WHAT NEXT FOR LION EL'JONSON? 5 MOMENTS WE NEED TO SEE!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 พ.ค. 2023
- Hey everyone Rho here! Today we're discussing what next for Lion El'Jonson? 5 moments and narratives I hope we get to see next!
Spoiler Warning to begin as the events we're discussing today are from across the Warhammer 40,000 universe. In particular we'll be referencing events from "The Lion: Son of the Forest" and "Arks of Omen: The Lion". As always I really recommend you read the stories for yourself first. As that's the best way to enjoy the lore for yourself! Without Spoilers!
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The Lion is acting according to his nature. Now free from the role given to him by the Emperor. He is once again a knight defending humanity from the monsters of the forest.
I think one of the best moments will be his reunion with Guilleman. In their last meeting the Lion hugged his brother so abruptly Roboute dropped his helmet. They however did not part on the best of terms.
I would love to see this time around having the Lion be more cautious and apprehensive in his approach to his brother, only to have Bobbie G give him a similar helmet dropping hug. An older brother expecting his younger one to be mad, only to have him equally relieved to not be alone.
That moment deserves to come full circle and be paid off.
I have been reading the imperium secundus arc and ruinstorm.
But in which book/story is that hugging part mentioned if you could indulge?
@@sajadhoxhaj6603 I believe it’s from the Unremembered empire
that would be brilliant
@@Kh4yon aaa yes I remember now. That was one truly funny and wholesome moment despite what happened next.
Yet my fav has to be:
"Curze will have us go at each other throats now"
The Lion looked down at the hand holding him:"Quite literally it seems"
Wolf Lord Roh has a reading of the moment, but I don't recall the name of the book. When I heard people talking about them meeting up again, the hug moment was the first thing that came to mind for me....that moment needs to be paid off in some way.
He was now only a few paces away. The lion stopped short and removed his helm. He watches as his brother did the same, pulling the blue helmet of the ultramarines tight to his side. He bowed his head in acknowledgment as he closed the final few paces between them. There could be no doubt, this was his brother. The Lion could now see the heaviness in his face and eyes. Weariness? Perhaps. This new imperium they have both found themselves thrust into was indeed burdensome place. Or was it weariness of the lion himself. Why him. Why this brother and not another? Why the Lion, the one whom was banished for his secrets.
He shook the notion from his mind. They were nearly face to face now, and as ElJhonson prepared to speak, his words became stuck in his throat, he felt a pain in his chest.
The pain of regret. The pain of failure. The pain of bonds broken that had not yet been mended. The lion stopped short of his brother. He could see the sadness in Roboute's eyes, but also the fire that only the eyes of a primarch could hold. His mind was now racing, desperately searching for the right words to say, he had never been as good a statesman as his brother for whom these things seem to flow naturally. He feigned a cough as if clearing his throat, now barely holding his classic stoic and aloof gaze that had served him all his life.
And then it happend.
The great winged helm he held at his waist was now tumbling in slow motion Before him. His brother, without a word or sound, and without even the Lions exemplary reflexes allowed to react, embraced him with such force that this time it was the Lions helm that was dislodged from his grip.
He winced at first at the sounds of his helmet rolling and clanking off the ceremite floor, but the strength of the embrace he now found himself in said everything that was needed to be said between them. Relief washed over him, and the Lion replied with an embrace of his own. One befitting a Lion of the first. And as they each pulled back Guiliman smiled for the first time since their eyes met. He looked down at the Lions helmet and bent over to pick it up. As he rose to hand it back to his brother so spoke for the first time. "Your getting slow old man." Said Guilliman with a smirk. The lion roared in laughter, the memory of their last meeting brushing his mind. "Perhaps I am, " he let his response hang..." but I'm still faster than Angron."
Robute's face darkened if only for a moment at the mention of his traitorous brothers foul name. Then placing a hand on the Lions shoulder he said " Now that brother, is a story I must hear."
This is a good start.
A big thing that keeps being missed out is that the vast majority of the chapter are unaware of the fallen and their nature, it's only the inner circle and ravenwing who are privy to the knowledge. The integration of risen/redeemed I don't believe will be that big of a deal, no worse than the primaris who were routinely mind wiped and sent on suicide missions
Which Azrael put a stop to.
