The biggest gameplay changes in Company of Heroes 3
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ค. 2024
- Covering the biggest changes that influence gameplay going from Company of Heroes 2 to Company of Heroes 3.
00:00 Auto Vault
01:03 Squad Spacing and Formations
05:49 Auto Reinforce
06:31 Auto Base Building
07:29 Victory Point Tick Rate
09:02 Snares
10:06 Side Armour
Enjoy the content? Support me on Patreon / tightrope or Donate:
streamlabs.com/tightropexilo
Send your replays for casting to tightropegaming@gmail.com
Top 200 only ($20 Patreon backers are exempt), 3v3 & 4v4 are ok, though 1v1 & 2v2 are preferred
Follow me on twitter @tightropegaming or on twitch / tightropexilo - เกม
auto reinforce is a god tier change
Yeah it is a real game changer
They could easily back-add it to CoH2 if they would want to, but they gotta sell those 60$ copies for a feature
@@glibchubik4090
Relic: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
but but new engine also the game feels like a early pre-alpha
Another god tier change is retreating from inside garrisons, especially useful for MG teams since its reduces the time wasted waiting for them to come out first.
@@glibchubik4090 i mean yeah they could still change a lot about coh2, the engine is solid so they could add a lot of shit, but they finalized the game half a year ago so any changes they make will upset the balancing again
It's incredible that tightrope isn't working for relic. So much effort put into these videos. I mean not just reading patch notes or whatever, actually testing and showing everything, like the squad spacing. I admire his dedication and passion for this series.
Also, side armor is a great addition. Regardless of game balance, it was stupid to have half front and half back.
This is a paid sponsorship, mate.
@@Fedac1 Hah good point but i mean he should be part of the damn company by this point, not just sponsored videos.
The only people paying me to make this video are my Patreon backers.
Really like tightropes quality and class in his casts. I’m OCD so it’s COH3 for me now and I hope TR casts a few of those games now.
@@Fedac1 Even if sponsored, I think the channel is better off partially sponsored, instead of hired to work for them. Objectivity will suffer inevitably because of the content he will be forced to push. I know he has his own morality but its inevitable.
Something I've quite liked is the ability to see the health numbers for squads and vehicles now rather than just relying on a health bar. It doesn't have a massive impact on my actual gameplay but it's neat to be able to compare units without having to look at a stat website.
i enjoyed seeing the stats of what type of units they killed as well, i don't think i saw that in coh3
@@obrobby it shows when you hover over veterancy rank
Great overview there Tightrope. Hadn’t thought about unit formations at all and it’s nice to see the changes there.
You forgot to mention the doctrine overhaul
Now its a mix of CoH 2 and CoH 1, featuring a small skill tree, a VERY good change in my opinion
Love that the same doctrine can be played in different ways now adds a ton of variation
It's significantly better - no doubt.
I'm not a fan of CoH3s doctrines.
Firstly, I don't like the choices in doctrine. Once I've picked my doctrine, I would prefer to get all the things. Having to pick and choose between two or more cool choices is anti fun for me.
Furthermore, they are far far too short. I was really hoping for a lot deeper tech tree's. Wider too, but deeper as a minimum. If they were deeper and wider, I think I wouldn't have a problem with giving the players choices to make.
Finally, I was kind of hoping to see the ability to create or tailor your doctrines. It would be cool if I could pick half of one tree, and half of another. And create my own custom playstyle. I understand it's not very historic. But thats a small price to pay for fun.
@@Hunter_6601 I generally always have a surplus of experience. So I'm not sure about it changing the game length. And I don't really agree with your "being played the same wat every time" take. If you want to play differently, pick a different doctrine?? Also, this is speculation, but I do believe most people will find their favourite doctrine and never change their playstyle. So the utility of adding choice isn't a much as you may think.
But on your last point, I cant disagree!!
Thank you for your reply!
