Usually the Ghoul(Cooper Howard) is calm and confident in any situation but when he sees Hank again in the final episode(asks about his family) you can see his hands shaking in rage. A great piece of acting and an awesome detail for the character.
Makes you wonder what happened to Janey since she was with him when the bombs fell. He distinctly says FAMILY not just WIFE so that implies that Janey survived somehow.
@@mattt233 I'm expecting a scene next season that takes place immediately after they rode off on the horse where a Vault-tec security force takes Janey from him and leaves him to die.
Those vault 15 former residents were acting outside of Vault-Tec’s orders for their vault. Still Hank may not have known. To answer another commenter, if Bethesda truly disliked the NCR, they wouldn’t have put the show on the west coast period. This is because the NCR was literally shown as the good guys (even though they were shown as aggressive militarist territory expenders in New Vegas), throughout the entire show. Bethesda never actually anything negative about the NCR in any projects they actually helmed. Fallout New Vegas had plenty of clues to the NCR’s eventual decline, a game that was written by the original Fallout writers (this being during the aftermath of the second Iraq war is likely no coincidence once so ever).
But they aren't really "decedents". We don't know for certain how many from Vault 15 started Shady Sands in 2142 but we know it became 35,000 people (in game) before its eventual destruction (show). around 120 years is not enough time for the Vault Dwellers to reproduce that much. They were around a hundred at most. Meaning yes a bunch of the people there were surface dwellers and therefore "fair game". Even with multiple baby booms a couple hundred becomes a few thousands. Sprinkle ontop the hazards of the wasteland and their numbers are still struggling. Shady Sands wasn't exactly Vault-Tec certified lol.
Remember, Betty stated they "buried" their mom. But when they are taking the dead when they are cleaning up, it's to the compost room... If Rose had "died in the plague" they would have sent her body to be composted, not buried.
Leadership definitely follows the same rules as everybody else. There is no reason the overseer could have set aside a special burial site for his wife. Definitely nothing an overseer would do.
I think they just use the term bury to maintain a sense of normalcy. I assume they use "bury" to mean "compost", like we use "passed" to mean "dead". Just a sugar coated way to avoid the reality of the situation
I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed. Seriously though can this series please move on from Vault Dwellers and plots involving their parents or children?
@@RAAM855The entire fallout franchise plot is to find something or someone while in the process save the wasteland and the people Chronological order Fallout 76: Find overseer Fallout 1: Find water chip Fallout 2: Find G.E.C.K Fallout 3: Find dad Fallout New Vegas: Find platinum chip/Benny Fallout 4: Find son Fallout TV show: Find dad,Find Head,Find ex-wife and daughter
I love how Lucy and Coop ended up together at the end of the season as traveling companions, cause really Coop taught Lucy what the waste land is all about in the short time they were together, and I think Lucy showed him that maybe there is still good in the waste land.
Also Cooper perfectly understands the sense of betrayal and devastation that comes when finding your loved one did, or is perfectly ok with doing, something terrible.
The song choice during that end scene is also important. In particular "My echo... my shadow... and me" Me, in this context, is obviously the ghoul. The shadow, dogmeat/CX-404, because that's what a good dog does. Leaving Lucy, as the ghoul's Echo, a distorted voice of his past self. You could make an argument that lucy is the me, the ghoul her echo. but dogmeat has more of a connection to the ghoul than it does to her, thus invalidating the shadow.
@rosabellavitaalvarez-calde5836 yes he does and being alive for over 200 hundred years, he's basically a walking history book of the waste land who I believe is going to tell and teach Lucy everything about Vault techs past to present, Lucy may become the new Moldaver in the end to fight for what her mom thought was right, I guess we will see next season.
If there's a redemption arc, it's for the Ghoul. I just get the feeling that's what they're leaning towards, especially with the old Mexican eulogy: "Feo, fuerte y formal'. Ugly, strong, and dignified.
mmhmm. The ghoul still has the framework of a moral compass. Tarnished by age, sure. But it's still there. He ain't going to kill someone who isn't a threat to him. One I think Cx-404/dogmeat will help, heh, dig up, based on the prewar scenes with howard's dog Roosevelt.
@Destroyer_V0 dont forget lucy. He might start looking at her as a daughter. She cant replace his daughter but she can fill the void much like Dogmeat cant fill the void for his dog but he makes it work
@@GamerMarine89 Oh yeah. I said it in another comment, but the choice of music at the end of the season was kinda a thing. Specifically "My echo, my shadow, and me" Me being the ghoul, the shadow being dogmeat. And the echo, being lucy.
I do think that Hank loves his daughter more than Vault Tec considering he was going to let Steph die to save Lucy which would’ve cost VT an entire generation’s Overseer.
@@coinisinorbit If you look at 2:24 you can see a bunch of pickles floating So unless they are Pickle-bobbing at a wedding 🤷 But more than likely its a bunch of vinegar, salt and/or pickling spices
@@twistedyogert Oh ya, even with no wounds it would suck. But I imagine this would be like when you got a covid test, and you felt it in the back of your nose where you didnt even know you *could* feel. Itd be like that but stinging INSIDE your face 😨
Notice how Hank kills Monty....whacks him on the head with a shovel, then shoves Montys face (with a large open wound) into a pickle barrel ensuring the Raider suffered as he drowned. You know Hank had killed before. Especially when compared to when Lucy kills her first ghoul in the Super Duper Mart.
yes, I immediately noticed he was a ruthless killer. Absolutely no hesitation to beat and drown a man. Obviously it wasn't his first rodeo. The fact that he seemed so comfortable in power armor at the end indicated military experience as well.
I didn't think about it when I watched it the first time, but I saw a reaction video where one guy said "Hank was a gangster! Did you see how easily he did that? He's done this before." I realized that, yes, this was lowkey a hint because you would definitely have to get used to killing people while being out in the wasteland.
@@WarLord645 sure, he did have it coming. But the way Hank purposely finished him in a painful and humiliating way, rather than just use the shovel or take him prisoner, strongly indicates that Hank is not just your usual protective dad. He went the extra mile there. Plus, no hesitation to take a life. Normal inexperienced people will always have reservations.
@WarLord645 he definitely did. But Hank could have ran and hid in his office like a lot of Overseers tend to do when things go wrong in the vaults. Or he could have just made sure Monty was knocked out so he could be imprisoned. Hank was ready to F*ck someone up in a way the rest of the vault dwellers weren't.
House was the only one not pitching his own vaults, too. You get the feeling that he's more there to see what his competitors are doing, not because he's buying what Vault Tec was selling.
@@senhowlerI think he did and I suspect the chamber where his body is held is held in a section of the vault which is why he started filling the vault with concrete eliminating one of the entry points to his real body leaving only one.
Hank: THE WORLD MUST BE MANAGED BY VAULT-TEC! Also Hank: *Nukes a city founded by Vault Dwellers using Vault-Tec technology that Vault-Tec provided them with.* Edit: What in God's name is this thread?
It makes sense, remember each vault is in essence striving to be the one whos ideals and people repopulate, if they were regular surface dweller survivors or vault tec from a diff vault. Same thing remember how Bud put it.."everyone not us."
It's consistent with the games that Vault-Tec was evil --- but not terribly competent. They have PLANS... but those plans fall apart. Also, Vault 15 wasn't supposed to survive. It was a experiment vault, filled with consumers who bought a place in the vault. The 'real' Vault Tec wouldn't see them as Vault Tec.
@@W0KeIzEvilI’ve noticed that some of the biggest assholes in the Fallout and Halo Fandoms are right wing. It keeps happening, idk why. Probably because you’re conditioned to see empathy as a weakness. If you listen to Developer Interviews behind the Show, you will learn that the idea to Nuke Shady Sands came from Johnathan Nolan and the Showrunners, not Todd Howard, whom was actually apprehensive about going through with this idea, but they convinced him. So no, Todd Howard doesn’t hate FNV, but you people sure as hell hate him, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he feels a little resentful towards FNV because you people keep accusing him of hating it. That’s basically how I feel about it.
@@richardarriaga6271 Did you once see anyone inside the vault have an apple? The only time we see one was done on purpose and it was Lucy as a kid in Shady Sands.
I first got suspicious about Hank when Lucy said they should return the core to Vault 4 because her dad would be horrified if she hurt others to save him. But that's exactly what he did with Lucy - he chose her over the vault dwellers during the raid. Combined with the "there's what people say they did, and what they actually did", it put some red flags up for me. I'd thought it was going to be a thing where Lucy had to realize the morals her dad actually has don't match the ones he taught her. Technically I was right, but I thought it was going to be something like that he had hurt Vault 32 to help his family or something, nothing like the level that it was. I haven't seen anybody talk about that line from Lucy yet, but I thought it was great writing and excellent foreshadowing.
I wouldn't say I suspected but by the going trend of every other tv serial and film over the last decade you could pretty much bank on the lead white guy being the misunderstood villian.
@@METALFREAK03 Literally both of the lead black women in the show were both evil asf as well this "white man bad" trope doesn't exactly work in this show
He doesn't get a lot of screen time but I did like his character a lot honestly. Blowing up Shady Sands just because it was proof that life could survive after the apocalypse without the involvement of Vault Tec. Wonder if he is going to do the same to Vegas XD
@@coinisinorbit Didn't matter. Vaults that were "experiments" were never meant to restore the wasteland. At best they were workers to be exploited. Only Vaults populated by Vault-tec staff and the Enclave bases were meant to actually restore the world.