I would like to see lion meeting bjorn, would be such an interesting idea seeing his reaction to one of the sons of Russ still alive and likely knew of him semi well depending how much he and Russ talk, is not only alive but still fighting and dealing with such decay of the imperium longer than any loyalist primarch combined and multipled lmao
Cypher, Guilliman, Luthor, and Azmodai. In no particular order but these are the meetings I want to see.
My thoughts exactly. My particular order would be Luther, Cypher, Guilliman, Azmodai.
and azrael ofc - should be an interesting chat.
@Scatter TheWinds I left azrael out because they are basically in the same place right now. Unless the rock left already I have only watched lore reviews of the arks of omen so I may he off on that and if so yes azrael will probably be at the top of the list.
Conflict and brother hood is gonna be juicy to see unfold how his sons will react to his forgiven fallen and reaction to current day traditions
@@123CantCatchMe royal rumble time!!!
I can only imagine reunion proper with rest of Dark Angels and them telling Lion what they were up to to this point resulting in louder and more horrified with each itteration of it: "WHAT?!" and then Lion traveling through Imperium with Azrael, starting bunch of countless meetings with: "My son would like to apologise to you..."
The Lion isn't really in a position to judge the Unforgiven too harshly on their treatment on the fallen. He did slaughter his way to Luther through scores of untainted recruits during the fall of Calaban.
@@williamings773 I think more than the slaughtering of the Unforgiven, what could make the Lion go “what” is the number of times the DA have failed to aid the Imperium because they did some wild goose chase of their traitor brethren. That is something he would scoff at
Based on what Guillemin said after his meeting with the EoM. He felt the Emperor only had enough strength left to have that level of communion only one more time. So the Lion hearing this may not go see his father or the Lion will be the last Primarch to speak to the EoM. If others return, the EoM will not have the strength left to speak to them. Also feel that Guillemin will not care if the Dark Angels and the Unforgiven act as single legion again. As long as the Chapter masters remain and they chose to follow the Lion. Since the point of breaking legions was breaking the unified command structure not the abilities of chapters to act as together if necessary.
I think it would be interesting if Lion kept his chapters separate but no longer bound to the 1000 man limit.
But took the potentially thousands of Risen he gathers as his personal legion since they are more familiar faces.
Not sure if the Fallen issue will be as big a problem for the rank and file marines in the Unforgiven chapters. Only the leadership knows about them so it may end up being OK.
I'd like a big moment being The Lion reminding us High Chaplain Sapphon exists, so Asmodai's fun policing comes to an end. Reluctant successful chaplain forced to be a radical is a much better story than banning Astartes to talk due to laughing.
It’s strange. Sapphon is high chaplain, so he is responsible for the morale of the chapter and regular discipline and faith business. But Asmodai is an interrogator chaplain, and their role is less about the wellbeing of the chapter and more being absolutely fanatical about chasing the Fallen. So it’s kinda hard to tell how much influence one group has over the other since they are both orders of chaplains but both require very different skills and mindsets.
But yes, it is strange that the head interrogator chaplain somehow has the authority to interrogate the Fallen and do stuff like order the executions of a planet’s initiate group and make an entire company take a vow of silence. Asmodai was specifically made an interrogator because he wasn’t interested in leading or inspiring his brothers. So him having that much power over entire companies is a bit odd.
Sapphon has the final say but his position is tentative with Asmodai gunning for the role.
@@chuck2703 Asmodai isn’t gunning for the role. They have two separate positions with two separate purposes. The high chaplain is more traditional chaplain rank and whatever the equivalent is for the interrogator chaplains is kind of a specialist position, a different kind of role for a different kind of chaplain. But I don’t think an interrogator chaplain can suddenly become high chaplain without pretty much the entire chaplaincy ending up dead first.
@@OutspokenSeeker Going back to the storyline after 'Angels of Darkness' that ends up with the battle against Typhus - Asmodai is working to take down Sapphon and take his place since those two have a bad relationship and Sapphon is his superior.
Honestly I'm a bit sick of Asmodai. He is only good for memes even though he probably has more depth that could be explored - and maybe meeting Jonson will be a good time to do it. But Sapphon is the far more interesting character, yet since GW loves to make the Dark Angels look like morons we have to stick with Asmodai as the example of an Interrogator Chaplain...