@@jamesespinosa690realism isn’t the issue, no coh game has done that for a reason. And that’s because it would be impossible to balance. Everyone would pick the best abilities for each factions and never change. Coh2 doctrines are, let’s be honest, quite pointless. Pick a doctrine that isn’t meta and you are going to lose. The only faction that can even get away with this is Wehrmacht and even they need some docs otherwise they’re gonna have a hard time. Doctrines make or break the game and that’s stupid
Infantry riding on vehicles is so useful and cinematic. Played a game as DAK where I had assault grens riding on a tiger. The tiger drove through a wall and I dismounted them - looked so cool
cinematic? its fucking COH
@@willh2739 stuff still can look cinematic tho
@@willh2739 you mean the game that takes it's themes and lines from famous war movies can't be cinematic?
My biggest issue is I was expecting the graphics to be a big improvement. Instead, while I love the scaling of the infantry being smaller, the overall look seems like a bit of a step down from CoH2. At the moment, I'm not sure if I'll upgrade as I was expecting a substantial upgrade rather than a side/downgrade in graphics.
CogH3 visual step down from the original CoH too!
Explosions look cartoony too :(
As far as I can tell the actual models and the way they are fit together into a world have vastly improved. The lighting and color saturation are a mess though. I liked the bright, colourful and slightly washed out look of the previous iteration, it really captured how a sunny day in mid Italy looks to me. But too many people didn't like it so they haphazardly changed it. If they give us multiple (dare I say custom) lighting modes I would be overjoyed. That way I can enjoy the "Italian-style" lighting I prefer and someone else can enjoy the Passchendale on a rainy winterday look he prefers. Oh and the animations look unfinished for now...
@@AhmadHando87 good ol Hollywood explosions made from 90% Gasoline. That is my favourite thing of CoH2, the very realistic and very meaty explosions :)
That's the thing though, you go smaller you miss out on some of the details. The game isn't a downgrade from Coh2 on a technical level, most of it comes down to the lighting being off and some effects not being up to snuff.
Really impressed with the video. I went into the game test researching, recording, etc but your level of insight and attention is amazing. We are very lucky to have you in the community. Thanks, Tightrope
Always staying up to date with the latest tightrope insights. Thanks!
Auto healing coupled with auto reinforce on halftracks is amazing
i REALLY wanted a salvage option for all, like the OKW in COH2. i hate leaving the enemy with mgs/mortars etc..
The auto reinforce is so good, I used to accidently order mortars by spamming the r key when I wanted to reinforce
I really hope they add the full line arc for the mgs again, i'm getting cancer trying to flank the mgs when you cant see shit at where the arc ends
Thanks TR, you’ve done an amazing job keeping COH 2 alive through in depth information. Can’t wait to get it from the start for COH 3
Agreed on all, but I must say on a couple points:
The shorter game length is badly needed, the VP tick change is great imo, games going on for more than an hour is rough
I think the side armor will need tweaking but it is amazing, really amazing.
cheers bud
What did you think about 5 VP maps for 4v4 in COH2? That lorch assault was added when I was still playing those big team modes and although the map was a bit of a mess I did like the 5 VP aspect.
@@tightropegaming 5VP imo is and always has been a reasonable way to change game length and make maps more interesting. Xroads 1v1 5vp was my fav version of that map despite pushback from players. Same goes for the 5vp 4v4 maps. There is a lot more to say in regards to your question but ill keep it brief.
They could have increased the tickrate the longer the game lasted, so that e.g. up to 50% of VP it does once per 4 seconds and afterwards once per 3 seconds; normal games last normaly and stalemates (which CoH2 was very guilty of) last much shorter.
Can't believe it took them 3 games for auto reinforce, but I'm glad it's finally here.
As convinient the auto base-building is, the unique faction base builds like the okw,brits and US in coh 2 brought a more challenging but fun learning curve of getting used to each factions playstyle. Especially the brits and OKW's forward base options.
The USF base was an abomination. OKW were the only ones with a valuable difference.
US base design is utter disaster. It takes too much space yet offer little reinforcement zone. It's terrible for faction designed to be aggressive and constantly pushing. The officers system isn't bad, but the base is.
Brits design is boring and nonexistent even by coh standard.
OKW is the better refined coh1 Brit truck design and the best out of the 3.
Mmmm, USF base building, that was soooo good. I love to waste my time, apm and concentration to send retreated rifleman to ambulance on the other side of the base. It is sooo nice to waste another 10 seconds to get bazookas on the other side of the base that I need right now at the field.
Also totaly not op to get free medicine for OKW and the best defence of the cut off that can shoot from the edge of the base and be safe, totaly not op. Also a free (shtty but still) AA.