And entire chain of event caused by an error on shipment that led to Vault 13 having to send out someone to get a spare water chip. And ironically, it was an actual error (Vault City’s manifest).
Its better since it proves nothing of the sort, his data was off As others have brought up.. Shady Sands and the NCR as awhole have Vault-Tec roots all over Makes the whole thing quite tragic even more.
Didn't matter. Vaults that were "experiments" were never meant to restore the wasteland. At best they were workers to be used. Only Vaults populated by Vault-tec staff and the Enclave bases were meant to actually restore the world.
Even terrible people can have a few good aspects to them. I loved how they did that with Hank. Some villains with a heart like this, it's like the good parts are tacked on or the bad parts amplified beyond reason just to justify fighting them. Hank, it actually feels believable and very much like a corporate leader.
As for redemption- to some extent, maybe. I'm reminded of a conversation between T'ealc and Tomin in Stargate SG1. I don't remember it precisely, but it was something like this that T'eal said "You and I can never atone for what we have done. But we must try anyways". That sort of a redemption could be interesting to see play out.
It's this whole "moral compass" idea in psychology. Humans don't actually have this within us. We have instinct and survival. Morals are ingrained in us by teachings. But if you need to survive, yet it is "immoral" through your teachings, then what are you going to do? Lay and die or fight anyway? Most, if not all humans, will do the latter. "desperate people do desperate things"
That last ep had me in tears. Lucy finding out the truth and realizing the ghoul that was sitting at the table was her mother broke my heart. What a plot twist and tbh I can't wait for the next season so we can find out what happened with The Ghoul's family
I do believe that Hank loves his daughter in some fashion but I don't think there's any redemption for him. He knew what Vault Tec was doing and went along with it and when he realized they were wrong he nuked Shady Sands. A person with any shred of morality would never nuke an entire city like that. Plus when his daughter finally shows up and realizes the truth he starts trying to justify his insane actions instead of thinking that hey maybe I was wrong and hey maybe I shouldn't have nuked an entire city because I was mad at my wife.
You can really tell that, like he said, the Creators favorite Fallout game is Fallout 3, as despite taking place in California, the Show draws inspiration from story events in Fallout 3 more than anything: A functioning Vault society, a prominent Vault Dweller with a Child having a mysterious past outside the Vault and being forced to leave, their child has to track them down, the Enclave is involved (although in the show they have a much smaller role), the Show expands on the “Vault Tek dropped the Bombs” theory which started with Fallout 3 after players noticed a symbol resembling Vault Tek on Megatons Bomb, the Brotherhood is after a piece of technology which will grant them supremacy in the region, the Great Game first mentioned in Point Lookout is elaborated…any else I missed?
@jbiehlable Bethesda didn’t write this show. Just advised for lore. The Showrunners had a favorite game and turned to it for inspiration it’s only fair.
The main point for me is that since Bethesda has always focused on the East Coast and since Black Isle/Obsidian are no longer involved to handle the West Coast, they've turned over control of the West Coast canon to the TV series.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS VIDEO!!!! I hadn't put together the famine/cover up yet- Brilliant! Also, what do you think about the ANGER Hank embodies when Rose chooses to leave and stay *with Moldover*? I find it fascinating. Like, Hank could have just taken the kids, he probably could have convinced Betty that total obliteration wasn't necessary. He likely would even have realized, with time, that Shady Sands was at least partly founded by Vault Dwellers. But the fact that HIS Rose would choose to stay - to abandon her children - when ultimately her purpose is to Be A Mother appears to be simply a bridge too far for him. (After all, they are Breeding Stock. Susan's treatment of Barry and Chet illustrate that well enough.) I'm so impressed with Kyle Mclaughlin's ability to communicate SO MUCH with so little performance time 🥰🥰🥰
Based on the way Betty talks about it, she wasn't on-board with Shady Sands' destruction. That was all purely Hank's idea. She seems haunted when she's cryptically dropping hints to Norm.
25:16 That's really just it. In Hank's eyes, Lucy ceased to be his daughter just like Rose had ceased to be his wife years ago. That's why he had no problem just abandoning her there with the Ghoul and jetting off.
Why I agree with you that Hank did not know if Moldaver would or would not kill the vault dwellers but he knew she was better than him at least at one point in her life. This could make saving his daughter a risk that would not result in the death of a vault dweller from 31. I will say that not killing them is smart , it changes how certain vault dwellers will see Hank. I would love to see if the vault rumor mill going flying cause I know a certain vault dweller will not keep quiet about Hank.
On the chalk board the arrow did not stop at the year 2277, but continued to the nuclear explosion image. 2277 was just when Shady Sands started it’s downfall, the NCR’s costly victory in defending Hoover Dam against the Legion likely was very much related. Also let’s not forget about Vault-Tec’s master, the Enclave (who is likely behind everything evil Vault-Tec did).
Still doesn't make sense. Every other event had a year attached to it. Suddenly people forgot how calendars work when a bomb dropped? They lost the ability to tell time?
I think you do Hank a lot of favors by saying he's radicalized. To me, his actions and motivations read as selfish, controlling and abusive. He must have control over what is his, he must have power. It lines up with the terrible things he does to shady sands, his wife, and his vault, and even allows the wiggle room he has shown his daughter so far: she comes from him, so she is an extention of him. I also don't see him being as charismatic as he comes off in the start. He looks like a good leader, of course he does. He and Buds buds have full control over whatever threats occur in the vault (which is how they all tend to 'vote 31,' as misfortune seems to strike in ways that allow someone from 31 to lead with confidence). But when something happens out of his control? He fails. Fails to read Muldaver and the raiders. Fails to convince his wife. Fails to sway Lucy. Buds buds are an absolute joke. A group of middle managers who believe they know best, when they are empty suits with puffed up titles. Vaults 32 and 33 are the accurate end result of their perfect management: a bunch of passive yes men who come up with ideas like 'what if we teach the raiders about Shakespeare.'
Once I saw this show come out, I just knew we were going to get more of your content! And I’m so glad this community is growing back. Used to watch your old vids- good to be back
I’d argue that being subject to radicalization has nothing to do with intelligence. Many very intelligent scientists were part of some very horrible groups throughout history. In universe, some super mutants are highly intelligent but were still radicalized by The Master. I’d say that Hank had a very high intelligence stat. I think the closest to wisdom that fallout gets to is perception, which I agree that he probably didn’t score too high on
That moment when you realize that changing the name of something was successful in changing someone's impression of that something. Executive Assistant is not some kind of high up management position... heck, it's not even middle management. It is what secretaries started calling themselves so that people wouldn't think of them as being... well, secretaries. And executive assistant is literally the assistant to an executive, or multiple of such. Bud's Buds were literally the gophers of the business world.
exec. assistants do actually tend to make decent money (80-120k in my experience), and it sometimes is a track to higher management. But, yeah, it's a glorified receptionist or secretary position in reality.
@@djx7134 They absolutely make decent money, and their jobs are important... anyone who has seen the time management skills of a VP or a Chief Officer knows that without assistants they would be screwed. Wasn't trying to put them down, just found the wordplay to be amusing.
What do I think of Hank McClean? Monster. Plain and simple. You don't just reverse radicalisation. Something like that is drilled into you over time. It would take a lot to de-radicalise someone. A process that takes TIME. Something that Vault-Tec had plenty of before the war. I just don't see Hank McClean as being redeemed at all. Leopards after all don't change their spots. No matter how hard they try.
I feel the real reason why Hank chose to save Lucy was his pride and vanity because he believed that she would go to save him. If she did it would heavily inflate his ego as his own flesh and blood who he also taught was the one who saved him. In addition her saving him works really well with the vault belief of trying to breed a group of very good resourceful people and that is has been successful
The end goals of eugenics are theoretically possible, but in the end it's just implausible. Even in a contained environment like 31-33, humans are too complex, and their interactions with external factors are correspondingly too complex, for such a relatively simplistic framework to direct. Even so, Lucy is a success, and Norm would be a success if VT valued independence, curiosity, and intelligence.
No I think Hank genuinely loves Lucy and that makes him a better written villain. He panicked when Moldaver started telling her the truth because he was ashamed. He doesn't care about other people's approval but he cares about Lucy's opinion of him. The idea that psychopaths can't feel love and affection for other people is simplistic and wrong.
@@droidmaker7932 dropping a nuke on thousands of people because you can't deal with your wife leaving you sounds pretty psychopathic dude... His speech to Lucy about "factions are the cause of conflict, so I just nuked all factions, problem solved!" was clearly meant to be the delusional ramblings of a man lying to himself.
@@AverageWagie if it’s lying to himself, why is it psychopathic? It’s just delusional and Hank was practically brainwashed by Vault Tec, their one of many hands to act in the open.
Oxhorn, this is your most well written profile so far. The others have been excellent. However, your exploration of radicalization via Hank and Vaultec is fantastic. Well done sir. 👏
Hank is what I’d call a _Techno-Fascist_ - meaning he was a corporate fascist. The main pillar of fascism is upmost loyalty to the state (Vault-Tec in this instance). He literally was so loyal to this 200 year old idea from an extinct company. Though he didn’t age, he’s smart enough to know the world around him did. He was just _that_ loyal to the company.
I'd put his Intelligence a bit higher. If he did destroy Shady Sands in the way that left that crater, then he probably tinkered with a Fusion Core or two to make that happen (Unless Shady Sands had a nuke in the basement I don't know about), and that would put his Science stat quite high.