@@erih2934 ah. My mistake, I haven’t been able to read that story yet
After finishing the lions new novel I have to say I 100% was much more drawn to the redeemed fallen than I’ve really ever been with the modern day DA but on few occasions in different novels and lore. Going to be interesting too see how to to integrate because from how it sounds the lions not done redeeming those of his fallen sons not to far gone.
"We didn't conquer the galaxy with honour"
@@Blinks77 that line and moment made me so damn proud as a DA and was so fucking funny seeing how that traitor was so dumbfounded by that
It really made me want an updated DA veteran set with multiple armor marks and possible loadouts. Would be an amazing kit on the tabletop and would fit in with the lore for the risen. Maybe give them special rules to go with the Lion or some such as well.
I hope they write something along the lines of Robouté and Lion travel through the forestwalk. It'll be some sort of the brothers journey physically/emotionally(?) And maybe spiritually. They fight some some sort of chaos undivided avatar there and coming out stronger.
I love the idea of him putting his Legion back together, whether Guilliman likes it or not. That would make a great story thread.
I don't think Guilliman would mind as he remade the Blood Angels into Legion...
I would hope there's some reasonable side to doing it these days
Lion talking to Logan Grimnar
He will just tell them that he was the one to delete all imperial records of the wulfen and best friends from then on.
@@pedromartinezcalzada6328 can i have the source cause i was unaware he did that
@@pedromartinezcalzada6328 He did?
Will be interesting how he deals with the Ecclesiarchy as he has been Avoiding them
There's a lot of stuff I cant wait for. Cypher, Asmodai, the McRib coming and going willy nilly. The Lion is in for some drama!
I'd want a scene where The Lion & Guilliman lay waste to a traitor brother like Bucky and Cap layed the smack down on Iron Man in Civil War (I was team Tony though XD.) Perfectly comboing their attacks to take down a powerful duelist like Fulgrim and banishing him together would be epic.
Most of all though, a touching reunion with Guilliman is what I am looking forward to the most. I want them both to air their regrets and grievances and voice their combined determination to set the Imperium right. As the last two loyal sons I'd love to see their relationship evolve from the days of the heresy and for some real trust to be borne between them.
The immediate time after the Wormwood battle does absolutely need time dedicated to it however. I want to read Azrael's first words to his returned Primarch and the reaction and guilt of the Unforgiven to be on full display. It is far too important to gloss over the reunion of a father with his sons who many believe have lost their way to paranoia and how the Lion will set them on a better path.
Azrael and the inner circle explaining to the Lion why they kept betraying the imperium to find on fallen marine over a vox cast
But only the leadership of the Dark Angels is aware of the Fallen. And the deathwing equivalents. The vast majority will be in awe of Crusade era marines returning
A theory I've seen floating around: When the Tyranids (and maybe Chaos) close in on Terra, the Emperor communicates in some vision to Cypher. Cypher attempts to enter the throne room but is blocked by the Custodes, so the Lion takes him to the King in his dreamforest, who is of course Big E. He asks the Emperor "Is it time?" or "Are you ready?". The Emperor affirms it, his relief visible. Cypher (or even the Lion himself) kills the Emperor with the Lion Sword, releasing him from his mortal body to become a God, with the psychic blast from the throne room obliterating the nids from the galaxy.
wouldn't that also shitfuck all of Terra and consume most of humanity as per current rules of how warp gods are born?
Gonna just squat the nids like that?
Love your content Rho! As the first view of this vid i just wanted to tell you to keep up the good work sir :)
El-J: "The Fallen are now Risen!, no more interrogations."
Asmodai: [Apoplectic] He took ma JERB!
remember only the death wing and the inner circle knew of the fallen! so for the most part the unforgiven will not care, they have their primarch back! as for Asmodai's reaction to the situation will be something to see!
I want to see the Lion having the inquisition explained to him and be like "so...secret orders within secret orders? this seems familiar..." XD
Would be interesting if the entire family of Unforgiven Chapters all just go on a massive penitent crusade together
One thing to keep in mind is that the Inner Circle/Ravenwing/Deathwing are the only ones who know about the Fallen. The line brothers weren’t told about that secret shame until they were inducted into those groups. So, the old guard will have their baggage. Those outside that group will only be finding out about them when the Lion returned with the Risen in tow. They’ll likely be quicker to come around getting all that info at once.