Soviets having to spend a solid minute to build another production while sturmpios, rear echelon and royal sappers sweep for mines, build birebed wire while ostheer pios chill at base WAITING FOR PHASE TO START BUILDING AFTER THAT!
No, new base building is the best. Only stuff you build outside should be bunkers, repair stations, medical centersand gun emplacements. Variety has to be balanced otherwise it’s just an unfair advantage for someone
@@tightropegaming i agree, most def could be better, i was just emphasize however on depending how each faction base is bulit could be design based on how each actual nation approached miltary doctrine adapted to a rts form.
yeah, remember when Starcraft rolled out and had 3 factions with completely different base setups that created an unique balance? And how CoH2 introduced a unique mix with OKW's agressive truck stuff, Brit sim city and US having a single node base?
Well that's too bad, let's forget about all of that, in fact let's give up and make basebuilding *so unimportant you can automate it*.
I much preferred longer game time because it let me use more of the cool looking heavy tanks and heavy emplacements late game. I usually only ever played 3v3 & 4v4 vs AI with friends though, I don't know much about the PvP scene.
It was easy to get a tiger at 12 minutes with DAK in team games so that doesn't seem to be an issue.
@@tightropegaming We're not really competitive players that's why we fight against the AI so it ends up taking a lot longer. The only time I ever managed to play with the heavy tanks was when I turned up the ticket amount, but I suppose having a triple cap makes the games a lot shorter then they used to. 12 minutes seems incredibly fast though
Auto base building placement is a little bugged in my experience. Sometimes the progress just freezes up and the building never gets finished.
Yeah the auto base build seems kind of ridiculous as well. You shouldn’t get sprites for engineers that can’t die to build sections of your base seems dumbed down
I'd imagine front/side/rear was just four 90-degree cones that rotated based on the vehicles facing. When enemy troops shoot from inside one of those cones, that would determine the hit location of the shot. So I'd be surprised if the width of the tanks mattered, but maybe it does and that'd add more fidelity for sure.
You forgot to mention that neutral buildings could be upgraded to a Forward Barracks as well before in the previous alphas like in the original CoH but it was removed for some reason.
Still it's nice to see that they've brought back so much from CoH and improved upon CoH2, as well as added so much more. I just wish the graphics and sounds were more gritty and realistic like in the original CoH.
This was a great analysis and brought up points I didn't even consider before. Great Job!
Tightrope you’re a trusted voice in COH thank you for all you do
COH3 looks like 720p (COH 1.5)
Good info in this video. I am mainly coming from coh1 so I dont have much knowledge of coh2. When you speak of coh3 favoring a player that can tech faster (get a tank out first) for example and take advantage of a lead, is there something specific in coh3 that allows that to happen? It seems like most factions have early enough AT options so it isnt obvious to me how this changes the balance. Or did you get AT from tier 1 and 2 buildings in coh2?
Another best change or feature you forget to mention is able to customize all hotkeys including grid key.
I sense a dark future of even more "I run my panther tank through your entire army and emerge unscathed"
During the explanation of how squads spread out and take different formation, I thought about how COH3 might have benefitted from implementing varied formation tactics as buttons to tell the units how to proceed like in Age of Empires 2.
That would be awesome to get 2 or 3 squads in a horizontal firing line. I think due to the map sizes in COH it's unfeasible though as you'd be able to cover so much ground
I really like the extra spacing, infantry sections/squads are meant to be as spread out as possible for just this reason irl
Looking forward to seeing this game come to life. I think it will become a classic in time
frontline mode would be cool line is drawn on the map based on what units are holding objective is to destroy the enemy base if not achieved winner is decided by percentage of held ground that would make it more realistic and capture points would be advantageous positions instead of exposed points
Tiger having side armor is actually pretty accurate
I love, every now and then when a unit is under fire as they move to cover they will diver or slide into cover, lovely little detail
been looking for a video on the changes, I didn't get a chance to play the beta! Thanks
Nice video!
I got a suggestion for COH3 but i dont know where to share it, so i might just write it down here.
About some bad retreating paths in COH leading to unfair bad luck. What if squads could retreat to a specific point and then back to base? If the player double taps the retreat button it acts like the currrent implementation. It also gives the player a confirmation step and there are no accidental retreats.