Could be a fatman-style portable nuke. Nuclear weapons were all over the place in Fallout's world, and they were actually used, just not on the scale of the apocalypse. Now, in real life, maintaining nukes is extremely expensive, but nuclear science in Fallout world is more like magic. It works different somehow ...
@@Turamwdd In the real world, radiation doesn't actually stick around that long. The area would quickly become habitable, like within a year. In Fallout's world, though ... nukes are different there. Whatever it was, it left a crater the size of what I'd expect from a lower yield nuke. And the area remains highly irradiated.
@@senhowlerShould’ve honestly been the quote, as Fallout 4’s entire dilemma is the dispute between synths and human ideology. To which no leaders in the equation are swayed. War has changed to the point that it evolved from armies to nuclear bombs. War does change, it’s the people and societies behind them that don’t.
Can you imagine finding out that your whole life's work, all the sacrifices you made, all the terrible things you maybe done in the name of something greater was all BS? It's gotta break your brain.
Civilization did return to the wasteland and it _WAS_ thanks to Vault-Tec. The original people of Shady Sands were the people who had left Vault 15, and made a life for themselves after generations of living in that Vault-Tec Vault. Of course it didn't go smoothly. As part of the social experiment conducted by Vault-Tec, the vault population was ensured to be a mix of radically diverse ideologies in order to gain data on their interactions and potential failure over the 50 years the vault was planned to stay sealed. As the years went by, the conditions within the Vault deteriorated. Population control was not implemented properly and by 2097, the Vault was overcrowded, with correspondingly bad living conditions. Conflict was imminent, and in spring, the situation exploded. The dwellers that left the Vault would eventually form distinct communities. The most significant of these was the village of Shady Sands, created with Vault 15's GECK. The rest banded into raider tribes (the Khans, Jackals and Vipers). So, Hank destroyed a successful example of Vault-Tec civilizing the wastelands because it happened _earlier_ than his vault did it, and because _he_ wasn't the one responsible._ This shows the inherent flaw in management, (both in game and in the real world.) Management has to believe that they are always right, _especially_ if they are very, very wrong, because if they ever believed they weren't "always right" they wouldn't stay managers and the work they managed would become of a higher quality, hold a higher value, and not cause harm to either their employees, customers or the environment.
Dudes been making fallout videos since I was 11. I’m now nearly 20, getting a computer science degree to hopefully work on these games. You’re legend dude, keep it up.
I still think it is possible that we will see Moldaver again in the form of a clone. Moldaver did not strike me as someone who would put all her eggs in one basket, and she was Killed off too quickly for someone that the waisteland revered like a god. The fact that the residents of vault 4 practically worship her tells me she will make another appearance in the series. Like there are multiple copies of her. I think it is possible that a copy died at Shadysands and when she resurfaced the survivors thought of her as being god like. Anyway its just a theory of mine. I don't think she survived through cryo because she was against Vaultec. Cryo was a Vaultec technology.
BTW, your "Character Profile" videos are INCREDIBLE and I think they are poor golden-pieces for this TV show I hope Todd Howard watches all of them!.. He obviously knows you... You just search "Fallout" and its you... That's why he was so nervous at Filly (: Its just that 3% bias I mentioned in a first comment. But this format of videos are incredible and should be canon pieces for the TV show They show how you are really good at this. Cheers!!
I think the “Plague of 77” is less referring to when Hank destroyed Shady Sands but more when Rose left with Lucy and Norm and subsequently Hank and Betty left to go look for her, they likely spent years looking all over the Californian wasteland as they didn’t know she was in Shady Sands until they actually went there so possibly the reason that so many people starved wasn’t because there was an actual plague but because they were locked in their rooms and couldn’t leave and some people ran out of food as it’d be pretty hard to fake people starving when everyone knows everyone else.
Finding out what Hank did at the end broke my heart. He lied to his own daughter, thinking what he was doing was right but only in the name of Vault-Tec. Poor Rose 😢
Vault-Tec would see Shady Sands as a legitimate target. It was created using stolen Vault-Tec equipment with a Cold Fusion reactor, the G.E.C.K., it's the entire plot of Fallout 2.
Its bethesda writing and probaby sweet baby inc forced them to write this way ( not the show but lore ), they butchered new vegas and fallout 1 and 2 because it didnt fit their ideologies
@@SPECREY I don't see it. I'm 45, I played Fallout 1 in highschool and was completely addicted to Fallout 2 in college. The only new lore is that Shady Sands was nuked around 2282, the FNV House ending is probably canon and the MM or BoS F4 ending is canon.
@@jiffypoo5029 to be fair the BOS3 cut off from the main BOS. When a religion starts to break off into groups those groups either become better or get worst and more extreme.
Evil people dont see themselves as the villain but as a hero. They are the ends justify the means type people. They dont see their actions as wrong but as a way to see their goals be realized. Intelligence does not mean you can not be raticalized, not see danger, or something is off. Some of the most integent people are generally the first to be radicalized because someone gave them something. It takes wisdom to know when something is wrong, that you can be wrong, or that the system you believe is wrong. I know wisdom is not a stat in fallout, but if it was Hank's wisdom score, it would be a 2, maybe 3, hall he maybe so far gone it maybe a 1. However, his intelligence could be 7 to 10.
I personally Hope Hank gets a redemption arc… Whether that’s a possibility though, I have my doubts.. Despite what I hope? I do think Hank has more chance of being a villain in the end… I’m not too sure how It’d be possible for a character like his to change to that degree, so quickly. My hope is though? *That maybe, just maybe.* the love he has for his daughter sways him in the end.
I feel like Hank won't get anything. What he did was so brutal and horrific that i don't think a man should get a redemption for something so selfish. The ghoul however i feel will get a red dead redemption like ending. Dying after finding his family, possibly killing the final big bad of the show, and possibly saving Lucy while getting killed in the process. Showing how far his character got from his brutal ways during his time in filly. Fulfilling his words. Dying strong, ugly, and with dignity.
I kind of wonder if hank is going to new vegas just because he's just trying to leave NCR territory, or perhaps just heading to the east coast, or if there is something in the Mojave that he is looking for. Vault-tec didn't have a whole lot of important vaults in the wasteland that weren't failures or blocked off. I think you should really do a video on the end credits scene showing off new vegas, and what that might mean for the canon ending of new vegas. I think that might give us a little more information of what might happen next season.
I hope he meets Mr. and Mrs. Deathclaw in season 2. Also he is the perfect evil character for recent Fallout entries. Yeah not all of us liked NCR but you got to admit what happened to Shady Sands was evil.
I kinda like that my mags stick when I cant the rifle. When I'm training, I'm usually training for SHTF, in which case I would want to retain my mags in a dump pouch. Never know where/when you'll be able to get hands on more mags, and you can only carry so many extra mags in a backpack. My planned setup (just need a plate carrier,) is 6 30rd mags on my chest, 2 40rd mags on my belt, a 40rd mag in my rifle, and 5 40rd mags in my backpack. That's already a lot of weight, and not a whole lot of magazines.
In my opinion. He's neither good nor bad, just a necessary evil one. Just like every ruler in the history. One can be seen as a demon by the enemies, and a saint by his own people.
Hank is a zealot and will never allow anything or person interfere with the beliefs he has. He's not capable of doing any actions that doesn't align with his world view, even if it is to protect someone he has confused trying to control them with loving them.
Good analysis, the Fallout series on Amazon is storytelling at it's finest, and illuminates issues we are facing IRL. Thanks for adding your voice. As for Hank, it's the system that's evil - the perfect representation of pure unbridled capitalism: strive to monopolize and justify it after the fact. One could argue that individuals within the system could still be good - but there are always those who resist that system, so those who perpetuate it have no excuse. There is no such thing as plausible deniability.
I disagree, I think Hank's motivation to destroy Shady Sands was because Rose ran off with Moldavor, he even said "she stopped being your mother" when she left with the kids, and he shows no emotion toward feral ghoul Rose. Bud said 33 and 32 were just "breading stock" for his buds, so Hank was enraged by his breading stock leaving him. When Betty told Norm when "clever boys" get angry "you're lucky not to have seen where that can lead"; I don't think she was talking about the Great War, I think she was talking about what Hank did. Even though she later kills the raiders, I still got the sense she was hoping there was another way, but realized the raiders were exactly what Vault-Tec was concerned would be on the surface. Shady Sands was founded by the residents of Vault 15, so even if they weren't meant to be the ones to repopulate the surface, they were still, in a way, Vault-Tec. Hank also didn't target the other cities of the NCR or look for any other civilizations. I also find it hard to believe Hank and Bud had no idea what was happening on the surface in the more than a century since Shady Sands was founded, so according to Bud's plan they should have just waited for the NCR to die out on it's own.
That’s what makes me hate him more. If the reason that he nuked Shady Sands was because his wife didn’t love him anymore then he would’ve been a pitiful villain. He got butthurt that his wife left his abusive ass and instead of trying to learn from it he just nukes the place she’s staying at.
Yeah, the attack on Shady Sands seems personal to Hank, rather than his excuse of it being for VaultTec so they can "rebuild" humanity. Why stop with Shady Sands? Why would VaultTec not target all of their potential competitors if they had the firepower and element of surprise and anonymity? It makes me think that maybe Hank went further than VaultTec wanted, and showed their hand far too early for his own personal revenge after getting comfortable with his power of overseer. But, as Cooper and Moldaver have now shown him, he was never safe and I bet that the "higher ups" of VaultTec aren't going to be happy with him either, especially once he leads Lucy, Cooper, and possibly the BOS right to their doorstep.