As to what the Lion & the Unforgiven will do now? I honestly see them staying in Imperium Nihilus for now. Plenty of worlds to protect & traitors to fight. Also, the Lion learned his lesson from Imperium Secundus - ruling isn’t a thing he’s made for.
Alpha Legion is sitting in the shadoy corner rubbing their hands with glee at the opportunities the gift a returning Johnson is to them!
I want him to reunite with G man, have a lot of tension in it, then G man just breaking down and hugging him to welcome him back.
Big E talk and if it’s different and Gullimen arguing or fighting with Lion will be action packed and they won’t be taking huge losses if United
Man if Lion fights or accepts Luther or Cypher is gonna be amazing to see happen and if he uses his old sword
He most definitely won't use his old sword or GW would have to change the miniature. I guess not invalidating Cypher's was reason enough that they came up with Fealty.
But these are the two meetings I look most forward to as they will (hopefully) move the story along the most. Guilliman and the others are all interesting, but predictable.
@@erih2934 yeah it’d be weird since he’d be unable to use his shield and greatsword at the same time so he might give it to Azreal or one of his risen/redeemed Sons
The Lion meeting Logan Grimmnar and the Space Wolves would be great
i relay like your content Roe, keep running !
Most of his time after his return would be, meeting his Legion's leaders namely, Azrael, Belial, Samael, Asmodai and all the other Chapter Masters of the Unforgiven. He will then act to revive his Legion thru the Hunt of the Fallen. For each Fallen, he will be judged as either Redeemed (rejoins the Legion) and with Chaos taint (executed). The Hunt will lead to two major characters, Cypher and Luther, with the latter's judgement. After removing all the taint from his sons, before travelling to Terra, he will conduct a retribution campaign/crusade against Vashtorr to stop him from getting the "weapon". During this campaign it is possible that we would encounter and free his brother Jhaghatai in the webway. If he is successful during the campaign, he could end up with the "weapon". He will then travel to Terra with Jhangtai and meet up with Guilliman. Then he will meet with the Emperor, and with Cypher by his side. What happens next........
If Johnson flat out tells Gulliman that he's reforming the 1st Legion, if imagine Gulliman would be 100% on board with it. He's now kinda debating with himself if now the Legions should be reassembled. He now realizes breaking up Ultramar was a dumb idea.
Here is an idea why can't you have both? Having chapters to be the elite troops or special op unite for Z, Y, Z while the main force is part of a legion strength
You missed one interaction out and that’s the lion meeting Cypher and we can finally find out what the hell he’s been up to
When Dante , Guilliman and Lion are finally in a same room together
Im most curious about Cipher and his meeting with the Lion.
The most likely thing Guilliman will do is appoint Lion the Lord Protector, the same job he had in Imperium Secundus and task him to reclaim Imperium Nihilus. Dante will still be Regent of Nihilus.
This might be a weird comment, but I really appreciate your slower cadence. I don't have to relisten hardly at all, unlike some other lore vids.
To quote a fan made meme the Lion might have a few words. “HE DID WHAT WITH A WHAT!?”
Man, the feels when everyone lost their marbles as the psycher confirmed that he was indeed the lion.
Reunion with Guiliman will go fine. I mean, his meeting with Angron went well!!! I don't expect blades drawn in this one though.
I honestly see Jagatai being the one to smooth relations between the two, if the dark eldar havent messed him up too bad.
Yes and his dark eldar jet biker travel
I would want to see the look on Asmodai’s face when Lion orders the Risen to be forgiven or when a Risen steps foot on The Rock for the first time.
Sapphon I also want to see, but less for comedy.
I half expect Asmodai to receive the decapitating backhand slap The Lion delivered to a previous Chaplin that pissed him off.
at last the Lion will get the title he has always wanted "Warlord"
Like Achilles, Guilliman knows he does not need to control the Lion, all he needs to do is unleash him. Give him a blank check and let the Lion do whatever he wants.
The meeting with the bestest, and defintely your favorite Primarch, Guilliman.
Lion and Abaddon discussing the history and current state of things.
