding motorcycles is always assume that nobody sees you....
Great and sombre video, thoughts and prayers with his family.
Totally agree with all you say. As an ex police officer I would much rather use the equipment on the bike that is designed to scrub off speed rather than lay down on my lower friction riding gear, which allows me to travel further down the road to spread the force of impacts. Dynema and leather are certainly slipper than rubber compound. Also, if you hit something whilst on the bike, you have a chance of going over the hood/top of the car and rolling off some of that energy. You drop and slide, you're on an uncontrollable course to a solid bodily impact with something that isn't going to move.
And these days, I don't even entertain a bike unless it has ABS.
Another great video and I recently signed up for one of our rider awareness courses run by the police in the UK. Because even with my history, I must keep my training in good order.
God bless sir!
Dale
"... going over the hood/top of the car and rolling off some of that energy..." Five decades ago I watched a rider do just that. A few weeks later he showed up on crutches to pick up my sworn affidavit of what I had seen. His lawyer was very happy for that affidavit. The rider made the instantaneous correct choice; lowering his CG would not have helped him, and "losing control" would have cost him his case.
I have been riding motorcycles for about 55 years and have never had a collision with a car. I always ride with the mindset that all of these people driving cars are out to kill me. I find the most dangerous situations are at intersections. When I approach one, I am always looking at the cars and the driver and slow up just a bit and have an extended following distance. When I deem the intersection is clear I will ad a little throttle to get out of the intersection quickly. I agree with you Kevin. I have had a couple very close calls, WAY to close for comfort but I did not lay the bike down but took evasive measures to keep from getting hit. Keep up the good instructional videos Kevin! They are great!!
"Laying down" the bike makes no sense to me at all! I always thought that the mission was to do all you can to stay up and if a bike went down, it was a consequence of evasive action that failed. Laying your bike down doesn't evade an accident it commits to it; if you go down, you've crashed!
Been riding 30yrs. Recently went to a BIG bike. Slow speed is alot different on a 600lb. bike compared to 900lb. especially when I weigh 150lbs. Your low speed vids has given me critical information to make me safer and a more confident rider. Thank you Kevin.
I read just yesterday someone boasting about “having to lay it down”. Adding to that, this person had only a helmet and no gear whatsoever. Such a shame, all the road rash could have been avoided by having a different mindset.
People have mocked me for wearing protective gear in the 100+ degree temps we have here, but I tell them it's because of allergies. Allergies?? Yeah, I'm allergic to road rash! 😂
Whether I’m riding my motorcycle, driving my car, walking along the road, or on my bicycle, I have never been disappointed by expecting everyone else on the road to do the unexpected.
I enjoy life and want to do activities (like riding) that increase my enjoyment. I understand there are risks, but, as you say, Kevin, I have control over a lot of those risks through constant situational awareness and skill based riding.
It is sad to hear of stories like this, and you’re correct that we don’t know all the details of this tragic event. They can serve as reminders to take responsibility for ourselves each time we throw a leg over and go for a ride.
Keep up the great work, Kevin!
The greatest safety feature of a motorcycle is the riders Knowledge. The knowledge that the street is not a racetrack or stunt park and even when you are riding sedately the street will sometimes try to kill you Also the knowledge that everyone else on the road is out to kill you (even your friend riding with you) but it is only occasionally that they see you as an actual target for murder
Often they just don't care or think even that far.
I survived my motorcycle crash in 1977 --- helmet on --- yamaha 650 going to work --- 4 lane street w/ side streets. Box van truck in the right lane signals right turn so I go left lane to cruise by --- driver on the side street wanting to turn left never sees me --- I never saw her. She pulls out into my path --- sees me and hits the brakes. My instincts saved me --- go for daylight --- don't let your body hit anything --- I was going 45 mph but swerved enough to hit her car at the trunk instead of the roofline. Would have been cut in half. Spent 6 days in the hospital because my legs were paralyzed from the shock. I still walk and ride. Take care and keep up these great videos.
Extactly! I imediately thought about "road strategy", sight, tires, brakes, developed skills. We have an entire arsenal to keep our selves safe. But sometimes Murphy's Law wins, no matter what. RiP that good man. 🙏😔
Great video Kevin. when people say " I know how to ride, I don't need a class" That doesn't automatically mean a person has skill.