This feature could be distance limited to avoid scouting exploits, after some distance, auto retreat is engaged.
Another implementation could be to set up commanding squads to act like mobile retreat waypoints to nearby units.
Cheers TR and i hope to see a lot of COH3 content with you!
The mechanical improvements are quite good! I can get behind the Graphics if these features are implemented correctly! Bravo for the information sir!
U r a legend dude, keep those coming please
Being able to move multiple units to cover is a welcome, auto reinforce is amazing
Thanks for the video! The coh3 maps look pretty sparse. Bland maybe?
Well tiger is a heavy tank it makes sense it has very good protection make it valuable for its price, while in coh2 tiger is useless due to TD spam on ally side
@Ryan Vetter yes thats one thing but, what I'm saying is back in coh2 tiger doesnt really performed for its price cuz every TD on allied side penetrate its front almost 80% of the time making it useless, theres really no need to flank it when you can easily smash it frontally which shouldn't be the case for a expensive unit that has a build limit of 1 for each player in each game right
@@chustingutiza6520 So like real life? You understand a M93HVAP 76mm Sherman in real life can frontal pen a Tiger? Actual armor defense comes from angles, which is not something a game like CoH can model properly, so you end up with 90mm guns hitting the tiger tank and the tiger tank doing a diceroll. If you don't want your tiger to die, then support it.
@@Schaden-freude dude im implying that its a 1 unit per player type of a unit ofcourse they cant do real life things in a game but c'mon whats the point of getting a tiger anyway if it can easily countered by CP 0 TDs that you can have blobs of it right?
And ofcourse dude you need support for the tiger why do you think I want the tiger to be "I win call in" unit? I only want it to be tough enough that it will encourage the allied players to gank/flank it together with thier teammates unlike in coh2 that you just sit a TD behind then the tiger is useless you dont even have to make a play cuz you can effectively bully it far away frontally
My main fear is that it's just gonna be "More of CoH 2", there really isn't anything that addresses core mechanics in a new light. It just seems to be the same with some upgrades
i feel like they took most of the core mechanics and improved enough to call it new. movement (for infantry) has been changed , garrisons have been changed, units and factions have been changed, base building has been changed, battlegroups/commanders have been changed, campaign has been changed, multiplayer pacing has been changed with the victory points and the return of recon vehicles.
honestly i wouldn't know how they could do anything different without removing or introducing other core mechanics. Which they are planning to do anyway after release i believe, something about other game modes, but don't quote me on that.
Do you disagree or do you mean something else?
It's mostly taken from coh1 tho which is a huge mistake
@@kobal6525 coh1 is superior to coh2 in every single way. so not a mistake at all.
Nah, im glad they're innovating on what works from the previous 2 games instead of making large changes this time. When they tried something new with DoW3 the vast majority of the community shat on Relic for it. I'm still mad that game didnt get any continued support, cause I actually enjoyed it.
Not true at all. If that was the case, the majority would still be playing it just like with AoE1 vs AoE4. The newAge of Empifes isn't enticing the AoE2 players. And there's a 20 years gap. I get it, you're a CoH1 groupie, fine. But most players moved to CoH2 and STAYED cos its better. Numbers dont lie
The camera zoom in game is terrible, it feels far TOO zoomed in. It's too close and I'm unable to get a feel for what else is going on.
The awful camera zoom seems to be a staple of this series. Idk what game devs have against strategic zoom. This game plays like sh!t compared to a proper RTS like Supreme Commander.
@@jamaly77 It feels worse than COH2 and is feeling too close to see the action or other units... at least give the players options to play how they prefer
The playtest was hella fun. Can't wait for release.
From what I played, the tiger with the armor changes is super strong. It's probably gunna need some adjusting right off the bat.
Flamethrower effect is cool but i think they drop down the impact sound of tank...
Thanks for the video, it was very informative.
But I was hoping to see info regarding the infantry hitching a ride with the tanks, as in how durable they are with it, what kind of gameplay options it opens up for COH3, etc.
Infantry automatically hop off of tanks when they get fired upon; it's only useful for transporting troops to the frontline i.e. if you pulled back your tank for repairs whilst infantry reinforcing at base, a callin sends in a tank and infantry combo, etc.