Calling it now. Hank McLean is redeemed by the second last episode of season 2, but it’s not due to him being de-radicalised. I think there will be a situation where he has to choose between Vault-Tec, and ultimately he will decide to choose his family this time, unfortunately he dies in the process. I think the most likely end point will be a confrontation between Hank, Lucy, The Ghoul and Barb/Daughter. I think Barb/Daughter tries to kill Lucy, The Ghoul is unable to act due to his familial ties, and ultimately Hank ends up killing Barb/Daughter and The Ghoul kills Hank in revenge. Yeah, it’s cliche. But it would give Hank a solid redemption, it would end The Ghouls search for his family as well as adding potential tension to Lucy and The Ghouls friendship. It ties up multiple season 1 storyline’s while opening up potential new ones, which is exactly what you want from a season 2 finale.
I think Hank Maclean Is no more bad then Father is in Fallout 4, Or Elder Maxson. Moldaver strikes me more like Destemona in Fallout 4 and a little bit of Preston. And Cooper I love cooper he is my men a bit extreem but you got to love this cowboy. If I compare it a bit like Fallout 4, this would be my comparison.
When Hank is giving his speech at the wedding the other 2 guys vying for vault leadership were standing next to him on the podium giving the impression they were his assistants or advisors, which is likely why when he was gone they tried to claim leadership themselves leading to them and Betty all vying for power until the election happened. I don't think it was disorganized at all as they clearly had a system of elections in place to replace overseers. Great video, always love Ox's lore videos.
The claim wasn't that the system was disorganized. It was that the two idiots were "aimless". Which is true, but Betty was controlling things for her own benefit.
This is an interesting analysis, and definitely picks up on some interesting breadcrumbs that make for good solid inferences, but there is a ton of theory here that relies on the assumption that Muldaver's account is credible. With everything we have stitched together on Muldaver so far, that's a leap. More likely, the truth of what happened in Shady Sands is a bit more nuanced - and the apparent gap between the "fall" of Shady Sands and it being nuked plus the "Cult of Muldaver" linked to that cataclysm give us more questions than answers.
I don’t see any possible way they could even attempt a redemption arch after all that he is done. Maybe I’m wrong though, if so that would be truly interesting.
I have a theory that Betty is the one who dropped the bomb on Shady Sands. I think Hank was upset and told her she set the bomb to fire and he decided to go get his wife, she followed and when Lucy's mom tried to warn everyone Betty killed her and convinced Hank to go along with the lie.
I’m really interested to see who the show makes into the “face” of Vault Tec : the mastermind and leader of the company since that has not been addressed in the games. It’s possible that it’s just the government/enclave but maybe they’ll come up with something new.
The funny thing will be to learn in season 2 that Hank was right in blowing Shady Sands. For example, it could a place of some horrific cult (notice the strange pyramid in the video of the pre-blown Shady Sands) and the cult remnants we see in Season 1. From games we know that cults are not just crazies and trhere are entities beyond the veil (Interloper, Antlantis Alien Gods, Mothman, The Atom, locations straight from Lovecraft, the ghouls, etc.)
Great question to ask yourself: what is your ideology? Has it radicalized you into doing evil? We need to always step back and realize that, in face to face actuality, we have far more in common than we think. And 99% of people are good people at heart.
Hmmm… watched a friend go down this radicalized path during Covid quarantine. Followed his own “vault tec”. Thought he was and his new friends were too smart. Responded angrily to anyone against his world view or reality. Broke with anyone, now enemies, and would dehumanize and burn everything to the ground… WOW Oxhorn… this video about Hank from the tv show shouldn’t have hit so hard.
The master only got a handfull and even then he was needing anouther source of fev due to low supplies, relax just a tv show be glad its not on street fighter live action level
@alexshinra6722 okay but then the enclave went vault to vault too. I just really don't get why they did it in California. Like I get BOS is rooted there and Bethesda writers love BOS but other than that I really don't get it. Wouldn't ot be easier to base the show in Colorado which is relatively untouched lore wise or in the east coast where they themselves have already woven their own narrative and wouldn't be caught tripping on pre established lore?
@@Samsungor oh remmber whilw the writters pay homage to past fallout work, its only to not piss everyone off but they love to dismiss f1 and f2, the show is a good way to cliam/ rewrite things bethesda didnt have a say in.
Hank can redeem himself if he tells/shows The Ghoul where his family is...but why New Vegas? Are they in Vault 21? I've binged almost all of your Fallout videos, they've been not only helpful but also entertaining. Kudos to Bethesda for the heartbreaking and heartwarming stories in the games, well written
When I first heard the cast, I thought Kyle MacLachlan was going to be the bad guy. I was surprised to find he was actually a good guy...until Betty told Lucy that they buried Rose with her Pipboy! There is not enough room in a vault to bury hundreds of years worth of residents and they would have recycled them instead(composted). They would have recycled the Pipboys for the same reason. Hank has just spent the last 29 years believing that the destruction of Shady Sands was justified not losing any sleep over the murder of his wife, so in my opinion, any redemption arc would feel artificial.
He didn’t just kill his wife. He killed a nations capital. Thousands of humans, ghouls, super mutants, nightkin; all gone because of his ignorance. Men, women, children, elderly; all of them dead. The blood of thirty four thousand innocent people is on his hands and he still slept at night like nothing happened.
Dude definitely sticks to his guns. 😂 Also, what kind of psychopaths would leave Rose in that state? Bound, feral, and likely in indescribable pain. Psychopaths.
Usually the Ghoul(Cooper Howard) is calm and confident in any situation but when he sees Hank again in the final episode(asks about his family) you can see his hands shaking in rage. A great piece of acting and an awesome detail for the character.
Makes you wonder what happened to Janey since she was with him when the bombs fell. He distinctly says FAMILY not just WIFE so that implies that Janey survived somehow.
@@mattt233 I'm expecting a scene next season that takes place immediately after they rode off on the horse where a Vault-tec security force takes Janey from him and leaves him to die.
@mattt233 maybe they're brains in jars
@@mattt233could be a ghoul kid then maybe?
Ghoul is fallout 4 protag, pre war dude searching for his kid
Actually the NCR (Shady Sands) is founded by people who originated from Vault 15, so Hank nuked decedents of a vault, which he may not have known.
Even if he did, it's still fair in "the Great Game".
Those vault 15 former residents were acting outside of Vault-Tec’s orders for their vault. Still Hank may not have known. To answer another commenter, if Bethesda truly disliked the NCR, they wouldn’t have put the show on the west coast period. This is because the NCR was literally shown as the good guys (even though they were shown as aggressive militarist territory expenders in New Vegas), throughout the entire show. Bethesda never actually anything negative about the NCR in any projects they actually helmed. Fallout New Vegas had plenty of clues to the NCR’s eventual decline, a game that was written by the original Fallout writers (this being during the aftermath of the second Iraq war is likely no coincidence once so ever).
Inter department conflict is encuraged.
But they aren't really "decedents". We don't know for certain how many from Vault 15 started Shady Sands in 2142 but we know it became 35,000 people (in game) before its eventual destruction (show). around 120 years is not enough time for the Vault Dwellers to reproduce that much. They were around a hundred at most. Meaning yes a bunch of the people there were surface dwellers and therefore "fair game".
Even with multiple baby booms a couple hundred becomes a few thousands. Sprinkle ontop the hazards of the wasteland and their numbers are still struggling. Shady Sands wasn't exactly Vault-Tec certified lol.
Even if he knows, Shady Sand was founded WITH surface dwellers. How do you deal with "impurities"? Cleansed with fire.
Hank Maclean: The whole world must learn our peaceful ways by force
Lmao reminded me of Anakin showing how peaceful Jedi are by lighting a second saber lmao 😂
Of course he's the OG Paul Atreides from the 80's
Oh just a perfect encapsulation of how people are just people.
Sounds like some religions...
@@RobertBrownieJror some political beliefs, cold war etc. So yeah mindset and culture more than anything imo.
Remember, Betty stated they "buried" their mom. But when they are taking the dead when they are cleaning up, it's to the compost room... If Rose had "died in the plague" they would have sent her body to be composted, not buried.
Leadership definitely follows the same rules as everybody else. There is no reason the overseer could have set aside a special burial site for his wife. Definitely nothing an overseer would do.
I think they just use the term bury to maintain a sense of normalcy.
I assume they use "bury" to mean "compost", like we use "passed" to mean "dead". Just a sugar coated way to avoid the reality of the situation
@@GaMeRfReAkLIVE I could get that if they didn't bury the pipboy with her. This gives the illusion it's a proper 6 foot dug grave IMHO.
I think it’s possible she’s still alive. 😮
@@scmanley4229who? what?
he’s the complete opposite of James in Fallout 3, imagine going out of the vault and find out that your dad blew up Megaton
Damn it! That was what I was gonna observe. XD
I'd be proud of my dad🎉
There were some Reddit post where someone was asking who's the worse father like that isn't clear it's Hank
I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed. Seriously though can this series please move on from Vault Dwellers and plots involving their parents or children?