My most anticipated, or the one I most hope for is his meeting Cypher.
Technically, no. It was only the Deathwing and Inner circle of the chapter and their successors that new the truth of the Fallen. The chapters as a whole have no idea what the Fallen even are. Yes they have psycho indoctrination as a part of their training. But they are never told until they are tapped for either the Deathwing or Ravenwing. AND!!! They are never told everything about the Fallen. Circles within circles within circles within circles.....
like ripples on a pond - these are the days of our lives (music plays)
I suppose the focus will be on the Lion’s reaction to the Empire and it’s many changes but in addition to Angron there are many Demon Traitor Primarchs who are going to react to his return as a new factor in their personal stories
We need to see Corvus Corax return. 😆 🤣
Only when Lorgar does, till then he's gonna keep smacking the crap outta that traitorous git every time he sticks his head out the door.
Lets not forget Valdor is out there... Now that's a triple reunion worth reading...
I would like to see Gulliman trying to explain his reunion with the emperor to the Lion and how the Lion reacts..
Maybe the Emps will want to see the Lion aswell, that would be a good meeting
Awesome
The correct question, "What is the secret of the Grail?" Things are getting very Arthurian.
I agree with all of your points Rho, however you left one off. The meeting between Cypher and Lion needs to be talked about. So many theories about who Cypher is. My head cannon personally is he is Alpharius. Barring that his ties to Constantine Valdor and the army he has built. And his ability to escape any prison which is quite possibly tied to the watchers in the dark. I am looking forward to this meeting in particular. And if Cypher is Alpharius. A traitor brother who is actually loyal. This would be a fun meeting.
Cypher was working with the lion the entire time.
I would like to see his reaction to the Ecclisiarch
This will be the best TLC family reunion. Dad -actually- came home.
In addition to his brother, Luther, Cypher. I want some time with Dante
Nice parallel to the legend of the fisher-king. I mean the first time the king was fishing in the lake, there is the wound which does not close. The king is one with the land. The Emperor is one with the Imperium.
The Lion did ask the King “Are you my father ?”
I need more Khan content from you.
Lion is already back.
The Lion will do whatever the Emperor tells him. He will have to go to Terra at some point to meet Guiliman and his father. Guiliman doesn't to tell him to do anything. The Emperor will direct him to do whatever he thinks is best for the Imperium, the same way he did with Guiliman when they met.
Readying to rebuild hi Legion to Crusade size.
I'll say it again; can't wait to see Asmodai vs Lion and the Risen
I wonder if some of the Unforgiven will end up like Nemiel if they will resist the Risen despite the Primarch's orders? Perhaps it will create another schism within the Unforgiven?
How gutting for DA, they stand at codex rules of 1000 and all of a sudden 50,000 risen turn up like, Cool a green unit LOLZ!!!
Maybe the Lion will try to rebuild his Legion from the various chapters and the Risen.
I think the question that the Lion needs to ask Big E isn’t “how do I heal you”, but “how do I free (kill) you”. Multiple of the Lion’s sons have come to this conclusion already. I think it’s only a matter of time before he figures it out as well.
There is no way Asmodai makes it through this without either being exiled, killed outright by the Lion, or killed off elsewhere by GW.
Asmodai is a fundamentalist. He deals in black and white. The Lion by his nature sees the world in shades of grey, at least where his own sons are concerned. That’s why he was able to coalesce the Risen around him in the first place.
I cannot see Asmodai letting go of the hatred and prejudice that has characterised his entire existence, not even for the Lion. Repentance is all he is.
I would Like him to save Terra From the nids. This time not coming late to save Daddy
A large part of me want more primarchs to return before they even get a chance to speak to one another, just adding to the confusion and tension.
I think this could be interesting, because i think the firstborn sre the ones who hate the fallen more and will be uncomfortable with the Risen, but the primaris are different because msny of them didn't know and they are borh from a similar era, it could be an interesting brotherhood between the old risen and the new primaris and it would be a good combo , what one has in strength the other has in knowledge and experience.
Well the thing of the fallen is that only inner circle unforgiven know of the fallen not the rank and file. So these risen knights are probably news to anyone but the death wing and even then the lion is the primarch
Love your videos!Thank you for inspiring me to make a channel! Reading on Lion El'Jonson recently has gotten me into some deep lore about him and the first legion! Actually just started making a video series on it! Would love you to tell me what you think!