I see.. Not quite how I imagined it but thats good to know, and thanks for clarifying :)
Don't touch spacing and side armor, it's simply better.
Great video mate! Thanks!
do they vault on the retreat path now? Didnt get a chance to play the multiplayer beta
In coh2 at least we can distinguish the units in relation to the environment that surrounds them.
amazing vid thanks for this infos!
I'm glad you enjoyed it
The biggest difference I felt is how much manpower I lack compared to coh2. In late game fuel and issue are not the bottleneck but the manpower. I hope they can address this later on.
There are a few side tech and battlegroup options to reduce drain. They just have to cost them correctly to account for the short matches.
@@tightropegaming Yes I have been using those. But it really feels like without the battlegroup techs you are putting yourself at a great disadvantage.
Is new Commander/Doctrine system will be changed morr in the future?
I struggle hard as allies to combat armour spam late game , I know it’s always being the same but it’s impossible
Are you using AT guns, infantry AT or anti-tank vehicles? I find a mix of these are effective against armour.
@@rkaho2573 the mg42 spam to accompany to tank spam is silly
Yeah, as a brit main in CoH2 it buffles me how hard it is for me in 3. They took out my Comets, botched snares, M3 Lee bounces off front too often, the only heavy tank is doctrinal, like wtf
@@glibchubik4090 Ukf does not even have a td in coh3 lmao, they removed the archer for some reason.
Armor spam? I think you’re talking about coh2 because 3 feels very infantry focused to me to the point where all I need is one or two armor pieces and if you have problems with the mg42 just use snipers
Auto reinforce had been around before CoH2 in Dawn of War 🙄
It took only ten short years to make an auto-cast ability in a CoH game. Something that was already in Warcraft 3 upon release.
with the difference in years between each game pretty much a new company would've made each game every time anyway
I'd be curious to see how the more spread out squads are impacted by minefields and stuff. Them being spread out more gives them a higher chance of hitting individual mine clusters, but obviously less damage to the whole squad as noted. I think that will make harassing mines a lot more useful personally.
This was a very helpful guide!
Great vid when will u do faction guides?
Do snares still do 100 damage? Also, do rear armor hits do bonus damage?
Great video can’t wait to make my maps 😊😁
Great video, thanks!
1:44 that "explosion" is why I play MoWAS
Is there no faction that is more flexible for base building? Like OKW in coh2 where you place your base where you want? Are all factions the same for base building?
We can't have nice things, basebuilding became so unimportant they automated it. Sigh.
Can you finally kill off the crew manning guns, mortars and other stationary weapons again? That was by far what i liked the least in CoH2. Britts with their bunkers and mortars everywhere that you couldnt clear out.
so those armor values arent going based on the vehicle's actual armor values. Also, also, the Sherman would actually have better armor than the Panzer IV. Sherman was effective 93mm, Panzer IV was only like 80mm or 50mm, depending on the variant.
sweet detailed video thanks
They already had auto-reinforce in DoW2, so one can only wonder why they never brought it to Coh2
I hate the snares change. A crew shock would make a lot more sense where they stop but can move after a few secs. A slow doesnt really make it a snare and that would make mines very ineffective since you often want the AT guns at maximum range and the tanks can just back up after hitting a mine.
But I do agree that engine damage was too much, engies are expensive to have and maintain.
Great breakdown as per
Very nice gameplay changes, it's just very hard to get over how bad the game is looking at the moment. Hopefully the lighting update fixes it.
Always been hooked up on coh games, this is the stuff that we have been waiting for. Lets go cant wait
The animation and formation makes people think there are inertia and unit is slow response, they should improve that by moving the whole squad first than the formation.
I would like them to add armor angling, and give side armor lesser values. So you would actually have to look where your target is and angle yourself properly.
That would be incredibly fiddly. CoH matches are already high paced and micro intensive enough.