@@RAAM855The entire fallout franchise plot is to find something or someone while in the process save the wasteland and the people
Chronological order
Fallout 76: Find overseer
Fallout 1: Find water chip
Fallout 2: Find G.E.C.K
Fallout 3: Find dad
Fallout New Vegas: Find platinum chip/Benny
Fallout 4: Find son
Fallout TV show: Find dad,Find Head,Find ex-wife and daughter
I love how Lucy and Coop ended up together at the end of the season as traveling companions, cause really Coop taught Lucy what the waste land is all about in the short time they were together, and I think Lucy showed him that maybe there is still good in the waste land.
Also Cooper perfectly understands the sense of betrayal and devastation that comes when finding your loved one did, or is perfectly ok with doing, something terrible.
The song choice during that end scene is also important.
In particular "My echo... my shadow... and me"
Me, in this context, is obviously the ghoul. The shadow, dogmeat/CX-404, because that's what a good dog does. Leaving Lucy, as the ghoul's Echo, a distorted voice of his past self.
You could make an argument that lucy is the me, the ghoul her echo. but dogmeat has more of a connection to the ghoul than it does to her, thus invalidating the shadow.
@@Destroyer_V0 I was thinking that very thing about the song and the ending
@rosabellavitaalvarez-calde5836 yes he does and being alive for over 200 hundred years, he's basically a walking history book of the waste land who I believe is going to tell and teach Lucy everything about Vault techs past to present, Lucy may become the new Moldaver in the end to fight for what her mom thought was right, I guess we will see next season.
Dont forget she can be leverage for Cooper when they catch up with Hank
If there's a redemption arc, it's for the Ghoul. I just get the feeling that's what they're leaning towards, especially with the old Mexican eulogy: "Feo, fuerte y formal'. Ugly, strong, and dignified.
mmhmm. The ghoul still has the framework of a moral compass. Tarnished by age, sure. But it's still there. He ain't going to kill someone who isn't a threat to him. One I think Cx-404/dogmeat will help, heh, dig up, based on the prewar scenes with howard's dog Roosevelt.
@Destroyer_V0 dont forget lucy. He might start looking at her as a daughter. She cant replace his daughter but she can fill the void much like Dogmeat cant fill the void for his dog but he makes it work
@@GamerMarine89 Oh yeah. I said it in another comment, but the choice of music at the end of the season was kinda a thing.
Specifically "My echo, my shadow, and me"
Me being the ghoul, the shadow being dogmeat. And the echo, being lucy.
I do think that Hank loves his daughter more than Vault Tec considering he was going to let Steph die to save Lucy which would’ve cost VT an entire generation’s Overseer.
Every time I see that guy get his gashed open face dunked into pickle juice, I cant help but think how much that would sting, holy moly
@@coinisinorbit If you look at 2:24 you can see a bunch of pickles floating
So unless they are Pickle-bobbing at a wedding 🤷
But more than likely its a bunch of vinegar, salt and/or pickling spices
The actor for Hank actually said how much he smelled like pickles after that.
@@frostpyr0 That would still hurt a lot. Imagine getting pickle juice in your eyes or nose.
@@twistedyogert Oh ya, even with no wounds it would suck.
But I imagine this would be like when you got a covid test, and you felt it in the back of your nose where you didnt even know you *could* feel.
Itd be like that but stinging INSIDE your face 😨
right?? i flinched so hard when i realized that he was dunking him in pickle juice
Notice how Hank kills Monty....whacks him on the head with a shovel, then shoves Montys face (with a large open wound) into a pickle barrel ensuring the Raider suffered as he drowned. You know Hank had killed before. Especially when compared to when Lucy kills her first ghoul in the Super Duper Mart.
yes, I immediately noticed he was a ruthless killer. Absolutely no hesitation to beat and drown a man. Obviously it wasn't his first rodeo.
The fact that he seemed so comfortable in power armor at the end indicated military experience as well.
I didn't think about it when I watched it the first time, but I saw a reaction video where one guy said "Hank was a gangster! Did you see how easily he did that? He's done this before." I realized that, yes, this was lowkey a hint because you would definitely have to get used to killing people while being out in the wasteland.
People acting like Monty didn't have it coming.... He almost killed that man's daughter
@@WarLord645 sure, he did have it coming. But the way Hank purposely finished him in a painful and humiliating way, rather than just use the shovel or take him prisoner, strongly indicates that Hank is not just your usual protective dad. He went the extra mile there. Plus, no hesitation to take a life. Normal inexperienced people will always have reservations.
@WarLord645 he definitely did. But Hank could have ran and hid in his office like a lot of Overseers tend to do when things go wrong in the vaults. Or he could have just made sure Monty was knocked out so he could be imprisoned. Hank was ready to F*ck someone up in a way the rest of the vault dwellers weren't.
Note that Mr. House is the only one who doesn't dismiss surface dwellers, with his "Rats in a cage" quip.
Exactly. He says they'll just eat your survivors, haha because they'll have superior survival and fighting skills.
House was the only one not pitching his own vaults, too. You get the feeling that he's more there to see what his competitors are doing, not because he's buying what Vault Tec was selling.
@@atomictao Sure. He already reached the conclusion the world would end. The meeting just gave Mr. House the confirmation he needed.
@@atomictao I wonder if he set up Vault 21 though? Knowing that he could rig things to take over when needed.
@@senhowlerI think he did and I suspect the chamber where his body is held is held in a section of the vault which is why he started filling the vault with concrete eliminating one of the entry points to his real body leaving only one.
Hank: THE WORLD MUST BE MANAGED BY VAULT-TEC!
Also Hank: *Nukes a city founded by Vault Dwellers using Vault-Tec technology that Vault-Tec provided them with.*
Edit: What in God's name is this thread?
He had no idea. Doubt he'd care either tho.
It makes sense, remember each vault is in essence striving to be the one whos ideals and people repopulate, if they were regular surface dweller survivors or vault tec from a diff vault. Same thing remember how Bud put it.."everyone not us."
It's consistent with the games that Vault-Tec was evil --- but not terribly competent. They have PLANS... but those plans fall apart.
Also, Vault 15 wasn't supposed to survive. It was a experiment vault, filled with consumers who bought a place in the vault. The 'real' Vault Tec wouldn't see them as Vault Tec.
Deacon: : "But when you give big power to small men, sometimes you'll pay for it."
Hank is a great example of this.
@@W0KeIzEvilI’ve noticed that some of the biggest assholes in the Fallout and Halo Fandoms are right wing. It keeps happening, idk why. Probably because you’re conditioned to see empathy as a weakness.
If you listen to Developer Interviews behind the Show, you will learn that the idea to Nuke Shady Sands came from Johnathan Nolan and the Showrunners, not Todd Howard, whom was actually apprehensive about going through with this idea, but they convinced him.
So no, Todd Howard doesn’t hate FNV, but you people sure as hell hate him, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he feels a little resentful towards FNV because you people keep accusing him of hating it. That’s basically how I feel about it.
Oh yeah. They didn't have apples in Vault 33. But young Lucy was holding an apple
Yes and its also why they preferred Jello cake over apple pie, the overseers told them they did because they could not even make apple pie.
Floppa provides
@@janetd5121They ran out of Dandy Boy Apples?
@@richardarriaga6271 Did you once see anyone inside the vault have an apple? The only time we see one was done on purpose and it was Lucy as a kid in Shady Sands.
@@janetd5121 But you could still make a pie from processed apples. Those things are almost as common as Fancy Lads snack cakes.
I first got suspicious about Hank when Lucy said they should return the core to Vault 4 because her dad would be horrified if she hurt others to save him. But that's exactly what he did with Lucy - he chose her over the vault dwellers during the raid. Combined with the "there's what people say they did, and what they actually did", it put some red flags up for me. I'd thought it was going to be a thing where Lucy had to realize the morals her dad actually has don't match the ones he taught her. Technically I was right, but I thought it was going to be something like that he had hurt Vault 32 to help his family or something, nothing like the level that it was. I haven't seen anybody talk about that line from Lucy yet, but I thought it was great writing and excellent foreshadowing.
You have high perception, I didn’t notice that! I knew something was off about him but didn’t pick up on that detail
I thought I was the only one who suspected Hank.
I wouldn't say I suspected but by the going trend of every other tv serial and film over the last decade you could pretty much bank on the lead white guy being the misunderstood villian.
@@METALFREAK03 Literally both of the lead black women in the show were both evil asf as well this "white man bad" trope doesn't exactly work in this show
@@ternative yet hank maclean is still considered bad.
He doesn't get a lot of screen time but I did like his character a lot honestly. Blowing up Shady Sands just because it was proof that life could survive after the apocalypse without the involvement of Vault Tec. Wonder if he is going to do the same to Vegas XD
@@coinisinorbit Didn't matter. Vaults that were "experiments" were never meant to restore the wasteland. At best they were workers to be exploited. Only Vaults populated by Vault-tec staff and the Enclave bases were meant to actually restore the world.
And entire chain of event caused by an error on shipment that led to Vault 13 having to send out someone to get a spare water chip.
And ironically, it was an actual error (Vault City’s manifest).
Its better since it proves nothing of the sort, his data was off
As others have brought up..
Shady Sands and the NCR as awhole have Vault-Tec roots all over
Makes the whole thing quite tragic even more.
Didn't matter. Vaults that were "experiments" were never meant to restore the wasteland. At best they were workers to be used. Only Vaults populated by Vault-tec staff and the Enclave bases were meant to actually restore the world.
@@coinisinorbit Shady Sands was founded by a vault where the residents were experiments, not by a good vault.