1. Firm progressive squeeze - if you don't know what that means please take a class.
2. LP1, LP2, LP3 - if you don't know what that means please take a class.
3. Space cushion - if you don't know what that means please take a class.
Frankly, I never got the whole "'lay 'er down" thing…and I think the crash I had last week confirms this: I had just finished filling up at the Costco gas station in a local mall, and pulled onto the ring road from the station exit. As I approached an intersection some 150 feet away, I noticed a rather tired-long Dodge Intrepid approaching a stop sign to my left. I had right-of-way, but as always, I shot the driver a quick look as I approached, noted they appeared to be slowing down, then accelerated through the intersection…which I've done countless times, with many other drivers around who did the right thing, but *this* driver chose to accelerate into the intersection the same time I did. We were going just fast enough for me to realize the only thing I could do was slam on he brakes and prepare for impact. I hit the car hard enough to get knocked off the bike, but slow enough to let myself do the rag-doll thing and and just drop for the sake of minimizing injury. (Note: other than regular jeans, I had All The Gear on: helmet, gloves armored mesh jacket, riding-specific high-tops.) Driver was cool: got out to check if I was okay, admitted fault, suggested heading into the parking lot to get insurance business settled. I escaped totally without injury; my Vespa GTS 300, not so much - only a mall scratch on the body/frame (it's a monocoque design, so messing that up would've been a problem), but the front end got tweaked enough for me to bring to the dealer for a proper once-over.
The upshot here for me is that there are times when trying to *avoid* crashing could leave you in worse shape than just taking the hit and rolling with it the best you can. And, make certain you're *properly* insured: if you shelled out for a cool ride but balk about paying for anything above minimum coverage, you might want to reexamine your priorities.
Excellent piece again, Kevin, and my condolences to officer Belcastro's family.
I had a very similar scenario happen to me. I had a curb on one side and a truck changing lanes towards me in the other. I had no where to go. I applied maximum braking and stayed with the bike until the impact. While the bike was totaled, and I was thrown off with a long slide, the combination of protective gear and slowing the bike down prevented me from having anything beyond a sore wrist. Tires brake much better than metal. One of the best techniques you can practice is front brake control, especially if you have a bike without ABS.
I believe everything you said is true. And you got almost everything right. I wasn't watching your video from my couch actually I'm sitting on my bed other than that spot on and a great tribute video. It was a reminder for me after not riding much at all during covid-19 it's like I'm starting all over at least I'm going to take it that way. Time to go back to the parking lot and practice. 🙁
Kevin, thank you for the video. This is an important one, and you did it respectfully, tactfully, and without condescension. It is this attitude that, in addition to the fantastic content, keeps me coming back to your channel. Thanks again for your life-saving advice.
Laying a motorcycle down is giving up so guys never give up .
@D. W. holding on I done it for as long as I could
I am 62, disabled vet. Got a bike last year after 30+ year lay off. Finally have it at shop and finished to riding condition. Was there settling bill things and was told i could test ride it. Got new tires without a mile on them, and it was raining. I passed on my first ride of bike.
Bike is at a shop 40 plus miles away, in a town i dont know very well. Am fully ready to put my gear on and head for home with someone along in case.
But not on new tires in rain on a 800 pound bike.
If new riders use the precious cargo the helmet protects, they might understand there are stupid ways to enjoy this sport.
In this case im like you and wasnt there. So cannot give full ways to avoid, i think i would of made sure i saw that lane and that lane saw me before this could happen.
Just be smart and safe on your two wheeled journeys. I promise i will be in the wind soon. Lol
"I had to lay the bike down" = "I lost control while braking / swerving".....
"What is counter-steering?"
im a new rider and this stuff really scares me. im doing a tonne of hazard perception training and going over and over different techniques but still. youve got to wonder if someday youll be faced with a situation that you dont have time to react in.
Not to be pessimistic (I'm not) ...most will tell you that it's not if but when. You're in control of how much space there is in front of you.
Just got my license… you probably just saved my life… I am going to practice safety maneuvers and stopping… from my heart… thank you…
Congrats on getting your license. Keep practicing and keep learning. Lots of great miles ahead for you.