That would be awful, I wanna play an RTS not world of tanks
@@martins3993 Like the game isn't fiddly already. It would add much to the game. You're already controlling the tank, just move it up at an angle and retreat at an angle. What's your 1v1 rank? Maybe we're just completely different players. What I mean is comp players will usually disagree with casual players
@@stefantheconqueror8710 Yeah the game is fiddly, that's my point. It's not necessary to add even more micro. That's why they are trying to remove micro with the auto reinforce and the auto vaulting. My CoH2 1v1 rank used to be top 200 with a few factions but now i just play occationally for fun so i've probably dropped to around 4-500.
hey TR, do you have a promo code that yields you a part of the purchase when I buy/preorder the game?
TIGHTROPE3 is my code
@@tightropegaming gotya, thanks!
What graph is that at 8:27?
did they add a zoom out?
I hope they let the camera zoom out more!
I think the spacing from the infantry is very good. Some tanks were too strong and could steamroll a game in COH 2. I'm sure in the pro scene it was not the case but we are not all pros.
Maybe extend the front onto the side a small bit and and the rear on the side a small bit to add a bit more surface area. But, that may not be easy to implement in their system if it's just a hit box with each face having a value. Maybe break the hit box into 3 boxes would be the easiest.
Did they fix camera being too close?
i never noticed most of these things... so minute but so important
6:14 he looks like he just witness a 4 car pile up where every car was full of kittens that were also victims
Good to se some good features added
Coh3 looks great and I played a bit in testing and it was good. But extremely fast paced and I found defensive tactics difficult because if you are not pushing and attacking quickly you find yourself on the back foot. You need to be aggressive all the time which is a big change for me. It's just a very expensive game so hopefully I can afford it when it comes out
Worth a buy review was interesting.
There was no need in previous COH to move camera to base in order to reinforce units :)
Will u make at least 1 more video about coh2, about light mgs, like brand,lmg42, BAR, M19...
Cool vid. Thx
I don't know if I'm just that dumb, but I couldn't find a way to change the facing of a garrisoned MG squad in CoH3 =(
If you drag right click the direction you want it to face while having the building selected that seemed to work.
don't forget you can also have your troops ON THE TANK! [sadly they can't fire from the tank, BUT STILL!] Literally, that ONE FEATURE has me so fucking hyped for CoH3.
Squad spacing was a much needed change. In CoH 1 I never felt like I was losing whole squads from lucky grenade RNG too often, and if a squad got wrecked it was my own fault. In CoH 2 the Wehrmacht's rifle grenade would absolutely shred anyone in cover because it was an intant hit, and Conscripts seem to want to get inside the guts of the guy next to them. I like a lot of the gameplay changes they're implementing, but for me the presentation is a real let down. I know they adressed some of those concerns in a recent devlog which gave me some hope the game is headed in a good trajectory, but I don't think they'll be changing the electric green/cyan wehrmacht. I won't be grabbing the game at launch, but I will be keeping a close eye on its updates.
“Hey guys, tartrup here” says the automatic captions 😂😂
Auto-Vault is definitely a good one for me, i can't forget how many times i fucked up because i forgot to queque a vault command when i was moving a unit to an area
Squad Spacing is a bit nice since i now don't have to fear losing a squad rushing or defending against a large aoe damage like explosives, tanks, artillery, or even mines, as i usually retreat them just out of fear of losing the entire squad.
i'm not sold in the Auto-Reinforce side though, as the Combined Command Card for Reinforce usually works for me, speaking of which i wish they implemented Combined Command Card for Abilities in squads/groups.
Same feeling for Auto-Build as i do not want to have another case of my Sherman getting stuck in their spawn/entry point because the US army bases were too thicc.
Side Armor, i'm abit skeptical, especially if they want to add specific tank models that had some changes done to add better side armor or have some form of side skirt/welded plate.
Thanks!
if you moved every time the camera to reinforce units instead of using units icons or macros you have a lot to improve
Me trying out USF: what they have a sniper now??
Me 3 min later: what snares don't save my sniper????
Great vid!
Is there gore like the first COH 1?
the problem with the side armor is the AI, correct me if I'm wrong, but tanks always aim for the "center", so even if the rear is slightly exposed they will still aim for the side armor
I really hope for a DLC they add the Italian Army for the Axis and the Royal Army, or even better, Partisans for the Allies. I think they could be weaker than the US/UK and the Germans, but also cheaper to produce, maintain, etc. and would be good as support for their respective allies. I also personally just want to use Partisans and blast Bella Ciao.