Even terrible people can have a few good aspects to them. I loved how they did that with Hank. Some villains with a heart like this, it's like the good parts are tacked on or the bad parts amplified beyond reason just to justify fighting them. Hank, it actually feels believable and very much like a corporate leader.
As for redemption- to some extent, maybe. I'm reminded of a conversation between T'ealc and Tomin in Stargate SG1. I don't remember it precisely, but it was something like this that T'eal said "You and I can never atone for what we have done. But we must try anyways". That sort of a redemption could be interesting to see play out.
No one whom is bad thinks they are bad, though. They always think they are "doing the right thing".
Just ask Ted.
It's this whole "moral compass" idea in psychology. Humans don't actually have this within us.
We have instinct and survival. Morals are ingrained in us by teachings.
But if you need to survive, yet it is "immoral" through your teachings, then what are you going to do? Lay and die or fight anyway? Most, if not all humans, will do the latter.
"desperate people do desperate things"
I think it's just narcissism. Hank wants to feel he's the good guy, but will kill anyone who conflicts with his vision.
That last ep had me in tears. Lucy finding out the truth and realizing the ghoul that was sitting at the table was her mother broke my heart. What a plot twist and tbh I can't wait for the next season so we can find out what happened with The Ghoul's family
I do believe that Hank loves his daughter in some fashion but I don't think there's any redemption for him. He knew what Vault Tec was doing and went along with it and when he realized they were wrong he nuked Shady Sands. A person with any shred of morality would never nuke an entire city like that. Plus when his daughter finally shows up and realizes the truth he starts trying to justify his insane actions instead of thinking that hey maybe I was wrong and hey maybe I shouldn't have nuked an entire city because I was mad at my wife.
He "loves" her the way I love my car or my phone.
You can really tell that, like he said, the Creators favorite Fallout game is Fallout 3, as despite taking place in California, the Show draws inspiration from story events in Fallout 3 more than anything: A functioning Vault society, a prominent Vault Dweller with a Child having a mysterious past outside the Vault and being forced to leave, their child has to track them down, the Enclave is involved (although in the show they have a much smaller role), the Show expands on the “Vault Tek dropped the Bombs” theory which started with Fallout 3 after players noticed a symbol resembling Vault Tek on Megatons Bomb, the Brotherhood is after a piece of technology which will grant them supremacy in the region, the Great Game first mentioned in Point Lookout is elaborated…any else I missed?
@jbiehlable Bethesda didn’t write this show. Just advised for lore. The Showrunners had a favorite game and turned to it for inspiration it’s only fair.
soo thats why writing suck and tries to kill original lore and new vegas
@@jakespacepiratee3740 still sucks doesnt change a fact
@@SPECREY New Vegas is a moderately modded Fallout 3.
The main point for me is that since Bethesda has always focused on the East Coast and since Black Isle/Obsidian are no longer involved to handle the West Coast, they've turned over control of the West Coast canon to the TV series.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS VIDEO!!!! I hadn't put together the famine/cover up yet- Brilliant!
Also, what do you think about the ANGER Hank embodies when Rose chooses to leave and stay *with Moldover*? I find it fascinating. Like, Hank could have just taken the kids, he probably could have convinced Betty that total obliteration wasn't necessary. He likely would even have realized, with time, that Shady Sands was at least partly founded by Vault Dwellers. But the fact that HIS Rose would choose to stay - to abandon her children - when ultimately her purpose is to Be A Mother appears to be simply a bridge too far for him.
(After all, they are Breeding Stock. Susan's treatment of Barry and Chet illustrate that well enough.)
I'm so impressed with Kyle Mclaughlin's ability to communicate SO MUCH with so little performance time 🥰🥰🥰
Based on the way Betty talks about it, she wasn't on-board with Shady Sands' destruction. That was all purely Hank's idea. She seems haunted when she's cryptically dropping hints to Norm.
25:16 That's really just it. In Hank's eyes, Lucy ceased to be his daughter just like Rose had ceased to be his wife years ago. That's why he had no problem just abandoning her there with the Ghoul and jetting off.
Why I agree with you that Hank did not know if Moldaver would or would not kill the vault dwellers but he knew she was better than him at least at one point in her life. This could make saving his daughter a risk that would not result in the death of a vault dweller from 31. I will say that not killing them is smart , it changes how certain vault dwellers will see Hank. I would love to see if the vault rumor mill going flying cause I know a certain vault dweller will not keep quiet about Hank.
On the chalk board the arrow did not stop at the year 2277, but continued to the nuclear explosion image. 2277 was just when Shady Sands started it’s downfall, the NCR’s costly victory in defending Hoover Dam against the Legion likely was very much related. Also let’s not forget about Vault-Tec’s master, the Enclave (who is likely behind everything evil Vault-Tec did).
Still doesn't make sense. Every other event had a year attached to it. Suddenly people forgot how calendars work when a bomb dropped? They lost the ability to tell time?
I don't play the game but I loved this series. This made me understand Hank more, and I'm so excited to see what happens in the next season!
The Mailman's coming
I think you do Hank a lot of favors by saying he's radicalized. To me, his actions and motivations read as selfish, controlling and abusive. He must have control over what is his, he must have power. It lines up with the terrible things he does to shady sands, his wife, and his vault, and even allows the wiggle room he has shown his daughter so far: she comes from him, so she is an extention of him.
I also don't see him being as charismatic as he comes off in the start. He looks like a good leader, of course he does. He and Buds buds have full control over whatever threats occur in the vault (which is how they all tend to 'vote 31,' as misfortune seems to strike in ways that allow someone from 31 to lead with confidence). But when something happens out of his control? He fails. Fails to read Muldaver and the raiders. Fails to convince his wife. Fails to sway Lucy.
Buds buds are an absolute joke. A group of middle managers who believe they know best, when they are empty suits with puffed up titles. Vaults 32 and 33 are the accurate end result of their perfect management: a bunch of passive yes men who come up with ideas like 'what if we teach the raiders about Shakespeare.'
Theres no redemption arc for hank… he went to new Vegas for a reason and hes gunna come back to raise hell imo
Seeing this pop up on youtube just made my weekend a whole lot better. TY
Once I saw this show come out, I just knew we were going to get more of your content! And I’m so glad this community is growing back. Used to watch your old vids- good to be back
I’d argue that being subject to radicalization has nothing to do with intelligence. Many very intelligent scientists were part of some very horrible groups throughout history. In universe, some super mutants are highly intelligent but were still radicalized by The Master. I’d say that Hank had a very high intelligence stat. I think the closest to wisdom that fallout gets to is perception, which I agree that he probably didn’t score too high on
That moment when you realize that changing the name of something was successful in changing someone's impression of that something. Executive Assistant is not some kind of high up management position... heck, it's not even middle management. It is what secretaries started calling themselves so that people wouldn't think of them as being... well, secretaries. And executive assistant is literally the assistant to an executive, or multiple of such. Bud's Buds were literally the gophers of the business world.
exec. assistants do actually tend to make decent money (80-120k in my experience), and it sometimes is a track to higher management. But, yeah, it's a glorified receptionist or secretary position in reality.
@@djx7134 They absolutely make decent money, and their jobs are important... anyone who has seen the time management skills of a VP or a Chief Officer knows that without assistants they would be screwed. Wasn't trying to put them down, just found the wordplay to be amusing.
The executive assistants know the inner operations of an organization in ways that many of the actual executives may not.
What do I think of Hank McClean? Monster. Plain and simple. You don't just reverse radicalisation. Something like that is drilled into you over time. It would take a lot to de-radicalise someone. A process that takes TIME. Something that Vault-Tec had plenty of before the war. I just don't see Hank McClean as being redeemed at all. Leopards after all don't change their spots. No matter how hard they try.
Clearly not redeemed. He still thought it was the right call even in the final few scenes.
I feel the real reason why Hank chose to save Lucy was his pride and vanity because he believed that she would go to save him. If she did it would heavily inflate his ego as his own flesh and blood who he also taught was the one who saved him. In addition her saving him works really well with the vault belief of trying to breed a group of very good resourceful people and that is has been successful
The end goals of eugenics are theoretically possible, but in the end it's just implausible. Even in a contained environment like 31-33, humans are too complex, and their interactions with external factors are correspondingly too complex, for such a relatively simplistic framework to direct.
Even so, Lucy is a success, and Norm would be a success if VT valued independence, curiosity, and intelligence.
No I think Hank genuinely loves Lucy and that makes him a better written villain. He panicked when Moldaver started telling her the truth because he was ashamed. He doesn't care about other people's approval but he cares about Lucy's opinion of him. The idea that psychopaths can't feel love and affection for other people is simplistic and wrong.
@@AverageWagieHank isn’t a psychopath, just a villain.
@@droidmaker7932 dropping a nuke on thousands of people because you can't deal with your wife leaving you sounds pretty psychopathic dude... His speech to Lucy about "factions are the cause of conflict, so I just nuked all factions, problem solved!" was clearly meant to be the delusional ramblings of a man lying to himself.
@@AverageWagie if it’s lying to himself, why is it psychopathic? It’s just delusional and Hank was practically brainwashed by Vault Tec, their one of many hands to act in the open.
Oxhorn, this is your most well written profile so far. The others have been excellent. However, your exploration of radicalization via Hank and Vaultec is fantastic. Well done sir. 👏
Hank is what I’d call a _Techno-Fascist_ - meaning he was a corporate fascist. The main pillar of fascism is upmost loyalty to the state (Vault-Tec in this instance). He literally was so loyal to this 200 year old idea from an extinct company. Though he didn’t age, he’s smart enough to know the world around him did. He was just _that_ loyal to the company.