I just took the advanced riders course last Sunday. I have been riding for around 46 years. But I still take training classes. I'm a founder for a FB group of lady riders called The Litas. We make sure the gals wear gear and continually work on their riding skills. I recommend your channel all the time. Thanks 😊.
Thank you, Kevin. Who knows how many lives you save presenting these videos. XXX
Kevin as always. Your training as a Instructor and fellow rider are right on time.
I pretty much assume when I'm riding that I'm invisible so I never assume Anything...I always try to look motorists in the eye when possable and hope I "register" in in the other drivers mind.. maintaing good lane position and always looking for an escape route these are good defensive riding technics but.. practicing emergency braking is in my humble opinion the most important thing any rider can do to save your own life .
Practice blip downshifting, and braking at the same time. With the engine breaking, I can slow down extremely fast. But also be careful doing that as well.
looking at the other motorists you are setting yourself up
because you are assuming they are coherent
or that there is someone even IN the vehicle
if a parked car rolls out into the street, blowing your horn or revving your loud pipes wont stop it...
Look at every vehicle as a moving object, or stationary object...
If one starts rolling out across your path, dont assume anything, brake or swerve to avoid it.
BTW the first human has already been hit by a self driving car and killed, 2 years ago in Arizona
its only going to get worse.
I 100% agree, do NOT intentionally lay a bike down. My 1st mtc crash was in 1993 - im on a str8 line, old woman sitting at a stop sign waits until im almost at the intersection, pulls out placing the driver's side directly in my path. No time to swerve, no good escape line, dug into both brakes, reduced imapact speed (in the split second i had). NOW, with that said - if you are going into a turn too hot, you're drifting offline and going to cross into oncoming traffic (or leave the roadway, if it is a left sweeper), keep Fn LEANING further. Most bikes can lean farther than you think (ive scraped a peg on my Dyna) and laying it down is MUCH better than a head on or driving into the trees (but let the BIKE decide when to "lay down"). Thank you, good video 👍 Qr need to squash some dangerous misconceptions. Stay safe!
Laying a bike down might have made some sense back in the days of drum brakes. It may have been that you could slow down quicker from the drag of the bike sliding than you could with the brakes. But now with dual discs on the front and often ABS, you are much better off braking until the end. Other than that "laying it down" makes no sense.
especially since modern tires are so wide, and rubber is much better
What if the situation is your fault and the difference between crashing and hitting another vehicle is points on your record and more expensive insurance .
Thank You for posting. Your presentation of the information and advice is greatly appreciated.
Stopping a motorcycle is easier with brakes, tires and gears than paint, chrome and your butt.
Unfortunately so many of us old guys started riding long before TH-cam videos, current high level training courses, and high level riding instructors. All we had to go by was what older, more experienced riders said most of which was at best simply wrong. Counter steering, trail braking, slow speed training, track tracking were simply unheard of. To be frank, it is amazing how much we didn’t know. “I had to lay her down” is one of those sayings that falls into that simply wrong category. Thanks Kevin for addressing this misnomer. Hopefully, this discussion will save lives.
In the old days brakes were bad and tire grip was bad too. A few even removed the front brake from the bike
Rest in peace to the young officer 🙏
Never seen a comment section do comprehensively intelligent and "road wise", it's a joy!
So many sound mindsets. Wish you all all the best!
I love my bike too much to dump it to avoid hitting something. If she is going down we are going together and it definitely wont be on purpose.
Very glad for the professional trainers frequently repeating the mantra of practice, practice, practice….AND train, train, train. Emergency responders train and practice all the time, allowing each to enhance the other. As you point out, during emergency response, we depend on our practiced training to save ourselves as well as others. Thanks for the reminders!
When I started riding I was told NEVER "lay the bike down, never give up" if the rubber is not on the road it's all over.
Great job in how you handled this. I am a cop of 25 years, a police chaplain for 10 years, a rider for 55 years. Great job, great training.
God bless his family and keep them safe!
Thank you! I've been saying this for 40 years and my mates have been telling me I'm nuts. I've never laid a bike down. I've always figured that if you've time to lay it down, you've time to do something better.