I still wanna see if my theory that Lohoc is actually Sevatar is true or not.
I don't get why people and lore channels in particular keep forgetting that only a small part of the Dark Angles and their successors leadership know who the fallen were. Most of the rest do not know about the secrets and shame. So they would readily accept the Risen and the Lion's decree that they are redeemed and returned to the fold. There is no way the inner circle will be able to turn enough of the Chapters members against the Lion's orders and all the Risen will side with the Lion as well so the inner circle will also be even more outnumbered.
Lion's todo list, in order.
1. Figure what the hell has happened in the past 10,000.
2. Bitch slap what has the psychotic paranoia that has become of his sons.
3. Bro hug Robute.
4. Reform the Astartes Legions.
5. Kill everyone in his way.
I personally want the Inperial Truth to be re established and see how that conflict plays out. In son of the forest he did describe it as a battle that needed to wait.
Cypher!
Asmodai is going to be a huge roadblock and may not survive the Lion's return, being a Chaplin to boot
You missed the most important: his reunion with Russ.
The lion has his forest walk abilities. He'll be able to get to any planet he needs to be at. The emp will send him to gman when he thinks its time or he will send him to terra to meet his dad and to tell him he needs to get along with his brother before they're reunited
Will his geneseed come into question being a original unhampered sample
We have the Deathwing and Ravenwing how many other "wings" will the Lion return to service and what weapons will they have?
I have always felt that the Lion would race to Terra as soon as practical. But I have been thinking that maybe things could be different. The Lion really never returned to Caliban until after the Crusade. He always wanted to but always found himself to be too busy. Especially if he manages to meet his father in alternate dimension, he may just get too busy cleaning up the mess of half a galaxy and just not be able to return to Terra. Could be interesting if the two brothers are only able to send communication indirectly for years with G just sending crusader fleets as reinforments and but also unable to Join the Lioin since he is busy organizing everything across the whole galaxy and however, much he would like to help, it just makes sense to to stay where he is as well. Give the Lion a few years with leading chapters from different bloodlines and really getting a feel for how desperate things are. When they meet ANY anger will be mild in comparison with both brothers now being exhausted and overwhelmingly thankful to have each other. All the awkwardness still remains but Lion and G will undoubtedly be thankful for the other and that hug needs to happen.
The Lion Sword is waiting outside the throne room for El'Jonson to free the Emperor from the Golden Throne.
well i wanna kow now about Cypher.
I wander how the Lion will interact with the black templars?
Honestly, I'm not so sure everything will go so smoothly with the Lion's reunion with his chapter. Or to put it another way, it wouldn't be grim-dark enough. I'm not saying the Dark Angels will betray him.. Maybe. But revealing all their secrets, ect. would be too neat of a bow. Who was that one Fleshtearer that didn't trust RG? The Dark Angels is that guy x10.
perhaps dante will fill the void sanguinius did he was the wisdom and experience of a primarch and practically is now after the devastation of baal he could smooth the relationship over between guilliman and and lion
Another thing I have not seen mentioned yet - with the forgiveness of certain members of the fallen and them becoming part of the Dark Angels again i.e Loyal and serving... would that not mean that Dante is no longer the oldest, living, loyal Space Marine serving the Imperium? With a lot of them being from the heresy era, they are far older. Although I suspect warp shenanigans will come to play in figuring that out, if they too have been hiding in the Eye of Terror
Afaik none of the Fallen has lived for more than a few hundred years, so Dante is still on top in every reasonable interpretation. Unless you count in Bjorn the Fell-handed of course :)
I actually wonder if when the lion is forced to become integrated back into the emperium hierarchy he ends up getting involved with the inquisition since that would alow him to stay out of the spotlight as much as possible and deal with the potential conflict thats about to boil over between the primarchs and inquisition
Wouldnt it be fun if asmodai went the same way as nemiel ?
Is "Son of the Forest" the first in a series/trilogy, or similar? Like the trilogy that Guilliman got?
Asmodai will be unleashed on the chaos corrupted fallen and the risen will be joining asmodai on a penitent crusade.
The reunion of the primarchs will be the best read if they make a book