I'd put his Intelligence a bit higher. If he did destroy Shady Sands in the way that left that crater, then he probably tinkered with a Fusion Core or two to make that happen (Unless Shady Sands had a nuke in the basement I don't know about), and that would put his Science stat quite high.
Could be a fatman-style portable nuke. Nuclear weapons were all over the place in Fallout's world, and they were actually used, just not on the scale of the apocalypse. Now, in real life, maintaining nukes is extremely expensive, but nuclear science in Fallout world is more like magic. It works different somehow ...
It couldn't have been a nuke though. Not enough years had gone by for people to show up there without suits on.
@@Turamwdd In the real world, radiation doesn't actually stick around that long. The area would quickly become habitable, like within a year.
In Fallout's world, though ... nukes are different there.
Whatever it was, it left a crater the size of what I'd expect from a lower yield nuke. And the area remains highly irradiated.
@@djx7134 Fatman like the ones we see in game? Hell no. Davey crocket or some other weapon? Maybe.
Hank Maclean, living proof that the pre-war world was not a kinder place. If it was, then why is the world a wasteland?
Human Beings just suck sometimes.
@@Tempus0ptic Humans....Humans never change.
@@senhowlerShould’ve honestly been the quote, as Fallout 4’s entire dilemma is the dispute between synths and human ideology. To which no leaders in the equation are swayed.
War has changed to the point that it evolved from armies to nuclear bombs. War does change, it’s the people and societies behind them that don’t.
Can you imagine finding out that your whole life's work, all the sacrifices you made, all the terrible things you maybe done in the name of something greater was all BS? It's gotta break your brain.
Civilization did return to the wasteland and it _WAS_ thanks to Vault-Tec. The original people of Shady Sands were the people who had left Vault 15, and made a life for themselves after generations of living in that Vault-Tec Vault. Of course it didn't go smoothly. As part of the social experiment conducted by Vault-Tec, the vault population was ensured to be a mix of radically diverse ideologies in order to gain data on their interactions and potential failure over the 50 years the vault was planned to stay sealed.
As the years went by, the conditions within the Vault deteriorated. Population control was not implemented properly and by 2097, the Vault was overcrowded, with correspondingly bad living conditions. Conflict was imminent, and in spring, the situation exploded.
The dwellers that left the Vault would eventually form distinct communities. The most significant of these was the village of Shady Sands, created with Vault 15's GECK. The rest banded into raider tribes (the Khans, Jackals and Vipers). So, Hank destroyed a successful example of Vault-Tec civilizing the wastelands because it happened _earlier_ than his vault did it, and because _he_ wasn't the one responsible._
This shows the inherent flaw in management, (both in game and in the real world.) Management has to believe that they are always right, _especially_ if they are very, very wrong, because if they ever believed they weren't "always right" they wouldn't stay managers and the work they managed would become of a higher quality, hold a higher value, and not cause harm to either their employees, customers or the environment.
Dudes been making fallout videos since I was 11. I’m now nearly 20, getting a computer science degree to hopefully work on these games. You’re legend dude, keep it up.
I still think it is possible that we will see Moldaver again in the form of a clone. Moldaver did not strike me as someone who would put all her eggs in one basket, and she was Killed off too quickly for someone that the waisteland revered like a god. The fact that the residents of vault 4 practically worship her tells me she will make another appearance in the series. Like there are multiple copies of her. I think it is possible that a copy died at Shadysands and when she resurfaced the survivors thought of her as being god like. Anyway its just a theory of mine. I don't think she survived through cryo because she was against Vaultec. Cryo was a Vaultec technology.
so as cloning... remember the gary vault ?!!!
Vault Tec's experience with cloning is not good. I am afraid we just lost the real Moldaver
Thank you for making these videos its really helped me understand bits about the show that seemed off or out of character
BTW, your "Character Profile" videos are INCREDIBLE and I think they are poor golden-pieces for this TV show
I hope Todd Howard watches all of them!.. He obviously knows you... You just search "Fallout" and its you... That's why he was so nervous at Filly (:
Its just that 3% bias I mentioned in a first comment. But this format of videos are incredible and should be canon pieces for the TV show
They show how you are really good at this. Cheers!!
Great Video my guy! Cooper Howard video when?
Have a great weekend everyone!
You too!
You too
You too! 💪🏾
Why yes mate u too
You too. Be safe with them Florida floods.
I think the “Plague of 77” is less referring to when Hank destroyed Shady Sands but more when Rose left with Lucy and Norm and subsequently Hank and Betty left to go look for her, they likely spent years looking all over the Californian wasteland as they didn’t know she was in Shady Sands until they actually went there so possibly the reason that so many people starved wasn’t because there was an actual plague but because they were locked in their rooms and couldn’t leave and some people ran out of food as it’d be pretty hard to fake people starving when everyone knows everyone else.
And just makes Hank more of a monster. He was willing to let a bunch of his people die to hide his trip to the surface.
Finding out what Hank did at the end broke my heart. He lied to his own daughter, thinking what he was doing was right but only in the name of Vault-Tec. Poor Rose 😢
20:14 Damn! Ox spitting the damn truth on what's going on the world right now.
Vault-Tec would see Shady Sands as a legitimate target. It was created using stolen Vault-Tec equipment with a Cold Fusion reactor, the G.E.C.K., it's the entire plot of Fallout 2.
Its bethesda writing and probaby sweet baby inc forced them to write this way ( not the show but lore ), they butchered new vegas and fallout 1 and 2 because it didnt fit their ideologies
@@SPECREY I don't see it. I'm 45, I played Fallout 1 in highschool and was completely addicted to Fallout 2 in college. The only new lore is that Shady Sands was nuked around 2282, the FNV House ending is probably canon and the MM or BoS F4 ending is canon.
@@SPECREY BoS being a Tech-Cult heavy on the religious ritual and brutality takes the BoS back to F1 and F2. If anything, they are erasing the F3 BoS.
@@jiffypoo5029 to be fair the BOS3 cut off from the main BOS. When a religion starts to break off into groups those groups either become better or get worst and more extreme.
@@SPECREY Sweet baby inc killed my wife and children and dog too. They're so bad and totally not a made up problem by internet weirdos.
Evil people dont see themselves as the villain but as a hero. They are the ends justify the means type people. They dont see their actions as wrong but as a way to see their goals be realized.
Intelligence does not mean you can not be raticalized, not see danger, or something is off. Some of the most integent people are generally the first to be radicalized because someone gave them something. It takes wisdom to know when something is wrong, that you can be wrong, or that the system you believe is wrong. I know wisdom is not a stat in fallout, but if it was Hank's wisdom score, it would be a 2, maybe 3, hall he maybe so far gone it maybe a 1. However, his intelligence could be 7 to 10.
Watching this makes me realise how much your voice reminds me of Tale Foundry. Quite pleasant to listen to while working
I personally Hope Hank gets a redemption arc…
Whether that’s a possibility though, I have my doubts..
Despite what I hope? I do think Hank has more chance of being a villain in the end… I’m not too sure how It’d be possible for a character like his to change to that degree, so quickly.
My hope is though?
*That maybe, just maybe.* the love he has for his daughter sways him in the end.
I feel like Hank won't get anything. What he did was so brutal and horrific that i don't think a man should get a redemption for something so selfish.
The ghoul however i feel will get a red dead redemption like ending. Dying after finding his family, possibly killing the final big bad of the show, and possibly saving Lucy while getting killed in the process. Showing how far his character got from his brutal ways during his time in filly. Fulfilling his words. Dying strong, ugly, and with dignity.
I kind of wonder if hank is going to new vegas just because he's just trying to leave NCR territory, or perhaps just heading to the east coast, or if there is something in the Mojave that he is looking for. Vault-tec didn't have a whole lot of important vaults in the wasteland that weren't failures or blocked off.
I think you should really do a video on the end credits scene showing off new vegas, and what that might mean for the canon ending of new vegas. I think that might give us a little more information of what might happen next season.
Oh Ox I so love watching your videos. Your soothing voice. Just great brother. Keep on keep on
I hope he meets Mr. and Mrs. Deathclaw in season 2. Also he is the perfect evil character for recent Fallout entries. Yeah not all of us liked NCR but you got to admit what happened to Shady Sands was evil.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Hank doubled down in season two and joined the enclave
This wasnt the Character profile i was expecting yet but it was very well done i enjoyed every minute of it
Damn, how did Dale Cooper become an overseer?
there's no redeeming Hank, he is gonna die eventually
Hawk time oh boy was dreading this but also excited lol
I kind of see Hank as a Post-Game player character from an Evil Playthrough
oxhorn should be a teacher the way he speaks i feel like im learning
I kinda like that my mags stick when I cant the rifle. When I'm training, I'm usually training for SHTF, in which case I would want to retain my mags in a dump pouch.
Never know where/when you'll be able to get hands on more mags, and you can only carry so many extra mags in a backpack. My planned setup (just need a plate carrier,) is 6 30rd mags on my chest, 2 40rd mags on my belt, a 40rd mag in my rifle, and 5 40rd mags in my backpack. That's already a lot of weight, and not a whole lot of magazines.
Let's not forget that the NCR had to deal with the enclave too. They had 1 bad hand after another dealt but they did try.
In my opinion. He's neither good nor bad, just a necessary evil one. Just like every ruler in the history. One can be seen as a demon by the enemies, and a saint by his own people.