No.1 Rule I was taught - Never assume your right of way. No.2 Rule If you ride a motorcycle and you are involved in a collision you have done something wrong regardless of who is technically at fault.
Thanks for that, very well put. In 50 years of riding, I have had 9 accidents. 5 ice/diesel/oil is one of those things, but 4 impacts with cars pulling in front of me. I was told very young, don't swerve or you will create the opportunity for a hit and run. My 4 impacts, braked the best I could, hit them just in front of the wind shield and took the flight. Cuts and bruises but limped away. None of the cars I hit were drivable after. My Gold Wing bent an Opel Manta's chassis. (Germany). I am not recommending this to anyone, but in these 4 cases it gave me the best outcome.
Keeps up the good work and be careful in this world full of selfish lunatics.
Kevin thanks so much for sharing your wisdom and experience.
How about a video on riding with a passenger, I don’t know if you have one out but I’ve been watching you for a lot of years and you made me a better rider, and thank you so much Kevin I have practiced all the maneuvers and everything in your videos much appreciated man and God bless
You never lay down a bike to avoid a crash. Who does that? Unless your brakes fail on the track and you can’t make a turn.
Thanks for reminding us to go back to the practice sessions and refresh our training. I surely needed that reminder and appreciate it. Ride safe.
My main crash avoidance strategy is to try to swerve into a vector that takes me out of danger, or at least minimizes the collision as much as possible. I also get on the brakes as hard as I can (I have ABS on my Yamaha FJR 1300). If I definitely can't avoid a crash, I will stay on the brakes right up to the point of collision to scrub off as much speed as possible.
When I started riding about 20 years ago, I took the Motorcycle Safety Foundation Basic Rider Course. I remember my instructor telling me to never lay down the bike because once you do - you have no steering or braking at all. If you can't avoid a crash - don't give up. Keep riding your bike and doing everything you can to lessen the impact.
That being said, I was involved in a crash a few years ago when a car turned left in front of me. I followed my strategy and braked while trying to steer out of danger, but the brakes locked up (I was on an old non-ABS Harley) and the bike went into a slide. I avoided the car, but I ended up with a broken collarbone and heavily damaged motorcycle. I was glad I was wearing a helmet, boots, jacket, and gloves - otherwise my injuries would have been a lot worse.
Last year a buddy of mine crashed his Harley in a high-side slide and went under a truck. He ended up with a broken femur and was laid up for two months.
Stay safe!
Well said Sir! I can remember a former instructor making the point that you're more likely to stop or avoid an accident with rubber on the road than you are with metal.
My friend and I signed up for BRC 2 scheduled to take place tomorrow, Sunday, May 30. I even bought a trailer to transport our bikes & spent over $2k to get my truck roadworthy for the trip, only to have the class canceled due to lack of signups. Minimum number is 5; there were only 3 - my friend, me, and another person through the school. We are in the Asheville/western North Carolina area. This is so frustrating. We want to take classes but there’s not enough interest or felt need. Somehow awareness of need for training must be addressed.
Thank you for posting these videos. In the past, i felt like i was an experienced rider but I've learned that some of my technique needs to be corrected to become a better and safer rider.
Now i need to go out next Saturday and practice for a couple hundred miles.
When I go out for a ride on my way home there’s a large parking lot a block from my house and is empty on weekends, which is when I usually go riding. After every ride I go into the lot, relaxed settled in the bike and I spend just 10 minutes or so practicing panic stops from different speeds, swerving at different speeds, u turns from lock to lock and see how tight I can make them, and if I feel like it weaves using the parking spaces as cones. This has been extremely helpful to me in the real world of riding. I am Developing muscle memory and it’s simple. When the time comes you’ll surprise yourself how well it works. Try it.
Cars and trucks, don’t see motorcycles no matter what. In a perfect world, Red Green Yellow, means Stop, Go, Caution, prepare to stop. This isn’t a perfect world…watch it!
Thank you Kevin, for saying the comment may be "speculation". I doubt any highly trained motorcycle officer would choose to "lay it down", but only the deceased officer and God knows. Bless his heart and may he rest in peace, and prayers for comfort for his loved ones left behind.