Hank is a zealot and will never allow anything or person interfere with the beliefs he has. He's not capable of doing any actions that doesn't align with his world view, even if it is to protect someone he has confused trying to control them with loving them.
Been trying to find this background music! Can you tell me the name/artist at around 25:50 please!
Sounds like Tread Carefully from Fallout 4, or Beware the Wrath of Caesar from New Vegas.
nah bro won't have a redemption arch. that bro will be the active main villain in season 2
men don't reflect themselves in pain. especially not radicalized men. he will blame everything else for the loss he suffered.
Good analysis, the Fallout series on Amazon is storytelling at it's finest, and illuminates issues we are facing IRL. Thanks for adding your voice.
As for Hank, it's the system that's evil - the perfect representation of pure unbridled capitalism: strive to monopolize and justify it after the fact.
One could argue that individuals within the system could still be good - but there are always those who resist that system, so those who perpetuate it have no excuse. There is no such thing as plausible deniability.
I disagree, I think Hank's motivation to destroy Shady Sands was because Rose ran off with Moldavor, he even said "she stopped being your mother" when she left with the kids, and he shows no emotion toward feral ghoul Rose. Bud said 33 and 32 were just "breading stock" for his buds, so Hank was enraged by his breading stock leaving him. When Betty told Norm when "clever boys" get angry "you're lucky not to have seen where that can lead"; I don't think she was talking about the Great War, I think she was talking about what Hank did. Even though she later kills the raiders, I still got the sense she was hoping there was another way, but realized the raiders were exactly what Vault-Tec was concerned would be on the surface.
Shady Sands was founded by the residents of Vault 15, so even if they weren't meant to be the ones to repopulate the surface, they were still, in a way, Vault-Tec. Hank also didn't target the other cities of the NCR or look for any other civilizations. I also find it hard to believe Hank and Bud had no idea what was happening on the surface in the more than a century since Shady Sands was founded, so according to Bud's plan they should have just waited for the NCR to die out on it's own.
That’s what makes me hate him more. If the reason that he nuked Shady Sands was because his wife didn’t love him anymore then he would’ve been a pitiful villain. He got butthurt that his wife left his abusive ass and instead of trying to learn from it he just nukes the place she’s staying at.
Yeah, the attack on Shady Sands seems personal to Hank, rather than his excuse of it being for VaultTec so they can "rebuild" humanity. Why stop with Shady Sands? Why would VaultTec not target all of their potential competitors if they had the firepower and element of surprise and anonymity? It makes me think that maybe Hank went further than VaultTec wanted, and showed their hand far too early for his own personal revenge after getting comfortable with his power of overseer. But, as Cooper and Moldaver have now shown him, he was never safe and I bet that the "higher ups" of VaultTec aren't going to be happy with him either, especially once he leads Lucy, Cooper, and possibly the BOS right to their doorstep.
Calling it now.
Hank McLean is redeemed by the second last episode of season 2, but it’s not due to him being de-radicalised.
I think there will be a situation where he has to choose between Vault-Tec, and ultimately he will decide to choose his family this time, unfortunately he dies in the process.
I think the most likely end point will be a confrontation between Hank, Lucy, The Ghoul and Barb/Daughter. I think Barb/Daughter tries to kill Lucy, The Ghoul is unable to act due to his familial ties, and ultimately Hank ends up killing Barb/Daughter and The Ghoul kills Hank in revenge.
Yeah, it’s cliche. But it would give Hank a solid redemption, it would end The Ghouls search for his family as well as adding potential tension to Lucy and The Ghouls friendship. It ties up multiple season 1 storyline’s while opening up potential new ones, which is exactly what you want from a season 2 finale.
I think Hank Maclean Is no more bad then Father is in Fallout 4, Or Elder Maxson. Moldaver strikes me more like Destemona in Fallout 4 and a little bit of Preston. And Cooper I love cooper he is my men a bit extreem but you got to love this cowboy. If I compare it a bit like Fallout 4, this would be my comparison.
When Hank is giving his speech at the wedding the other 2 guys vying for vault leadership were standing next to him on the podium giving the impression they were his assistants or advisors, which is likely why when he was gone they tried to claim leadership themselves leading to them and Betty all vying for power until the election happened. I don't think it was disorganized at all as they clearly had a system of elections in place to replace overseers.
Great video, always love Ox's lore videos.
The claim wasn't that the system was disorganized. It was that the two idiots were "aimless". Which is true, but Betty was controlling things for her own benefit.
24:34. Now THATS WISDOM! “It’s easier to track a stuck pig than to ask him where he’s off to.”
Yup.
Hey, started playing Fallout 4 after watching the show. Watch all your videos now!
This is an interesting analysis, and definitely picks up on some interesting breadcrumbs that make for good solid inferences, but there is a ton of theory here that relies on the assumption that Muldaver's account is credible. With everything we have stitched together on Muldaver so far, that's a leap. More likely, the truth of what happened in Shady Sands is a bit more nuanced - and the apparent gap between the "fall" of Shady Sands and it being nuked plus the "Cult of Muldaver" linked to that cataclysm give us more questions than answers.
I don’t see any possible way they could even attempt a redemption arch after all that he is done. Maybe I’m wrong though, if so that would be truly interesting.
What's it it's like to be a father? Regardless of who's at fault in a family matter. The man takes all the blame. Happy father's day everyone.
I don't care what the show says, they kidnapped Hank to deal with stand worms.
You win the internet today
Nice call back.
Muadib! ✊
I have a theory that Betty is the one who dropped the bomb on Shady Sands. I think Hank was upset and told her she set the bomb to fire and he decided to go get his wife, she followed and when Lucy's mom tried to warn everyone Betty killed her and convinced Hank to go along with the lie.
I'm loving this series of character studies from the show, keep up the great work!
I’m really interested to see who the show makes into the “face” of Vault Tec : the mastermind and leader of the company since that has not been addressed in the games. It’s possible that it’s just the government/enclave but maybe they’ll come up with something new.
Your narration is always immaculate
The funny thing will be to learn in season 2 that Hank was right in blowing Shady Sands. For example, it could a place of some horrific cult (notice the strange pyramid in the video of the pre-blown Shady Sands) and the cult remnants we see in Season 1. From games we know that cults are not just crazies and trhere are entities beyond the veil (Interloper, Antlantis Alien Gods, Mothman, The Atom, locations straight from Lovecraft, the ghouls, etc.)
Great question to ask yourself: what is your ideology?
Has it radicalized you into doing evil?
We need to always step back and realize that, in face to face actuality, we have far more in common than we think.
And 99% of people are good people at heart.
Hmmm… watched a friend go down this radicalized path during Covid quarantine. Followed his own “vault tec”. Thought he was and his new friends were too smart. Responded angrily to anyone against his world view or reality. Broke with anyone, now enemies, and would dehumanize and burn everything to the ground… WOW Oxhorn… this video about Hank from the tv show shouldn’t have hit so hard.
Lined it up with fathers day nice one
Love these videos. It's like the old oxhorn is back
Hank got what he deserved, but he needs more punishment
So Wise , Thank You .
It's amazing to believe all the vaults in the show survived the master and the enclave.
The master only got a handfull and even then he was needing anouther source of fev due to low supplies, relax just a tv show be glad its not on street fighter live action level
@alexshinra6722 okay but then the enclave went vault to vault too. I just really don't get why they did it in California. Like I get BOS is rooted there and Bethesda writers love BOS but other than that I really don't get it. Wouldn't ot be easier to base the show in Colorado which is relatively untouched lore wise or in the east coast where they themselves have already woven their own narrative and wouldn't be caught tripping on pre established lore?
@@Samsungor oh remmber whilw the writters pay homage to past fallout work, its only to not piss everyone off but they love to dismiss f1 and f2, the show is a good way to cliam/ rewrite things bethesda didnt have a say in.
Hank can redeem himself if he tells/shows The Ghoul where his family is...but why New Vegas? Are they in Vault 21?
I've binged almost all of your Fallout videos, they've been not only helpful but also entertaining. Kudos to Bethesda for the heartbreaking and heartwarming stories in the games, well written
Your videos are kickass man.
This video definitely helped me contextualise things, thanks!
When I first heard the cast, I thought Kyle MacLachlan was going to be the bad guy. I was surprised to find he was actually a good guy...until Betty told Lucy that they buried Rose with her Pipboy! There is not enough room in a vault to bury hundreds of years worth of residents and they would have recycled them instead(composted). They would have recycled the Pipboys for the same reason.
Hank has just spent the last 29 years believing that the destruction of Shady Sands was justified not losing any sleep over the murder of his wife, so in my opinion, any redemption arc would feel artificial.
He didn’t just kill his wife.
He killed a nations capital. Thousands of humans, ghouls, super mutants, nightkin; all gone because of his ignorance. Men, women, children, elderly; all of them dead.
The blood of thirty four thousand innocent people is on his hands and he still slept at night like nothing happened.
The biggest passive Buff Hank has, is that he looks just like Paul Atreides
Fun Fact:
The code for cold fusion, 101097, is a date, 10th October 1997, the year the first fallout game was released
This is why very well round antagonists are so important or good stpry telling
Dude definitely sticks to his guns. 😂
Also, what kind of psychopaths would leave Rose in that state? Bound, feral, and likely in indescribable pain. Psychopaths.
14:18 does this mean that Vault Tec and Ulysses from Lonesome Road share essentially the same ideology on how to end war?